Galatians 2:8
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles

Peter calling has a focus . Pauls calling has a focus. Paul would not judge the ministry of Peter and James even though he didn't agree with all their teachings. And he would not allow their teaching in his own ministry .but he was mature enough to recognise the different callings. But didn't happen over night. Paul tried to reach everybody

1 Corinthians 9:19-23
19 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. 20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; 21 To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law. 22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. 23 And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.

As much as he tried , paul couldn't reach all. He was rather walking against the plan of God. But after making several futile attempt to reach the Jews which he wasn't sent to reach, he realised that a man has to abide in his own calling.

1 Corinthians 7:20-24
20 Let every man abide in the same calling wherein he was called. 21 Art thou called being a servant? care not for it: but if thou mayest be made free, use it rather. 22 For he that is called in the Lord, being a servant, is the Lord's freeman: likewise also he that is called, being free, is Christ's servant. 23 Ye are bought with a price; be not ye the servants of men. 24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God.

It took paul some years to realise the truth.it shouldn't take you years to realise. Let's learn from the apostles .As  we tear each other apart. We give the devil right to distract us.

I believe in posterity, you don't
I believe in healing you don't
You believe everyone has a demon I don't.
I believe in tithing , you don't .
I believe in make up you don't
I believe in dancing, you don't
I believe in clapping hands only , you don't
You believe in speaking in tongues I don't. . . .

The list is endless. Teach your convictions  back it up by scriptures . But don't tear your brother apart. It's a fight that no one can win. It is rather Satan that wins against the church when we fight fleshly worldly fight.

Romans 14:2-8
2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs. 3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him. 4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. 6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks. 7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself. 8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.

The same way it is today. It is possible to be called of God to minister among peasants and identify with their state just to reach them . It is a choice.  So certain people can take the sacrifice of denial of comfort for the sake of the gospel. but such ministers can't make bigger impact on global scale in a generation. But they will receive the praise of christ at the judgement seat for their focus. John the baptist was only a signboard just to point out the messiah to the people. Yet he was the greatest of all prophets.

On the other hand, It is possible to be called to reach out to the World on global scale. Some people are called to reach out to the criminals and gangsters. I remember reading the missionary book CROSS AND THE SWITCHBLADE as a young christian. How a missionary left the city to minister to the gangsters. If I see a christian man having purple hair and earrings and yet making impact among the hippies and gangsters, I may not approve of his appearance. But I should not judge him. Because I may not have boldness to enter the house of gangsters,I should commend the guy that take such initiative.

Some others need to reach out to the nobles , and they have to be wealthy enough to be recognised and be listened to. They had to fly first class in the plane.

The problem we have today that Satan is using to distract us is the fact that those who are supposed to function among the peasants are busy criticising those who are ministrying in palaces.  Everyone should focus in his call. The question you should ask yourself is  " WHAT IM I DOING WITH MY LIFE FOR JESUS."?  Judging and criticism is not one of Gods callings.

Romans 14:12-13
12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God. 13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

Apostle paul made himself a celibate ,denied himself marriage  And Jesus also did not marry, some  ministers in our time also may not marry. But every christian minister should not be judged by the sacrifice of another.

Matthew 19:12-13
12 Some are born without the ability to marry, and some are disabled by men, and some refuse to marry for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven. Let anyone who can, accept my statement."
.
Let's leave men of God alone . We sin as we judge unknowingly. Let the master who knows better thsn us all be the judge Let's focus on how to reach the world for Jesus  in our differences, revelations and ability.  Criticism can give us that good religious feeling of "IM HOLIER THAN THOU" but is not a calling. It is against christ.

We saw live on TV how the president knelt down before pastor ADeboye. Would he have knelt down before a road side preacher? Certainly not. God has positioned such men to influence the world on the bigger scale. The peasant preacher can't do that. But he can be very effective in the creeks and villages and slums. But he shouldn't judge Elijah and Jeremiah for going to the government house and talking to the king. It's on judgement day we know who is who before God. The peasant preacher will be rewarded for his focus . Others will be rewarded for their focus. So let's be focused .
Some are  okada minister, some are taxi ministers, some are luxurious bus ministers ,some are national ministers and some are international global ministers.

GOD BLESS YOU!!!!!!

"Let everyone be fully persuaded of their own mind"

well said joagbaje
nice thread

@Joagbaje

Nice try! Things must be getting bad for you prosperity charlatans.

You attempt to explain away the fraud committed by you 419 charlatans as mere differences in the christian family. This is nonsense - what you charlatans preach and defend is FRAUD.

You want us to accept that a pastor buying a plane(s) in the midst of poverty in his own congregation is a mere difference of understanding of the scripture - it is NOT, it is downright fraud and wickedness.

You want us to keep quiet Benny Hinn, T B Joshua, Oyaks etc are faking miracles ? Why ? Who is going to speak up for the vulnerable ?

You want us to keep quiet when Ashimolowo says we should give him dollars in Ghana ? We should keep quiet when he says we should sow a seed for a 24 hours miracle ?

If our arguments were about 'What day is Sabbath' or something along those lines - your posting would make sense. However we are talking about FRAUD commited by your 419 charlatans in the name of God - I am afraid there can be no negotiation on my part. Anyone who defends these guys is either a victim or an aspiring fraud himself.

you said

We saw live on TV how the president knelt down before pastor ADeboye. Would he have knelt down before a road side preacher?

This is just silly talk - the only people who compare to the 419 pastors is our politicians whose actions led to vast numbers of people putting their faith/lives in prosperity charlatans in the first place. Jonathan kneeling down in front of Adeboye does not prove anything!!

Furthermore are you now prepared to admit you lied about raising someone from the dead ? Until you do, you can not and should not be taken seriously.

^^^^
I would not really want to respond to your likes , but let me ask you a question? You you preach the gospel to people . Do you lead people to christ? .

@Joagbaje

No, I personally dont preach the gospel to people - so I dont lead people to Christ. There are many others that do.

Like I said in my earlier post - until you recant your lies about raising a dead person and apologise for posting the picture of a naked man (to prove you helped him to hospital) you cannot and should not be taken seriously.

You defend frauds like Oyaks, Joshua and Eddie Long - that makes you are a fraud yourself.

The message you guys preach has destroyed and is still destroying millions of lives - it is despicable.

EarsWide:

@Joagbaje

You want us to accept that a pastor buying a plane(s) in the midst of poverty in his own congregation is a mere difference of understanding of the scripture - it is NOT, it is downright fraud and wickedness.
You want us to keep quiet Benny Hinn, T B Joshua, Oyaks etc are faking miracles ? Why ? Who is going to speak up for the vulnerable ?
You want us to keep quiet when Ashimolowo says we should give him dollars in Ghana ? We should keep quiet when he says we should sow a seed for a 24 hours miracle ?

so what if oyedepo bought planes, what if ashimolowo told to give in dollars, so what if TB Joshua and Pastor Chris do miracles
so what if,
how does it affect you
you have being on this your parade for God knows how long and yet things get better for them
Instead of you to go and think about your life and how to get better and more productive, you sit on the net to try to preach what you don't know
if you like shut up, if you like don't but you will wear out one day soon

@Mabell, you said

so what if oyedepo bought planes, what if ashimolowo told to give in dollars, so what if TB Joshua and Pastor Chris do miracles
so what if,
how does it affect you
you have being on this your parade for God knows how long and yet things get better for them
Instead of you to go and think about your life and how to get better and more productive, you sit on the net to try to  preach what you don't know
if you like shut up, if you like don't but you will wear out one day soon

The part in bold 'how does it affect you' sums up your lack of understanding of christianity.

I am not being personally defrauded by Josua, Chris and co but there are millions who are - what happens to these people. Remember 'Love your neighbour like yourself' ?

@Topic,
On issue of doctrine or belief I might just keep quiet but if it bothers on deceit, fraud and manipulations by so called MOG's, I will speak. Thank God for cyberspace the launch pad of the 21st century revolutions .

mabell:

so what if oyedepo bought planes, what if ashimolowo told to give in dollars, so what if TB Joshua and Pastor Chris do miracles
so what if,
how does it affect you
you have being on this your parade for God knows how long and [b]yet things get better for them[/b]Instead of you to go and think about your life and how to get better and more productive, you sit on the net to try to preach what you don't know
if you like shut up, if you like don't but you will wear out one day soon

Things get better for them while mabell and most of the congregation continue to sow seeds, pay tithes, love offerings, peace offerings, anointing blessing and kuli kuli offering while hopping on Okadas and harrasing okada men who just want their due with their "soul winning".

I bet when chris gets his G4 and flies to Cape Town en route to New York, Mabell will be somewhere hopping off an okada while pestering the f_ck out of the okada man with her babbling preaching.

SirJohn:

@Topic,
On issue of doctrine or belief I might just keep quiet but if it bothers on deceit, fraud and manipulations by so called MOG's, I will speak. Thank God for cyberspace the launch pad of the 21st century revolutions .

Well the thread is about focus on Gods objectives and dealing doctrinal differences .

Leave men of God alone?


Because they are more special than the rest of Us?



Would you have left Pastor Odulele alone after finding out he is molesting Kids in your church?

Would you have left him alone if he had molested your innocent son?

@ears wide

EarsWide:

@Joagbaje
No, I personally dont preach the gospel to people - so I dont lead people to Christ. There are many others that do.

.Every believe has the primary responsibility of reaching sinners and getting them saved. If you embrace the real purpose of reaching sinners for christ, you will do well. Than embarking on a futile crusade of criticism .

Like I said in my earlier post - until you recant your lies about raising a dead person and apologise for posting the picture of a unclothed man (to prove you helped him to hospital) you cannot and should not be taken seriously.

The girl was raised from the dead dude. And I helped the other guy to have his life back. And I have hundreds of cases and testimonies to God . I don't think you believe in miracles in the name of Jesus . What other proof do you want?

The message you guys preach has destroyed and is still destroying millions of lives - it is despicable.

what is this message ? Thanks

If you guys can't handle the diversity of this site and are expecting a monopoly where guys will continue to go un-challenged,

Why don't you open up your own WEBSITE?

What about Yookos?  I'm sure nobody will challenge your ideals there.


But the objective of the site is for[b] EVERYBODY[/b] to air their views.

@Joagbaje

you said

Every believe has the primary responsibility of reaching sinners and getting them saved. If you embrace the real purpose of reaching sinners for christ, you will do well. Than embarking on a futile crusade of criticism .

So you think only people who personally preach the gospel have a right to point out fraud - you are a joker Mr Jo.

The girl was raised from the dead dude. And I helped the other guy to have his life back. And I have hundreds of cases and testimonies to God . I don't think you believe in miracles in the name of Jesus . What other proof do you want?

You did NOT raise anyone from the dead. YOU ARE A LIAR AND A FRAUD.
If you did raise her from the dead why was is this not publicized by CEC - or does raising from the dead happen so often in your church that it is no longer news ?
On the CEC website there are testimonies about healing from cancer, back pain etc yet nothing about an incredible raising from the dead.
You are a charlatan Mr Jo - and a crap one at that.

what is this message ? Thanks

The message that says if you sow a seed (money) you always get a monetary return.
The message that says good christians will ALWAYS be healthy and rich.
The message that says it is alright for the pastors to have private jets while the congregations are dirt poor.
The message that encourages you to give 10% of your income to the church even when you dont have enough to live on.
The message that says it is alright to curse your enemies.
The message that allows charlatans like you to parade themselves as pastors.

@Joagbaje,

beloved brother, I also agree we are not here to put each other down or condemn our fellow brethren.

The most important thing to GOD amongst others is living a life that is free from the corrupting influences of sin, satan and the world, and also that as many as believe should be converted.

However we are also here to combat false doctrine which is prevalent in the organised physical church system of these latter days.

Please do not take it personal, I am personally not attacking you or any other person for that matter.

We are fighting against false doctrine.

God bless you.

Joagbaje:

Some others need to reach out to the nobles , and they have to be wealthy enough to be recognised and be listened to. They had to fly first class in the plane.

Oga Jo, you can't be serious . Your post was making some bit of sense till i got to this bit

Joagbaje:

We saw live on TV how the president knelt down before pastor ADeboye. Would he have knelt down before a road side preacher? Certainly not. God has positioned such men to influence the world on the bigger scale. The peasant preacher can't do that. But he can be very effective in the creeks and villages and slums. But he shouldn't judge Elijah and Jeremiah for going to the government house and talking to the king.

Elijah the prophet that was sustained by Ravens hanging out with Kings in government house so you see Jo, a prophet don't need to be wealthy/large to hang out and preach to big boys GEJ kneeling before Adeboye was politics, nothing more

frosbel:

However we are also here to combat false doctrine which is prevalent in the organised physical church system of these latter days.

Please do not take it personal, I am personally not attacking you or any other person for that matter.

We are fighting against false doctrine.

Thank you jare

@Mr Jo

I am PERSONALLY attacking you - you are a liar.

You did NOT raise anyone from the dead.

EarsWide:

@Joagbaje

No, I personally dont preach the gospel to people - so I dont lead people to Christ. There are many others that do.

Like I said in my earlier post - until you recant your lies about raising a dead person and apologise for posting the picture of a unclothed man (to prove you helped him to hospital) you cannot and should not be taken seriously.

You defend frauds like Oyaks, Joshua and Eddie Long - that makes you are a fraud yourself.

The message you guys preach has destroyed and is still destroying millions of lives - it is despicable.

@Earswide,
This is a big eye-opener. So you would rather specialise in leading people away from Christ?
Common, get a life now.
The same bible you read says He has given us the commission to make disciples of all nations and preach the word but you are comfortable to make the bolden statement and much more you sit down behind your computer screen and make mockery of the efforts of others that do?
Ha! All I can tell you is that God will ask that day that what did you do with what he gave you.
I would rather you pray that you have a good response to it.
This is a big pity. Sincerely,

You claim to go after 'the charlatans', have you thought it wise to compose an email of all your convictions and send it to these men since quite a number have their emails on their websites? When Paul rebuked Peter, did he do that to his followers or he went to face him directly? Why have you not done this, why are you taking up the task of the devil?

Earswide, whether they are right or wrong, fake or real, what have you done to your fellow brother and how are you fulfilling the great commission.
You would rather take the easier way of tearing down since you cannot build up. What value are you adding to the body of Christ? You have not won a soul for Christ but it is easier to castigate people doing the work?
May God have mercy on you.


@Joagbaje,
You have said it all. Lot of things going on in the churches today show to tell us that we are not perfect but we cannot live on an island, we need to love, pray rebuke people directly if need be.
I hope all those things people have said here against all these men can be said to their faces.
A lot of criticisms people give show that they do not understand and even when they do, there are always better ways of doing things.
May God help us o, let us focus on our purpose.

Zikkyy:

Oga Jo, you can't be serious . Your post was making some bit of sense till i got to this bit

Elijah the prophet that was sustained by Ravens hanging out with Kings in government house so you see Jo, a prophet don't need to be wealthy/large to hang out and preach to big boys GEJ kneeling before Adeboye was politics, nothing more

Thank you, Bro,


To those who keep quoting the Bible, remember how Ahab was scared of Elisha because he always told him the truth concerning the state of Israel?

Can anyone say that about our current religious leaders?

Joabaje, let's leave aside doctrines.

With the way pews are filled every Sunday, why is there so much corruption in Nigeria? How do ladies dance in clubs on Saturday night, then after party in Church the next day?

"Let everyone be fully persuaded of their own mind"

@Mr Jo 'I can raise dead poeple' Agbaje

Can I have your full address please ? Many people will like to come to you so you can raise their dead relatives.

Oh I forgot - you raised the dead girl remotely. 

spamdare:

If you guys can't handle the diversity of this site and are expecting a monopoly where guys will continue to go un-challenged,

Far from it. I love to be challenged. As long as we dwell on the bible.

Why don't you open up your own WEBSITE?
What about Yookos?  I'm sure nobody will challenge your ideals there.
But the objective of the site is for[b] EVERYBODY[/b] to air their views.

My admonition is to my fellow christian . What I taught is based on the word. I don't know if you're born again. Any spiritual knowledgeable person will understand my exhortation.

Snowwy:


@Joagbaje,
You have said it all. Lot of things going on in the churches today show to tell us that we are not perfect but we cannot live on an island, we need to love, pray rebuke people directly if need be.
I hope all those things people have said here against all these men can be said to their faces.
A lot of criticisms people give show that they do not understand and even when they do, there are always better ways of doing things.
May God help us o, let us focus on our purpose.

Thanks snowy , you are always an inspiration. Spiritually mature people like you are rare.

@Mr Jo 'I can raise dead people' Agbaje

By the way, does the remote raising from the dead only work on MTN or does it work across networks ? 

Mr Jo, you are a clown, one thing I will give you is that you provide comic relief. Keep it up 

^^^^
Are you born again? And what is your concept of salvation?

@Joagbaje,
Like i always say, the inspiration is from the word of God.
Keep labouring in the vineyard of the Lord and leave those that do not preach the word, help the needy or sow to their ignorance.
Afterall, the Lord God is the judge.

One thing I commend you for is that you back a lot of your statements with scripture and this will never make you ashamed.

I pray the Lord will give us the grace to run the race set before us and help us grow and develop more in Him.

@Snowy

you said

One thing I commend you for is that you back a lot of your statements with scripture and this will never make you ashamed

How will Jo back up raising someone from the dead via SMS with scriptures ? 

@Mr Jo 'I can raise dead people' Agbaje

you said

Are you born again? And what is your concept of salvation?

I will tell you what I know is NOT salvation:

1) Giving money to the church, because I expect a reward
2) Giving money to the church, so that the pastors can ride in a private jet and luxury cars
3) Praying for my enemies to die
4) Going to church because I want to see signs and wonders
5) Accepting every lie told by the 419 charlatans.

Regarding salvation, I like to think it is down to two things

1) Loving God
2) Loving your neighbour like yourself.

If we follow these two simple yet difficult concepts then our salvation is assured.

Salvation certainly does not include people believing that a charlatan like you is able to raise dead people.

^^^^

Absolutely, that's all we need to do :

1) Loving God
2) Loving your neighbour like yourself.

You see because it is quite a narrow path to follow, some people must come up with other outward manifestations that have nothing to do with God , but pamper the flesh to continue in sin and make excuse for wickedness.

The truth is that false prophets abound and their diabolical doctrines and lies must be exposed.

However I would personally advice we do not attack in a rude way some of the false prophets but submit them to God and deliver their flock from bondage.

spamdare:

Leave men of God alone?
Because they are more special than the rest of Us?
Would you have left Pastor Odulele alone after finding out he is molesting Kids in your church?
Would you have left him alone if he had molested your innocent son?

This thread is not about crime. If a man commits a crime . He should face the music legally. Either he be a man of God or man of the devil. This thread us about Walls of doctrinal diferences in the churches lack of tolerance of others based on doctrines .

@Frosbel,
Loving God and our neighbour is all we need to do like you say.
However, do you know what loving God entails or loving our neighbour?
Jesus narrowed it down to two commandments but a lot springs forth and this is what true christians do today.
Calling people names (when you do not know all information required) does not constitute loving your neighbour, backbiting and slandering does not include loving your neighbour, bearing false witness does not include loving your neighbour.
Loving God entails following his commandments, laws and words and it is a lot o, we need God's grace and mercy.