Apatheist: An atheist wants to live forever.

GeneralShepherd:
I'm just pondering. I examine my worldview once in awhile.

'A life not examined is not worth living '. I've gotten who has that quote

So is this what will happen when we die? We fade into oblivion? Into nothingness? Like we were never here.

striktlymi: At what point does consciousness begin? Is it at the point of conception? The point when we start becoming aware of our environment? Or does it predate our physical existence?

RayMcBlue: The afterlife is a fairy tale invented by human imagination. And each person's fairy tale is different.

We imagine that we have "souls," fabricate the concept of "eternal life" and then fantasize a place called "heaven," complete with streets of gold, calorie-free foods, frolicking virgins and whatever else we can come up with. Christians imagine it so vividly and repeat the fantasy so often that they actually believe it to be reality.

How bizarre can the fantasies get? Fly to Cairo and take a look at the Great Pyramid . There is the pyramid itself - still one of the largest man-made objects on earth. In addition there is the whole mummification process, the disassembled boats, the sacred artwork and so on. All of
this was designed to help the pharaoh reach the afterlife.

We look at it now and we all know, with absolute certainty, that it was a complete and total waste of time. The Egyptian notion of the afterlife was a fantasy. The Christian notion of the afterlife is a fantasy in exactly the same way. Heaven is completely imaginary, just like hell... and just like God. Don't get it twisted.

GeneralShepherd:

I think when we start becoming aware of our environment

striktlymi:
I think you are right but one can argue that individual consciousness began before we were born but because of the limited nature of our current existence, we have forgotten what that state of consciousness was like.
Though, I wouldn't go that far personally but I believe there is an element of truth in that line of thought. It is widely accepted that energy can neither be created nor destroyed. Consciousness is a form of energy; which implies that consciousness as we know it today was not exactly created, strictly speaking.
Consciousness could only have been derived from the Ultimate Energy source, though in another form other than our experience of it today. To deny an existence beyond our 'physicality' would be to act against that fundamental 'principle' of science. Consciousness does not just seize to exist when we die. It only transforms. What happens after the transformation is subject to debate.

Apatheist:
So do we all.
Your answer is in your question:

That's pretty much what happens.
The same way it was before you were born, that's how it'll be when you die.

You can leave your mark in the world, like the people who you mentioned did-- Jaja of Opobo and Lugard.

RayMcBlue:

The "miracle of life" is no miracle -- it is a big chemical reaction. When those reactions stop, the cell is dead.

The human body is nothing but a set of chemical reactions. The chemical reactions powering a human life are no different from the reactions powering the life of a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. When a human being dies, the chemical reactions stop. Finis.

There is no "energy" or "soul" mixed in with the chemicals, just like there is no soul in a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. Why would there be an afterlife for the chemicals that make up a human body?

The whole notion of your energy transforming when you die is completely imaginary. The concept of a "soul" has been invented by religion because many people have trouble facing their own mortality. It makes people feel better, but the concept is a complete fabrication. Don't mix science with delusions, please, both have absolutely nothing in common.

alexleo:

And this is also your own invention because you havent died before to be so sure of what you are saying. NO PROOF(as you people will always say). Before the discovery of planets, people then never knew such things existed.

alexleo:

On the bold i ask- have you died before to be so sure?

In intelligent animals, human and non-human alike, consciousness as we know it begins to appear at neonatal stages, and is lost and recovered sporadically in the course of their lifespan—during deep sleep, syncope and sometimes coma, because of a lack of communication between cerebral neurons . Consciousness depends on the integration and functioning of several interconnected networks in the brain, two that are most important are the cerebral cortex—the gray matter that covers the outer layer of the brain, and the other is a structure located in the brainstem , called the reticular activating system (RAS) which keeps the cortex "activated" and aroused by encouraging increased brain activity which is needed in order for the brain to process information in such a way that can give rise to awareness.

In the process of clinical death, the heart stops working and pumping blood to the brain, thereby cutting the brain's
essential supply of oxygen and of other less urgent nutrients. In dogs, measurable brain activity ends within 20 to 40 seconds. And during brain death, all brain function halts permanently. As characteristic of all biological cells, brain cells die once deprived of oxygenated blood, destroying the brain. According to the current mainstream neuroscientific view, the mind fails to survive brain death and ceases to exist.

enigmaotr: Why are humans so profoundly distressed by death? Why do we dream of living forever? Why must we have a purpose in life? Why do people make deathbed confessions?
When you can find the answers to these questions, you'd know if afterlife is a fantasy or reality!

benodic:
the mystery of death lies in proper understanding of what happens when the physical body is asleep and the person is dreaming.
in dreams you still retain your consciousness. sleep is afterall a temporal death and death is a permanent sleep.

RayMcBlue:

The beauty of science is that it never assumes. It doesn't invent notions out of thing air. It examines, calculates, separates and then proposes. It's borne of "cold hard logic."

GeneralShepherd: I am sure no one reading this post lived in King Jaja of Opobo's era,nor did anyone of us reading this hear a live speech from Lord Lugard. The truth of the matter is we have no memory of our consciousness when these events happened.

So is this what will happen when we die? We fade into oblivion? Into nothingness? Like we were never here.

It is easy to deal with idea of not existing during the world war,or holocaust or any event before our date of birth,but how does one deal with the idea of fading away?

Is it remotely possible that our consciousness might survijavascript:void(0);ve our earthly bodies when we die? Is a belief in an afterlife just a mere fantasy?


Cc mranony1 thebigurban2 obi1kenobi striktlymi manmustwac Martian muskeeto

a) If an afterlife does not exist then man really has no actual moral obligations i.e It is not reasonable to act morally

a. If there is no afterlife, then there are no consequences for the sort of life you choose to live i.e. whether you spend your life taking pleasure in smashing the skulls of innocent babies or whether you spend your life taking pleasure in caring for the helpless little ones, in the end you will just die and rot forget everything and eventually be forgotten. There is no way we can objectively say that one pleasure is better than the other. Therefore there is no reason why one needs to act morally.

If on the other hand you don't believe in an afterlife, then I struggle to see how you can make a case for why we ought to live morally especially if we can derive pleasure from doing evil deeds. (If you think the two are rationally compatible then you may need to explain to me how so)

RayMcBlue:

The "miracle of life" is no miracle -- it is a big chemical reaction. When those reactions stop, the cell is dead.

The human body is nothing but a set of chemical reactions. The chemical reactions powering a human life are no different from the reactions powering the life of a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. When a human being dies, the chemical reactions stop. Finis.

There is no "energy" or "soul" mixed in with the chemicals, just like there is no soul in a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. Why would there be an afterlife for the chemicals that make up a human body?

The whole notion of your energy transforming when you die is completely imaginary. The concept of a "soul" has been invented by religion because many people have trouble facing their own mortality. It makes people feel better, but the concept is a complete fabrication. Don't mix science with delusions, please, both have absolutely nothing in common.

Weah96:

I agree, but in reality, true science faces obstruction from political forces and the lure of financial interests.

There's no reason why I should put more than a gallon of gas in my car every week. Something is preventing the manufacture of 500mpg vehicles.

Apatheist: @MrAnony1:

So your morality is born out of fear-- and greed?
So you are good only because you fear punishment after death?
Your morality is just eye service.

I hope you never become atheist.

Here you go:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rationalism
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-moral/
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/practical-reason/
https://ndpr.nd.edu/news/23849-rationality-and-moral-theory-how-intimacy-generates-reasons/
http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/morality.html
www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1908675179?pc_redir=1408583053&robot_redir=1
http://objectivism101.com/Lectures/Lecture31.shtml
www.holisticeducator.com/rationalethics.htm

striktlymi:

If you don't know that everything (even the rock you step on) is one form of energy or the other, in its strict sense, then there is no need having a debate with you.

striktlymi: ^^^You want Apatheist to express his own thoughts?

You would have better luck asking him to stay under water for 1 hour without surfacing.

I do hope I am wrong about that dude.

RayMcBlue:

The beauty of science is that it never assumes. It doesn't invent notions out of thing air. It examines, calculates, separates and then proposes. It's borne of "cold hard logic."

Apatheist:
Science, man.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consciousness_after_death

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neural_correlates_of_consciousness
Premise 1: The brain causes consciousness
Premise 2: In the event of death the brain "dies" (stops working)
Corollary: In the event of death consciousness ceases.

GeneralShepherd:

I seek purpose in life because I am a sentient being

RayMcBlue:

The "miracle of life" is no miracle -- it is a big chemical reaction. When those reactions stop, the cell is dead.

The human body is nothing but a set of chemical reactions. The chemical reactions powering a human life are no different from the reactions powering the life of a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. When a human being dies, the chemical reactions stop. Finis.

There is no "energy" or "soul" mixed in with the chemicals, just like there is no soul in a bacterium, a mosquito, a mouse, a dog or a chimp. Why would there be an afterlife for the chemicals that make up a human body?

The whole notion of your energy transforming when you die is completely imaginary. The concept of a "soul" has been invented by religion because many people have trouble facing their own mortality. It makes people feel better, but the concept is a complete fabrication. Don't mix science with delusions, please, both have absolutely nothing in common.