₦airaland Forum

Satan teaches his followers to blaspheme so that they can draw away from God.

adebayor1490:
oh lord

CAPTIVATOR dies in 1000BC.
Judgement is 2070AD
Who/what will God judge?
Your thoughts and anything about you ceased in 1000BC. Does God implant the memories to the FRESHLY created dummy after your image and then judge it? From whence does he restore your memory and thoughts.....?

CAPTIVATOR:
Jesus said the daughter of Jairus IS SLEEPING , when she is dead ! What a fine illustration

When u ar in a deep sleep, do u know what happens in d midnight ? NO ! So also is death, scripture says " as for the dead, they know nothing at all" Ecc 9:5,10 !

Gentleman, Judgement comes after the resurection of the dead !

" the hour is coming , when all those in the GRAVES will hear the voice of the son of God and come out " - joh 5:28,29

Judgement IS YET FUTURE

" For God has [u]SET A DAY[u] IN WHICH HE PURPOSES TO JUDGE the inhabited earth in Righteous" Act 17:31

What will God judge,recreated dummies that have never been on earth, and then proceed to annihilate them in the lake of fire?

frosbel:
are you arguing with the bible ??

So, if a man's thoughts and everything in him PERISHES upon death, what is judged?
Does God RECREATE a new body that has never sinned and then loads it with memory of the guys who died and then judges them for things they never did?

CAPTIVATOR:
Go and vomit this fabricated religious fiction !

" YOU are dust , and to dust YOU shall return" Gen 3:19 !!!
Adam was in d dust before God created him, and when he dies HE WILL RETURN TO THE GROUND , Out of which he was taken !!!

" his spirit (breath) goes out, HE returns to the GROUND; on that day his thoughts perish" Psalm 146:4 !! When a person dies , his thoughts perish!

"and Jesus called out with a loud voice and said: "Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit. After saying this , he expired" Luke 23:46 !! His spirit is the force of life in him,.... And as a matter of scriptures, Jesus never ascend to heaven until 40 days after his RESSURECTION .(joh 20:17

They never celebrated Christmas and nobody did for another 300 years since pentecost.
So Christmas is not one of those traditions paul was writing about.
It means the Christians for the first three hundred years did not know what is 'right'

FrancisTony:
We should know what's right without being told.

Did Apostles use internet to spread their goodnews?

Why using it?

Do you think the apostles celebrated it?

FrancisTony:
Year I don't know.

WHEN FIRST was Christmas celebrated?

FrancisTony:
For roman god "Sol Invictus".

We celebrate our own for "Jesus Christ".

It was not announced

FrancisTony:
Okay. If Jesus birthday was actually announced as Nov1, it would be held on Nov7?

Fantastic

When first was this Christmas 'tradition' celebrated?

FrancisTony:
What do you mean @bolded?

Idi0t,
Invest in a corporate email first

henry459:
[size=3pt]WELCOME TO GREAT ILLUMINATI BROTHERHOOD666 Are you a business man or an artist,Politicians and you want to become big,
Powerful and famous in the world, join us to become one of our official
member today.you shall be given an ideal chance to visit the Illuminati and
his representative after registrations is completed by you, no sacrifice,
or human life needed, Illuminati brotherhood brings along wealth and famous
in life, you have a full access to eradicate poverty away from your life
now. it only a member who is been initiated into the church of Illuminati
have the authority to bring any member to the church, so before you contact
any body you must be link by who is already a member, Join us today and
realize your dreams. we also help out our member in protection of drugs
pushing, once you become a member you will be rich and famous for the rest
of your life, Illuminati make there member happy so i will want you all to
also be a member of the Illuminati Thanks. [/size]contact this email on
Brotherhoodilluminati666temple@gmail.com or call
+2349032255900

Can't feed your presumptions

Weah96:
Can't answer a question with another one.

Negroes have their hands full with occult and witchcraft not to mention poverty and illiteracy to bother about space toys

Is eternity 10 billion years?

Weah96:

Does Hitler deserve to roast for eternity or are 10 billion years of roasting enough for his less than 60 yr life?

Do you know that governments around the world have the technological ability to keep a death row inmate alive while torturing the person for the rest of his life?

Even in Africa, these people are put out of their misery. What are you saying?

isn't it rather funny that critics of hell present it as being full of innocent people (like themselves!)?

Mumu
The Jewish calendar does not follow our Roman calendar and the 12th month is not our December!
Besides, their years had 360 days while ours have 365-366 days. This means even if their months coincided with ours, they would gain 5 days EVERY year. In just 6 years and they would be 30 days or 1 month ahead

FrancisTony:
Debunk my OP biblical quote and stop ranting.

Use your head for once. If Christmas was one of those traditions never mentioned yet it was practiced, how comes there is no extrabiblical records of the same for over the first 300 years of Christianity? Which tradition was being followed in introducing Christmas?

FrancisTony:
2 Thess2:15 Paul advised us to keep believing in oral tradition.

I believe in Bible and Oral tradition.

Sola biblica is devilish doctrine introduced by Martin Luther.

I don't 'claim to want verification' just saying that this Catholic rubbish is pretending to bow to science but it is anything but that. Mindless sheeple like you are falling for it

italo:
Aha! You claim to want verification...but you cannot use your internet to search for a way to reach the people involved in this examination process.

You're just angry and frustrated at any manifestation of God or his things. That's why you curse and curse instead of doing what you can to honestly analyze the claim.

It is satan in you that is making you react this way.

Search for the ways to reach the people involved or stop pretending to be looking for proof.

Zugibe is no more and you don't even have any of his findings except what you scrape from the gutter
Castanon is only keen in shooting videos. I left a message on his FB account. tic toc

italo:
We already have objective examination. Dr Zugibe wasn't even told what it was before he announced his findings.

Dr Castanon was even an Atheist before he got involved in examining miraculous claims.

I pray you meet Christ

sonOfLucifer:
I pray the same for you.

nlMediator:
I appreciate your making your position clearer on prophets and prophecies. Inconsistencies remain as I will show below but your position is less muddled now.
1. First off, your accusation on tithing is invalid as you simply do not know my position on tithes. You’ve never heard me defend tithing here. I prefer not to engage in fruitless tithe discussions here. I only pointed it here to somebody that takes a position on that and is taking an inconsistent one now.

Good to clarify that. But there is no inconsistency

2. Your claim that tithing is ritual while your prophecy standards are eternal gave me a chuckle for a number of reasons. For one, when tithing advocates call tithing an eternal principle, the opponents reject it. Now, you’re borrowing their argument and expecting others to accept it! Second, interesting that you’re classifying the law into ceremonial laws and non-ceremonial laws. For eons, you and your cohorts have rejected any sort of classification of the law. You even claimed erroneously that Nigerian law is not classified. That all laws have been dispensed with, not just ritual laws. All of a sudden when it suits you, you go into the law to find something binding on Christians!!

The idea that there is a 'principle' behind every Mosaic Law that must be decoded is faulty. It takes PhD in theology to get past 100 out of the 614 laws. Still, some principles may be readily identified. When paul in Corinthians appealed to Moses to justify supporting ministers, he mentioned the entire sacrificial system (including tithing). This means the only principle in tithing is supporting ministers not imposed a fixed fraction. Those giving 10% in the name of living up to 'tithing principle' may as well bring animal sacrifices to pastors for them to feast

3. Your ‘muzzle the ox’ analogy does not apply. Paul was writing scriptures and borrowed from the OT. Now that the canon is complete, we can’t go to the OT to pull out a principle unless we can see it supported in the NT. Otherwise, you should support first fruits. It’s in the OT but many of you reject it because when it is mentioned in the NT, it’s not about money. Yet, you want to impose standards from OT that are not even mentioned in the NT. And claim Paul is your example!?!

There is nothing wrong with borrowing principles, but there is everything wrong with borrowing principles over similar circumstances as first century when those principles were not borrowed. paul could have easily borrowed on tithing or first fruits to collect offerings. He didn't yet you are here flashing new revelations in the name of borrowing from OT. Ridiculous

4. Your claim that nobody is called into special ministry and all Christians are called into ministry is false. Paul said in Ephesians 4 that God gave some apostles, prophets, etc. He did not give it to every Christian. Because as Paul explains there, these ministry offices are to help Christians mature and be of service to God. In Romans 1:1, Paul said that he was called to be an apostle. A few verses below, Paul said in Romans 1:7 that people are called to be saints. He made the distinction right there.

These ministries are one area where you employ active imagination to craft their exact role. The distinction pursued by Pentecostals is not more valid than random guesswork

5. I know some of you would want to create an image of a masculine God that never ‘apologizes’ instead of an effeminate God, as you say. There is one man in the Bible who understood God more than any other person. It was David. When Prophet Nathan came and told him what was wrong and prophesied that the baby would die, David was obviously familiar with your standards for judging prophets and your non-effeminate God. But what did he do? He still went ahead to pray to God. Because he knows the God he serves is a merciful God. That the prayer was not answered does not change the understanding he had of God. Nowhere in the Bible is David condemned for seeking to change prophetic outcome, disqualify a prophet, or make God effeminate because of that prayer. You’re free to have any image of God that suits you, but I’d rather serve the God of David.

There are two excuses for failed prophecies; 1. Delayed judgement, and 2. Repentance. Note the magniotude of Nineveh repentance before responding. Which of these caused a prophecy of Eiffel Tower falling to shift to Asia Japan?
https://www.nairaland.com/2002872/here-prophet-claiming-malachi-4s#28310356

6. Please point to me the condition in Jonah’s prophecy. Chapter and verse, please.

What was the point of sending Jonah there? Jesus said they repented at Jonah's preaching. This man was a preacher

7. The spirits of the prophets being subject to the prophets refers to chaos alright, but there is no indication it is limited to that. If something is subject to you, it is under your control. It means you can direct how it functions. Otherwise, it was never under your control. And Paul would be lying by saying so.

Very true but you can't blurt out garbage and still ascribe it to the gift. False prophecies are not abuses of the gift of prophecy but absence of the gift

8. Funny enough, you see that scripture as referring to charismatic chaos. Yet, you believe prophets do not exist today. Which means that particular scripture has ceased and thus cannot be referring to Charismatics who exist today. See the inconsistency?.

Told you once, the point is even if the gifts were operational today, they should follow biblical standards. Cessationists are simply pointing this out

9. The three standards you mention are standards for judging prophets, not prophecies. Yet, you apply them when you believe there are no prophets. To use a popular chef example we’ve seen here, if there’s a standard for judging who’s a qualified chef, it does not mean that you should automatically use it to judge good cooking. Cooking and being a chef are not the same thing. So, you have to make up your mind. If there are prophets, you look for standards to judge them. If there are not prophets, you cannot judge them by inapplicable standards.

With what else can you judge a chef if not their cooking? Jerry curls?
A prophet is a Christian and they should be judged on this basis first. When they go beyond this and prophesy, then prophecy is the other criteria we utilize. How do you judge a prophesying Christian minus their prophecies?

10. You keep on latching on to Peter and the sure word of prophecy. For the umpteenth time, Pater said the Word is a MORE sure Word. Not a sure word as you claim. Peter understood there are other sure words. In fact, the transfiguration experience he was describing was a sure word. Peter knew it was true. He just didn’t want us to depend on other sure words at the expense or in competition with the MORE sure word. Your’re simply adding to or subtracting from scriptures.

You have the WITNESS of the apostles and a MORE sure Word. That's very different from saying we have revelations of 2014 and then a more sure Word

11. You and the cessationists have one thing in common. They claim that gifts have ceased without citing ONE scripture that says so. You reject some of their positions, based on made-up positions, without citing one scripture that supports you EXACTLY. It’s just your interpretation and conjecture.

No comments

I don't think back and forth is inherently unhealthy. It's our choice. And even one-off responses can be unhealthy too.

Where is mbaemeka? You argue like him

nlMediator:
1. You're still ignoring the threshold question: is the OT applicable to the christian? If yes, when does the OT apply and when does it not apply? On what principled ground can you reject First fruits but support using criteria outlined in the OT for prophets?

OT is ONLY applicable to a Christian to the extent the same principles are emphasized in the NT. Firstfruits in NT has zero to do with offerings but it points to Jesus Christ

2. I'm not VERY interested in Balaam or OT prophets, when we're discussing who's true or false. In the NT, one can be true who does not meet your criteria ALL the time. And one can be false who APPEARS to meet them when you look at outward factors.

How can one who actively and accurately prophesies, is of good standing and has never on any record contradicted the Word of God be FALSE?

3. Certainly, callings are privately ascertained. But that does not mean that we cannot discuss callings. Ok, you determine a false prophet by your criteria. How do you determine who qualified or qualifies as a false apostle, false teacher or false evangelist? If they plant a church in the wrong place, teach something you disagree with, win fewer souls than you expect?

False apostles? Anybody clinging to that title and was not an eyewitness of the resurrected Christ is as false as they come.
False teachers? Their teachings of course
False evangelists? Their doctrine

4. Flashing the Jonah card. As a brother already pointed out to us, I guess God was lying when he sent a prophet to Hezekiah. By your stand, God sent his prophet on a foolish errand He never intended to execute. In fact, He never added any years to Hezekiah because there was no decree that he was going to die. Right?

My brother, How many instances in the entire scriptures do you find men averting prophetic decrees? Using these exceptions to excuse EVERY epic fail ever so often is fraudulent. I will leave you defending your own but I know too well beyond NL you are hardly convinced
https://www.nairaland.com/2002872/here-prophet-claiming-malachi-4s#28310356of your own words. look at this charlatan

5. In a nutshell, while I like the OT criteria, I do not believe it applies as a rule governing christians. I believe that God can use somebody to prophesy whose life is not completely in order and who may have a sin or two in their lives. God looks at His call and the righteousness of Jesus. Even in the OT, didn't Saul prophesy at a point when he was not right with God? 1 Sam. 19. Yes, he was prophesying while trying to kill David! I guess they couldn't find enough stones to stone him then.

I agree with you that one may prophesy,preach and teach,evangelize . In the OT, prophets were not stoned for sinning so the example is out of place. What has never been excused is ACCURACY and DOCTRINE. FRUIT is not a sin or two but the essential you

You should have told those who were wishing Oyaks Happy birthday to get a life as well. Very predictable these sheeple

Oyinprince:
Now, what concerns this OP with whether I give my 4 months or a whole year's salary to the church Is it your salary I'm giving? What concerns you with how much I give? Nawa o

Some Peeps no get jobs sha

Firstfruits is a clear fraud I agree. A very wicked means of exacting money

lastmessenger:
The truth is that I am not really unhappy that some guys can give their four months salary but when you lie in the name of God just to make sure that people pay is my concern.that is where the injustice is . For example you know that there is nothing like first fruit or tithe for today's Christians but they keep brainwashing them with these Old Testament practices that should be done away with.

If you are talking from experience it is well my broda

lastmessenger:
I was once a member of CE. I know what I am saying. Even the sincere members. How am I unfair to CE? Is it a lie that members pay not less than their 4 months pay to CE.

Where do you draw the line between cajoling and simply asking believers to give?
You are unfair on Christ Embassy. Any church collecting an offering may as well be 'cajoling'

lastmessenger:
I have already answered the question.if people are cajoled into giving then even if they give one dollar, it is still not acceptable.
People are cajoled to give in CE and the highest giver is even given an award. You see is more like competition.

nlMediator:
So, why do you reject some OT practices that are not condemned in the NT, tithing being the obvious one? Or you pick and choose what to adopt wholesale from the OT?

Tithing is not condemned in the NT nor is it invoked for the MOST OBVIOUS purpose namely supporting ministry. Isn't this obvious? Just like Sabbath. We have believers meeting on FIrst Day and not Sabbath so much that Paul asks them to bring the gifts during these meetings. That's enough to tell you nobody cares about Sabbath keeping no more after Pentecost

I'm not against the criteria for prophets from the OT but they should be seen as guidelines, not as rules that the church in the NT is bound by.

OT is clear. You prophesy, it comes to pass but you mislead and you are to be ignored. You prophesy and it fails to come to pass, you are false and should be stoned. We don't stone but the principle remains; you are false

Calling is what determines if one is true or false. A false teacher is one that Jesus did not put there. Jesus said at the last day, He'd tell false teachers and the like that He never knew them. He didn't reject them simply because of their teaching but because He never had a relationship with them and thus could not have called them.

Once again, I don't know who Jesus called and who He didn't. The reason is callings are rather private. Look at Paul. Since I was not there, I can only judge by what is evident namely the FRUIT of their 'calling' namely prophecies and teachings. Do you have a manual or checklist for confirming 'calling'? I sure would be interested in going through it with a fine tooth comb

Jonah is neither conditional nor a one-off example. God does nothing without revealing to His prophets. He told Prophet Abraham that He wanted to destroy Sodom, yet He was willing to relent as He listened to Abraham, agreeing with him that if He could find a few good people, He'd spare the city. He told Prophet Ezekiel a similar thing. To say that a prophecy must come to pass in the face of prayer is to reject the efficacy of prayer. Besides, such position has no scriptural foundation.

YOu are now blaspheming by telling us that God goes out of His way to reveal to his servants things He has no intention of executing. What's the point? How then were the OT prophets judged if they could flash out Jonah card?

In summary, feel free to judge prophecies. But don't determine who's false or true solely on the basis of rules not in the NT.

In short, drop semantics to 'protect' the false charlatans in your crowd. False prophecies & teachings by 'true' or 'false' prophets/teachers are dangerous. Call them carnal,fallen,backslidden prophets or any other English word you can cook but at least WARN your flock against these crooks.

PS:was Baalam a true or false prophet?

Food for thought. If the first time Jesus walked on earth he had no mother or father, what was the need of having at least a mother when he came to save us?

MarkMiwerds:
There is an old saying, "Tell a lie often enough, the gullible will accept it as truth."

So many have told the lie that "Melchizedek/Melchisedec was Jesus Christ" for so long that the gullible have accepted it as truth. The fact is, it is not truth, as the text clearly states. Melchisedec was made "like unto" the Son of God. "Like unto" denotes comparison. Melchisedec was being compared to the Son of God in Hebrews 7.

If they were one and the same person, "like unto" would not have been present in the text.

Paul in 1 Cor 9 used the Bible (Torah) to 'cajole' them to give.

1 Corinthians 9:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?

How much is 'acceptable' to you? Two salaries, one salary or half a salary?

lastmessenger:
Willing giving is acceptable.But what we see is men being cajoled with bible and the name of God to pay at least four month pay to CE. That's injustice.

Nlmediator,
1. Am far from cessationism but if I were in the camp and was bombarded with prophecies and the thus-saith-the-Lord guys, the most natural thing would be to test them for accuracy,consistency with the Word and character....the point is even if there were prophecies today,the believers are called upon to examine e them and this has not been the case. This laxity in testing prophecies is part of the reason we have Strange Fire

2. Paul's statement that spirits of prophets are subject to the prophets is no formula for testing prophets. It means prophecy is no excuse for chaos. There is no distinction between NT and OT prophets. These are assumptions

3. When you think through your criteria for testing prophecies/prophets, it is IMPOSSIBLE to identify them. How do you test the calling for genuineness? What do you call a genuinely called prophet who routinely spews garbage? What about a not-called guy who delivers them accurately?

You are engaging in semantics in distinguishing between prophecies and prophets. Prophets prophesying lies are false prophets just like teachers peddling false teachings are false. In short we know them by their fruit not the spectacular nature of their calling

4. We all know the perfect excuse for epic fail is Jonas. But the prophecy was conditional. Otherwise what was the point of sending Jonas there? What you are telling us is to ignore the most obvious sign of a false prophecy; accuracy and stick to the ambiguous untestable 'calling',and deem all fails as 'mistakes'

nlMediator:
1. Your (and the cessationist) position is not clear. Do you believe that the office of the prophet has ceased or not? If yes, we need not bother about judging it. So, let us know if you believe people still have the gift of foretelling and that being a prophet is not only about forth telling. Seems to me like you guys want to have it both ways.

2. The criteria you outlined for validity of prophecy is from the OT. The NT had no such criteria. What the NT says is that the spirit of prophets is subject to the prophets. That means, among other things, that a prophet can say the wrong thing deliberately or mistakenly. Neither makes him a false prophet.

3. Being a false or true prophet is primarily about calling. False prophets are those that were never called by God into that office. Even if all their predictions are true, they're still false. True prophets are those that have a genuine calling. Their mistakes do not invalidate their call. Because the gifts and callings of God are without repentance.

4. The criteria outlined for judging prophecy by the cessationists seem to leave no room for divine intervention. God can change an outcome He asked somebody to prophesy about, as He did with Jonah. If a prophet says a building will not be bombed and the building gets bombed, it may well be proof that God did not speak through the person claiming to be a prophet. But if God says a building will be bombed, people's prayer may avert the catastrophe. It may even be the reason for the prophecy - as an advance warning to let people have the opportunity to thwart it through prayer and other means.

lastmessenger,
How much giving is 'acceptable'?

Get me his contacts

Meaningless nois is flapping gum here in the name of science while bloviating Catholicism junk that is not even pseudoscientific

While at it, acquaint yourself with Serratia
http://www.antimicrobe.org/h04c.files/history/serratia.asp

italo:
Contact the Doctor and the other people in the video...

...and stop making meaningless noise.

Objective examination of the same. Not gutter junk

italo:
So what is evidence?