@eastbay
incase you're still wondering about that youth policy thing, maybe this will enlighten you more:

Distribution of outfield player ages (Players who have represented their club in the PL this season) in the top 3 Premier league clubs (data from soccernet)

           Manure          Chelsea           Arsenal

Above 25     13               16                 8
23-25            3                2                  3
21-23            5                2                  5
Below 21       5                4                 10

Total             26                24               26

(%<23)       39%               25%              58%


Notice anything? yu should now understand what people mean when they say each passing year favours Arsenal and is detrimental to Chelsea, by the way, a great proportion of those 16 chelsea players are above 30 years old.

~Sauron~:

Cesc
Eboue
Arshavin

Van Persie is shyte. . . . .
Gallas is brawns with no brain cells.
Vermaelen had it going for him but his decision-making in the games against United/Chelsea/Man City was atrocious.

I forgot TV5. I don't think he is getting paid that much so he is absolutely worth it(may be even under paid when compared to the salary Lescott is on)
Eboue!!! Really?

Van Persie ain't shit. He's just injury prone. A fuly fit RVP is worth his current pay packet
Gallas is kinda 50/50. Some days he looks worldclass while on other days he plays like your run of the mill center half.

@Dudu

Where i personally find the youth mantra ridiculous is in the area of Wenger refusing blatantly to ADD experience when it is EXTREMELY needed.The mistake was glaring in 07/08,made worse by the fact Flamini and Hleb were allowed to leave at the beginning of last season and yet again we are in the same TRAP right now.Everyone and his dog knows getting an attacker will add an impetus to our campaign this season but what do we have?

It's a bit "luxurious" to always use the youth policy as a leeway and i think it's over played.You may want to read the below excerpt:

But Fabregas has gone so far as to state that the club cannot even blame the growing injury crisis, and that the players just have to get on with it.

Fabregas said: "We can't hide behind people saying we are too young, or we have injuries. We just have to compete.

"People say you must learn from your mistakes, but you learn how to play football when you are 12, 13, 14, 15. You don't learn these things when you are 25.

That is from the club captain.Enough said.

I was talking to a friend in France sometimes ago about how i think our whole set up needs a correct atmosphere.Believe me,even the kids at Man U are not extra-ordinary but the winning mentality the senior squad has is an added advantage to the up coming lads.This present team needs to win something,anything to know how it feels to be a winner.

chic2pimp:

I forgot TV5. I don't think he is getting paid that much so he is absolutely worth it(may be even under paid when compared to the salary Lescott is on)
Eboue!!! Really?

Van Persie ain't poo. He's just injury prone. A fuly fit RVP is worth his current pay packet
Gallas is kinda 50/50. Some days he looks worldclass while on other days he plays like your run of the mill center half.

Gallas looks world class? Are you high?
TBH, Vermaelen is the world class material in wait threatening to blow up like nitro.
He reminds me of Nesta with the way he's comfortable in possession and at 23, there's still enough time to improve!!!

Come to think of it, Belgium will be a world superpower by 2014 with the young players coming through in that country.

Vermaelen
De Laet
Fellaini
Kompany
Eden Hazard
Defour
Witsel
Dembele

duduspace:

@eastbay
incase you're still wondering about that youth policy thing, maybe this will enlighten you more:

Distribution of outfield player ages (Players who have represented their club in the PL this season) in the top 3 Premier league clubs (data from soccernet)

            Manure          Chelsea           Arsenal

Above 25     13               16                 8
23-25            3                2                  3
21-23            5                2                  5
Below 21       5                4                 10

Total             26                24               26

(%<23)       39%               25%              58%


Notice anything? yu should now understand what people mean when they say each passing year favours Arsenal and is detrimental to Chelsea, by the way, a great proportion of those 16 chelsea players are above 30 years old.

I knew Arsenal were sort of a young team but I definitely did not expect them to be this young.

~Sauron~:

Gallas looks world class? Are you high?
TBH, Vermaelen is the world class material in wait threatening to blow up like nitro.
He reminds me of Nesta with the way he's comfortable in possession and at 23, there's still enough time to improve!!!

Come to think of it, Belgium will be a world superpower by 2014 with the young players coming through in that country.

Vermaelen
De Laet
Fellaini
Kompany
Eden Hazard
Defour
Witsel
Dembele

Yes I've seen some games where Gallas has performed admirably(may be worldclass was taking it too far). I also don't think he is all brawn. He reads the game quite well.
TV5 reminds me of Agger.
Regarding Belgium being a super power, I came across an article on the net recently where the author basically made a prediction of emerging superpowers based on the amount of young talents countries have. I was quite amazed cuz quite a few amount of countries has good young player.
You never know but the 2018 worldcup might be the first worldcup final not contested by the so called 'Super Powers'

chic2pimp:

Yes I've seen some games where Gallas has performed admirably(may be worldclass was taking it too far). I also don't think he is all brawn. He reads the game quite well.
TV5 reminds me of Agger.

How did i miss Agger's name?
Seriously, Agger and TV5 musta been midfielders/strikers earlier in their career.
Their composure in possession is breath-taking. . . . .

Regarding Belgium being a super power, I came across an article on the net recently where the author basically made a prediction of emerging superpowers based on the amount of young talents countries have. I was quite amazed cuz quite a few amount of countries has good young player.
You never know but the 2018 worldcup might be the first worldcup final not contested by the so called 'Super Powers'

Argentina, Brazil, Germany will always be there.
They can never run out of starlets. . . . .but with Walcott leading the line here, England is doomed.

~Sauron~:

How did i miss Agger's name?
Seriously, Agger and TV5 musta been midfielders/strikers earlier in their career.
Their composure in possession is breath-taking. . . . .

Most of this ball playing center halves probably started their career as Midfielders.
The likes Sandro,Ferdinand,Carvalho & co

~Sauron~:


Argentina, Brazil, Germany will always be there.
They can never run out of starlets. . . . .but with Walcott leading the line here, England is doomed.

Well, you never can tell. Didn't we think Greece would never win a trophy let alone the European Championship.
I somehow don't see Walcott leading the english line . At best he'll be squad player who will come on to frighten defenders with his pace when England need to change things.

~Sauron~:

Come to think of it, Belgium will be a world superpower by 2014 with the young players coming through in that country.

Vermaelen
De Laet
Fellaini
Kompany
Eden Hazard
Defour
Witsel
Dembele

They are exactly like the Arsenal team at present, so much quality but have maturity issues, you wonder how they did so badly in their group for the world cup qualifiers, they are about to turn a corner though and I definitely will look forward to seeing them in the 2012 euros.

chic2pimp:

Most of this ball playing center halves probably started their career as Midfielders.
The likes Sandro,Ferdinand,Carvalho & co

Ferdinand gives me hypertension. He even dribbles strikers sometimes and stuffs like that are the reasons he makes countless mistakes.
He sometimes forget he is the last man and any mistake in that area of the pitch is GRAVE.

Well, you never can tell. Didn't we think Greece would never win a trophy let alone the European Championship.
I somehow don't see Walcott leading the english line . At best he'll be squad player who will come on to frighten defenders with his pace when England need to change things.

So who will lead England in 2014?

kay_pumpin:

@Dudu

Where i personally find the youth mantra ridiculous is in the area of Wenger refusing blatantly to ADD experience when it is EXTREMELY needed.The mistake was glaring in 07/08,made worse by the fact Flamini and Hleb were allowed to leave at the beginning of last season and yet again we are in the same TRAP right now.Everyone and his dog knows getting an attacker will add an impetus to our campaign this season but what do we have?

It's a bit "luxurious" to always use the youth policy as a leeway and i think it's over played.You may want to read the below excerpt:

That is from the club captain.Enough said.

I was talking to a friend in France sometimes ago about how i think our whole set up needs a correct atmosphere.Believe me,even the kids at Man U are not extra-ordinary but the winning mentality the senior squad has is an added advantage to the up coming lads.This present team needs to win something,anything to know how it feels to be a winner.

I am proud of Cesc making that statement, I would have been disappointed in our captain hiding behind age as an excuse for not winning, that is the winning mentality we want. The demand on the team has always been trophies and in truth the team is no longer as young as it once was, they are in the frame to start winning things now and that is the spirit the players should exemplify.
Most of the time, the spirit of a team is exemplified by one player, in the case of Arsenal, it has been Cesc ever since PV4 left, that player is still only 22 years old and he beleives the time has come to start winning.
The manure team has won before and still has largely, the same core that has won in the past. With each passing season, the playing field is levelled and I see it tilting in our favour very soon, there is only one way left for this team and that is upwards.
You are very right that once this team wins something which I hope would be this season, the whole dynamics of the PL changes from there on.

~Sauron~:

Ferdinand gives me hypertension. He even dribbles strikers sometimes and stuffs like that are the reasons he makes countless mistakes.
He sometimes forget he is the last man and any mistake in that area of the pitch is GRAVE.

Hehehehehe . It's the risk that makes him great
I don't know why but I just prefer the ball playing center half.

~Sauron~:

So who will lead England in 2014?

Rooney!!!!(28 years old). Walcott can't and never will be able to lead the line.
His other option is on the right wing however I don't see him displacing Lennon(lennon is faster,more skilful & has better end product)

chic2pimp:

Hehehehehe . It's the risk that makes him great
I don't know why but I just prefer the ball playing center half.

I like them too and this is why i think Nesta and Rio are the best centre-halves on their day.
Their distribution of the ball is brilliant and they start attacks from the back.

Rooney!!!!(28 years old). Walcott can't and never will be able to lead the line.
His other option is on the right wing however I don't see him displacing Lennon(lennon is faster,more skilful & has better end product)

The thunk of Rooney @ 28 gives me the shivers.
I actually think because Rooney started earlier he would burn out before 28. . . .prolly get crocked for life or he will just turn shyte.

~Sauron~:

The thunk of Rooney @ 28 gives me the shivers.
I actually think because Rooney started earlier he would burn out before 28. . . .prolly get crocked for life or he will just turn shyte.

I don't think this can happen, Rooney is that special blend of hustle, skill and heart that doesn't come along often, IMO he is almost like Diego Maradona, if his work rate drops he still has his skill to fall back on and still make an impact. I see him playing well into his 30s.

duduspace:

I don't deny most of what you say, mutually beneficial it definitely is, my question is this, are you or any of the persistent moaners the one putting the money into the club? Most of the share holders like Kroenke and co don't even draw salaries from the club and the club has never once declared a dividend to its shareholders while ploughing back all the profit back into the club, the accounts are there for all to see, Wenger gets his salary cos he does his job in implementing the club's strategy, he doesn't even have shares in the company at present because he doesn't want a conflict of interest.
The Newcastle fans made so much noise about Mike Ashley last season, are they making noise now when they are in the championship and reality dawned that noone wants to buy the club? when you see clubs falling like stones round you, please learn to appreciate what yu've got and don't belittle it, it is all well for Sauron and Dayokanu to belittle your club and manager because they want you to feel small in supporting your club, see the positives in the direction your club has taken, or if you can't see any, tone down the negative talk since you can't do much about it anyway.

If the profit is being ploughed back into the club is it used to service debts or sign minors from Nicaragua?? Or both?? All these things should be the job of the GM and not Wenger and with that we are already giving him an alibi for failure!! No wonder we have not been able to work on our on-field issues

How much did Mike Ashley invest in Newcastle Compared to his mates?? Besides he obviously was too hands-on in his approach for someone who knew precious little about football.

I am not belittling Arsenal or Arsene!! I am venting my frustrations at a man who seemingly has not learn from his past mistakes. Policy or no policy Arsenal should be doing better than they are now! Maybe you believe in patting backs and massaging egos i believe in tough love. I will in no wise kiss a.s.s and not point out whats wrong so we can move forward that has not been working for a while now

duduspace:

Of course we don't need to sell to a sheikh, a lot of us don't even want any silly money bag coming to treat our club like some sort of plaything particularly these days when some sheikhs are turning out to be poorer than church rats. You are so proud of our style of play and you say it with pride but have you asked yourself if that style of play suddenly appeared out of thin air or if its the culmination or part culmination of some strategy running through the club and being pioneered by somebody? You say we don't need this or that but those who are outperforming us are exactly making use of what yu say we don't need, a rich benefactor in Abrahamovic and being neck deep in debt like Manure, can you please show me a club outperforming us and is not doing any of what you mention we don't need?

Its not just about money to blow. Ranieri also blew money with Chelsea and didn't win much well maybe not as much money as Mourinho but my point is our problem is not just the money or the lack thereof. Its about a deep lying mentality that is lacking a problem that this strategy or youth policy would not solve barring any changes to our methodology. I am proud our style of play yes but we never seem to have a Plan B when faced with adversity. This is not a problem any billionaire can solve. The major difference between us winning and losing the league in the past couple of seasons has been defence!! This is an issue i have raised a gazillion times! We have seen teams with even more meagre resources outperforming us in that area in recent times. Are any steps being taken to remedy that??

duduspace:

A winner's mentality comes from maturity and experience, a youth policy needs time to gestate and reach that peak, it is a credit IMO to Arsene that he has guaranteed at least a minimum top 4 finish during this period while bringing us close on occasion during this time, can you show me any other club that embraced a youth policy in recent times yet has still been able to keep such high standards both domestically and in Europe?

So who are the inexperienced fellas in the current Arsenal setup?? And how many more years do we wait for them to mature and gain that "Requisite Experience" A sizeable bunch are in their third or fourth season at Arsenal already. There are a lot of other clubs that have embraced a youth policy but still take out time to do the right thing when they are supposed to which is buy the right kind of players to compliment the team. Our youth policy sef is not full-fledged and encompassing there are still a few old heads in our team or peeps that where bought from other clubs. And if we want to talk about Europe please lets not go there our record amongst England's big four is nothing to write home about! We are the only team that has lost to every member of the big four in that competition. They might be high standards to you but to me they are not high enough

duduspace:

I will not comment on individual players much but i will only like to point out that for whatever reason, the team has performed better this season without Ade or Kolo Toure than it did last season, infact at the beginning of the season, a lot of fans now complaining now were applauding it like some stroke of genius.Last season we were already out of contention for the PL, the money gained from sale of those players does not necessarily have to be used to buy like for like, there are management decisions in this things involving wages, interest payments e.t.c for which I don't have enough data to determine the good or bad in these decisions. Have you considered if part or all of the money made from the sale went into giving our other players longer term contracts?

The team has performed better because our midfield has been providing more than its own fair share of goals! The attack was not doing too badly till RVP went down with injury read my post well i did not say we should not have sold Ade and Toure all i am saying is get better replacements for them and not osho-free and 750,000 pound players!! Yes we are in contention but all that could change very quickly with injury to any of Gallas and Vermaelen and then the season would end again and y'all would still come and sing that "Youth Policy" hook again for us. Who are the other players that where given the longer term contracts? Do they get paid in lump sums or is it not a rolling thing?

duduspace:

If you still feel the policy is some form of cover up then I'm at the end of my tether, I will have to throw my hands up in surrender cos there isn't much more I can say, I do know however that not all of our key players can leave at the same time, I also know that the club is aware of this and this is why we are tying our young players to long term contracts.
I have never been one to bother my head about what I have no control over, the day I came to the conclusion that Arsenal had embraced a youth policy, I got interested in our youth setup and the whole academy system as a whole. The day will come when the youth that came through our youth setup like Barazite, Wilshere and co will win silverware and I would be happy to recall the days they were young lads coming through the academy or when I went to the Reebok to watch Jack Wilshere while on loan at Bolton.
I personally think that is what it means to be a fan and not only rejoicing when they win something big even though that is also an important part of it.

I tend to see it as an excuse when season after season i see the same errors made and i see the same manager unwilling to address these issues and make requisite changes. That i make criticisms here and there and point out areas we urgently need to improve to end this drought does not make me less of a fan and if your idea of being a fan is to shy away from the truth then i am sorry we are unlikely to ever agree on much as regards Arsenal

Beats me oh!
Please this fallacy about Arsenal and their youth policy is over-stretched.Whenever I hear the usual mantra stating that Arsenal are a young team,I start to wonder if it is a relative term.Because some of these grandpas you mentioned make this their ÿoung team"talk quite laughable

That was the Man Utd squad that started against Arsenal last weekend
Edwin van der Sar-39
Patrice Evra- 28
Wes Brown-28
Da Silva Rafael-19 (Teenager)
Jonny Evans-22
Ji-Sung Park - 28
Michael Carrick-26
Luis Carlos Nani- 23
Paul Scholes 35
Darren Fletcher- 25
Wayne Rooney - 24


Manuel Almunia- 32
Bacary Sagna - 26
Emmanuel Eboue, 26
Thomas Vermaelen-26,
William Gallas-
Gael Clichy- 24
Vassiriki Abou Diaby -23
Tomas Rosicky- 29,
Cesc Fabregas-22
Samir Nasri- 22
Theo Walcott-20
Alexandre Song- 23
Andrey Arshavin -29

By the time you add Eduardo and RVP who missed due to injury, the Young claims fall like a pack of card.

Man Utd won the league and CL when the key members were CR7-22, Rooney-22, Tevez- 22 add that to Nani, Anderson yet Fergie didnt come up with any young claim.

A-40:

If the profit is being ploughed back into the club is it used to service debts or sign minors from Nicaragua?? Or both?? All these things should be the job of the GM and not Wenger and with that we are already giving him an alibi for failure!! No wonder we have not been able to work on our on-field issues

This way of thinking is exactly why some clubs are fighting administration while others are heavily in debt, the work of the manager in my opinion is to work with the board to either make the club better than it is when he came in or leave it in the same state he met it, not just to "Win Silverware". Arsene has done the former and that is why the board who are the custodians of the club have never complained about him. Not because they don't want silverware as well as you do but because they are aware of the constraints Arsene is working with. You should ask yourself why Real Madrid still approached Arsene to come be their manager as recently as last summer if he is as clueless as yu're making him out to be.

A-40:

How much did Mike Ashley invest in Newcastle Compared to his mates?? Besides he obviously was too hands-on in his approach for someone who knew precious little about football.

No matter how little he invested, he deserved the respect of the fans being the custodian of the club. They woke up and smelt the coffee this season after all their noise about being a big club last season when they realised there was no one willing to buy the club off Ashley. Do you see them demonstrating against Ashley now? The moral of the story is, appreciate those who pay the bills to maintain your club as the alternative is not always better than what you have. I hope Manure fans will learn from this and stop giving the Glazers grief, it is in their power to wreck that club with dubious policies and they shouldn't be given any more reasons to do so along with the ones they already have.

A-40:

I am not belittling Arsenal or Arsene!! I am venting my frustrations at a man who seemingly has not learn from his past mistakes. Policy or no policy Arsenal should be doing better than they are now! Maybe you believe in patting backs and massaging egos i believe in tough love. I will in no wise kiss a.s.s and not point out whats wrong so we can move forward that has not been working for a while now
Its not just about money to blow. Ranieri also blew money with Chelsea and didn't win much well maybe not as much money as Mourinho but my point is our problem is not just the money or the lack thereof. Its about a deep lying mentality that is lacking a problem that this strategy or youth policy would not solve barring any changes to our methodology. I am proud our style of play yes but we never seem to have a Plan B when faced with adversity. This is not a problem any billionaire can solve.

It is well and good to vent your frustrations at the club, all I've requested is that yu shld not throw the baby out with the bath water, there are a lot of positives in our club that what I call "The whiner's brigade" are all too hasty to forget about. Keep perspective is all I ask, you definitely have seen me complaining on this forum haven't yu? but it does take understanding what the club is willing to stand for. Silverware is not anyone's right and that is a fact.

A-40:

The major difference between us winning and losing the league in the past couple of seasons has been defence!! This is an issue i have raised a gazillion times! We have seen teams with even more meagre resources outperforming us in that area in recent times. Are any steps being taken to remedy that??

I think you mean outperforming us in the defence and not outperforming us as a whole? cos the former might be true but the latter is definitely untrue. If you consider Portsmouth's FA Cup or Tottenham's carling cup as outperforming us, then lets agree to disagree about that.

A-40:

So who are the inexperienced fellas in the current Arsenal setup?? And how many more years do we wait for them to mature and gain that "Requisite Experience" A sizeable bunch are in their third or fourth season at Arsenal already. There are a lot of other clubs that have embraced a youth policy but still take out time to do the right thing when they are supposed to which is buy the right kind of players to compliment the team. Our youth policy sef is not full-fledged and encompassing there are still a few old heads in our team or peeps that where bought from other clubs. And if we want to talk about Europe please lets not go there our record amongst England's big four is nothing to write home about! We are the only team that has lost to every member of the big four in that competition. They might be high standards to you but to me they are not high enough

Take a look at the age distribution I put up above and yu'll see where the inexperience and age issues come from. Embracing a youth policy does not mean all your squad has to be below a certain age, its got to do with the bulk of the squad. Our squad presently has close to about 60% of its playing squad under 23 years old. If that is not a youth policy, please tell me what a youth policy is.

A-40:

The team has performed better because our midfield has been providing more than its own fair share of goals! The attack was not doing too badly till RVP went down with injury read my post well i did not say we should not have sold Ade and Toure all i am saying is get better replacements for them and not osho-free and 750,000 pound players!! Yes we are in contention but all that could change very quickly with injury to any of Gallas and Vermaelen and then the season would end again and y'all would still come and sing that "Youth Policy" hook again for us. Who are the other players that where given the longer term contracts? Do they get paid in lump sums or is it not a rolling thing?
I tend to see it as an excuse when season after season i see the same errors made and i see the same manager unwilling to address these issues and make requisite changes. That i make criticisms here and there and point out areas we urgently need to improve to end this drought does not make me less of a fan and if your idea of being a fan is to shy away from the truth then i am sorry we are unlikely to ever agree on much as regards Arsenal

It hasn't been season after season since Arsene joined the club, it has only been after Abrahamovic's money came to upset the prevailing dynamics of the premiership. Arsene has won (a lot) before even though it may now be a bit distant to a number of fans, and I do beleive he will win again once this youth policy begins to bear fruit which in my opinion might be as soon as this season but no later than next season. Chelsea in 2 season's time will need cash injection of at least another 150m to be able to keep up a semblance of their present level of performance and they had to have the initial investment of about 450m written off just to balance the books. Manure had to go borrow 500m from the bond market to stave off their high interest payments on what they borrowed before, I maintain that these are the only 2 clubs in the PL who have outperformed us during this period (2005 - 2009) and they've paid the price to do that, we look better going forwards than either of these 2 clubs and that is definitely not the work of an idiot, the work of a genius is more like it, I am happy Arsenal has a Manager called Arsene Wenger.

@Dayokanu

Stop being myopic in your analysis, we are talking of performance over time with a squad and not a single match or even 2 matches. In case you didn't know, in the first season that manure team won the premiership, we beat them both home and away. Also in the squads you put up we still had more players 23 years and under, 5 to their 3. Go and look at the age distribution or at least dispute it and stop yarning opaks like a market woman.

Regarding Belgium being a super power, I came across an article on the net recently where the author basically made a prediction of emerging superpowers based on the amount of young talents countries have. [b]I was quite amazed cuz quite a few amount of countries has good young player.[/b]You never know but the 2018 worldcup might be the first worldcup final not contested by the so called 'Super Powers'

That means you have not been following the German set up
The best young keepers in the world
Manuel Neuer and Rene Adler
Toni Kroos
Mesut Ozil
Jerome Boateng
Thomas Muller
Marko Marin
Sami Khedira
Andreas Beck
Grote
Felix Kroos
Holger Badstuber

porto. . . . .

Gunner 1800, , , ,Valz day

duduspace:

@Dayokanu

Stop being myopic in your analysis, we are talking of performance over time with a squad and not a single match or even 2 matches. In case you didn't know, in the first season that manure team won the premiership, we beat them both home and away. Also in the squads you put up we still had more players 23 years and under, 5 to their 3. Go and look at the age distribution or at least dispute it and stop yarning opaks like a market woman.

Rubbish!

United's kids won the league in 2005/6. . . . .Arsenal kids are yet to win any title since Wenger started his moronic youth policy he copied from SAF.
I can understand the EPL being a tough task. How come these baby gooners are yet to even win the Carling cup or the FA cup?
Arsenal kids are shyte!!!

dayokanu:

That means you have not been following the German set up
The best young keepers in the world
Manuel Neuer and Rene Adler
Toni Kroos
Mesut Ozil
Jerome Boateng
Thomas Muller
Marko Marin
Sami Khedira
Andreas Beck
Grote
Felix Kroos
Holger Badstuber

Nah I was referring to the so called 'Low Key' Nations.
We all know teams like Italy,Germany,Brazil,Argentina,England,spain.France e.t.c will always have good players

chic2pimp:

Nah I was referring to the so called 'Low Key' Nations.
We all know teams like Italy,Germany,Brazil,Argentina,England,spain.France e.t.c will always have good players

Don't mind that Dayokanu. . . .
We are talking about countries who are likely to become superpowers and he is mentioning a superpower.
How did he graduate from college?

What if Yugoslavia never broke into several countries like they did.
U will have Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia, Slovenia, etc all wrapped in one.
That's a thousand acres of football talents.

~Sauron~:

Don't mind that Dayokanu. . . .
We are talking about countries who are likely to become superpowers and he is mentioning a superpower.
How did he graduate from college?

Hehehehe
I woulda yabbed him if not for the fact he went to one of the best unis in nigeria

~Sauron~:


What if Yugoslavia never broke into several countries like they did.
U will have Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia, Slovenia, etc all wrapped in one.
That's a thousand acres of football talents.

Scary thought indeed
Just look @ the abundance of talented players those countries have who ply their trade in the premier league(off the top of ma head names like vidic,ivanovic,modric,kranjcer). I haven't even mentioned La liga,Serie A or the Bundesliga players yet
They would definitely make the quarter finals of the worldcup at the very least.

~Sauron~:

Rubbish!
United's kids won the league in 2005/6. . . . .Arsenal kids are yet to win any title since Wenger started his moronic youth policy he copied from SAF.
I can understand the EPL being a tough task. How come these baby gooners are yet to even win the Carling cup or the FA cup?
Arsenal kids are shyte!!!

Go get a clue Sauron, there were only 2 players in their early 20s you could call kids in the 2006/07 manure squad, Rooney and Ronaldo and how much did they cost Manure combined again? about 40m.
Cesc Fabregas has been one of our major midfield player since before his 19th birthday. Even the so called Fergie's fledglings were in their early 20s (Giggs 23 and the others between 20-22) when they won the league in 95/96, which places them in exactly the same age range as the likes of Diaby and Song if they were to win the league this season.
Only difference I see is that I'm sure they were the youngest players in that squad as no other notable youngsters have come out of the Manure academy since that particular group while we have still got even much younger players appearing in our first team squad like Ramsey and others. Also I recall that particular squad being thumped 4-1 at their direct rivals like Spurs that season, they even started the season with a 3-1 loss at Aston Villa which prompted the quote by Alan Hansen. You write off our youngsters at your peril.

One thing we must stop claiming is 'young' - this side is NOT young. The only portion that may be regarded as being remotely young is a midfield of Song Diaby and Cesc, but not a defence with 2 players over 30 and no player under 23.

Not with a front three which will usually have two players close to thirty (AA23 and Rozzi).

Cesc has said it all - age is no excuse for this team's performance.

I can't wait for the footie to resume - all this idle talk by DK and co has become seriously tiresome.

If saying Arsenal's kids are useless and Wenger have failed gives you the buzz you want, then so be it.

We will soon see if there i truly any quality in the side to win a trophy this season, and afterwards, if waiting for Chamakh (if he comes) and who else we might lose over the summer will be worth it.

But then again, I'm getting ahead of myself - Porto first. . . .hope the boys dispatch them with a clean sheet.

@Debosky
It is not about a single team we put out, it is about our squad as a whole, our players arent really known for staying fit all season anyway. Show me any other team in the premiership that has so far had 10 players 21 years old and younger represent them this season. The only team with an average age younger than ours in the PL is Wolves and everyone can see where they are in the table.
I am not saying this is an excuse for not winning though, just pointing out that the youth policy was a strategic decision by the club when they knew they couldn't compete in the spending stakes with the likes of Manure and chelsea.
If the young boys are good enough, they will still win or at least be thereabouts.

Nah I was referring to the so called 'Low Key' Nations.
We all know teams like Italy,Germany,Brazil,Argentina, England, spain.France e.t.c will always have good players

How can you include England in a list of countries with talents? Did you smoke saw dust as weed

@duduspace,
I think you're shifting the goalposts on this "young" team issue.
First it was 18-21.Now it's below 23.
The core Arsenal side today cannot be termed as "young" as you would want us to believe (i.e. average age of 21)
United fielded the only teenager in that game against Arsenal.Besides,you raise the issue of the "youths" United used in winning the league in 06/07 and how much they cost.I think it's a matter of foresight really.If Arsene really wants to win,money shouldn't really be an object to purchase decent young talent.If Fergie got those players at the price they did and they went on to win the UCL and Premier League in the same season,I think it was worth it in the end.
Besides,the 10 players under 21 (who are they by the way?Maybe Vela and Merida but who are the rest?) could easily be players who have featured in garbage time (i.e. when the games have been won and lost).I do not believe those players are the ones Wenger seriously had in mind to prosecute this season's campaign.If that is the basis of your argument/defence for Wenger and his youth policy,I have to disagree with you.

Gunners eh, how far?

Well well, Dudu holding it down. Youth Policy against Money Policy, so far seems getting finished product has been winning the day. Well who's to say that cant all change in a moment. Anyways season over we will gauge the standings again.

Meanwhile we have a champs league match away to porto to focus on. No Arshavin, maybe maybe-not for Song. Eduardo will be making it back, will be interesting to see who leads the line between him and Bendtner.

Dennilson might make it back to the middle. Chei, see people dey frown. Well i believe Diaby will had stability.

Unto to wednesday jo. Meanwhile Dudu well done oh. But until we show these guys a trophy, we cant say much in fans land oh. Seems its all about bragging rights over there.

duduspace:

@Debosky
It is not about a single team we put out, it is about our squad as a whole, our players arent really known for staying fit all season anyway.

Let's not fudge statistics - you can't really count players who've barely stepped on the pitch for cameo appearances like Wilshire and Eastmond - they've played peripheral roles in our season.

The bulk of this side has been much older, especially in defence, and even attack as well.

Show me any other team in the premiership that has so far had 10 players 21 years old and younger represent them this season. The only team with an average age younger than ours in the PL is Wolves and everyone can see where they are in the table.

It is a pointless statistic in a sense because we know not all of the so called youth players will make it, we carry them for a couple of years then get rid of them - like we did for Hoyte, Owusu-Abieye and Lupoli. 'Youth' indeed.

I am not saying this is an excuse for not winning though, just pointing out that the youth policy was a strategic decision by the club when they knew they couldn't compete in the spending stakes with the likes of Manure and chelsea.
If the young boys are good enough, they will still win or at least be thereabouts.

Spending stakes? We are spending just as much in wages overall, the only difference is in transfer wages - and we spend marginally less than Utd in the summer window, and comparable to Chelski.

The other clubs are NOT going to lie idle and allow Arsenal to take over. . . it won't happen. We've been waiting for years for this 'change' to happen, but it hasn't, while we continue to lose players in the interim and rebuild again and again. If we don't win something to at least hold on to some of these players, we'll ALWAYS be one or two players short.

Eastbay:

@duduspace,
I think you're shifting the goalposts on this "young" team issue.
First it was 18-21.Now it's below 23.
The core Arsenal side today cannot be termed as "young" as you would want us to believe (i.e. average age of 21)
United fielded the only teenager in that game against Arsenal.Besides,you raise the issue of the "youths" United used in winning the league in 06/07 and how much they cost.I think it's a matter of foresight really.If Arsene really wants to win,money shouldn't really be an object to purchase decent young talent.If Fergie got those players at the price they did and they went on to win the UCL and Premier League in the same season,I think it was worth it in the end.
Besides,the 10 players under 21 (who are they by the way?Maybe Vela and Merida but who are the rest?) could easily be players who have featured in garbage time (i.e. when the games have been won and lost).I do not believe those players are the ones Wenger seriously had in mind to prosecute this season's campaign.If that is the basis of your argument/defence for Wenger and his youth policy,I have to disagree with you.

You are putting words in my mouth now Eastbay, I have never said anything about 18-21 (even though the likes of Diaby, Song and Fabregas came into our first team while in that age range anyway, Cesc was already a major squad player at 17) and you totally miss the point about money not being a factor while chasing trophies(try telling that to Portsmouth's fans), all I said was that Manure are welcomed to their trophies because they paid for them, now let them go and carry the can of paying interest on the money they borrowed, We have gone with a different strategy which has taken a period of time to come through but the only amount we owe was spent on our stadium which is now a cash cow able to more than pay for itself.

What Arsene had in mind and what is happening are 2 different issues, Arsene had in mind probably that RVP would play between 25 - 30 games this season but that is not happening is it?

The 10 players under 21 are:

Name             Age                     Starts                Subs

Walcott          20                        6                      9
Merida            20                        4                      3
Ramsey           19                       10                    17
Gibbs              20                        7                     0
Vela               20                        5                     11
Eastmond        19                        4                     2
Traore             20                       11                    0
Coquelin          18                        2                      1
JET                 18                       1                       0
Wilshere           18                       5                       3

Total                                         55                      46

That is a whole lot of appearances in the first team up there and Manure's youth appearances pale in comparison (almost double in starts and over triple in substitue appearances.

Rafael             19              11                0
Danny Welbeck     19              7                        4
Federico Macheda     18      4                        1
Gabriel Obertan     20              5                        6
Fabio Da Silva     19              3                        1

Total                                       30                      12