preciousoz:


Brother, I never said they are not Men of God. They are Men of God and it Ends there (Men). Why Create a Cult Figure out of yourself? Why d Emphasis of this 20th century Church on the Man and not God? Are U going to deny the fact that we are getting it all wrong as christians?

In one of the Sunday service in my church, My pastor during the sermon encouraged us to help those in Need around us and asked us to help someone in financial Need this week and see what God will do in our lives. We Set out and by Next Sunday there were Testimonies everywhere and prayers answered.


The above is an example of what it should be like. Imagine all churches encourage that, but what we see is the Term "Fertile" ground. Only when u drop it in the church or in the corfers of the pastor that's when U get Blessed ? More churches More Crimes, More kidnapping, some even steal and send to pastors ..... This is killing Christianity. Go on Evangelism out there and see what people say. Am I judging ? Of course No. I will definitely not keep quiet and see Charlatans take over Christianity or see people fooled and robbed of their sweat...

Please don't get me wrong, Many people have resolved to be atheist because of many Selfish acts by Men that are supposed to be Role Models. My positin is this , THEY ARE MEN and not GOD and are capable of Making mistakes.

I AGREE with u brother.We are on same page.I'm only saying that for the fact that we have the FAKE men of GOD every where does not mean that there are no real men of GOD !But what i am saying is that i should not try to correct an act and cause harm to my self or even others !I am only saying we should advise them like christians.Pray to God on their behalf while we call the ones we can call and talk to them if we can and think that they are on the wrong plat form.These men are called differently but to achieve one goal-SALVATION !
You said something concerning ur pastor admonishing members to be kind to one another.To go out there and sow into some ones life. To help the needy,BUT no one started a thread about that wonderful and spiritually motivated teaching.But the day ur pastor will teach concerning giving in the house or giving to a pastor to aid their work with God or for the purpose of evangelism,THEN some one will start up a thread on that. That is what i am saying ! There are people who are just happy the way things are and does not want it to change at all.
Those who weere christians and resolved to be atheists,were baby christians in the first place but i am not saying that if you are a son in the kingdom of GOD that u shouldn't consider the babies-NO. Infact as a matter of fact,there are scripturally accepted things u may want to do but becos it will drop the faith of the baby christains,you dnt have to go ahead with it expecially IF u decide to drop it it won't contradict the word of God.We have to check the consequences of our actions and how GRAVE the consequences will be !
Thanks for the advise reagrding the worship of man ! If i see my pastor as the all in all,then i dnt study my bible ! If i study my bible and meditate upon the word,the holy spirit can help me discern the true men of God !

Let's pray for our churches/pastors and believe God will do something some day.It is HIS word and not ours.-PRAY will do the work !
God bless us

To all those complaining about the seed of faith. . . .

1. Have you ever been forced to sow a seed? It is always voluntary!

2. When will you learn that even though the pastor could ignite the sowing, but the agreement is between you and God? He knows how to pay you back.

3. Have you forgotten the poor woman in the bible that cooked her last meal of flour (semo) for Elijah to get God's abundance?
What about Abraham sacrificing his only child?

4. Though the miracle might not be instant. . .but God never forgets!


5. Instead of blaming others, why don't you give it a try by sowing the seed and holding unto God to play his part.


My Testimony

2 years ago, I went to a church where the pastor embraced us to sow a seed of faith. I gave out everything in my pocket, including my tfare (call it stupidity if you like"

After the service, I planned to trek home. . .but I saw a friend that took me home in his jolly ride. On getting home, a man has been waiting to give me a job. Through out the week, it was one payment or the other. I got times 200 of what I gave out!

I tried it over and over by not seeing the pastor but God as my partner in the seed and he has suprised me beyond what I could say.


As per the $240 and $100. . . I was in the service and the second day was even more . . .$1000.

It's voluntary, so no one looked down on any. I tried my best and am believing in God (not Ashimolowo) for a greater testimony. By the way, the money belongs to the church, not the guest pastor!

Please bookmark this thread as I would soon come back to give thanks to God!

Dee60:

Thank you and God bless you for the honest post. I do continue to have a question: Where in the Word of God have we seen people being asked to give a particular amount?

Remember the warning in Revelation where we are asked not to add to the word of prophecy. We cannot help God. I do not have an answer to this controversy but maybe you can help. I see that the Word enjoins us to give bountifully, but is there a reference to particular amounts?

It's about giving ur ALL-The widows mite !Give almost all that you have irrespective of ur condition.
Giving cheerfully-The bible says that God loves a cheerful give.No matter how much you are giving,let it come from ur heart
And giving what MUST cost u something-David said that he will not give God what does not COST him !Cain gave anyhow and was rejected but abel gave the VERY best.
And some other ways that i'm yet to have a knowledge of !
Pastors sometimes want's to be specific according to the instruction given to them by God !-(spiritual) and that does not mean that if u give above that,it will be rejected or if u give below,it won't be accepted.
Some times the word of God is applied.
There are things that we do that may not be literally seen in the bible but a close spiritual view will show it to u scripturally.Apostle paul says that the letters of the law kills but the spirit of the law gives life !
I pray the holy spirit helps you to understand these sayings !
God bless us

Jcob: To all those complaining about the seed of faith. . . .

1. Have you ever been forced to sow a seed? It is always voluntary!

2. When will you learn that even though the pastor could ignite the sowing, but the agreement is between you and God? He knows how to pay you back.

3. Have you forgotten the poor woman in the bible that cooked her last meal of flour (semo) for Elijah to get God's abundance?
What about Abraham sacrificing his only child?

4. Though the miracle might not be instant. . .but God never forgets!


5. Instead of blaming others, why don't you give it a try by sowing the seed and holding unto God to play his part.


My Testimony

2 years ago, I went to a church where the pastor embraced us to sow a seed of faith. I gave out everything in my pocket, including my tfare (call it stupidity if you like"

After the service, I planned to trek home. . .but I saw a friend that took me home in his jolly ride. On getting home, a man has been waiting to give me a job. Through out the week, it was one payment or the other. I got times 200 of what I gave out!

I tried it over and over by not seeing the pastor but God as my partner in the seed and he has suprised me beyond what I could say.


As per the $240 and $100. . . I was in the service and the second day was even more . . .$1000.

It's voluntary, so no one looked down on any. I tried my best and am believing in God (not Ashimolowo) for a greater testimony. By the way, the money belongs to the church, not the guest pastor!

Please bookmark this thread as I would soon come back to give thanks to God!

God bless u sir !
God bless us

MAYOWAAK:


Pastor E A.Adeboye, "Open Heavens" Volume 12; 20 November, 2012

"Dollar is a measure, Naira is another measure, Euro is another and Pounds is another measure. If you want returns in Dollars, sow in Dollars. Do not sow in Naira and be expecting a harvest in Euro. It does not work like that.

You can be in any country and sow in the particular currency in which you want your harvest. Sow and keep on sowing in that currency. By the time your harvest comes, you will celebrate. In addition, the various denominations of each currency are different measures too. Take for instance the Nigeria Naira, you have N1000, N500, N200, N100, N50, N20, N10 and N5 notes. It is the particular denomination that you use that God will multiply and return to you. If you keep using the smallest of the denominations and think you are thrifty or wise, you are only limiting yourself. Do yourself a favour by using the b...
iggest denominations so as to get the greatest harvest."

Sometimes however, when you sow in a foreign currency, God may give you the harvest in a local currency for a reason. But if you check the value and compare with what you sowed, you will know that God knows how to calculate value in any currency. How often do you sow? The key to you financial breakthrough is in your hands. If you fail to use it, nothing will be delivered to you but if you use it very well, your life will turn around for good.

ACTION POINT:
Before you give, decide on the harvest you want and thereafter choose the seed and container that will deliver the harvest to you.

Pastor E A.Adeboye, "Open Heavens" Volume 12; 20 November, 2012

But our gods of men have a way of taking scripture out of context. Especially when money is involved. God has been alive for billions of years but Naira was printed by man only 30 something yrs ago. Yet they want us to believe he is counting every Naira we drop in church. That is demeaning. Very demeaning.

Jcob: To all those complaining about the seed of faith. . . .

1. Have you ever been forced to sow a seed? It is always voluntary!

2. When will you learn that even though the pastor could ignite the sowing, but the agreement is between you and God? He knows how to pay you back.

3. Have you forgotten the poor woman in the bible that cooked her last meal of flour (semo) for Elijah to get God's abundance?
What about Abraham sacrificing his only child?

4. Though the miracle might not be instant. . .but God never forgets!


5. Instead of blaming others, why don't you give it a try by sowing the seed and holding unto God to play his part.


My Testimony

2 years ago, I went to a church where the pastor embraced us to sow a seed of faith. I gave out everything in my pocket, including my tfare (call it stupidity if you like"

After the service, I planned to trek home. . .but I saw a friend that took me home in his jolly ride. On getting home, a man has been waiting to give me a job. Through out the week, it was one payment or the other. I got times 200 of what I gave out!

I tried it over and over by not seeing the pastor but God as my partner in the seed and he has suprised me beyond what I could say.


As per the $240 and $100. . . I was in the service and the second day was even more . . .$1000.

It's voluntary, so no one looked down on any. I tried my best and am believing in God (not Ashimolowo) for a greater testimony. By the way, the money belongs to the church, not the guest pastor!

Please bookmark this thread as I would soon come back to give thanks to God!

You are a sheep and your pastor is a theif. You and the pastor were made for each other

have you all lost your minds?

do u read scriptures with understanding @ all? who says the seed needs only be given to churches or pastors...

Jesus said if u wanna do someting for him...do it to your neighbour...

i ll understand if these seeds are sown to the needy...

Pls poick your bibles and read!

do u know the practice in the early days? xtians would sell all they had...lay it before the apostles' feet and the apostles would share equally in a way no one would lack...remember thats wat annanias and saphira was meant to do?


and yall shd stop blaming Nairalanders criticising you...if your gospel message warrants critism...you shd stop and reflect...Scriptures says u dnt do things that will make your neighbour lose faith...

he who has ear...listen! Selah!

ONLY THE POOR,BROKE, FRUSTRATED, JOBLESS, VISION-LESS GUYS CRITIZISE MEN OF GOD

bankylan: ONLY THE POOR,BROKE, FRUSTRATED, JOBLESS, VISION-LESS GUYS CRITIZISE MEN OF GOD

Just like you eh?

hey dears,
I has participated in the 24-hours seed under pastor Mathew's Ministratin and there is certainly enuf testimonies following it

it was voluntary then asn i'm sure it still is

bory09: Where you sow thou shall you reap. Where you work thou shall you enjoy. Give and it be given unto you. Everything has gain so my people stop criticising.

Where does the scripture says this? Many people are Christians but do NOT know God.

Their Bible remains under their pillow and all they know is what their Pastors say NOT what God said.

mosun_ade: Whats all that about? All churches do that. Inclusive of Redeem. It is not by force, so, what are you crying about? If you have you give, if you dont, you sit still. When they call for special offerings, it could be for specific projects, programmes or some community work somewhere. Why do you all assume it is so they could defraud people? People willingly give millions, because they have been so so blessed, but because you are broke and poor, you think it is a taboo or 419 for people to give money in church. SMH. If you understand the principle of giving, you will every week look for the nearest church to give something to, but if you dont, you will continue to think like a pauper and blame yourself when you find people progressing from God's hundred fold blessings.

Some good points all muddled up with personal feelings. You need to be careful not to mix scripture with your personal opinion.

Where in the Bible does it ask you to give a particular currency or amount? The word of God is our standard as Christians so anything outside the Holy Bible is not His WORD.

So please confirm the scripture and verse .

I have a question: " If a pastor comes up and tells you to give without expecting anything in return. Would you give?"

Some pastors or MOG mave have genuine needs and ask for money. May the members are not giving the way they ought to so the MOGs device schemes.

People know the reasons they should not give, but do they know the reasons they should?

I think that's one reason people fall into all sorts of schemes. It beats my imagination that someone like Bill Gates does not sow to any church and he's the richest man in the world.

My conclusion is this: If you feel led to give all your life savings, its between you and God. Don't do it because you were manipulated or psyched to do it. You must understand why you're doing it.
The fact that you gave cheerfully and don't receive any bumper harvest doesn't mean God hasn't accepted your gift.

jamace: There you go again, making monetary profits instead of winning souls for Christ. Too bad.

I am convinced by many of the comments here, that many people are Christians but they do not know God. God loves souls. People love money. The two will never meet.

May the true God who saved,raised &sent a Martin Luther to burst the Catholic Church scams of his day raise up save,raise&send a 21st century Martin Luther to expose this cunning craftiness of decietful plotting originating from men whose god is their belly and turn the faith of people to the power of God away from this sensual wisdom of men
Amen
Even if all you have read is the New Testament,you'll know this dude&his ilk are scammers.
Africans need to exorcise this witch doctor annointing mindset we use in relating with this men.

SELFWORTH:


Just like you eh?

I went through all your posts on Nairaland just to confirm my opinion of you, and I am not surprised. I am sure you have lost hope in life, maybe because of the poverty and frustration you have suffered in life. Calling a Pastor you don't know a thief is the height of mental degradation. If at all your problem is hereditary, you should not be too boastful of it by saying things like this on Nairaland.

Go and write this down, if you will ever fulfill destiny in life, you need to ask God for forgiveness. No one ever blasphemed against the ordained men of God and go free. Are you more intelligent and educated than people in church who are givers? Go to churches on Sundays and see young men and women in thousands serving God. Are u better than them in any way? Do you want to say they don't know what they are doing?...

bankylan:

I went through all your posts on Nairaland just to confirm my opinion of you, and I am not surprised. I am sure you have lost hope in life, maybe because of the poverty and frustration you have suffered in life. Calling a Pastor you don't know a thief is the height of mental degradation. If at all your problem is hereditary, you should not be too boastful of it by saying things like this on Nairaland.

Go and write this down, if you will ever fulfill destiny in life, you need to ask God for forgiveness. No one ever blasphemed against the ordained men of God and go free. Are you more intelligent and educated than people in church who are givers? Go to churches on Sundays and see young men and women in thousands serving God. Are u better than them in any way? Do you want to say they don't know what they are doing?...

sssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

bankylan:

I went through all your posts on Nairaland just to confirm my opinion of you, and I am not surprised. I am sure you have lost hope in life, maybe because of the poverty and frustration you have suffered in life. Calling a Pastor you don't know a thief is the height of mental degradation. If at all your problem is hereditary, you should not be too boastful of it by saying things like this on Nairaland.

Go and write this down, if you will ever fulfill destiny in life, you need to ask God for forgiveness. No one ever blasphemed against the ordained men of God and go free. Are you more intelligent and educated than people in church who are givers? Go to churches on Sundays and see young men and women in thousands serving God. Are u better than them in any way? Do you want to say they don't know what they are doing?...

STOP THIS RUBBISH, THREATENING PEOPLE. And what if he fulfills destiny Shall we then say you serve a false God you don't know We are tired of all these religious threat. It has no biblical stand!

bankylan:

I went through all your posts on Nairaland just to confirm my opinion of you, and I am not surprised. I am sure you have lost hope in life, maybe because of the poverty and frustration you have suffered in life. Calling a Pastor you don't know a thief is the height of mental degradation. If at all your problem is hereditary, you should not be too boastful of it by saying things like this on Nairaland.

Go and write this down, if you will ever fulfill destiny in life, you need to ask God for forgiveness. No one ever blasphemed against the ordained men of God and go free. Are you more intelligent and educated than people in church who are givers? Go to churches on Sundays and see young men and women in thousands serving God. Are u better than them in any way? Do you want to say they don't know what they are doing?...

Behold my people the insidous underside of "Churches" so focused on Prosperity preaching they lose sight of the true Christian calling. A true "Christian" living in the shadow of Jesus will not resort to threats and abuses. The Pastor has been elevated to the "God of Man" whose actions must not be critically examined.

There are churches and there are cults. By your actions and utterances, it is easy for us to deduce which one most of you attend without knowing it.


Let me relate this experience: When I was in secondary school (boarding), this popular Chris Oyakhilome guy was a senior and also top honcho in the Scripture Union (SU?). He was a nice guy and also very charismatic so, to humor him, we would sometimes allow him to corral us juniors into the sunday service (we hide and dodge from other seniors) - even though I am a muslim.

With him standing there, a guest preacher (some hungry looking guy in a shabby suit that must have seen better days) came to testify that he had a dream revealing how he was going to marry some rich Onassis woman in Greece. And, to receive bountiful blessings, we were to donate towards his flight ticket! I was only 11, just fresh from my home environment but I somehow donated from my meagre spending money, along with many others I must say. Maybe it was mass hypnosis or not willing to be left out of the group dynamic. One thing though, I was mostly hungry the rest of the term.

It was obviously a scam. A lowdown dirty stinking sham to extort money from gullible young persons. As I grew up, this experience has informed my ability to rationalize the dirty pillars holding up these prosperity churches and their Pastors. I am grateful for that valuable lesson.

Hi Guys, This is really getting personal. I think we should just hold this or end.
If we continue like this today people will start abusing families and others.
I will suggest the initiator of this should either close or end this or we can discuss what we can do for this our great nation.

What do you think guys?

I dont want us to start making names of each other and have serious hatred for each other please.
This is a very delicate issue and everyone will have personal issues they will want to express.

Thank you all.

24hr miracle? Why not $24 instead of $240

Behind bobo: 24hr miracle? Why not $24 instead of $240

That is exactly my point. The one i watched on TV was also titled 24 miracle anointing based on faith. It was not about money and there was no request for money. I just listened to the word and it really lifted my faith . He prayed at the end of the message for everyone including those watching and within 3 days i got a new job out of the blue.

Its faith that moves God. I guess some gullible Nigerians feel they need to part with something to be 'in faith'.
Who knows why (probably greed) they fall for these stupid lies but then again God Himself said my people perish because of lack of knowledge.

bankylan:

I went through all your posts on Nairaland just to confirm my opinion of you, and I am not surprised. I am sure you have lost hope in life, maybe because of the poverty and frustration you have suffered in life. Calling a Pastor you don't know a thief is the height of mental degradation. If at all your problem is hereditary, you should not be too boastful of it by saying things like this on Nairaland.

Go and write this down, if you will ever fulfill destiny in life, you need to ask God for forgiveness. No one ever blasphemed against the ordained men of God and go free. Are you more intelligent and educated than people in church who are givers? Go to churches on Sundays and see young men and women in thousands serving God. Are u better than them in any way? Do you want to say they don't know what they are doing?...

Please read my posts again and make sure you understand. It is not written in Greek language.

You are wrong because I actually know Pastor Matthew and have met him several times which shows you know nothing about me or my life so all your assumptions have been dumped into the bin where they belong.

Please WRITE THIS DOWN TOO. You cannot speak into my destiny because you are not my God. I serve a living God and He said by their fruits we shall know them. Your comments (your fruits)prove you know nothing about God. Your comments, values, threats including everything you stand for is not biblical and gives you away as a Bible basher.

I am on point that many people like you profess to be a Christian but DO NOT KNOW GOD. Stop worshipping your Pastor because he is an ordinary man. He is fallible just like you and I. I love my pastor too but he is not my GOD.

I rest my case.

Goshen360:

STOP THIS RUBBISH, THREATENING PEOPLE. And what if he fulfills destiny Shall we then say you serve a false God you don't know We are tired of all these religious threat. It has no biblical stand!

Dont mind them. They all claim to know 'God' but God DOES NOT KNOW them.

Luke 13:22-27 Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”He said to them, “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’ “Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’ “But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers

Behind bobo: 24hr miracle? Why not $24 instead of $240

Why not even 24 naira

oluchikeh: hey dears,
I has participated in the 24-hours seed under pastor Mathew's Ministratin and there is certainly enuf testimonies following it

it was voluntary then asn i'm sure it still is

Why don't you give us details of the so called testimonies instead of just making vacant claims to promote Ashimolowo's scam. I say it again with all sense of responsibility as a God fearing christian that Ashimolowo is a fraudster peddling the gospel for personal gain.

JNdupu:


Let me relate this experience: When I was in secondary school (boarding), this popular Chris Oyakhilome guy was a senior and also top honcho in the Scripture Union (SU?). He was a nice guy and also very charismatic so, to humor him, we would sometimes allow him to corral us juniors into the sunday service (we hide and dodge from other seniors) - even though I am a muslim.

With him standing there, a guest preacher (some hungry looking guy in a shabby suit that must have seen better days) came to testify that he had a dream revealing how he was going to marry some rich Onassis woman in Greece. And, to receive bountiful blessings, we were to donate towards his flight ticket! I was only 11, just fresh from my home environment but I somehow donated from my meagre spending money, along with many others I must say. Maybe it was mass hypnosis or not willing to be left out of the group dynamic. One thing though, I was mostly hungry the rest of the term.

It was obviously a scam. A lowdown dirty stinking sham to extort money from gullible young persons. As I grew up, this experience has informed my ability to rationalize the dirty pillars holding up these prosperity churches and their Pastors. I am grateful for that valuable lesson.

I never knew Oyakhilome started scamming people as far back as his secondary school days. I actually thought he derailed along the line but with this new info, one can safely conclude he has fraud engraved into his DNA.

JNdupu:


Let me relate this experience: When I was in secondary school (boarding), this popular Chris Oyakhilome guy was a senior and also top honcho in the Scripture Union (SU?). He was a nice guy and also very charismatic so, to humor him, we would sometimes allow him to corral us juniors into the sunday service (we hide and dodge from other seniors) - even though I am a muslim.

With him standing there, a guest preacher (some hungry looking guy in a shabby suit that must have seen better days) came to testify that he had a dream revealing how he was going to marry some rich Onassis woman in Greece. And, to receive bountiful blessings, we were to donate towards his flight ticket! I was only 11, just fresh from my home environment but I somehow donated from my meagre spending money, along with many others I must say. Maybe it was mass hypnosis or not willing to be left out of the group dynamic. One thing though, I was mostly hungry the rest of the term.

It was obviously a scam. A lowdown dirty stinking sham to extort money from gullible young persons. As I grew up, this experience has informed my ability to rationalize the dirty pillars holding up these prosperity churches and their Pastors. I am grateful for that valuable lesson.

I never knew Oyakhilome started scamming people as far back as his secondary school days. I actually thought he derailed along the line but with this new info, one can safely conclude he has fraud engraved into his DNA.

Theology of prosperity!!!
If u talk they will say u r possessed . Rubbish

Pastor Kun:

I never knew Oyakhilome started scamming people as far back as his secondary school days. I actually thought he derailed along the line but with this new info, one can safely conclude he has fraud engraved into his DNA.

To be fair, and to place it on record here, Oyakhilome was a very very nice senior. Totally immersed in his SU stuff of course, always trying to convert everybody, but really one of the top guys we juniors could relate to.

This was also a one-off so I'm thinking the scam was more the modus operandi of the hungry guest Preacher. In any case, I got wiser and actively kept away from the SU stuff. Good lesson I think.

JNdupu:

To be fair, and to place it on record here, Oyakhilome was a very very nice senior. Totally immersed in his SU stuff of course, always trying to convert everybody, but really one of the top guys we juniors could relate to.

This was also a one-off so I'm thinking the scam was more the modus operandi of the hungry guest Preacher. In any case, I got wiser and actively kept away from the SU stuff. Good lesson I think.

It is standard practise in commercial churches to use a guest preacher when they want to actively scam their congregation so he can be denied if the scam back fires. That is why rogues like Ashimolowo are always invited to do the dirty work for them and they share the proceeds based on a fixed ratio or they pay him a hefty honourarium for a job well done. Even if it was a one off then, Oyaks was still learning the trade but totoday we can safely say that scamming is a way of life for him today.