Truthabounds:

Hell: A word used in the King James Version (as well as in the Catholic Douay Version and most older translations) to translate the Hebrew sheʼohl′ and the Greek hai′des. In the King James Version the word “hell” is rendered from sheʼohl′ 31 times and from hai′des 10 times. This version is not consistent, however, since sheʼohl′ is also translated 31 times “grave” and 3 times “pit.” In the Douay Version sheʼohl′ is rendered “hell” 64 times, “pit” once, and “death” once.
Concerning this use of “hell” to translate these original words from the Hebrew and Greek, Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 2, p. 187) says: “HADES . . . It corresponds to ‘Sheol’ in the O.T. [Old Testament]. In the A.V. of the O.T. [Old Testament] and N.T. [New Testament], it has been unhappily rendered ‘Hell.’”
From my study of the Bible I have come to the conclusion that Hell is not a literal burning fire of torment, but it is only the common grave of mankind to which we all go. Even Jesus himself went into hades (sheol).
The doctrine that hell is a place of torment is not based on the Bible. Rather, it is a pagan belief masquerading as a Christian teaching.

ijawkid:

I just went through isaiah 14...


And aLl it did was re-affirm the bibles stand on the fact that eternal death or everlasting destruction is what awaits persons or nations who don't obey God...



I would like to point out to you first that isaiah 14 was a ""proverbial saying"" against the ""babylonian dynasty.""..(isaiah 14:4-6)
The subject of that prophecy is ""BABYLON""....verse 4 transpicuously tells us that...


those expressions penned down through out this chapter are a symbol of what babylon will face and what it did Face....

Isaiah 14:7-8 shows how the kings of the nations round about were to babylons rulers,like trees to be cut down and used for their own purposes..well all of that is finished since the wood cutter(babylon) is soon to be destroyed....

So astonishing was babylons fall that even HELL reacts...
Mind you ihedinobi,HELL is sheol or hades, the coMmon grave of mankind,not a literal fiery place of torment...

This powerful poetic image depicts HELL(common grave of mankind) as waking up all those kings who preceded the babylonian dynasty into death so that they can greet the new comer..they mock the babylonian ruling power,which is now feeble,helpless and lying down on a bed of maggots...(Isaiah 14:9-11)...

This proverbial pronouncment coÑtinues in verse 12 as babylons kings A.K.A lucifer according to the KJV is cut down to the earth..babylon§ pomp and priÐe met its end...

Verses 15-17 shows the reversal that was in store for the proud babylonian dynasty..
The ambitious dynasty will come down to Hades(sheol) just like any human...

So ihedinobi I don't see how this chapter of isaiah supports your stance on the eternal fiery torment dogma...

Rather this chapter proverbially explains how the fall or destruction of the babylonian Dynasty would be.."" permanent and complete"".....it would be rooted out..there would be no renaissance of that dynasty....

Verses 21-23 tells us that...

21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the
iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise,
nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the
world with cities.
22 For I will rise up against them, saith the
LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the
name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith
the LORD.
23 I will also make it a possession for the
bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it
with the besom of ""destruction"", saith the
LORD of hosts.
(KJV)

Read verse 23 in particular....total destruction is what befell babylon,not some literal everlasting torment in a furnace...


The medo persian world power gladly carried out this proverbial sayings on babylon.....

...

Ihedinobi my bro always remember that the word ""HELL"" is never a place of torment but mans common grave....the KJV's mistransliteratiÓn is what has been causing thi§ confusion over time....

obadiah777: you are not your body. your body is simply dust from the ground. you are your spirit. we are spiritual beings wearing a dust suit. the spirit is who you are.

truthislight:

i thought it was written that "the spirit goes back to its owner"

now it is your property

Why not give it to another person since it is yours?

That is if you ca[/b]n?

Who ever had a property that cannot use it the way he wants?

Is that not why God is the source of our lives?

obadiah777: man is an immortal soul. the body wears out and dies but the spirit lives forever. lets examine this verse

matthew 16 vs 28 I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom." when was this statement made ? around 2000 years ago ? so are there 2000 year old men walking around today that we dont know about ? NO. what does that tell you ? that verse tells you that the spirit is what makes the man and not the body. some of those spirits in those men standing there with Christ will not die spiritually because they were part of the 144,000 sealed whose spirits reside in the lord forever and will keep on being alive and residing with the lord till Christ comes. what does that tell you again ? you are your spirit not your body. your spirit has a personality that it expresses through your body. your spirit is not an electricity used to jump start a flesh as Truthislight and Frosbel have said. thats just a ludicrous and preposterous assertion

obadiah777: THATS A PARABLE. and what the parable is trying to say is that when christ is on earth, no one will be married to their idols anymore. this is another reincarnation verse which further proves the point that spirits are forever. spirits dont get destroyed. souls are immortal

frosbel:
@Obedia77

you lost me

obadiah777: most of the stories in matthew mark luke and john are parables. its a hidden way of making a point. the point being made with that parable is that during the ressurection ( of CHRIST OR 'THE RETURN OF CHRIST ON EARTH' ) people will not be given to marriage ( DOES NOT MEAN PEOPLE WILL NOT GET MARRIED TO THEIR SPOUSES. ITS TALKING ABOUT THEY WILL NOT BE MARRIED TO OTHER DOCTRINES AND PHILOSOPHIES AND IDOLS ). They will be as angels of God in heaven meaning they will be messengers of God. they will only obey God now. no more idols. total allegiance to God

truthislight:

how easily you forgot that the disciple Philip saw Jesus "in his heavenly glory standing at the right hand of God"

since you forgot you got confuse by the scriptures.

Sorry friend.

truthislight:

not only you bro, the guy has gut some skills of weight lifting.
Lol.

truthislight:

my dear brother, please dont forget that that statement was made reply to a question that the pharisees ask Jesus about about a woman and seven brothers that got married to her and who will she marry at the recreation?

And he said the above that the "resurrected will be as the angels that they will not get married"

are you saying that Jesus christ was lying to them?

Freksy:

Now tell us, your position regarding death resulting from sin better fits which of the following two statements?

1. "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil , thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die". - Gen. 2:17 KJV

God later shaded more light on Gen. 2:17 regarding death as follows:

"In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread , till thou return unto the ground ; for out of it wast thou taken : for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return". - Gen. 3:19 KJV


2. "And the serpent said unto the woman , Ye shall not surely die" - Gen. 3:4 KJV

truthislight:

hahahahahaha^^^ hahahahaha^^^hahaha

lol in 20 languages including chinese.

Kiakiakia, MOmom, Hohoho. Lalalala, nanana, bababababa, kokokoko etc.

Anything goes for you.

Mr_Anony: Hmmm,
I had a busy day yesterday and thankfully this thread hasn't degenerated yet and we have been able to keep the insults and sectarianism to a minimum. I might not be able to post much today cause I've got a mountain of stuff to take care of (I might just be able to sneak in this post this morning before running off).

I'll give this as sort of a summary answer to objections raised so far.

It breaks my heart to have brothers who look the scripture in the eye and deny it. Thankfully, we have gotten rid of the emotional argument of a loving cuddly teddybear kind of God who won't hurt a fly.

One thing with scripture is that scripture is one. It is either all of it makes sense or none of it does. The validity of a post is not based on how many verses the poster was able to spit out but on whether the post is in alignment with what the scripture is saying.
It is bad practice to argue based on "I have 3 verses while you have 2 therefore I win" That is an insult to scripture. Scripture must be as a whole.

When we argue about hell and we raise the parable of the rich man and lazarus, and also the parables Jesus always ends with the sinner being thrown into the outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Some of us immediately write it off as if it being a parable somehow makes it less true. What is even more surprising is that these same people quote a psalm (a song) or a proverb (which can also be called a parable) in order to make their points. As if a psalm and proverb are somehow more literal.
When we talk about the book of Revelations or souls and spirits of men, they say oh it is a "vision" only to quote a prophecy (which is also a vision).

Please I beg us all, let us stop insulting the Word of God like this. If a verse of scripture seems to conflict with another verse, The aim should be reconciling them so as to understand them. Instead of discrediting their value and trying to make one verse "more correct" than another.

Another tactic which I find equally puzzling is when they ask "what is the rich man's name?", "where are adam and eve","did fire burn Jesus", "who will torment the devil" (even when the bible clearly says that he will be tormented forever)etc. As if these irrelevant questions somehow mean anything or make a narrative any less valid.

If we read something from the bible, we must learn to submit to it and accept it as true even if we don't like it.


A quote I particularly like is one from Lord Reed. I believe he put it best. And I noticed everyone seemed to avoid the question he asked there.



I'll ask the same question to all of us.

[size=13pt]
Even if it is "just a parable", Why would Jesus use false conditions to illustrate a truth?[/size]

This is a question we must ask ourselves instead of merely writing it off because it is a "parable".

The thing is that if you try hard enough, you can escape from the truth. The real question is: At what price?
I urge us all, let us seek the truth instead of trying to escape from it.

The aim of this discussion is not to break into camps and "try to win" but to find out the truth of what awaits a sinner after he has died.




@Ihedinobi:

My twin bro: Good to see you finally joined in. I have noted your comment and you know my heart. I will continue to pray and hope that these men see, I will continue to give a long rope until the Holy Spirit relieves me of the responsibility and then it is feet-dusting time. (You are like Paul and me like Barnabas...but let us not split over John Mark )

Please ignore a certain someone who really isn't on this thread. Don't bother replying him.

ijawkid:

I just went through isaiah 14...


And aLl it did was re-affirm the bibles stand on the fact that eternal death or everlasting destruction is what awaits persons or nations who don't obey God...



I would like to point out to you first that isaiah 14 was a ""proverbial saying"" against the ""babylonian dynasty.""..(isaiah 14:4-6)
The subject of that prophecy is ""BABYLON""....verse 4 transpicuously tells us that...


those expressions penned down through out this chapter are a symbol of what babylon will face and what it did Face....

Isaiah 14:7-8 shows how the kings of the nations round about were to babylons rulers,like trees to be cut down and used for their own purposes..well all of that is finished since the wood cutter(babylon) is soon to be destroyed....

So astonishing was babylons fall that even HELL reacts...
Mind you ihedinobi,HELL is sheol or hades, the coMmon grave of mankind,not a literal fiery place of torment...

This powerful poetic image depicts HELL(common grave of mankind) as waking up all those kings who preceded the babylonian dynasty into death so that they can greet the new comer..they mock the babylonian ruling power,which is now feeble,helpless and lying down on a bed of maggots...(Isaiah 14:9-11)...

This proverbial pronouncment coÑtinues in verse 12 as babylons kings A.K.A lucifer according to the KJV is cut down to the earth..babylon§ pomp and priÐe met its end...

Verses 15-17 shows the reversal that was in store for the proud babylonian dynasty..
The ambitious dynasty will come down to Hades(sheol) just like any human...

So ihedinobi I don't see how this chapter of isaiah supports your stance on the eternal fiery torment dogma...

Rather this chapter proverbially explains how the fall or destruction of the babylonian Dynasty would be.."" permanent and complete"".....it would be rooted out..there would be no renaissance of that dynasty....

Verses 21-23 tells us that...

21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the
iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise,
nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the
world with cities.
22 For I will rise up against them, saith the
LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the
name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith
the LORD.
23 I will also make it a possession for the
bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it
with the besom of ""destruction"", saith the
LORD of hosts.
(KJV)

Read verse 23 in particular....total destruction is what befell babylon,not some literal everlasting torment in a furnace...


The medo persian world power gladly carried out this proverbial sayings on babylon.....

...

Ihedinobi my bro always remember that the word ""HELL"" is never a place of torment but mans common grave....the KJV's mistransliteratiÓn is what has been causing thi§ confusion over time....

Paris_Love: I really don't have a stance whether hell here is symbolic or literal. Of course as a sinner that i am, I'd love to think hell is symbolic or does not exist. But, does the bible really support this view?

For does who think hell fire here means grave, death or something should please explain this verse

Mark:9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God withone eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:

48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Ihedinobi:

I only asked who you thought was the subject of those two prophecies Anyway, you said Babylon.

You know, if you guys stopped thinking for a minute that someone is trying to defeat you in an argument, you might actually start saying things that really make sense. The question was not a trap. It was meant to see what you really know about prophecies. For instance, for whom were the words in Ezekiel 28 about being full of wisdom and beauty etc etc meant? That would help me deal with Isaiah 34:9, 10 without ripping Scriptures apart.

Don't bother about teaching me, just provide simple answers and I'll do my best to understand you.

Edited for word correction.

Mr_Anony: Hmmm,
I had a busy day yesterday and thankfully this thread hasn't degenerated yet and we have been able to keep the insults and sectarianism to a minimum. I might not be able to post much today cause I've got a mountain of stuff to take care of (I might just be able to sneak in this post this morning before running off).

I'll give this as sort of a summary answer to objections raised so far.

It breaks my heart to have brothers who look the scripture in the eye and deny it. Thankfully, we have gotten rid of the emotional argument of a loving cuddly teddybear kind of God who won't hurt a fly.

One thing with scripture is that scripture is one. It is either all of it makes sense or none of it does. The validity of a post is not based on how many verses the poster was able to spit out but on whether the post is in alignment with what the scripture is saying.
It is bad practice to argue based on "I have 3 verses while you have 2 therefore I win" That is an insult to scripture. Scripture must be as a whole.

When we argue about hell and we raise the parable of the rich man and lazarus, and also the parables Jesus always ends with the sinner being thrown into the outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Some of us immediately write it off as if it being a parable somehow makes it less true. What is even more surprising is that these same people quote a psalm (a song) or a proverb (which can also be called a parable) in order to make their points. As if a psalm and proverb are somehow more literal.
When we talk about the book of Revelations or souls and spirits of men, they say oh it is a "vision" only to quote a prophecy (which is also a vision).

Please I beg us all, let us stop insulting the Word of God like this. If a verse of scripture seems to conflict with another verse, The aim should be reconciling them so as to understand them. Instead of discrediting their value and trying to make one verse "more correct" than another.

Another tactic which I find equally puzzling is when they ask "what is the rich man's name?", "where are adam and eve","did fire burn Jesus", "who will torment the devil" (even when the bible clearly says that he will be tormented forever)etc. As if these irrelevant questions somehow mean anything or make a narrative any less valid.

If we read something from the bible, we must learn to submit to it and accept it as true even if we don't like it.


A quote I particularly like is one from Lord Reed. I believe he put it best. And I noticed everyone seemed to avoid the question he asked there.



I'll ask the same question to all of us.

[size=13pt]
Even if it is "just a parable", Why would Jesus use false conditions to illustrate a truth?[/size]

This is a question we must ask ourselves instead of merely writing it off because it is a "parable".

The thing is that if you try hard enough, you can escape from the truth. The real question is: At what price?
I urge us all, let us seek the truth instead of trying to escape from it.

The aim of this discussion is not to break into camps and "try to win" but to find out the truth of what awaits a sinner after he has died.




@Ihedinobi:

My twin bro: Good to see you finally joined in. I have noted your comment and you know my heart. I will continue to pray and hope that these men see, I will continue to give a long rope until the Holy Spirit relieves me of the responsibility and then it is feet-dusting time. (You are like Paul and me like Barnabas...but let us not split over John Mark )

Please ignore a certain someone who really isn't on this thread. Don't bother replying him.

ijawkid:

Ok sorry my comrade....I"m loyal......

I just added those few details to just give an over view of that chapter......

We are both learning....thanks.....

cyrexx:



this got me laughing in Aramaic and Koine Greek.

The posts of that certain someone will remain as a part of modicum of balance and sense on this thread whether you choose to ignore it or not and whether or not you like what he is saying

SUPPRESSION AND DENIAL of that someone's words is not the same as NEGATION AND REFUTATION that someonels words, especially when that someone explicitly states that he is just posting to air his views (and you cant tell him where to or where not to air his views; this is nairaland, not christianland) and he is not expecting responses that will distract or derail the thread.

cyrexx:

i hope you know that that statement was originally a spoken word by Jesus, not a written word. The comma was inserted later by scholars based on their understanding.
The comma could as well be placed elsewhere and the verse could equally have read like this
"I say unto you today, you shall be with me in paradise"

ijawkid:

You didn't quote any scripture Jesus was conscious of his surrounding at death...or that he was somewhere else while still in the grave for 3 good days......

Did Jesus go to heaven the very day he made that promise to the robber??or did the robber go to heaven??

1 Peter 3
King James Version (KJV)
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

Lord_Reed:

On what basis are you making that change? Where is the evidence?



Here you go:

Lord_Reed:

One thing is clear from scriptures that men are conscious after they die.



There is a holding place for the dead or Jesus would not have said "Today...".



O c'mon don't nitpick. Are you going to say you need scripture before I can say God is intelligent? This a universally held attribute that barely needs introduction into any topic. We would not even be having this discussion if we didn't accept it without reservation.

Lord_Reed: One thing is clear from scriptures that men are conscious after they die.

Lord_Reed: There is a holding place for the dead or Jesus would not have said "Today...".

Lord_Reed:
O c'mon don't nitpick. Are you going to say you need scripture before I can say God is intelligent? This a universally held attribute that barely needs introduction into any topic. We would not even be having this discussion if we didn't accept it without reservation.

frosbel:

We are all busy mate, there is a word called multitasking , no ?

Anony , remember what I said about context , truth and consistency ?

We MUST always compare scripture with scripture from the Old Testament to the New Testament.

You cannot and dare I say even allowed to form a doctrine from a parable in one chapter of the bible.

Quotation of the bible in context is key to verifying and understanding foundational truths.

No one is denying HELL , certainly not me.

The crux of the matter is the nature of this place called HELL.

Is it a NOW thing or a LATER thing ?

Will the Judge of the earth not do right as Abraham lamented to GOD when he was about to destroy Sodom.

God is JUST and therefore he cannot sentence a prisoner before judgement, otherwise the judgement becomes irrelevant.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad - 2 Corinthians 5:10

To suggest that a criminal is punished before judgement is actually lying against GOD, even earthly judges will feel this is not appropriate. You only find this sort of thing in Nigeria where suspects languish behind bars in abject misery for years even before Judgement. And then we all fight against this injustice with the support of human rights groups etc. If we mortals can have this level of morality how much more GOD.

My friend, God always does what is right, the guilty will not be acquitted and must face the punishment , but not before judgement.

Which is why we have the resurrection unto judgement and the great white throne judgement etc.

Remember that famous scripture that goes, "it is appointed to MAN to die once and after that judgement". This cannot mean an immediate judgement, this is talking about the same judgement as mentioned previously.

Therefore once we die , we sleep , totally void of consciousness or memory until the trumpet sounds and then and only then will we face Jesus on his judgement seat.

To try and twist this TRUTH is to exhibit a disrespect for God's WORD and logic.

Indeed it is , because John was in a vision , so the bible says , and he received prophecy or revelation from Jesus who in turn received this from GOD.

Revelation is an unfolding of TRUTH .

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John" - Revelation 1:1

Is this all you have left, a get out of jail free card which actually is simply a Parable ?

Common you can do better.

And this same devil you talk about is the same one that will be destroyed in Ezeiekel 28 , no ? I bet you won't even go there, any scripture that lights up the truth to debunk your myth will always be avoided by you , this is something I have noticed.

We are not fools who accept anything , just because Prophet Anony says it is true.

This is precisely why 85% of the church is in error.

We are called to careful study and meditate on the WORD of GOD , not some concocted blind FAITH.

God created logic and he gave us a brain to apply reason to logic , to suggest otherwise is to turn MAN into a robot who has not capacity to think, learn and make the right decisions.

May I end this comment by saying that when you arrogantly prevent others from learning, though they may be Muslims or Atheists , you are actually a stumbling block to their salvation.

Ihedinobi:

Twin bro, I actually barely ever have the time to get on nl these days. Thankfully, the project has gotten big enough to eat up far more of my time than before what with all the research involved. So, I post only when I find the time and I have learned to use my resources better so you need not worry about me wasting God's trust to me answering certain sentiments. After all, I've been in the know for long enough that our alliance is very nerve-wracking for some interests. I don't intend to help them break it down.

I assure you there will not be any kind of split. We are as we should be. I really don't want you to become as hardhitting as myself, and while I totally appreciate your longsuffering, I am extremely conscious of the value of Christ and will quickly apprise anyone who names Him of that fact. We cannot split over that. If you were me, some people would probably never get into the Kingdom. If I were you, some people would probably never get through a day without spitting on Christ somehow. Together we make it possible for those who will be saved to be saved and for all who will know to know that Christ Jesus is God's All.

Don't let your heart be troubled. The thing does not exist that can destroy our communion.

Mr_Anony:
I love you, my brother.

ijawkid:

Lol.....

So while in the grave Christ went to visit the spirits in prison??is that what you are saying??

If Christs spirit had already started roving about before his ressurection,then of what use was God ressurecting him again??

Why ressuect someone who doesn't need ressurection??


Chei I don die ooooo.............

truthislight:

yes you are right, you have the knowledge that satan has been spreading befor God chose Israel and start teaching them and gave them the true knowledge.
Satan's knowledge, that is the knowledge that is available all over the place.

if you need the knowledge that is Truth you have to read God's word the bible well and trough away all others.

That is why you said the thief was with Jesus that same day

ijawkid:

Lol.....

So while in the grave Christ went to visit the spirits in prison??is that what you are saying??

If Christs spirit had already started roving about before his ressurection,then of what use was God ressurecting him again??

Why ressuect someone who doesn't need ressurection??


Chei I don die ooooo.............

obadiah777: YOU DO KNOW THAT SCRIPTURE DO SAY IF A MAN SLEEP WITH MANKIND AS HE DO A WOMAN, HE SHALL BE PUT TO DEATH

frosbel:

We are all busy mate, there is a word called multitasking , no ?




Anony , remember what I said about context , truth and consistency ?

We MUST always compare scripture with scripture from the Old Testament to the New Testament.

You cannot and dare I say even allowed to form a doctrine from a parable in one chapter of the bible.

Quotation of the bible in context is key to verifying and understanding foundational truths.




No one is denying HELL , certainly not me.

The crux of the matter is the nature of this place called HELL.

Is it a NOW thing or a LATER thing ?

Will the Judge of the earth not do right as Abraham lamented to GOD when he was about to destroy Sodom.

God is JUST and therefore he cannot sentence a prisoner before judgement, otherwise the judgement becomes irrelevant.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad - 2 Corinthians 5:10

To suggest that a criminal is punished before judgement is actually lying against GOD, even earthly judges will feel this is not appropriate. You only find this sort of thing in Nigeria where suspects languish behind bars in abject misery for years even before Judgement. And then we all fight against this injustice with the support of human rights groups etc. If we mortals can have this level of morality how much more GOD.

My friend, God always does what is right, the guilty will not be acquitted and must face the punishment , but not before judgement.

Which is why we have the resurrection unto judgement and the great white throne judgement etc.

Remember that famous scripture that goes, "it is appointed to MAN to die once and after that judgement". This cannot mean an immediate judgement, this is talking about the same judgement as mentioned previously.

Therefore once we die , we sleep , totally void of consciousness or memory until the trumpet sounds and then and only then will we face Jesus on his judgement seat.

To try and twist this TRUTH is to exhibit a disrespect for God's WORD and logic.




Indeed it is , because John was in a vision , so the bible says , and he received prophecy or revelation from Jesus who in turn received this from GOD.

Revelation is an unfolding of TRUTH .

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John" - Revelation 1:1



Actually , this is quite a dishonest statement, it is rather you and your twin brother who seem to have a knack for this increasing trend.




Is this all you have left, a get out of jail free card which actually is simply a Parable ?

Common you can do better.

And this same devil you talk about is the same one that will be destroyed in Ezeiekel 28 , no ? I bet you won't even go there, any scripture that lights up the truth to debunk your myth will always be avoided by you , this is something I have noticed.



We are not fools who accept anything , just because Prophet Anony says it is true.

This is precisely why 85% of the church is in error.

We are called to careful study and meditate on the WORD of GOD , not some concocted blind FAITH.

God created logic and he gave us a brain to apply reason to logic , to suggest otherwise is to turn MAN into a robot who has not capacity to think, learn and make the right decisions.


May I end this comment by saying that when you arrogantly prevent others from learning, though they may be Muslims or Atheists , you are actually a stumbling block to their salvation.