I don't blame you guys that support the discrimination, Nigeria education as already rotten. Go outside Nigeria and see how Polytechnic education is treated with high esteem. Even Polytechnic of Namibia is ranked 79th best higher institution in Africa whereas most of the Nigerian Universities are not there.
Even among the so called BSc holders In Nigeria, they still discriminates among themselves. Who also said Polytechnic engineering students can't have the title of Engineers, surveyors etc. Most of you are talking within your view, myopic thinking.

I don't blame you guys that support the discrimination, Nigeria education as already rotten. Go outside Nigeria and see how Polytechnic education is treated with high esteem. Even Polytechnic of Namibia is ranked 79th best higher institution in Africa whereas most of the Nigerian Universities are not there.
Even among the so called BSc holders In Nigeria, they still discriminates among themselves. Who also said Polytechnic engineering students can't have the title of Engineers, surveyors etc. Most of you are talking within your view, myopic thinking.
Our leaders are corrupt, politics as how taken over every sector.

williamson46:
so, Nigerien Bsc equals??

Nigerian BSc should also equal their BSc. Its not bad if You send your BSc to WES and come tell us d equivalent. All i know is that from an American perspective Bsc = Hnd, while a Nigerian would say its not. We kno dy gree honor ourself 4 hia. BE WELL

kayusbrown:


Is the Nigerian HND the same as other HNDs obtainable in Europe? This is the question most Bsc supremacists shy away from.

The BTEC-HND in the UK for example is just a 2-year programme not requiring another 2-year diploma (ND for example in Nigeria) as part of entry requirements. In other words, it takes 2years of full-time study to obtain HND in Europe while it takes 5years of full-time study to obtain the Nigerian HND. Though the two bear the same nomenclature it is obvious they are not equal in terms of academic worth. This is why the Nigerian HND, when evaluated alongside its prerequisite (ND), is usually found to be equivalent to bachelor's degree. There are attestations to that on this forum by HND holders who have done such evaluation for postgraduate studies.

Well I am not here to take sides just ask questions. What evidence can you share about this equivaent evaluation.Evaluation by whom?

Lolz, show me anyone who has been to the polytechnic and has maybe ND or HND and also been to the university and let the person come and say polytechnic and universities certificates should be considered equal. You are being taught by mostly mr's and mr's in polytechnics and you being taught by mostly dr's and professors in the universities and you want the certificates equal? Even by their environments the difference is clear, With 150 or 160 jamb score u can enter most polytechnics, even if ur papa be jonathan and ur uncle buhari, you no fit enter OAU with that score. Even if you do you won't be able to cope academically. On so many grounds poly and uni's are not just on the same pedestal, its mere wishful thinking to even assume such. Most polytechnics are just mere business centers, u see all manner of people who can barely read and write as students and you wonder how come? Have been to poly before so I can say all these from first hand knowledge. U wan also equal first class of a university with distinction in poly too? Lolz.

DivineConnect:
. I quite understood your saying but it is very unfortunate that Nigeria graduates especially those with Bachelor Degrees project ego without actually showcasing the qualities of having such degrees. Though, by principle of Nigeria education curricula, BSc is rated higher than HND but many so called degree holders are really not meeting up; only putting up ego of having the certificate. All you have said is based on theories but contrary is the case in practice. If you could recall, Nigeria Society of Engineers once allowed HND holders to pass through graduateship examinations set by the body. To the dismay of many, the examinations were rubbished by many HND holders thereby qualifying them for corporate membership cadre of the institution. COREN had no option registering those in that category as qualified engineers. When such was noticed, they quickly moved on scrapping the examination. I was fortunate to be part of the team. As far as I am concerned, many of my collegues having B. Eng degrees are not performing better than I do in engineering design, leadership and management. In fact, some are not even meeting up what is expected of them. If Polytechnic education is strenghtened in Nigeria, brilliant minds will excel their counterparts in the universities. Many foreign polytechnics award degrees equivalent to universities with no iota of discrimination.I will not mince words by telling you that some polytechnic graduates are also a big shame to the their respective institutions while many polytechnics have no standards at all. I am of the opinion that the two set of graduates(degrees and HND) be tried in their respective offices before promotion. Whoever is not meeting up could be set aside. They should be given the right to aspire to the highest cadre so far they meet up the requirement. My friend, I still hold Bachelor Degree in Communication Technology coupled with my HND in Electrical Engineering. Let us drop discrimination but root for the best brains in the country. I do hope you will strongly believe that best brains are not limited to university system. Thank you.

God bless you man!!! Its all about d brains and always about the brains!!! Neva about ur certificate that could be useless without brains!!!
Nigeria as a nation is suffereing dis intellectual disregard, and with all dis discrimination, d country is still as backward as dis!!!

busoye19:
BSc and HND are not the same anywhere in the world. For those who are agitating that Bsc should be equal to HND in Nigeria. Try and apply for Masters program abroad with your HND certificate and see what will happen.
Stop all this your agitation and accept your fate or better still, get a Bsc certificate.
The curriculums and course contents are not the same, I went through both systems. They're not the same I repeat.
University is a research and Technological based institution, while Polytechnic is just a Technological based institution.
In the Polytechnic, HND/Bsc holder can become a senior lecturer/HOD, Msc a Rector. You may not pass through a Professor throughout your duration in school.
In the University, Bsc can only be assistant lecturer even with first class honors. HOD/Dean of facilities are Professors.
There is no basis for comparison pls.

exactly. In most Federal Uni, the dean of a Faculty will most likely be a Professor ...

dayowunmi:
Lolz, show me anyone who has been to the polytechnic and has maybe ND or HND and also been to the university and let the person come and say poly and uni are the same. You are being taugh by mostly mr in polytechnics and you being taught by mostly dr's and professors in the universities and you want the certificates equal? With 150 or 160 jamb score u can enter most polytechnic, if ur papa be jonathan and ur uncle buhari, you no fit enter OAU with that score. Even if you do you won't be able to cope. On so many grounds poly and uni's are not just on the same pedestal, its mere wishful thinking to even assume such. Most polytechnics are just mere business centers, u see all manner of people who can barely read and write as students and you wonder how come? Have been to poly before so I know better. U wan also equal first class of a university with distinction in poly too? Lolz.

I think you should let the house know what your qualification is. If you are a BSc holder, then I'm really sorry to say that your grammatical constructions up there isn't in any way reflecting that... I am an HND holder and I have led several BSc Holders in different job positions. I have supervised many of them. What I have noticed with all these debacle is that: regardless of being HND or BSc holder, discrimination starts from within. I have never been intimidated one day by a BSc holder, that because I know what I carry inside of me. Infact, the reverse is the case most times for me.
I particularly like the "fools' suprise" on some peoples' face when I proudly tell them I'm an HND holder. If anyone needs BSc cert to be intellectually recognized, then maybe, just maybe the person isn't intelligent at all in the first place.

The Difference Between HND And BSC Certificates Is Discrimination – Wole Soyinka (SHARE THIS)
The recent media sprout pertaining to the long lasted discrimination between holders of Bsc and Hnd degrees have successfully passed through to the second reading in the House Of Assembly.

However, the nobel Laurette; Professor Wole Soyinka was invited to Channels TV to share his opinion on the aforesaid issue. And he gave clarification on the matter by saying the Government is the root cause of the discrimination sprouting across all industries.

“Basically, looking at this, one would agree the cut off marks for these institutions are clearly not the same. But who sets these cut off marks? What would it cost the Government to ensure the appropriate bodies charged with the sole responsibility of setting the yardsticks into these institutions; get to review the measures.

These are pertinent things we shy away from. I can tell you I have been across products from both institutions and you should know they both produce quacks and good products. So its a question of individual development to an extent. But as regards the nomenclature of the divide. Most people claim, perhaps if the Government can put in facilities to upgrade the polytechincs, maybe they can measure up. But that is pure rubbish.

When was the last time facilities were installed in universities across the nation? All these rants need to stop, because its like planting a seed of enmity among these two categories of students.

When reliance is totally placed on a government on issues like this, the society fails to move forward. I personally think its high time students across both divides started looking forward to what they can do for themselves as individuals than what some certificate can do for you.

Geniuses are made and not born, but apparently, we have a government that isn’t ready to scrutinize the frustrations being caused by the educational sector to these children at the early stage. When I pass Jamb a couple of times but refused admission several times at the university just because I didn’t make them both my first choice and second choice, won’t I opt for a polytechnic. Or must I keep trying till I wield grey hair? We need to think deep about these things.

The government has really neglected its checks and balances on that. A BSC holder and an Hnd holder should be equal given that they were both able to squarely take-on whatever that was thrown at them during their cause of study.”

tonytony208:
Your spelling of "dangerous" is enough to show you off as a poly student. Many of them cant speak or write simple and correct English; just like you have displayed here. Now, which polytechnic did you graduate from? Your school's standard must have been very poor! "Dangerious"? Queen Elizabeth must hear this!

From what you posted, it's easy to conclude that you are one of the ardent promoters of the disparity.

It's a futile venture, any further investment must be regretted because loss is eminent.

Hnd and bsc have infiltrated themselves in almost every family including yours, therefore wondering where you will run to when the trouble you are instigating begins to play out.

In case you don't know, bad or good English is spoken by both hnd and bsc holders including you. The difference remains the level of individual inquisitiveness in learning and applying grammatical rules.

BluePulse:



Nigeria as a nation is suffereing dis intellectual disregard, and with all dis discrimination, d country is still as backward as dis!!!

life in the zoo can be very interesting,dontcha agree,zoogerian?
Btw,did u get that gtae man job?

omonnakoda:
Well I am not here to take sides just ask questions. What evidence can you share about this equivaent evaluation.Evaluation by whom?

Would have inserted a link but I'm replying with a phone. Check this thread: https://www.nairaland.com/370346/what-hnd-equivalent-usa


The credential evaluation agency is World Educational Services (WES) www.wes.org .

Besides, I know personally two seniors from my alma mater who gained master's degree admission in the USA with their HND after the evaluation.

omonnakoda:
There are no HND polytechnics anymore in the UK .I suggest you inform yourself better on the Binary Divide and the relevant legislation. You seem to be implying that where HNDs exist they ARE NOT ENGINEERS,is that your position?

But there is HNC which is equivalent to HND.

Modified*
Hnd actually still exist..

There are Hnd programs at the university of Salford, Manchester college, Salford city college, university of Greenwich e.t.c

Imagine I told a frnd of mine who graduated frm uni that 'I wish I saw my girlfrnd tomorrow' he said is grammatically wrong. Then, what are they teaching uni students? A uni graduate who cn't write ordinary application letter! What a pity! I'v helped sm uni graduates to do this,so,what ar we nw saying? A uni graduate of mass comm who doesn't knw d meaning of 'dummy'/page planning and doesn't knw hw to plan pages. I alwys proud to be a poly graduate

perryy:


While I agreed with your assertion that many distinction graduates from poly find it hard to graduate with 2.2, at the university, I will equally tell you that there are some people who find it hard to graduate with 2.1 at the poly but later graduated with first class in the university. It all depends on the type of lecturers you passed through and your type of person. Many lecturers in the polytechnics are very poor academically, if you can't give them what they gave you, you won't graduate with good grade. They have narrow knowledge of the subjects they teach and as such, if you provide them with most recent answer to their examination questions, they won't be able to comprehend what you wrote and they end up giving you half of the score or even less. But a university professor won't act that way. No professor will encourage student to just cram their hand outs, they even encourage students to go to the Internet to get the most recent idea about any given topic. This is where the university is better than the polytechnic system.

However, there are still some poly students who do not mind the score, and went out of their way to seek knowledge outside the half baked hand outs from their lecturers. What we are saying is that the system should allow such people to succeed. They should be recognised by their employers. They should be given the needed support and encouragement to grow instead of this baseless discrepancy

i cant help but just say thank you for these points. i presumed you have gone through the system because you really understand the state of things in the polytechnic. all what you stated up there are what i am presently going through as a polytechnic student. i am a knowledge seeker and i like doing research and coming up with new things, but it is so unfortunate that all these are not appreciated in the polytechnic. research is not appreciated in the polytechnic because what the lecturers want is you giving them what they have given to you (though not all the lecturers). i have many university graduates as friend and they always long for my quo, and they respect and appreciate my level of intelligent even though i am yet to graduate. really, i do not let the nature of things bother me much because i know that, even though i attend a polytechnic, i can always give myself the best of education through self determination and commitment. the difference between university and polytechnic is just the nomenclature. no book that a university student can lay his hands on that a polytechnic student cannot, and no book is restricted to university students. after all, we have those who do not pass through these institutions and still become academic sound through self-study. pls i would like to know you because i feel i could learn more from you.

BluePulse:
The discrimination is really un-called for. I'm an HND grad. I've worked in a bank where I was a team lead over BS.C holders due to my experience and how much I blv in myself.
Now I have Masters in Risk Management from an American Institution. I am currently heading a department of more than 5 BSc holders.

big fooo,keep on deceiving urself and everybody...
U have this n that n u are on here waking up 5am just to catch da free danfo to attend Apm apapa terminus job interview n the next thing,u are in da board! Real zoogerian!

BluePulse:


I think you should let the house know what your qualification is. If you are a BSc holder, then I'm really sorry to say that your grammatical constructions up there isn't in any way reflecting that... I am an HND holder and I have led several BSc Holders in different job positions. I have supervised many of them. What I have noticed with all these debacle is that: regardless of being HND or BSc holder, discrimination starts from within. I have never been intimidated one day by a BSc holder, that because I know what I carry inside of me. Infact, the reverse is the case most times for me.
I particularly like the "fools' suprise" on some peoples' face when I proudly tell them I'm an HND holder. If anyone needs BSc cert to be intellectually recognized, then maybe, just maybe the person isn't intelligent at all in the first place.

Lolz, correct me on which mistake you noticed now. I made some assertions which I expected u to disprove not for you to come and be marking grammar here, and pls kindly highlight the errors u noticed in my speech. I said, is the cut off score for polytechnics and universities same? Is the knowledge base available the same? In the polytechnic u went to, how many ph.d holders or professors do they have? Or u wanna tell me, there's no difference between a prof and a mr? Even the environments are different, maybe u can cite a country in the world where HND and B.sc are equal ! Very few polytechnic students got over 200 in jamb utme, u can hardly gain admission to any reputable or descent university in Nigeria with a score less than 200. Disprove my facts then we can talk sir.

pinkyruledworld:
Have u heard about world evaluation service? If not, you can look it up on google. They evaluate a certificate from any country and tell u its american equivalent. HND is equivalent to B.Sc, while ND is equivalent to an associate degree. The british were known to use the Hnd format which we automatically used due to our "colony", but they have since stopped bt Nigeria still uses it as we all know. Well, WES is based in USA. God Bless and may Allah help us in this country.

WES is not a degree awarding institution. Can you apply for MSC in Oxford or Caltech with WES evaluation result

bodbod:
Hello nairalanders, I don't really see why the descimination is so much, I work in a financial institution as an HND holder,a contract staff but each time a BSC holder is been employed as a full staff,d HND holders(the so called contract staff) are ones to train the newly employed BSC holder.so what is the justification? There are lots of BSC holders that can not even withstand some HND holders when it comes to performance and skill application. God help us.

Sorry Bros, if you have the opportunity, please go back to school(university) even if it is open university. The truth is you should not be contented and happy with training others employed as full staff and you remain a contract staff. I am telling you this from my heart as I am a product of both poly and uni. Immediately you finish training those newly employed BSc, they become your oga. I know you really don't want that to continue

BluePulse:


Lolsssss...
Against public opinion, dat man was my favorite act in d series. U are gbaski bro!!!

yea he was more like a quote man in the series,i just loved every word he uttered,to a point i have everything up in my brain....he really gave lex a cruel training both verbally and demo statically.......

emmanator:
clear throat! let's face it bsc have an edge but that does not make an HND holder a mediocre. what really matters is how effective and innovative an individual can be at his or her field of duty,pls let's work as one,together we'll be progressive and seperated we'll be retarded

No one ever said one is/was mediocre. What guyz are saying is that both qualifications were set up for different reasons.
In Canada, we have diploma and advanced diploma which is equivalent to Ond and HND. Then the engineering degree required to practice as an engineer.
It goes like this,
Technician-Journeymen:
Technologist-Diploma:
Engineer:Degree

hakinz87:
I don't blame you guys that support the discrimination, Nigeria education as already rotten. Go outside Nigeria and see how Polytechnic education is treated with high esteem. Even Polytechnic of Namibia is ranked 79th best higher institution in Africa whereas most of the Nigerian Universities are not there.
Even among the so called BSc holders In Nigeria, they still discriminates among themselves. Who also said Polytechnic engineering students can't have the title of Engineers, surveyors etc. Most of you are talking within your view, myopic thinking.
Our leaders are corrupt, politics as how taken over every sector.

Even in Canada, their are some polytechnics that rank higher than some universities but they were set up for different purposes. So both of them including their grads know their limits and scope of work.

saxywale:

WES is not a degree awarding institution. Can you apply for MSC in Oxford or Caltech with WES evaluation result

i never said WES is a degree awarding institution, and i believe u should be able to use the evaluation result in caltech since its American but am not sure about oxford. NAMASTE

Excellentmind:


From what you posted, it's easy to conclude that you are one of the ardent promoters of the disparity.

It's a futile venture, any further investment must be regretted because loss is eminent.

Hnd and bsc have infiltrated themselves in almost every family including yours, therefore wondering where you will run to when the trouble you are instigating begins to play out.

In case you don't know, bad or good English is spoken by both hnd and bsc holders including you. The difference remains the level of individual inquisitiveness in learning and applying grammatical rules.

sir, i refer you back to gns 101. Your use of words is abberant. You used infilterate wrongly. Additionally, it is not eminent, it is imminent. Hope you are enlightened now?

See quarrel oooo..... Una dy insult una sef for paper wey no go fit giv u seat 4 heaven. All na God's favour....

zeusdgrt:
A fool is never had to be noticed.Get small sense and try shut up Agbaya!

you are actually the fool here. You cant even differentiate btw "had" and "hard" and you call yourself a graduate. Shame on you! Did they use vernacular to teach you in your schl?

frank043:


Some people find it difficult to understand that all five fingers ain't equal.
By the way, do you have to swear to prove that you look cute when no one has asked for your pix? Just asking....don't crucify me oooo. Do have a splendid Sunday, ma'am.

hahahahahaha never mind if I may feel bad or not, I'd already made up my mind never to get upset cos I did not provide any vacancy for that. enjoy ur sunday!

CREDENTIAL VS POTENTIAL
One thing that has killed the productivity of many Nigerian graduates and put them permanently on the unemployment queue is the excessive emphasis and dependence on paper (academic) qualification at the expense of potentials. Credential is good, but in this present economic
time your credential alone might not sustain you in the real world. If you depend solely on the fact that you graduated with a good grade, then you might end up frustrated in life. This over-dependence on credentials has (so much) affected the youths that most of them do not care to know if they posses any abilities that could be developed into a career, all they care about is how
to go to school, graduate and then join the unemployment queue in search of unavailable
white collar jobs. This tradition is a major cause of graduate joblessness in the country; graduates
that are supposed to develop their potentials and use them to affect humanity are busy moving from one company to another submitting CVs and hoping to get a job. On a practical note, it is not your credential that matters but your competence and ability to carry out tasks. A result-focused employer is not really concerned with what you graduated with, but his interest is on whether you have what it takes to move his organization forward. I believe school should be a place where potentials and talents are refined and developed, and not merely a place for acquiring paper qualifications. Paper without potential makes you a liability, which is why there are lots of graduates with papers that are liabilities. If you want to work in the bank it shouldn’t be because you are a graduate of Banking and Finance or Business Admin, but it should be because you have the potential to deliver as a banker and notjust another employee. If you are just ‘anotheremployee’ you will be sacked or retrenched in no time. Let me tell you the truth; there are academicbankers as well as talented bankers. An academic banker only adds to the bank’s payroll, with verylittle contribution to the Bank’s growth; while a talented banker is one whose potential is able to impact to a large extent, on the bank’s growth. The talented banker is an asset to the bank, and they are the ones that climb faster on the corporate ladder. The difference between the academic and talented banker is in their level of intelligence. Intelligence here doesn’t refer to having good grades in school
L or being able to cram long theories. “Intelligence is the ability to provide practical solutions to practical problems”. So, our talented banker here is one thatis intelligent enough to provide practical solutions to practical banking problems. He depends onpotential, natural intelligence and abilities unlike the academic banker whose strength is just on his paper qualification.
People like Jim Ovia and Tony Elumelu, former CEOs of Zenith Bank and UBA respectively, are intelligent bankers. They could never have risen to their positions merely because of their paper qualifications. Though I’ve used banking as an illustration, it also applies to
other fields-Technolo gy, engineering, business etc. Majority of mechanical engineering graduates cannot fixa car engine, while most mechanics are not graduates
of any university or polytechnic. Most of the so-called Mechanicalengineering graduates just have their heads filled with formulas and theories which have turned their heads into warehouses of unproductiveinformation. Don’t deceive yourself; it is not about what you know, but what you can do with what you know. Would you hire someone to fix your car just because he is a graduate or because he can actually fix the car perfectly? Life is about delivering value. It is this
credential-mind edness that has affected theeconomy of the country negatively. Why can’t we
develop our potentials like the Americans, Japanese, Chinese or Indians? A large number of
the major corporations owned by Americans were started while the founders w

Jakara:


Tonytony208 you might be an educated illiterate or enlightened coward. You are a big disappointment to B.Sc Holders. Consult your dictionary before calling champion "shampion". I don't mean inault but advice.

Inault, is that a new model of Renault or Audi?

zeusdgrt:
A full is never had to be noticed.Get small sense and try shut up Agbaya!

you cant even construct simple and correct sentence. Shame on you! It is not "had to noticed", it should be "HARD to NOTICE". At least, your eediotic self has learnt something today

Adultnextdoor:
.......you're just an unfortunate asshole......i'm sure you are one of those who supports the discrimination of polytechnic institutions...

1. Your fathder is an unfortunate assshole.

2. It is not "supports", it is "support" (third person plural).

dsul:
. Guy? 1 simple mistake does not mean u should condemn him or poly graduates. I av seen many uni graduates dat can not express themselves. So pls Grow. English is not our language what matters most is knwin wat u study.

since english is not our language, why didnt you write this thing you have written in vernacular?