₦airaland Forum

budaatum:
This is just utter nonsense. If a remedy effects a cure, it has worked. And that work is the evidence of its efficacy. And scientist will search to discover why it works because that's what scientists do, they find causes for effects, and effects for causes.

You are yapping nonsense because you don't know the difference between anecdotal evidence and scientific evidence . And why did you not specify what remedy this time .

You want to deceive yourself . We are talking about herbal remedy which sometimes is not scientifically proven and not any other kind . Stick with that .

And if one scientist ignores that effect or cause, many others wouldn't so science can not ignore. But who goes looking for "no evidence it can effect a cure" just because "people are already using it everywhere to treat themselves with perfect results"? Hasn't research shown numerous so called cures that have had no effect despite the user claiming they have? Should objective evidence of a cure not be ascertained before you claim it works?

I guess its to do with how your brain works. But I would however leave you with some wise words once uttered.
https://www.nairaland.com/6589774/sandra-ezekwesili-prophet-tb-joshua/6#102467464

Gibberish and irrelevant nonsense you brought in.

I'm not interested in guess work to know how my consciousness work. If you depend on that ,goodluck .i

People don't have cognitive dreams because they believe in it
It has nothing to do with believe It's a natural phenomenon . Even atheist have such dreams that come to pass .

budaatum:
Of course there's a difference in cause and effect, but you only find out what makes a thing work after you have ascertained sufficiently that it works, and both require detail records of the method used for both which is what science is.

Not everyone is properly trained to carry out scientific research concerning the things they use or consume . You didnt make any sense here.

Of course "not so"! You first have to have competence in the chosen field and your research has to show significant improvements on previous research for anyone to bother, and the reason they would bother is because there's money in doing so. And it's not true you can't fund your own scrutiny. Companies do it all the time, and even pay to have results fiddled, though they are usually rumbled in the end.

You answered your previous comments here . There must be competence in carrying out research . Not everyone can do it .

The local woman who sells local herbal remedies lack competence to scientifically explain how what she sells work .

As long as it's not toxic, please allow her to sell her products in peace . Look elsewhere for your cure .

At least you see the sense why products manufactures should not do so .

budaatum:
Coming from a home shared by a medical professional, I can't possibly be that stupid and ignorant.

Cure for temperature amongst many is to cover the shivering person in lots of clothing which rises their temperature even further. Some don't have fits but many do and die, but ask those who live and they'd claim it works.

Once, ma got called by a parent in the neighbourhood. Her daughter was burning hot, please help. On arrival, ma took child's temperature, quickly took child's clothes and blanket coverings off child and dunked (I exaggerate small), child in the woman's Coca-Cola cooler. Minutes later the child's temperature dropped and after being treated for malaria the child was well a few days later.

That's why we do science, as in keep objective records of the tests we do that prove a thing works or not. This objective evidence we record is what shows whether a thing worked or not, and if it works, we do more science to find out what makes it work.


Your subjective truth, you mean, which you are trying very hard but failing to present as some sort of objective truth?

Seriously, I am surprised you'd think your claims would not be scrutinised here. You'd think your time here would have thought you it would, but I guess you might have failed to consider the feedback you been getting.

The alternative, which I am very certain many others get here is, use your senses to check all spirits. It's even in a book read by many, though I don't expect you to see it in that context.

You failed already and just grasping at straws .

How can you scrutinize what you are clueless about ?

What do you know about most of the things I have mentioned . Nothing.

Do they teach them in regular schools? . No

Do you have any direct experience on any of these things. No .

So tell me, what have you been depending on to examine them ?

Can t you see you have been acting irrationally with your failed attempts to make mockery of what I have so far presented ?

I have advised you before ,Stick to what you know so you don't continue to overreach yourself . You have fumbled already ,and without shame still want to continue .

You don't know the difference between precognition and premonition .

You don't know what a 'third eye ' refers to . You think it's a real third eye in the middle of ones head .Lol . I Shared a link to educate you ,but won't read it because you think you know everything .

You don't know the technical meaning of NDE ,nor do you know the difference between OBE and NDE,.

The worst part you don't know what constitute a valid scientific research ,or what scientific evidence really means amongs scientist who use that technical expression all the time .

Despite not understanding any of these ,you want to believe you are in a position to advise me to use my senses , when you have learnt how to use yours very well? I think something is really wrong with you .You need help

The only thing you are good at is clowning yourself with you other fiend


BTW none of the things I have mentioned are my subjective truths ,but truths about the human being and the world we live iñ ,which most people are not aware of.

They have become my own truths because I have earned them from some of the understanding I have gotten from how my consciousness operates . Are you aware of how yours. You should channel your attention there ?

Please just ignore me if what I present here is causing you cognitive dissonance . Both of us cannot have the same life experiences . Look to yours and learn from it .

Sages of old have advised ,'man know thyseif ' what do you know of yourself ?

What are you ?

You like to use the Bible , and it says , 'the kingdom of God is within you . What does this mean ?


I replied Lordreed, not you .Give him the space to respond if he wants to and don't derail my conversation with him.

If you think my claims are not scientifically proven, ( you don't even know what that means ) then don't buy my 'herbal products '

But as long as I have issued a disclaimer , I acted responsibly and so free to 'sell'. Please look elsewhere for your cure . I don't have what you are looking for .

Thank you .

Maynmann:
Most pharmaceutical drugs are “herbal”.

A person coming up with a herbal drink that’s medicinal is practicing Science already.

Is “science” synonymous with “white” people?


All these people selling herbs in the market know how fermentation and other scientific method works and its effects to produce it. They know what leaves contain which and which vitamins, all these are part of “science”.

I agree with you mayman ,but your observation is not the bone of contention here .

I have advised you before to go back and read how it all started so you don't misconstrue me again and again .

And where did I say science is synonymous with white people ?

In 1946, a man called John Godley – then a student at Oxford University – dreamt he was reading a list of horse race winners in a newspaper and saw the names Bindal and Juladdin. The following day he checked a newspaper and found that two horses with those names were running that day. He risked a bet with a group of friends; both horses won, and the group won large sums of money.

article continues after advertisement
Godley had the same experience several times over the following years. The fourth time he had such a dream, he made a written statement of his predictions (again involving two horses), which was witnessed by several people, sealed in an envelope, stamped by a post office official, and locked away until the day of the race. When this prediction came true, Godley became famous.

The standard scientific reaction would be to explain this story in terms of coincidence, exaggeration, or fraud. Many scientists are convinced that psi phenomena such as precognition do not exist. However, I am open to the existence of such phenomena. This is partly because, on occasion, I have experienced them myself. I have also had a few precognitive dreams related to sport. It’s not as though I dream about sports matches regularly. I can only recall a few such dreams. But on most of these occasions, the details of my dreams have been correct.

Continue here,



https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/out-the-darkness/202107/the-possibility-precognition%3famp

Is precognition a possibilty and are there benefits for possessing this ability

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/out-the-darkness/202107/the-possibility-precognition%3famp

budaatum:
If you found a way to ascertain it works, nothing is wrong with that at all. Just that we will ask you to provide us with the tests and studies you did to ascertain it works, and we will perform those tests ourselves to ascertain it works too. We wouldn't just take your word for it.

"Herbal products in the market comes with this disclaimer" because it has not been proven to cure what they claim. Its like if you found a way to ascertain it works but refuse to provide evidence of your claim for scrutiny or scrutiny of your tests failed to ascertain what you claim you ascertained, when you bottle it to sell, we will insist you label it with "the claims of cure in this product is not yet proven", and that's provided you prove it's not toxic, in which case we shall not let you sell it all. Snake oil would come under that label except those who sell it leave it off to deceive.

You don't still get it.

There's a difference between ,'it works ' and 'what makes it to work .

There are herbal remedies in the market , right now,which are very effective in curing some ailments that main stream scientist have yet to find a cure for .

Most people, who use them, know they work , not because they carried out any scientific studies or test of their own before usage ,but because it has helped them personally to treat a particular ailment they once sufferred from ,and also know of millions of others who have also benefited in the same way .

The product manufacturer may have carried out scientific research on his own to know why it works and is sure about that ,but not yet confirmed by other scientist .


Scientific analysis or study done by others in the main body of sciences to determine if an herbal product , or claim ,can effect a cure goes through a very strict and rigorous process.. In most cases ,it usually takes time and huge amount of funding to conduct .

Scientists and regulatory agencies , don't always have all the funds available each time to ascertain all claims of cure ,or any other kinds of claims ,made by anyone, or group of persons . Different claims keep coming up every now and then .



Another another thing you need to know is that , the person who is making the herbal claim is not allowed to provide the funding for such confirmation in order not to unduly influence what other scientist will be doing to validate it.



It's because you are unaware of what goes on within the scientific community ,you just assume that if an individual scientist or group of scientist present their own research findings for just about anything for verification, then it will be investigated immediately . Not so.

You have used to personal pronoun ,we' as if you are a trained scientist and so know better when infact you are clueless about some of those things .Don't pretend what you are not to win argument . Be yourself .

Everything is not investigated and not everthing will be investigated . You as an individual will sometimes need to do that yourself instead of waiting lazily all the time for scientist to come up with something before you start taking advantage of it.



Those in the main body of the sciences are not too keen to validate herbal claims ,especially if there's already an orthodox cure available . We all saw that during the covid 19 pandemic .

There's politics in the sciences too. Morever ,Scientist are also humans with their own
personal bias which sometimes influences their decision making .

I'm not against scientist or science ,far from it ,but only follow it with common sense, and not just swallow everything and end up being used as a guinea pig , or start acting irrationally based on wrong conclusion arrived at in the sciences which will be later abandoned for another .

However ,there are enough reasons to trust scientists more than pastors ,but one should always apply common sense .



People are always coming up with different claims of cure ,some very good ,others empty claims .

So in the absence of scientific validation by the 'we' ,how do we know which claim is true or false ?

It's by verifying it ourselves , and using it ,if not toxic, while waiting waiting for confirmation from the ' we'


. If it's not toxic and works ,without scientific validation, use it. .



This is my position .

And why are you against this and don't want me to speak my truth which others who don't know about it could benefit from ?

The worst part you have not provided any reasonable alternative .

budaatum:
This is just utter nonsense. If a remedy effects a cure, it has worked. And that work is the evidence of its efficacy. And scientist will search to discover why it works because that's what scientists do, they find causes for effects, and effects for causes. And if one scientist ignores that effect or cause, many others wouldn't so science can not ignore. But who goes looking for "no evidence it can effect a cure" just because "people are already using it everywhere to treat themselves with perfect results"? Hasn't research shown numerous so called cures that have had no effect despite the user claiming they have? Should objective evidence of a cure not be ascertained before you claim it works?

I guess its to do with how your brain works. But I would however leave you with some wise words once uttered.
https://www.nairaland.com/6589774/sandra-ezekwesili-prophet-tb-joshua/6#102467464

If I found a way to ascertain it works , what is wrong with that ?

Do you know the reason why some herbal products in the market comes with this disclaimer , 'the claims of cure in this product is not yet proven '

budaatum:
You will teach me through the wall with your third eyes no doubt.

You are very predicted . I know you will respond this way to avoid dealing with the embarrassment your stupidity has caused you .

Look for someone else to teach you , or teach yourself .old fool who doesn't know the difference between precognition and premonition .

What is third. eye and where did I say I have a third eye .

Third eye is in quotes .Werey who doesn't know that if an expression is in quote it doesn't mean it literally. Dumbo

Maynmann:
No, scientists can’t explain it not science.

One of the characteristics of a monotheistic deity is “omni’science”, science is the only way to know and understand the universe.

The better we get at science the better it is for everyone .

You jumped into something you didnt even bothered to check what has gone on before now .

The discussion is not centered on any monotheistic deity or any kind of deity whatsoever . I'm not a theist .


You don't know the issue under contention . It's as simple as that .


Read first so you understand why I made that comment you have responded to . It has nothing to do with what you think .

Who here has listened to Davido's hit jamb, already topping the charts in 17 countries and still counting

Dem go feel it ' !

Honestly this is the first I time have liked his music , and have been playing it on repeat as I type all of this .

Dem go feel it , dem go

I'm sure someone is feeling it here

Some blind followers of science here don't understand what it really means to say something doesn't find scientific support yet ,but it's truth.

Some herbal remedies which are far effective than the orthodox ones sometimes don't find supported yet , . The truth here, is that it works ,but since scientist have not been able to identify the active constituents in the plant which gives it its healing property ,they will declare before they know it , that there is no evidence it can effect a cure ,even when people are already using it everywhere to treat themselves with perfect results .

Some ignoramous here dont understand this ,and carry this lack of understanding into every discussion , ' if it's not scientific proven it's not true ' or it can work who says

Go and educated yourself properly what is scientific evidence or scientific proven in the sciences , and how it's used .

Don't use your layman understanding to interpret technical terms in the sciences . You will only end up making a fool of yourself .




There are alternative methods to knowing truth in the world we live in , before main stream scientist could validate it.



Scientist only validate truths already existing nature , they don't create them and don't yet know everyone of the truths in this physical universe we collectively share as humans .

And anyone can stumble on this truths themselves if they know how , without having to wait for trained scientists which we all trust to do so before we know and accept them .

Half education is dangerous .

budaatum:
I will quote you as much as I want actually and subjectively.

And I will continue to expose your ignorance each time you do so ,and I just did that . Lol

You don't yet know what you into , or the person you are discussing with, if not ,you would have avoided me.

You are about to learn the hard way

I

Very embarrassing for someone who claimed to have schooled in England not to know the difference between precognition and premonition .

Here
Truths in the world science still can't explain.

https://www.sciencealert.com/9-phenomena-that-science-still-can-t-explain

Is there a ' third eye' . What actually is it.

https://www.verywellmind.com/opening-your-third-eye-7501747

I have maintained that some of the things I present here are not fully supported by science ,but it doesnt mean they are not true , people have experienced them and these experiences ,scientist says, happen ,but can't be explained

There are truths not yet supported by science . Blind followers of science are ignorant of this fact .

The placebo effect is one of the truths science cannot explain, that is they still don't know the cause ,but know it works ,hence it's used in drug trials .

That's the difference .

Half education is dangerous .

Precognition

Premonition

One should master how to think critically first before trying to teach others what it is .

If you have dream where a friend bought a particular brand of car for you ,and a week later , ,it happens in the waking state exactly the same way, and it's the exact brand of car ,that's a perfect example of precognitive dream . Meaning you saw the event ,all of it , and not just that you had an inkling of it happening .

And that's what I'm talking about . One should take time to critically analyse what another as described before interpreting it so as not to make a fool of oneself .

Precognition vs premonition . Half education is dangerous .

budaatum:
He doesn't know. He just wants to test if others know.

Speak for yourself . What do you know ?

Nothing .

You shared the link to an article containing certain info that are no longer current and don't even know it, yet you still want talk ? This is not the first time ,and you claimed you schooled in England ?

If that's true ,then you must have been one of the dullest in class . Who else if not a slowpoke that would reference an article written in 2017, without first confirming if everything there is still valid .

You continue to show why someone here once called you a scientific illiterate . That's what you are.

And please stop quoting me . I don't want to discuss with someone like you that maliciously edited my comments, out of the context it was made , and then match it with another one to misrepresent me .

Are you not ashamed for such display of stupidity ?

Rest old fool

LordReed:
Then how do you know it isn't a product of the interactions in the brain and body?

Brilliant question. I will answer it immediately because I know you will take your time to read everything before replying .

It's said that the human mind functions in two modes, the unconscious (AKA the subconscious) and the conscious . Everything we experience subjectively within ourselves can come from either of the two .

The operations of the latter is easily seen in the observable human brain .

For instance , we know the part of the brain that is responsible for the sense of Smell ,taste ,sight ,etc. However there's a limit to which the brain can make us perceive anyrhing that come from outside of it

As for the unconscious ,not much is known of how it operates and what part of the brain controls what it does. Most people just assume it's the brain that controls it , and call it the non conscious part of the brain . That assumption is wrong as you shall come to see .

The subconscious mind can make us known directly things the observable human brain is incapable of making us sense or experience at any given time .

With the subconscious, one can have a precognition of an event that is yet to occur or know it before it manifest later. No part of the brain has been identified that can make this happen , yet some persons have this sort of experiences all the time .

The brain together with the central nervous system cannot make us experience anything else apart from what is already stored in it , or what it's programmed to react to. But when that happens ,insisting it's still the brain that has made it happen is foolish and ignorant talk by someone who is not too well informed of the science behind the human body .

Also the subconscious can make it possible to 'see' through walls to know what is happening behind it.,not with the physical eyes of course ,but through what some persons refer to as the third eye .Not an actual eye really ,but it's own unique way of making one perceive reality directly, far better than what the five physical senses can give us.

When the unconscious 'sees ' anything ,it flashes it across the screen of your mind so one is aware of it, and also for the brain to store and process it. But most people are so disconnected from their unconscious, or not fully conscious of their own consciousness , that they are not even aware when this happens within themselves ,

There is no part of the brain that can make one "see" through walls . But some persons have had that kind of experience and when they report it ,,some ignorant persons who believe it's not possible , would dismiss it with , Oh, You were just hallucinating or it was conincidence.

Furthermore ,the subconscious can make anybody perceive the smell of something beyond the normal range of what the brain can detect ..Some humans and animals ,sniffer dogs especially, can sense the 'smell' of an illness,, cancer ,diabetes, etc , weeks or months before it manifest in the human body . The brain is incapable of such function it's limited to only experiencing what is 'there ' already in the body .

And again ,the subsconscious doesn't forget anything. It is not like the brain which forgets easily and cannot store much information or know anything that's not stored within it.

Through hypnosis regression one can recall memories of what one has experienced in the past even to the extent of remembering the exact time one entered the physical body in their mother's womb. If it's possible to remember, through the subconscious , that sort of thing ,which is actually possible with hypnosis ,then ,it would only mean one thing , the real human being is not the same as the body it is believed it emerged from You cannot watch and see your body formimg in your mother's womb before possessing it and still delude yourself into thinking your conscousness or your self has emerged from it. It doesn't make sense .

And finally ,OBEs, which you are yet to accept, is another reason I say consciousness, the real self has not emerged from the brain . Yes , the brain and the central nervous system is what makes us have objective conscousness through the physical body ,but that's not enough reason to conclude it has emergred from it .

My phone, any phone or any other device that's internet enabled , is what gives me presence, or make me come alive on Nairaland, without which nobody can interact with me . Those devices are not me and not responsible for the thoughts I express eventhough it's through them I do so . If they become faulty or damaged, it will affect my presence , or what I try to do get across on this board.( The material plane )



The above analogy, though not perfect ,can help one understand how consciousness ,the real self inside uses a physical body to operate in the material plane . If the brain is dameged ,it is not the being using it that is
directjy affected ,but that only makes it more difficult , or no longer possible to manifest ones intentions through it, since everything coming in and going out then becomes garbled due to the faulty brain . .

The pain we feel when our body gets hurt is to alert us to what has happened withiin it so we can deal with or take care of the problem and continue to using the body . Without this ,you won't know what's going untill the body stops working . But one should know they are not the body , and will depart from it one day .

The human being is much more than its observable physical parts . but unfortunately neuroscientist and others within the scientific community are treating the human being like a machine whose outer body parts and engine once understood ,will make everything fall into place . Unless there is a paradigm shift in the sciences about the human being ,I'm afraid not much will be known . The mystification will continue .

Long time ago when I first started to meditate , I wasn't too sure if what I was doing was worth it or could help me in anyway . The reason for this was because the position of main stream science as at that time was,; meditation was harmful to one's mental health . That it causes depressions and also cannot help you make any meaningful changes within yourself as people who practiced it were claiming .


But my experiences proved otherwise . So I continue ,but with caution .

And now more than 20 years later ,the same scientist are now encouraging people to meditate because they found its helpful for those suffering from depression . Haba!

Well it's still good . It has helped people like me to take the practice more serious since scientist can now confirm it works .


There are meditative techniques to help one separate from the body ,but not easy to master . If you want it fast, then look for individuals with the ability to take you out of your body with your permission . Or join genuine esoteric group to give you the experience during your first initiatiion.

If you don't want to go through that ,then try this , tell you self each night people you go to sleep that you need an experience to confirm if ones consciousness can actually separate from the body . After that don't give it any thought . If it's something you are ready for ,your higher self , the subsconscious , will do everything to make you have the experience so you know the truth about yourself.

So thanks Lordreed for the question. I hope you read all .Most of the things I promised to come with yesterday ,before I was distracted, are contained in it

LordReed:
Where is it localised?

Nobody knows where because the subjective part of one's being is non material

budaatum:
I am not your student nor your slave. Go do your own homework!

https://www.psychologicalscience.org/observer/neuroscience-empathy#comment-8362341

Lol

You are hiding now, and on the defensive


And who tells you I don't have an explanation

I sure do, but wanted to see what you know .

I already explained to Lordreeed in another thread where he asked for a description of the model of consciousness I currently work with.

You can confirm from him . .

You could not even explain rationally what
exactly was making you to react to your mum's emotional states as a kid, without running to Wikipedia to reference an article you lack the basic background knowledge and experience to understand .

Goigke and paste will not help you here as you will continue to display your ignorance by referencing irrelevant materials


You cannot be my student because you are not willing to learn anything , and if I were to buy a slave, not an arrogant one like you that would cause me problems


Stick to what you know very well and don't overeach yourseif by trying to teach what you are clueless about

Good day. .

budaatum:
Every experience that is experienced by a subject is subjective. I.e. Pain of hammer hitting thumb.

All reports of subject's experiences are subjective. I.e. subjects report of hammer hitting subject's thumb, since it is a subjective report of their subjective experience..

Corroboration by subjects (dem say), are subjective. I.e. reports by other subjects of hammer hitting subject's thumb since they did not subjectively experience the hammer subjectively hitting their thumb.

The first link below is on objectivity but I could not access it on my device hence the second link too. Understanding the difference helps understand both.

https://iep.utm.edu/objectiv/

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/scientific-objectivity/

Is this an explanation for what asked for ?

If you cannot explain it ,why don't you just say so instead of wasting my time .

Modified.

You assume you know what I'm talking about ,but I can see you don't , if not ,you will not be asking me to know the difference between subjective and objective .

What I'm descriping is not what you have
directly experiencedd before so you are unable to make head nor tail of it.

Those who have extensive knowledge on the topic and have experienced it directly can make sense of it. .

The limitations of language is the problem .

I will look for simple descriprive words for easier understanding so you don't continue to misrepresent me each time .

Later

@budatum
Below is the full statement . Why have you edited that way ?

triplechoice:
You are one a different wave lentght What you talked of your mother is something other people have experienced .

And it has scientific explanation already . You search for it yourself

budaatum:
I'm very certain my Lord will tell you where to go for asking me to answer a question you can't answer as if you will pay me or I am your slave.

What are you doing ?

I can see you don't teke your time to read my replies .

The second statement is for you not me .

Your experience ,I said is scientifically explained . You look for it .

But I just did that for you .


You should thanking me instead of this misrepresentation

LordReed:
I doubt any neuroscientist is looking for where consciousness is localised in the brain since they understand it is the entire brain that is involved in producing the consciousness not some singular part.

What I actually wanted to say is that the operations of the subconscious is not ocalised in the visible human brain and not that they are trying to look for it there .

budaatum:
I so love how the unconscious and consciousness works. When I was much younger my mama will have headache and my head will be hurting. She broke her leg in Lagos and I was limping in Ibadan, and God help me when she was pregnant 5 times. That's special relationships for you.

Triple, It is not unusual to know the cooking or perfume worn by one one has "some special relationship with".

I'm afraid you are projecting .

I'm not focused on the unusualness of the experience . I don't regard it as unusual as it's normal to me and some other people who have that kind of experience regularly .

I only ask you to provide a rational explanation for the experience . What is the actual cause ?

What you experienced with your mum and what I described are not the same .

You are comparing apples and oranges .

Both experiences are subjective ,but not the exactly the same kind of subjective experience.



Yours is called somatic empathy, and it's triggered in the brain . You were constantly affected by your mum's emotional state due to the strong affinity that exist between the two of you . This kind of experience is also common between siblings that are twins ,and not just anyone .

Distance is not a barrier because neural pathways in your brain , which connects you to your mum , and which also represents the kind of fondness you have for each other ,acts not only as a controller of your behaviour ,but also as a receiver of whatever signal her brain was emitting whenever she was in distress .

The signal that you receive is processed in your brain to activate physiological effects in your body that matches the exact emotional States of your mum, making you to experience it directly.

The one I described is not the same yours . It can happen between anybody ; a perfect strangers one is contacting on phone for the first time, the anonymous person one is chatting with on Nairaland ,Twiiter , Facebook etc ,,and not only those one has a close personal relationship with . I mentioned this breifly in my earlier description ,but you ignored it .

And again ,what is perceived subjectively in what I described are the activities going on in the other person's outer environment, and not what is occuring inside their mind ,

The natural laws controlling the workings of the human brain makes it impossible for anyone to perceive directly the smell of something beyond a certain range .

And when that happens ,what's the cause ?

That's what I want you to explain



I have taken my time to explain your own subjective experience scientifically.

So please reciprocate in kind and don't give me mumbo jumbo., or irrelevant links .Thank you

@ I invite Lordreed to be the moderator for this one