₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
Guy only JWs perfectly fit in to what the first century Christians were practicing as Christianity!

Ọmọ quote what you know mine aptly explain what the scriptures say in a practical sense!

Only me fill into the God’s idea of Man in the image God. Every other Christian who follows God diligently with their heart doesn’t fit into this, just me.

Do you see I ridiculous i sound with the statement above?

MaxInDHouse:
Paul planted and Apollos water then you're of the opinion that those taught will have divers opinion on what Paul and Apollos believe like your contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines in Christendom, shey?
Continue deceiving yourself.
For your information the first century Christians all have the same line of thought regarding teaching because they're all in total agreement with whatever comes from the apostles! Act 2:42 compare to 1Corinthians 1:10
So whatever makes your line of thought differ as Deeperlife and RCCG does today it simply means you're not Christians {Luke 11:23} Jesus wants our belief to be exactly the same {John 17:22} not some wavering opinions that can't be verified as one family! Revelations 3:16

Are you insinuating in anyway that JW is not a Christian establishment?

Also, kindly stop quoting scriptures bc they’re never relevant in

Actions and consequences are fundamental part of human existence that need to be properly understood for good living.

Action is a thing done; an act. The consequence is something that happens as a result of a particular action or set of conditions; an effect caused by an action, or a reaction to an action.
It was popularly believed that actions are responsible for consequences. This belief, though ancient, is supported by a rudimentary scientific law that states that every action attracts a befitting reaction or consequence.

We expounded this Law to explain human behaviors by assuming that the consequences dished on people are based on their actions.
This belief was used to rationalize certain toxic behaviors; for example, a partner who cheats will find something about the other person to blame as the reason for their infidelity. Ladies who got raped were told they attracted this consequence with their indecent dressing. This conclusion was very satisfying at the time until people started raping children and infants.

While the rudimentary law is peripherally true, it cannot and should not be used to explain human behaviors because the law is not so reasonable in psychology.

Actions don't really determine consequences; the actions of others do not determine our reactions. The consequence of an action is determined by a person's interpretation of the action. This interpretation is not based on the action itself, but on the reacting person's mental state.

An action might initiate a process, but it’s highly insignificant to the outcome; a person will react based on their thinking pattern; mental state.
This is an interesting thing to learn from understanding the gospel of Christ and learning about his life. Let's focus on his dying moments on the tree for instance. Was forgiveness the proper reaction to the people's actions? No, they deserved to be burned with fire from the Sun, but they were forgiven instead. This shows that the people's actions didn't affect the consequence. Jesus’s mental state solely determined the consequence; he forgave them because of his mental state.

Another situation we can learn from was the moment when he (Jesus) was arrested. This situation is better explanatory because it shows two different people's reactions to the same event.

When the soldiers came to arrest Jesus, Peter who was not being arrested reacted violently while Jesus who was being arrested reacted peacefully. This showed that Peter and Jesus were of different mental states and their reaction to the same event was dependent on their respective mental states.

HOW DID WE GET HERE?
Well, it's not a lie that as humans, we've not fully realized what we are, and we're only just learning about ourselves. Whatever beliefs established in the past are not reasonable enough to explain the reality of life. Efforts must be made to accurately know the truth.

We got here because blaming the action is innate to humans. We might not be able to tell the origin of this behavior and why it’s innate on our own, but the bible gives us a clear picture of the beginning of this behavior with the events of the Garden of Eden.

Adam was said to blame or censure both God and the woman for his reaction to the woman’s action, and the woman likewise blamed the serpent in her delusion.

Because we didn't understand that action is insignificant in consequence, so we joined the bandwagon at certain points in our lives. Because we didn't understand that the action (giving) carried out by the woman was insignificant in the consequence (accepting), we heaped blame on the woman and some still do to this day.

This behavior (blaming the woman for the man’s reaction to her action) has made us poor in judgment and has blinded us, so much such that we're unable to see that consequences are independent of actions in our personal lives; we’re fully responsible for how we react to actions of others.

However, the writers of the scripture were inspired to write very intelligently. The Bible is written with a great level of ambiguity so that whoever reads it will come to a conclusion based on their understanding of the framework of life.

The Patriarchists blame the woman, then shift this blame to the serpent in solidarity. The irreligious persons read it and blame God. The Patriarchal opinion is prevalent because most (if not all) religions are Patriarchal.

Note: it's written that God made the serpent the way it is. By and large, the Patriarchists are also blaming God (for making the serpent) indirectly. Thus, both groups are exhibiting their innate behavior; the denial, an attribute of the Adamic nature, for Adam already blamed God.

However, such beliefs are not scriptural, they are just beliefs of people who do not understand the framework of life. The Bible throws open the identity of the wicked one in the beginning so that each person's conclusion will reflect their level of understanding of the fact (consequences are independent of actions).

Therefore, the Bible is a literary body of works to test our understanding and judgment. It's like a story you tell children then ask them to say the morals of the story. Each child's response reflects their focus, level of understanding, and sense of judgment. For conclusion will only be as sound as level of knowledge.

HOW DO WE FIX THIS?
Fixing this habit like everything is not easy but becomes easy if we’re willing. This means no one can make a person change this behavior, the change can only happen personally.

The first move to defeating this habit is to properly appropriate blame. Every willing person must realize that their actions and reactions are independent of other people’s actions. This understanding will help us see life broadly and helps us become responsible entities.

Secondly, Jesus is one man who fully conquered this behavior; he never acted based on people’s actions. Therefore, following the life of this man is the only possible way to overcome this behavior.

We can follow the life of Jesus by obeying his commandments (the gospel) because he was known to only teach and command what he did (Acts 1:1). These commandments are a selection of laws (not the 10 commandments) that if obeyed will create a new mental state in us; a mental state that is independent of actions of others.

For example, Jesus commands that we pray for those who curse us. The innate behavior is retaliative but a mind that obeys Jesus acts independently of the action. Therefore, a person can only truly fix this behavior by understanding that their reactions are totally dependent on their mental state, and by obeying the commands of Jesus.
Thank you for reading[i][/i]

MaxInDHouse:
One plants the other waters! 1Corin 3:6

So if Paul has answered your questions regarding his faith in Christ Jesus you expects Apollos to have a contrary opinion shey? John 17:22

Misinformed Churchgoer, no matter how you twist your questions no JW will ever agree with you on interfaith you're brandishing as various denominations!

Don’t you think you’re twisting the bible for your own gain? Don’t you think you’re using the bible out of context sir?

I think Paul was talking about evangelism and sustained teaching in that respect. Paul laid the word in their heart and Apollos taught them continuously till they grew.

That is the context of that statement and for a man of your calibre, I fear that you do not understand the scriptures properly. You just quote it however you feel without regard for context.

Quite often I have taken the time to really look at the scriptures you quote on here and I find that they do not correlate with the topic at hand. Do you just use google and find a verse that suits your argument without caring to underhand the context of that statement? Is that what you do sir? Do you think you’re part of those Peter was talking to in 2 Peter 3:15-16?

I care about your soul sir. If you would allow me, I’d like to take you on proper study, I believe you can learn given the right amount of time. God bless you sir

.

Actions and consequences are fundamental part of human existence that need to be properly understood for good living.

Action is a thing done; an act. The consequence is something that happens as a result of a particular action or set of conditions; an effect caused by an action, or a reaction to an action.
It was popularly believed that actions are responsible for consequences. This belief, though ancient, is supported by a rudimentary scientific law that states that every action attracts a befitting reaction or consequence.

We expounded this Law to explain human behaviors by assuming that the consequences dished on people are based on their actions.
This belief was used to rationalize certain toxic behaviors; for example, a partner who cheats will find something about the other person to blame as the reason for their infidelity. Ladies who got raped were told they attracted this consequence with their indecent dressing. This conclusion was very satisfying at the time until people started raping children and infants.

While the rudimentary law is peripherally true, it cannot and should not be used to explain human behaviors because the law is not so reasonable in psychology.

Actions don't really determine consequences; the actions of others do not determine our reactions. The consequence of an action is determined by a person's interpretation of the action. This interpretation is not based on the action itself, but on the reacting person's mental state.

An action might initiate a process, but it’s highly insignificant to the outcome; a person will react based on their thinking pattern; mental state.
This is an interesting thing to learn from understanding the gospel of Christ and learning about his life. Let's focus on his dying moments on the tree for instance. Was forgiveness the proper reaction to the people's actions? No, they deserved to be burned with fire from the Sun, but they were forgiven instead. This shows that the people's actions didn't affect the consequence. Jesus’s mental state solely determined the consequence; he forgave them because of his mental state.

Another situation we can learn from was the moment when he (Jesus) was arrested. This situation is better explanatory because it shows two different people's reactions to the same event.

When the soldiers came to arrest Jesus, Peter who was not being arrested reacted violently while Jesus who was being arrested reacted peacefully. This showed that Peter and Jesus were of different mental states and their reaction to the same event was dependent on their respective mental states.

HOW DID WE GET HERE?
Well, it's not a lie that as humans, we've not fully realized what we are, and we're only just learning about ourselves. Whatever beliefs established in the past are not reasonable enough to explain the reality of life. Efforts must be made to accurately know the truth.

We got here because blaming the action is innate to humans. We might not be able to tell the origin of this behavior and why it’s innate on our own, but the bible gives us a clear picture of the beginning of this behavior with the events of the Garden of Eden.

Adam was said to blame or censure both God and the woman for his reaction to the woman’s action, and the woman likewise blamed the serpent in her delusion.

Because we didn't understand that action is insignificant in consequence, so we joined the bandwagon at certain points in our lives. Because we didn't understand that the action (giving) carried out by the woman was insignificant in the consequence (accepting), we heaped blame on the woman and some still do to this day.

This behavior (blaming the woman for the man’s reaction to her action) has made us poor in judgment and has blinded us, so much such that we're unable to see that consequences are independent of actions in our personal lives; we’re fully responsible for how we react to actions of others.

However, the writers of the scripture were inspired to write very intelligently. The Bible is written with a great level of ambiguity so that whoever reads it will come to a conclusion based on their understanding of the framework of life.

The Patriarchists blame the woman, then shift this blame to the serpent in solidarity. The irreligious persons read it and blame God. The Patriarchal opinion is prevalent because most (if not all) religions are Patriarchal.

Note: it's written that God made the serpent the way it is. By and large, the Patriarchists are also blaming God (for making the serpent) indirectly. Thus, both groups are exhibiting their innate behavior; the denial, an attribute of the Adamic nature, for Adam already blamed God.

However, such beliefs are not scriptural, they are just beliefs of people who do not understand the framework of life. The Bible throws open the identity of the wicked one in the beginning so that each person's conclusion will reflect their level of understanding of the fact (consequences are independent of actions).

Therefore, the Bible is a literary body of works to test our understanding and judgment. It's like a story you tell children then ask them to say the morals of the story. Each child's response reflects their focus, level of understanding, and sense of judgment. For conclusion will only be as sound as level of knowledge.

HOW DO WE FIX THIS?
Fixing this habit like everything is not easy but becomes easy if we’re willing. This means no one can make a person change this behavior, the change can only happen personally.

The first move to defeating this habit is to properly appropriate blame. Every willing person must realize that their actions and reactions are independent of other people’s actions. This understanding will help us see life broadly and helps us become responsible entities.

Secondly, Jesus is one man who fully conquered this behavior; he never acted based on people’s actions. Therefore, following the life of this man is the only possible way to overcome this behavior.

We can follow the life of Jesus by obeying his commandments (the gospel) because he was known to only teach and command what he did (Acts 1:1). These commandments are a selection of laws (not the 10 commandments) that if obeyed will create a new mental state in us; a mental state that is independent of actions of others.

For example, Jesus commands that we pray for those who curse us. The innate behavior is retaliative but a mind that obeys Jesus acts independently of the action. Therefore, a person can only truly fix this behavior by understanding that their reactions are totally dependent on their mental state, and by obeying the commands of Jesus.
Thank you for reading[i][/i]

.

THE PATTERN OF THE RICH
Dear Father of our faith, we thank you for this opportunity to learn your truth and the hidden mystery in your Word. We ask for mercy to follow you wholeheartedly, and help us not to be like the rich man. Amen!

There’s a pattern to all things, even as there’s a particular mindset that works for each pattern of life. The pattern of life leads to different lifestyles and whatever lifestyle a person chooses determines their reality here and after.
The lifestyle we live is a reflection of our choices and decisions, and our decisions create our behaviors, and this in turn makes us suitable for certain patterns of life. Every pattern of life leads to either of two directions; life or death hereafter.

The Bible makes it very clear that all sinners shall die, irrespective of the kind of wrongdoing. A fornicator or an adulterer cannot say to a thief “you shall die but I’ll live” simply because society approves of sexual immorality and disapproves of stealing. For both are dead in sin; they are of the same pattern of life.

Sin is not an act, but a pattern. People become unrighteous by their thoughts (Isaiah 55:7, Colossians 1:21), and their actions are only a confirmation of their death within (dead in unrighteousness). Sin is in the thoughts and a sinner is a person who thinks this way, and this is reflected in his pattern.

No one can escape this even though we might argue that all humans are not the same and everyone can’t make the same decision.

However, decisions are born out of thoughts, similar thoughts lead to a pattern, and every pattern leads to either of two places; a place of life or death.

Our focus will be on the pattern of the rich, and our excerpt will be taken from the biblical account of the encounter between Jesus and the rich man:
¹⁶ And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
¹⁷ And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
¹⁸ He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
¹⁹ Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
²⁰ The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
²² But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions (Mathew 19:16-30).

This encounter between the rich man and Jesus reflects the pattern, decision, and end of the rich. For this rich man is not just a particular person, it’s the disposition of the rich. It’s the thought pattern of the rich and the way the rich behave towards the program of salvation and their thoughts for attaining eternal life.

The rich man was enthusiastic at first, he wanted eternal life so he enquired about it. However, he didn’t understand the basics of the message of Christ. He didn’t understand the concept of salvation and what he needed to be saved from, he just wanted eternal life. It was this lack of understanding that made him assume there has to be something he could offer to qualify for eternal life.

So, Jesus replied to him sarcastically by telling him to keep the commandments. Jesus knew the man didn’t understand the commandments and didn’t know he was guilty of all (for a person who breaks a commandment, has broken all because they’re connected). Yet, the rich man claimed to have observed all the commandments (which is quite awkward because no one can truly obey a law they do not understand).

The rich man thought he had a good standing with God for obeying the law (by his standards), and wanted to know what he lacked, so Jesus told him to give off all his possession and follow him. The rich man lost his enthusiasm at this junction and chose his possession over the same eternal life he so wanted. This shows the man wanted eternal life as a plus to his wealth; as something acquired as extra possession, and not his main possession in life.

The law in the rich man’s perspective was physical, he didn’t know God’s perspective of the law yet salvation is only found through God’s perspective of the law. To the rich man, he was not a murderer because he hadn’t killed anyone, however, God’s perspective of murder is an intense dislike for someone (1 John 3:15, Mathew 5:21-26). His definition was different from God’s definition of murder. He was just and hadn’t killed anyone in his own eyes, but he had killed someone in God’s eye.

Similarly, the rich man thought he was not an idolater because he hadn’t bowed to any graven image nor served them, however, God’s definition of idolatry is too much desire for wealth or possession: covetousness (Colossians 3:5, Luke 12:15-21), and his reaction to Jesus’s response showed he lives by this.

The concept of salvation is a process and it entails overcoming human desires and pride, for all problems of life are tied to these two things: a strong desire for wealth and pride (1 John 2:16, 1 timothy 6:10). Usually, when a person achieves what he desires, pride and judgment set in, and if he doesn’t achieve it, shame and resentment arise within, and this is usually expressed in anger and violence.

Salvation in Christ provides freedom for a person such that they can live above desires and become humble. For this reason, Christ gives us a list of commandments called the gospel which if followed obediently, a person will walk in righteousness and overcome the common disease of all humans.

Salvation from the common madness of all flesh takes time. It requires a series of practices and tests as instructed through education in the Holy Spirit. A person needs full focus and time to 2 study the word of God in other to be transformed by the Word into a new person created in the image and likeness of God (Colossians 3:10, Ephesians 4:24), after which they shall be rigorously tried (1 Peter 1:7, James 1:2-4). The rich man lacked this focus and he did not have the time to be saved.

After the rich man heard what Jesus said, he went away sorrowful because the requirement for eternal life was not what he hoped for. He didn’t want to follow Jesus, he didn’t want anything to disrupt his plan for his time and possessions.

He loved his life the way it was, he just wanted eternal life as an addition to it. He wanted to continue his life and business as usual and at the same time have a place in eternity. So, he wanted to gain a spot in the kingdom of God by supporting the ministry of Jesus with something other than his time and focus in life.

However, nothing can be given for salvation. For the work of salvation is within, that which a person needs to be saved from is happening within them. Therefore, God requires us to create time to study his word and know his righteousness, and get saved as we live by his righteousness.

Eternal life cannot be given to the unsaved, it’s the profit we get for allowing God to do his salvation work in us. It’s the aim of the work of salvation. God can save the rich man and give him eternal life, but in the end, he walked away from eternal life because he did not have the time to allow God to work in him. He did not want the work of salvation to be done in him, he just wanted eternal life, and his end is common to the rich who think like him; they die when they have amassed so much (Luke 12:20), and will find themselves in the same place hereafter (Luke 16:1-31).

The behavior of this rich man in the bible is the pattern of the rich towards salvation and eternal life, they get so preoccupied with acquiring possession with little or no time left for anything else. The rich who lives by this pattern do not have time for the transformational work that happens in Christ, because they do not have time to study the scriptures and commune with the Holy Spirit as is required to know the truth, yet freedom only comes as a result of knowing the truth (John 8:32).

This predisposition is common to the rich: Those who think this way do not give their time to anything other than acquiring possessions. They’d rather give large sum donations to religious establishments or clerics, and pay full equivalence as tithing on their increase but would never give their time and focus to following Jesus. This leaves them with wealth yet still captives to the old nature.

Sadly enough, the rich man is the reality of most people in the present world. We live in a harsh world and are faced with an unprecedented level of hardship almost every day, and this has turned the average human into a very covetous entity as a means to overcome the hurdles of life.

From the least to the greatest of us is an idolater through covetousness, and when we get what we desire, we cling to it like the rich man and would not give it up to follow Jesus. The average human is not driven through life by the desire for the kingdom of God, instead, he’s driven by the ardent desires for wealth, power, and fame: ambition, and this is reflected in his choices and decisions.

The pattern of the rich is inherent to all humans, in fact, the world encourages us to think and live this way. Many of us may not be rich yet, but our trajectory is the same as the rich. We have this pattern of thought and our wants are the same; to acquire and possess.

This is our focus in life, and the implication is that we become poor in the things of God and in no time fall into the rudiments, thinking that we stand a chance in eternity when we have all the boxes checked for the Ten Commandments like the rich man. We even go as far as justifying our busyness with our need for a comfortable life forgetting that comfort is only found in the Lord.

This pattern of life has only one end for as many who think and live this way. As Christians, we must not be carried away by our ambitions, we must not be too busy acquiring and possessing that we forget to serve God. We must distinguish ourselves as a kind that has nailed our desires and passions to the cross and has crucified them there. So then, let’s give our time to God to work in us so that we might overcome the old nature.

Let’s make eternal life our main desire in life and not an addition to our immediate desires: food, shelter, and societal importance. Let him who’s overtaken by desires let the word of God help him overcome them, and he who is proud should let the word make him humble, for without this work happening in us, we cannot be fruitful or multiply nor will we replenish the earth and subdue it as commanded.

Thank you for reading...

THE PATTERN OF THE RICH
Dear Father of our faith, we thank you for this opportunity to learn your truth and the hidden mystery in your Word. We ask for mercy to follow you wholeheartedly, and help us not to be like the rich man. Amen!

There’s a pattern to all things, even as there’s a particular mindset that works for each pattern of life. The pattern of life leads to different lifestyles and whatever lifestyle a person chooses determines their reality here and after.
The lifestyle we live is a reflection of our choices and decisions, and our decisions create our behaviors, and this in turn makes us suitable for certain patterns of life. Every pattern of life leads to either of two directions; life or death hereafter.

The Bible makes it very clear that all sinners shall die, irrespective of the kind of wrongdoing. A fornicator or an adulterer cannot say to a thief “you shall die but I’ll live” simply because society approves of sexual immorality and disapproves of stealing. For both are dead in sin; they are of the same pattern of life.

Sin is not an act, but a pattern. People become unrighteous by their thoughts (Isaiah 55:7, Colossians 1:21), and their actions are only a confirmation of their death within (dead in unrighteousness). Sin is in the thoughts and a sinner is a person who thinks this way, and this is reflected in his pattern.

No one can escape this even though we might argue that all humans are not the same and everyone can’t make the same decision.

However, decisions are born out of thoughts, similar thoughts lead to a pattern, and every pattern leads to either of two places; a place of life or death.

Our focus will be on the pattern of the rich, and our excerpt will be taken from the biblical account of the encounter between Jesus and the rich man:
¹⁶ And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
¹⁷ And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
¹⁸ He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
¹⁹ Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
²⁰ The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
²² But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions (Mathew 19:16-30).

This encounter between the rich man and Jesus reflects the pattern, decision, and end of the rich. For this rich man is not just a particular person, it’s the disposition of the rich. It’s the thought pattern of the rich and the way the rich behave towards the program of salvation and their thoughts for attaining eternal life.

The rich man was enthusiastic at first, he wanted eternal life so he enquired about it. However, he didn’t understand the basics of the message of Christ. He didn’t understand the concept of salvation and what he needed to be saved from, he just wanted eternal life. It was this lack of understanding that made him assume there has to be something he could offer to qualify for eternal life.

So, Jesus replied to him sarcastically by telling him to keep the commandments. Jesus knew the man didn’t understand the commandments and didn’t know he was guilty of all (for a person who breaks a commandment, has broken all because they’re connected). Yet, the rich man claimed to have observed all the commandments (which is quite awkward because no one can truly obey a law they do not understand).

The rich man thought he had a good standing with God for obeying the law (by his standards), and wanted to know what he lacked, so Jesus told him to give off all his possession and follow him. The rich man lost his enthusiasm at this junction and chose his possession over the same eternal life he so wanted. This shows the man wanted eternal life as a plus to his wealth; as something acquired as extra possession, and not his main possession in life.

The law in the rich man’s perspective was physical, he didn’t know God’s perspective of the law yet salvation is only found through God’s perspective of the law. To the rich man, he was not a murderer because he hadn’t killed anyone, however, God’s perspective of murder is an intense dislike for someone (1 John 3:15, Mathew 5:21-26). His definition was different from God’s definition of murder. He was just and hadn’t killed anyone in his own eyes, but he had killed someone in God’s eye.

Similarly, the rich man thought he was not an idolater because he hadn’t bowed to any graven image nor served them, however, God’s definition of idolatry is too much desire for wealth or possession: covetousness (Colossians 3:5, Luke 12:15-21), and his reaction to Jesus’s response showed he lives by this.

The concept of salvation is a process and it entails overcoming human desires and pride, for all problems of life are tied to these two things: a strong desire for wealth and pride (1 John 2:16, 1 timothy 6:10). Usually, when a person achieves what he desires, pride and judgment set in, and if he doesn’t achieve it, shame and resentment arise within, and this is usually expressed in anger and violence.

Salvation in Christ provides freedom for a person such that they can live above desires and become humble. For this reason, Christ gives us a list of commandments called the gospel which if followed obediently, a person will walk in righteousness and overcome the common disease of all humans.

Salvation from the common madness of all flesh takes time. It requires a series of practices and tests as instructed through education in the Holy Spirit. A person needs full focus and time to 2 study the word of God in other to be transformed by the Word into a new person created in the image and likeness of God (Colossians 3:10, Ephesians 4:24), after which they shall be rigorously tried (1 Peter 1:7, James 1:2-4). The rich man lacked this focus and he did not have the time to be saved.

After the rich man heard what Jesus said, he went away sorrowful because the requirement for eternal life was not what he hoped for. He didn’t want to follow Jesus, he didn’t want anything to disrupt his plan for his time and possessions.

He loved his life the way it was, he just wanted eternal life as an addition to it. He wanted to continue his life and business as usual and at the same time have a place in eternity. So, he wanted to gain a spot in the kingdom of God by supporting the ministry of Jesus with something other than his time and focus in life.

However, nothing can be given for salvation. For the work of salvation is within, that which a person needs to be saved from is happening within them. Therefore, God requires us to create time to study his word and know his righteousness, and get saved as we live by his righteousness.

Eternal life cannot be given to the unsaved, it’s the profit we get for allowing God to do his salvation work in us. It’s the aim of the work of salvation. God can save the rich man and give him eternal life, but in the end, he walked away from eternal life because he did not have the time to allow God to work in him. He did not want the work of salvation to be done in him, he just wanted eternal life, and his end is common to the rich who think like him; they die when they have amassed so much (Luke 12:20), and will find themselves in the same place hereafter (Luke 16:1-31).

The behavior of this rich man in the bible is the pattern of the rich towards salvation and eternal life, they get so preoccupied with acquiring possession with little or no time left for anything else. The rich who lives by this pattern do not have time for the transformational work that happens in Christ, because they do not have time to study the scriptures and commune with the Holy Spirit as is required to know the truth, yet freedom only comes as a result of knowing the truth (John 8:32).

This predisposition is common to the rich: Those who think this way do not give their time to anything other than acquiring possessions. They’d rather give large sum donations to religious establishments or clerics, and pay full equivalence as tithing on their increase but would never give their time and focus to following Jesus. This leaves them with wealth yet still captives to the old nature.

Sadly enough, the rich man is the reality of most people in the present world. We live in a harsh world and are faced with an unprecedented level of hardship almost every day, and this has turned the average human into a very covetous entity as a means to overcome the hurdles of life.

From the least to the greatest of us is an idolater through covetousness, and when we get what we desire, we cling to it like the rich man and would not give it up to follow Jesus. The average human is not driven through life by the desire for the kingdom of God, instead, he’s driven by the ardent desires for wealth, power, and fame: ambition, and this is reflected in his choices and decisions.

The pattern of the rich is inherent to all humans, in fact, the world encourages us to think and live this way. Many of us may not be rich yet, but our trajectory is the same as the rich. We have this pattern of thought and our wants are the same; to acquire and possess.

This is our focus in life, and the implication is that we become poor in the things of God and in no time fall into the rudiments, thinking that we stand a chance in eternity when we have all the boxes checked for the Ten Commandments like the rich man. We even go as far as justifying our busyness with our need for a comfortable life forgetting that comfort is only found in the Lord.

This pattern of life has only one end for as many who think and live this way. As Christians, we must not be carried away by our ambitions, we must not be too busy acquiring and possessing that we forget to serve God. We must distinguish ourselves as a kind that has nailed our desires and passions to the cross and has crucified them there. So then, let’s give our time to God to work in us so that we might overcome the old nature.

Let’s make eternal life our main desire in life and not an addition to our immediate desires: food, shelter, and societal importance. Let him who’s overtaken by desires let the word of God help him overcome them, and he who is proud should let the word make him humble, for without this work happening in us, we cannot be fruitful or multiply nor will we replenish the earth and subdue it as commanded.

Thank you for reading...

Prosper1912:
Okay, repeat the question let me give the answer to it.

Do you think you’ll be saved judging with the way you’ve lived?

Do you think you’ll be with Christ forever if you die today?

Also, what makes you more like Christ than every other person?

Prosper1912:
Mr.max has already answered the question,so there is no need repeating what he has said,we all have the same line of taught.

So can we proceed with other discussion.

So, you can’t speak for yourself? Confession unto salvation is a personal thing Mr. Prosper. So I’ll like you to answer this question yourself unless you imagine that Mr. Max is your lord and leader.

MaxInDHouse:
No wahala you can continue waiting for your fellow believers if you don't want to know the truth behind the contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines in the sects claiming denominations under Christendom!

Ok sir. Thank you for your contribution to the thread

MaxInDHouse:
Humbly subjecting ourselves to the same line of thought binding on all believers! John 17:22

Whoever can't present any group of worshipers with whom he/she holds onto the same rules is a worker of LAWLESSNESS! Matthew 7:23

Mr. Max the question is a personal question to Mr Prosper so kindly move away from it pls.

Prosper1912:
[b][/b]

What is the name of yr fellowship,so that I can verify myself if the government paid it.

Yeah, Jesus didn't seek attention but the work e did while e was on earth move people to draw closer to him.

Yes that’s the point my dear friend. Don’t seek attention, just do your work and people will come if it’s right. God himself will draw people to you. Don’t even brag about what you do. Don’t think you’re better than anyone for doing what you do. Just labour and go. Isn’t that what I had been telling you?

The name of my fellowship is irrelevant to the purpose of this thread. We don’t seek attention.

Look at these question. Do you think you’ll be saved judging by the way you’ve lived?

Do you think you’ll be with Christ forever if you die today?

Also, what makes you more like Christ than every other person?

Prosper1912:
[b][/b]

I hope u still know that it not only jw organization that is being paid by the government,all other religions too are still being paid by the government. So talk with fact next time.

And also when Jesus Christ walk the surface of earth, his work was seen by all men including those that hate him.he did not do the work of GoD silently.infact the preaching work e did while e was on earth caught the attention of people and even the religion leader at that time.
So the question now is that

WHO ARE WE SUPPOSED TO IMITATE?

Mr Prosper, I believe there’s good inside of your soul. You’re not like these other darkened souls, there’s an iota of light inside of you so I need you to think critically of everything you say and how you behave pls.

For the record, I didn’t say other religions don’t get paid. You all have the same masters who pay you to divide the people with unbiblical theories. I just mentioned that with its self righteous stance, JW organisation should have known better than to be used and get paid like an harlot.

I’m a bonafide member of my fellowship and I can boast that the government of this world doesn’t pay us. Everything we have is by grace so we don’t need to adjust our doctrine to suit government policies. And if by any chance my fellowship also gets paid, the truth is salvation is a personal walk. The fact that I’m a member of a fellowship doesn’t mean I’ll carry it on my head over the message of Christ. Any day my fellowship starts to preach unbiblical theories, that’s the day I’ll leave bc my fidelity is not unto them but to the truth.

Everyone knows that gift corrupts innocence, it’s just shameful that JW that claims to be the portal of heaven paid by the government like a harlot.

Also, Jesus didn’t seek attention. If you’re doing the work of God, fame, honour and peace will find you. That’s natural. I mentioned that JW loves attention and it seeks with all diligence, that’s mentally degrading.

And pls, let’s change the subject. Why did you wait for me and MR mAx to finish our discussion before you started yours? Are you all working together to frustrate teachers of the truth? Is this like a gang up of demonic entities? Let’s change the conversation pls. This is getting boring

sonmvayina:
So instead of looking for a good rabbi to teach you guys the Torah, and learn to keep God's commandments. You guys are arguing over Roman paganism and propaganda....

When Una wan wake up and smell the coffee?

Jesus is a Roman Catholic creation.....

The Torah is the way, the truth and the life...there is no other way to please God than to obey his laws and commandments.....

Thank you for this insight. I realised The work of the distractors quite late.

If Torah is your way that’s fine. There’s no problem. Anyone can serve whoever they choose and can even create their own God.

However, the truth is that no one will burn in the lake of fire forever (except Satan and his cohorts).

The false doctrine tells people they’ll burn in hell forever if they do not convert and become their member. They put an image in their mind and this causes them to become false convert who go around shouting Jesus without understanding.

No one is burning in the lake of fire forever. God’s judgment is just and he’ll not punish anyone more than is required.

MaxInDHouse:
Your thread is not for my own people so wait for your own people they'll come and discuss with you.
Farewell!

So answer no the main questions right? But you do have all the answers for denominational questions don’t you? If I continued with you on unnecessary debate about denominations I know you’ll answer till eternity. But now that the focus is shifted you, you have no answers. Kudos to you then. I want to continue to talk about the thread and not unnecessary time wasting discussions about denominations. So you can leave the thread now.

MaxInDHouse:
So after i've answered and backed it up with the scriptures this is what you have to say.

Ọmọ you can continue deceiving yourself nobody can force the truth down your throat it's a free world!

Thank you sir. I’m glad you’re not disputing the authenticity of the information in the article. So let’s rest.

Are you going to continue to walk in the path of Christ even if you find with evidence that Jesus was just a manipulation in history? Will you still be righteous if you find that there’s no punishment for unrighteousness? Will you still walk rightly even when you find that Jesus is never coming to save you?

These are the things that matter now. Thank you for your time though, at least your engagement and those of your colleagues has driven the post to over a thousand views. Christ be glorified.

Hopefully more than half of those who read it realise that there’s no eternal burning for any soul and are better convinced of the righteousness of God.

MaxInDHouse:
If it's PERSONAL Jesus won't condemn groups like Pharisees and Sadducees after all there were honest hearted and sincere individuals among them such as Nicodemus and Gamaliel.

So sincere and honest worship is institutional as directed by God's only begotten Son Jesus Christ {Matthew 17:5} all other forms of worship no matter what they call themselves are heading towards destruction {Matthew 7:21-23} even if they worship Jesus as their God! Mark 7:7

I have a problem with people who quote the scriptures like you bc they do that without understanding. Yesterday, I copied one of your messages and checked all the verse you quoted then realised they’re not connected with what you’re saying. I felt really sad for you.

Also, salvation is not an institutional walk, it’s personal. It’s blindedness that makes a person think otherwise. If this is what they teach you in JW then I can understand why you quote scriptures without understanding.

The family is an institution yet the father’s salvation cannot stand for the son. Both the father and son must work out their salvation bc it’s a personal thing. You don’t get saved by association, you get saved by personal encounter and realisation of Christ.

The work of salvation is internal, it’s not external. Do you imagine in your wildest dreams that caring bag up and down and being unreasonably judgmental of everyone who isn’t of your denomination will get you to heaven? If you really think that then you must be deeply blind.

I hope you know JW gets paid by different governments just to get you normalised and conformed. Norway is presently looking at stopping their payment bc of one event. Who would have thought a self righteous institution as JW is in the government’s paycheck? It’s all for the money and you’re just the tool needed to get the money.

I have a soft Copy and a hard copy of your bible and I see how you people changed certain words in the scriptures just to suit your idea of what God should be. You’ve literally created your own word of God and as such have created your own God.

This is shameful and it’s shameful of you to reject brothers simply bc of denominational inclination. There are many fellowships and institution who are really helping people become like Christ; who are doing their work tirelessly underground and do not brag about it.

In Nigeria I know my fellowship and we’ve spread to almost every city of the country, doing our thing silently without drawing unnecessary attention to ourselves. Do you know how mentally retarded it’s to do something just for attention? Many JW members like attention and it’s evident with the irresponsible behaviour of many of you on this platform.

I just hope not all of you is like this bc that will be disastrous but I’m convinced with evident fruit that your works are evil and your heart is not changed. It’s a disgrace that you (Mr Max) claim to serve the same Jesus as the brothers who are really living for Christ. I do hope you get saved someday and until then I’m leaving you again. Do have a great day Mr. Max

MaxInDHouse:
But Jesus also worshiped inside the same temple with the Pharisees yet he claims nobody can gain God's approval except through him! John 14:6

So your illustration is misplaced.
Just say you don't know how to distinguish between true and false religions {Luke 6:42} that will make a lot of sense than claiming tens of thousands of different religions with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines are all worshiping the same God! Matthew 7:13-14

Today over 41,000 different sects are claiming they're Christians if you can't figure out what is wrong in that then forget about Jesus because that's exactly what he came to teach sincere and honest hearted person: how to differentiate between true and false religions since Satan is always around to complicate issues regarding religion! 2Corinthians 4:4

Is this sincere and honest worship institutional or personal?

MaxInDHouse:
So in a nutshell only JWs are practicing pure worship and can boldly speak publicly!

Of course the empty barrel makes the loudest noise. The Pharisees like to be seen that they’re doing the things of God, but we know their futility. They brag about worshiping God better than others and even think other people are condemned yet they’re not saved bc all they do is twist the scriptures for their own gain. We recognise these spirits of Pharisees in the bodies of men so it’s fine when you make noise dear friend.

It’s not to make noise, it’s to make coherent sounds that is both palatable to the sense and impact the mind that matters.

It’s fine if you think what you think, after all the child who is limited and has not seen any part of life thinks he’s father’s farm is the biggest.

Can now shift the focus to Christ pls?

Prosper1912:
So techobeys can u point out any denomination or group or fellowship that is following or practicing half of what the apostle were practicing. If u can tell the any fellowship, denomination or group I will renown my faith as a jw right now.

Actually there are many fellowship that are practicing what the disciples practised. I’m a member of a particular fellowship that doesn’t obey the norms. We run a schooling system where people are taught based on their level of understanding. You don’t need to even recite the apostles creed and all that things they do in the mainstream Christianity; Christ is revealed to every member of our fellowship through proper bible study and participation in the works of faith.

But like I said, unlike you, I’m not here to advertise my fellowship, so I won’t give you its name. I’m here to advertise Christ so kindly shut it with all that denominational talk.

I know you can’t leave your denomination btw, bc they own you. They own your soul and your only hope is on your denomination. So let’s just shut up with all that talk pls. Do you have anything to talk about the article or any part of it? If yes let’s talk and if not let’s shut up pls.

Christ should be our topic every time we open our mouth. Let’s withstand demonic derailments. If we won’t speak of Christ then let’s all mouths be shut.

Prosper1912:
Techobeys
If there is no need for one group or denomination.then
Why will the first century christain form different congregation under chirst umbrella?

This is a very beautiful question Mr. Prosper, you’re somewhat different from the rest of your kind on Nairaland who are so uncultured and mannerless, who do not reflect Christ nor are willing to learn of him. With you as an evidence, I can say their problem is personal.

Let’s get the fact right pls. I didn’t say it’s not good to gather. I want to believe you made an honest mistake by assuming I said that so kindly read properly and watch your words next time pls.

I said you can fellowship with brethren but don’t let denominational spirit of separation trap you with the lies of one denomination being better than the other. Just join fellowship, listen to teachings but go back to check what you’ve heard so you’re not deceived. There’s no best denomination.

Also, the apostles didn’t form different denominations of the brotherhood. They established congregations of the brotherhood in different cities and country. They were led by the same spirit and were humble to learn from each other.

Today we have misguided Christians who behave like cultists and have occultic inclination to their denominations. Christians who will defend lies as long as it’s spoken by a member of their denomination. This isn’t what the disciples established and practiced. This is the work of demons in human flesh parading themselves as followers of Christ and teachers of the gospel.

If we’re of one spirit, our teachings will align and if our teachings is from the same scriptures, our facts will be the same. The denominations of Christianity are of different demons causing separation among people. The JW demon is making its member believe they’re more righteous than others. That’s a dangerous way to think, it’s prideful.

Any reasonable JW member will reject that lie and embrace everyone who is for Christ. Our fidelity is not to denominational demons, our fidelity is to Christ and whoever is for Christ is our brother. So watch people, if their ways and words is according to the scriptures then they’re your brother.

If you hate a son of God simply because he’s not a member of your denomination then you’re not saved, you’re in bondage of the demon of your denomination. You must love everyone who is Christ’s.

MaxInDHouse:
How good it is that God's Holy Spirit never supported you so you can't quote a single scripture to back your iniquity?

You've said this before, i only used that post you quoted to expose your folly for others to know that individuals like you are workers of LAWLESSNESS (INIQUITY) Matthew 7:23

Know today that Jesus only have one group it's only through this group that we can be saved because Jesus' disciples must all have the same line of thought {John 17:22; 1Corinthians 1:10} not different sects with contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines! Luke 11:23

It’s the devil or a demonic spirit that waits for you to say something now and use it against you at a later time. I suppose that spirit in you is leading you accordingly so no qualms.

I hope you’ve read that these demonic spirit know how to quote the scriptures well enough bc even the devil quoted the scriptures when tempting Jesus.

Yes, Jesus have just one group, and that group are the people who worship God in truth and in spirit. So whoever worships God in truth and in spirit is by default a member of that group.

Don’t you think it’s rather unwise to assume that JW is that group? Mr Max stop this please, you’re not thinking straight at the moment. I understand that you might have been brainwashed but you can stop thinking this way.

Go back, sit down and as yourself the following questions: what if JW is doing the wrong thing? What if you’re not saved? what if your religion reject scriptures totally, would you still follow them? Now ask yourself this last question: which is most important, JW or Jesus? Think about this things pls. I hope you find answers.

MaxInDHouse:
The only problem you have now is self deceit!

Jesus will not acknowledge anyone who is not attached to his group {Luke 18:20-23} you must be in subjection to whatever rules they agree upon that's binding on them {Matthew 16:19} all as long as they're carrying out the assignment he gave as a group {Ephesians 5:23} after pentecost whoever is not attached to that group is on his/her own, that's why Jesus directed Paul to go and attach himself to the group! Act 9:6, 27

So if you don't subject yourself under the same line of thought with a multitude of believers {John 17:22} that means you can't be disciplined or reproved under the rules binding on all brothers in the truth {Matthew 16:19} in that case whatever service you render will be thrown back at your face because from Jesus' standpoint you're lawless! Matthew 7:21-23

How does this relate to the misguided idea that only your denomination leads people to heaven? It’s ok if you don’t understand anything written, They’re words of the spirit. Fellowship with the brethren is healthy, we’re encouraged to fellowship with the brethren, and told to gather to interpret the scripture and not to sell misguided ideas.

It’s not wise for us to assume that every gathering of brethren that’s different from our own is demonic. This idea itself is a demonic idea. This is why many people are careful with JW members bc of this demonic idea that it’s them or no one.

The kingdom of God is not JW property. The fact that you call your halls “kingdom hall” doesn’t mean you guys are even saved.

Don’t preach denomination Mr max, preach Christ and teach the truth. That’s all that matters. It’s not hard to accept but a person’s heart makes accepting easy messages difficult for them.

Kindly leave your denomination out of this discussion pls. The article was written purely bc I didn’t want to insinuate that my denomination is Better than any. Salvation is a personal walk dear friend. See it that way and have peace.

Aemmyjah:
Lol
Just reading comments sha

I'm just happy that I'm serving God without a morbid fear and I was convinced that hellfire is a borrowed lie to manipulate people to serve God

Anyone who does not believe in hellfire, they will say na JW
Anyone who does not celebrate Christmas, na JW
Anyone who does not want to participate in politics, na JW
Anyone that does not give tithe, na JW
Anyone that teach that paradise will be restored, na JW
Anyone that does not believe in the Trinity, na JW
Anyone that does not accept Jesus as God but son of God, na JW
Anyone that does not promote religious title, na JW
Anyone that uses God's name, Jehovah, na JW
Where there are no female religious leaders,na JW
Someone that won't go to war, na JW
Anyone that does not believe in the speaking unintelligible words in the name of speaking in tongues, na JW
Anyone that does not practice interfaith, na JW
Anyone that reject spiritism, na JW

When it comes to true knowledge of the Bible, we are always far ahead, others come up later and when they share it (cos what is common or longstanding is not always true), other people accuse them as JW...

I do not do these things you mentioned - does that mean I’m JW? Nope, it doesn’t. If anyone give themselves to proper scriptural studies, They’ll realise the truth without being sold a lie. They don’t need to be a JW. They do not limit their own freedom.

They are free indeed bc the son of God has set them free. They are not a member of any society. They are Christian not bc they belong to a society but bc they live the Christly life. If they fellowship anywhere, they do as the spirit leads them per time. They don’t have any attachments that might cause them to be bias to other establishments. If anyone says the truth, they support it irrespective of that person’s secret or open society, and if anyone lies, they respectfully criticise the false claims.

We all have to reach a level of total freedom. If we assume that we’re free bc of our societal affiliation then we’re still slaves to be commanded at the appropriate time. There could be a whole lot about JW that are evil but you might not see it bc of your bias. So kindly live a totally free life Sir. That’s what Christ wants for us all

Thank you

Dtruthspeaker:
Respectfully, it is implied. Everything has its implication. If water pours on you, then it impliedly means that you are wet!



That is not true, punishment is for things that live. Punishment ceases when a thing ceases to live and exist.



Sorry, I do not permit people to run or hide from the Truth, so I will always throw it in their faces.

'Truth is so rare that it is delightful to tell it." Emily Dickinson

Facing the Truth is the Way to Eternial Life of goodness

"The truth will set you free, but first it will make you miserable." James A. Garfield

Emotional manipulation is not the way to go for someone who knows the truth sir. Using “truth speaker” as your name on Nairaland doesn’t mean you know the truth sir. So I don’t think you’re serious about knowing or speaking the truth by trying to emotionally manipulate or anyone following this thread.

Jesus didn’t tell people to respect God bc he made this and that or bc God formed the earth and the heaven Bla bla bla. No, Jesus taught people the truth, he exposed the fault in their belief system with proper scriptural dissection.

I’ll respect you more if you dissect the scriptures properly without reminding me that God created the heaven and the earth or did any more things. I already know, I do not need to be reminded of that. What matters is the topic we’re discussing. Which is that your belief about eternal burning of any soul is unscriptural and it’s coming from a place of hate and violence of the heart of man.

It’s not the judgment of mercy of God but of the Adamic wickedness in the soul sir. It’s just a Greek and Babylonian myth bc it’s there in these myths that Zeus will torment his enemies in hades forever but scriptures do not support such baseless claims.

Maybe you’re only a Christian bc you fear this eternal burning of certain people and now you’re defending it bc you feel lost; your reason for being a Christian had been a lie all along. Something in you hates that no one is going to burn forever so you want to continue to sell this fear to people or cause them to hate God.

Every rational human being knows that this judgment is not perfect neither is it just but you’re seeing this judgment bc of the nature your heart Sir. You also want to retain Christians in false beliefs so they remain Christians by fear of this wicked judgment in your heart.

You want God to torment them forever so you can watch them suffer so that the wickedness in the soul can feel satisfied. You shall not get this satisfaction sir, no one who desires it will get it bc only the devil and his cohorts will face that fate.

Our God is a just God sir. Go and study and stop this continued bickering on a topic you do not properly understand. Do have a great day sir, I hope this silences you but if it doesn’t, then I have left the floor for you. Good bye.

Dtruthspeaker:
So also does smoke come out at the beginning of Fire and as long as there is fire there is smoke and by Leviticus God is warning us that He has a Fire that never goes out, hence smoke will always be there.



It is implied

Matthew 25:46
These will go away into eternal punishment,

Meaning unending punishment.

You guys do not want to real eyes that it is God you are talking about o. Who made dust to live. If dust can live is it now Ash?

Can iPhone die if Steve Jobs does not permit it? No!

That is why Job and psalms warns FEAR YOUR CREATOR! HE CAN DO ANYTHING HE HAS EVEN TOLD US NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NO THING IS IMPOSSIBLE WITH HIM. ASHES AND DUST LIVE BECAUSE HE MADE THEM LIVE AND DID NOT PERMIT THEM TO GO POOF!

It’s not implied sir. You’re only interpreting it that way bc of what you’ve already believed. For a person to inexist forever, that’s also eternal punishment.

The highlighted part is highly unnecessary if you’re saying the truth sir. This is emotional manipulation. The truth of the scriptures must be established and defended irrespective of your beliefs sir.

Dtruthspeaker:
And it did not say "and shall fade away" as you added to it.



Isn't the "away" mean away from the new heaven and earth where the just and the meek would live forever and ever?

Revelation 11:14 and other scriptures show where and how they shall be living. It's as simple as that. No addition or subtraction or twisting. It plain for all to see, if you want to truly see.

"they have no rest day nor night,"

Smoke rising is exactly what Leviticus 6:14 warned us about "a fire that will never ever go out".

Thus, they shall burn forever!

This is not true sir, when you burn something to ash, it’ll definitely give smoke. Ashes will continue to give smoke even after something is completely burnt. It’s this smoke that the bible says will ascend to heaven forever. The bible doesn’t say people will burn forever. The bible says they’ll have no rest for as long as they burned and when they have been fully dissipated, they’ll be no more (inexist forever)

I know you’re trying to defend what you believe so I do not blame you for being wrong sir, I’ll only talk against what you say if they’re untrue. Kindly check again, I pray you’re able to see it clearer this time. This isn’t about winning an argument by the way, it’s about establishing biblical truth and separating it from mere beliefs