alexleo:

What you are saying is different from what the OP is saying. OP is totally denying the existence of hell while you are cautioning on the content of some of the testimonies. He is spreading a false message while you are cautioning. Yours is a different thing all together and its quite a good step too.
Having said that, let me inform you that there is no need for you to be afraid of the testimonies or begin to feel that its difficult to make heaven. Jesus has paid the price of our sins and his blood is available always to cleanse us from all sin. As a child of God, all you need do is to always plead for the blood of Jesus to wash you in your daily prayers. Ask him for the grace to live a holy life that is pleasing to him. Do not desire sinful things. Move away from where there is temptation but each time you find yourself that you have sinned, pls do not waste time to plead for the blood of Jesus to cleanse you. There is nothing hard about doing the things I ve said just that satan often times makes us ignore these things as if our life is in our hands. Mark this- none of us will make heaven by our power but by the grace of God. If you rely on your strength it ll appear so hard to make and you ll lose it "for by strength shall no man prevail"(1 Samuel 2:9). God bless you.

Frosbel's position is that of emotions, he sincerely finds it difficult to comprehend eternal damnation of the unrighteous. He thinks it will paint God wicked, a notion you would expect from an atheist/agnostic individual. When people die, such people would call God wicked but as christians we should know better, we have been told there will be a time to live and a time to die, The bible says He makes alive and He brings death. When death now comes we question God based on our limited moral cognizance cos of the lack of understanding of God through His word.

The scripture says His wrath will be revealed against all unrighteousness, If you think that is a mere threat, study the old testament all over again to see the both sides of God.

[quote author=shdemidemi]

Frosbel's position is that of emotions, he sincerely finds it difficult to comprehend eternal damnation of the unrighteous. He thinks it will paint God wicked, a notion you would expect from an atheist/agnostic individual. When people die, such people would call God wicked but as christians we should know better, we have been told there will be a time to live and a time to die, The bible says He makes alive and He brings death. When death now comes we question God based on our limited moral cognizance.

You have a strange way of presenting your false doctrines , rather than pursue a serious study of scripture, you are busy parroting myths and fables. Those days are over, the days of holding people in bondage with these doctrines of demons.

The scripture says His wrath will be revealed against all unrighteousness, If you think that is a mere threat, study the old testament all over again to see the both sides of God.

What is God's wrath ? And why did Paul use the present tense being to underpin his statement that even now GOD's wrath is being revealed ( Romans 1). Also, what is the purpose of the Lake of fire.

According to your sadistic , Satan inspired doctrine, punishment in this life and destruction in the next is not enough, it has to be forever and ever.

I will tell you who is propagating this lie, Satan the father of lies , while you are unwittingly acting as his agent , by disseminating this falsehood.

be careful.

DrummaBoy:

Well, truth is we all must make room for ourselves on this forum and not allow insults, curses and name calling derail thread discuss. I know dispute get so bad that some people resort to name calling to vent their frustration, the old doctrine of restraint or self-control should come in handy in times like that. And it is not just Alex alone that is guilty of it; we all are. I drew Pastor Kun's attention to this yesterday. Now how do we adorn the doctrines we so passionately support, when we curse and insult and malign, as if we are on the politics section.

So I call everyone on each side of the divide to pls exercise restraint. Let us discuss like matured people. I may not agree with Bidam on many issues but I give him this credit that he hardly insults anyone on the forum.

So use of words like satan, false prophets, stu-pid, , etc, should not be found among those of us who profess religion

truthislight:

Did you say those on red (bold) ?

I laugh in ten languages.

It is true you may be really new around here.

@truthislight

My brother you are right. I really am new here. That same day I made the comment, Pa Bidam and I were in a debate and he just fall my hand completely. I was like: I just gave this guy the credit. No wonder the modify tab is on each post. I was just dissapointed. We all have our moments...

DrummaBoy:




@truthislight

My brother you are right. I really am new here. That same day I made the comment, Pa Bidam and I were in a debate and he just fall my hand completely. I was like: I just gave this guy the credit. No wonder the modify tab is on each post. I was just dissapointed. We all have our moments...

the truth is when scriptural evidences and explanations are given to someone who claims to be a christian and still remains obstinate in his stance even though he realizes his folly like frosbel here we term them spiritual f.oo.ls..like apostle Paul rightly said concerning the Galatians..so if i offend you in any way no vex.

frosbel: What is God's wrath ? And why did Paul use the present tense being to underpin his statement that even now GOD's wrath is being revealed ( Romans 1). Also, what is the purpose of the Lake of fire.

Anyway, I was not talking about this particular wrath here, but in Romans 1
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness,

Paul was talking to a predominant gentile church, he was making them understand the effect of not accepting God.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error

He explained that unnatural things would seem natural to such people. This has nothing to do with the eternal wrath I am talking about.

frosbel:
You have a strange way of presenting your false doctrines , rather than pursue a serious study of scripture, you are busy parroting myths and fables. Those days are over, the days of holding people in bondage with these doctrines of demons.

I will ignore this cos your Adamic nature is fully in control of you, you need to get to a place in your christian walk where your mind will be renewed. You can't achieve that by reading to make an argument or counter argument. Read to understand the attribute and nature of God with an open mind.

^^


I guess what irks you guys the more , is that people like me have the audacity to challenge your physical church institution with all it's false doctrines and fakery.

I stand for the church of GOD in Zion not the church of mystery Babylon with her multitudes of mysterious heretical doctrines.

shdemidemi: Anyway, I was not talking about this particular wrath here, but in Romans 1
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness,

Paul was talking to a predominant gentile church, he was making them understand the effect of not accepting God.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error

He explained that unnatural things would seem natural to such people. This has nothing to do with the eternal wrath I am talking about.


I will ignore this cos your Adamic nature is fully in control of you, you need to get to a place in your christian walk where your mind will be renewed. You can't achieve that by reading to make an argument or counter argument. Read to understand the attribute and nature of God with an open mind.

I would be very grateful if you can provide an answer to this question with relevant (contextual) Bible passages.

Who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?

Thank you.

nep2ra:


I would be very grateful if you can provide an answer to this question with relevant (contextual) Bible passages.

Who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?

Thank you.

A believer of the gospel goes to heaven

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

No more, no less.

If thou shall not believe and go to church from now till eternity, you are condemned.

DrummaBoy:




@truthislight

My brother you are right. I really am new here. That same day I made the comment, Pa Bidam and I were in a debate and he just fall my hand completely. I was like: I just gave this guy the credit. No wonder the modify tab is on each post. I was just dissapointed. We all have our moments...

Bidam, smh.

Just dont cross him with tithe.

shdemidemi:
A believer of the gospel goes to heaven

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

No more, no less.

If thou shall not believe and go to church from now till eternity, you are condemned.

Thank you for your answer.

From the answer given above, I can deduce these things:

1. A believer of the gospel of Jesus Christ goes to heaven.

2. If you are not a believer of the gospel of Jesus Christ, you will be condemned to a place of eternal torment. Right?


You quoted Romans 10:9

"...if you declare with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved" Romans 10:9 NIV

If I may ask, what is the believer saved from? The Bible doesn't expressly say what the believer is saved from. Did Jesus teach this?
What is the unbeliever condemned to? Condemned to what exactly? Did Jesus teach this?

What is the gospel of Jesus Christ?

What happens to people who never had the opportunity to hear and believe this gospel? What happens to people who lived in ancient civilizations and who practiced different religions? What happens to good people who are adherents of other religions?

What happens to Jews in Old Testament who worshiped God but never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ?

Thank you.

nep2ra:

What is the gospel of Jesus Christ?

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

nep2ra:
What happens to people who never had the opportunity to hear and believe this gospel? What happens to people who lived in ancient civilizations and who practiced different religions? What happens to good people who are adherents of other religions?

We don't choose God, God chooses us by election,Everyone that came to God was elected by Him. Anyone outside God is condemned.

nep2ra:
What happens to Jews in Old Testament who worshiped God but never heard the gospel of Jesus Christ?

In the old, the jews were made holy by atonement. Salvation was primarily for the Jews at the time through blood sacrifice and other rituals but Christ came to die so the whole world can be saved. Therefore, everyone after the death of Christ would be judged by the new covenant.

shdemidemi:



We don't choose God, God chooses us by election,Everyone that came to God was elected by Him. Anyone outside God is condemned.

I am going to address this lie from HELL , that we cannot choose GOD meaning our wills are just for fancy, we have no part in repenting from our sins and continuing our walk with GOD.

This Calvinist ( Calvin was a murderer btw ) doctrine , has caused many believers to think that they can sin all they want , but not care one iota because after all they are elected. This is false.

You keep showing who you stand for by your doctrine, appears at this stage that you are seriously at cross purposes with the true Gospel.

frosbel:

I am going to address this lie from HELL , that we cannot choose GOD meaning our wills are just for fancy, we have no part in repenting from our sins and continuing our walk with GOD.

This Calvinist ( Calvin was a murderer btw ) doctrine , has caused many believers to think that they can sin all they want , but not care one iota because after all they are elected. This is false.
You keep showing who you stand for by your doctrine, appears at this stage that you are seriously at cross purposes with the true Gospel.

Say whatever you want to say,the best you can do is prove me wrong through scriptures.

shdemidemi:

Say whatever you want to say,the best you can do is prove me wrong through scriptures.

You are going in circles and confusing yourself, I have provide a plethora of scriptures in this article, read them.

frosbel:

You are going in circles and confusing yourself, I have provide a plethora of scriptures in this article, read them.

You just said you would address the lie...go on then

shdemidemi:
You just said you would address the lie...go on then

You give up !

Okay , let me allow you rest,

frosbel:

You give up !

Okay , let me allow you rest,

That should be my line, the onus is on you to prove me wrong

shdemidemi:
That should be my line, the onus is on you to prove me wrong

He is getting tired of his lies. You can't sustain a lie for too long. Truth always punctures it.
My dear frosbel I plead with you to drop those lies of yours and embrace the bitter truth of this issue. I still maintain that I don't hate you but I hate the lies you are spreading. Pls my dear don't lose your soul to the devil's cheap lies. God will help you and help all of us. Amen.

alexleo:

He is getting tired of his lies. You can't sustain a lie for too long. Truth always punctures it.
My frosbel I plead with you to drop those lies of yours and embrace the bitter truth of this issue. I still maintain that I don't hate you but I hate the lies you are spreading. Pls my dear don't lose your soul to the devil's cheap lies. God will help you and help all of us. Amen.

Plead with you CULT to stop destroying souls.

frosbel:

Plead with you CULT to stop destroying souls.

I know you cultists easily brand every group a cult once they are against your evil machinations. The satan cult you belong to will not help you. Quit from them because the devil has no good gift to offer you.
You ll remember the words of advice you ve been given here but it ll be too late to amend. Except you repent now.

^^^^

Churches cannot save you , following MEN cannot save you , Only Jesus can.

frosbel: ^^^^

Churches cannot save you , following MEN cannot save you , Only Jesus can.

Of course only Jesus can save. Are we arguing it? NO bros. Your problem is pride and rebellion. The world is structured that we must learn from one another, be it in a church or outside the church for us to grow. The disciples were taught and groomed by Jesus himself, they in turn groomed others when Jesus had left. I ll rather learn in a church environment where the bible is studied in group and everybody makes contribution than your one man study that the result will tilt towards your selfish or even devilish interest. NO

alexleo:

Of course only Jesus can save. Are we arguing it? NO bros. Your problem is pride and rebellion. The world is structured that we must learn from one another, be it in a church or outside the church for us to grow. The disciples were taught and groomed by Jesus himself, they in turn groomed others when Jesus had left. I ll rather learn in a church environment where the bible is studied in group and everybody makes contribution than your one man study that the result will tilt towards your selfish or even devilish interest. NO

It is good to sit with a group of believers and discuss the word of GOD , we all do it, problem is , how do we do it ?

If we do it in a setting where we have no creeds , rules and dogmas to follow and instead rely solely on the bible , questioning things that we are not sure of and hanging onto the truth, this is healthy.

But, if we do it under the umbrella of an organisation where there are set down creeds, dogmas , rules etc, it is almost always impossible to argue , question or even challenge existing creeds , next to impossible. Why ? Because from experience, these organisations are 100% certain they are right and cannot be wrong in any shape or form ,very similar to the catholic church, hence they are left to hang onto falsehoods, lies and outright damnable heresies.

frosbel:

It is good to sit with a group of believers and discuss the word of GOD , we all do it, problem is , how do we do it ?

If we all do it like in this forum..why do you always claim to be right and all others to be wrong no one has a monopoly of knowledge except God.

Bidam: If we all do it like in this forum..why do you always claim to be right and all others to be wrong no one has a monopoly of knowledge except God.

Brother, trust me , I am not claiming to be right , ask forum members, many years ago I held onto certain positions which were challenged on all fronts by Christians , atheists and Muslims. However, most of the positions I defended are those that 90% of your churches believe in.

Anyway , some deep study of the word and sharing with other brethren, I was shocked at the result of my hard work ( study ). My Pastor could not help me, his answer to one or 2 of my questions was that deeperife doctrines are bible doctrines , meaning 100% accurate , no argument. Being the curious person I am, I refused to agree and went further into study and opened a can of worms, the can of the apostate church of Babylon masquerading as the church of Christ with her mysterious false and deceptive doctrines. I had enough , I left deeperlife.


If you can prove me wrong with scripture,I will happily change position, so far all you and your friends have done is is dribble yourselves into scoring own goals, constant moving of the goal post during debates ( quite dishonest ) , twisting scriptures to fit into the creeds and doctrines of your church ( not the bible ) , and constantly misrepresenting the facts presented to you with full backing of 100s of bible verses.

Prove me wrong bro.

frosbel:

It is good to sit with a group of believers and discuss the word of GOD , we all do it, problem is , how do we do it ?

If we do it in a setting where we have no creeds , rules and dogmas to follow and instead rely solely on the bible , questioning things that we are not sure of and hanging onto the truth, this is healthy.

But, if we do it under the umbrella of an organisation where there are set down creeds, dogmas , rules etc, it is almost always impossible to argue , question or even challenge existing creeds , next to impossible. Why ? Because from experience, these organisations are 100% certain they are right and cannot be wrong in any shape or form ,very similar to the catholic church, hence they are left to hang onto falsehoods, lies and outright damnable heresies.

Nobody stops anybody from questioning things they are not sure of. Just that you appear to be a sturborn and insubordinate fellow so you can't be humble enough to learn rather you ll prefer an environment where you can scream and yell until everybody falls to your almighty teachings. No.
Except in one man churches that's where you can find the founder being worshiped and obeyed even when he is wrong. My church is not a one man church as you know, the founder in the U.S died decades ago and even the person that established the Nigeria/Africa branch died decades ago and since then there has been successors. We study the word together and people make contributions and ask questions. However in some branches I ll agree that some leaders are rigid and sometimes impose their opinion on members but with the present leadership of the church at the national level there is now room for members to give a feed back of anything going on in their branches that they are not comfortable with to the national headquarter for corrections to be effected. Its no more what it used to be in those days when you(frosbel) use to sneak into the church and sneak out. Everybody subjects himself to learn at one point or the other. Both leaders and the led.
Having said that, I still want you to know that what all of us as children of God should do is to "follow peace with all men and holiness without which no man shall see the Lord"(Hebrews 12:14). That's the main thing. Frosbel you are too busy arguing and criticizing others while you are not also good yourself. You abuse pastors and their members anyhow out of your pride. You feel you ve arrived when you have not even started. BE CAREFUL.

Frosbel, as much as some of your opinions are valid, it is wise to be careful how you speak of the church. With its many faults, it is still Christs bride...

2buff: Frosbel, as much as some of your opinions are valid, it is wise to be careful how you speak of the church. With its many faults, it is still Christs bride...

He claims love but talks evil about people who are innocently studying the bible to plwase God. When he is talking about men of God you see bitterness, pride and rebellious mind in him. In his little mind he feels so perfect.

The doctrines we should be concerned about are the ones outlined in the scriptures and not the commandments and creeds of men.

Too many people these days worship the "doctrines" of organizations and institutions. Jesus warned the people that the religious leaders of His day taught the commandments of men, "Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men." Mar 7:7

chukkynwob:

In my opinion the only difference between you and Bokoharam is that you don't have bombs yet.

Even Jesus said allow the corn and grass to grow,let Christ do the sifting.

Pastor Kun:

I had decided to ignore this post before because personally I don't indulge in bragging or creating impressions about my status on NL or anywhere else for that matter but I find it amusing how a rodent like alexleo can be making such claims about me who he knows nothing about. That said, I wish to state that even if I am a house boy, we are all equal before God and no true christian shd feel superior to another based on social status or anything else for that matter.

You mean a rat

na wa ooh....

Pygru:
You mean a rat

na wa ooh....

Hahahahaha this guy your own is just to laugh at the anger being displayed here. Your own better o .
Anyway we are through with that stage and moved on. Cheers.