solite3:
you are the one contradicting yourself. How can a man without the Spirit produce the fruit of the spirit?




Genesis 15:6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

Mr twister, look at what the bible said Abraham believed in The LORD and imediately it was accounted to him for righteousness. God did not wait to see Abraham's work. Abraham's work was just a testament that he has been justified.
Rahab the harlot's faith was confirmed by her works.





The theif on the cross had no work but yet he was saved does this not expose your heresy?

If the law of moses can not save no other commandment can.

No sir its either faith alone or works alone. It can never be the two.

Romans 11:6
And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

I am glad you brought up the case of the thief on the cross, I was expecting that...

Are you using the case of a man whom at the point of death to tell us.

1) He would have no works to show for his faith if he had lived?

2) Does that also mean James was wrong to say Faith without works is useless?

Other unanswered questions on the words of Jesus


3) What did Jesus use to separate the goats from the sheeps?

4) Why were the barren branches cut off from the vine and cast into the fire?


5) Why was the man who was unproductive with his talent cast into outer darkness?

6) Why did Jesus say EVERY MAN would be judged according to their works?



IT IS NOT SUFFICIENT TO JUST HEAR AND BELIEVE THE WORD (FAITH & BELIEF), YOU ALSO HAVE TO BE A DOER (WORKS) OF THE WORD!

This has been said repeatedly by Jesus and the Apostles!


Study the parable of the vine. Those that abide in Christ are those that does what He says...not just hearing and doing nothing...

Hearing is the faith, doing is the works.

Remember the scriptures that says Faith cometh by hearing the word... If that alone is sufficient, why did Jesus emphasize on the doing?



Faith and works go hand in hand.

OkCornel:


Did you just say the Law of Liberty James spoke of is the Law of Moses that brings sin-consciousness...


The Law of Moses that constantly reminded the Jews they cannot meet up to God's standard of righteousness and holiness is a reflection of the Law of Liberty?


Are you sure of what you just typed now?

Stop twisting my words. Where did I say the law of moses is a reflection of the law of liberty or rather the law of liberty reflects the law of moses.
the law of liberty fulfills the law of moses.
James 2:7-9 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.


Romans 7:12
Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 8:4
That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

solite3:

Stop twisting my words. Where did I say the law of moses is a reflection of the law of liberty or rather the law of liberty reflects the law of moses.
the law of liberty fulfills the law of moses.
James 2:7-9 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.


Romans 7:12
Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 8:4
That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

How exactly is the stringent Mosaic Law of 613 instructions a reflection of the Law of Liberty? or vice versa...

The same Law that James said if you keep all instructions but break one of it...that you're under it's curse? That same Law is a reflection of the Law of Liberty?

What a joke...

solite3:
you are the one contradicting yourself. How can a man without the Spirit produce the fruit of the spirit?

Where did I mention a man without the Spirit will produce the fruits of the spirit?

solite3:

Genesis 15:6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.

Mr twister, look at what the bible said Abraham believed in The LORD and imediately it was accounted to him for righteousness. God did not wait to see Abraham's work. Abraham's work was just a testament that he has been justified.
Rahab the harlot's faith was confirmed by her works.

Read what James said again on how Faith without works is useless. Pay special attention to James 2 v 24

James 2
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

Solite3, according to you...all the branches in the vine are those who heard the word...

Note that Faith comes by hearing the word...


In that same parable of the vine, Jesus said those who DOES (the works) as He commands are His friends... not just those that hears.

That is what separates a fruitful branch from a barren branch...

And you know the final fate of those branches that bears no fruit...

OkCornel:


You are a very deceitful person.

James asked a question if Faith without works could save. And the answer to his question was still in that same James Chapter 2, but you ran off to Romans.

Please tell us James was wrong to write these;



James clearly wrote in James 2 v 24, that Faith alone can never justify you.

Verse 22 clearly shows Faith and works go hand in hand...

Verse 21 and 25 also showed Abraham and Rahab were justified by works as well...

James 2 v 20 and 26 clearly says Faith without works is USELESS, DEAD!

Na dead faith this guy wan carry enter heaven?

I am eagerly awaiting you to call James a Satanist too...

James never gave an answer to his question. None of the verses stated that faith needs works before salvation can take place.

James also never said Faith without works is useless. He only said it's dead. A company which has it's factory abandoned can be said to be a dead company because it's not working. But does that mean the company is not there? It is there but not working. When it's starts working, we say it is alive. When it stops, it is dead. This in no way means it is non-existent.

OkCornel:


To think I'm discussing with someone who is saying Abraham committed sin by having several concubines...


Didn't God even approve of this same concubine/polygamy arrangement when he rebuked David for killing Uriah to get Bathsheba? So according to you, God encouraged David to sin...

Infact Jacob also sinned against God for having Bilhah and Zilpah as concubines...


Smh

Having concubines are sins. Nowhere did God approve of it. You are a satanic liar if you can't show where God approved of it.

To clearly show that God didn't approve of it, he doesn't approve of concubines today. God is the same Yesterday, today and forever. What he approved in the past still gets approved of today. What he disapproved of still gets disapproved of today.

His plan has always been one man one wife. But just made us disobey.

OkCornel:



I have brought the words of Jesus here for you to dispute or agree...


1) On what basis were the sheeps separated from the goats?

2) Why do you have the barren branches in the vine cast into the fire?

3) Why was the man who was unproductive with his talent cast into outer darkness?

4) Why did Jesus say EVERY MAN would be judged according to their works?

I'm glad you couldn't challenge the Bible verses in my post. Instead you took the easy way out by asking these dumb questions.


1.) The motive behind this question is to prove that the sheep and goats were separated by their works. You are clearly wrong on that. Yes, the passage shows that the sheep and goats were rewarded according to their works, but the separation wasn't according to their works. The separation already took place before they where now judged according to their works. How where they separated?

First and foremost, the fact that they were called sheep and goats has already separated them. What made the sheep to be called sheep?

John 10:27-30
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
30 I and my Father are one.

As seen in verse 27, the sheep hear Jesus voice and follow him. He in turn gives them eternal life and they shall never perish.

John 10:25-26
25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

If you read the verses above on the same chapter, you get to see that Jesus said those who don't believe him are not his sheep. Such are definitely stubborn goats just like you.

So basically, the sheep and the goats are separated on the basis of eternal life. All those who have eternal life as stated in John 3:16 are the sheep which rhymes with John 10:27-28, while those who don't have eternal life are regarded as goats because they don't belong to Christ.

After the separation then comes the reward according to works. Those who helped Jesus and his brethren get rewarded with the inheritance of the kingdom of God.

Mathew 25
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom
prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

The sheep did the will of the father that's why they entered the kingdom.

Mathew 7
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Now what is the will of the father?

John 6:40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day

See how it ties in with John 3:16 that very popular verse.

John 3:16 (KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

2.) The baren branches bore no fruit that's why they were cast into fire. They didn't bear their own fruit neither did they have the fruit of the spirit. Not having the fruits of the spirit means you don't have the Holy Spirit in you. It means you don't belong to Christ and aren't abiding in him. That's why you are not bearing your own fruit nor that of the Spirit.

3.) The unprofitable servant didn't believe in his master, that's why he was cast into hell. The others believed him, so they made use of what he gave them and brought profit. The third servant didn't believe in him, that's why he didn't make use of the talent. He just returned it to his master the way he got it.

Mathew 25
24 Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.

But you think because he did not work, that's why he got condemned. No, he got condemned because he didn't give a damn nor believed in what was given to him. Same way unbelievers don't give a damn about the gospel and don't do anything with it when they receive it. How do I know his condemnation was not because he didn't do works?

Romans 4:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

4.) Yes, Jesus said every man will be judged according to their works. But what he never said is that their works plays any role in their salvation.

Don't you know that a man who saved 10 souls can't get the same reward as one who saved 10,000? Same way a man who rejected Jesus won't get the same hell fire depth as the one who deliberately deceive people into hell, just as you are doing?

OkCornel:


I am glad you brought up the case of the thief on the cross, I was expecting that...

Are you using the case of a man whom at the point of death to tell us.

.

Yes.

You are the one who has to explain to us how the thief on the cross who did no works made heaven because he believed. Are you not the one dancing around that faith and works go hand in hand which implies that one can't make heaven with faith alone?

Oh, you are trying to create an exception for the thief simply because he was dying?

Sorry dude. God doesn't lower his standard, neither did he lower his standard for the thief. The thief already met God's standard which is believe towards eternal life.

John 3:16 (KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

LifestyleTonite:


Yes.

You are the one who has to explain to us how the thief on the cross who did no works made heaven because he believed. Are you not the one dancing around that faith and works go hand in hand which implies that one can't make heaven with faith alone?

Oh, you are trying to create an exception for the thief simply because he was dying?

Sorry dude. God doesn't lower his standard, neither did he lower his standard for the thief. The thief already met God's standard which is believe towards eternal life.

John 3:16 (KJV)
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Yes, God almighty who knows all the possible outcomes of a man's decision is in the best position to grant that thief mercy. If that thief was alive after his encounter with Jesus, his faith would definitely have works to show for it.


Those who had an encounter with Jesus e.g. Zaccheus, The Prostitute turned away from their sinful life...

But you are here telling us one can have faith in Jesus and still live a sinful lifestyle and yet make Heaven!

The thief asked for mercy and repented from his sins. If he had lived on earth after that encounter with Jesus, inevitably there would be works to show for it.


Jesus said in the parable of the vine that those that abide in Him are those who does his words and not just hear them. Those are the people He calls His friends.



For the umpteenth time, I am asking you these questions;

1) What basis did Jesus separate the sheeps from the goats?

2) Why was the man who did not use his Talent cast out of the kingdom into everlasting darkness?

3) If you agree faith comes by hearing the word of God...is hearing the word of God alone sufficient? Why did Jesus say there should be DOERS (works) of the word?

4) Why did Jesus say every man will be judged according to their works?

Can't you see faith and work goes hand in hand as James has said?

OkCornel:


Where did I mention a man without the Spirit will produce the fruits of the spirit?

Read what James said again on how Faith without works is useless. Pay special attention to James 2 v 24

James 2
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

James didn't say faith without works is useless. He only said it is dead. This means it can come back to life. How do we know that faith without works is not useless? It is not useless because it still helps to count one as righteous before God.

Romans 4:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Hope you took note of the Bold parts above. The dead faith which h products no works still helps to count one as righteous before God. But before men, such a person can't be counted as having faith. If we had not read about Abraham's works, we won't have been able to believe he had faith because we can't see his heart. Only God who sees the heart knows he had faith. But Abraham's works which he did are the reason we humans today who can't see his heart know he had faith.

So, never ever downplay a workless faith. That workless faith got the thief into heaven. Why did he get into heaven? He got there because he had faith alone which is all Good wants.

OkCornel:


Yes, God almighty who knows all the possible outcomes of a man's decision is in the best position to grant that thief mercy. If that thief was alive after his encounter with Jesus, his faith would definitely have works to show for it.

God's mercy is the same. He doesn't give different people different chances. He gives same chance to everyone. Here you are lying that God changed his ways by granting the thief free access to heaven without doing works which you say is required to make heaven. What makes you think God is not doing the same for everyone else? Guess what? That's what he simply does according to John 3:16 which doesn't say work is required for eternal life but believe.[/quote]

Those who had an encounter with Jesus e.g. Zaccheus, The Prostitute turned away from their sinful life...

But you are here telling us one can have faith in Jesus and still live a sinful lifestyle and yet make Heaven!

Yes, you can still make heaven despite sins. No man on Earth is without sin. See why I call you a Satanist. You don't want people to accept the gospel. You want them to see it as something difficult to attain because no man can do without sin. Can you mention one man on Earth sithout sin? Are you without sin? Your answers are no. This means no man will make heaven. I'm glad that's not the gospel. Bloody liar that you are.

The thief asked for mercy and repented from his sins. If he had lived on earth after that encounter with Jesus, inevitably there would be works to show for it.

Sorry dude, God only has one standard. It is either faith alone or the faith plus works which you believe in, not both or either of both. The Bible clearly says in Ephesians that it is Faith alone and not of works. It clearly sideline works. That's why the thief who did no works could make heaven.

Jesus said in the parable of the vine that those that abide in Him are those who does his words and not just hear them. Those are the people He calls His friends.

Of course everyone hears his words but not all do his words. His words require us to believe. Those who believe are his friends. They abide with him because they believe. Those who hear but don't believe are those who don't abide with him. They don't abide with him because they don't believe in him.

For the umpteenth time, I am asking you these questions;

1) What basis did Jesus separate the sheeps from the goats?

2) Why was the man who did not use his Talent cast out of the kingdom into everlasting darkness?

3) If you agree faith comes by hearing the word of God...is hearing the word of God alone sufficient? Why did Jesus say there should be DOERS (works) of the word?

4) Why did Jesus say every man will be judged according to their works?

Can't you see faith and work goes hand in hand as James has said?

Stop recycling this dumb questions. I've answered them.

Ah yes, I am back to deal with a heresy where someone claims those who hear the words and believe them alone without doing them can still make heaven...

Now to deal with each mention one by one...

LifestyleTonite:


Having concubines are sins. Nowhere did God approve of it. You are a satanic liar if you can't show where God approved of it.

Like I mentioned earlier on this thread, if having concubines was a sin, that means God was encouraging David into sin when He promised David He could have given him more beautiful ladies if only David asked Him...rather than killing Uriah to take Bathsheba...

2 Samuel 12 v 7-9;

7 Then Nathan said to David, “You are the man! This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: ‘I anointed you king over Israel, and I delivered you from the hand of Saul.

8 I gave your master’s house to you, and your master’s wives into your arms. I gave you all Israel and Judah. And if all this had been too little, I would have given you even more.

9 Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing what is evil in his eyes? You struck down Uriah the Hittite with the sword and took his wife to be your own. You killed him with the sword of the Ammonites.

LifestyleTonite:

To clearly show that God didn't approve of it, he doesn't approve of concubines today. God is the same Yesterday, today and forever. What he approved in the past still gets approved of today. What he disapproved of still gets disapproved of today.

His plan has always been one man one wife. But just made us disobey.

That means Jacob, David, Solomon, other Jewish kings sinned against God because they had more than one wife and various concubines...

But it is that same God you said IS THE SAME YESTERDAY, TODAY AND FOREVER that clearly told David He gave him Saul's wives as an inheritance and would have given him even more if that was little...


You're very ignorant of this and you speedily called me a Satanic Liar. Guy, go and hide your face in shame....

Cc: Budaatum

LifestyleTonite:


James never gave an answer to his question. None of the verses stated that faith needs works before salvation can take place.

James also never said Faith without works is useless. He only said it's dead. A company which has it's factory abandoned can be said to be a dead company because it's not working. But does that mean the company is not there? It is there but not working. When it's starts working, we say it is alive. When it stops, it is dead. This in no way means it is non-existent.

Guy, stop lying brazenly on James head... Follow the entire passage to see the message the author is passing across.

He asked a question in Chapter 2, and the answer to that question was in that same chapter.


James 2 v 14 {Amplified Version}

QUESTION;
14 What is the benefit, my fellow believers, if someone claims to have faith but has no [good] works [as evidence]? Can that [kind of] faith save him? [No, a mere claim of faith is not sufficient—genuine faith produces good works.]


ANSWER;
James 2 v 20-25 {Amplified Version}
20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish [spiritually shallow] person, that faith without [good] works is useless?

21 Was our father Abraham not [shown to be] justified by works [of obedience which expressed his faith] when he offered Isaac his son on the altar [as a sacrifice to God]?

22 You see that [his] faith was working together with his works, and as a result of the works, his faith was completed [reaching its maturity when he expressed his faith through obedience].

23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and this [faith] was credited to him [by God] as righteousness and as conformity to His will,” and he was called the friend of God.

24 You see that a man (believer) is justified by works and not by faith alone [that is, by acts of obedience a born-again believer reveals his faith].

25 In the same way, was Rahab the prostitute not justified by works too, when she received the [Hebrew] [h]spies as guests and protected them, and sent them away [to escape] by a different route?

26 For just as the [human] body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works [of obedience] is also dead.






Lifestyletonite, a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God. A faith without results is worthless.

To cap it off, you are promoting a heresy that Faith with a sinful lifestyle would still guarantee a believer heaven... No one is permitted to sin with the mindset that God's grace would abound...

According to James, only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person, and that such a faith is useless, obsolete and dead...

OkCornel:


Guy, stop lying brazenly on James head... Follow the entire passage to see the message the author is passing across.

He asked a question in Chapter 2, and the answer to that question was in that same chapter.


James 2 v 14 {Amplified Version}

QUESTION;
14 What is the benefit, my fellow believers, if someone claims to have faith but has no [good] works [as evidence]? Can that [kind of] faith save him? [No, a mere claim of faith is not sufficient—genuine faith produces good works.]


ANSWER;
James 2 v 20-25 {Amplified Version}
20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish [spiritually shallow] person, that faith without [good] works is useless?

21 Was our father Abraham not [shown to be] justified by works [of obedience which expressed his faith] when he offered Isaac his son on the altar [as a sacrifice to God]?

22 You see that [his] faith was working together with his works, and as a result of the works, his faith was completed [reaching its maturity when he expressed his faith through obedience].

23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and this [faith] was credited to him [by God] as righteousness and as conformity to His will,” and he was called the friend of God.

24 You see that a man (believer) is justified by works and not by faith alone [that is, by acts of obedience a born-again believer reveals his faith].

25 In the same way, was Rahab the prostitute not justified by works too, when she received the [Hebrew] [h]spies as guests and protected them, and sent them away [to escape] by a different route?

26 For just as the [human] body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works [of obedience] is also dead.






Lifestyletonite, a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God. A faith without results is worthless.

To cap it off, you are promoting a heresy that Faith win a sinful lifestyle would still guarantee a believer heaven... No one is permitted to sin with the mindset that God's grace would abound...

According to James, only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person, and that such a faith is useless, obsolete and dead...

Why are you infusing your own words into verses? Moreover, you are unstable, that's why you are jumping from different Bible Translations looking for the one which suits your narrative.

Also, we have shown you many verses to show that you clearly misunderstood James 2, still yet you are clinging to your misunderstanding of it.

It's like using 5000 verses which are in harmony to show you that faith alone saves, while you keep holding to one single verse. You have been trying to invalidate 5000 with just one. The worst part is that you haven't shown us how we got the 5000 verses wrong. At least one party has to be wrong. All you've been doing is trying to show how one is better than 5000.

I've told you to stop clinging to James 2 which you either have misunderstood or deliberately being a satanic deceiver. Can't you see that that's the only verse you have been hammering on while we've been dishing out tonnes of verses against your believe?

OkCornel:


Like I mentioned earlier on this thread, if having concubines was a sin, that means God was encouraging David into sin when He promised David He could have given him more beautiful ladies if only David asked Him...rather than killing Uriah to take Bathsheba...

2 Samuel 12 v 7-9;

7 Then Nathan said to David, “You are the man! This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: ‘I anointed you king over Israel, and I delivered you from the hand of Saul.

8 I gave your master’s house to you, and your master’s wives into your arms. I gave you all Israel and Judah. And if all this had been too little, I would have given you even more.

9 Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing what is evil in his eyes? You struck down Uriah the Hittite with the sword and took his wife to be your own. You killed him with the sword of the Ammonites.

To see how wrong you are, is having concubines today a sin? Yes of course it is. If you say it wasn't a sin back then, then it means you have said God changes.

God said "For I am the Lord, I change not".

That means Jacob, David, Solomon, other Jewish kings sinned against God because they had more than one wife and various concubines...

But it is that same God you said IS THE SAME YESTERDAY, TODAY AND FOREVER that clearly told David He gave him Saul's wives as an inheritance and would have given him even more if that was little...


You're very ignorant of this and you speedily called me a Satanic Liar. Guy, go and hide your face in shame....

Cc: Budaatum

So Solomon who had 300 wives and 700 concubines was actually delighting God?



Look let's not derail this with this.

LifestyleTonite:


Why are you infusing your own words into verses? Moreover, you are unstable, that's why you are jumping from different Bible Translations looking for the one which suits your narrative.

Also, we have shown you many verses to show that you clearly misunderstood James 2, still yet you are clinging to your misunderstanding of it.

It's like using 5000 verses which are in harmony to show you that faith alone saves, while you keep holding to one single verse. You have been trying to invalidate 5000 with just one. The worst part is that you haven't shown us how we got the 5000 verses wrong. At least one party has to be wrong. All you've been doing is trying to show how one is better than 5000.

I've told you to stop clinging to James 2 which you either have misunderstood or deliberately being a satanic deceiver. Can't you see that that's the only verse you have been hammering on while we've been dishing out tonnes of verses against your believe?

Kai...this guy can't refute the clear words of James...he's now complaining about the Bible version I am using. I posted KJV and Amplified version of that same passage. There are no contradictions.

You are also lying I am infusing my words into the verses. I will paste the link and screenshots here of the scripture here to show you are accusing me falsely...

I will not only bring the teachings of James here...but the words of Jesus Himself here. Faith comes by hearing the word. But hearing alone is not enough. The DOING (works) is the real deal.

LifestyleTonite:


To see how wrong you are, is having concubines today a sin? Yes of course it is. If you say it wasn't a sin back then, then it means you have said God changes.

God said "For I am the Lord, I change not".



So Solomon who had 300 wives and 700 concubines was actually delighting God?



Look let's not derail this with this.

You are just dribbling yourself.

I have shown you where God clearly told David he would have given him more ladies if only David asked.

Going by the above, God was encouraging David to sin abi?

If God had something against Polygamy, he would have banned it through the Laws of Moses...just as he did for homosexuality, incest, bestiality, rape, fornication, adultery e.t.c.

But that same God was clearly saying He would have given David more ladies if he asked for it. God also said He gave David the WIVES OF SAUL as an inheritance... You don't have any point here...

LifestyleTonite:


Why are you infusing your own words into verses? Moreover, you are unstable, that's why you are jumping from different Bible Translations looking for the one which suits your narrative.

Also, we have shown you many verses to show that you clearly misunderstood James 2, still yet you are clinging to your misunderstanding of it.

It's like using 5000 verses which are in harmony to show you that faith alone saves, while you keep holding to one single verse. You have been trying to invalidate 5000 with just one. The worst part is that you haven't shown us how we got the 5000 verses wrong. At least one party has to be wrong. All you've been doing is trying to show how one is better than 5000.

I've told you to stop clinging to James 2 which you either have misunderstood or deliberately being a satanic deceiver. Can't you see that that's the only verse you have been hammering on while we've been dishing out tonnes of verses against your believe?

I have stopped replying him. He twist words, contradicts the bible. He doesnt want to know he is in error.
He denies the gospel because, it doesnt suit him.

He is joined with Budaatum, someone that denies Jesus. Birds of same feather flocks together.

LifestyleTonite:


Why are you infusing your own words into verses? Moreover, you are unstable, that's why you are jumping from different Bible Translations looking for the one which suits your narrative.

Just to prove to you that you accused me falsely here. This is a screenshot of that same passage. I inserted nothing into that.

Here is the link to the scriptures in Amplified version;
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2&version=AMP

OkCornel:



Lifestyletonite, a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God. A faith without results is worthless.

To cap it off, you are promoting a heresy that Faith with a sinful lifestyle would still guarantee a believer heaven... No one is permitted to sin with the mindset that God's grace would abound...

According to James, only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person, and that such a faith is useless, obsolete and dead...

Just take a look at the two statements you made below and see how they contradict the word of God

1.) a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God.

2.) only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person

You said a dead faith is useless to anyone not even God. Sorry dude, tht faith without works may not be useful to you, but it is useful to the holder of that workless faith because it helps count him as righteous before God who also finds it useful.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The verse also debunks your second statement because it shows that faith without works justifies a person.

You haven't shown us how we've gotten these verses wrong. All you've been doing is misconstruing James which only asked a question not a plain statement.

Can you kindly send us how we quote the verses we've been throwing at you wrongly?

solite3:
I have stopped replying him. He twist words, contradicts the bible. He does want to know he is in error.
He denies the gospel because, it doesnt suit him.

He is joined with Budaatum, someone that denies Jesus. Birds of same feather flocks together.

Jesus and James must be the ones in error whilst you and Lifestyletonite knows better than them.

You first accused me of sticking to a verse in James. Now that more references are coming out... "I am in error"...

Now for the Pharisitical attitude to come out whilst you are confronted with the truth...

OkCornel:


Just to prove to you that you accused me falsely here. This is a screenshot of that same passage. I inserted nothing into that.

Here is the link to the scriptures in Amplified version;
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2&version=AMP

Don't you get it? You are part of the fraud who infuse their own idea into the Bible. Why are you supporting a translation inserting words into verses? That's how fraud and corruption of the word of God starts.

Stay with the King James or get carried away by lies.

LifestyleTonite:


Just take a look at the two statements you made below and see how they contradict the word of God

1.) a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God.

2.) only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person

You said a dead faith is useless to anyone not even God. Sorry dude, tht faith without works may not be useful to you, but it is useful to the holder of that workless faith because it helps count him as righteous before God who also finds it useful.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The verse also debunks your second statement because it shows that faith without works justifies a person.

You haven't shown us how we've gotten these verses wrong. All you've been doing is misconstruing James which only asked a question not a plain statement.

Can you kindly send us how we quote the verses we've been throwing at you wrongly?

I applaud your defense if the gospel but you should know that a dead faith is a false faith.

LifestyleTonite:


Just take a look at the two statements you made below and see how they contradict the word of God

1.) a dead and useless faith is of no use to anyone, not even God.

2.) only a fool would believe Faith without works would justify such a person

You said a dead faith is useless to anyone not even God. Sorry dude, tht faith without works may not be useful to you, but it is useful to the holder of that workless faith because it helps count him as righteous before God who also finds it useful.

Romans 4:5 (KJV)
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The verse also debunks your second statement because it shows that faith without works justifies a person.

You haven't shown us how we've gotten these verses wrong. All you've been doing is misconstruing James which only asked a question not a plain statement.

Can you kindly send us how we quote the verses we've been throwing at you wrongly?

James shed more light on that particular scripture of Romans 4 v 5;

Read James 2 v 21-22;

21 Was our father Abraham not [shown to be] justified by works [of obedience which expressed his faith] when he offered Isaac his son on the altar [as a sacrifice to God]?

22 You see that [his] faith was working together with his works, and as a result of the works, his faith was completed [reaching its maturity when he expressed his faith through obedience].



Please tell us how you can believe in someone without DOING WHAT HE TELLS YOU TO DO!

The Faith comes by hearing the word. The place of work is in THE DOING

Lifestyle Tonight read this,

Question: "Why is faith without works dead?"

Answer: James says, “For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also” (James 2:26). Faith without works is a dead faith because the lack of works reveals an unchanged life or a spiritually dead heart. There are many verses that say that true saving faith will result in a transformed life, that faith is demonstrated by the works we do. How we live reveals what we believe and whether the faith we profess to have is a living faith.

James 2:14–26 is sometimes taken out of context in an attempt to create a works-based system of righteousness, but that is contrary to many other passages of Scripture. James is not saying that our works make us righteous before God but that real saving faith is demonstrated by good works. Works are not the cause of salvation; works are the evidence of salvation. Faith in Christ always results in good works. The person who claims to be a Christian but lives in willful disobedience to Christ has a false or dead faith and is not saved. Paul basically says the same thing in 1 Corinthians 6:9–10. James contrasts two different types of faith—true faith that saves and false faith that is dead.

Many profess to be Christians, but their lives and priorities indicate otherwise. Jesus put it this way: “By their fruits you will know them. Do people pick grapes from thorn bushes, or figs from thistles? Just so, every good tree bears good fruit, and a rotten tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a rotten tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire. So by their fruits you will know them. Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name? Did we not drive out demons in your name? Did we not do mighty deeds in your name?’ Then I will declare to them solemnly, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers’” (Matthew 7:16–23).

Notice that the message of Jesus is the same as the message of James. Obedience to God is the mark of true saving faith. James uses the examples of Abraham and Rahab to illustrate the obedience that accompanies salvation. Simply saying we believe in Jesus does not save us, nor does religious service. What saves us is the Holy Spirit’s regeneration of our hearts, and that regeneration will invariably be seen in a life of faith featuring ongoing obedience to God.

Misunderstanding the relationship of faith and works comes from not understanding what the Bible teaches about salvation. There are really two errors in regards to works and faith. The first error is “easy believism,” the teaching that, as long as a person prayed a prayer or said, “I believe in Jesus,” at some point in his life, then he is saved, no matter what. So a person who, as a child, raised his hand in a church service is considered saved, even though he has never shown any desire to walk with God since and is, in fact, living in blatant sin. This teaching, sometimes called “decisional regeneration,” is dangerous and deceptive. The idea that a profession of faith saves a person, even if he lives like the devil afterwards, assumes a new category of believer called the “carnal Christian.” This allows various ungodly lifestyles to be excused: a man may be an unrepentant adulterer, liar, or bank robber, but he’s saved; he’s just “carnal.” Yet, as we can see in James 2, an empty profession of faith—one that does not result in a life of obedience to Christ—is in reality a dead faith that cannot save.

The other error in regards to works and faith is to attempt to make works part of what justifies us before God. The mixture of works and faith to earn salvation is totally contrary to what Scripture teaches. Romans 4:5 says, “To him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness.” James 2:26 says, “Faith without works is dead.” There is no conflict between these two passages. We are justified by grace through faith, and the natural result of faith in the heart is works that all can see. The works that follow salvation do not make us righteous before God; they simply flow from the regenerated heart as naturally as water flows from a spring.

Salvation is a sovereign act of God whereby an unregenerate sinner has the “washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit” poured out on him (Titus 3:5), thereby causing him to be born again (John 3:3). When this happens, God gives the forgiven sinner a new heart and puts a new spirit within him (Ezekiel 36:26). God removes his sin-hardened heart of stone and fills him with the Holy Spirit. The Spirit then causes the saved person to walk in obedience to God’s Word (Ezekiel 36:26–27).

Faith without works is dead because it reveals a heart that has not been transformed by God. When we have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit, our lives will demonstrate that new life. Our works will be characterized by obedience to God. Unseen faith will become seen by the production of the fruit of the Spirit in our lives (Galatians 5:22). Christians belong to Christ, the Good Shepherd. As His sheep we hear His voice and follow Him (John 10:26–30).

Faith without works is dead because faith results in a new creation, not a repetition of the same old patterns of sinful behavior. As Paul wrote in 2 Corinthians 5:17, “If anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.”

Faith without works is dead because it comes from a heart that has not been regenerated by God. Empty professions of faith have no power to change lives. Those who pay lip service to faith but who do not possess the Spirit will hear Christ Himself say to them, “I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers” (Matthew 7:23).

LifestyleTonite:


Don't you get it? You are part of the fraud who infuse their own idea into the Bible. Why are you supporting a translation inserting words into verses? That's how fraud and corruption of the word of God starts.

Stay with the King James or get carried away by lies.

All of a sudden, Amplified Bible is a fraudulent version of the scriptures... Oya let's see KJV;

James 2 v 20-26;

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2&version=KJV

.

solite3:
I have stopped replying him. He twist words, contradicts the bible. He doesnt want to know he is in error.
He denies the gospel because, it doesnt suit him.

He is joined with Budaatum, someone that denies Jesus. Birds of same feather flocks together.

I've always known him from his argument with albgahdadi. He's always opposing the word of God by twisting the scriptures. He uses one tactics which is clinging to only one misconstrued verse despite you throwing several verses at him. Look at all the verses we've thrown at him, yet he keeps clinging to James 2:14 which he doesn't understand or he's just deliberatly being a deceiver.

He's a Satanist and an opposer of the gospel. His mission here is to prevent people from accepting the gospel. He clearly wants them to keep relying on their works which can't save them.

I think I've wasted enough data and spiritual words on him. He can't receive it because he doesn't have the Holy Spirit in him. Why? Because he's relying on his works to save him instead of Grace through faith alone. Clearly he's not born again. O would see he also doesn't understand the doctrine on tithing.

1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned

LifestyleTonite:


I've always known him from his argument with albgahdadi. He's always opposing the word of God by twisting the scriptures. He uses one tactics which is clinging to only one misconstrued verse despite you throwing several verses at him. Look at all the verses we've thrown at him, yet he keeps clinging to James 2:14 which he doesn't understand or he's just deliberatly being a deceiver.

He's a Satanist and an opposer of the gospel. His mission here is to prevent people from accepting the gospel. He clearly wants them to keep relying on their works which can't save them.

I think I've wasted enough data and spiritual words on him. He can't receive it because he doesn't have the Holy Spirit in him. Why? Because he's relying on his works to save him instead of Grace through faith alone. Clearly he's not born again. O would see he also doesn't understand the doctrine on tithing.

1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned

You mean the same albhagd.adi that is also spreading tales on how the tree of knowledge of good and evil represents Adam and Eve's tithe?

Or how believers in Jesus are supposed to hate their enemies despite no instructions from Jesus on such?

Clap for yourself...

This post of yours only shows you have zero understanding on the works I've been talking about. Obviously, it is not the works of the Law or the works of the flesh.

The works I am referring to obeying the words of Jesus, the fruits of the Spirit and obeying the leading of the Spirit. That is the works you show for your faith. Absence of these is a Dead Faith

LifestyleTonite:


I've always known him from his argument with albgahdadi. He's always opposing the word of God by twisting the scriptures. He uses one tactics which is clinging to only one misconstrued verse despite you throwing several verses at him. Look at all the verses we've thrown at him, yet he keeps clinging to James 2:14 which he doesn't understand or he's just deliberatly being a deceiver.

He's a Satanist and an opposer of the gospel. His mission here is to prevent people from accepting the gospel. He clearly wants them to keep relying on their works which can't save them.

I think I've wasted enough data and spiritual words on him. He can't receive it because he doesn't have the Holy Spirit in him. Why? Because he's relying on his works to save him instead of Grace through faith alone. Clearly he's not born again. O would see he also doesn't understand the doctrine on tithing.

1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV)
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned

yea no need to waste time on him