plaetton:

He he he. Is that all you could pick up and pick upon? Same vicinity? Is that thee all important thing now?
I thought the distinction was the main issue here, now you have turned it to Vicinity issue.
Na wa for you davidylan.
Anyway, I'm off now.
Another time.

Your lying, prevarication and dishonesty is appalling. This is what you said...

plaetton:
But why did the Nabataens, that you referred to earlier, have both their High Places and their Temple, in the same vicinity? Surely, they must have known better than you, that they were distinct. Don't you think?

When asked to provide evidence to back this up now you're off? What a complete joke.

Enigma:


1. You know very well that my view is that you are extremely intellectually dishonest.

2. You know very well that I have caught you expressly and undeniably at clear intellectual dishonesty several times; on some of the occasions, you went mum or underground after I pointed things out to you.

3. You know very well that on one occasion, you actually expressly stated that you would deliberately maintain and continue an intellectually dishonest approach; this was when you were still using the globexl (or whatever) name; even one of the atheists tried to call you to order on that occasion.

4. Finally, for the avoidance of doubt, I think you are extremely intellectually dishonest (granted some of your problems could be put down to poor comprehension); that with your predilection for conspiracy theories have the effect that I am not readily inclined to engage with you in discussion.

Well, each to his own. I thought the general format of the the forum was to thrash, debunk and point out weakpoints in a discussion , rather than focusing upon and stalking individuals for character assasinations, which what is what you do best. I am not your only victim,many have noted and felt your bitter personal vandettas on this forum. So I am not bothered.
I get off the cliff sometimes, but I 'm quick to retrace my steps and make amends.
Like I said, you are who you are.

I think an intellectually dishonest person is one who is never wrong and tries to bully anyone or those who are not in agreement with his or her viewpoint.
Anyway, enough for now.

davidylan:

Your lying, prevarication and dishonesty is appalling. This is what you said...

When asked to provide evidence to back this up now you're off? What a complete joke.

What other evidence do you want? a side by side picture?. What part of vicinity do you not understand?
I'm off because I have to attend to other things.
Why, you want to claim victory?
pls be my guest if it will make your day.
Good night.

plaetton:
What other evidence do you want? a side by side picture?. What part of vicinity do you not understand?
I'm off because I have to attend to other things.
Why, you want to claim victory?
pls be my guest if it will make your day.
Good night.

The part that knows that YOU'RE LYING because you really do have no proof. All we have is your word which has been proven to be very dishonest. You were all too happy to post two pictures which you claimed where the temple and high places in the same vicinity. Please post the pictures and point them to us.

It is not enough to just come here, make bogus statements and then try to bullshit your way with a word salad that carries zero meaning.

plaetton:
Well, each to his own. I thought the general format of the the forum was to thrash, debunk and point out weakpoints in a discussion , rather than focusing upon and stalking individuals for character assasinations, which what is what you do best. I am not your only victim,many have noted and felt your bitter personal vandettas on this forum. So I am not bothered.
I get off the cliff sometimes, but I 'm quick to retrace my steps and make amends.
Like I said, you are who you are.

I think an intellectually dishonest person is one who is never wrong and tries to bully anyone or those who are not in agreement with his or her viewpoint.
Anyway, enough for now.

seriously? what a joke you are. This thread alone is enough evidence that you are guilty of what you accuse others of.

davidylan:

i wonder why... perhaps because islam is purely a retelling of jewish culture?

Yes! The Prophet(SAW)came to reaffirm the teachings of all the other Prophets (AS). The Jews were a very stubborn people, they kept corrupting God's message, slandering and killing Prophets. There is hardly any Prophet they didn't badmouth, part of it is what you were quick to quote against Solomon (AS) from the Bible. Pure slander of God's Prophet. #Disgraceful.

maclatunji:

Yes! The Prophet(SAW)came to reaffirm the teachings of all the other Prophets (AS). The Jews were a very stubborn people, they kept corrupting God's message, slandering and killing Prophets. There is hardly any Prophet they didn't badmouth, part of it is what you were quick to quote against Solomon (AS) from the Bible. Pure slander of God's Prophet. #Disgraceful.

Was he a jew? No. so exactly why is he interested in reaffirming the life history of other people? Perhaps he should have done a better job with arab history.
Just seems to happen that a lot of his "affirmation" flies in the face of common sense and established history.

davidylan:

Was he a jew? No. so exactly why is he interested in reaffirming the life history of other people? Perhaps he should have done a better job with arab history.
Just seems to happen that a lot of his "affirmation" flies in the face of common sense and established history.

God's message to mankind is Universal. The stories of these Prophets have resonance across all races- worship one God and follow his rules, this world and the next will be a better place for you.

plaetton: Well, each to his own. I thought the general format of the the forum was to thrash, debunk and point out weakpoints in a discussion , rather than focusing upon and stalking individuals for character assasinations, which what is what you do best. I am not your only victim,many have noted and felt your bitter personal vandettas on this forum. So I am not bothered.
I get off the cliff sometimes, but I 'm quick to retrace my steps and make amends.
Like I said, you are who you are.

I think an intellectually dishonest person is one who is never wrong and tries to bully anyone or those who are not in agreement with his or her viewpoint.
Anyway, enough for now.

Your problem.

It is a public forum; anyone can make whatever contribution they wish to a thread or choose whom they think worthwhile to "discuss" with.

You are the one frequently asking me to engage in discussion with you; you have made the request many times; even today on this thread. So, who is "stalking" who?

I have maintained my stance always; I am not interested ---- as long as you maintain your usual intellectually dishonest disposition.

maclatunji:

God's message to mankind is Universal. The stories of these Prophets have resonance across all races- worship one God and follow his rules, this world and the next will be a better place for you.

sigh. we've been through this hubris time and time again. It appears islam was only interested in jewish prophets. You dont seem prophets from buddhists, sikhs etc in the quran... didnt they all preach one God too?

What we have is the naked attempt to dishonestly attach allah to the jewish culture and religion... God's message is universal YET he seemed (at least from the islamic perspective) to be solely interested in jews only? Odd.

davidylan:

seriously? what a joke you are. This thread alone is enough evidence that you are guilty of what you accuse others of.

Are you minding him. I saw him making (probably jealous) denigrations of your education etc (granted he later apologised) and calling others "religious nutjobs" on this thread alone.

In any event it is the modus operandi of his and some other sciolists who come here to form "intellectual" without realising the fundamental importance of honesty or indeed truthfulness in the quest for truth. People who are blinded by bigotry that they cannot see any good in religion generally and especially in Christianity.

Simply ridiculous.

davidylan:

Bros, i have never seen such level of dishonesty until i started running into NL atheists.

my brother don't mind the confused mortals called atheist.

i took part in its construction in my past life.

maclatunji:

God's message to mankind is Universal. The stories of these Prophets have resonance across all races- worship one God and follow his rules, this world and the next will be a better place for you.

There are other people in the Qur'an that either predate the Jews or weren't Jews at all. You are too lazy to acknowledge them.

by davidylan(m): 10:38pm

maclatunji:

God's message to mankind is Universal. The stories of these Prophets have resonance across all races- worship one God and follow his rules, this world and the next will be a better place for you.


sigh. we've been through this hubris time and time again. It appears islam was only interested in jewish prophets. You dont seem prophets from buddhists, sikhs etc in the quran... didnt they all preach one God too?

name your 'jewish prophets' and show us your evidence that they are jewish in their religion. i think you do not know what is the core of judaism. did anyone of your 'jewish prophets' pray to the wall, with a kappi on his head [the praying jews of 2012], etc?

What we have is the Unclad attempt to dishonestly attach allah to the jewish culture and religion... God's message is universal YET he seemed (at least from the islamic perspective) to be solely interested in jews only? Odd.

some people are drunk without consuming any alcohol. the story of man is what you will find in the Quran. bani israil is different from yahud [jew]. no prophet or believer from the loin of Prophet Jacob [as] is called yahud.

Quran contains stories of prophets Hud, Salih and Shuib [as] and i dont know if the bible recognizes any of them. you can read about them in many chapters [Hud, The prophets and other chapters]. Yet, the Quran has a chapter about Luqman, who the bible has nothing about. While to the ignorant mind the Bible only talk about the jews, the word jew or judaism, jewish cant include Joseph because Judah was one of his brothers or their father , Jacob or their grandfather isaac, or his older brother Ishmael who am sure no christian or jew will say he is jewish, or their father Ibrahim [as] or his nephew Lot or the king of salem genrations before [Noah, Enoch, etc, etc, etc, . . . Adam [as]]. Yet the story of man includes all of these noble people and righteous people. the story of man includes the story of tyrannical pharaoh of Moses. and ruler/azziz of the time of Joseph. The first idols worshiped by man were named in surah Noah and the bible has no clue of when paganism entered the life of man. we know that the children of israel have no regards for faith. its not by word of mouth but to claim true faith, you have to act upon it.

maclatunji:

There are other people in the Qur'an that either predate the Jews or weren't Jews at all. You are too lazy to acknowledge them.

not really dude. You're new here so you obviously dont know... that issue has been thrashed here so many times there is no point rehashing it. What is most apparent when you look in the quran is the fact that all those mentioned in the quran who were NOT significantly talked about in jewish history are barely mentioned by name once or twice in the quran and VERY LITTLE information is provided for them. those with significant stories in the quran are all present in the jewish torah!

For example... there are numerous stories of Abraham, solomon, david and co in the quran... they all just happen to be the EXACT SAME stories found in the bible!

When it comes to others not in the bible... there is VIRTUALLY NOTHING on them. For example, who are the Jurhums?

inurmind:

I also believe they practiced polytheism, Yahweh was just the main god. There are alot of hidden things Christians do not know about their religion.

Everyone knows that the ancient Israelites practiced polytheism. All the ancient prophets complained about this. The books of Kings, Samuel and Chronicles detail this. Jehovah allowed them be taken into exile to Assyria and Babylon just because they worshipped other gods along with Him. Any Christians who are ignorant of this do not read their Bible.

SEYI_KP: TO GOD BE D GLORY ALL THIS ATTEST TO THE AUTHENCITY OF THE ONLY HOLY BOOK IN THE WORLD I MEAN BIBLE. ALL OTHER PROFFESS holy book ARE ILLUSION.

dat bible was written by Paul whom by history neva met JESUS and thats why u cnt tel me where "BIBLE" was mention in the so called holy book..

#just dnt knw 4 u guys oo slowpoke

SNCOQ3:

1Ki 11:6 And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father.
1Ki 11:7 Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon.
1Ki 11:8 And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods.
1Ki 11:9 And the LORD was angry with Solomon, because his heart was turned from the LORD God of Israel, which had appeared unto him twice,
1Ki 11:10 And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the LORD commanded.


So whats your point exactly again you shameless liar. What have they discovered that is not already in the bible?

My broda abeg tell them o. So many of these so-Called atheists never studied the Bible when they were Christians.

Muslims the ones wey u dey do 4 north no reach u na, u na wnt start anoda bombing where 2
y u na leave Christians alone i beg oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

davidylan:

Was he a jew? No. so exactly why is he interested in reaffirming the life history of other people? Perhaps he should have done a better job with arab history.
Just seems to happen that a lot of his "affirmation" flies in the face of common sense and established history.

i dnt tnk d holy quran and bible ever change face. But wait its lyk d latter do oo lyk many times.. Mhen religious wit wich it holy book change author...wat am i even saying author 4 got sake,it shows its arranging noni,the quran say the hear of a kafir(disbeliever) is bin block so the truth would neva b heard but god is a saviour he save many folk who later was healed.so u guys re more or less a deaf...but i pray u are healed.

uwem18: Muslims the ones wey u dey do 4 north no reach u na, u na wnt start anoda bombing where 2
y u na leave Christians alone i beg oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

am i misin sumtin maybe i 4gt say na onlx north nigeria muslims dey.. Aaargh u're dumb !olohun!

by davidylan(m): 12:29am

maclatunji:

There are other people in the Qur'an that either predate the Jews or weren't Jews at all. You are too lazy to acknowledge them.


not really dude. You're new here so you obviously dont know... that issue has been thrashed here so many times there is no point rehashing it. What is most apparent when you look in the quran is the fact that all those mentioned in the quran who were NOT significantly talked about in jewish history are barely mentioned by name once or twice in the quran and VERY LITTLE information is provided for them. those with significant stories in the quran are all present in the jewish torah!

there are chapters chapters named after Hud, a prophet not mentioned in the bible. There are other prophets like Salih and Shuaib not mentioned in the bible, but you can find a whole about their lives and times and their messages to their people in the Quran. Luqman has a chapter named after him. what this christian poster is saying about the Quran relative to the Bible is incorrect. the stories that Quran have in common with the Bible are merely in names of the personalities, while the story lines and details are quite different.

For example... there are numerous stories of Abraham, solomon, david and co in the quran... they all just happen to be the EXACT SAME stories found in the bible!

same names, the details are completely different. in the Quran father Ibrahim [sa] was not an adulterer, the exact opposite of what the bible is saying about him relative to Hagar. Ibrahim attempted to slaughter his cooperate and patient son, Ismail while the bible is saying that in spite of the iron lady hold that sarah had over Abraham, he was able to get Isaac out, while lying all the way to the slaughter place to the lad. solomon of the bible is an idolater, while Sulaiman of the Quran is honored and truly a prophet of God. David of the bible was a killer and womanizer, while God made the Dawd a man that animals and even mountains joined him in praising God and the iron is made soft in his hand so that he was able to fashion from it even weapons and through it his livelihood. Nothing the Bible has that Quran copied. God told the stories so that where the bible gets each wrong, the accurate information can be found in the Quran as what corrects the lies already held as truth.

When it comes to others not in the bible... there is VIRTUALLY NOTHING on them. For example, who are the Jurhums?

what spiritual benefit is there in a story of a nation, tribe, people? quraish is the only makkan or arab tribe mentioned in the Quran. is this the only tribe in Makka of Muhammad [sa]? How about any arab or jewish tribe in Madina? anyone who knows about the children of Israel will tell you the tribe of judah [jewish] is just one of the 12 nations. i guess the 12 nations were the "world" of Jesus. Fortunately, Quran did not mention any of the 12 tribes/nations. but spoke about noteworthy family [imran of Mary mother of Jesus], prophets from the children of Jacob.

Did Quran talk about the tribe of benjamin or any other of the 12? and when yahudi [jew] is used, it is similar to when the jews say gentile but not as degrading when they say goyim [animals]; the term they use to describe non jews.

Sweetnecta: @Revolutnis: Paul the chronic liar who passed his opinion up as revelation? are you for real, mehn?


i see that you do not believe one can have direct connection to God. which is singly essential for salvation; believe in God by adhering to His Commandments from the beginning of time or simply giving your life to Jesus [what form does this giving your life?]?



God was already known, long time before Abraham [as]. Definitely Adam [as] must have known that God existed.



Before Moses [as], The Name of God was known to many; Adam, Noah, etc [as] knew it not as "I AM", but in their native tongue. in the native tongue of Adam, it is Allah. in the native tongue of Jesus, it is Ellah which you people intentionally say is Eli. did you notice that Jesus never said the Name of God is "I AM, Yahweh, Jehovah"?


it will be silly if i started writing to you with knowing its you by your name, above. Paul didn't wait for the devil he said appeared to him before he said "is it you lord". do you think the deceiver, satan will say to him, no, its me satan, when his intention was to deceive and change the course of the prophetic legacy of Jesus? Paul ran with satan and elevated Jesus to more than a prophet, and there was the birth of your ideology; chritianity.



now He is Elohim. not I AM of Moses. not Eli of Jesus. not even Jehovah of Paul. i see how honest you are.



how are obeying the One God Who you not only make up a son for Him, but the same son is He and His partner? How can one be three, a bachelor be married?



one will expect a person such as yourself, who considers himself not a sinner, to not lie because sin is actually a lie or intentionally ignoring the truth.

if you are not a sinner, then you will have to answer the following questions, below:

I have decided to lecture u a bit about ur Muhammad the (prophet) and his deluded religion. Muhammad was the son of Abdullah and Amina. he was born 570 AD in Mecca. His father died b4 his birth, his mother when he was 6. After that he was brought up by his grandfather Abdu'l Muttalib and after his death by his uncle Abu Talib. he belonged to the clan of Hashim. which was part of the Quraish tribe of which Abdu'l Muttalib was the chief. in his youth Muhammad traveled widely wt camel trading caravans. he is reported to have bn a quiet, amiable and pleasant boy. in his childhood he had some occult exposure. at the age of 25 he married Khadijah, by whom he was employed and who was 15 years his senior. the marriage was a happy one, and 2boys and 4girls were born to them. Muhammad was widowed after 25 years of marriage. He surely knew some Biblical stories which were related to him by some Jews and Christians, whom he met on his travels (Surahs 14+15) Waraqa ibn Naufal, a cousin of Muhammad's wife Khadijah, was a christian and had translated (part of?) the Gospel into Arabic (DICTIONARY OF ISLAM by T.P Hughes) the Apostle of Islam Muhammad received his revelation while asleep in Mecca when he was about 40years of old Mishkat IV, PP. 356-357. Muhammad made up the his Quran with the Biblical stories he had from his childhood + the delusive revelations he came up with. YOU BETTER RUN FOR UE LIFE BEFORE YOU MEET HIM IN HELL FIRE

plaetton: This temple would most likely have been built during the reign of King Jeroboam. The most interesting aspect of this is that (a), the bible tells us that the ancient Israelites built only one sacred temple for their one and only god, Yahweh. (B) There is no evidence to show that this particular temple was built or dedicated to the worship of Yahweh.
(c) Since temples are built for and dedicated to the worship of a particular deity, one can draw any one of two conclusions from this discovery:

1. That the ancient Israelites did indeed, as I have argued severally, practice polytheism.
or,
2. The ancient Israelites never resided in that geographical area and never had a kingdom as we have been led to believe. Indeed, there have been no remnants of any great Hebrew kingdom ever discovered.

Very interesting post.

Billyonaire: Why are we interested in the life and times of neanderthals?

"We" are interested in the past because a lot of what we do is based upon assumptions about the past.

Moreover, understanding the past helps us more clearly see the present and future.

davidylan:

and the islamic accounts made up out of thin air are worth the paper they are written on? My guy please park well for one side.

What is the islamic basis for its "belief" that solomon was no idolater? Where is its historical record? The lips of a murderous thug who came over 2000 yrs AFTER solomon had long died? When history is being discussed, muslims do need to just keep quiet.

Very true.

Along the course of their history,the israelites did worship false gods,even during the time of king Solomon. Remember the Holy Book tells us he allowed his wives worship their gods.So this find does not support nor disagree with the israelites claim to Jerusalem.

REVOLUTNIS:
I have decided to lecture u a bit about ur Muhammad the (prophet) and his deluded religion. Muhammad was the son of Abdullah and Amina. he was born 570 AD in Mecca. His father died b4 his birth, his mother when he was 6. After that he was brought up by his grandfather Abdu'l Muttalib and after his death by his uncle Abu Talib. he belonged to the clan of Hashim. which was part of the Quraish tribe of which Abdu'l Muttalib was the chief. in his youth Muhammad traveled widely wt camel trading caravans. he is reported to have bn a quiet, amiable and pleasant boy. in his childhood he had some occult exposure. at the age of 25 he married Khadijah, by whom he was employed and who was 15 years his senior. the marriage was a happy one, and 2boys and 4girls were born to them. Muhammad was widowed after 25 years of marriage. He surely knew some Biblical stories which were related to him by some Jews and Christians, whom he met on his travels (Surahs 14+15) Waraqa ibn Naufal, a cousin of Muhammad's wife Khadijah, was a christian and had translated (part of?) the Gospel into Arabic (DICTIONARY OF ISLAM by T.P Hughes) the Apostle of Islam Muhammad received his revelation while asleep in Mecca when he was about 40years of old Mishkat IV, PP. 356-357. Muhammad made up the his Quran with the Biblical stories he had from his childhood + the delusive revelations he came up with. YOU BETTER RUN FOR UE LIFE BEFORE YOU MEET HIM IN HELL FIRE

Your teachers didn't teach you well. The Prophet hardly met Waraqa more than once and then he started telling Bible stories, just like that? Read Sweetnecta's post again. The Qur'an counters many of the wrong submissions of the Bible that was simply adopted by Christians from Jews. It is noteworthy that the Jewish Holy Book is different from the Old testament but Christians have no divine record in the Old testament and rely on their Jewish teachers who are known not to be honest.

It was easy for the unlettered Prophet (SAW) to debunk the Jewish and Christian leadership of his time as evidenced in the stories of Suratul Kahf because he had divine knowledge passed to him. You guys argue from a very myopic position.

Running to antiIslamic websites to quote twisted conjecture is too lame.

maclatunji:

Your teachers didn't teach you well. The Prophet hardly met Waraqa more than once and then he started telling Bible stories, just like that? Read Sweetnecta's post again. The Qur'an counters many of the wrong submissions of the Bible that was simply adopted by Christians from Jews. It is noteworthy that the Jewish Holy Book is different from the Old testament but Christians have no divine record in the Old testament and rely on their Jewish teachers who are known not to be honest.

It was easy for the unlettered Prophet (SAW) to debunk the Jewish and Christian leadership of his time as evidenced in the stories of Suratul Kahf because he had divine knowledge passed to him. You guys argue from a very myopic position.

Running to antiIslamic websites to quote twisted conjecture is too lame.

hmmmm do we really need to debate this obvious lie?

What are muslims doing on this thread?
When did jewish history became arabic history?

solomon111: What are muslims doing on this thread?
When did jewish history became arabic history?

Without jewish history, islam would have faded into the twilight of history so for them this is huge.