ilynem:

I do not believe that sir. No one just grows up and becomes gay. Either he his environment plays a part in his choice of He makes the choice himself. Common factor is the word "choice". And if he makes the choice himself, that first trial is always weird for him. That's because deep down he knows it is unnatural. But as he continues, he begins to see it as normal.

how do you know the first experience is always weird? my opinion is not based on hearsay.it is based on experience

spacetacular:


Can you be attracted to anyone without these hormones being activated or present?

I'm not talking about presence or absence, I'm talking about misinterpreted/misreading signals.
It has been evaluated, that and difference in hormone levels. Nothing was found.

spacetacular:


There is always a comparative preference. Not doing it is a preference isn't it? Taking sweets is a preference isn't it?

I also did not say getting paid to have someone stick a phallus in your bum makes you gay....but it's a start. If your will is weak, then it's a start.

taking sweet is preference?
preference to what exactly? zobo? biscuits? eggs?

I think you're just trying to force this into your narrative here

a gay is sexually attracted to same sex instead of opposite sex or is more sexually attracted to same sex than opposite sex

there's NO way I can become more attracted to a man more than I do a woman "by choice" no matter how long it is I keep taking dicks from men or keep giving dicks to men; all I would need is a simple look at a woman and a reset totally happens

Pastafarian:

taking sweet is preference?
preference to what exactly? zobo? biscuits? eggs?

I think you're just trying to force this into your narrative here

a gay is sexually attracted to same sex instead of opposite sex or is more sexually attracted to same sex than opposite sex

there's NO way I can become more attracted to a man more than I do a man "by choice" no matter how long it is I keep taking dicks from men or keep giving dicks to men; all I would need is a simple look at a woman and a reset totally happens

Have you been attracted to a man before sexually?

CatfishBilly:

There is no evidence that exposure has an influence on sexual orientation.
No evidence whatsoever.

Doc? Must you always wait for evidence before concluding? Don't we have minds of our own?

I know you're a scientist but don't you think some evidences are influenced by bias factors also?

Are you saying you can't give conclusions, personal conclusions drawn from your mindset or even observations around you?

Even in research, conclusions are done with the help of hypotheses.

What about your hypothesis and not evidence from elsewhere

spacetacular:

Have you been attracted to a man before sexually?

No!

bennyann:

Are you saying you can't give conclusions, personal conclusions drawn from your mindset or even observations around you?

because that would be only his opinion which is subjective

CatfishBilly:

Nature vs nuture proves it. I've used Arab countries as an example.
The scientific consensus is that Homosexuality and any other sexual orientation is not a choice backed up by research evidence, so you can make your inferences from this statement.

Just because they kill gays in the middle east proves nothing. Drug dealers are killed in many countries, but there are still drug dealers. Where they born with it? Let's come home. Any thief caught in the market is usually burnt alive. But people still steal in the markets almost every day. So that's not a point.

CatfishBilly:

I'm not talking about presence or absence, I'm talking about misinterpreted/misreading signals.
It has been evaluated, that and difference in hormone levels. Nothing was found.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3138231/

My opinion is echoed there. Like I always say, it's my opinion.

spacetacular:


Well in both men and women there are hormones that cause attractions called testosterone and oestrogen and by extension, Oxytocin and Vasopressin.

Misinterpreted hormonal signals lead to wrong emotional feelings.

Homosexuality to me is not genetic but a hormonal misinformation or misreading.

If I remember my biology right, it is called hormonal imbalance. I know pretty well what hormonal imbalance can do.

Now since we NOT fully in charge of how hormones are released in our body, Can we now say homosexuality is abnormal but they (homsexuals) should be treated as 'normal' since they are not in charge of their hormonal system?

Can this be treated medically?

Pastafarian:
No!

Then how would you know if you would think outside this attraction if per chance you eventually are?

spacetacular:


Then how would you know if you would think outside this attraction if per chance you eventually are?

I already gave a narrative that shows I have no such tendencies

you can peruse this post

https://www.nairaland.com/3814113/future-photos/9#56801237

bennyann:






Are you sure you aren't confused?

Darling, I am an open-minded person. I argue with people here not to win (there is no price) but to learn. If you present superior arguments, I will agree and change my position. That's it

ilynem:

Just because they kill gays in the middle east proves nothing. Drug dealers are killed in many countries, but there are still drug dealers. Where they born with it? Let's come home. Any thief caught in the market is usually burnt alive. But people still steal in the markets almost every day. So that's not a point.

drug dealing and stealing are totally different

drug dealers became that strictly for the Money and feel the risks involved are worth it, almost all drug dealers would stop if it becomes legal, certain countries have effectively gotten rid of drug dealers by legalising the drugs

thieves also risk it for the money/materials only AFAIK


but homosexuals prefer same sex partner to opposite sex partner, I see no reason someone would suddenly "chose" to "prefer" that if that's not the case

and to buttress that, there are straight people that are ready to carry out homosexual acts for the money too

spacetacular:


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3138231/

My opinion is echoed there. Like I always say, it's my opinion.

It's your opinion. I respect that.
In the conclusion of the article, it is written that their findings suggest that hormones play a role.
It's not conclusive.
I've also come across research that negates the position of the article, I can't find it now.
So, even if it's because of hormones, that still doesn't make it wrong, if it's wrong, that means all cases of hermaphroditism both true and pseudo should be classified as a mental disorder.

onyenze123:


If I remember my biology right, it is called hormonal imbalance. I know pretty well what hormonal imbalance can do.

Now since we NOT fully in charge of how hormones are released in our body, Can we now say homosexuality is abnormal but they (homsexuals) should be treated as 'normal' since they are not in charge of their hormonal system?

Can this be treated medically?

Of course the homosexual as a person is "normal" his actions are not. It could be able to treated in the future since its still being studied and that is if the LGBT community stop their interference.

Going by natural law and reason, it is clear enough that homosexuality is highly unreasonable.
Clear reasoning reveal to us what is or isn't appropriate. That's why you sometimes think about justice before you decide to do something unjust. That's why you can sometimes keep yourself in check when certain thoughts like harming someone else occur to you while angry. That's why you may find it irritating to behave or talk in certain ways sometimes.. Clear unbiased reasoning make these things clear!



That's why a man who wants to live Unclad is not allowed to roam about free but rather kept at rehab.
That's why people who love to take drugs such that they can't do without it are referred to as addicts and treated as such.
That's why chauvinism is not accepted in the conventional society but rather disapproved.

Why then should homosexuality be accepted?
Is it natural? Clearly Not! How do I know? Well, based on natural laws, the following determine the sex of any human being:
(i) Chromosomal factors; (ii) Gonadal factors (i.e. presence or absence of testes or ovaries); (iii) Genital factors (including internal sex organs); (iv) Psychological factors.

These are the natural factors that makes sex between a male and a female the acceptable norm. A man can not be qualified to marry a man based on these scientific requirements. Neither is a woman naturally qualified to marry another woman.
If these were to be, abuse of the body is inevitable.
Obviously, nature designs sex to be between opposite sexes. Anything contrary then is abnormal and really an abuse of human kind [even as Bible puts it].
When a boy or a man begins to be sexually attracted to another boy or man, then he shouldn't be treated differently from the psychiatric hospital patients.. A woman attracted to another woman sure needs to see the psychologist. Why? Reasonably, Naturally and Logically, it is not normal.

CatfishBilly:

It's your opinion. I respect that.
In the conclusion of the article, it is written that their findings suggest that hormones play a role.
It's not conclusive.
I've also come across research that negates the position of the article, I can't find it now.
So, even if it's because of hormones, that still doesn't make it wrong, if it's wrong, that means all cases of hermaphroditism both true and pseudo should be classified as a mental disorder.

I am also studying it which was why I made bold to say it was my opinion.

If it's found to really be a hormonal disorder then indeed it's a disorder of sorts and those hormones are found in the brain. So no point being angry if referred to as a mental disorder.

Hermaphroditic qualities in animals do not have to mean it must be so with man. So to animals it could be seen to be normal because they need it to survive, Man does not.

Pastafarian:
drug dealing and stealing are totally different

drug dealers became that strictly for the Money and feel the risks involved are worth it, almost all drug dealers would stop if it becomes legal, certain countries have effectively gotten rid of drug dealers by legalising the drugs

thieves also risk it for the money/materials only AFAIK


but homosexuals prefer same sex partner to opposite sex partner, I see no reason someone would suddenly "chose" to "prefer" that if that's not the case

and to buttress that, there are straight people that are ready to carry out homosexual acts for the money too

Same way people go into homosexuality for the pleasure they derive from it. For them, the love for the act or their partner is worth the risk. Comprende?

ilynem:

Same way people go into homosexuality for the pleasure they derive from it. For them, the love for the act or their partner is worth the risk. Comprende?

the pleasure which they apparently can't derive from straight sex

comprende

spacetacular:


I am also studying it which was why I made bold to say it was my opinion.

If it's found to really be a hormonal disorder then indeed it's a disorder of sorts and those hormones are found in the brain. So no point being angry if referred to as a mental disorder.

To the best of my Knowledge​, testosterone and oestrogen have no receptors in the brain, except for feedback inhibition on the pituitary gland, so I don't still see why they should be classified as mental disorders.

gonna be busy for a while, I'll reply my mentions when I'm back

Pastafarian:

the pleasure which they apparently can't derive from straight sex

comprende

How can a "normal" person not derive pleasure from same sex? Anus or vagina which holds better sensory stimulation? For lesbians what's difference between the fingers or tongue of a man or woman? Is the Love Machine better or different from a phallus?

That's why I said "in my opinion " I believe it's all shades of error.

CatfishBilly:

To the best of my Knowledge​, testosterone and oestrogen have no receptors in the brain, except for feedback inhibition on the pituitary gland, so I don't still see why they should be classified as mental disorders.

I do not have to spell it out for you sir. We both know that without the gonadotropin-releasing hormone (GnRH), which is produced by the hypothalamus testosterone would not exist. So ultimately the source of testosterone is from your hypothalamus which secretes GnRH. Which was why I said "the brain".

spacetacular:


Of course the homosexual as a person is "normal" his actions are not. It could be able to treated in the future since its still being studied and that is if the LGBT community stop their interference.

probably.

This is what I found online:

"Three techniques for identifying the cause of, and then eliminating, homosexuality has been described: surgical techniques, use of hormones, and prenatal research. Each derives from the belief that biology is destiny"

This have been tried in the past, it didn't work. something is not right somewhere.

spacetacular:


I do not have to spell it out for you sir. We both know that without the gonadotropin-releasing hormone (GnRH), which is produced by the hypothalamus testosterone would not exist. So ultimately the source of testosterone is from your hypothalamus which secretes GnRH. Which was why I said "the brain".

Fair enough.
So, that we are clear, if it is found that an abnormality in the hypothalamic-pituitary-testis/ovary axis of sex hormones or any misreading of signals, then it's safe to say that it's a mental disorder?

onyenze123:


probably.

This is what I found online:

"Three techniques for identifying the cause of, and then eliminating, homosexuality has been described: surgical techniques, use of hormones, and prenatal research. Each derives from the belief that biology is destiny"

This have been tried in the past, it didn't work. something is not right somewhere.

It confirms my theory. However is still work in process.

CatfishBilly:

Fair enough.
So, that we are clear, if it is found that an abnormality in the hypothalamic-pituitary-testis/ovary axis of sex hormones or any misreading of signals, then it's safe to say that it's a mental disorder?

It's a hormonal disorder but the actions are grouped under mental disorder. We know it's a hormonal disorder but due to its many variants it's safer to classify them as mental disorders with sub groupings under non psychotic

This the point I grab my popcorn and listen to my two favourite doctors

spacetacular:


It's a hormonal disorder but the actions are grouped under mental disorder. We know it's a hormonal disorder but due to its many variants it's safer to classify them as mental disorders with sub groupings under non psychotic

Wouldn't​ it be normal to be grouped under endocrine disorders since the etiology is hormonal?
There are so many hypothalamic-pituitary-testis/ovary axis sex hormone disorders with mental health implications that are still classified under endocrine​ disorders.
Are there any other endocrine disorders that are classified under mental disorders?

CatfishBilly:

Wouldn't​ it be normal to be grouped under endocrine disorders since the etiology is hormonal?
There are so many hypothalamic-pituitary-testis/ovary axis sex hormone disorders with mental health implications that are still classified under endocrine​ disorders.
Are there any other endocrine disorders that are classified under mental disorders?

Do not feel bad at the choice of word (mental disorder)

The mind is the seat of decision making so when the hormones are in error it would affect ones decisions mentally or cause a conflict in decisions that's why it's a mental disorder. It does not mean they are insane. Just that they have an impaired decision making process which results in an act known as homosexuality or LGBT.

spacetacular:


Do not feel bad at the choice of word (mental disorder)

The mind is the seat of decision making so when the hormones are in error it would affect ones decisions mentally or cause a conflict in decisions that's why it's a mental disorder. It does not mean they are insane. Just that they have an impaired decision making process which results in an act known as homosexuality or LGBT.

Like you earlier stated, it's your opinion.