₦airaland Forum

The Gospel according to Shdemidemi;

shdemidemi:
Tongues or praying all together never edify anyone.

Holy Spirit through the inspired pen of Paul the apostle;
1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

I chose the word of God over your garbage. Am sorry if I esteem His revelation infinitesimally higher than your puny brains imagination

shdemidemi:
ok..I will let you the last say.

I have the benefit of the entire canon of 66 books to deal with my health. Part of that is to anoint and pray for the sick not just wait to die. I choose to run to God over your impotence

shdemidemi:
If Paul prescribed alcohol for Timothy, what does that tell you? If oil could do it, he would simply tell him to take oil but he opted for a form of anaesthetic to ease the pain. Mind you, this is not a one off problem, Timothy had been suffering from the stomach pain before the particular recorded instance.

shdemidemi:
They were not talking rubbish like the corinthian church. They were not abusing the gift at Pentecost so there is a difference between these two tongues.

I don't know what you mean by rubbish. Whatever Corinthians did came from the Spirit. If Holy Spirit utterances are rubbish, I'd rather that any time to your scripture illiteracy trash

They did not need interpreters because every one heard them in the languages.

Interpretation of tongues is a spiritual gift. Why is it necessary? Why does the Holy Spirit go out of His way to give this precious gift that elevates tongues to prophecy?

Some people called them drunks is not sufficient enough to claim they were doing what the church in Corinth did. Even if they had rushed out to speak in their local dialect some might as well call them drunks.

They spoke in tongues, Corinthians spoke in tongues. You need a degree in logic to equate the two?

Get interpreters first while you are at it tell bidam and other churches to stop disobeying Paul's instruction on the matter.

Start revering the Word of God before calling Holy Spirit utterances gibberish and spreading your impotence all over

You couldn't have been more right on the abuse of common sense. If the bible recorded the thoughts of people's mind, what is then difficult to record something that you hold in lofty esteem.

Tongues are gifts. I didn't ask for them, nor did the apostles. I esteem what Holy Spirit is doing in my life. Feel free to trash that

Paul instructed the church to pray, He instructed Timothy in particular on how and what to pray at gatherings so that isn't an apt question. He never told him to make some vulgar utterances for any reason.
1 Timothy 2
I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people--

The same Paul by the Holy Spirit records

1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

Paul used a marriage situation to explain what it means to be bought by God from the slave market and what is expected from the slave.
Romans 7
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

Paul is teaching about covenants not marriage. I asked for marriage teachings in Romans

Nor did Paul prescribe that for Timothy's ailments. I have the entire 66 books not just James. That spares me tunnel vision and other idiocies such as an-unknown-tongue vs tongues Shdemidemi-esque religious garbage

shdemidemi:
James did not tell his audience to do that though. He said-
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:

Is that what you do? No.

Ordinarily you have flouted that instruction, if what you do is visit medical science for solution.

I fight diseases with EVERYTHING, prayers, medical science and living a healthy lifestyle

shdemidemi:
So when you are sick, you go to church for oil and not the hospital?

This is what lack of understanding of the word does- Delusion in high places.

shdemidemi:
[5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.

Why was tongues given by God at this time?

It was a perfect occasion, every nation under heaven was represented here. What better time could the Holy Spirit have announced Himself to the world. The tongue at pentecost will be of no use if nobody there understands what the people were saying. The bible says everybody heard them speak in his local dialect. I don't understand why you can't see beyond your nose on this isuue.

1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
The 120 NEVER understood what they were saying. Those who did heard them praising. It is important to note that despite them understanding what they were saying, some dismissed them as drunks. Little wonder then that tongues not understood is gibberish to you

Even if you go back, where is the interpreter? none.

Paul recommends INTERPRETATION which is a gift. We should desire not just tongues but interpretation as well

Why don't you heed Paul's advice by holding to the greater gift of prophecy.

All gifts are given by Holy Spirit as he purposes but we are exhorted to desire prophecy and interpreting tongues

This is where you must rightly divide and not misrepresent scripture. If self edification by tongue is so important or relevant to the body, we would have seen Paul, Timothy, Peter do it but no, they never did.

Common sense is the most abused term. Here is why, if they prayed in tongues and they were edified, how would that be recorded? on DVDs? How many Timothy prayers are recorded? Did he ever pray?

1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

says who?

Show me marriage teachings from Romans

shdemidemi:
Do you even understand what LOVE means? Love isn't self. Love is putting your brother before yourself.

Love is not self edification.

Love is the fruit of studying the Word

God/Jesus/the Word(Spirit) is Love

All these edify when we understand the Word not gibberish my brother.

At this point, I look to Jesus CHrist and how he responded to Satan, IT IS WRITTEN
1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
If this is not enough for you, nothing will EVER deliver you.

This is exactly what I am saying. No one should present himself as one that has a power to call miracle at their whims and caprices. God remains sovereign.

If God gives christians power to do as they will for one hour, you and I won't be here, we will be dead. I say we won't be here because some christian somewhere might see us as his enemy and quickly decree that we die. When you hear what some christians pray for you will understand why God hold all powers to Himself.

Again just as my Master would have the devil, IT IS WRITTEN
James 5:14-15 King James Version (KJV)
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
The same man who teaches us to say 'God willing' teaches us to pray for the sick while Shdemidemi would have us rant to GOd about our issues to get them off our chest...very therapeutic excuse for impotence

shdemidemi:
People understood what Peter and the rest spoke at Pentecost. Would they really need an interpreter in the context of the tongues in Acts 2? No. These gift of interpretation was a way of making them stick to that which is profitable and greater in a place where tongues have been abused.

The reason they understood is because there was a gathering for the Feast in Jerusalem devout Jews from so many (at least 15) parts of the world and each heard the Galilean speak their own language/dialect. Common sense tells you if the gathering was not there, few to nobody would have understood
Acts 2:8-11 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,
10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,
11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

We don't see interpreters of gibberish in the church, all we see are speakers of gibberish. Is this not going against the teachings of Paul himself?

Then the solution is to go back to Pauline regulations of the gifts not to discard them and pretend they don't exist

I am showing you where you get your warped idea of tongues. Its from this church and a poor holistic understanding of what the Apostle was looking to achieve.

AM showing you Holy Spirit spoke by the pen of Paul the Apostle and that's all that matters. Were those words inspired or not?

The best church Paul had never mentioned tongues, in fact no other church mentioned it. Trust the spiritually weak to pick their major doctrine from a book of correction and rebuke due to carnality.

That is the gospel according to you. I only need to hear ONCE from Holy Spirit to believe it. If you need repetition, you are on your own bro. Ephesians dwell at length on husband-wife relationship. The same is not mentioned in Romans. Does that make whatever Paul says about marriage to Ephesus localized and thus less universal?

Bro, whatever the language we will be deceiving ourself if we say 'brojkdkjdkkddkdkk' means a thing. Put the mooted argument away, where are the interpreters?

Tongues like interpretation are gifts of the Holy Spirit. How would Mandarin sound to you?

You need to have some reverence for the Word of God. He has esteemed His Word above His name (Psalms 138:2) and you are busy trashing it? Holy Spirit is telling you tongues edify and you are drowning in your obtuseness by insisting they don't. You are fighting God to keep your religious garbage

shdemidemi:
What was the effect of pentecost? It was to empower the Apostles.
The glory of God was present and powerful around this time that people died instantly for lying. The Apostles had so much power that people needed them to receive the Holy Spirit. All these things aren't so today, that period initiated a new dispensation of Grace. Tongues will not add to you or the church today- only the Word can do that.

Correction my broda,
On Pentecost they had at least 120 out of whom ONLY 12 were apostles. The empowerment was therefore not a reserve of the 12 but EVERYONE. Peter later preaching said the very things they were observing was for them, their children and as many as the Lord may call

Acts 2:38-39 King James Version (KJV)
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized [size=20pt]every one of you[/size] in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Paul an apostle under the inspiration of Holy Ghost says tongues edifies and Shdemidemi blowing hot air says tongues don't edify. Who is right?

1 Corinthians 8:1 King James Version (KJV)
8 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
LOVE too edifies not just tongues.

I pray you may outgrow inventing strawman arguments and false dilemmas to disguise your weak arguments. Being edified by tongues or Love does not negate scriptures; they are not mutually exclusive. It is not either you are edified by tongues or scriptures, it is both. Remember it is the very WORD of God that teaches us that tongues and Love edifies.
If I read scriptures and learnt about Love and applied the same and was edified, was I edified by love or scriptures?

Ask yourself if Peter wouldn't raise James if it was all in his hands to decide who stays dead or who deserves to come back to life. The Apostles latched unto what the Spirit was doing at all times. They were mere tools used by the Spirit, they had no power or agenda within them to do any mighty works.

ALL God's miracles are wrought by Holy Spirit working through believers. Minus the Spirit, we can't do nothing. This was so in the First Century church, it is so today

shdemidemi:
What Paul wished for these people was to speak a language that could be put in to words. A language that someone around will also be able to interpret to the congregation. It isn't what the 'church' do today, where they all speak in tongues (gibberish) against the instruction of the Apostle.

My brother, interpreting tongues is a GIFT of the Holy Spirit. If I spoke in Yoruba and a Yoruba believer understood what am saying, that is no gift of the Holy Ghost. Interpretation of tongues is supernatural comprehension of a language you have never learnt. In its absence, there was no need for public tongues

The best that can happen if the church interpret tongues according to 1 cor 14:5 is to be at par with prophesying. Paul made it clear he would rather have them do prophesying/teaching head on to blowing hot air.

When a toddler speaks, we say things like only God understand what the child is saying. This is exactly what Paul was saying- no one understand you, I will rather have you speak what we all understand so we can all be built in God.

Once again, your beef with what 'church do today' does not substract from Holy Spirit inspiration. The solution is to go back to scriptures not to dismiss tongues

Why would they speak in tongues at Pentecost? It was real. They were not just talking nonsense..illiterates were speaking things beyond their capacity.

Paul came back to give these regulation as a guide because it was abused in this church. This church mirrors today's church, they love to show off with their supposed God given gifts. Paul had to address the issue by telling them they can't all have the showy gifts and how they should have love for one another before any spiritual gift. They were getting the whole thing wrong just like we are today.

There is a difference between languages and gibberish. I don't speak spanish but I can sure tell the difference between 'amigo' and 'prokotoloshamoraba'. Unknown tongue is not a language, it is a lazy way of praying by moving your mouth freely without thinking much.

There are over 3,000 languages and dialects in the world not to mention hundreds of extinct languages, and it is highly probable that not every congregation is represented by believers who understand ALL of these at the same time. Common sense demands that I don't dismiss tongues I don't understand because I can only speak four languages of the 3,000

I second ayoku777.

Shdemidemi believes prayer is a mere psychological exercise where you get it off your chest by ranting before God. For him, NOTHING is accomplished by prayer that was not God's will so prayer or no prayer, His will prevails.
That is the most m0ronic version of fatalism. What about scriptures, or evangelism? Why preach the gospel?

Bidam:
I like the bold, hope shdemidemi is putting on his thinking cap.

So what is Paul saying here?

1 Corinthians 14:4-5 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
5 I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Christians did not invent tongues or other gifts of the Spirit, it was and it remains part and parcel of the gospel, a gift to everyone who believes first prophesied by Joel and confirmed from Pentecost

shdemidemi:
Jesus says 'He is the way the truth and the life', He proclaimed Himself as the only way to the father. The gospel message is Christ and it is the only way we can become spiritually built (edified). Not by tongues, prayers fasting or some other out of body experiences.

Romans 10:1-2 King James Version (KJV)
1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

The zeal is certainly commendable but is it according to knowledge?

Bidam:
Lol,shdemidemi is zealous for the traditions of those who do not believe in tongues. I wonder how he interprets clear statements from scriptures. In his mind he feels he is sincere, but it is a pity that he is sincerely wrong. When someone promotes his own understanding of scripture as the truth and makes it a constant for a long time and this so called truth is in direct opposition to the will of God it becomes a tradition.

shdemidemi:
Tongues or praying all together never edify anyone.

How can somebody who pretends to have a modicum of reverence for the scriptures state this?

ayoku777:
Now how do you mean tongues edifies no one? Who is saying something that is not in the scriptures now?

1Cor 14v4 -He that speaketh in an unknown tongue EDIFIETH himself

The same Paul that spoke of love and charity also said in 1Cor 14v18 -I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all.

No one is saying the scripture is not a tool of edification, but to say that is the ONLY tool of edification is as wrong as it comes. Or show us in scripture where the scripture is describes as the ONLY tool of edification.

An angelic king of Salem?

Legacy44:
I believe Melchizedek is an Angel

We have been called to destroy arguments that's what I learnt from the Strange Fire Conference. Stop hiding behind some esoterical 'context', this verse says EXACTLY what it says. Even heathens would understand it's plain reading without shdemidemi 'context' theories. You may want to explain the highlighted to us mere mortals in your own words or from ANY version or paraphrase and in ANY language

1 Corinthians 14:5 (KJV)
I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Nobody interpreted tongues on Pentecost nor in any of the other three instances we have recorded of tongues. If Pentecostal churches you frequent don't interpret tongues, that's their experience. We don't use 2014 experience to water down what Holy Spirit inspired Paul to record. Any language you don't understand is gibberish. I don't understand your pidgin nor Yoruba. So if I visited your church and you rehashed your unknown tongue versus speaking in tongues theories in Yoruba,you'd be talking gibberish to me

Same case if you were praying. I can't say Amen to your prayers. Now, if I prayed in tongues and that tongue happened to be Yoruba, you would understand what am saying. But if I prayed in tongues in Yoruba in Budapest, I'd be praying gibberish

shdemidemi:
Save your nuances bro. Read in context to understand what the man was conveying to these people.

'RATHER' is equally strong and I dont see where they interpret tongues in pentecostal gathering today. How can they, when what they say can't be put to words- Its gibberish.

I find it decidedly ironical that you call upon me to THINK
Pentecost lasted one day, the Day of Pentecost. On that day, there was a mighty rushing wind, tongues of fires and baptism of the Holy Spirit.
On one other ocassion we have rushing wind and NO tongues. On the remaining two occasions, we have no rushing wind nor tongues of fire ,but we have Baptism of the Holy Spirit. In all these four occasions, the baptism is followed by speaking in tongues

This tells me baptism of the Holy Spirit and tongues is the common denominator.

Now, James was killed and never raised back from the dead but LONG AFTER this, we have Eutychus and Tabitha raised from the dead! So much for your diminishing theory

shdemidemi:
You are answering my question, how I wish you would think robustly about your questions. It happened once and never like that again. Some things stopped and Pentecost was once. You and your likes will almost have us believe you exclusively experience pentecost in your rooms.



If you were following and reading other people's post objectively enough, you will realise my point was that they did not have the power to do so. Pentecost was gone, it was never permanent. God only delegated temporal powers to mankind (Apostles) and this was certainly not a power to replace Himself. Rather, It was a power to authenticate the message the apostles were commissioned to herald.

EXCEPT is a powerful word
Prophecy and Tongues (interpreted) are EQUALS

The 'greatness' of one prophesying ceases the moment the one speaking in tongues interprets them or some other person

shdemidemi:
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
5 I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater(lesser is the one that spoke in tongues) is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, [size=32pt]except[/size] he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Paul NEVER told them to strive for either. He sought for order and sobriety.
Personal edification in a public gathering is at the expense of the rest and may be misunderstood just like on Pentecost. So it is BEST to keep it private UNLESS interpretation is availed so all are edified. The difference between private and public edification is UNDERSTANDING

1 Corinthians 14:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, EXCEPT he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Do you want to revise your statement in the light of 1 Corinthians 14:4? Between Shdemidemi and Holy Spirit, who should we follow?

Tongues or praying all together never edify anyone

shdemidemi:
Which one did Paul tell them to strive for- self edification or edification of Christ(body)?

Drop the drama. How many instances did you see tongues of fire? What about rushing wind? And nlMediator aksd you a simple question, how comes the apostles never raised James from the dead?

Scarce means what, they are still there but in limited measure or TOTALLY nonexistent

shdemidemi:
How we love a move of the Spirit as it was experienced at Pentecost, How we love to experience a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind. Our desire yearn so much for cloven tongues like as of fire; we will love the attention of dying people scuffle to catch up with our shadow so they can be healed. How we so love to replay Pentecost all over again- speak languages in the honour of God even when we have not studied the language. Wow, what a sight that would be to behold.

Well, since these things won't happen some will wishfully think they happen but they are scarce. Why the scarcity? Why are there thousands and millions who fake it while the rest who seem to have the power will rather sit behind their computers and avoid to get their hand dirty?

1 Corinthians 14:4 King James Version (KJV)
4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

The Holy Scriptures teach us one of the means of edification; praying in tongues. We apply that and are edified. Tongues is a gift, nothing to brag about. Just go to God and pray for this gift my broda

cc
Bidam
mbaemeka

shdemidemi:
Tongues or praying all together never edify anyone. Pray in tongues from now till tomorrow if you don't understand scriptures you remain spiritually impoverished and impotent.

If you need edification God's way, it is in studying God's word with a corresponding readiness within us to apply what we learn.

Paul was preaching love and charity for all within the body and not a self edification exercise or technique.

Bidam my broda and my 'enemy'

Mark 7:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

There is nothing wrong with traditions. From a sociological/psychological perspective, animals develop habits to cope with the uncertainties in this world. Bidam wakes up at around the same time, follows a routine that is repeated until it becomes a habit. We hate spontaneity. Habits soon become traditions we pass on to our kids/descendants.

What concerned our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ is giving traditions the FORCE of Commandments or Laws. This is exactly what the pharisees did so much that they had beef with those who flouted the traditions and worked so hard to keep them at the expense of the Law.

When you tell us that 'self-edification' is carnal but 'public edification' is spiritual and you can't back that up with scriptures yet you believe it with all your heart, you are a prisoner of man-made doctrines and traditions that void the Word of God and make it of none effect.

It is sad that people who know not the scriptures nor the power of God speak evil of these things

Mark 12:24 King James Version (KJV)
24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?

Bidam:
Bless you for putting it succintly, i have had nudges like this to pray in tongues at home, work, school and other places, i just flow quietly so i won't disturb folks around me, when the burden is much on me, i look for a quiet place and pour my heart to God. It is never a SELFISH prayer because i do not know what i am praying for but sometimes God gives me scriptures that wells up in my heart during utterance and i give voice to it. Now how do you explain these things to religious mindset who neither believe in tongues nor the gifts of the Spirit. cessationists hide their impotency under the guise that the gifts of the Holy Spirit was only manifested during the era of the apostles. I am not at the mercy of folks with vain arguments who are held locked up in traditions. You will agree with me that the most difficult thing to break is long entrenched traditions of men.

When the Son put on flesh, we say the Word became flesh. When Holy Spirit put on flesh, He is not Melchizedek? Interesting
So Melchizedek was around when Jesus was born?

When your doctrine/belief leads you to absurd conclusions, you need to recheck it. That's why I won't have nothing to do with cessationism among others.

mbaemeka:
I didn't say the Holy Spirits name is Melchizedek. The Holy spirit answers to being called Jesus.

I said when the Holy Spirit put on flesh the name of that flesh was Melchizedek. Jesus became our high priest when he died on the cross and resurrected. Then he took his blood to Heaven (Hebrews 9). The death and resurrection transferred the main priestly role to Jesus. That's what the bible says. The priest before Jesus was Melchizedek. That is why Jesus is according to his order same way Eleazer is according to the order of Aaron. The first person in the line begins the order.

Where is it written she didn't touch him?

She could have touched him or she may have attempted to and was stopped. Once again where is it written she didn't touch him?
IMMEDIATELY is your interpolation

The portions of Torah you mentioned, they specifically or clearly state that a High Priest should not be touched around atonement?

Did Jesus bear our sins at the cross?
1Peter 2:24 (KJV)
Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

mbaemeka:
John 20:16-17 KJV

Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

She turned and SAID. . .then Jesus immediately said "don't touch me". This shows she couldn't have or did she disobey him?

As per the Torah, reading Exodus 28:42 or so and Leviticus 16 mentions the requirements. It can be simplified by doing a research on the day of atonement.

Less than 80 days from today, it will be Anita Oyakhilome's birthday. Will they still wish her this or is she suddenly turned radioactive?

https://www.nairaland.com/1208476/happy-birthday-pastor-anita-oyakhilome

You are yet to explain to me at what point Melchizedek the Holy Spirit stepped down and Melchizedek the Son took on the office. Who was the Melchizedek order priest BEFORE Christ shed his blood say when he was born? It was eternal,wasn't it?

mbaemeka:
Jesus calling his mum "woman" actually shows her to be his mum. A research on that term reveals that it used to portray endearment.

As per Jesus' priesthood, you have to realise that Jesus didn't pre-exist himself (contrary to the general consensus). Jesus existed as the inseparable word of the father not as a man. And the bible says no one has ever seen God the father in his glory, so whenever God made an appearance in the OT he did so by the messenger of his presence (the Holy spirit) who took the form of a man who at times (like in the case of Melchizedek) appeared as a king-priest.

Now when the time was right God sent his word to come on earth and become flesh. That flesh was called Jesus. We know the story. That Jesus (the word made flesh) now died and resurrected and completed the will of the father concerning our salvation and when he ascended the first time. Hebrews says that is when he offered his blood in heaven, and was conferred with the role of High priest. This was the time the prophecy of Psalms about the savior becoming a priest according to the order of Melchizedek was fulfilled. Then he came back down on earth, met with his disciples, taught them some of these things, gave them gifts, and then ascended the second time (10 days away from pentecost)

Show me where it is written she didn't. You may also want to direct me to the relevant shadow of this in the Torah.

Thanks bro

mbaemeka:
She didn't. The High priest (when he was about to offer the blood of bulls or a lamb) in the most holy place for the sins of the nation always wore white apparel and was NEVER touched. The reason being that if he was touched by anyone or thing, he would be rendered unclean and the sacrifice would be disallowed.

So Jesus was on his way to playing the role of high priest. His body and blood were the sacrifice which he presented in the most Holy place in Heaven. That is why he told Mary not to touch him and why he had to ascend on that day. Of course, the spiritual world isn't timed like the physical so whatever he did in heaven he was able to accomplish it and still return in the evening of that same day (remember he met Mary very early in the morning). This time around he had done his role and was given all authority in heaven and earth (something he didn't have while on earth before his death). That is why he told his disciples to hail him and also why he could let them touch him.

I have done my bit; from the diatribe I pick specific points and I present my view.

The strongest argument in favor for cessationism is ABUSE of the Charismatic. This is also the weakest as it has no biblical precedence. Paul was not about to ban spiritual gifts where they were abused.

The strongest argument for continuitionism is, all theological arguments against it are fatally weak. It takes serious imagination to read cessationism from scriptures.

I also spotted intellectual dishonesty; denying or not disclosing HISTORICAL accounts of the gifts long after 96AD. I won't repeat the references, but you can refer to a thread I created about this. Page 13 to be precise
https://www.nairaland.com/2002518/skeptics-guide-tongues-prophecy

WinsomeX:
This thread is presenting the views of cessationists and their disagreement with Charismatics. Since cessationists are human, their views are certainly not infallible. These are the things I was hoping those who disagree with them would point out.

All am saying is ushers are just trying to get order in church. But believers treat them like bar maids. They feel they are too important to take instructions from them.

If you ever see an educated and relatively well off negro berating a poorly remunerated fuel attendant or a gatekeeper, know it is an ego thing. This is the whole reason behind this rant.

daveP:
i understood halfway. Is it the ushers that are after seats or.....

Who told you she didn't touch/cling to him?

mbaemeka:
He didn't appear to her. Mary Magdalene went to his grave to embalm his body on the 3rd and was surprised by him. Then he said "don't touch me. Go and tell my brothers that I ascend to my father". The bible says she went to tell them. Later on the same day he came back and then appeared to them. This time he let them touch him. Why didn't he let her (Mary) touch him earlier on in the day?

This is no different form telling me that Mary was not Jesus' mother because he called him woman. Semantics really.
Care to explain how Jesus assumed e priesthood? Did Holy Spirit step down? Is Melchizedek priesthood some form of rotating office between members of the Godhead?

mbaemeka:
The flaw in this reasoning is that the bible didn't say "we have no records of his birth or death". That is what you have to make it say to take your position. The bible simply said "WITHOUT Father WITHOUT Mother. Neither HAVING beginning of days nor end of life". This is clear enough. Before we even add that the scriptures say their similarities as priests is in relation to their ENDLESS LIFE.

To make it clearer he concludes that God almighty declared that his son, Jesus would forever be a priest according to Melchizedek's order. If this doesn't say DEITY. Nothing else does.

If you want to see Christians practicing paganism, aks ushers, they are insulted,shoved, and crazy demands are made out of them....all these by the same idiots who proceed to lift up holy hands in worship.

They want the front seat even when it is a fully packed service, they want to sit at the end of a pew and stand as everyone wake to the empty seat next to them, they want five empty seats next to each other in the middle of a service. Bloody hypocrites! Obey ushers or get to church well before the church starts