₦airaland Forum

dastranger:
more and more questions will make us deviate from the purpose of this thread..... Jesus was not a Christian.... it was after Jesus had long gone that idolators termed people of the book as Christians.... Jesus never claimed to establish christianity...... he only preached oneness of God

You see the problem Muslims have with the Bible is that it cannot be presented in its original form (Aramaic)....instead it has bn edited and translated by man to English wch is wy Muslim questions its originality?
.
Pls mature comments not mockery

It's the understanding that is missing and that is why muslims have an issue with Christianity.Jesus indeed did not establish any religion.Christianity is not a religion.Jesus came to give eternal life.No religion could give eternal life.Muhammed could not give it.He didn't have it.Jesus gave it and He said this commandment I receive of My Father.
As the Father hath life in Himself,so has He given life to the Son...(John 5:26)

To say Jesus was not a Christian doesn't make sense.Like I said,a will is executed after the owner of the will dies.He didn't establish a religion but brought eternal life which none of the prophets had.After He left the earth,the people who saw those who followed Him(you call them idolators) called them Christians-which means Christ-like.It was a description.It was not the name of any religion.

A lack of understanding is the reason why muslims argue against this thing.Christianity is not a religion(I know this statement is too big to comprehend with a religious mind).
I hope you can understand it.

If Muhammed said the bible is corrupted,he should have asked his lord to provide the original as proof.How come the Islamic world cannot provide the original Injeel?

Zaikon:
aiit bro...[b]According to Islamic tradition which describes this graphically, Jesus'
descent will be in the midst of wars fought by al-Mahdi (lit. "the
rightly guided one", known in Islamic eschatology as the redeemer of
Islam, against al-Masīh ad-Dajjāl (the Antichrist "False messiah" and
his followers. Jesus will descend at the point of a white arcade,
east of Damascus, dressed in yellow robes—his head anointed. He will
say prayer behind al-Mahdi then join him in his war against the Dajjal.
Jesus, considered as a Muslim, will abide by the Islamic teachings.
Eventually, Jesus will slay the Antichrist, and then everyone who is
one of the People of the Book (ahl al-kitāb, referring to Jews and
Christians) will believe in him. Thus, there will be one community,
that of Islam.
Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43: Kitab-ul-`Ilm (Book of
Knowledge), Hâdith Number 656:—Narrated by Abu Huraira
“
After the death of al-Mahdi, Jesus will assume leadership. This is a
time associated in Islamic narrative with universal peace and justice.
Islamic texts also allude to the appearance of Ya'juj and Ma'juj (known
also as Gog and Magog), ancient tribes which will disperse and cause
disturbance on earth. God, in response to Jesus' prayers, will kill
them by sending a type of worm in the napes of their necks.[29]
Jesus' rule is said to be around forty years, after which he will die.
Muslims will then perform the funeral prayer for him and then bury
him in the city of Medina in a grave left vacant beside Muhammad,
Abu Bakr, and Umar (companions of Muhammad and the first and
second Sunni caliphs (Rashidun) respectively).[/b]

This has to be the greatest falsehood and manipulation I have seen.Jesus will come back as a muslim and follow Islamic traditions.Why didn't he do it when he was here earlier?He will die and be buried beside Muhammed's grave?
This has to be one of the greatest works of fiction.

dastranger:
I am still coming to this bro, meanwhile give me the prophets message in the bible that prophesiced the coming of jesus christ too...

Therefore will the Lord himself give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and shall bring forth a son, and call his name Emmanuel,which being God with us(Isaiah 7:14).This was a prophecy by Prophet Isaiah concerning Jesus.

The LORD said unto my Lord,sit thou at my right hand until I make thy enemies thy footstool..(Psalm 110:1)This was a prophecy by King David that also speaks about the divinity of Jesus Christ.

These are just two of the prophecies concerning Jesus.

dastranger:
There re other books that has remained the same ? give me an example pls...............Angel Gabriel(Jibril) is the only one that brings inspiration................


Imam Ahmad recorded that `A'ishah said: The first thing that began happening with the Messenger of Allah from the revelation was dreams that he would see in his sleep that would come true. He would not see any dream except that it would come true just like the (clearness of) the daybreak in the morning. Then seclusion became beloved to him. So, he used to go to the cave of Hira' and devote himself to worship there for a number of nights, and he would bring provisions for that. Then he would return to Khadijah and replenish his provisions for a similar number of nights. This continued until the revelation suddenly came to him while he was in the cave of Hira'. The angel came to him while he was in the cave and said, "Read!'' The Messenger of Allah said,

«فَقُلْتُ: مَا أَنَا بِقَارِىء»

(I replied: "I am not one who reads.) Then he said, "So he (the angel) seized me and pressed me until I could no longer bear it. Then he released me and said: `Read!' So I replied: `I am not one who reads.' So, he pressed me a second time until I could no longer bear it. Then he released me and said:

﴿اقْرَأْ بِاسْمِ رَبِّكَ الَّذِى خَلَقَ ﴾

(Read in the Name of your Lord who has created.) until he reached the Ayah,

﴿مَا لَمْ يَعْلَمْ﴾

(That which he knew not. )'' So he returned with them (those Ayat) and with his heart trembling until he came (home) to Khadijah, and he said,

«زَمِّلُونِي زَمِّلُونِي»

(Wrap me up, wrap me up!) So they wrapped him up until his fear went away. After that he told Khadijah everything that had happened (and said),

«قَدْ خَشِيتُ عَلَى نَفْسِي»

(I fear that something may happen to me.) Khadijah replied, "Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you. You keep good relations with your relatives, you speak the truth, you help the poor and the destitute, you serve your guests generously, and you help the deserving, calamity afflicted people.'' Khadijah then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqah bin Nawfal bin Asad bin `Abdul-`Uzza bin Qusay, who, during the period of ignorance became a Christian and used to scribe the Scriptures in Arabic. He would write from the Injil in Hebrew as much as Allah willed for him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight. Khadijah said to him, "O my cousin! Listen to the story of your nephew.'' Waraqah asked, "O my nephew! What have you seen'' Allah's Messenger described what he saw. Waraqah said, "This is An-Namus whom Allah had sent to Musa. I wish I was young and could live until the time when your people would drive you out.'' Allah's Messenger asked,

«أَوَ مُخْرِجِيَّ هُمْ؟»

(Will they drive me out) Waraqah replied in the affirmative and said, "Anyone who came with something similar to what you have brought, was treated with hostility and enmity; and if I should remain alive till that day then I would firmly support you.'' But Waraqah did not remain. He died and the revelation paused until Allah's Messenger became sad according to what we were told. Due to this grief he set out a number of times with the intent of throwing himself from the mountain tops. However, every time he would reach the peak of a mountain to throw himself from it, Jibril would appear to him and say, "O Muhammad! You are truly the Messenger of Allah!'' Therefore, his worry would be eased, his soul would be settled and he would return (down from the mountain). Then, when the revelation did not come again for a long time, he set out as he had done before. So when he reached the peak of the mountain, Jibril appeared to him again and said to him the same as he had said before.'' This Hadith has been recorded in the Two Sahihs by way of Az-Zuhri. We have already discussed this Hadith's chain of narration, its text and its meanings at length in the beginning of our explanation of Sahih Al-Bukhari. Therefore, whoever would like to read it, it is researched there, and all praise and blessings are due to Allah. So the first thing that was revealed of the Qur'an were these noble and blessed Ayat. They are the first mercy that Allah bestowed upon His servants and the first bounty that Allah favored them with.

Again all these doesn't prove anything.It is one man's story.
I need proof of prophets' messages that spoke of the coming of Muhammed as a prophet.

There's a lady on another thread on fp who is 35yrs and does not have a toaster.I think you should hook your friend with this lady.

The date is not what is important.What is important is the purpose!We celebrate the purpose of His birth!

It's common knowledge that He wasn't born on the 25th of December.

So much writing without proving anything.The bible says ever learning but never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.It's not about dates and all that.........it's about purpose.The purpose is celebrated,dates are not what is important.


How can Jesus celebrate Christmas when He is the center of the celebration?Can a will be executed without the owner of the will dying first?

dastranger:
(Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth among the People of the Scripture, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.) Therefore, when People of the Scriptures disbelieved in Muhammad , they had no beneficial faith in any Messenger or what the Messengers brought. Rather, they followed their religions because this conformed with their ideas, lusts and the ways of their forefathers, not because they are Allah's Law and religion. Had they been true believers in their religions, that faith would have directed them to believe in Muhammad , because all Prophets gave the good news of Muhammad's advent and commanded them to obey and follow him. Yet when he was sent, they disbelieved in him, even though he is the mightiest of all Messengers. Therefore, they do not follow the religion of earlier Prophets because these religions came from Allah, but because these suit their desires and lusts. Therefore, their claimed faith in an earlier Prophet will not benefit them because they disbelieved in the master, the mightiest, the last and most perfect of all Prophets . Hence Allah's statement,ا
[color=#990000](Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth among the People of the Scripture,) This honorable Ayah was revealed with the order to fight the People of the Book, after the pagans were defeated, the people entered Allah's religion in large numbers, and the Arabian Peninsula was secured under the Muslims' control. Allah commanded His Messenger to fight the People of the Scriptures, Jews and Christians, on the ninth year of Hijrah, and he prepared his army to fight the Romans and called the people to Jihad announcing his intent and destination. The Messenger sent his intent to various Arab areas around Al-Madinah to gather forces, and he collected an army of thirty thousand. Some people from Al-Madinah and some hypocrites, in and around it, lagged behind, for that year was a year of drought and intense heat. The Messenger of Allah marched, heading towards Ash-Sham to fight the Romans until he reached Tabuk, where he set camp for about twenty days next to its water resources. He then prayed to Allah for a decision and went back to Al-Madinah because it was a hard year and the people were weak, as we will mention, Allah willing.

I need scriptures that say the prophets prophesied about Muhammed and directed people to follow him.
Please don't quote bible passages that DO NOT speak about Muhammed to me.John 16 did not speak of Muhammed.The Comforter is NOT muhammed!

dastranger:
.

This Qur'an could never have been devised by any besides Allah. Rather it is confirmation of what came before it and an elucidation of the Book which contains no doubt from the Lord of all the worlds. Do they say, "He has invented it"? Say: "Then produce a sura like it and call on anyone you can besides Allah if you are telling the truth."
(Qur'an, 10:37-38)

Verily! It is We(Allah) Who have sent down the Quran to you (O Muhammad SAW) by stages.
(Qur'an , 76:23)

And this is a Book We have sent down and blessed, so follow it and have fear of Allah so that hopefully you will gain mercy. (Qur'an, 6:155)

Haven't the unbelievers considered if this was from other than Allah, they would find within it many contradictions?
[Noble Quran 4:82]


The Quran is from Allah (God) not Muhammad's story

That is simply a question of belief and a religion propagated.Muhammed was said to have seen an angel who revealed the quran(what proof)?
What proof is there that it was angel gabriel he saw?
Again,the complexity of the Quran is no proof of it's authenticity.Do you realise there are other religious books that have remained the same?Do you know there are books- occultic books that are complex?

See it's still not enough PROOF.

Zaikon:
i keep saying this " u will find it difficult to comprehend" . More...

There is nothing I do not comprehend in what you wrote and the verse of the Quran you quoted.

Your wife is 7mths pregnant and you say you want to settle your debts and start buying baby things in the next 3 mths?Your baby will come in about 2 months.
Well now you need to cut down on all unnecessary spending and look for ways of settling your debts.

Now as a Christian,do you personally believe in tithing?Abraham,Isaac and Jacob tithed and they didn't do it because there was a law that compelled them to do it.They gave it of faith,they made God a partner.Those who don't understand it may disagree with the principle.If a man pays tithe and says it makes him more indebted,he should look more towards his confessions.

Take practical steps to manage your finances well.

Zaikon:
the story wasn't PROPHET MUHAMMED's story but it was a Qur'anic verse which you also quote. That reminds me what about that one I strike in which you quote as a verse

Is the Quran not Muhammed's story?

Zaikon:
. I understand you too well *winks* no comment not just say an assumptions... More ?

Jesus came and fulfilled a purpose.The story was that he was killed and was raised from the dead even before Muhammed was born.Muhammed came later with his story that he did not die but another person was killed in his place.Even before Muhammed came there was the story that he died but did not rise from the dead.
I can say it was Muhammed's story and assumption since he did not leave any undeniable proof except his story that it was what God told him.

Zaikon:
Tanx bro I gat little typo errors initialy hia u hav it .". And [for] their saying, "Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the
son of Mary, the messenger of Allah ." And they did not kill him, nor
did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them.
And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no
knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not
kill him, for certain.

Well I'll say your response is an assumption too.

Zaikon:
[b] Qur'an 9:29 Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day, nor hold that
forbidden which has been forbidden by God and His Apostle, nor
acknowledge the religion of truth, [even if they are] of the People of
the Book, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel
themselves subdued.
Some people have falsely concluded from verse 9:29, that Muslims are
commanded to attack all non-Muslims until they pay money. In fact,
such an interpretation is completely false and contradicts authentic
Islamic teachings. Commenting on this verse, Shaykh Jalal Abualrub
writes:
These Ayat (Quranic verses) stress the necessity of fighting against the
People of the Scripture, but under what conditions? We previously
established the fact that the Islamic State is not permitted to attack
non-Muslims who are not hostile to Islam, who do not oppress
Muslims, or try to convert Muslims by force from their religion, or
expel them from their lands, or wage war against them, or prepare for
attacks against them. If any of these offenses occurs, however, Muslims
are permitted to defend themselves and protect their religion.
Muslims are not permitted to attack non-Muslims who signed peace
pacts with them, or non-Muslims who live under the protection of the
Islamic State.

Qur'an 4:157And because of their saying (in
boast), "We killed Messiah 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the
Messenger of Allâh," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but
the resemblance of 'Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they
killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They
have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For
surely; they killed him not [i.e. 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary) ]:
But Allâh raised him ['Iesa (Jesus)] up (with his body and soul) unto
Himself (and he is in the heavens). And Allâh is Ever All-Powerful, All
Wise.}his body and soul were raised to the heavens.
It is confirmed in the Saheeh that he will descend with his body and
soul. Because if Allah meant that I’sa died, He would have said: ‘They
did not kill him, and they did not crucify him, but he died’.
That is why some Ulamah said: “and raise you” means “I take you up”,
i.e. with body and soul’.
In Arabic language “Tawafaitu” i.e. I received the amount in full, and
“Istawfait” means the same thing. The word “Tawafa” does not
necessarily refer to the “taking” of body and soul.
It can also refer to ‘taking the soul away at the time of sleep’.

Qur'an Qur'an 5:47
Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed
therein. If any do fail to judge by(the light of) what Allah revealed,
they are (no longer better than) those who rebel.

We must read everything in its context. When one sees the clear evidence that Islam
teaches that the text of the Christian and Jewish scriptures of today is corrupt, he or
she then must attempt to harmonize and understand what the other verses are
speaking about. When all verses are looked at together, the problem will go away.
The main problem with Christians who put forth these arguments is that they fail to
identify and understand how the Qur'an uses the terms 'Torah' and 'Gospel' in the
Qur'an. When the Qur'an talks about the Torah and Gospel, one of its intentions is to
speak about the original revelations sent to Moses and Jesus peace be upon them
both respectively. Sometimes the Qur'an or authentic hadith might appear to be
speaking about the Torah and Gospel, which Jews and Christians refer to.
[/b]

Can you provide PROOF that the resemblance of Jesus was placed on another man who was killed?
The bible records that some people were sent to watch over the tomb of Jesus so that his body was not stolen.When He resurrected and they couldn't find Him,they reported back to those who gave them the instruction.These people gave them money and told them to go round saying Jesus' body was stolen by his disciples and many believed them(Matt.28:13)
Anyone can tell stories.Muhammed told his own story.
I will be convinced with PROOF that indeed someone else was killed in Jesus' place.

Abasi Mbok! Poor girl just ekking out a living.She ought not to be on the streets in the first place.

But why dey come leave her under tyre?

If she is not bad looking,what should matter is her presentation,carriage and character.
She should be neat,dress well and be friendly.

She should not neglect prayer too,it works.

I hope when she was young she was not posing for potential suitors.

dre11:
Wetin the girl wan use football age do since she is not into any sport from what I gather from the post and her profile

What i am trying to say in essence is that Gbolahan is not 23yrs old.

dre11:
How do u know that she is a teen
You get winch eye ni

If the boy get football age,the girl sef go get.

23yr old and the girl is probably a teenager...........hmmm

Wish them a happy married life.

The cycle could be delayed but the only way to be sure is to do a pregnancy test.
Yes a woman can still see her period though pregnant.

Reiyvinn:
LOL and that's EXACTLY the point I was making. I really don't know why Christians do that nonsense. You read 2 - 3 lines out of a lengthy post and assume you've gotten all the point(s) the OP has to offer and when you come up with a response, it's so repulsive as filth.

What happened to where Zikdik ASKED the audience what they'd do if they lived during the Pre-Jesuit era where the Jewish Law was still very much binding on worshipers of Yahweh and what they'd do if they caught two Homos or Adulterers in the act?

Or the part he described the gruesome practice of the 'stone to death' judicial act?

Of course, you didn't read to that part. You were obviously stuck with those 2 - 3 liner assimilation to get there and thus your response was obviously oblivious to that.

Now that's very silly.



*Laughs in Chinese*

Go and re-read my response to your comment and when you're done, come back and tell me if I insult your person or addressed the nature of the comment which is exactly what I said it is: silly.

No point having a lengthy conversation with you.Anyone who is wise and of understanding can decipher.

Reiyvinn:
Go and re-read my response to your comment and when you're done, come back and tell me if I insult your person

Reiyvinn:
thorpido ...., you're here re-advertising your sheer idiocy.

You're obviously not a wise person and of short-term memory.

Reiyvinn:
thorpido ....mtchew! instead of you to take your time to read through the entire post to see how off-the-mark you are, you're here re-advertising your sheer idiocy.

Anyway, I mean no offense O 'Christ-like' One. Enjoy yourself

I understand there are many like you on this forum,so I won't take offence.
The thread is easy enough to understand.It speaks about cherry-picking scriptures.I quoted a scripture saying there is an understanding that comes with scriptures.You come here saying stuff showing you obviously didn't understand that scripture.
I take no offence.I understand.

*modified
Reiyvinn,I just checked your profile and I see you have a thread condemning people's insulting habits.
Yet your comments here are full of it.Hypocritical much!
No wonder.

Reiyvinn:
Did I read and understand the entire post before commenting Jeez! I am silly, seriously!

Again I say,THE UNDERSTANDING.If you don't have it,everything looks silly.

You probably have a wrong statistic or impression.Maybe you pay more attention to the threads encouraging separation or divorce than the ones encouraging working on the relationships.
There are countless threads that advise on patience,romance and other things to make the marriage work.



Emphasis is usually on abuse(continuous) and cheating.

Good traits?
If the person you want to marry has similar good traits as any of your parents,why wouldn't you want to marry them?

figlio:
I am studying at the state university, but yes my dad is from Gombe even though my mom is from Imo, that makes me a northerner I bet?

Oh well,You're a Gombe citizen then.

Thank God for your life.

But Op,why una still dey rooted to that place?Are u a northerner?

Try to see a specialist(a physician/pulmonologist).I would advise you repeat the Mantoux test.
Also Op,have u done HIV test?

When will this madness stop?

The war can only be won in the mosques,not in the forests.

He should have spoken about how he got her pregnant outside of marriage which was against what he was taught in House on the Rock.

...not judging him.Just saying.