sadism - are you saying the parents gain pleasure from scarring their children?

dayokanu:

Ok Now to the grandfather of all beatings. September 9 1995 (Ojo buruku esu gbo mimu)

I was attending JAMB lessons in prepararion for the UME held on December 2 1995. I would usually get to lessons like 3pm and hang around smooching girls in empty classes until its like 5pm. When I would go for classes by then the already quiet class would erupt into cheers since i was the ringleader of the troublesome students The queer thing was that I was still the smartest in the class. The teachers reported me that i was a disruptive influence and the lesson co-ordinators told me to stop attending and even detailed a gateman to make sure I dont come into the premises. One of our neighbours daughter went home to tell her parents who in turn informed mine.

My dad heard and drove me to the lesson co-ordinators house who told him how bad I was.

Got back home and my dad changed his trousers to shorts in readiness for the epic flogging,  he had 4 canes at home then, He locked me in the room and started after like 2hrs all the canes were worn out and broken. My mom was banging on the door shouting but he wont listen.

after the canes were finished he went to get electric cables (Nigerian wire and cable those thick grey coloured cables. He kept a sack or wires at home for emergency electrical repairs) When my mom saw him carrying the sack of cable to where I was, she attempted to wrestle him and he shove her aside. And my Part 2 of the ordeal started with those cables. In the meantime my mom ran to some of his friends house to get them to stop the beating by the time his friends came back It was already over an hour of cable beating and cables dont wear out.

It took his friends to stop him, they pleaded with him in the name of everything . I couldnt get up for a while, I was like 3 times fatter cos all my body was swollen, The next day was Sunday I couldnt go to church. My mom came to the room, She was also crying and brought the bible and she was ministering to me that she believed the devil was using me. After that, she said every morning before I bathe, I should read Psalm 3 into the water I would use to bath and pray everyday.

When my father came the next weekend. He told me to get a paper and write an undertaking that I would be of good behaviour. I wrote it and he kept it in my file (He had a file for everyone of us which contains all our academic progress from nursery 1). In my undertaking, I deliberately wrote "i would be of good behaviour till I get to university". And he was like "you intend to turn bad after you get into University?" and I got a quick 6 strokes

It was like a week before I could walk properly and for months after the scars were still all over me, My friends in school noticed some black lines on my skin like 4 months after when the scars were healing and they knew what was up.

That was the last major beating I got.

are u sure u are not exageratting? this is pure, undiluted abuse!!! 3 hours beating? jeeezuz!!!

olybaby50:

My parents did all the wrong(s) this world could endure, But today i realized they only made me a better person
When i think of my dad. The thing i remember about him becomes countless.
All the same i give thanks to them cause i would have learnt the hard way
Mum and Dad! Thanks for every and God bless (R.I.P)*2

there's always the possibility that you are what you are  in spite of all this rather than because of it

i'm very sure the babangida's husseins etal got plenty of discipline as kids

bawomolo:

sadism - are you saying the parents gain pleasure from scarring their children?

12 strokes of the cane? fair enough. but 200?  

discipline by boiling water?

its no longer about punishment imho  

just sayin' and like i said no offense intended

shadrach77:

are u sure u are not exageratting? this is pure, undiluted abuse!!! 3 hours beating? jeeezuz!!!

When I hear ppl complaining that they were beaten with belt, Asked to pick a pin, Stool down, Kneel down I just wish those were the kind of punishment i got.

I was certain that the beating of April 1993 was over 100 cos It was structured. 60 first day, 24 second day and 12 third day. That doesnt include bonus strokes.

On September 9 1995 I lost count but I was sure it was well over 120

Hmmm I like this topic,
I agree with some people on here that most of what our parents did was because of their own insecurities but primarily out of love.
My folks were never comfortable with any of my friends they dont know their parents, no footie, and girls was a serious no-no.

@ dayo kanu >>> i feel your pain >>> my broda  >>> take comfort in knowing that i was 4 when u were getting the big stick >>>
my version was to come 5 years later >>> funny though  >>> the beating which was quite similar to yours but not as bad >>> and it was over how i beat my younger brother on the street >>> right after a 'family forum' 

what sort of struck me was that it was about that period (can't remember d details b'cos i was so, & still am, young) i got a major beating

The story:

my dad used to buy assorted stationeries (and, as i now realize, wares to sell) from India_he was into importing
he had a particular store where he kept them >>> one day, he was lookin for a nylon which had something tha was apparently important
he called me & asked me whether i took it >>> i replied in the negative >>> after searching with occasional suspicious glances at me
he decided i was guilty of stealing the nylon & proceeded to flog me >>> my mom had to intervene & advised him to check properly
the place where he kept it >>> The 'stolen item' happened to be there; neatly concealed between other goods in the store
he smiled at me, told me that he was sorry & gave me coke to drink & got my mom to prepare me pounded yam with chicken 
the flogging had been delivered, the sorries were said but then >>> the damage was done
my foray into the thing called lying started

some similarities between your dad & mine in their flogging methodology

*you get to lie down & get flogged with periodic interruptions during which you're advised
*they flogged with canes, cables, koboko, broom e.t.c >>> anything that could really inflict pain
*they believed what they were doing was 'right'

so many instances of what my dad did that was wrong >>> but now with, my mom late & my dad rendered invalid (due to partial stroke) >>> me taking on responsibilities e.g handling family finances  >>> i realize that i did, do & still will love my parents despite their wrongs

whither i'll flog the children i'll have or not >>> i'll prefer to adopt a 'wait & see' posture

.

Uyi Iredia:

@ dayo kanu >>> i feel your pain >>> my broda   >>> take comfort in knowing that i was 4 when u were getting the big stick >>>
my version was to come 5 years later >>> funny though   >>> the beating which was quite similar to yours but not as bad >>> and it was over how i beat my younger brother on the street >>> right after a 'family forum'  

my foray into the thing called lying started

some similarities between your dad & mine in their flogging methodology

*you get to lie down & get flogged with periodic interruptions during which you're advised
*they flogged with canes, cables, koboko, broom e.t.c >>> anything that could really inflict pain
*they believed what they were doing was 'right'

Glad to see someone who shared a similar experience. Some people wont believe it when i tell it but I think mine was more because I was the first born, and the first boy. the 2 after me were girls and couldnt be beaten that much so all my dad's energy were concentrated on me.

I wasnt beaten with a broom though because there is some form of superstitition attached to it in Yorubaland.(Beating a male child with a broom)

My dad tried to explain later(Which i termed as an apology) but you know its un-African for parents to apologize and admit wrong doing

I even remember one (Which i think was outrageous). I borrowed a novel from the school library and my dad saw it lying around.

He invited me to his room.

Dad: I saw one Novel who is the owner.

Me: I borrowed it from the school library.

Dad: In your library do they have Physics, Chemistry and Maths textbooks, I mean book that related to your studies.

Me: *Sensed trouble was coming* Yes they do.

Dad: You couldnt borrow any of those but only Novels.

Me: *Quiet* (Murmurs and steady myself for the impeding assault)

Suddenly a cane sprung up from nowhere and I received some lashes (Though those were not the usual stuctured lying down it was more like stretch out your hand and receive the cane. When my hand wasnt streching well he got up to reach other parts of my torso.

After like 10mins.

Dad: (yelling) Now get out of my sight and let me see you another time with any useless and irrelevant Novel and I trudged out.

(_{Ko to so wipe wa ya iyakuya, O ma se oju emi ati iwo ninu ile yi}) Before you turn into a bad child, you would have to contend with me first in this house

Let us learn from this thread so that we do not pass it on to our kids

Mine was anytime we have fever or headache and needed some medication
My Dad will go to the bush and get the akum shorup peel it
grind it and gave it to us to drink that instead of buying panadol


He will give us medication to swallow without water and
sometimes force us to chew it even if it is chroloqiune that itches and taste very bitter

Not these days that kids have there medications all coated with sugar

Dayokanu, my questions appears to go unanswered.  

ElRazur:

Dayokanu, my questions appears to go unanswered.

You mean would I beat my kids? I dont think I would or whats your question

I think it was more on page 9 or so. Your dad apologising (or was it something along the lines of making him see the error of his ways). I was just wondering if it gave you a relief that's all.

Na wa o. Dayo you did not faint after that marathon trashing? What a resilient boy!!!

ElRazur:

I think it was more on page 9 or so. Your dad apologising (or was it something along the lines of making him see the error of his ways). I was just wondering if it gave you a relief that's all.

Actually The setting was like this he was sitting and he called me. I was standing there in my usual posture looking down, hands to the back when he now told me to go get a chair and sit beside him

He was just giving me the story of his life how he had to struggle for everything.

His own parents were illiterates and they lived in the North wanted him to be a lorry boy but he came downsouth at age 9 to hustle for himself, He did every menial job from hawking to Houseboy that he atimes ate food worshippers of their family masquerade brought as sacrifice

while training himself in school The story long wella.

He doesnt want us to go through what he went through that was why he was hard/harsh on us.

After he gave me an assignment to go look up Freedom/Independence in the dictionary and write a two page essay on the advantages and disadvantages of Freedom. And for me to conclude if Freedom was a good thing or Not.

Relief? I couldnt be bothered at that time, I was actually bidding my time to leave the house and be on my own. All he said I didnt respond. I just sat there and was nodding.

I just understood were he was coming from that was all. And he assumed that his training methods were perfect because it worked out well for me, I always excelled at academics because I felt that was the easiest and fastest way for me to leave home.

And that was a major reason why schooling in UNILAG and UI was a No No to me. Too close to home

Obviously those that feel they had better will turn their noses up!
That is what I loathe about Nigerians. Yes your parents were so perfect and gave you hugs and kisses everyday!
Now shut it and choke on it. We are here to talk about those of us that were whooped.

Elrazur, as much as i sympathize with you i think you are assuming that your situation is indicative of the average nigerian parent. It really isnt. My father was a very strict disciplinarian but it was NEVER IN DOUBT how much this man loved each one of his sons. The same man who would not hesitate to lasso you with nepa cables would be the first to sell his shirt off his back just so we could eat, attend the best schools, defend you to the death in public. The same man who just finished calling you an  would be the first to go outside there and tell his friends how you were the best child that ever lived. My youngest brother doesnt have many stories like this to tell, infact i think my dad only ever touched him no more than 10 times all his life and that was because over the yrs my dad learnt that excessive flogging didnt make me any better than i would have ended up. and guess what, that same brother of mine gave my parents the worst headache. My dad used to proudly tell his friends how of all his sons, i was the one he can most vouch for to keep safe and do the right thing even in the absence of parental monitoring. The day i will never forget was the day my dad unreservedly apologised in tears for the way he treated me growing up . . . i understood him to a point, its hard to learn to love if you never had parents to show you love growing up urself.

He may have been a bad guy in some aspects . . . perhaps even abusive in some cases but he taught me to be a man, to be responsible, to NEVER settle for second best (at the pain of nepa cables) . . . if i were to choose another father - i know who i'll have thanks.

Now to address your points . . .

The thing with the bible is that is says to beat (well not use the word beat, but it is clear what the message is about) but at what point does beating becomes abuse? My dad was a Senior Apostle, knows the bible like the back of his hand but sometimes when I reflect on some his beating session on me, I tend to think it is nothing but abuse at best. Is it okay to beat and leave massive mark, scare or deformities, just because the bible support physical discipline? Where does it stop?

I have permanent scars on my arms and cheek (most have faded now) from excessive flogging . . . but is that enough reason for me to say i will never chastise my son? No way . . . the fact that it is VERY EASY to walk all over a mother is enough to tell me there is no substitute for a father's cane. My uncle is diff, he flogs his kids but he NEVER does it in anger . . . he waits a few days until he is calm, beats you and then gently tells you the reason and warns you not to try it again.

That some choose to fall into the abuse category does not mean flogging is wrong.

As for kids throwing tantrum, come on now woli. Kids will always be kids. Surely at your time you threw a few episode of it. I think this is why I get worried, your view is somehow not taking into consideration that kids will be kids simply because of your unshaken belief in the words of the bible.

A tantrum excused today does not innocently disappear, it simply reinforces in the child that somehow, bad behaviour has no consequences.

Now the amount of anger and aggression you've expressd here is, in of itself, very worrying. You definitely do need counselling

The above was from Tensor77 . . .

The way some folks think they can diagnose you from barely 3 sentences on this forum is amazing. Anger, aggression . . . where? Just by simply quoting 3 passages TAKEN FROM THE BOOK OF PROVERBS? And exactly why is my position worrying to you? Dont worry, i wont be in a position to discipline ur kids.

I know some family friends whose parents were so lenient, they would come over to our house and make fun of us each time we were disciplined. Today when i look back at them . . . i am eternally grateful for my father's anger and aggression. Without it i may have ended up like them . . . a calm, laissez faire attitude to parenting obviously didnt do them much good afterall. Too late.

dayokanu:

Ok Now to the grandfather of all beatings. September 9 1995 (Ojo buruku esu gbo mimu)

I was attending JAMB lessons in prepararion for the UME held on December 2 1995. I would usually get to lessons like 3pm and hang around smooching girls in empty classes until its like 5pm. When I would go for classes by then the already quiet class would erupt into cheers since i was the ringleader of the troublesome students The queer thing was that I was still the smartest in the class. The teachers reported me that i was a disruptive influence and the lesson co-ordinators told me to stop attending and even detailed a gateman to make sure I dont come into the premises. One of our neighbours daughter went home to tell her parents who in turn informed mine.

My dad heard and drove me to the lesson co-ordinators house who told him how bad I was.

Got back home and my dad changed his trousers to shorts in readiness for the epic flogging,  he had 4 canes at home then, He locked me in the room and started after like 2hrs all the canes were worn out and broken. My mom was banging on the door shouting but he wont listen.

after the canes were finished he went to get electric cables (Nigerian wire and cable those thick grey coloured cables. He kept a sack or wires at home for emergency electrical repairs) When my mom saw him carrying the sack of cable to where I was, she attempted to wrestle him and he shove her aside. And my Part 2 of the ordeal started with those cables. In the meantime my mom ran to some of his friends house to get them to stop the beating by the time his friends came back It was already over an hour of cable beating and cables dont wear out.

It took his friends to stop him, they pleaded with him in the name of everything . I couldnt get up for a while, I was like 3 times fatter cos all my body was swollen, The next day was Sunday I couldnt go to church. My mom came to the room, She was also crying and brought the bible and she was ministering to me that she believed the devil was using me. After that, she said every morning before I bathe, I should read Psalm 3 into the water I would use to bath and pray everyday.

When my father came the next weekend. He told me to get a paper and write an undertaking that I would be of good behaviour. I wrote it and he kept it in my file (He had a file for everyone of us which contains all our academic progress from nursery 1). In my undertaking, I deliberately wrote "i would be of good behaviour till I get to university". And he was like "you intend to turn bad after you get into University?" and I got a quick 6 strokes

It was like a week before I could walk properly and for months after the scars were still all over me, My friends in school noticed some black lines on my skin like 4 months after when the scars were healing and they knew what was up.

That was the last major beating I got.

and i thought my father was bad! 

One day in 1995, a friend lied that i stole his pencil - now if there is anything my father can stand, it certainly is NOT a thief.

The man came back at night, got his thin wire, undressed me down to pata and flogged the hell out of me. After i had to carry a cement block on my head until his friend came and begged for me. I was so unlucky because my mom was on night call that day. It wasnt until she came back that i was able to finally go to sleep . . .

I think i must have sat on the bed all night because the pain was so much and the clothes stuck to the bloody scars.  Turns out the claim was a lie . . . i confronted my father many yrs later . . . he felt so bad when he found out it was only a prank and he fell for it.

Now its quite interesting that this worst beating also occured in Sept 1995. Perhaps our fathers were coordinating it.

wow omo to dun, your case is certainly more serious.

Omo to dun( Sweet man it means right?) That is something else really! What does this say about men and their ways?
How are we in this generation going to be better if we continue to follow in their footsteps?

Men and all the atrocities they've done.

chika98:

Omo to dun( Sweet man it means right?) That is something else really! What does this say about some men and their ways?
How are we in this generation going to be better if we continue to follow in their footsteps?

Some Men and all the atrocities they've done.

there, i fixed it for you.

This thread is still going?!!  

@ElRazur, Thanks for starting this Bro!!

Dani1luv, Oyb, Seun; You all need to make this Thread sticky or something.

OR

If you can get aisha2 or someone with a political/humanitarian bent to do some organizing. I'm willing to support them. let's get something signed, sent to the National assembly and pushed right here on Nairaland. Even if we don't succeed, we can try. This is how people start Social revolutions.

The Child right laws we have in Nigeria are just too weak with little political will to enforce them(the enforcers were raised like that too  

Like oyb, ujujoan and several people asked; How do we enforce discipline without abusing kids like these?

We need answers to that question. It is too vital to ignore it. Like I mentioned earlier, I believe it goes to the heart of why our society is the way it is.

I don't know if it's the cause or just the symptom of; our reluctance to challenge authority, our "unreasonable" ability to stomach socio-political abuse and still smile. Our constant production of heartless, clueless, I-don't-care-what-you-gon-do-about-it leaders just makes you wonder it these harsh methods are the cause.

We have work to do, else our kids will come on their generation's Nairaland and say all these all over again. Hopefully we will get our own Freuds and Maslows to give us ideas and our Mary Slessors to push it before then.

If you don't believe Dayokanu's stories, just count yaself lucky.

Several kids are still living like that as we type. I remember my own beatings like yesterday. Including keeping your own 'koboko' safe and secured so it doesn't get lost,, because you have to produce it when it's time to get the beatings. If my father ask for it and you can't find it then you are going to get a stronger more painful one. Imagine keeping you own weapon of oppression in good shape ?!

I love some aspects of my culture, But we need to push against some of these cultural nonsense, else we are helping our oppressors keep their weapon of oppression in good shape.

Yes, a lot our parents showed us love and some of them will die to provide for their kids even after beating those kids into a pulp.

BUT

I still believe we can find better ways to raise children while maintaining discipline, some parents did it well in Nigeria and raised disciplined children, but I believe Majority just follow the beat-them-down method because they don't know how else to do it.

omo_to_dun:

 I admit that not all men are like that back home, but a lot are. An evil side of me just wakes up whenever I see a man maltreating a woman. And in most cases, these men are weak. I'm not talking about slapping, or shoving, or even mild punches(not that these are any good); I am talking about slave beating. In the early nineties, I remember vividly when my dad beat my mom on christmas so bad that she had to undergo a surgical operation, word! But I am grateful though. My girl is still alive. I just wish I could have done more, instead of crying.

I say this to all women: please, get an education(or learn a trade or anything else) and do not rely on a man, else, you may be taken advantage of. He may not physically abuse you, but there's a great chance that he'll abuse his power. That was my mom's lot. She was fully dependent on him. As a man, the first thing I look for in a woman is independence; if you don't have it, at best, we'll have s#ex, then I'll politely tell you to leave my house. Come back when you can stand on your feet. Don't get my wrong, there are some people who will take good care of their spouses, even if they are dependent on them. But my philosophy is borne out of my sad childhood experience. In the US, whenever I see a wife beater going to jail, or prison, my heart rejoices, because weak men belong in prison. And my African brothers, I do not intend to paint us in a bad picture; however, the truth must be told, some Nigerian men are just animals, and it'll be good if we can have laws to protect our women.

Two thumbs up!

davidylan:

there, i fixed it for you.

It is definitely more than some. Let's be realistic here.
Even the crap we read here on NL and how people view marriage and all.

I remember a neighbor back that who will beat his wife all the time.
This time around she caught him with her sister red handed and the guy beat her so bad that she woke everyone up!

Men ran up there to see what was going on and they told him " Send her back to her parents if you don't want her anymore"
" She is someone else's daughter" and you can't believe what he said " Well she isn't owned by anyone so even if I kill her no one will miss her!"

Kilode?!:




If you can get aisha2 or someone with a political/humanitarian bent to do some organizing. I'm willing to support them. let's get something signed, sent to the National assembly and pushed right here on Nairaland. Even if we don't succeed, we can try. This is how people start Social revolutions.

The Child right laws we have in Nigeria are just too weak with little political will to enforce them(the enforcers were raised like that too  

Like oyb, ujujoan and several people asked; How do we enforce discipline without abusing kids like these?

We need answers to that question. It is too vital to ignore it. Like I mentioned earlier, I believe it goes to the heart of why our society is the way it is.

I don't know if it's a cause of just a symptom; Our reluctance to challenge authority, our "unreasonable" ability to stomach socio-political abuse and still smile, our constant production of heartless, clueless, I-don't-care-what-you-gon-do-about-it leaders just makes you wonder it these harsh methods are the cause.

We have work to do, else our kids will come on their generation's Nairaland and say all these all over again. Hopefully we will get our own Freuds and Maslows to give us ideas and our Mary Slessors to push it before then.

If you don't believe Dayokanu's stories, just count yaself lucky.

Several kids are still living like that as we type. I remember my own beatings like yesterday. Including keeping your own 'koboko' safe and secured so it doesn't get lost,, because you have to produce it when it's time to get the beatings. If my father ask for it and you can't find it then you are going to get a stronger more painful one. Imagine keeping you own weapon of oppression in good shape ?!

I love some aspects of my culture, But we need to push against some of these cultural nonsense, else we are helping our oppressors keep their weapon of oppression in good shape.

Yes, a lot our parents showed us love and some of them will die to provide for their kids even after beating those kids into a pulp.

BUT

I still believe we can find better ways to raise children while maintaining discipline, some parents did it well in Nigeria and raised disciplined children, but I believe Majority just followed the beat-them-down method because they don't know how else to do it.

lagos already banned child flogging, and quite a few nigerians dont support such a law.

and as for wife beating, dont see what can be done about that in nigeria.

chika98:

It is definitely more than some. Let's be realistic here.
Even the crap we read here on NL and how people view marriage and all.

I remember a neighbor back that who will beat his wife all the time.
This time around she caught him with her sister red handed and the guy beat her so bad that she woke everyone up!

Men ran up there to see what was going on and they told him " Send her back to her parents if you don't want her anymore"
" She is someone else's daughter" and you can't believe what he said " Well she isn't owned by anyone so even if I kill her no one will miss her!"

1. Since the word "some" does not refer to a definite number or proportion, how do you figure out that the number of abusive men is definitely more than some? Does your 1 example out of millions of married nigerian men indicate most or quite a lot of nigerian men abuse their wives?

2. The "crap" you read up here on marriage is just that . . . crap. If we were to believe everything we read up here then all of us are RICH, SUCCESSFUL, BUSY with real life and HONEST to a fault. Now we know all that is false. That pple post "crap" does not mean they necessarily practice that in real life.

tpiah:


lagos already banned child flogging, and quite a few nigerians dont support such a law.

and as for wife beating, dont see what can be done about that in nigeria.

Yea Tpiah, thanks for the heads-up, I read that great news earlier, I have also read portions of the Child right laws we have in Nigeria.

You and I know these laws are as good as the will to enforce them. But I get you, we are trying.

But, the Intellectual or social foundation under them are more important than the laws on paper.

We can't just copy and paste laws into our psyche, we need to see why they are important and enforce them with great will.

As we speak, only about 24 or 25 states have passed the child right bill as state laws, there are still hold-out states like Bauchi, Borno, Enugu, Sokoto and others. I know it is not easy to change people's long-held cultural and religious beliefs, but we have to keep trying.