DoctorAlien:


Now, I want you to answer this question honestly: of all the commandments in the moral law, why have you chosen to 4th one to attack constantly? You seem to have no problem with the other nine. Now, what is your problem with the 4th one?

Where did I attack? Have I not been quoting Jesus and the Apostles?

Now do you realise that the Law was just a part of the terms of the Old Covenant that God made with Israel? Now we are under the New Covenant and the righteousness in the NT(or if you like the Moral Law) demands not just a faithful outward observance to written codes but a transformation of heart and a reception of Life and expressing same by faith!
From the sermon on the mount, we see that God's expectation from NT believers is higher than just the facial value of the 10 commandments but a heart in tune with the substance and essence thereof.


Consider the exposition of Christ on some parts of the OT in Matthew 5. What then might we say is the deeper dimension of the 4th commandment if Christ were to teach on same. I find the answer in Matthew 11:28-30 and Hebrews 4:3,10

Scholar8200:
Where did I attack? Have I not been quoting Jesus and the Apostles?

Now do you realise that the Law was just a part of the terms of the Old Covenant that God made with Israel? Now we are under the New Covenant and the righteousness in the NT(or if you like the Moral Law) demands not just a faithful outward observance to written codes but a transformation of heart and a reception of Life and expressing same by faith!
From the sermon on the mount, we see that God's expectation from NT believers is higher than just the facial value of the 10 commandments but a heart in tune with the substance and essence thereof.


Consider the exposition of Christ on some parts of the OT in Matthew 5. What then might we say is the deeper dimension of the 4th commandment if Christ were to teach on same. I find the answer in Matthew 11:28-30 and Hebrews 4:3,10

Do you still live by the tenets of the 10 commandments? Answer me.

Scholar8200:

Now do you realise that the Law was just a part of the terms of the Old Covenant that God made with Israel? Now we are under the New Covenant and the righteousness in the NT(or if you like the Moral Law) demands not just a faithful outward observance to written codes but a transformation of heart and a reception of Life and expressing same by faith!

What do you have to say about Rom. 3:31 "Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law" ?

And what do you have to say about Psalm 119:160 "All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal" ?

What is the meaning of eternal?

Scholar8200:
Consider the exposition of Christ on some parts of the OT in Matthew 5. What then might we say is the deeper dimension of the 4th commandment if Christ were to teach on same.

The 4th commandment is about as simple and straightforward as it gets. Christ saw no need to expatiate on that. The argument surrounding the Sabbath of GOD first appeared when the antichrist (pope) thought he could tamper with the law of GOD to accommodate all forms of paganism in Christianity. Of course, there are still a people who serve GOD in truth and in spirit, and who know that His righteous laws "...can never fail" (Luke 16:17)

Satan is really working tirelessly. Working through the antichrist (pope), he made a direct attack on the only commandment that shows truly who the Creator of the whole universe is. Pope Sylvester in 338 AD declared Sunday "the day of The Lord". This is in stark contrast to the day which GOD claimed as His own (Luke 6:5). Indeed, the beast speaketh haughty things. The 4th Commandment is an insignia of the fact that GOD is the sole Creator of everything that is. Jesus in Luke 6:5 vehemently staked His claim to the Sabbath, showing that it is not to be meddled with. It is the only commandment among the 10 that shows who the true creator is and why he deserves worship. Of course, GOD deserves worship because He is the Creator. The 4th commandment is the only commandment that shows this. And then, Satan has been working tirelessly to obliterate the true identity of the Creator. Indeed, he cannot succeed, "...for we are not ignorant of his devices."(2 Cor 2:11)

Scholar8200:
Now do you realise that the Law was just a part of the terms of the Old Covenant that God made with Israel? Now we are under the New Covenant and the righteousness in the NT(or if you like the Moral Law) demands not just a faithful outward observance to written codes but a transformation of heart and a reception of Life and expressing same by faith!

What man can claim he has Faith in GOD when he continues in disobedience to GOD's law?
1 John 2:3-4 "And hereby we do know that we know him, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

Amen.

On the seventh day he rested. The seventh day is relative. Any christian group can choose that their week starts on tuesday and have their sabbath on the seventh day which would be monday. The sabbath day on the jewish calender usually starts from friday evening and ends on saturday evening. The catholic church that uses the Julian calender decided that their on seventh day is sunday. So the sabbath can be chosen any day depending on the group. But for convenience saturday or sunday are chosen. Remember during the days of the ancient jews there was noting like saturday or sunday. The keyword is every seventh day.

broswilli:
On the seventh day he rested. The seventh day is relative. Any christian group can choose that their week starts on tuesday and have their sabbath on the seventh day which would be monday. The sabbath day on the jewish calender usually starts from friday evening and ends on saturday evening. The catholic church that uses the Julian calender decided that their on seventh day is sunday. So the sabbath can be chosen any day depending on the group. But for convenience saturday or sunday are chosen. Remember during the days of the ancient jews there was noting like saturday or sunday. The keyword is every seventh day.

There is no confusion whatsoever as to identity of the seventh day; It is clear that the seventh day is Saturday. And we can be sure that the true Sabbath of GOD is the one contained in the 10 Commandments, which the Jews keep. The whole Jewish race in the world could not have lost track of the true Sabbath of GOD. So, the Sabbath is not "relative".

broswilli:
On the seventh day he rested. The seventh day is relative. Any christian group can choose that their week starts on tuesday and have their sabbath on the seventh day which would be monday. The sabbath day on the jewish calender usually starts from friday evening and ends on saturday evening. The catholic church that uses the Julian calender decided that their on seventh day is sunday. So the sabbath can be chosen any day depending on the group. But for convenience saturday or sunday are chosen. Remember during the days of the ancient jews there was noting like saturday or sunday. The keyword is every seventh day.

The Seventh day is not relative bro. For you to have said the Sabbath of the Jewish calendar starts from Friday evening to Saturday evening confirms that indeed the Seventh-day is "Saturday". If Jesus was a Jew, then it means Jesus kept Saturday. You also confirm what DoctorAlien said about the papacy attempting to change the Sabbath by saying @the bolded. I hope you know that all the churches in the world broke out of the Roman Catholic church? The reason your church is a protestant church. Saying the Sabbath can be chosen from any day of the week is wrong as God gave us clarity on that issue in exodus 20:8-11.
Not for convenience sake. Who should bend the rules here for the other? Man or God? So why say "for convenience sake"? Remember, God does not change. Anything that makes God to change qualifies Him to be a man, God forbid.
If there was no Saturday or Sunday in the Jewish calender (which is so as the days are according to their position), the whole Jewish nation cannot be wrong to keep Saturday as their Sabbath.
If they are wrong, over 100 languages on earth cannot be wrong too as the seventh day of most languages in the world means Sabbath, rest or anything that relates to it.

Saturday in Igbo is Ubochi Izu-ike which means "Sabbath morning"
Saturday in Yoruba is Abameta the day 3 things happened (God Blessed, Rested and Sanctified). Exodus 20:8-11 confirms that God did these 3 things on the Sabbath day.
Browse and see what other languages in the world call Saturday. You'll be amazed.

DoctorAlien:


What man can claim he has Faith in GOD when he continues in disobedience to GOD's law?
1 John 2:3-4 "And hereby we do know that we know him, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

Amen.

1 John 3:23
And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave commandment

Wither the keeping of sabbath for salvation in the New Covenant?

DoctorAlien:


The 4th commandment is about as simple and straightforward as it gets. Christ saw no need to expatiate on that. The argument surrounding the Sabbath of GOD first appeared when the antichrist (pope) thought he could tamper with the law of GOD to accommodate all forms of paganism in Christianity. Of course, there are still a people who serve GOD in truth and in spirit, and who know that His righteous laws "...can never fail" (Luke 16:17)

Then who was the scapegoat that made Jesus and the Apostles silent about it all along as it being a prerequisite for salvation? Even the council at Jerusalem Acts 15:23-29 did not recommend it to the Gentiles!

Scholar8200:

1 John 3:23
And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave commandment

Wither the keeping of sabbath for salvation in the New Covenant?

What do you have to say about this verse? Luke 16:17 "It is easier for Heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the law"

Scholar8200:

1 John 3:23
And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave commandment

Wither the keeping of sabbath for salvation in the New Covenant?

Who do you think the bolded part is referring to? Tell me.

Scholar8200:

1 John 3:23
And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave commandment

Wither the keeping of sabbath for salvation in the New Covenant?

You are yet to define the word "eternal" used to qualify the Law of GOD in Psalm 119:160. If the Bible says the Law of GOD is eternal, please what does it mean?

Scholar8200:
Then who was the scapegoat that made Jesus and the Apostles silent about it all along as it being a prerequisite for salvation? Even the council at Jerusalem Acts 15:23-29 did not recommend it to the Gentiles!

Romans 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

What law is being discussed here?

DoctorAlien:


What do you have to say about Rom. 3:31 "Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law" ?

Simple! It simply means the purpose of the law is properly served when those under it are brought to Christ. See this:
Galatians 3:24,25
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith
But after that faith is come we are no longer under a schoolmaster

The law was not redundant, it served/ and still serves this purpose! But if it fails in serving this purpose, this is the result:

Christ is become of no effect unto you whosoever of you are justified by the law, ye are fallen from grace
Galatians 5:4

The law was to lead us to Christ not justify us. Note that he that is fallen from grace has no salvation because we are saved by grace through faith.

And what do you have to say about Psalm 119:160 "All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal" ?

What is the meaning of eternal?

I guess the answer above answers this.

Scholar8200:
Simple! It simply means the purpose of the law is properly served when those under it are brought to Christ. See this:
Galatians 3:24,25
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith
But after that faith is come we are no longer under a schoolmaster

The law was not redundant, it served/ and still serves this purpose! But if it fails in serving this purpose, this is the result:

Christ is become of no effect unto you whosoever of you are justified by the law, ye are fallen from grace
Galatians 5:4

The law was to lead us to Christ not justify us. Note that he that is fallen from grace has no salvation because we are saved by grace through faith.
I guess the answer above answers this.

Romans 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

What law is being discussed here?

DoctorAlien:


Do you still live by the tenets of the 10 commandments? Answer me.

I live by the faith of the Son of God Whence comes grace that teaches me to deny worldly lusts and ungodliness and live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world

Philadelphia:


Romans 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

What law is being discussed here?

The same law whose purpose was to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by Him not it(law). That's the purpose of the law according to Galatians 3:24,25. (Mind you, this was written by a Hebrew of Hebrews)

DoctorAlien:


You are yet to define the word "eternal" used to qualify the Law of GOD in Psalm 119:160. If the Bible says the Law of GOD is eternal, please what does it mean?

The Greatest of the Laws describes God's Essence, Nature and Person and it underlies every other laws. God remains the same for all eternity, so does His Nature!

I hope you are not implying that in Heaven we will still be hanging to the 10 commandment eg thou shalt not commit adultery etc when Jesus plainly said there will be no marriages in Heaven!
Thi analogy establishes the first paragraph.

Scholar8200:
The same law whose purpose was to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by Him not it(law). That's the purpose of the law according to Galatians 3:24,25. (Mind you, this was written by a Hebrew of Hebrews)

Give me a bible verse to situate this law.

DoctorAlien:


Who do you think the bolded part is referring to? Tell me.

Of course it is referring to the Only One to Whpm Jesus Is A Son!
Note that the commandments concerned were stated!

Scholar8200:
The Greatest of the Laws describes God's Essence, Nature and Person and it underlies every other laws. God remains the same for all eternity, so does His Nature!

I hope you are not implying that in Heaven we will still be hanging to the 10 commandment eg thou shalt not commit adultery etc when Jesus plainly said there will be no marriages in Heaven!
Thi analogy establishes the first paragraph.

Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

DoctorAlien:


What do you have to say about this verse? Luke 16:17 "It is easier for Heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the law"

It is same as Matthew 5:18 and was spoken by He Who came the law to fulfil ( not obey mind you).

The word used -fulfil- is suggestive! When a prophesy is fulfilled it is said to have come to pass.

Philadelphia:


Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Just as you (or your bro) established that New moon is part of the ceremonial law that is done away with and we dont observe same today; realise that the audience here were Israelites and the mention of new moon and sabbath is used to measure time! Just as we wont be celebrating New Moon in Heaven (REMEMBER THERE IS NEITHER SUN AND MOON THERE), also we wont be observing sabbath there too!

Philadelphia:


Give me a bible verse to situate this law.

Romans 13:8-10 in fact Paul Inspired by the Spirit said concerning love (being the fruit of the Spirit) that against such there is no law!

Scholar8200:
It is same as Matthew 5:18 and was spoken by He Who came the law to fulfil ( not obey mind you).

The word used -fulfil- is suggestive! When a prophesy is fulfilled it is said to have come to pass.

So Christ came to "fulfill" the law and not to obey it? So Christ did not obey the Law when He was on earth? So Christ transgressed the Law? So You're saying Christ sinned when He was on earth?

DoctorAlien:


So Christ came to "fulfill" the law and not to obey it? So Christ did not obey the Law when He was on earth? So Christ transgressed the Law? So You're saying Christ sinned when He was on earth?

Fulfil includes but is not limited to obedience else what special thing did Jesus do that Elizabeth, Zechariah, Rich young ruler etc did not do? They all obeyed the law!

P. S.: the law brought them to Christ being the schoolmaster that it is!

Scholar8200:
we are no longer under a schoolmaster

If you claim as a Christian you are no longer under the moral Law of GOD, under whose law are you?

Scholar8200:
Fulfil includes but is not limited to obedience else what special thing did Jesus do that Elizabeth, Zechariah, Rich young ruler etc did not do? They all obeyed the law!

P. S.: the law brought them to Christ being the schoolmaster that it is!

Answer this question with yes or no: did Christ obey the 10 Commandments when He was on earth?

Scholar8200:
It is same as Matthew 5:18 and was spoken by He Who came the law to fulfil ( not obey mind you).

The word used -fulfil- is suggestive! When a prophesy is fulfilled it is said to have come to pass.

So answer this question with yes or no: Has the moral Law of GOD "come to pass" (whatever that means) ?

DoctorAlien:


Answer this question with yes or no: did Christ obey the 10 Commandments when He was on earth?

He fulfilled it! That's the language the Bible used, i would stick with that!