FrancisTony:

Okay... I take it back.

Cool. Thanks!

Idowuogbo:

Coogar,stop it!!!

He's 18!!! Haba!

who cares if he's 18?
his mates fend for themselves in my neighbourhood. his mates are british patriots defending their respective countries in the middle east.

you want to keep spoon-feeding this idîotic adult? so cos he's 18, he shouldn't be responsible? cos he's 18, he has the right to insult people that can feed his family for decades.

idowu, better mind yourself......

coogar:


who cares if he's 18?
his mates fend for themselves in my neighbourhood. his mates are british patriots defending their respective countries in the middle east.

you want to keep spoon-feeding this idîotic adult? so cos he's 18, he shouldn't be responsible? cos he's 18, he has the right to insult people that can feed his family for decades.

idowu, better mind yourself......

Hian! @ bolded, you don vex?

This military way of teaching someone respect is something else ooo....calm down....

coogar:


who cares if he's 18?
his mates fend for themselves in my neighbourhood. his mates are british patriots defending their respective countries in the middle east.

you want to keep spoon-feeding this idîotic adult? so cos he's 18, he shouldn't be responsible? cos he's 18, he has the right to insult people that can feed his family for decades.

idowu, better mind yourself......

2nded,3rded and 4teth sef!

OK this thread escalated to something else rather quickly.

@ FrancisTony and Mindfullness,imagine the ignorance and arrogance from some of thse people!! BIOLOGY IS THE STUDY OF LIFE AND LIVING ORGANISMS,INCLUDING THEIR STRUCTURE,FUNCTION,GROWTH,EVOLUTION,DISTRIBUTION AND TAXONOMY.Biology itself has many subjects or areas of study:aerobiology,anatomy,histology,botany,cell biology,building biology,biotechnology,cognitive biology,biomedical research,bio physics,ebryology and many more .Due to biology and medicine studies the human lifestyle,quality and quantity has greatly improved. Case in point:vaccines,childbirth methods and surgeries are one of the biggest advancements due to biology and medicine studies.YET SOME FOOLS HERE ARE SAYING ITS LESS IMPORTANT/BORING THAN ENGINEERING.....a fool is a person who lacks good sense/judgement ....please one of the fools who was saying theses studies are easy:GO MAKE THE CURE FOR HIV AIDS AND CANCER!!!show us how easy it all is

^^^

Yeah that ish was just plain wrong. Biology and medicine, true sciences that they are, are demanding courses in their own rights.

To put things back on track the fascinating question here is that why are women under-represented in the STEM fields even when the cultural and societal hurdles that checked their participation in times past are removed?

Why do some people see this as a problem so much so that they want some kind of government intervention or cultural effort to address this? They are only creating a problem where none existed before - women, as has been stated earlier, will tend to make career choices that are in line with their inherent natural dispositions. Women are nurturers by nature so it shouldn't come as a surprise that they dominate the Health sciences and are under represented in other STEM fields, boys tend to build things. This is all natural. It's only activists and politicians who are not in tune with how biology and nature actually work that will go about trying to fix something that isn't broken here.

O ga oo,them come shut down family thread. Hian. Francistony can u atleast respect ur elders

Oga o

Idowu what happened to the Funroom.

coogar I really wish I was or knew your GP after that your diss at doctors

Yeah we get engineers build stuff but I hope y'all never fall ill cos you are the mercy of the 'crammers' if you do.

coogar:


don't make excuses for a brat behaving badly.....18 isn't an excuse!

I'm not oo!! He admitted he has/had a problem with tearoses and I told him off for being rude.The next stage is getting him to apologise to Madam Tearoses and then we can package him and send him back to the romance sect. He is definetly not mentally matured to be here.

damiso:
Oga o

Idowu what happened to the Funroom.

coogar I really wish I was or knew your GP after that your diss at doctors

Yeah we get engineers build stuff but I hope y'all never fall ill cos you are the mercy of the 'crammers' if you do.

Lolz...latecomer! Na alt accounts dey show themselves o... and then one 18 year old too dey misyarn but he don dey calm down sha.

Idowuogbo:

Lolz...latecomer! Na alt accounts dey show themselves o... and then one 18 year old too dey misyarn but he don dey calm down sha.

I don't get that alt account ish sha the only other acct I have is damiso1 and that was when spambot kicked me out one time.If na now sef I no go even bother.

at latecomer no mind me I need my sleep o the pressure at work too much jare plus my pikins various activities etc.

today na Friday and I am off for the next two weeks so na to flenjo small I wan ask for name of something buzzing you on whatsapp now.

How you dey jare?

damiso:


I don't get that alt account ish sha the only other acct I have is damiso1 and that was when spambot kicked me out one time.If na now sef I no go even bother.

at latecomer no mind me I need my sleep o the pressure at work too much jare plus my pikins various activities etc.

today na Friday and I am off for the next two weeks so na to flenjo small I wan ask for name of something buzzing you on whatsapp now.

How you dey jare?

I'm jealous mehn...i need this right now I swear. E no easy to dey hustle owo Louboutin. GOD DEY#

Mindfulness:
I have no case to present to you. I am still a learner regarding the subject of this discussion. I liked your essay so I read it carefully and by doing so some questions popped up, which I am asking you to answer. I hope, you don't mind.

At all.

Mindfulness:
When you refer to medical schools, do you also have nurses in mind?

Nope - just MD's really.


TV

ApexTitan:
^^^

Yeah that ish was just plain wrong. Biology and medicine, true sciences that they are, are demanding courses in their own rights.

To put things back on track the fascinating question here is that why are women under-represented in the STEM fields even when the cultural and societal hurdles that checked their participation in times past are removed?

Why do some people see this as a problem so much so that they want some kind of government intervention or cultural effort to address this? They are only creating a problem where none existed before - women, as has been stated earlier, will tend to make career choices that are in line with their inherent natural dispositions. Women are nurturers by nature so it shouldn't come as a surprise that they dominate the Health sciences and are under represented in other STEM fields, boys tend to build things. This is all natural. It's only activists and politicians who are not in tune with how biology and nature actually work that will go about trying to fix something that isn't broken here.

AT abeg no mind them.

No one said any such thing. Ask them to point out where. Simply put, the demands of hardocre TEM courses suit men better. No one has said that women can't excel in TEM, or that natural science/medical courses are not rigorous or don't require brains.

The inability of - mostly women - to reason, deduce and make cogent arguments is actually prima facie evidence of why they are "under-represented". It's mostly peppered sentiment and emotional indignation.

If anyone will make a case for women, it's not the females here - who are confusing their ideology with their biology. Scientific fact !


TV

RoyalRoy,

Good morning

Please come and cleanse this thread of all insane posts.

Any poster who has issues with themselves should find another thread to exhibit their insanity

@ All the posters who kept this thread going in my absence, thanks a lot.

crackhaus:

Maybe, maybe not.

What do you think?

I said definitely.
I thought you don't like "unnecessary" questions.

ApexTitan:
^^^

Yeah that ish was just plain wrong. Biology and medicine, true sciences that they are, are demanding courses in their own rights.

To put things back on track the fascinating question here is that why are women under-represented in the STEM fields even when the cultural and societal hurdles that checked their participation in times past are removed?

Why do some people see this as a problem so much so that they want some kind of government intervention or cultural effort to address this? They are only creating a problem where none existed before - women, as has been stated earlier, will tend to make career choices that are in line with their inherent natural dispositions. Women are nurturers by nature so it shouldn't come as a surprise that they dominate the Health sciences and are under represented in other STEM fields, boys tend to build things. This is all natural. It's only activists and politicians who are not in tune with how biology and nature actually work that will go about trying to fix something that isn't broken here.

Very good question.

I guess because countries are in high demand of engineers and need to tackle skills shortages.

TV01:

At all.


Nope - just MD's really.


TV

Could it be that women are overrepresented in the medical field because they have always been a big part of it and hence find it easier to access it whereas the other fields have always been male-dominated?

TV01:


Ah Stilly, so you at once deign not to to answer any of my assertions and at the same time charge me with something I did not say? . Why should women be at 45% in TEM, why not 60% like in medicine. Why does it make them lazy !

I'm sure nurture influences everyones choices to some degree, and doubtless it's at play here also. However, the fact remains that when it comes to the requirements of technology engineering and mathamatics, men' brains are better suited.

Does that mean women can't excel in those areas? No, it just means that they won't tend to go there as much and consequently have fewer outliers.

Other factors would be women' situations and life choices - they typically try and juggle family (for which read child-rearing) with career, this also informs their choices.

If you want to make a case for "nurture" being the overriding factor, please do so. I figure you are able to present your position absent snide asides and "skirt-surfing".



TV

^{skirt surfer* - one who lacks the nous to rebut opinions or present a cogent case on a topic, but instead chooses to indirectly make baseless insinuations and trite asides - typically by referencing their pain indirectly as a response to another post. Closely related to trolls, but typically sadder, and with a tendency to whinge and present as emotionally skewed}

TV01, I'm glad you are aware of the familial factors and the way women are 'nurtured' that 'hinders' our progress.
And yes we should at least be at 45% at the moment if women are socially brought up to prioritize traits like assertiveness, doggedness, not modesty. And yes I am making estimations not assertions , because for the fact that we are merely having a discussion, we can make hypothetical statements, and a scientist often puts her opinion and estimations in her discussion section of her scientific reports, tehehe.
So no I'm not being 'ideological' but doing what scientists do, make hypothetical statements and then work towards proving it.

I chose 45% at the moment because men have always had the benefit of a head start. I'm not stupid to make foolhardy estimations of 60% at the moment.
As of my lazy comment, as of the 1930s we start seeing women in physics, chemistry fields. So yes I think Western women have grown lazy over the years.
I have no worries though Nigerian women match them despite the incriminating factors we have in our country, both economic and sexist views that most of you here would wish women to aspire too. To think kitchen! But not under my watch. Tehehe

Here is some evidence that corroborates the notion that the gender choices we make from the get go are to a large extent biologically determined http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20232129 Boys will tend to choose to play with toy cars and trucks whereas girls tend to play with dolls. With this in mind it cannot be far-fetched to understand the reasons behind the careers that boys and girls choose when they grow up.

Another one that finds a similar occurrence in animals here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18452921

I would argue that it is an innate realisation of what science is only beginning to uncover that informed the prevailing societal directions and conventions that we have in place up until now as regards how children are brought up. It is all these modern day and so-called progressive thinking that seeks to disrupt the harmony.

Stillfire:


TV01, I'm glad you are aware of the familial factors and the way women are 'nurtured' that 'hinders' our progress.
And yes we should at least be at 45% at the moment if women are socially brought up to prioritize traits like assertiveness, doggedness, not modesty. And yes I am making estimations not assertions , because for the fact that we are merely having a discussion, we can make hypothetical statements, and a scientist often puts her opinion and estimations in her discussion section of her scientific reports, tehehe.
So no I'm not being 'ideological' but doing what scientists do, make hypothetical statements and then work towards proving it.

I chose 45% at the moment because men have always had the benefit of a head start. I'm not stupid to make foolhardy estimations of 60% at the moment.
As of my lazy comment, as of the 1930s we start seeing women in physics, chemistry fields. So yes I think Western women have grown lazy over the years.
I have no worries though Nigerian women match them despite the incriminating factors we have in our country, both economic and sexist views that most of you here would wish women to aspire too. To think kitchen! But not under my watch. Tehehe

Women have grown lazy over the years? Kai, don't let those Scandinavian women, who in-spite of the strong push by their governments to enter STEM fields have refused to budge, hear you o.

It's wrong to even start with the premise that this under representation is wrong. This is just what it is. Simple.

ApexTitan:
Here is some evidence that corroborates the notion that the gender choices we make from the get go are to a large extent biologically determined http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20232129 Boys will tend to choose to play with toy cars and trucks whereas girls tend to play with dolls. With this in mind it cannot be far-fetched to understand the reasons behind the careers that boys and girls choose when they grow up.

Another one that finds a similar occurrence in animals here http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18452921

I would argue that it is an innate realisation of what science is only beginning to uncover that informed the prevailing societal directions and conventions that we have in place up until now as regards how children are brought up. It is all these modern day and so-called progressive thinking that seeks to disrupt the harmony.

Wrong. Boys show consistent and strong preference for wheeled toys whereas girls are more flexible and show greater variability.

This is taken from the link you have quoted up there:


Abstract
Sex differences in toy preferences in children are marked, with boys expressing stronger and more rigid toy preferences than girls, whose preferences are more flexible. Socialization processes, parents, or peers encouraging play with gender-specific toys are thought to be the primary force shaping sex differences in toy preference. A contrast in view is that toy preferences reflect biologically-determined preferences for specific activities facilitated by specific toys. Sex differences in juvenile activities, such as rough-and-tumble play, peer preferences, and infant interest, share similarities in humans and monkeys. Thus if activity preferences shape toy preferences, male and female monkeys may show toy preferences similar to those seen in boys and girls. We compared the interactions of 34 rhesus monkeys, living within a 135 monkey troop, with human wheeled toys and plush toys. Male monkeys, like boys, showed consistent and strong preferences for wheeled toys, while female monkeys, like girls, showed greater variability in preferences. Thus, the magnitude of preference for wheeled over plush toys differed significantly between males and females. The similarities to human findings demonstrate that such preferences can develop without explicit gendered socialization. We offer the hypothesis that toy preferences reflect hormonally influenced behavioral and cognitive biases which are sculpted by social processes into the sex differences seen in monkeys and humans.

Mindfulness:


Very good question.

I guess because countries are in high demand of engineers and need to tackle skills shortages.

Occupations in the STEM fields are in high demand the world over however this approach to solving the skills shortage isn't wholesome and will only lead to the creation of different types of shortages in the future. The gender with the natural disposition to work effectively in these fields should continue to be encouraged and supported.

ApexTitan:


Occupations in the STEM fields are in high demand the world over however this approach to solving the skills shortage isn't wholesome and will only lead to the creation of different types of shortages in the future. The gender with the natural disposition to work effectively in these fields should continue to be encouraged and supported.

We don't know whether this approach will be ineffective, yet. We will see.

Which gender has a natural disposition to work in what field?

Mindfulness:


Wrong. Boys show consistent and strong preference for wheeled toys whereas girls are more flexible and show greater variability.

This is taken from the link you have quoted up there:


Abstract
Sex differences in toy preferences in children are marked, with boys expressing stronger and more rigid toy preferences than girls, whose preferences are more flexible. Socialization processes, parents, or peers encouraging play with gender-specific toys are thought to be the primary force shaping sex differences in toy preference. A contrast in view is that toy preferences reflect biologically-determined preferences for specific activities facilitated by specific toys. Sex differences in juvenile activities, such as rough-and-tumble play, peer preferences, and infant interest, share similarities in humans and monkeys. Thus if activity preferences shape toy preferences, male and female monkeys may show toy preferences similar to those seen in boys and girls. We compared the interactions of 34 rhesus monkeys, living within a 135 monkey troop, with human wheeled toys and plush toys. Male monkeys, like boys, showed consistent and strong preferences for wheeled toys, while female monkeys, like girls, showed greater variability in preferences. Thus, the magnitude of preference for wheeled over plush toys differed significantly between males and females. The similarities to human findings demonstrate that such preferences can develop without explicit gendered socialization. We offer the hypothesis that toy preferences reflect hormonally influenced behavioral and cognitive biases which are sculpted by social processes into the sex differences seen in monkeys and humans.

Err, come again. Is the problem my choice of words? Boys will tend to and Boys show consistent and strong preference...

Girls show greater variability

Semantics anyone?

ApexTitan:


Err, come again. Is the problem my choice of words? Boys will tend to and Boys show consistent and strong preference...

Girls show greater variability

Semantics anyone?

Yes, your choice of words is a problem because it distorts the results of this study.

You said the following:

"Boys will tend to choose to play with toy cars and trucks whereas girls tend to play with dolls."

The study shows, HOWEVER, that ...

1. boys have a strong preference and that
2. girls are flexible and show greater variability.

This is very different from what you have said.

Mindfulness:


Yes, your choice of words is a problem because it distorts the results of this study.

You said the following:

"Boys will tend to choose to play with toy cars and trucks whereas girls tend to play with dolls."

The study shows, HOWEVER, that ...

1. boys have a strong preference and that
2. girls are flexible and show greater variability.

This is very different from what you have said.

Abeg let my words not lead you to confusion. Here is the main gist of that study as stated in that abstract (emphasis is mine) : Male monkeys, like boys, showed consistent and strong preferences for wheeled toys, while female monkeys, like girls, showed greater variability in preferences. Thus, the magnitude of preference for wheeled over plush toys differed significantly between males and females.

Mindfulness:
Could it be that women are overrepresented in the medical field because they have always been a big part of it and hence find it easier to access it whereas the other fields have always been male-dominated?

It may well factor, as will a number of other things, amongst which are; it better suits womens strengths, it is more family friendly and at the point of entry women are able to compete favourably against men

Mindfulness:
I guess because countries are in high demand of engineers and need to tackle skills shortages.

...and the best way to tackle a skills shortage would be to positively discriminate in favour of a group whose preferences typically lie elsewhere? As opposed to incentivising it for all - i.e. making the opportunity equal and attractive - in order to increase take-up by all??

Discriminating in favour of women to increase STEM take-up is bad for women and bad for STEM.


TV

ApexTitan:


Abeg let my words not lead you to confusion. Here is the main gist of that study as stated in that abstract (emphasis is mine) : Male monkeys, like boys, showed consistent and strong preferences for wheeled toys, while female monkeys, like girls, showed greater variability in preferences. Thus, the magnitude of preference for wheeled over plush toys differed significantly between males and females.

I am not confused, I am very clear.

Now when you compare what you have just quoted to what you said before, you will spot the huge difference that led to a false statement on your side.