alj harem:

The point is why did he seclude Awolowo and "his" yoruba people . Did he not write Ojuwku/nnamdi were driven by the over riding desire to over rule Nigeria ? Common, you are just being bias here

An excerpt from a book means Yoruba people were secluded?

dayokanu:

At the time of the wedding Chief Onoh disapproved of the wedding but that did not stop Ojuku from marrying biancar

So the premise that if a man(Achebe) disapproves, the wedding wont go on is hogwash. Hope you understand

BTW Can you marry your Godfather? the man who was there at your christening even against your fathers blessings?

Yes, but he could have overlooked that initial disapproval and came to terms with arrangement.
Two, unless you are genie you cannot say the same for Achebe and his daughter. You gave me an example, that A involves two people of the same ethnicity and B has nothing to do with the situation with Achebe. If you had gave me an example where Achebe refused to acknowledge the marriage of one of his other children to "x" ethnicity you might have a point.In many cases weddings do fall through because of family issues with potential spouses, is Ojukwu now the definitive example of marriage

You also ignored my other point that Achebe and Soyinka routinely collaborate together on issues. During the fuel subsidy issue was it not Achebe and Soyinka who spearheaded the letter that criticized the removal of the subsidy? Or is Soyinka person non grata in Yoruba circles? If he truly hate Yoruba people and was jelous of Soyinka's award why would he associate with Soyinka even up till today?

I wouldn't marry my godfather, but some people are cool with that. Some folks marry their cousins, that's their business. As long as it was between 2 consenting adults that's all I care about.

aryzgreat:

so wots d fuss about awolowo if he balanced his book with ojukwu and zik's story also? You yorobbers think u can keep throwing lies up as truth because u control d media? Dats a futile dream. The truth must be made known weda awolo-devil is affected or not, d only thing u can do is rant and that shows u guys have some skeleton to hide thats why this exposure is hitting ur nerves like bad, if not tell me why u guys are doing everything to cover up awolowo's crime against humanity? Awolowo is more deadly than osama bin laden and ALUU community!

First of all, I would correct your accession. The so called media is not controlled by yorubas, that is all you Igbos delusion. Out of 11 media houses, about 6 is controlled by the SS, 3 by Igbos, 2 by yorubas and 1 by the north.

You see yorubas are not being clandestine here, if Awolowo did any wrong people would say it, it is a just a shame that you fail to realise the fault of your so called leaders and move on.

alj harem:

My brother you are just quoting things out of context here. Achebe implying that he wanted power for his people suggested (alj harem extrapolated) that not only Awolowo was involved but HIS PEOPLE SUPPORTED HIM in this so called evil you all claim he did.

for more here is Achebe's quote

"However, Awolowo saw the dominant Igbos at the time as the obstacles to that goal, and when the opportunity arose–the Nigeria-Biafra war–his ambition drove him into a frenzy to go to every length to achieve his dreams. In the Biafran case it meant hatching up a diabolical policy to reduce the numbers of his enemies significantly through starvation — eliminating over two million people, mainly members of future generations.”

so as to help his yoruba people ? How does that sound to you ?

If you are a naive kid and you are asked to read this what would you think of Yorubas ?

What Achebe did was not only wrong but has really drawn a dividing line to the East West politics incase you do not realise. He has not only painted an bad picture of Awolowo and his Yoruba people but also showed the world everything wrong with Nigeria.

Tribalism has no place in the world incase Achebe does not know, I hope you tell him.

Once again a comment on Awolowo and not Yoruba people. Find me something that shows Achebe saying that Yoruba people agreed or Awo was doing the bidding of his people you might have a point.

You are quoting a comment from a book which has to be read in the context it was written to understand the reason behind it and I'm the one quoting out of context

We are now crossing into that ironic territory where the same folk in here that are having a fit over Achebe would not miss a beat claiming that all Northerners are a member of Boko Haram, because obviously they speak for all Northerners and since they are pro-Muslim (which a mjority of the North is) Northerner clearly support their actions.

Its come full circle

stillwater:

An excerpt from a book means Yoruba people were secluded?

Yes he secluded the yorubas as if they were part of the main actors in the Biafran war. He should also have put emphases on groups like Ijaw, Edo etc in such a way that it would generate controversies.

Awolowo is our Ghandi, through AWOISM. And we're all AWOISTS!! So, basically, any malicious attack on his person based on lies, half-truths, innuendos, and hatred; is an attack on Yoruba nation and it will not be allowed. He's our modern day Oduduwa and he raised more than two generations of Yoruba sons and daughters!

alj harem:

Yes he secluded the yorubas as if they were part of the main actors in the Biafran war. He should also have put emphases on groups like Ijaw, Edo etc in such a way that it would generate controversies.

Who knows if he did? Its hard to tell when you don't have a copy of the book.

And Awo was only pro-Yoruba, the rest could sink for all he cared if we are being honest here.

kindabigg: Awolowo is our Ghandi, through AWOISM. And we're all AWOISTS!! So, basically, any malicious attack on his person based on lies, half-truths, innuendos, and hatred; is an attack on Yoruba nation and it will not be allowed. He's our modern day Oduduwa and he raised more than two generations of Yoruba sons and daughters!

Ok then make that clear that Yoruba people are like NATO, if you attack one you attack all, and stop trying to make it seem as though Achebe is saying anything about Awolowo we all don't know already

The guy was Pro-Yoruba, which is well in his right to be.

The rest is how Achebe felt about Awolowo's actions.

Crayola1:

Once again a comment on Awolowo and not Yoruba people. Find me something that shows Achebe saying that Yoruba people agreed or Awo was doing the bidding of his people you might have a point.

You are quoting a comment from a book which has to be read in the context it was written to understand the reason behind it and I'm the one quoting out of context

We are now crossing into that ironic territory where the same folk in here that are having a fit over Achebe would not miss a beat claiming that all Northerners are a member of Boko Haram, because obviously they speak for all Northerners and since they are pro-Muslim (which a mjority of the North is) Northerner clearly support their actions.

Its come full circle

What ! A world recognised author writes a book that A man (Yorubas hero) was driven by an overriding ambition for his yoruba people therefore leading to the death of biafrans and you are telling me he did not involve Yorubas but just AWOLOWO ?

Crayola1:

Who knows if he did? Its hard to tell when you don't have a copy of the book.

And Awo was only pro-Yoruba, the rest could sink for all he cared if we are being honest here.

Because if he did, others would speak out just as the yorubas are doing. If a man writes on how bad Ojukwu was because of his Igbo people, would Ohaneze not try to defend him ?

Crayola1:

Who knows if he did? Its hard to tell when you don't have a copy of the book.

And Awo was only pro-Yoruba, the rest could sink for all he cared if we are being honest here.

Who in that era cared about other ethnic group apart from his? At least Awo cared about the mid-Westerners, his closest associate, Anthony Enahoro, was an Urhobo man. And he was loved by the Oba of Benin. One can also argue that the minorities were discriminated against in Eastern region, hence, why Southern Cameroon left Nigeria. The Efiks were going to leave too, and the Ijaws complained about Igbo domination.

Back to topic.

So can anyone recommend a book written by this Nobel prize winner? I'd like to order one and read it.

alj harem:

What ! A world recognised author writes a book that A man (Yorubas hero) was driven by an overriding ambition for his yoruba people therefore leading to the death of biafrans and you are telling me he did not involve Yorubas but just AWOLOWO ?

So now he is a world recognized author
Yes, from those excerpts I can only say that Awo was being critiqued. Until I read the rest I can't say if this was an overall point about Yoruba people by Achebe.

alj harem:

Because if he did, others would speak out just as the yorubas are doing. If a man writes on how bad Ojukwu was because of his Igbo people, would Ohaneze not try to defend him ?

No one said you can't defend Awolowo but if you are going to pull out the tribalism card, we need receipts other that a few excerpts that by all accounts admonish Awo.

Most of the rebutals I've read are borderline juvenile. If your argument about a man is that he is old and therefore crazy, then that is not much of an argument to me at least.

ekt_bear: Back to topic.

So can anyone recommend a book written by this Nobel prize winner? I'd like to order one and read it.

Google and Amazon.

Crayola1:
Ok then make that clear that Yoruba people are like NATO, if you attack one you attack all, and stop trying to make it seem as though Achebe is saying anything about Awolowo we all don't know already

The guy was Pro-Yoruba, which is well in his right to be.

The rest is how Achebe felt about Awolowo's actions.

We're not individualistic like Igbos, we live in an organized society, and Awo was our last great leader. He lived and died for his people and any malicious attack against his person will not be tolerated, esp. from a Yorubaphobe and Awophobe like Achebe.

"However, Awolowo saw the dominant Igbos at the time as the obstacles to that goal, and when the opportunity arose–the Nigeria-Biafra war–his ambition drove him into a frenzy to go to every length to achieve his dreams. In the Biafran case it meant hatching up a diabolical policy to reduce the numbers of his enemies significantly through starvation — eliminating over two million people, mainly members of future generations.

^That's the excerpt from Achebe's memoir, read between the lines. Achebe made a preposterous claim that Awo was trying to reduce the numbers of 'enemy' significantly. For what reason, if I may ask? Who is this enemy? Read between the lines!!

kindabigg:

Who in that era cared about other ethnic group apart from his? At least Awo cared about the mid-Westerners, his closest associate, Anthony Enahoro, was an Urhobo man. And he was loved by the Oba of Benin. One can also argue that the minorities were discriminated against in Eastern region, hence, why Southern Cameroon left Nigeria. The Efiks were going to leave too, and the Ijaws complained about Igbo domination.

What is your point?

Well everyone is being discriminated under the Federal Government of Nigeria, so I guess that's progress.

alj harem:

Yes he secluded the yorubas as if they were part of the main actors in the Biafran war. He should also have put emphases on groups like Ijaw, Edo etc in such a way that it would generate controversies.

Achebe has always been anti-Nigerian government. And Awo was part of it at the time. So Awo was a main actor. I'm sure the book would have some unsavory contents towards the Northern people and their policies as well. Why don't we all get a copy of the book?

Bottom line , this bitter old man released this hate and tribalism book in time for the Nobel award season hoping to be considered before taking his old and disgruntled into his sad grave, but the old fool forgot that the world moved on while his sorry and pathetic axss remains in the sixties with his tribalistic existence. The Nobel folks obviously snubbed his broken down ax ss to let him know that the era of hate mongering and division is gone.

The man is a failure and he is going to his grave with a big F around his neck.

^^^I don't know how you can accuse another of being tribalistic, while you are no different.

Eko Ile: Bottom line , this bitter old man released this hate and tribalism book in time for the Nobel award season hoping to be considered before taking his old and disgruntled into his sad grave, but the old fool forgot that the world moved on while his sorry and pathetic axss remains in the sixties with his tribalistic existence. The Nobel folks obviously snubbed his broken down ax ss to let him know that the era of hate mongering and division is gone.

The man is a failure and he is going to his grave with a big F around his neck.

Eko Ole why are you all over NR talking like a headless chicken? Why do you and your fellow Yoruba manu people hate the truth so much? Repent from your evil ways and maybe your rotten sins might be forgiven.

Crayola1:
What is your point?

Well everyone is being discriminated under the Federal Government of Nigeria, so I guess that's progress.

My point is why single out Awo, when he was by far the best in that era? Did Ahmadu Bello care about Igbos? The same Ahmadu Bello who said he'd rather employ a white foreigner before an Igbo. And how was Zik better? The same Zik who never contested an election in the Eastern region, but went there to dislodge a minority who was elected over there.

The only leader in the era who talked about his ethnic group dominating others was Zik. I guess we know who was trying to dominate then, go figure!!

kindabigg:

We're not individualistic like Igbos, we live in an organized society, and Awo was our last great leader. He lived and died for his people and any malicious attack against his person will not be tolerated, esp. from a Yorubaphobe and Awophobe like Achebe.




^That's the excerpt from Achebe's memoir, read between the lines. Achebe made a preposterous claim that Awo was trying to reduce the numbers of 'enemy' significantly. For what reason, if I may ask? Who is this enemy? Read between the lines!!

Ok then, position the argument as an attack on Awo's character. Because up until this point a good deal of the sideways talking bastard.s
in this thread 2 weeks ago would have said nothing but good things about Achebe, including the Yoruba defenders. So we have two theories here:

A) Achebe is the greatest actor of all time to have fans and well wishers from a group he secretly despised for damn near 50+ years

or B) Folks are reading more than what is being said.

According to Achebe from what I get in that quote is that Awo felt that Igbo people were not allowing members of his ethnic group get into positions (government/education/whatever) and that in effect Igbo people were the enemy of his goals (because if he ran for office Igbo people probably would not support him) and his goals for his people (jobs, choice positions, etc.) So if we play devils advocate here, it would makes sense (in Achebe's view) for Awo to jump on this opportunity to get rid of the competition.

kindabigg:

My point is why single out Awo, when he was by far the best in that era? Did Ahmadu Bello care about Igbos? The same Ahmadu Bello who said he'd rather employ a white foreigner before an Igbo. And how was Zik better? The same Zik who never contested an election in the Eastern region, but went there to dislodge a minority who was elected over there.

The only leader in the era who talked about his ethnic group dominating others was Zik. I guess we know who was trying to dominate then, go figure!!

Well its hard to say what he said about Bello or Zik because, and I keep hammering this point home...no members of the public have a copy of this book.
All we have are snippets of what he thought about Awo.

Can we get sources on that quote by Zik?

stillwater:
Achebe has always been anti-Nigerian government. And Awo was part of it at the time. So Awo was a main actor. I'm sure the book would have some unsavory contents towards the Northern people and their policies as well. Why don't we all get a copy of the book?

Why wasn't Achebe anti-government when Aguiyi Ironsi became an illegal the head of state? What happened to his voice back then? He only finds his voice when Igbos are not in power, but goes numb when they're in power, right?

Igbos created, started, and executed everything wrong with Nigeria right now. The Unitary System of government was created by Igbos, the first coup was by Igbos, secession clause was taken out at the independence conference by Igbos, the first civil war in Africa was started by Igbos etc.. Stop blaming others for your woes!!!

kindabigg:

My point is why single out Awo, when he was by far the best in that era? Did Ahmadu Bello care about Igbos? The same Ahmadu Bello who said he'd rather employ a white foreigner before an Igbo. And how was Zik better? The same Zik who never contested an election in the Eastern region, but went there to dislodge a minority who was elected over there.

The only leader in the era who talked about his ethnic group dominating others was Zik. I guess we know who was trying to dominate then, go figure!!

Leave the Igbos and their delusion

stillwater:

Achebe has always been anti-Nigerian government. And Awo was part of it at the time. So Awo was a main actor. I'm sure the book would have some unsavory contents towards the Northern people and their policies as well. Why don't we all get a copy of the book?

Thank you

kindabigg:

Who in that era cared about other ethnic group apart from his? [b]At least Awo cared about the mid-Westerners, his closest associate, Anthony Enahoro, was an Urhobo man. And he was loved by the Oba of Beni[/b]n. One can also argue that the minorities were discriminated against in Eastern region, hence, why Southern Cameroon left Nigeria. The Efiks were going to leave too, and the Ijaws complained about Igbo domination.

D yorrobber lies again, please tell me why d mid west voted to be separated from western nigeria? tell me any of awolowo legacy left in the midwest when they were under west? Awolowo even said that cocoa revenue will be used in the area it was farmed. Do u want me to get u d records? yorrober and lies! na wa o

Crayola1:

Well its hard to say what he said about Bello or Zik because, and I keep hammering this point home...no members of the public have a copy of this book.
All we have are snippets of what he thought about Awo.

Can we get sources on that quote by Zik?

Nnamdi Azikwe in his own words!!

[img]http://1.2.3.10/bmi/i.imgur.com/14cGn.jpg[/img]

Eko Ile: Bottom line , this bitter old man released this hate and tribalism book in time for the Nobel award season hoping to be considered before taking his old and disgruntled into his sad grave, but the old fool forgot that the world moved on while his sorry and pathetic axss remains in the sixties with his tribalistic existence. The Nobel folks obviously snubbed his broken down ax ss to let him know that the era of hate mongering and division is gone.

The man is a failure and he is going to his grave with a big F around his neck.

Yes I'm sure the words of Fashola's whor.e, gives Achebe many sleepless nights

What are you going to be known for? Being a glorified blowup doll?

The era of hate and division is gone coming from a guy who goes to every thread about the SE to say Igbo this Igbo that? Negro the stuff you are on is grade A product

kindabigg:

Who in that era cared about other ethnic group apart from his? At least Awo cared about the mid-Westerners, his closest associate, Anthony Enahoro, was an Urhobo man. And he was loved by the Oba of Benin. One can also argue that the minorities were discriminated against in Eastern region, hence, why Southern Cameroon left Nigeria. The Efiks were going to leave too, and the Ijaws complained about Igbo domination.

D yorrobber lies again, please tell me why d mid west voted to be separated from western nigeria? tell me any of awolowo legacy left in the midwest when they were under west? Awolowo even said that cocoa revenue will be used in the area it was farmed. Do u want me to get u d records? yorrober and lies! na wa o

kindabigg:

Nnamdi Azikwe in his own words!!

[img]http://1.2.3.10/bmi/i.imgur.com/14cGn.jpg[/img]

Well I'm off to go have lunch or dinner, whichever
If you are not a fan of this book by Achebe, may I suggest other titles:

Man of the People
The Problem with Nigeria
The Anthills and Savannas

I've heard that these book's seem to have a lot in common with Nigeria Some say the books are true to life with the 1st and the 3rd.