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The Atheist's Dilemma - Religion (2) - Nairaland

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The Theist/Atheist Dilemma / Conclusion : Atheism Is So Illogical , The Atheist Delusion / Is God Deliberately Ignoring The Atheist??? (1) (2) (3) (4)

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Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by donnffd(m): 11:39pm On Dec 04, 2016
skeendyke:


In other words, anarchy is a welcome development based on your argument.

Again, why do people use the word 'wicked' in describing the extremist sect, boko haram, when all the murders they have committed is 'good' according to their subjective definition if the word?

Even if you don't agree with their definition, do you think they are right to act the way they do given the fact that morality does not have an objective scope of interpretation or definition?

Read my post well, i ddnt claim that everybody should live according to what suites them, i only said good and evil is subjective to human experience which it is.

Let me give an analogy, Red, Red is a colour, we see it everyday right, but you must be aware that Red is very subjective to the human experience, there is no such thing as Red in nature or the other colours for that matter, infact i cant even be sure if my Red is your Red, both because of our shared human experience, we all experience Red.

Good and evil follow the same principle, we all experience good and evil and we know that good is the utmost well being of ones self and life in general, while evil is anything short than that, we know that the outside world doesnt experience good or evil like computers or even insects(just sentient beings), so you cannot claim that there is an objective absolute moral law in the universe for an experience that is solely subjective to human experience, just the same way the experience of Red cannot be objective to the universe because it is solely a human experience.

2 Likes

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by donnffd(m): 11:50pm On Dec 04, 2016
OLAADEGBU:


Read the OP and recalibrate your post. cool

This is a very unenlightened response...
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by LightandDarkness: 12:08am On Dec 05, 2016
Morality and our ideas of good and evil have always been subjectivery, labelling something as good or is not in reference to an absolute moral code but is simply a statement of opinion. This is why I've always said there is no such thing as a common good because everyone will have different opinions of what is truly good and what is bad.

A simple way to demonstrate my point is this passage from the bible. Theists this is not a trick question.


Deuteronomy 22:22
"If a man is found lying with a married woman, then both of them shall die, the man who lay with the woman, and the woman; thus you shall purge the evil from Israel."

Do you think this punishment is right or wrong?

If this was in the Nigerian constitution would you approve or disapprove?

Some mightime think this is right/good/just and some will be absolutely horrified. If majority of nigerian society approved then this punishement will be considered good in nigeria. If majortiy of british society disapproved this punishement would be considered bad.That's the way morality, and good and evil, works and always will work. Nothing to do with an absolute moral code.

I believe the greatest factor that determines what is good and bad when interacting in humans is simply empathy. How would I feel if this was done to me?

2 Likes

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by mrvitalis(m): 6:28am On Dec 05, 2016
OLAADEGBU:


The Infinite Uncreated Creator Created all things, including you. smiley
I only askrd of prove
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by Niflheim(m): 2:44pm On Dec 05, 2016
@OP,

Your post is "light-weight" material!!!

1."If you assume there such a thing as evil, you must assume there is such a thing as good"...................The killing of Hitler, was good for the allies!!! But was it good for the Nazis? No? It wasn't? Then there is no such thing as objective good, because what id good for the goose, most likely is bad for the gander!!!

2."There must be a moral, absolute law giver"..................................Show me his office!!! Where is his(or her) address!!! Og wait!!! Let me guess!!! You read about this absolute moral law giver, in a book where a donkey spoke hebrew!!! Pathetic!!!

3."Whom the atheists are trying to disprove"...........................No, no, no, we are only waiting for you to provide the evidence!!! There's a difference!!!

4."But that would be god"...................Now hang on a minute!!! The Romans said that the divine law giver was Egeria, the mamiwata goddess!!! Is she the one you are referring to? And the Babylonians sais that the divine law giver was Oannes(the catfish who forgot to shave his moystache)!!! Abi you sef dey worship catfish?

1 Like

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by blueAgent(m): 10:12am On Dec 07, 2016
foladara777:
That's my question... Is badness or goodness determined by God


Yes only God is the law giver.

1 Like

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by urheme: 3:53pm On Dec 07, 2016
Kay17:


When God instructs you to



Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 5:30pm On Jan 05
mrvitalis:


I only askrd of prove

What other prove do you want?

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Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:02am On Feb 16
Niflheim:


@OP,

Your post is "light-weight" material!!!

1."If you assume there such a thing as evil, you must assume there is such a thing as good"...................The killing of Hitler, was good for the allies!!! But was it good for the Nazis? No? It wasn't? Then there is no such thing as objective good, because what id good for the goose, most likely is bad for the gander!!!

Why would you say that the killing of a mass murderer is not good universally? undecided

Niflheim:


2."There must be a moral, absolute law giver"..................................Show me his office!!! Where is his(or her) address!!! Og wait!!! Let me guess!!! You read about this absolute moral law giver, in a book where a donkey spoke hebrew!!! Pathetic!!!

If laws of morality are just adopted social customs, then why was what Hitler did evil?

Niflheim:


3."Whom the atheists are trying to disprove"...........................No, no, no, we are only waiting for you to provide the evidence!!! There's a difference!!!

Where is the evidence that God does not exist? undecided

Niflheim:


4."But that would be god"...................Now hang on a minute!!! The Romans said that the divine law giver was Egeria, the mamiwata goddess!!! Is she the one you are referring to? And the Babylonians sais that the divine law giver was Oannes(the catfish who forgot to shave his moystache)!!! Abi you sef dey worship catfish?

If those where to be God you would be attacking them as you do Yahweh.

1 Like

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 10:32am On Mar 27
LightandDarkness:


Morality and our ideas of good and evil have always been subjectivery, labelling something as good or is not in reference to an absolute moral code but is simply a statement of opinion. This is why I've always said there is no such thing as a common good because everyone will have different opinions of what is truly good and what is bad.

A simple way to demonstrate my point is this passage from the bible. Theists this is not a trick question.


Deuteronomy 22:22
"If a man is found lying with a married woman, then both of them shall die, the man who lay with the woman, and the woman; thus you shall purge the evil from Israel."

Do you think this punishment is right or wrong?

If this was in the Nigerian constitution would you approve or disapprove?

Some mightime think this is right/good/just and some will be absolutely horrified. If majority of nigerian society approved then this punishement will be considered good in nigeria. If majortiy of british society disapproved this punishement would be considered bad.That's the way morality, and good and evil, works and always will work. Nothing to do with an absolute moral code.

I believe the greatest factor that determines what is good and bad when interacting in humans is simply empathy. How would I feel if this was done to me?

The Moral Law is different from the constitution of the nation of Israel which you quoted above. Learn to differentiate. The Nigerian constitution would not work in Israel and vice versa. cool
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by LightandDarkness: 12:06pm On Mar 27
OLAADEGBU:


The Moral Law is different from the constitution of the nation of Israel which you quoted above. Learn to differentiate. The Nigerian constitution would not work in Israel and vice versa. cool

That was biblical law, were you claim mortality originates from. What according to you is moral law if not biblical law
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 12:24pm On Mar 27
LightandDarkness:


That was biblical law, were you claim mortality originates from. What according to you is moral law if not biblical law

The Moral Law is what you get in the decalogue (10 Commandments) and that is universal.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by LightandDarkness: 12:30pm On Mar 27
OLAADEGBU:


The Moral Law is what you get in the decalogue (10 Commandments) and that is universal.

So your argument is that the 10 commandments are the source of morality and the morality of any other laws in the Bible are subjective?
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by hahn(m): 12:32pm On Mar 27
OLAADEGBU:


The Moral Law is what you get in the decalogue (10 Commandments) and that is universal.

Add "thou shalt not keep slaves" and make it 11 commandments undecided

1 Like

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by akintom(m): 1:06pm On Mar 27
OLAADEGBU:
The atheist's dilemma

This dilemma doesn't exist. In the atheists use of words, evil means a wrong act that hurts (without spiritual influence).

Atheistic position is that, morality is relative/subjective and not absolute/objective.

Your God isn't a pervading influence, therefore the fabrications tied to god idea are mere thoughts of nil consequence.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:11pm On Mar 30
akintom:


This dilemma doesn't exist. In the atheists use of words, evil means a wrong act that hurts (without spiritual influence).

Atheistic position is that, morality is relative/subjective and not absolute/objective.

Your God isn't a pervading influence, therefore the fabrications tied to god idea are mere thoughts of nil consequence.

www.livingwaters.com
"An atheist doesn’t believe that nothing created everything.”

Atheists say that they have "no belief in a god." If I have a car and have no belief in a maker of the car, it, by default, means that I think that the car made itself--or that no one made it.

It is scientificially impossible for nothing to create anything.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:23pm On Aug 28
OZAOEKPE:


Seun needs to calm down

You can say that again. cheesy
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:28pm On Aug 28
foladara777:


If God is the moral law giver... Is there a reason God give laws... Lemme do it this way, does God forbid killing because it is bad or is killing bad because God says so... Plss I need your answer

God lays down the moral law and man has to obey just as man has to obey the laws of nature that God has set in place, either he likes it or not. Only God has the power to give life and He is the only One who has the power to take it. smiley
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:30pm On Aug 28
foladara777:


That's my question... Is badness or goodness determined by God

Yes.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:35pm On Aug 28
Kay17:


Good and evil are value judgments not concrete reality.

Is evil universally accepted as bad? undecided
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:41pm On Aug 28
mrvitalis:


Armed robbery is neither bad nor good it just ur perception towards it

Stealing can be good or bad depending on ur perception

Killing is not bad ooh.. After all we celebrate David killing the Palestinians

Your subjective perception does not matter it is the universally objective perception that we are talking about.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 3:47pm On Aug 28
mrvitalis:


Ok define good and give example

Define bad and give examples

Add "o" to God and you will get good. Add "d" to evil and you will get devil. You need not look any further. cool
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:00pm On Aug 28
mrvitalis:


We now have human law based of generally majority perception. .. in a sense nazist naver saw there actions as bad

Just as Christians and jews will never see god promising a land that belong to other people to iseral and asked them to kill them and take the land? Or will never see gods instruction to make Saul as bad

Human law is as a reflection of the Moral Law God put in place in every human being and that explains why what it is universally wrong is accepted as wrong. You set yourself as a moral judge when you assume it is wrong for the Jews to take what they believe belongs to them. Your judgment at best is only subjective and not objective.
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:02pm On Aug 28
Richirich713:


Actually God has the right to punish people for sins and he has the right to take human life because he is the judge and the creator and sustainer of all life and existence.

I take it that on your view the nazi's weren't wrong, nor is anyone really wrong since there's nothing like good or bad, it's all subjective perception? Again if that's true you can't condemn the nazi's or the racist's who ran apartheid in South Africa actions as immoral or wrong.

That is the atheists' dilemma that they can't wriggle out from. cheesy
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:23pm On Aug 28
hahn:


Add "thou shalt not keep slaves" and make it 11 commandments undecided

Don't be an hypocrite. Haven't you used househelps, drivers or employees? Are they not servants/slaves?
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:26pm On Aug 28
OLAADEGBU:


www.livingwaters.com
"An atheist doesn’t believe that nothing created everything.”

Atheists say that they have "no belief in a god." If I have a car and have no belief in a maker of the car, it, by default, means that I think that the car made itself--or that no one made it.

It is scientificially impossible for nothing to create anything.

I hope atheists took note of this. cheesy
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by hahn(m): 4:51pm On Aug 28
OLAADEGBU:


Don't be an hypocrite. Haven't you used househelps, drivers or employees? Are they not servants/slaves?

Employees = Slaves

You just had to show the world how much of a demented psychopath you are

5 Likes

Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by mrvitalis(m): 4:57pm On Aug 28
OLAADEGBU:


Human law is as a reflection of the Moral Law God put in place in every human being and that explains why what it is universally wrong is accepted as wrong. You set yourself as a moral judge when you assume it is wrong for the Jews to take what they believe belongs to them. Your judgment at best is only subjective and not objective.
What God are you talking about ?

Even Jews accepted that people owned the land before them
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by mrvitalis(m): 4:59pm On Aug 28
OLAADEGBU:


Your subjective perception does not matter it is the universally objective perception that we are talking about.
And who defines that

When had being popular opinion meant something is correct
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 5:15pm On Aug 28
hahn:


Employees = Slaves

You just had to show the world how much a demented psychopath you are

Check up the dictionary for synonymous words of "employ, employed, employee, employer" and give us your feedback. cool
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 5:26pm On Aug 28
mrvitalis:


What God are you talking about ?

Even Jews accepted that people owned the land before them

Am talking about the Only wise God. cool
Re: The Atheist's Dilemma by OLAADEGBU(m): 5:28pm On Aug 28
mrvitalis:


And who defines that

When had being popular opinion meant something is correct

The Moral Law giver decides, we've got the choice to either obey or disobey it.

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