All praise is to Allah, The Most Compassionate, The Most Merciful, May His blessings and mercy be on the Noble Prophet Muhammad (SAW) his household, companions and Muslims till the end of time (Ameen).

We are delighted to welcome you to the first ever Nairaland Islam Section Debate (NISD).

Our topic for debate is- Difficulty in Getting Married Amongst Muslims: Who Do We Blame? Single Muslim Men or Single Muslim Women?

For this debate, we have 2 teams of debaters: Men’s Team and Women’s Team.

Men’s Team

1. Wizeboy (Captain/Chief Debater)

2. Baba11 (2nd Debater)

3. Balash (3rd Debater)

*Reserve Debater: Teewhyraul

Women’s Team

1. Yeyenatu (Captain/Chief Debater)

2. Slitz (2nd Debater)

3. Semioyin

*Reserve Debater: Harmeenat

Date: Friday, December 26, 2014.

Time: 10am

Venue: This thread.

Like and share with your friends, watch out for more updates.

Please post your comments here https://www.nairaland.com/2059988/nairaland-islam-section-debate-nisd

RULES

1. All Normal Nairaland Rules Apply to this Debate.

2. The debaters are to show maturity and comportment; no personal attacks, insults, rants or other forms of inappropriate behaviour would be tolerated.

3. Debaters are to adhere strictly to time. Otherwise, the opposing team would be allowed to develop and advance their arguments further to the detriment of the erring team.

4. Our readers are also implored to cooperate with the moderators/organisers and only post on the thread when they are requested to do so. Posting at the wrong time on this thread could get you banned.

5. There shall be no protests during the course of this debate. All compaints/grievances are to presented after the debate has been concluded.

6. The teachings and guidelines of Islam are also applicable here. Debaters and readers should kindly take note.

Once again, you are welcome.

SCHEDULE

Friday, 26th December 2014

10.00am: Welcome address and throwing of floor open for debate by Maclatunji/Sissie

10.05am-11.00am

Sequence of presenting arguments by teams

1. Male chief debater to post presentation.

2. Female chief debater to post her presentation

3. 2nd male debater posts his presentation.

4. 2nd female debater posts her presentation.

5. 3rd Male presenter posts his presentation.

6. 3rd female presenter posts her presentation

7. 11.01am-1pm Debaters are to engage each other and try to puncture each other's arguments.

8. 1.01pm Thread open to all posters to comment in support of or against any of the teams, you are also free to direct questions to them.

9. 8.00pm: Thread Locked For Voting to Commence.

10. 8.00am on Saturday, December 27, 2014: Voting Ends.

11. 8.01am-9.00am: Collation of votes and announcement of winners.

Voting Process:

A post stating:

"Click like or share for men will be posted." Those who think men have won should click either. At the end of voting the average of total "Likes and "Shares" obtained will be awarded to men."

Another post stating:

"Click like or share for women will be posted." Those who think women have won should click either. At the end of voting the average of total "Likes and "Shares" obtained will be awarded to women.

The team with the highest score at the end of this process wins!

Asalam Alaykum,

You are welcome once again to first ever Nairaland Islam Section Debate (NISD).

Without wasting anytime, I will call on one of my co-modeartors, Sissie to make her opening comments.

Please our readers should delay posting comments for now, the floor is open to moderators and debaters.

Well Sissie is not commenting yet. Therefore, I will now call on the Chief debater for the men, Wizeboy to post his presentation.

Wizeboy over to you.

If you are not a debater or moderator please don't post comments yet please.

Thank you.

In The Name of Allah, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful

Good day to the Moderators of this wonderful thread, as well as the Organisers of this debate. I won’t proceed to the business of the day without acknowledging the presence of my co-debaters and the esteem viewers. I will write to assert that Single Muslim Women are the Cause of Difficulty in Getting Married Amongst Muslims  
 
Asalam Alaykum Waramotullah Wabarakatuh,
 
Marriage refers to the mutual relationship ordained by Almighty Allah for the believers as an act of worship between two people who love, trust, care, understand and respect each other for the sake of Allah; so as to attain jannah, procreate children, fulfil their sexual desires, unite and enjoy companionship forever with its continuation in paradise In Shaa Allah.  The Prophet (pbuh) said: “Three matters should not be delayed: prayer when its time comes, burial when the funeral has arrived, and the marriage of single brothers/sisters when a well-suited spouse has proposed.” [Tirmidhi]
 
Islam however, is clear on the kind of wife brothers should be seeking. The Prophet (SAW) said: "A woman may be married for four reasons: for her background, her status, her beauty, and her religion; so try to get one who is religious, may you be blessed." This specifically defines just what kind of a companion we (brothers) are seeking, for if we marry her for anything other than her religious piety, our marriage MIGHT likely bound to fall into misery. True, beauty and charm is hard to resist, yet beauty does not last forever and does not guarantee you her obedience and religiousness. Financial status is dynamic, and so is worldly status, yet religion strongly establishes a household, and it may be that through your intention of marrying her for her religion, the rest is given to you anyway.
 
In another hadith, the Prophet (SAW) said: "The whole world is a provision, and the best object of benefit of the world is the pious woman." Imagine! Nothing in this world is as valuable as a pious woman! This point has been stressed many times by Rasulallah (SAW), who himself, when asked what three things he loved the most, mentioned a pious woman. Once the following ayah was revealed: "They who hoard up gold and silver and do not spend it in the way of Allah, unto them give tidings of a painful doom. On that day when it will (all) be heated in the fire of Jahannam, and their foreheads and flanks and their backs will be branded therewith (and it will be said to them): 'Here is what you hoarded for yourselves, now taste of what you used to hoard' "[al-Taubah: 34-35]. Umar (r.a.a) has been quoted to say that, when this ayah was revealed, he approached the Prophet (SAW), submitting that the ayah weighed heavily on the minds of the Sahaba. Rasulallah (SAW) replied that the best thing to be treasured is the DEVOTED WIFE who causes pleasure when seen, obeys orders instantly and takes full care of herself and her husbands’ property when he is away. Abu Bakr once asked Rasulallah (SAW) what was the best thing to be treasured, and he (SAW) replied: "the tongue in remembrance of Allah, the heart filled with thanks to Allah and a pious wife who helps in virtuous deeds". Look at how valuable such a woman is in the sight of Allah! How can a man live unhappily with such a person?
 
The Prophet (SAW) taught us in many hadith about the various characteristics which one looks for in a spouse and their relative importance and which ones determine success insha Allah and Allah's blessing on a marriage.  Among those hadith:
 "Inna al-mar'ata tunkahu lideeniha wa maaliha wa jamaaliha fa 'alaika bi dhaati ad-deeni taribat yadaaka."
"A woman is married for her deen, her wealth or her beauty.   You must go for the one with deen, may your hands be in the dust! (if you fail to heed)"  Muslim
"Takhayyaroo li nutafikum fankihoo al-akfaa'u wa ankihoo ilaihim."
"Choose carefully for your seed.  Marry those who are equivalent (or "qualified" and give to them in marriage."  Ibn Majah and others and it is sahih.
 
According to the above hadiths, brothers are expected to choose the best and pious among sisters as a wife but to see the qualities or a pious sisters in this 21st century are not only hard to find but unattainable.   

To make matter worst, when brothers try to overlook some of the above mentioned qualities that Almighty Allah and Prophet Muhammad prescribed, which most of these sisters lack and decided hook up with them in order to complete half of deen, they (sisters) normally reject such offer and are always seeking brothers with unrealistic qualities which includes:
 
APPEARANCE: A lot of sisters have thrown away good partners with reasons like “he is too short’, ‘he is chubby now, 'he is not that handsome', which made them to reject the proposal of so many qualified brothers.
 
MATERIAL THINGS: These sisters also reject brothers on the premise of ‘He stays in a one bedroom apartment’, ‘he doesn’t have a car’, he hasn't build house yet or doesn't work in an oil company. They never wanted to build fortune with brothers but rather looking for a ready-made brother.
 
TRIBE: Some sisters also discriminate along ethnic line; they are fond of 'I can't marry Yoruba brother', 'Is Hausa brother I must marry'. Prophet Muhammad (SAW) asks us never to discriminate among human being and Muslims are refer to, as a family no matter the tribe, colour, race or culture.
 
SISTERS FORGET THAT GOOD BROTHERS LOOK FOR SISTERS WHO SHARE SIMILAR NON-ROMANTIC, NON-SPIRITUAL VALUES: Sure he should be romantic and sure he must share those spiritual values but eerrmmm sisters… these brothers are looking for those other character traits as well that speak to the operation of your possible lives together. Dependability, thriftiness, work ethic, time management, hard work, follow-through and so on.  That’s how you earn a man’s respect…when you can show him that what he HAS does not define who you are.
 
MANY SISTERS WANT TO BE MARRIED BUT THEY ARE NOT TRULY READY TO BE LED: They want to marry a boyfriend but not a husband. They want only a partner but not a leader. They want an emotional prenup that things will always be 50:50. They say they will concede authority to God himself but in their heart, they are not willing to be led by His representative in the home. What I am about to say next I say with the utmost respect to women.
"Men were created to lead at home. Now, with that leadership comes accountability to Almighty Allah meaning that Allah holds him accountable and will punish him first for bad leadership. But a man cannot be accountable for a woman he can’t lead….and a man does not want to be over anything he can’t be accountable to Allah about".

The rights of the husband upon his wife are greater than the rights of the wife upon her husband for the simple reason that Allah, the Almighty, stated in the Glorious Quran what means: “…And due to the wives is similar to what is expected of them, according to what is reasonable. But the men have a degree over them [in responsibility and authority]. And Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise." [Quran 2: 228]
Man is the caretaker of his wife and household. He is responsible for all her affairs. He is responsible for training, direction and discipline if needed. Allah Almighty Says what means: “Men are in charge of women by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth…” [Quran 4:34]

It is an essential right of man over his wife to be obeyed so long as his commands do not conflict or contradict the commands of Allah, the Almighty, Allah’s Messenger and the general teachings and codes of ethics of Islam.

UNIMAGINABLE EXPECTATION: Sisters are fond of looking for brothers who are utmost caring, sensitive, listens to them, treats them like a princess, spoil them with nice things, help around the house, cook on occasions, buy things for their family, impresses their friends, In fact, I don’t really think its possible to put all qualities women seek in one post.  How one man could possess all these qualities when he is not an alien?
 
MANY SISTERS APPROACH RELATIONSHIPS FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF “LOW RISK, HIGH REWARD”: Meaning, they want to get the absolute best man with the least amount of risk. (And I’m not just talking about finances here)They don’t want to put themselves out there at all.

They want the man to take ALL the risks…to be utterly convinced he wants to be with them before they open up about who they really are. You know who you are…You act like YOU are the ONLY prize in the equation. He doesn’t know anything about your background but you turned into a private investigator to make sure he is good enough for you. You are financially irresponsible and an impulsive spender, you’re spending insane percentages of your income on your hair, shoes, bags, and your “package” but you want a man who knows how to make and keep money. You have not grown your faith or prayer life to where it needs to be  but you want a God-fearing brothers as husband…because “he is the leader of the home”.

You want to see him as he is but you cover yourself up in perfectly filtered Instagram pictures, hair extensions, makeup and layers of stuff that make it impossible to see who you really are. You are lazy with not much follow-through but you want a man who can stay up all night working on a project. If he put that spotlight on you, would YOU make the cut?

In essence, many Sisters say they have faith but they don’t. They say that Allah is their source but they are lying. They say that they trust Allah’s will and believe in qadara (destiny) for their future but they are lying. They don’t. They put their trust in a man. What kind of job he has/can get. How much he is making or can make. They want to make sure he has the “ability to provide” both necessary and unnecessary stuff they want at any particular point in time. They want him to have his life utterly figured out…

But I have met many great men who haven’t found the employment they have the potential to get. I have met many others who were living it up until the economy crashed.
 
MANY YOUNG MARRIED WOMEN ARE PAINTING A FAIRYTALE PICTURE OF MARRIAGE TO THEIR SINGLE LADIES: Many young married women are doing a major disservice to single sisters. These young married women create a fairytale picture of weddings and marriage to their single friends. They love being the center of attention and talk up how dreamy it is. Perfect Instagram photos, perfect wedding photos, expensive glamorous weddings, perfect Facebook updates, photos and so on. Is there anything wrong with that? No. It would just help a lot more when married young women keep it real with their sisters and tell them that the wedding day does not make the marriage. It would help a whole lot more if they sit their single friends down and talk about the importance of a praying wife, a strong wife, a submissive wife (to a Godly man)  and how contrary to popular opinion, the faith of a wife is both a weapon for the family and its defense as well. Instead, they get their single sisters all dreamy eyed and waiting for a perfect story and a perfect man…waiting for KalEl from planet Krypton with the big “S” on his chest and a red cape, when they should look at Clark Kent from Planet earth.

SELFISHNESS: Sisters are always after what they can benefit from marriage only, without considering what they can offer. Sisters, if you must look for a perfect brother, make sure you are even near perfect; you can't be an imperfect person and be expecting to hook up with perfect brother, that's really an unfair calculation at your own end.
 
What normally amazes me is how they (Sisters) always cry foul of not seeing suitor among brothers when there are array of well qualified and financially-fair brothers around. Kindly take a look at the MSMS thread: https://www.nairaland.com/1935933/muslim-singles-matching-service-msms full of potential brothers and how they (sisters) always complained bitterly of looking for suitor, then you will definitely be amaze about how confused they always be.

While you are looking/waiting for a guy to walk in and fit into your radar, you are doing some things that also confine you to the "never my type" hemisphere... So, just as good men are hard to find, "manageable" ladies are unicorns!!!!  What is GOOSE for Uganda... Is GOOD for PERU

I will conclude by saying THEY (Sisters) SIMPLY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WANT... That's how they usually dangling around till they will fell into wrong hand who might have sweet-mouth or deceive them.
 
Sisters! Allah has a beautiful story of love written for you. Am I saying settle? No way. But I am saying look at these men through the eyes of Almighty Allah. Get your pride out of the way. Don’t define your marital success by how well your wedding day or “lifestyle” stacks up with other women.  Most importantly, start seeing yourself as a true (not just perceived) gift from Allah that can bring Allah’s favour and blessings into your husband’s life because that’s what you are. So work to BECOME that and I truly wish you a love-filled, Allah centered happy marriage when it does happen.


Maa Salaam

Thank you Wizeboy.

Yeyenatu the Chief debater for the women's team now has the floor. Please post your presentation.

If Yeyenatu is not available, can we have a presentation from any other member of the women's team here present?

maclatunji:
If Yeyenatu is not available, can we have a presentation from any other member of the women's team here present?

salaamu aleykum wa rahmatullah wa barakaathu

Yes, if she isn't available the second and third can put their presentation

Women's team have 3 minutes to make a presentation or the 2nd male debater would be allowed to make his presentation.

semioyin:


salaamu aleykum wa rahmatullah wa barakaathu

Yes, if she isn't available the second and third can put their presentation

Please present yours now.

We are waiting, I see Slitz as well. We do not have all the time to wait for you ladies.

I now call on Baba11 the 2nd male debater to make his presentation. We are no longer waiting for the ladies.

Ladies don't tell us: "I will post now". Just post whatever it is you have for us.

Thank you.

Asalam alaikum warahmotulahi wabarakatuhu

The present economic situation in the country has greatly affected our brothers in a way that marriage is the last thing they think of no thanks to unrealistic demands from ladies they want to marry.

Imagine a sister that expects her man to spend lavishly on her for nikkah ceremony and also wants it to be the talk of the town.In this case,such brothers may withdraw from going ahead with it if he's financially incapable of meeting such excessive demands.

The poorly defined concept of "gender equality" has also crept into the psyche of many single Muslim sisters whereby they are clamouring to be given the same treatment as their male counterparts. We have many Non-Governmental Organisations (NGOs) championing this cause but what they fail to realise is that Allah (SWT) created us different. Women are naturally meant to be submissive and supportive to their husbands according to our religion and societal customs but now, they have become more confrontational and get thrown out of their marital homes. Hence, the alarming increase in single mums. This has become alarmingly rampant in recent times.

Gone are the days when there was widespread early marriage but nowadays, the practice has nosedived to the point that some parents want their daughters to attain Msc/PhD status before thinking of marriage! I have seen several cases like that but what they fail to understand is that nature can never be cheated, it'll surely take its course.

There's nothing wrong with women continuing their education after marriage in as much as there's great understanding between both of the spouses involved.A case study here to buttress my point is this married muslim sister that attained overall best graduating student at OAU some days ago: https://www.nairaland.com/2052467/oau-best-graduating-student

That we have the same degree doesn't mean we are equal. Whatever happens, the man is still the head of the family because it is this simple principle that keeps a family strong. Imagine a situation where a lady tells her husband that "they both have Bsc", indirectly telling him that she's not going to be submissive in any manner.
Any brother that's serious in settling down with a woman needs a submissive one. Though, they may never be aware that we are on the look out for this, nevertheless, we have a way of identifying their true worth and character without going outside the jurisdiction of Islamic rules and regulations.

Generally speaking, we brothers want women who have better understanding of Islam rather than the 'my papa is doing Islam, I need to do it too' type. In essence, I am not saying we don't value and appreciate muslim sisters but we want someone who can call us to order whenever we are threading the wrong
path or we are becoming lazy with our deen. May Allah give us the best of spouses (Ameen).

If our ladies want tall, rich, handsome, caring, gentle etc in a brother, how will they marry when that is almost non-existent in one man. I can confidently say now that because of these and many others, they find it very difficult to settle down.

I just hope that they will learn from these so that we can have a society devoid of sina (fornication and adultery)and other Islamic misdeeds because where ever nikkah is difficult and expensive,sina thrives in there.

Ma salam

Thank you Baba11. Ladies, what is it going to be?

You have the opportunity to post again.

Salaamu aleykum wa rahmatullah wa barakaathu dear brothers and sisters

Please note, as a non-Nigerian living in Europe my perspective can different from the rests. However I will try my best InshaAllah to contribute my views on the difficulties brothers and sisters face as far as marriage, to the debate.
Since its more the rule than exception that the brothers propose and initiate the steps towards marriage, we must look at what keeps brothers taking the steps towards marriage.

It is no secret that most men wish to be in a position that allows them to provide for their wives. That means that these brothers delay marriage until they have the means they themselves deem necessary to afford the wedding, provide a home and also afford the mahr. Especially in regards to the brothers taking long educations we see that they wait until they are done and have worked some years and saved enough money. For the brothers who cannot rely on parents that cannot afford to help with the expenses related to marriage including the cost of the wedding and mahr, it adds on to the pressure of having to save up to be financially "ready", causing further delay.
So the issue of money plays a big factor when speaking of difficulties related to marriage.

The prophet salallahu aleyhi wa salaam said: “Give spouses to your single ones, because Allah makes their morality better (improves it) (under the shadow of marriage) and expands their sustenance and increases their generosity (human values).”

This hadith tells us three things, that marriage improves the morality of the believer and that Allah ta^ala expands the believers sustenance and increases their generosity.

In this hadith we're told by the messenger peace be upon him, that Allah promises to provide for the believers.

Sayyiduna Umar (Allah be pleased with him) said, "I heard the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) say, “If you relied on Allah as He should be relied on, He would provide for you as He provides for birds.

They go out hungry in the early morning, and return full in the evening." [Tirmidhi]

As stated several times in hadiths and in the holy Quran, Allah will provide for us what we need and with the emphasize on the importance of marriage, issues related to money shouldn't be the cause of delaying it.

I'm surat Al -Talaaq, 65:7, Allah ta^ala says, what means: “Let the rich man spend according to his means, and the man whose resources are restricted, let him spend according to what Allâh has given him. Allâh puts no burden on any person beyond what He has given him”

Again we can extract from the message that money shouldn't be the cause of delay in marriage. There isn't a set price so the men should pay what they can afford to spend and nothing more or less.

And in surat Al-A'raaf, 7:31:“…but waste not by extravagance, certainly He (Allâh) likes not Al-Musrifûn (those who waste by extravagance)”

As we can see now, we are encouraged to marry but discouraged to waste money on extravagance. This message follows the previous whereby the men should spend according to their means and resources.

Furthermore Allah promises us time and time that Allah will provide for us if we rely on Him.

What can we learn so far in relations to delaying marriage because of wealth? We should first of all rely on Allah to provide for us. Second of all, we must understand that although the majority of the brothers who delay do so, to be able to afford the wedding, it isn't necessary to delay until he has saved a large amount.

The wedding is not meant to be expensive and extravagant, the mahr isn't supposed to be an outrageous amount and he isn't supposed to be at the peak of his finances when he gets married. He should only pay according to his means. Therefore it is not necessary to spend years saving up which can lead to some brothers doubting if they even should marry or if the financial burden is to big.
The wanting of intimacy, love etc. is a natural fact, and with marriage this can be fulfilled in a halal way. However when marriage is delayed the risk of falling into temptation rises. The act of marriage is also an act of worship, and an institution Allah has blessed. Therefore the brothers should hasten to fulfill half of their deen and the prophet salallahu aleyhi wa salaams sunnah by marrying the righteous women.

Now, the point should be clear. With all the benefits and blessings that come with marriage, the brothers these days should not keep from marrying due to financial issues. The brothers are not obligated to spend more than their resources allow them and extravagance is highly discouraged, which means that there isn't a need to spend years saving up for the wedding. What the brothers should focus on is finding a righteous spouse and thereby fulfilling a grand part of the deen and pleasing Allah ta^ala instead of spending years increasing their wealth and delaying a huge part of their religion, a part they should hasten towards

Ma salaam