mzilakazi:

You are lying my Friend. Withdrawal can be done for political reasons, relieve or as a result of overwhelming pressure from international community and is not dependent on whether defeat was looming or not. Retreat is something else, it can either be strategic for reinforcement purposes or maneuverable as in when your forces have been overpowered and taking to their heels. The difference between the two is that withdrawal is always seem to be permanent in contrast to retreat which always is temporary. Many jurnos do not know how to differentiate between the two and use the two words interchangeably without knowledge unless the writer is a war journalist who also happened to be soldiers in their lifetime.

on a second thought,i think that i'll have to agree with you,however,withdrawal when used in context of resistance from a more powerful foe,equals retreat,and retreat means conceding gained grounds{except its a tactical maneover of course},germany nearly won.

EVarn:

oh
.
.
my
.
.
God ! ! ! !
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like seriously?,what is the difference between withdrawing and retreating or even conceding?!,all are moves made by the military when facing superior and overwhelming firepower....perhaps you need to be lectured on military matters,please tell me where you live in SA.
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.
even your compatriot,mzilakazi,bowed before my superior analysis,so why forment such lies?
.
.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Withdrawal_(military)

A withdrawal is a type of military operation, generally meaning retreating forces back while maintaining contact with the enemy. A withdrawal may be undertaken as part of a general retreat, to consolidate forces, to occupy ground that is more easily defended, or to lead the enemy into an ambush. It is considered a relatively risky operation, requiring discipline to keep from turning into a disorganized rout or at the very least doing severe damage to the military's morale.

The term retreat is mostly miss used. The correct term is rout

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rout

A rout is a chaotic and disorderly retreat or withdrawal of troops from a battlefield, resulting in the victory of the opposing party, or following defeat, a collapse of discipline, or poor morale.

A routed army often disintegrates into of "every man for himself" or sauve qui peut as the survivors flee for safety. A rout often results in much higher casualties for the retreating force than an orderly withdrawal. On many occasions, more soldiers are killed in the rout than in the actual battle. Normally, though not always, routs either end a battle or provide the moment the winner needs to win decisively a battle (or even campaign).

EVarn:
on a second thought,i think that i'll have to agree with you,however,withdrawal when used in context of resistance from a more powerful foe,equals retreat,and retreat means conceding gained grounds{except its a tactical maneover of course},germany nearly won.

Germany threw divisstions at 1 SA infantry brigade and dropped so many shells there only 1 tree survide. They inflect well past 70% cassulties on the SA forces and only got a nearly won. Many SA solders simply ran out of ammo and either withdrew or got captuerd. But the fact is the SA brigade held the woods untill relvied even after suvering losses well beyond that of what a fighting force is expected to survive.


People have this bad misconcepstion on withdrwaing. There is nothing wrong with withdrawing. Routing is a problem.

andrewza:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Withdrawal_(military)
A withdrawal is a type of military operation, generally meaning retreating forces.A withdrawal may be....a general retreat
The term retreat is mostly miss used. The correct term is rout
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rout
A rout is a chaotic and disorderly retreat or withdrawal of troops from a battlefield, resulting in the victory of the opposing party, or following defeat, a collapse of discipline, or poor morale.
A routed army often disintegrates into of "every man for himself" or sauve qui peut as the survivors flee for safety.

in your own words you said "a withdrawal may be a general retreat".let me lecture you:
.
.
there are two types of withdrawal;
(a)the tactical withdrawal- this is when troops withdraw force from a place in order to reinforce,restrategize or frustrate the opponent into making a field blunder.
.
.
(b)retreat- this is when troops are facing superior opponents and are in risk of being routed.

bidexiii:
. Wow I can't imagine someone just said this !!! Nigerian soldiers fought bravely in the WW1 and WW2 ; a very good example is the jungle battle"burma" where nigerian troops deafeted the jepanese and send them on there heels!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8201717.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8344170.stm

Secondly all I see are pronganda pictures you've edited except for few ones that I saw "white soldiers" they may be SA soldiers or not ! All your captured tanks,mines and artillery are mere internet pictures may be you will do better by giving me links !

Come and visit our war museum that's where you will see them.

andrewza:

Germany threw divisstions at 1 SA infantry brigade and dropped so many shells there only 1 tree survide.They inflect well past 70% cassulties on the SA forces and only got a nearly won.Many SA solders simply ran out of ammo and either withdrew or got captuerd.But the fact is the SA brigade held the woods untill relvied even after suvering losses well beyond that of what a fighting force is expected to survive.
People have this bad misconcepstion on withdrwaing. There is nothing wrong with withdrawing. Routing is a problem.

we are saying the same thing love,in your words,you said"they{germany} inflected over 70% casualties on SA force"...."many soldiers ran out of ammo and simply withdrew or were captured"- which means germany nearly{perhaps already} won!....you also said : "people have bad misconception about withdrawing,there is nothing wrong with withdrawing"-well,tell that to your fellow saffers who dont know the difference between tactical maneover and "fleeing"

EVarn:
in your own words you said "a withdrawal may be a general retreat".let me lecture you:
.
.
there are two types of withdrawal;
(a)the tactical withdrawal- this is when troops withdraw force from a place in order to reinforce,restrategize or frustrate the opponent into making a field blunder.
.
.
(b)retreat- this is when troops are facing superior opponents and are in risk of being routed.

And in the case of France the SA forces did both. Though the brige has a whole only did one.

Hence SA did not retreat. Sure a few solders here and there did. But when germany invaded France in WW2 there where cases where germany forces all so retreted. In fact the french CHA2B tanks out gunned and armoured the german tanks and could did force germans forces to retreat. But the battloins, brigads, divstion and Army groups has a whole never retreated.

EVarn:
we are saying the same thing love,in your words,you said"they{germany} inflected over 70% casualties on SA force"...."many soldiers ran out of ammo and simply withdrew or were captured"- which means germany nearly{perhaps already} won!....you also said : "people have bad misconception about withdrawing,there is nothing wrong with withdrawing"-well,tell that to your fellow saffers who dont know the difference between tactical maneover and "fleeing"

Because many times the Nigerians are routed or forced to withdraw from a major stragic objective. And Nigeria is fighting BH sa fought Germany.

I all so tend to keeping my mocking on this very thread, but even here I await the fully story.

I mean I could start mocking at how Nigeria lost another attack chopper in a fatal crash. But instead I will say NAF is run by morons for waisting money on buying one of the best transport choppers in a VIP transport role.

Facts about how SA defeated Germany in Nambia.


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/South-West_Africa_Campaign

Facts about how SA repelled German forces invasion.


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kakamas

EVarn:
on a second thought,perhaps i will have to agree with you,however,withdrawal when used in context of resistance from a more powerful opponent,equals retreat,and when you retreat{withdraw} from a place,you concede the territory gained throughout the campaign.

Not in high mobility warfare where the focus is on the disruption of the enemy center of gravity and not on attrition or te holding of territory

Some interesting reading
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Center_of_gravity_(military)

andrewza:


And in the case of France the SA forces did both. Though the brige has a whole only did one.

Hence SA did not retreat. Sure a few solders here and there did. But when germany invaded France in WW2 there where cases where germany forces all so retreted. In fact the french CHA2B tanks out gunned and armoured the german tanks and could did force germans forces to retreat. But the battloins, brigads, divstion and Army groups has a whole never retreated.

Caen counter attack is an example of the Germans retreating

rommel only managed to stop it with his last battery of artillery acting as AT guns

patches689:



Augustus the only source you have that says that the FH77B has a max range of 42km says that it is only achieved at high altitude

And he gives a different standard max range of 30km


So, are you saying that your only source rant says that the FH77B has a max range of 40km is a charade?

Are you saying the only source is a fallacy?

Ok, I agree. We can then consider theax range of the FH77B to be 30km

Congratulations on destroying your own argument and the only source that supports your claims.

Nope, TWO different reliable sources....

1. Indian army

2. America based website, Army guide website

.

I quote the same source as agaugust which proves that G6 can fire up to 67 km.




http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product1207.html

agaugust:



Nope, TWO different reliable sources....

1. Indian army

2. America based website, Army guide website

.

That's a lie, the official Indian army says maximum range is 30 km.


http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORCES/Equipment/Artillery/354-155mm-Bofors-Fh-77b.html

patches689:


Dude, I am not your tutor. I am not here to address your lack of education

It is clear you lack reading comprehension skills as well, because no one is talking about cold air. We are talking about altitude.

you are the only one here talking about temperature, because you cannot comprehend the argument or the (basic) laws of physics at play here.

Don't worry though, I don't blame you for your complete ignorance and utter lack of basic knowledge or general knowledge. I blame your countries education system.

I shall explain again (since your simple mind cannot grasp such basic concepts, and much like one training a dog, we shall have to do this many times)

- At high altitude air is less dense

- Less dense air provides less resistance and less drag

- This means projectiles retain kinetic energy for longer

- This means they travel further, like the shell of a FH77B

You not understanding something doesn't make me crazy, it just makes you poorly educated

Now I must ask, how much longer will you continue to embarrass yourself and waste our time?

I set a trap for you and you have fallen inside it

Less dense air begins immediately you go up from sea level, at every metre or feet you go up, even at 100 metres air is less dense, so the effect of less dense air should also affect artillery guns on a city just 500m above sea level, it does not only happen at mountain height.

Prove to me that at 500m in many African cities, the less dense air effect does not help increase artillery range

Also prove to me that the definition of high altitude meaning of the Indian army analysis is only 2.6km high mountain, the army captain did NOT mention any particulat height, and the most of Africa off the coast is about 500m to 8km high including ordinary cities and Kilimanjaro mountain ranges.

At high altitude, there is less dense air because there is far less oxygen to breathe, so how do they soldiers survive at that level of high altitude where the air gets less dense, so at the great altitude where the density of air reduces so much, human beings cannot survive for long as the soldiers will have much less oxygen to breathe and they will die.

So how does an army deploy to that great altitude and the soldiers stay there in position to fight without enough oxygen for survival ?


"Altitude and weather systems : As you go higher, the air's pressure decreases from around 1,000 millibars at sea level to 500 millibars at around 18,000 feet.

Effects of lower density on humans :

If you go high enough, either by climbing a mountain or going up in an airplane that does not have a pressurized cabin, you will begin feeling the effects of lower air pressure and density.

As air pressure decreases oxygen continues to account for about 21% of the gasses in the air as it does at sea level. But, there is less oxygen because there is less of all of the air's gasses. For instance, by the time you go to 12,000 feet or 3.6km the air's pressure is about 40% lower than at sea level. This means that with each breath you are getting about 40% less oxygen than at the lower altitude.


http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/weather/wdensity.htm

@Patches, your artillery gunners will die of shortage of oxygen by the time you get to where the altitude air is so less dense that your shell range will increase by extra 40%, that is almost half of the original range is added like magic !

Fool
.

agaugust:



Nope, TWO different reliable sources....

1. Indian army

2. America based website, Army guide website

.

Your second "source" is quoting the stats for the FH77 B05 L52

The FH-77 B05 L52 enables a range of 40 plus km to be achieved with standard base bleed projectiles. It is fitted with an integrated navigation, positioning and aligning system and onboard ballistic computation.

That same "source" clearly states that the maximum range, for the FH77B using advanced HEER base bleed is 30km.
http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product4673.html

So are you simply incompetant or were you trying to mislead the forum again?

agaugust:



I set a trap for you and you have fallen inside it

Less dense air begins immediately you go up from sea level, at every metre or feet you go up, even at 100 metres air is less dense, so the effect of less dense air should also affect artillery guns on a city just 500m above sea level, it does not only happen at mountain height.

Prove to me that at 500m in many African cities, the less dense air effect does not help increase artillery range

Also prove to me that the definition of high altitude meaning of the Indian army analysis is only 2.6km high mountain, the army captain did NOT mention any particulat height, and the most of Africa off the coast is about 500m to 8km high including ordinary cities and Kilimanjaro mountain ranges.

At high altitude, there is less dense air because there is far less oxygen to breathe, so how do they soldiers survive at that level of high altitude where the air gets less dense, so at the great altitude where the density of air reduces so much, human beings cannot survive for long as the soldiers will have much less oxygen to breathe and they will die.

So how does an army deploy to that great altitude and the soldiers stay there in position to fight without enough oxygen for survival ?


"Altitude and weather systems : As you go higher, the air's pressure decreases from around 1,000 millibars at sea level to 500 millibars at around 18,000 feet.

Effects of lower density on humans :

If you go high enough, either by climbing a mountain or going up in an airplane that does not have a pressurized cabin, you will begin feeling the effects of lower air pressure and density.

As air pressure decreases oxygen continues to account for about 21% of the gasses in the air as it does at sea level. But, there is less oxygen because there is less of all of the air's gasses. For instance, by the time you go to 12,000 feet or 3.6km the air's pressure is about 40% lower than at sea level. This means that with each breath you are getting about 40% less oxygen than at the lower altitude.


http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/weather/wdensity.htm

@Patches, your artillery gunners will die of shortage of oxygen by the time you get to where the altitude air is so less dense that your shell range will increase by extra 40%, that is almost half of the original range is added like magic !

Fool
.

Why are you argueing? It is a well known fact the higher you go the farther you can shoot due to air densty. The efects at 500m are far less than at 2000m above sea level.

patches689:


Dude, I am not your tutor. I am not here to address your lack of education

It is clear you lack reading comprehension skills as well, because no one is talking about cold air. We are talking about altitude.

you are the only one here talking about temperature, because you cannot comprehend the argument or the (basic) laws of physics at play here.

Don't worry though, I don't blame you for your complete ignorance and utter lack of basic knowledge or general knowledge. I blame your countries education system.

I shall explain again (since your simple mind cannot grasp such basic concepts, and much like one training a dog, we shall have to do this many times)

- At high altitude air is less dense

- Less dense air provides less resistance and less drag

- This means projectiles retain kinetic energy for longer

- This means they travel further, like the shell of a FH77B

You not understanding something doesn't make me crazy, it just makes you poorly educated

Now I must ask, how much longer will you continue to embarrass yourself and waste our time?

I know you will say that, and I am just working you up from low altitude cold to high altitude, now chew on this :

[size=14pt]

Okay, so all army equipment used by the soldiers at high altitude lands, that is all artillery shells, RPG, missiles, and rifle bullets will travel with extra range increase of 40% ?

So, a surface to surface missile with 30km range, fired at sea level on low altitude grounds, will h.it target at 42km because @Patches new law of Physics has increased it's range at high altitude by extra 40% automatically ?

@Patches, during the fight on the Himalayas mountains, all rifles like AK-47, etc fired while deployed on your high altitude will have it's bullet travel extra range and increase from 400m to about 560m ? Right ?

Now show us a source to prove that, because we cannot see any military source that talks about these magical extra 40% increase in weapons range that will make Nigerian army Grenade launcher range to increase from 2.2km to over 3km !!!! Wow !!!

Please show us a source to prove this because ONLY PATCHES is saying it, prove it now !

.[/size]

agaugust:



I set a trap for you and you have fallen inside it

Less dense air begins immediately you go up from sea level, at every metre or feet you go up, even at 100 metres air is less dense, so the effect of less dense air should also affect artillery guns on a city just 500m above sea level, it does not only happen at mountain height.

Prove to me that at 500m in many African cities, the less dense air effect does not help increase artillery range

Also prove to me that the definition of high altitude meaning of the Indian army analysis is only 2.6km high mountain, the army captain did NOT mention any particulat height, and the most of Africa off the coast is about 500m to 8km high including ordinary cities and Kilimanjaro mountain ranges.

At high altitude, there is less dense air because there is far less oxygen to breathe, so how do they soldiers survive at that level of high altitude where the air gets less dense, so at the great altitude where the density of air reduces so much, human beings cannot survive for long as the soldiers will have much less oxygen to breathe and they will die.

So how does an army deploy to that great altitude and the soldiers stay there in position to fight without enough oxygen for survival ?


"Altitude and weather systems : As you go higher, the air's pressure decreases from around 1,000 millibars at sea level to 500 millibars at around 18,000 feet.

Effects of lower density on humans :

If you go high enough, either by climbing a mountain or going up in an airplane that does not have a pressurized cabin, you will begin feeling the effects of lower air pressure and density.

As air pressure decreases oxygen continues to account for about 21% of the gasses in the air as it does at sea level. But, there is less oxygen because there is less of all of the air's gasses. For instance, by the time you go to 12,000 feet or 3.6km the air's pressure is about 40% lower than at sea level. This means that with each breath you are getting about 40% less oxygen than at the lower altitude.


http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/weather/wdensity.htm

@Patches, your artillery gunners will die of shortage of oxygen by the time you get to where the altitude air is so less dense that your shell range will increase by extra 40%, that is almost half of the original range is added like magic !

Fool
.

That is a cool story

I see I have now educated you about air density. You can thank me later.

Max range of the Bofors in standard operating conditions is 30km... according to your own source.

And again, since the G5 and G6 outrange you at standard altitude, they will outrange you at high altitude

agaugust:



I set a trap for you and you have fallen inside it

Less dense air begins immediately you go up from sea level, at every metre or feet you go up, even at 100 metres air is less dense, so the effect of less dense air should also affect artillery guns on a city just 500m above sea level, it does not only happen at mountain height.

Prove to me that at 500m in many African cities, the less dense air effect does not help increase artillery range

Also prove to me that the definition of high altitude meaning of the Indian army analysis is only 2.6km high mountain, the army captain did NOT mention any particulat height, and the most of Africa off the coast is about 500m to 8km high including ordinary cities and Kilimanjaro mountain ranges.

At high altitude, there is less dense air because there is far less oxygen to breathe, so how do they soldiers survive at that level of high altitude where the air gets less dense, so at the great altitude where the density of air reduces so much, human beings cannot survive for long as the soldiers will have much less oxygen to breathe and they will die.

So how does an army deploy to that great altitude and the soldiers stay there in position to fight without enough oxygen for survival ?


"Altitude and weather systems : As you go higher, the air's pressure decreases from around 1,000 millibars at sea level to 500 millibars at around 18,000 feet.

Effects of lower density on humans :

If you go high enough, either by climbing a mountain or going up in an airplane that does not have a pressurized cabin, you will begin feeling the effects of lower air pressure and density.

As air pressure decreases oxygen continues to account for about 21% of the gasses in the air as it does at sea level. But, there is less oxygen because there is less of all of the air's gasses. For instance, by the time you go to 12,000 feet or 3.6km the air's pressure is about 40% lower than at sea level. This means that with each breath you are getting about 40% less oxygen than at the lower altitude.


http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/weather/wdensity.htm

@Patches, your artillery gunners will die of shortage of oxygen by the time you get to where the altitude air is so less dense that your shell range will increase by extra 40%, that is almost half of the original range is added like magic !

Fool
.

@Agau, your understanding of science is up to scratch. On the mountains there are trees and plants which give away oxygen and it does not mean that at high altitudes there is no oxygen at all even though we know that it is less. Hence, the birds can survive while they are still in the sky.


Beside, a raised surface such as mountains will always have oxygen upon which it will rest. Hence, it is not a hollow where oxygen molecules will keep on descending. The soil on it own has oxygen.

agaugust:



I know you will say that, and I am just working you up from low altitude cold to high altitude, now chew on this :

[size=14pt]


Okay, so all army equipment used by the soldiers at high altitude lands, that is all artillery shells, RPG, missiles, and rifle bullets will travel with extra range increase of 40% ?

So, a surface to surface missile with 30km range, fired at sea level on low altitude grounds, will h.it target at 42km because @Patches new law of Physics has increased it's range at high altitude by extra 40% automatically ?

@Patches, during the fight on the Himalayas mountains, all rifles like AK-47, etc fired while deployed on your high altitude will have it's bullet travel extra range and increase from 400m to about 560m ? Right ?

Now show us a source to prove that, because we cannot see any military source that talks about these magical extra 40% increase in weapons range that will make Nigerian army Grenade launcher range to increase from 2.2km to over 3km !!!! Wow !!!

Please show us a source to prove this because ONLY PATCHES is saying it, prove it now !

.[/size]

The laws of physics dictate that less dense air = longer trajectories due to higher terminal velocity achieved due to lower drag and resistance

Look at the two graphs

Do you notice something?

Whats next, you want me to prove gravity?

And I didnt say it increased by 40% for everything, your source said that high altitude increased range by 40%

Again, just because you dont understand something doesnt mean I have invented a new law of physics, it means that you havent been properly educated in basic physics.

Patchesagain:


The laws of physics dictate that less dense air = longer trajectories due to higher terminal velocity achieved due to lower drag and resistance

Look at the two graphs

Do you notice something?

Whats next, you want me to prove gravity?

Again, just because you dont understand something doesnt mean I have invented a new law of physics, it means that you havent been properly educated in basic physics.

That's a free education from South Africans.

mzilakazi:



@Agaugust, truly your mind is messed up. I do not believe that you have studied physics at high school. In science and geography I was taught that air is less dense in high altitudes than in low altitudes. Moreover, I was equally taught that cold air is heavier than hot air, the reason is dependent on the molecules of air which tend to expand and move faster in high temperature. On the contrary, molecules of air tend to be compressed in low temperatures, making the air more heavy.

However, the composition of air is made of molecules of N2: H2: O2 etc and the heaviest of them being Oxygen. The oxygen as an element has a mass of 16 in periodic table, hence, if we were to do stoichiometry to calculate the molecular mass of oxygen (O2) we will have 16+16=32. So, oxygen has a molar mass of 32g/mol which appears to be heavier than other molecules of composition of air. So, you see how easy it is for air above our roof to be lighter than the one we normally breathe. Irrespective of the temperature, the status core will remain where the upper air will always be lighter than the lower air anywhere in the world. The density of air in Nigeria might differ with that of Russia because of temperature, but the common aspect will be that at altitude the air will always be slightly lighter in both countries but with different densities. It can never be that the density of air is the same in Russia from low grounds to high altitudes.


Well, I can see that you have drawn an example by using a missile and unwittingly seem to have forgotten that surface to surface missiles have a massive thrusting force due to their engines. Their engines can only drive them to a certain distance and shut down but the good thing is that they can be upgraded to extend the range if you have the competent engineers and technicians. That is something that artillery shells lack, since their range are merely dependent on the type of ammunition, charges and altitude. SA, however, has a new modern shells called VLAP which are similar to missiles and can reach the range of over 70 km at a faster speed than normal shells.

Lastly, I will recommend you to get your science skills in action and stop reasoning like a baby. This does not change the fact that G6 is superior than FH77B and it had always been and will always be.

Waste of time, I too have posted sources that say air is less dense at altitude, but I also posted the balancing other side that says cold air is heavier and reduces the speed/range of objects travelling through it, golf balls travels slower and lesser distance on cold days when the air is heavier.

My physics is very good and backed up with sources.

Your South African physics is internet copy and paste of theories of physics, you don't know the applied physics for practical effects and I am your teacher here, get it ?

.

mzilakazi:
I quote the same source as agaugust which proves that G6 can fire up to 67 km.


http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product1207.html

Problem is that SANDF has on 38km range shell.

CASE CLOSED
.

agaugust:



Waste of time, I too have posted sources that say air is less dense at altitude, but I also posted the balancing other side that says cold air is heavier and reduces the speed/range of objects travelling through it, golf balls travels slower and lesser distance on cold days when the air is heavier.

My physics is very good and backed up with sources.

Your South African physics is internet copy and paste of theories of physics, you don't know the applied physics for practical effects and I am your teacher here, get it ?

.

Augustus

Your "cold air is denser" is irrelevant

Cold air at altitude is denser than warm air at altitude

But cold air at altitude is still less dense than cold air at low altitude

The air temperature is largely irrelevant within the confines of what is being discussed.

And let me remind you, you know nothing about physics, you thought air at high altitude was more dense than air at low altitude because it was cold

This is why South African Universities are the best in Africa

This is why Nigerian Universities barely make the top 20

mzilakazi:




That's a lie, the official Indian army says maximum range is 30 km.


http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORCES/Equipment/Artillery/354-155mm-Bofors-Fh-77b.html

That source you quoted is NOT Indian army official information, it is a private website.

The Indian army video is final authority and army guide website supports it, 42km or 41km if you wish.

CASE CLOSED
.

agaugust:


Problem is that SANDF has on 38km range shell.

CASE CLOSED
.

It lists our range with base bleed

It doesnt say we dont have VLAP

And since you claim Nigeria has Base-Bleed without proof, we say we have VLAP, and we dont need any proof.

agaugust:


That source you quoted is NOT Indian army official information, it is a private website.

The Indian army video is final authority and army guide website supports it, 42km or 41km if you wish.

CASE CLOSED
.

No, its 30km in standard operating conditions.

And Nigeria does not have Base-Bleed, so its actually 27km

10 km short of the G5 and G6

We out-range you in standard conditions, and we will out-range you at high altitude

Unless of course, the laws of physics do not apply to the SANDF

Patchesagain:


Augustus

Your "cold air is denser" is irrelevant

Cold air at altitude is denser than warm air at altitude

But cold air at altitude is still less dense than cold air at low altitude

The air temperature is largely irrelevant within the confines of what is being discussed.

And let me remind you, you know nothing about physics, you thought air at high altitude was more dense than air at low altitude because it was cold

This is why South African Universities are the best in Africa

This is why Nigerian Universities barely make the top 20

The effects will be balanced out. Theoretic Physics the altitude air is lighter because of less oxygen, but with the mountain snow it becomes colder and heavier, but it has a plus and minus effect.....that is now practical, called Applied Physics.

South African education did not tell you the difference between pure physics and applied physics, that is why your country imported Nigerian science teachers to save your backward brains from embarrassment in the international community

.

agaugust:


That source you quoted is NOT Indian army official information, it is a private website.

The Indian army video is final authority and army guide website supports it, 42km or 41km if you wish.

CASE CLOSED
.

The army guide also support SA G6 range and it is final. Remember that our G6 rhinos have been upgraded to G6-52 which have a longer barrel, thus an extended range with the same ammunition.

agaugust:



The effects will be balanced out. Theoretic Physics the altitude air is lighter because of less oxygen, but with the mountain snow it becomes colder and heavier, but it has a plus and minus effect.....that is now practical, called Applied Physics.

South African education did not tell you the difference between pure physics and applied physics, that is why your country imported Nigerian science teachers to save your backward brains from embarrassment in the international community

.

Uhhh... no

Air at altitude is factually less dense than air at low altitude

This is why your universities barely make the top 20 in Africa

This is why superior South African minds have economically colonized your country