I am DrummaBoy and I endorse every word written above by our brother and Pastor christembassey. Being the only practicing pastor among the presenter the preaching can be felt. God bless u our brother. The floor is still open to Q and A!

@ all, **pls sing with me** "it is enough that Jesus died and that he died for me (2x) , I have NO other argument, I have NO other plea - for, it is enough that Jesus died AND THAT HE DIED FOR MEEEEEEEEEEEE!. I want to apologise to all 4 d delay of my presentation, I have told Goshen d reasons behind d delays which are still valid, but d real truth is that, when it comes to preaching d Good News to d poor and equiping/edificatin of d Saints, i do not endore 'academic or intelectual process, tro prepared speach, I believe that God always want to speak to his ppl directly on d spur of d moment, so i'd rather stand, open and close my mouth n let God tro his spirit speak directly. So I planed to come online an hour b4 Am due to make a live presentation, but few hours to my time, my pc packed up, hence d delay. I know in d process of trying to articulate thoughts on paper n d presure of late presentation, many vital points are lost, but I trust d Spirit, our great teacher will increase and perfect you as regards this paper according to his purpose. AMEN. I thank Goshen, Drummaboy, Tgirl, d mods, all d teachers, Bidam, Image123, that sister who blessed us so much with those very edifying hymes, ATMC, all d attendees christians n non-christians alike and the Almighty God for the GRACE to share in this convention. "Grace and Peace be multiplied to all tro d knowledge of God and of his son Jesus. Who tro his Divine power hath given to us ALL THINGS THAT PERTAINS TO LIFE AND GODLINESS" AMEN. Praise the Lord!!! Abeg make una bring ur tithes and painful seeds that will move god hand n leg in ur direction, * i dey l tell una ooo,* key in ooo to dis grace, *laughs n leaves d podium*

God bless you Christembassy, Goshen360, Drummaboy, Enigma, all the preachers... and attendants... I was able to finish my 3day wait thru your words of encouragement, help and GRACE of GOD... I Love you all...

christemmbassey: @ all, **pls sing with me** "it is enough that Jesus died and that he died for me (2x) , I have NO other argument, I have NO other plea - for, it is enough that Jesus died AND THAT HE DIED FOR MEEEEEEEEEEEE!. I want to apologise to all 4 d delay of my presentation, I have told Goshen d reasons behind d delays which are still valid, but d real truth is that, when it comes to preaching d Good News to d poor and equiping/edificatin of d Saints, i do not endore 'academic or intelectual process, tro prepared speach, I believe that God always want to speak to his ppl directly on d spur of d moment, so i'd rather stand, open and close my mouth n let God tro his spirit speak directly. So I planed to come online an hour b4 Am due to make a live presentation, but few hours to my time, my pc packed up, hence d delay. I know in d process of trying to articulate thoughts on paper n d presure of late presentation, many vital points are lost, but I trust d Spirit, our great teacher will increase and perfect you as regards this paper according to his purpose. AMEN. I thank Goshen, Drummaboy, Tgirl, d mods, all d teachers, Bidam, Image123, that sister who blessed us so much with those very edifying hymes, ATMC, all d attendees christians n non-christians alike and the Almighty God for the GRACE to share in this convention. "Grace and Peace be multiplied to all tro d knowledge of God and of his son Jesus. Who tro his Divine power hath given to us ALL THINGS THAT PERTAINS TO LIFE AND GODLINESS" AMEN. Praise the Lord!!! Abeg make una bring ur tithes and painful seeds that will move god hand n leg in ur direction, * i dey l tell una ooo,* key in ooo to dis grace, *laughs n leaves d podium*

DrummaBoy:

DrummaBoy:

wetin u dey laugh? Abeg bring ur tithe n painful seed joor!

Please ChristEmbassy, can I please get your presentation in docx or pdf format.

Thanks a lot

moshoodn: Please ChristEmbassy, can I please get your presentation in docx or pdf format.

Thanks a lot

pls send ur email to 08188294293,

christemmbassey: pls send ur email to 08188294293,

I've done that...

Thanks.

The LORD fortress bless the teacher christemmbassey so much. Today, the LORD our fortress used your teachings to set my free. I testify before everyone that I am free today. I will proclaim the freedom in Christ to my household. The convention is in deed a grace blessing to me. LORD OUR FORTRESS bless the organisers too.

@Christemmbassy,

If someone has been born again and as time goes on he falls into the sin of fornication etc. do you mean that the person has not sinned? Because he is under grace?

alexleo: @Christemmbassy,

If someone has been born again and as time goes on he falls into the sin of fornication etc. do you mean that the person has not sinned? Because he is under grace?

my brother take a look @ d story of d prodigal son, to his elder brother, he was a terrible sinner and deserved no mercy or welcome, but to their father, he never sined, that was why, as he rushed out to welcome d boy and d boy started convesions, d father did not even hear, his main concern was, "my boy was lost, but is now found, he was dead, but now lives, lets celebrate. Fortunately, for us christians, we have an elder brother who loves us (unlike the jealous law of Moses keeping elder brother of d prodigal son,) who d bible says "is nt ashame to call us brethren. Yes to you, he sin, but to God he never sined, bc "he can nt commit sin" 1jn 3:9, a christian is NOT 'a forgiven man' but 'a JUSTIFIED man'. He is innoscent, acquited, decleard, 'not guilty', why? Bc, every sin commited, d spirit activate a bill, grace paid up and is back dated to Calvary, IT LIKE SOME ONE DEPOSITED MONEY IN A SHOP AND GAVE A PERPETUAL STANDING ORDER, THAT ANY TIME U PICK SMTHING FROM THAT SHOP, D SHOP KEEPER SHOULD REMOVE FROM D CONTIGENCY FUND. should we indulge in sin bc of this? GOD FORBID BAD THING?. Now my bros, d man dat used to commit sin, died @ Calvary, d one dat lives now is Christ, Gal 2:20. CHRIST CAN NOT COMMIT SIN. He is holy and righteous. God bless u sir..

alexleo: @Christemmbassy,

If someone has been born again and as time goes on he falls into the sin of fornication etc. do you mean that the person has not sinned? Because he is under grace?

to u he has sin and u may condem him, d bible says, "who are you to condem another man's servant(son)? To his master(father), he standeth or falls", God said, "whosoever is born of God, CAN NOT COMMIT SIN, BC HIS SEED(CHRIST-GOD'S GRACE) QEMAINETH IN HIM". Its either God is telling d truth or not, i believe, he's telling the truth. Pls dont believe ur experience, but believe God.

1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.


And John was writing to Christians.

Enigma: 1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.


And John was writing to Christians.

brother, do u undastand d story of Nebuchadnezzar and d prodigal son? Besides that, its not d christian who says, "i can not sin". Its God that says, shut up, you can not sin, bc u're my son!, born again, NOT OF CORUPTIBLE SEED, BUT OF INCORUPTIBLE, by the word of God that liveth and abideth for ever, it is GRACE my brother, u may say , i've sined, but God say no, it was Christ tha sined, and he was purnished for that at Calvary. O how i wish u undastand this thing, sin consciousness is the bane of many christians, and that is why they sin, when u look at urself and say i am a useless flesh and bloody sinner, u have rejected the grace of Jesus and looking at the law of Moses, that's 'PROFANITY' James 1:25 says "but who so looked at the perfect LAW OF LIBERTY, amd contenueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but the doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deeds". I dont know about u, but for me, i will always look at the perfect law of liberty(of Jesus), who will always pronounce on me, NOT GUILTY, DISCHARGE AND ACQUITED. God bless u sir.

Bros, I understand that presenters are not supposed to challenge each other's presentations. Also, I am interpreting that as meaning it is inadvisable to argue on this thread.

Nevertheless, I must make clear and I am making clear that I do not subscribe to an interpretation that says Christians cannot commit sin.

What Jesus and the apostles taught is to ask for forgiveness.

That is my own view.

God bless you too very much, my brother.

Enigma: Bros, I understand that presenters are not supposed to challenge each other's presentations. Also, I am interpreting that as meaning it is inadvisable to argue on this thread.

Nevertheless, I must make clear and I am making clear that I do not subscribe to an interpretation that says Christians cannot commit sin.

What Jesus and the apostles taught is to ask for forgiveness.

That is my own view.

God bless you too very much, my brother.

we are not arguing but discusing as brethren that we are, ok, pls what do u think of 1jn 3:9, and 1Peter 1:23.

Bros, please let me excuse myself; I think it is better that I just make my own position known as I have done.

Specifically on 1 John 3:9, I suggest reading it in the NIV just for an idea of how it might be interpreted without taking anything away from 1 Peter 1:23.

Enigma: Bros, I understand that presenters are not supposed to challenge each other's presentations. Also, I am interpreting that as meaning it is inadvisable to argue on this thread.

Nevertheless, I must make clear and I am making clear that I do not subscribe to an interpretation that says Christians cannot commit sin.

What Jesus and the apostles taught is to ask for forgiveness.

That is my own view.

God bless you too very much, my brother.

I am also in support of enigma's position

Enigma: Bros, please let me excuse myself; I think it is better that I just make my own position known as I have done.

Specifically on 1 John 3:9, I suggest reading it in the NIV just for an idea of how it might be interpreted without taking anything away from 1 Peter 1:23.

i agree with you as well.

btw @all, when are we having the e-prosperity convention

Zikky Bros!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dat prosperity e-convention can only hold when our our good friend Joagbaje confirms that tithes, firstfruits etc are all up to date.

Nice to 'see' you, bros.

@ Enigma, Kun &ZIKKY, LET EVERY MAN BE FULLY PERSUADED IN THNIR HEART, I REST MY CASE. Grace be mulriplied to all.

Enigma: Zikky Bros!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dat prosperity e-convention can only hold when our our good friend Joagbaje confirms that tithes, firstfruits etc are all up to date.

Nice to 'see' you, bros.

Let's leave the merchandizers of the gospel to organise that convention.

@ Enigma,

The convention is over. Pls challenge anything you deem necessary to challenge for the sake of those reading.

We are here to uphold God's word.

I am yet to update myself on the latest submissions, so I can't comment directly on the issue.

God bless!

My dear Sis

I think the spirit of this thread is friendliness, fellowship and appreciation of perspectives.

I personally think that we should avoid arguments on this thread. I think if someone feels strongly about anything in particular, they should just express it as a point of view i.e. state that "this is my own position".

Even in churches, when we hear a preacher --- I don't think we always agree with everything they say 100% but a regular service is for celebration and communion so would not be appropriate place to raise a challenge.

I think if anyone feels an issue should be "debated", it is advisable to open a thread for the purpose or to look at old threads (if any) on the topic.

alexleo: @Christemmbassy,

If someone has been born again and as time goes on he falls into the sin of fornication etc. do you mean that the person has not sinned? Because he is under grace?

It is just like a Pig and a cat analogy.

A pig will be happy to wallow in the gutter because it feels that is the natural habitat it loves.

When a cat falls into a gutter,its natural inclination is to jump out quickly because it feels that is not the natural habitat it ought to dwell in,hence the bible says though the righteous falls seven times,he will surely rise again.Proverb 24:16

Bidam: It is just like a Pig and a cat analogy.

A pig will be happy to wallow in the gutter because it feels that is the natural habitat it loves.

When a cat falls into a gutter,its natural inclination is to jump out quickly because it feels that is not the natural habitat it ought to dwell in,hence the bible says though the righteous falls seven times,he will surely rise again.Proverb 24:16

d cnd best i've ever read from d prophet, on point, God bless u plenty.

@Alexleo,
I think Enigma has answered that question well. Part of the strategy of the enemy is making a Christian sin and feel he has not sinned because he 'cannot sin'. That is one of the worst deceptions because that person will not tap into the grace of God. When people tell the story of the prodigal son, they fail to understand that the prodigal son REALISED what he had done and turned back and RETURNED home and His father was waiting.
God is always waiting...If we fail to return claiming all is well, we deceive ourselves.

Grace is ever available but if the sinner does not draw from it, it is a waste to the sinner not the father. It is the sinner that loses and suffers for it.

I really expected to gain a lot on grace in this convention as an enabler and a helper as grace has helped me do things I never thought I could do and I did not get the nitty-gritty of that though Ayoku I believe may have handled that. That is how I know grace is beyond a saver, it's other key role is a helper, teacher perfecter and trainer and makes us more like Christ, a people zealous for good works.

Enigma: 1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.


And John was writing to Christians.

I agree 100 percent with you my brother. 1 John 2:1-2 confirms this too.---

1 My little children, these things write I unto you, THAT YE SIN NOT. And IF ANY MAN SIN, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Alwaystrue: @Alexleo,
I think Enigma has answered that question well. Part of the strategy of the enemy is making a Christian sin and feel he has not sinned because he 'cannot sin'. That is one of the worst deceptions because that person will not tap into the grace of God. When people tell the story of the prodigal son, they fail to understand that the prodigal son REALISED what he had done and turned back and RETURNED home and His father was waiting.
God is always waiting...If we fail to return claiming all is well, we deceive ourselves.

The definition of sin never changed because grace was poured out.Sin is still lawlessness to God. Grace only came to give us that which we couldn't attain on our own & that is the righteousness that meets God's standard.

A Christian might fall occasionally, in fact he'll fall as he's still in this corruptible body of flesh but he'll never be comfortable there as the seed of God(holy spirit) resides in him and it is an enemy of the flesh.

Grace is NOT and CAN NEVER be License to engage in sin

Grace is ever available but if the sinner does not draw from it, it is a waste to the sinner not the father. It is the sinner that loses and suffers for it.

I really expected to gain a lot on grace in this convention as an enabler and a helper as grace has helped me do things I never thought I could do and I did not get the nitty-gritty of that though Ayoku I believe may have handled that. That is how I know grace is beyond a saver, it's other key role is a helper, teacher perfecter and trainer and makes us more like Christ, a people zealous for good works.

Dear sister, the grace of God is beyond our comprehension. We can only try to imagine. I also wish Ayoku and Shdemidemi can create time to bless us with their own topics.God bless u plenty

Bidam: It is just like a Pig and a cat analogy.

A pig will be happy to wallow in the gutter because it feels that is the natural habitat it loves.

When a cat falls into a gutter,its natural inclination is to jump out quickly because it feels that is not the natural habitat it ought to dwell in,hence the bible says though the righteous falls seven times,he will surely rise again.Proverb 24:16

This also confirms 1 John 2:1-2. Sin is sin. Grace does not redefine sin but when we fall into sin we should do what the scripture I quoted said.

^^ I really like that "cat and pig" analogy very much and that is why I borrowed it from belabela to include it in my presentation.

alexleo: @Christemmbassy,

If someone has been born again and as time goes on he falls into the sin of fornication etc. do you mean that the person has not sinned? Because he is under grace?

christemmbassey: my brother take a look @ d story of d prodigal son, to his elder brother, he was a terrible sinner and deserved no mercy or welcome, but to their father, he never sined, that was why, as he rushed out to welcome d boy and d boy started convesions, d father did not even hear, his main concern was, "my boy was lost, but is now found, he was dead, but now lives, lets celebrate. Fortunately, for us christians, we have an elder brother who loves us (unlike the jealous law of Moses keeping elder brother of d prodigal son,) who d bible says "is nt ashame to call us brethren. Yes to you, he sin, but to God he never sined, bc "he can nt commit sin" 1jn 3:9, a christian is NOT 'a forgiven man' but 'a JUSTIFIED man'. He is innoscent, acquited, decleard, 'not guilty', why? Bc, every sin commited, d spirit activate a bill, grace paid up and is back dated to Calvary, IT LIKE SOME ONE DEPOSITED MONEY IN A SHOP AND GAVE A PERPETUAL STANDING ORDER, THAT ANY TIME U PICK SMTHING FROM THAT SHOP, D SHOP KEEPER SHOULD REMOVE FROM D CONTIGENCY FUND. should we indulge in sin bc of this? GOD FORBID BAD THING?. Now my bros, d man dat used to commit sin, died @ Calvary, d one dat lives now is Christ, Gal 2:20. CHRIST CAN NOT COMMIT SIN. He is holy and righteous. God bless u sir..

Enigma: 1 John 1

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.


And John was writing to Christians.

My Position

I think that Enigma and Christembassey are on the same page here. The two have provided scripturally correct positions to the question asked by Alexleo. The question is (paraphrased) can a believer commit the sin of fornication? My answer is: is there a greater sin in Christendom today than the sin of fornication? We may say yes there are others; but in reality, practice and perspective of the average Christian, there is no greater sin than the sin of fornication. If you are in doubt ask COZA. LOLZ!

But my point in that answer is that there are greater sins than the sin of fornication. It was the late Pastor R B Thieme that coined the term "mental attitude sins", when he tried to describe Jesus discourse about defilement coming from within and not without; and how Christ said that beholding a woman in a manner is as bad as a sin of adultery. Women may not understand this, but there is no man on earth that doesn't know this kind of sin: Lust. When we realize that mental attitude sin is as bad as any overt sin, we must then resort to scripture to help us comprehend sin in its true nature and let the same scripture offer to us the solution Jesus came to provide for the all consuming problem of sin (Matthew 1:21).

I said all that only to prove the fact that Enigma and Christembassey are right. The bible and the grace that came with Jesus provided two solutions to sin; and it is the two position each of our teachers have provided above, albeit independently. There is a positional solution to sin, that causes God to impart Jesus' righteousness on all that believe such that sin or no sin, such a believer cannot sin! There is an outworking solution for sin also: so that the believer that sin, and sins as gravely as fornication or any mental attitude sin, causes the Spirit of God within him to be grieved, which should make a sensitive believer to be convicted of sin and leads him to ask God for forgiveness. It is for this that the scripture, 1 Jn 1:8,9, applies so adequately to.

In trying to blend the two positions of our teachers above, I wish that every Christian is not so concerned about sin or no sin; but rather with the grace that Jesus died for us to enjoy. Let sin, like the matter of praying against satan, be relegated to a background, where believers can privately meet God and settle scores with. If we should be concerned about sin at all, let us be concerned about our own sins: the log in our own eye! The danger with an overly concern with sin, especially the sins of others, is the tendency toward self righteousness and pride: a mental attitude sin that outweighs all of fornication and adultery combined together.