tensor777:

@ mbuela

You are the one coming with a lot of assumptions and negativism about both yourself and your nation. Address your own problems and stop bothering yourself about militants.

try and enlighten me, what is my problem?
what assumptions?
that militant leaders are making millions in the name of a 'struggle'?
that Asari and Soboma (just two examples) are better off today than they were before this militancy began?
that the criminality in the ND is a direct result of this militancy?
that voting billions for the amnesty program, depicts the true intention and purpose of the program?
that Timi Alaibe is one of the problems of the ND, considering the billions that govt has voted to the NDDC with little result, visible to the human eye?
that state govts have been paying militant groups millions (a conservative estimate) and these funds can never be accounted for as it is termed security vote?
that Nigeria is a failed state?
that most of the people proferring solutions to the ND issue are beneficiaries of the stalemate?
which of the above are assumptions and what is my problem and negativity that you refer to?
your kind answers will be appreciated.

@mbulela

It is simply that any group of people, that engage in:-

1)murder,
2)robbery,
3)kidnapping and
4)extortion

ever had, or have any other people's interests at heart but themselves.

You don't have to bother with them because eventually they will be destroyed by the superior firepower of the FGN.

If you personally are suffering then it is up to you to sort out your own problems.

are you sure you are on the same page?
what exactly are you talking about?
what personal problem are you referring to?
which superior power are you referring to? JTF?
is this a joke?

@Ibime

you have said it that you are curt to people with dysfunctional thinking. I now understand your rabid attitude to people with functional thinking.

Today you will say Edo are not Niger Delta. Tomorrow you will say Itsekiri are not Niger Delta. Then after that You will say only Ijaw are Niger Delta. Divide and conquer that will lead to factions and defeat. Shey you have seen Bayelsa and Delta factions of MEND.

Go and be curt to your people with dysfunctional thinking.

We will not purchase that okrika AK47 from you for 300K. You lazy swine. No one for you to kidnap today? No pipeline to draw crude from? No NYSC girls for you to rape? No cult wars to fight?

nex:

@Ibime

you have said it that you are curt to people with dysfunctional thinking. I now understand your rabid attitude to people with functional thinking.

Today you will say Edo are not Niger Delta. Tomorrow you will say Itsekiri are not Niger Delta. Then after that You will say only Ijaw are Niger Delta. Divide and conquer that will lead to factions and defeat. Shey you have seen Bayelsa and Delta factions of MEND.

Go and be curt to your people with dysfunctional thinking.

We will not purchase that okrika AK47 from you for 300K. You lazy swine. No one for you to kidnap today? No pipeline to draw crude from? No NYSC girls for you to rape? No cult wars to fight?

I am glad you have got all these off your chest. . . . I know it was something you were itching to say. . . . its good to hear the raw coco from you, not the sugar coated insidiousness we hear from you everyday. . . .

Yes, Edo are not Niger-Delta cos it seems that you guys will be the first to say "I am Niger-Delta, but not in my name!". . . . therefore, it is better to seperate the wheat from the chaff early. . . . I consider Ndigbo to be more ideologically linked to the struggle than the turncoats in Edo State. . . . Edoites will be the first to decry violent struggle, but when the violent struggle reaps rewards, they will also be at the table, no doubt eating with a long spoon. . . . who can forget that the sweat of people like Ken Saro-Wiwa etc allowed Edo State to receive 13% derivation from their resources from the 1.5% that previously held. . . . of course, this is still not reaching down to the people, but the same holds for the rest of Nigeria and will continue to do so until Nigeria adopts a sterner approach to corruption. . . . the same Edoites would be the first to label MEND as kidnappers when kidnapping is the no1 vice in Edo State, despite the absence of MEND there.

@mbulela

Yes you doubt the capabilities of the armed forces to deal a sudden, massive, and decisive blow to the bandit groups operating in and around the niger-delta.

You doubt that these militants would be able to withstand a coordinated combined-arms assault on their positions in the delta.

The only thing preventing the launching of such an operation is the number of civilian casualties that would ensue given the nature of the terrain, not any firepower the bandits imagine they possess.

bros, leave that small matter attend to my questions.
thank you.

the last post was for ibime

tensor777:

@mbulela

Yes you doubt the capabilities of the armed forces to deal a sudden, massive, and decisive blow to the bandit groups operating in and around the niger-delta.

You doubt that these militants would be able to withstand a coordinated combined-arms assault on their positions in the delta.

The only thing preventing the launching of such an operation is the number of civilian casualties that would ensue given the nature of the terrain, not any firepower they bandits imagine the possess.

now you are making sense to me.
a more important fact (not a doubt) is that the govt does not have the sincerity needed in this matter.their hands are stained.
when you have unofficial advisers like Ibori, how you wan take solve ND matter?

Ibime:

You gotta be one of the silliest MFs known to humankind. . . . what do you term as "being in the struggle for anyone apart from themselves". . . . whats the monetary gain of travelling 200miles offshore to blow-up Bonga oil platform? Or travelling 200 miles to Lagos?. . . . . you have been warned that it is open-season on members of your profession in the Niger-Delta . . . . I am sure its affecting you, thats why you are constantly spewing gobbledygook.

Bonga wasn't blown up - Jomo Gbomo's emails are typically rich in hyperbole. It's patently clear that these attacks are merely aimed at showcasing the 'might' of the MEND millitants. The monetary gain is in the long term, not that anyone expected an immediate payment for these actions.

I've long since noticed that plain facts are the bane of your existence, so let's see you answer these.

1. What have the MEND millitants done (directly) for the people of the Niger Delta so far? How many relief materials did they donate to the displaced people of Gbaramatu?

2. What do you say to the hundreds of millions of naira these millitants demand (and get) from ND state Governors? What was the purpose of this money when it was in the hands of the State Government? Develop the state or pay millitants?

3. What have the ND millitants done about the corrupt state and local government officials who have ceaselessly diverted monies meant for the common man?

4. Can MEND raise the dead? if not, what have they done to recompense the families of the innocent civillians they've brutally killed in their operations?

5. Four innocent civillians were cut down in the Atlas Cove attack. Why has there been no public apology from MEND over this to the families of those involved?


Please reply.

Ibime:

the same Edoites would be the first to label MEND as kidnappers when kidnapping is the no1 vice in Edo State, despite the absence of MEND there.

And wasn't it MEND that brought this wave of kidnapping upon us in the first place?

I do not believe i am you enemy, Ibime. There's a lot to fix in Nigeria. I have my cogent reasons why i do not trust or admire MEND. Does that place me on the side of devils too?

Let us debate, not dispute

@texazzpete

it seems you have not understood that Ibime only discusses with dysfunctionally thinking people.

nex:

@texazzpete

it seems you have not understood that Ibime only discusses with dysfunctionally thinking people.

guys, ve always maintain that we should contribute logically and intellectually without resulting unwarranted insult. eithr polite or otherwise. am not singling anybody out rather am passing my obesrvation to everyone on the FORUM

texazzpete:

1. What have the MEND millitants done (directly) for the people of the Niger Delta so far? How many relief materials did they donate to the displaced people of Gbaramatu?

2. What do you say to the hundreds of millions of naira these millitants demand (and get) from ND state Governors? What was the purpose of this money when it was in the hands of the State Government? Develop the state or pay millitants?

3. What have the ND millitants done about the corrupt state and local government officials who have ceaselessly diverted monies meant for the common man?

4. Can MEND raise the dead? if not, what have they done to recompense the families of the innocent civillians they've brutally killed in their operations?

5. Four innocent civillians were cut down in the Atlas Cove attack. Why has there been no public apology from MEND over this to the families of those involved?

I am surprised that you would be asking the questions above. Is war a cut-and-dried process?

(1.) Is this conjecture or fact? How does Texazzpete know if militant x gave Mr Daminabo N10,000 to help his family? Should they set-up a charitable foundation and publish their accounts? Pls refrain from conjecture. I know some boys who would boldly come here and state what and what MEND have done or not, but I am not on ground to witness any of this, and neither are you. MEND have repeatedly called for the rehabilitation of all citizens of Gbaramatu as a pre-condition for any armistice from the FG

(2.) Sourcing of funds for guerilla warfare is hardly ethical anywhere in the world. Listening to you, one would think that it was a straightforward process, and if so, why can Ibime and Texazzpete not also pick up arms to demand the change we all know we need?

(3.) See point 2. Jomo Gbomo has said that a true revolution would consume all present day leaders in Niger-Delta. The issue is that most of these leaders also have thugs, and MEND do not have the time or resources to get bogged down fighting their own people whilst still engaging the FG. All that should evidently follow later. Strategy is more important at this stage.

(4.) Casualties are a fact of war. The day America, Britain, or any army infact, apologise for innocents killed in their wars, then MEND will have to apologise to families of innocent casualties. As long as the innocents were not wilfully killed (eg Germans killing of Jews, Nigerians killing of Biafrans), there is nothing to be said. Fact remains that no oil-captives have been wilfully murdered etc, and this shows MENDS approach to civilians, unlike the blood-thirsty JTF.

(5.) Refer to (4.). Perhaps MEND would consider applying extra discretion when dealing with victims of Atlas Cove because they are from a different tribe.

texazzpete:

And wasn't it MEND that brought this wave of kidnapping upon us in the first place?

I do not believe i am you enemy, Ibime. There's a lot to fix in Nigeria. I have my cogent reasons why i do not trust or admire MEND. Does that place me on the side of devils too?

Let us debate, not dispute

@ bolded,

Why not go further back and blame the Arochukwu for bringing kidnapping into Nigeria? 

Should we also blame Benin Boys for the proliferation of Armed Robbery in Southern Nigeria? 

Abeg, make everybody answer im papa name. MEND started off kidnapping oil-workers, next thing every copycat is doing it to their fellow Nigerians. One remembers that when a list of kidnappers was released back when everyone was blaming 'militants' (not to be confused with MEND) for kidnapping, I often used to see a lot of Igbo and other tribes names paraded as suspects, and anyone with a brain cell would know these kidnappers are not MEND, but profiteers. The Govt strategy toward MEND remains that of giving a dog a bad name in order to hang it, and attributing every kidnapping in Niger-Delta to "militants" (Read: MEND!). Today, the virus is all over Southern Nigeria, and we should also attribute every kidnapping in Igbo land to MASSOB or every kidnapping in Yorubaland to YCE. 

I believe one should read the news with intelligence, and not be a sheep being led by every falsity. For example, look at how some people jumped on this thread thinking it was MEND that was the subject of this amnesty deal, when every intelligent observer should have noted that MEND flatly rejected the amnesty.

after all my begging, you are still ignoring me and my questions.
so what should i deduce from your silence?

Ibime:

I believe one should read the news with intelligence, and not be a sheep being led by every falsity. For example, look at how some people jumped on this thread thinking it was MEND that was the subject of this amnesty deal, when every intelligent observer should have noted that MEND flatly rejected the amnesty.

I dont think this your point held until "MEND" itself distanced themselves from the issue after the 1st publication. You may have been more informed about the happenings in ND cos you are from there. Reception of the information itself by many posters on the thread is not a measure of their intelligence but their response to same that is. Enough about intelligence this intelligent that  
But seriously,I hope we get a solution to the ND crisis soon.
The faction that made the demands to the FG just goes on to show the rot eating away at any system set up in Nigeria. Let us see how this eventually pans out. Peace

nex:

@Ibime

you have said it that you are curt to people with dysfunctional thinking. I now understand your rabid attitude to people with functional thinking.

Today you will say Edo are not Niger Delta. Tomorrow you will say Itsekiri are not Niger Delta. Then after that You will say only Ijaw are Niger Delta. Divide and conquer that will lead to factions and defeat. Shey you have seen Bayelsa and Delta factions of MEND.

Go and be curt to your people with dysfunctional thinking.

We will not purchase that okrika AK47 from you for 300K. You lazy swine. No one for you to kidnap today? No pipeline to draw crude from? No NYSC girls for you to rape? No cult wars to fight?

Ibime you have biten more than you can chew, do you remember this comment you made on the NYSC rape thread, sometime ago?

Ibime:

Lite N Cee, what do Omehia and Odili have to do with freedom struggle? They are opponents of the struggle, not part of it. So are most of the so-called militants. [b]The only names I can vouch for in this struggle are Asari and Boyloaf. [/b]Your crass generalisations show your lack of understanding of anything to do with Niger-Delta.

now you say Prince Harry is negotiating for boyloaf = militants, not MEND. the same boyloaf you vouch for is now asking for N300k per AK. shame on you for lack of consistency and integrity, my guy some folks here definitely have better memory and intelligence than you so, pls tell your MEND/militant brothers to clean up their act. it is very disgraceful that with all the problems in the ND, you guys muddle things up like this and still hope to be taken serious. how do you guys want us to believe you have any other ideology apart from money. MEND has much more money than MASSOB yet they dont even have a clear cut means communicating their agenda, not even a website or radio station like MASSOB, before we even talk about building schools. you guys really need to clean up your act.

Lite-n-Cee:

now you say Prince Harry is negotiating for boyloaf = militants, not MEND. the same boyloaf you vouch for is now asking for N300k per AK. shame on you for lack of consistency and integrity, my guy some folks here definitely have better memory and intelligence than you so, pls tell your MEND/militant brothers to clean up their act. it is very disgraceful that with all the problems in the ND, you guys muddle things up like this and still hope to be taken serious. how do you guys want us to believe you have any other ideology apart from money. MEND has much more money than MASSOB yet they dont even have a clear cut means communicating their agenda, not even a website or radio station like MASSOB, before we even talk about building schools. you guys really need to clean up your act.

I would hope that every human being realises that change is inevitable. Who would think the great Dora Akinyuli who fought so bravely against the importation of fake drugs would become nothing but a stooge and who would think that Ohakim who was doing so well would deflect to PDP. Similarly, who would think that Boyloaf would tire of the struggle? Any system in Nigeria would surely have some rot in it.

. . .Just to clarify a few things. . .

MEND is not an army, but a group of highly organised, educated and highly intelligent people who use the system to fight itself, both as a strategy and because they are minorities who cannot engage in frontal conventional warfare with the state. This is due to their minority status, population wise, economically and in both govt and military representation. In a law of the jungle, "winner takes all" nation like Nigeria, minorities are totally voiceless, with zero representation. Therefore, lateral thinking and asymmetric warfare have been employed with core goals in mind; ending deprivation, pollution, injustice, giving the Niger Delta a political voice and enriching the Niger Delta, while clamouring for fiscal federalism in Nigeria.
Peaceful agitation has failed several times, with the execution of the regions leaders (e.g. Ken Saro Wiwa) .
MEND works like this:

[list]
[li]The leadership of MEND is deliberately kept unknown, so the leaders can function as every day Nigerians, pushing the cause in peaceful ways.[/li]
[li]MEND is very skilled at sourcing sophisticated weapons and provision of military training.[/li]
[li]Politicians love thugs so they arm up deprived youths to loot and shoot their rivals and to cow the general populace.[/li]
[li]MEND contacts these same thugs, gives them arms to use against the state that created them; only now there’s no politician boss and they aren't terrorising the populace; they are now used against oil wells.[/li]
[li]Politicians from all over Nigeria (especially from the far North) love bunkering, MEND uses this against them by making the waters unsafe (with the politicians very own former thugs).[/li]
[li]MEND uses the politicians apparatus to bunker oil to boost the economy of the Niger Delta.[/li]
[li]MEND controls very sophisticated arms (JTF claims to have captured a drone) and so controls the armed groups through supply.[/li]
[li]MEND exerts pressure for their cause by by putting pressure on oil supply.[/li]
[/list]

The nature of representation of minorities in a winner takes all society like ours has given birth to a new kind of creature of resistance. MEND is studied the Word over as a masterpiece of military strategy that can bring any nation to its knees (look at sites for Stratfor, Global Guerrillas etc). In the converse, JTF with no tangible gains apart from the destruction of Gbaramatu, is viewed as a failure.
Foreign powers are beginning to take note, let’s watch Hilary Clintons visit very closely; it will indicate the side of the table that the US will play its game (likely with the Niger Delta).
Until Nigeria redeems herself off corruption and institute true federalism, MEND will continue to win.

Beaf:

[list]
[li]The leadership of MEND is deliberately kept unknown, so the leaders can function as every day Nigerians, pushing the cause in peaceful ways.[/li]
[li]MEND is very skilled at sourcing sophisticated weapons and provision of military training.[/li]
[li]Politicians love thugs so they arm up deprived youths to loot and shoot their rivals and to cow the general populace.[/li]
[li]MEND contacts these same thugs, gives them arms to use against the state that created them; only now there’s no politician boss and they aren't terrorising the populace; they are now used against oil wells.[/li]

One should always be mindful of the points above. . . .when I say I support MEND, people think I vouch for the ethics of the boys themselves. . . . this couldn't be further from the truth, cos I have stated repeatedly that the boys are hired criminals. . . . Im more mindful of the leadership of MEND than the boys. . .

Beaf:

MEND is studied the Word over as a masterpiece of military strategy that can bring any nation to its knees (look at sites for Stratfor, Global Guerrillas etc).

Foreign powers are beginning to take note, let’s watch Hilary Clintons visit very closely; it will indicate the side of the table that the US will play its game (likely with the Niger Delta).

Are the above your views or did you cull them from somewhere? If so, can I have the link please so I can sudy it for myself, especially with regard to Hillary Clintons visit.

ibime, you can vouch for Asari?

Beaf:

. . .Just to clarify a few things. . .

MEND is not an army, but a group of highly organised, educated and highly intelligent people who use the system to fight itself, both as a strategy and because they are minorities who cannot engage in frontal conventional warfare with the state. This is due to their minority status, population wise, economically and in both govt and military representation. In a law of the jungle, "winner takes all" nation like Nigeria, minorities are totally voiceless, with zero representation. Therefore, lateral thinking and asymmetric warfare have been employed with core goals in mind; ending deprivation, pollution, injustice, giving the Niger Delta a political voice and enriching the Niger Delta, while clamouring for fiscal federalism in Nigeria.
Peaceful agitation has failed several times, with the execution of the regions leaders (e.g. Ken Saro Wiwa) .
MEND works like this:

[list]
[li]The leadership of MEND is deliberately kept unknown, so the leaders can function as every day Nigerians, pushing the cause in peaceful ways.[/li]
[li]MEND is very skilled at sourcing sophisticated weapons and provision of military training.[/li]
[li]Politicians love thugs so they arm up deprived youths to loot and shoot their rivals and to cow the general populace.[/li]
[li]MEND contacts these same thugs, gives them arms to use against the state that created them; only now there’s no politician boss and they aren't terrorising the populace; they are now used against oil wells.[/li]
[li]Politicians from all over Nigeria (especially from the far North) love bunkering, MEND uses this against them by making the waters unsafe (with the politicians very own former thugs).[/li]
[li]MEND uses the politicians apparatus to bunker oil to boost the economy of the Niger Delta.[/li]
[li]MEND controls very sophisticated arms (JTF claims to have captured a drone) and so controls the armed groups through supply.[/li]
[li]MEND exerts pressure for their cause by by putting pressure on oil supply.[/li]
[/list]

The nature of representation of minorities in a winner takes all society like ours has given birth to a new kind of creature of resistance. MEND is studied the Word over as a masterpiece of military strategy that can bring any nation to its knees (look at sites for Stratfor, Global Guerrillas etc). In the converse, JTF with no tangible gains apart from the destruction of Gbaramatu, is viewed as a failure.
Foreign powers are beginning to take note, let’s watch Hilary Clintons visit very closely; it will indicate the side of the table that the US will play its game (likely with the Niger Delta).
Until Nigeria redeems herself off corruption and institute true federalism, MEND will continue to win.

I think what should be really agitating the minds of insurgent commanders is how they would be able to withstand a massive combined-arms assault by the armed forces having digested the lessons of the recent successful military campaign in the north- east by the special police and infantry units and even further afield of how the 'world's most successful guerilla army' - the tamil tigers - was crushed by the Sri Lankan military.

you have come again.
there shall be no bombardment.
the govt officials are profiting from this criminality.
they will want to maximize the looting at the risk of any bombardment.
try and understand that.

mbulela:

ibime, you can vouch for Asari?

Is this a trick question?  

I can vouch for the fact that Asari is an ideologue, and is ideologically tied into the struggle. As for his ethical practices, I am not God.

tensor777:

I think what should be really agitaing insurgent commanders is how they would be able to withstand a massive combined assault by the armed forces having digested the lessons of the recent successful military campaign in the north- east by the special police and infantry units and even further afield how the 'world's most successful guerilla army' was crushed by the Sri lankan army.

We heard the same during the bombings of Tombia and Gbaramatu only for MEND to come back stronger.

Unless Nigeria is intent on carpet-bombing the whole Niger-Delta and all its oil facilities with it, this is just wishful thinking.

In a country as corrupt and dysfunctional as Nigeria where JTF members are selling information to MEND, a Sri-Lankan style victory is out of the question, not to mention the fact that Tamil Land does not sit on highly combustible elements.

I have a friend here in London who was a soldier with the JTF. An Igbo boy. He says that JTF are not interested in fighting and have no heart for it cos they are not as highly motivated as the boys. He also told me that they used to go and collect money from Asari whenever they needed it cos Asari's bunkering barges float from Bundu waterside and they collect money from Asari on the pretext that they do not disturb his business. This raises a pertinent question: How come not one single barge has been apprehended by the JTF? The media is awash with stories of bunkering, yet the FG/Army know where these barges operate from and have never done anything about it. What is the purpose of JTF in the Niger-Delta? You would be surprised at the inter-web relationships between JTF and militants in the Delta.

which successful campaign are you even talking about?
is it the shooting and killing of a defenseless civilian that has been circulating the web?

it is not a trick question.
you can use a lifeline; call a friend or ask the audience

tensor777:

That says it all. I don't know why people come here with a lot of unfounded assumptions.

Nigeria as a country looks faulted on so many fronts. Refering to freedom fighting for alams and co. The point here is when this militants sees Nigeria as a failed state, they can go ahead and manipulate so as to achieve what ever gains they desired, that is not to say there are no true agitations.

Let me state here that FGN should in a matter of urgency instill true federalism or co-federalism and come to ask me if other things including all these agitations and clashes will not fall in place

that your answer is not acceptable.
you are sitting in the fence.
he is ideologically tied to the struggle while making money out of the struggle and living fat (not just well) off the same struggle?
i love that struggle.

mbulela:

that your answer is not acceptable.
you are sitting in the fence.
he is ideologically tied to the struggle while making money out of the struggle and living fat (not just well) off the same struggle?
i love that struggle.

that will solve the problem and expose the criminals who are masquerading as militants.
however the problem is that this govt is incapable of such a sacrificial and nationalistic step. their crooked myopic tendency seeks to exploit the loopholes in every solution to loot and declare a bazaar.

mbulela:

that will solve the problem and expose the criminals who are masquerading as militants.
however the problem is that this govt is incapable of such a sacrificial and nationalistic step. their crooked myopic tendency seeks to exploit the loopholes in every solution to loot and declare a bazaar.

If only things were that simplistic.

We do not live in a utopia my friend.

Anyone seeking to influence anything in Naija must amass some money.

If that is the yardstick for measurement, then Asari is more legitimate than any of our public servants.

The questions you have asked are public knowledge eg everyone knows Asari is a bunkerer therefore I dont need to waste time answering. Infact, some would argue that Niger-Deltans have the right to lift oil from their own backyard since others have been doing it for decades without prosecution.

Even the late Ken Saro-Wiwa was accused of stealing money from foreign donations to MOSOP. The question is, what was his overriding motivation?