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| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Jeromejnr(m): 7:35pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
italo3: That guy that doesn't know anything. |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by italo3: 7:43pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Jeromejnr: KingEbukasBlog: He's still more sensible than Ifeness. What he does when he is proven wrong is to disappear...what ifeness does is to hurl insults at you, Christians and God. Perhaps he believes that insults can make God cease to exist. |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 7:44pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Jeromejnr: walahi ... he even contradicts his ideologies He tried being sardonic about God destroying the earth he created but failed to admit that since thoughts created matter -according to him - thoughts can obliterate matter  |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 7:46pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
hahn , johydon22 ... I'm here now ... you can't invite me to a fine -ass party like this and not have fun with me   |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by johnydon22(m): 8:20pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:dont even have an idea what the bone contention is here.. Anu is the son of both Ansar and Kisar and Anu is the King of the Gods in Sumerian pantheon. Father of Ishatah, enlil and Enki. . . Wonder why i am ruminating sumerian myths here |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:25pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
johnydon22: So suddenly you don't understand English again Anu cannot be supreme if he is the son of another god - its simple logic He even had a sister and exists in our universe  - in our own dimension |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 8:28pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:And jesus a.k.a God the son is supreme and even equal to His father. Mind applying thesame logic here? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by johnydon22(m): 8:37pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog: Are we discussing Sumerian Gods or your idea of supreme Gods ..which exactly  |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:41pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Kreysik: God does not exist in our universe or dimension . God exists as three entities - the Father , Son , Holy Spirit - the trinity The Father did not create the son or the Holy Spirit but the three exists as one In our dimension , two persons cannot exist as one . The Father is God , the Son is God , the Holy Spirit is God . All three as one have been existing , will continue to exist and will always exist - having no beginning and end . For Anu , he is an offspring and his dad is an off spring - infinite regress |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by bstringz(m): 8:42pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Question: Why is it that people try to compare the ancient Sumerian tablets, saying that they are similar to the book of Genesis? Why is it that people try to relate those gods to the God in the Old Testament? Answer: It is difficult to judge the motives of people I have never met. I am sure that those who do this do so for a variety of reasons. It is only natural that anthropologists, historians and those who study religion to look for parallels between the earliest docoments of the Old Testament and the Sumerian/Babylonian/Akkadian religions in Mesopotamia. Presumably, the book of Genesis has its roots in Mesopotamia from the early part of the second millennium BC. The parallels are not just a figment of the imaginations of scholars. The parallels between the Gilgamesh Epic and the Genesis flood story are really striking. Both have a universal flood coming on mankind. Both have a man building a large boat and saving his family and a number of animals on the boat. I am copying and pasting an article on the parallels between the Gilgamesh Epic and the Genesis flood account. The question naturally arises: Where did these obvious parallels arise? Did the Jews borrow their flood story from the Sumerians? Did both accounts arise from a common real event in the distant past? Might the Sumerians have borrowed their account from the Jews? The last option seems unlikely because there is evidence for the Gilgamesh Epic from before 2000 BC, but we cannot rule out that the ancestors of Abraham passed along the account we now have in Genesis. So, good, honest, open-minded scholars and students of religion will look for parallels and comparisons between Judaism and Mesopotamian religion. When they do so, the differences are far more striking than the similarities, although some scholars do not agree with the rather obvious (at least to me!) fact. Mesopotamian relition was polytheistic. It had elements of ancient animism as well. It was "primitive" religion when compared to Judaism. Skeptical, non-believing scholars try to paint early Judaism as polytheistic, but there is no solid evidence for this. Judaism appears from its inception to be a fully developed monothism, with out all the superstitions of Mesopotamian religion and the fantastic (and unbelievable) stories of gods and their petty intrigues. The Genesis creation account is absolutely unique among all creation stories, both in its simplicity and in its scientific accuracy. To conclude that Judaism evolved from a nascent polytheism is speculation which is not justified by the Hebrew text of the Bible. Nevertheless it is not true to say that there is absolutely nothing in common between Judaism and Mesopotamian religion. Both were formed in the cultural context of Mesopotamia. Both were influenced by a massive flood. The local religion of Mesopotamia finds its way into Genesis indirectly, for example when Laban chased Jacob down in an attempt to get back his household gods. In conclusion, it is not just skeptics and unbelievers who look for parallels between Sumerian religious ideas and customs and the book of Genesis. This is a potentially fruitful area of research for Bible believers as well. (do not forget the Q & A below with more details about the Gilgamesh Epic) John Oakes, PhD Question: I recently viewed a documentary claiming that ancient tablets (older than OT manuscripts) were found in Iraq, telling a story almost identical to Noah’s… and that the soil there showed signs of an ancient flood as well (unlike the land around Mount Ararat). The final conclusion was that Israel received this "story" from the Babylonians while in captivity. Do you have any insight about this? Answer: The ancient tablets you refer to probably contained what is commonly known as the Gilgamesh Epic, although it is difficult for me to say for sure without seeing the source of the information you refer to. The Gilgamesh Epic was known to the ancient Sumerian and Babylonian cultures. The epic was almost certainly composed before 2000 BC. It has been estimated by some to be based on a tradition as old as 3000 BC. If one takes Abraham to be the father of the Jewish nation, as supported by the Bible, then one can assume that the Gilgamesh Epic is older than the written, Jewish version of the story which is found in the Bible, as Abraham died somewhere around 1850 BC. There are significant similarities between the Gilgamesh epic and the flood account in Genesis, which seem to defy coincidence. For example, in Gilgamesh, a god speaks to a man Utnapishtim in a dream, telling him to constuct a boat because of a great flood which is coming. Although the stories are not identical (for example, when God spoke to Noah, it was not in a dream) there is obvious parallel to the biblical flood account. In the Gilgamesh Epic, Utnapishtum took his family, some friends as well as many animals on the boat. Again, one can see parallels but also differences in the accounts. To deny any possible common root to these two flood stories seems unrealistic. There are two possibilities to explain this. One possibility is that the flood is an actual event, the memory of which was carried forward by the survivors, finding its way into both Gilgamesh and the biblical account. Another possibility is that one or the other was created first, and the other borrowed from it. Assuming the second possibility, the question becomes who borrowed from whom? Logically, one might assume that since the Gilgamesh Epic precedes the Bible account, at least in its written form, it was the source for the biblical story of the flood. From an historical or literary point of view, this is hard to disprove. However, if one can assume that the book of Genesis is inspired by God, then the idea of the Genesis flood account being borrowed from Gilgamesh does not work. There is a great wealth of evidence supporting the belief that the books of the Bible, and specifically the book of Genesis is indeed the inspired creation of God. Of course, much of that evidence is found at my web site, to include prophecies in Genesis which are fulfilled in Jesus (see my book From Shadow to Reality www.ipibooks.com ), historical and archaeological accuracy of Genesis (Reasons For Belief www.ipibooks.com ), and so forth. If the Bible, and therefore Genesis, is indeed inspired by God, then the most likely conclusion is that Gilgamesh represents a tradition which goes all the way back to the actual flood which is recorded in Genesis, and that the account in Genesis, being inspired by God, is a separate, but much more accurate depiction of the actual events which occurred in this massive event as described in Genesis chapters 5-7. If this is the correct explanation, then the parallels between the accounts are due to the fact that they both describe the same, actual event, although with a different level of fidelity to the actual events. This is what I believe to be the case, but I leave it to you to decide for yourself. As to the Israelites receiving the story from the Neo-Babylonians while in captivity, I find this explanation very unlikely for a few reasons. First of all, the Gilgamesh Epic was around in the time of the first Babylonian Empire, about 1800 BC, not during the Neo-Babylonian Empire, under Nebuchadnezzar. Second of all, there is sufficient evidence, in my opinion, to conclude that the book of Genesis was written in essentially its final form well before the time of the captivity (586-538 BC). This would make the claim that it was borrowed from Neo-Babylonian sources not work. John Oakes, PhD 1 Like |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by bstringz(m): 8:46pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Can the athiests answer the question kingebukasblog asked ifeness... You guys are putting up the sumerian gods as an argument but I thought atheism was belief in no God or gods at all. So @ifeness do u believe in the sumerian gods? If you don't which I know would likely be your answer then bringing up this argument by you was totally pointless and shows how desperate you are to lie to your self that God doesn't exist. 1 Like |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:46pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
johnydon22: You claimed Anu was supreme and that Yahweh and the rest were smaller gods which I evidently refuted . You dont even understand the origin of Anu neither do you understand God - Yahweh - of we christians . |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 8:46pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:In other words 1+1+1=1..even if this is true which definitely isn't Mind explaining how they still are 1 when christ died for 3 days |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 8:51pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:In other words 1+1+1=1..even if this is true which definitely isn't Mind explaining how they still are 1 when christ died for 3 days I'm sure you're also familiar with the statement in-"eloi eloi lama sabatana" meaning "my lord my lord why has thou forsaken me?".....meaning that jesus God d SoN was forsaken or better still betrayed by another God...if these 3GODS are equal and one don't you think they should possess equal minds? How come one forsakes the other? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by hahn(m): 8:54pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
italo3: Bro, na wa for you o. I didn't run away na, my battery died and there is no power. First of all, the context of ifeness' presentation is not to present the sumerian story as truth but only to explain that it is an older text than the Christian text and also to compare the similarities between that story and the story of genesis in order to prove that the Christian story is only the by product of another myth. I'm on my phone now and I can't really do much research as regards the truth of the story but hey, I don't see you presenting any Christian article or any article for that matter disproving the authenticity of the story. Besides, I'm personally not interested in either story. As far as I'm concerned, they are both myth and should only be read for pleasure and not taken seriously. Kingebukasblog(bubu), how far na? Jereomejnr, bomb dey your head  @italo3, what happened to the "italo" moniker? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 8:56pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Kreysik: In other words : a + b + c = a ; a+ b + c = b; a + b + c = c; . For ( a = b = c ) Remember they are three entities but one person . For your question , its pretty ambiguous and intricate . I have to go deep into theology for you to understand |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by johnydon22(m): 8:58pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:[b] oh jeez you see, you just from no where deducted my post wrongly in the childish attempt to defend the jewish yahweh. my post was too clear, whether you understand it becomes your own cup of tea. i said these semitic deities developed from the influence of these older Sumerian deities.. i equated yahweh to el the supreme god of canaanite pantheon... seriously... this was my post The thing is .. surely enough you just assumed my post means Yahweh was a lesser deity of Sumerian pantheon. yahweh is just another deity of semitic origin... maybe you should stop assuming and refuting your assumptions next time.. dont even see an argument in this thread just people ruminating over semitic myths and deities[/b] 3 Likes 3 Shares |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:00pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
hahn: Brother I dey oo ... I thank God The way you take mention me , I think say na serious matter . Anyways - there is no proof that the bible is mythical or do you have one ? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by hahn(m): 9:08pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog: There are several. Let's start with the fact that it talks about a supreme god that likes suya and has anger management issues. That's usually the foundation of myth. And the fact that god has chosen to play hide and seek since creation. God and the tooth fairy are in the same league save for the fact that the tooth fairy is not taught as truth or worshipped. 3 Likes 2 Shares |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:08pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
johnydon22: The story of the Annunaki connects also to the "God creator of all " This "God creator of all " is supposedly called Yahweh by the Jews . Enki and his brother are "creator gods" who came on earth on a mission involving genetics . The story long die sha |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 9:12pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:Chuckles!!..can you insert numerical values into you a,b and c and c if does numerical values will be equal Ambiguous or unfathomable.. Please I will also like to ask if these your Gods are equal why did christ state that " I was SENT only to the lost sheep of the house of isreal"..the word SENT makes Him a messenger I.e he was sent to carry out some duties given to Him by God the father, are these Gods really one? again if they are one why did christ pray and fast in seclusion for 40 days and night..and who was HE praying to,finally why "lord if it be your wish let this cup pass me by" if christ was truely one with the Father why will he pray to the father to save Him from calamities,isn't he equally powerful? Don't say ambiguous.I hate that word |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:14pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
hahn: 1. Hell is a deterrent 2. God no dey play hide and seek since creation 3. God does not have anger issues - I wonder where you got that from 4. What is the foundation of myths ? 5. God is a creator/designer . You are a product of his work - through procreation . Is it difficult to understand ? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:23pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Kreysik: I used letters initially - a, b, c - to show they are different entities - the condition attached : for a=b=c - show they exist at one . Well apparently it boils down to 1 + 1 + 1 = 1 Jesus came in human like form possessing a second nature and had to play that role for obvious reasons . Plus His life was supposed to be exemplary for we CHRISTians to follow . Lol ... I have to use the word ambiguous because there was different interpretations to it |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:27pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
bstringz: The whole thread is pointless |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 9:32pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:The initial doesn't explain anything man Is live should be exemplary? Seriously? Was that why he said "my Lord my LoRD why has thou forsaken ME?what is this suppose to teach us...was that why HE was SENT why didn't HE come of His on accord but required an order from the father? Again are they really one? |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:35pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Kreysik: He was then " dual natured "- as man and as God - meaning some divine characteristics were dropped |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by hahn(m): 9:36pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog: You mean to say a threat right? 2. God no dey play hide and seek since creation Then how come no one has seen him? 3. God does not have anger issues - I wonder where you got that from A god that ordered the death of millions of people, the rape and slavery of innocent women? That one no dey para abi? 4. What is the foundation of myths ? Truth. And myth is often exagrerrated truth. Jesus might have existed but the virgin birth, miracles and signs are all an exagerration. If not, they would be easily replicated in modern times. How come god only performed miracles to primitive people and only in a certain part of the earth? 5. God is a creator/designer . You are a product of his work - through procreation . Is it difficult to understand ? "God did it" is a theistic excuse for "I don't know". Is it difficult to understand? 1 Like 1 Share |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 9:41pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:Lol...astonishing...please go make more findings from your priests,hopefully they won't give you this reply |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:43pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
hahn: Hahn , are threats deterrents ? 2. Then how come no one has seen him? Everything possesses a inherent characteristic of God - energy
Quote the verses of the scripture you discovered that Truth. And myth is often exagrerrated truth. Jesus might have existed but the virgin birth, miracles and signs are all an exagerration. If not, they would be easily replicated in modern times. How come god only performed miracles to primitive people and only in a certain part of the earth? I've experienced an instant miracle before , I'm I primitive ?
You use a phone , who manufactured or designed the phone ? Is "Apple /Samsung did it" an excuse for "I don't know" |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by KingEbukasBlog(m): 9:50pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Kreysik: Like I earlier said , I dont want to confuse you .  Trust me they'd give a related reply Some divine characteristics were dropped - now look at this : 1.Since Jesus is God why did he pray? 2.Since Jesus is God why didn't he know the time of his coming? 3. Since Jesus is God why does he need to send the Holy Spirit to be with us till He comes again . Doesn't it mean logically He has been with us all these while since the Holy Spirit is God too ? These three entities are one but play different roles and at the same time play the same roles -its just complicated |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by scosco1: 10:01pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
Like I still said earlier...religion is all about belief. Whatever evidence one wishes to present as proof of bible stories will be discredited or contested with numerous questions, archaeological finds, scientific discoveries. Religion is supposed to be about faith and not history. Religion is supposed to be about humanity not god Religion teaches us God created the the universe but is there proof ?...NO!... The universe on its own is grandiose, we need not look for proof. The study of the universe is called science...science studies laws and patterns of the universe ...science and not religion should lead reveal and lead us to greater insight about the Great Law Giver. It's true that science hasn't got all the answers but it sure is the best avenue to discover the hidden and secret hand of God. Religion is a set of belief that offers the picture of the universe in a specific manner or point of view and in turn proclaim it as doctrine , it also becomes the definer of morality and objective truth and as such declares itself to be the way. Religion proclaim themselves as absolute truths...yet they are not testable, proven absolute. It is what we believe not what we can prove...let religion be about humanity and how best we can serve and support one another...we are all humanity, any other description divides us. The universe reveals existence of higher realities all the time...we therefore need to learn more and more. |
| Re: I Have Decided To Help The Christians Do Some Concret Research by Nobody: 10:05pm On Oct 21, 2015 |
KingEbukasBlog:1-So God can drop some divine xtics...are you saying this xtics are not His essence but acquired?? 2-meaning that infinite knowledge of God which was also supposed to his essence was also acquired and can be dropped 3-the spirit of truth will not come until I return to the father..meaning christs was initially seperated from the father which annuls your claim of these 3 Gods being equal.afterwards christ will return to d father and d holy spirit will also separate from him wandering on earth until christ separate from the father again.giggles...like sailing in a boat made of clay |
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