baralatie:

the real question is this
In the court of any jurisprudence in the United States of America.
Will the court excuse any black American man for his faults/errors and hold the black American woman who is the mother accountable or responsible for the black American man's action.

the answer is no!

the courts in the USA says the black American man is to be held accountable.

even if his mom is frost,Clyde or mia khalifa

So it is now US courts u go to for answers on social issues? The same courts that will free a man everyone saw commit murder because he wasn’t read his rights. That’s who u r going to for answers??

sexylassie2:


I have updated my answer.

It is a myth that 70% of black women are not married.

Democratic party policies destroyed the black family unit.

Go read about the welfare society they created and the rules for a black woman to be on welfare.

E.g: the Missouri welfare department imposed strange rules on families who lived in public housing. No "able-bodied man" could be in the house if it was also occupied by a woman who received state aid for dependent children."

Another example, they rewarded black women who had multiple children from different fathers instead of stopping the bad behavior.

For instead, instead of fathers should be held financially responsible for their kids, the state financially rewarded the mothers, the mothers saw it as an opportunity to sleep around without consequences.

The consequences of their policies brought about the mentality of so called independent black women, many of these women had never had any father figure in their lives, that is why many of them are inpatient with men and have daddy issues

U r of course right, but here is the conundrum: those are the same people AA’s massively vote for year in, year out. US is having elections in Nov? I bet u Democrats will get 99% of black vote!

sexylassie2:

Now back to the topic, Blacks during slavery had the family unit intact, even in the 50s, it was a shame for a black woman to have kids out of wedlock but then came the welfare society of the Democratic party and white liberals who brought out policies to destroy the black family.

Now single motherhood is a thing of pride, I see similar stuff going on in the carribean community in the UK and it is gradually coming into our society before you know it the crime rate will increase.

I can categorically say that a strong father is needed in every home, it help to instill discipline in the children.

To end my case, a welfare society and a feminist oriented society will destroy our way of life and cause increase in crime and also rift between men and women.

U totally make sense. But I have a question: if it were all due to lack of father, how come so many AA icons never had a father around - from Jesse Jackson to Sharpton to Obama and countless others?? Even Oprah had no father, neither did most of these billionaire and millionaire rappers and sports figures

CanadaOrBust:


This is actually quite insightful tho a bit biased against BAW.
@bolded, so why do u think each acted the way he did?

Because, one saw it as a way of life,while the other thinks that such kind of lifestyle is not good to begin with.

Some people learn from others mistakes, while some continue to make same mistake because they do not know any other way to go about or maneuver that very situation.


It also implies, that some AA women who grew up without proper family orientation, they felt that it was bad for them, most of them suffered and vowed never to allow their own kids go through the same fate that befell them as kids,teenagers and adults. They put in more work to see that their kids have that balanced life.

While some who grew in such bad scenarios, only continued to pass down the history of their being broken to their kids. To them, “ I didn’t have a father, but here I am, I am surviving “ so why can’t my kids survive too?. They ended up not seeing it as a big deal when they deny their kids that fatherly love.

Now you understand why I made that point.



All in all, I pray that all AA see the importance of family values. Some men walked out on their kids/ abandoned them, some women also abandoned their kids, Some walked away because of the mothers attitude ( loud, vindictive, nagging etc), while some women on the other hand deprive their kids of that fatherly love because the man either cheated or broke up with them. Let them allow any man that wants to be in a child’s life the opportunity to be. At the end of the day, it is the younger generations that are being hurt the most. at the end of the day, it is no longer about you, but the kids. We must do everything we can to get them to live a better life than we lived.

CanadaOrBust:


U totally make sense. But I have a question: if it were all due to lack of father, how come so many AA icons never had a father around - from Jesse Jackson to Sharpton to Obama and countless others?? Even Oprah had no father, neither did most of these billionaire and millionaire rappers and sports figures

These are just few compared to millions of AA people who are still broken because they lacked that father figure in their lives. Many people define success differently. Now check most of those rappers that had kids and see if they are not if not all in their kids lives? Most people that turned out well, saw the importance, they knew how broken they were, and they vowed to make and make things right. Go and check their success stories, they suffered and then vowed never to allow their own kids go through what they passed through.

But out of the millions of AA these are just but few.


Like I said earlier. A man ( drunkard)gave birth twins, one grew up to be like the father, the other grew up and vowed never to be a drunk like the father. Two people faced with same situations but acted differently. It’s in human nature. One learnt a lesson from the father, while the other continued because he saw what the dad did as a normal thing any other person would be doing.

CanadaOrBust:


U totally make sense. But I have a question: if it were all due to lack of father, how come so many AA icons never had a father around - from Jesse Jackson to Sharpton to Obama and countless others?? Even Oprah had no father, neither did most of these billionaire and millionaire rappers and sports figures

Jesse was adopted by his step father.

If you listen to interviews with alsharpton acquitances,he was living recklessly, a gang member. He was involved in boxing match fixing and decided to be a fbi spy and informat... Guess since his race hustling business brought fame, he decided to change.

Oprah she had a good role model from her step father

My opinion is that there are many black america families without fathers who came out successful, some sport and music saved them, education saved them or their mothers who valued education saved them.

To be sincere, it is hard for those without fathers

sexylassie2:


Jesse was adopted by his step father.

If you listen to interviews with alsharpton acquitances,he was living recklessly, a gang member. He was involved in boxing match fixing and decided to be a fbi spy and informat... Guess since his race hustling business brought fame, he decided to change.

Oprah she had a good role model from her step father

My opinion is that there are many black america families without fathers who came out successful, some sport and music saved them, education saved them or their mothers who valued education saved them.

To be sincere, it is hard for those without fathers

Then there are a WHOLE LOT with both fathers and mothers who amounted to absolutely nothing!

chigoizie7:


These are just few compared to millions of AA people who are still broken because they lacked that father figure in their lives. Many people define success differently. Now check most of those rappers that had kids and see if they are not if not all in their kids lives? Most people that turned out well, saw the importance, they knew how broken they were, and they vowed to make and make things right. Go and check their success stories, they suffered and then vowed never to allow their own kids go through what they passed through.

But out of the millions of AA these are just but few.


Like I said earlier. A man ( drunkard)gave birth twins, one grew up to be like the father, the other grew up and vowed never to be a drunk like the father. Two people faced with same situations but acted differently. It’s in human nature. One learnt a lesson from the father, while the other continued because he saw what the dad did as a normal thing any other person would be doing.

B4 we get carried away, let’s not forget, all mordern serial killers had both fathers and mothers and there are a WHOLE LOT of people with both fathers and mothers who amounted to absolutely nothing!

chigoizie7:


Because, one saw it as a way of life,while the other thinks that such kind of lifestyle is not good to begin with.

Some people learn from others mistakes, while some continue to make same mistake because they do not know any other way to go about or maneuver that very situation.


It also implies, that some AA women who grew up without proper family orientation, they felt that it was bad for them, most of them suffered and vowed never to allow their own kids go through the same fate that befell them as kids,teenagers and adults. They put in more work to see that their kids have that balanced life.

While some who grew in such bad scenarios, only continued to pass down the history of their being broken to their kids. To them, “ I didn’t have a father, but here I am, I am surviving “ so why can’t my kids survive too?. They ended up not seeing it as a big deal when they deny their kids that fatherly love.

Now you understand why I made that point.



All in all, I pray that all AA see the importance of family values. Some men walked out on their kids/ abandoned them, some women also abandoned their kids, Some walked away because of the mothers attitude ( loud, vindictive, nagging etc), while some women on the other hand deprive their kids of that fatherly love because the man either cheated or broke up with them. Let them allow any man that wants to be in a child’s life the opportunity to be. At the end of the day, it is the younger generations that are being hurt the most. at the end of the day, it is no longer about you, but the kids. We must do everything we can to get them to live a better life than we lived.

U make a lot of sense, tho it is still a mystery why one child would vow never to be like his drunken father while another will drink even more than him

CanadaOrBust:


Then there are a WHOLE LOT with both fathers and mothers who amounted to absolutely nothing!

yes, there will be those who will be successful without a father and those who will not

even in our society, those with fathers have a higher chance of success than those without, it is just logic

i am talking as a woman and from what i have seen, many single mothers are poor and have difficulties taking care of their children, that is why it is better for a woman to get married and train up her child in a home where both parents are married. it good for her and her kid.

sexylassie2:


yes, there will be those who will be successful without a father and those who will not

even in our society, those with fathers have a higher chance of success than those without, it is just logic

i am talking as a woman and from what i have seen, many single mothers are poor and have difficulties taking care of their children, that is why it is better for a woman to get married and train up her child in a home where both parents are married. it good for her and her kid.

@bolded, strangely enough, in 9ja, of those I know, those without fathers always do better if given any chance at all.
I’ve always wondered why this is.

CanadaOrBust:


@bolded, strangely enough, in 9ja, of those I know, those without fathers always do better if given any chance at all.
I’ve always wondered why this is.

yeah it happens but i see more children with fathers getting it because of their fathers network

the ones with fathers do not have to work hard so much to get things done when compare with the ones without father

i could count how many times, i have used my father networks to get things done, someone from a single mother home might not have that opportunity.

that is why i will never support any woman wanting to do the baby mama thing especially if she is struggling to eat, she is in the long run destroying the future of her kid for short term gains

CanadaOrBust:


@bolded, strangely enough, in 9ja, of those I know, those without fathers always do better if given any chance at all.
I’ve always wondered why this is.

your lie get grade

CanadaOrBust:


U make a lot of sense, tho it is still a mystery why one child would vow never to be like his drunken father while another will drink even more than him

It might be a mystery. But we hear the saying “ like father like son”. And also we hear people say, that s child is just the exact opposite of the fathers bad evil ways.

CanadaOrBust:


American by naturalization? Or were u born and raised in the States

My family has been here for centuries, I'm the real black American/ADOS.

CanadaOrBust:


B4 we get carried away, let’s not forget, all mordern serial killers had both fathers and mothers and there are a WHOLE LOT of people with both fathers and mothers who amounted to absolutely nothing!

Absolutely correct. But you have the money check the ratios.

In Nigeria for example, our bad leadership and corrupt politicians and policies has turned some people into committing crimes, while some, despite the hardship has refused to commit any form of crime.


Some of us go to school, spend time with the same people, receive the same lectures, but at the end of the day, some people excel more than others, some pass very well, some also fail, but that doesn’t mean that they all didn’t attend the same classes. So my brother, the same way some people without good parental upbringing turn out good, while some turn out bad. That’s the same way some who has good parental upbringing turn out bad while some also turn out good. But what we should be concerned about is the ratios.

baralatie:

the real question is this
In the court of any jurisprudence in the United States of America.
Will the court excuse any black American man for his faults/errors and hold the black American woman who is the mother accountable or responsible for the black American man's action.

the answer is no!

the courts in the USA says the black American man is to be held accountable.

even if his mom is frost,Clyde or mia khalifa

I pray Nigerian men would stop raping their daughters and I pray Nigerian men would feed their starving, homeless children, I pray Nigerian men would save their children from orphanages. Amen!

CanadaOrBust:


U totally make sense. But I have a question: if it were all due to lack of father, how come so many AA icons never had a father around - from Jesse Jackson to Sharpton to Obama and countless others?? Even Oprah had no father, neither did most of these billionaire and millionaire rappers and sports figures

Outliers always exist in a normal distribution.
Just take any group subjected to some extreme condition, you would find those who rose above it.

Those icons didn't have a father around because it is common not to have a father around.
When looking at icons, we fail to consider what is best for the most part of a society as opposed
to some few who can rise above the fold.

Thank you for your compliment

CanadaOrBust:


This actually is a very good write-up

sexylassie2:
Most of the comments are biased, using poor blacks in the ghetto to judge all blacks.

First and foremost, it is a myth that 70% of black women are single.

in 2016 just under half or 48% of black women had never been married which is up from 44% in 2008 and 42.7% in 2005

15% percent of Black men were married to non-Black women which is up from 11% in 2010. About three-fifths of those non-Black women were WhiteWhite

25% of Black male newlyweds in 2013 married non-Black women compared to 12% of Black women who “married out.

Black women were the least likely to marry non-Black men at only 7% in 2017, and only 4/% were married to White men.

Have you got a source for your stats?
I instinctively suspected the 70% figure because I don't even know who is included
or excluded. Teens, Childless, those with kids or elderly?

Now back to the topic, Blacks during slavery had the family unit intact, even in the 50s, it was a shame for a black woman to have kids out of wedlock but then came the welfare society of the Democratic party and white liberals who brought out policies to destroy the black family.

No. Some blacks had families during slavery but most do not.
Those policies weren't designed to destroy black families.
They were supposed to fight poverty. Just like the clamor for UBI and "tax the rich"
rhetoric that is very common today.

Now single motherhood is a thing of pride, I see similar stuff going on in the carribean community in the UK and it is gradually coming into our society before you know it the crime rate will increase.

Single motherhood is likely the future in most "free" countries unless there are changes
to some laws.
The sexual revolution of the 50s and 60s already started the process.
Coupled with the financial ruin that can result from divorce, marriage isn't that
attractive anymore.

I can categorically say that a strong father is needed in every home, it help to instill discipline in the children.

You appear to be viewing modern times with the lens of the past.
There is no evidence that fathers discipline is better than mothers, at least not in a society where child abuse
laws are very strong and most people frown on the harsh treatment of children. The days of tough father's are almost over.
This suggests that the positive effects of a father's presence isn't about discipline.
In fact, fathers love and not discipline is associated with better behavior among the children irrespective of gender.

To end my case, a welfare society and a feminist oriented society will destroy our way of life and cause increase in crime and also rift between men and women.

You are conflating disparate issues.
There is nothing inherently wrong with a welfare society unless the results are bad.
America is hardly a welfare society or even "feminist oriented" when compared with other western nations with
more generous welfare. These countries should be swimming with criminals if your hypothesis is true.
Yet, they have some of the lowest poverty and crime rates in the world.

What you are neglecting is culture and the current personal wealth of different societies.
The wealth of a family(single parent or not) is a better predictor of children's success than other factors.

If feminism is inherently bad, the most feminist society should be worse off with extreme poverty and crimes.
White American women are more feminist than black women, yet they suffer
lesser social ills such as teenage pregnancy and even have a higher proportion
of children living with fathers and mothers.

A conclusion from this is that an inherited culture is a very strong predictor of societal trajectory.

A poor society should not institute welfare, especially the ones that incentivizes laziness and bad behaviors.
I agree with you that some government programs to fight poverty have actually had the opposite effects
on the black community but those programs are not inherently bad for all people at all times.

sexylassie2:


yeah it happens but i see more children with fathers getting it because of their fathers network

the ones with fathers do not have to work hard so much to get things done when compare with the ones without father

i could count how many times, i have used my father networks to get things done, someone from a single mother home might not have that opportunity.

that is why i will never support any woman wanting to do the baby mama thing especially if she is struggling to eat, she is in the long run destroying the future of her kid for short term gains

What u say is logical and should be right. But in my particular experience people whose fathers died while they were little somehow always seem to eventually make it bigger than those with both

baralatie:

your lie get grade

Look at older folks and compare those whose fathers died while they were young to others.

chigoizie7:


It might be a mystery. But we hear the saying “ like father like son”. And also we hear people say, that s child is just the exact opposite of the fathers bad evil ways.

That’s the bottom line: it is a mystery

Terryishere:


My family has been here for centuries, I'm the real black American/ADOS.

U r the real deal then. How did u find out about Nairaland then

chigoizie7:


Absolutely correct. But you have the money check the ratios.

In Nigeria for example, our bad leadership and corrupt politicians and policies has turned some people into committing crimes, while some, despite the hardship has refused to commit any form of crime.


Some of us go to school, spend time with the same people, receive the same lectures, but at the end of the day, some people excel more than others, some pass very well, some also fail, but that doesn’t mean that they all didn’t attend the same classes. So my brother, the same way some people without good parental upbringing turn out good, while some turn out bad. That’s the same way some who has good parental upbringing turn out bad while some also turn out good. But what we should be concerned about is the ratios.

So true. Two brothers with exactly same upbringing, one turns out saintly while the other becomes an armed robber. I’ve seen that myself

CanadaOrBust:


Look at older folks and compare those whose fathers died while they were young to others.

you are funny!
you seriously think any man makes it unaided without the influence of a father figure in this country called Nigeria

CanadaOrBust:


U r the real deal then. How did u find out about Nairaland then

A friend.

Xisnin:

Outliers always exist in a normal distribution.
Just take any group subjected to some extreme condition, you would find those who rose above it.

Those icons didn't have a father around because it is common not to have a father around.
When looking at icons, we fail to consider what is best for the most part of a society as opposed
to some few who can rise above the fold.

I think I have solved it - those with both parents usually end up in the middle while those without fathers usually end up either at the bottom, in jail, or extremely successful

VULCAN:
Thank you for your compliment

It’s well deserved

baralatie:

you are funny!
you seriously think any man makes it unaided without the influence of a father figure in this country called Nigeria

Look, I’ve always wondered why cos it makes no sense, but in my particular experience people whose fathers died while they were little somehow always seem to eventually make it bigger than those with both.

Terryishere:


A friend.

Lol.. It must be torture reading some of the comments on Nairaland

CanadaOrBust:


I think I have solved it - those with both parents usually end up in the middle while those without fathers usually end up either at the bottom, in jail, or extremely successful

It is not that clear cut as some of those with both parents will end up at the top or the bottom too.
I suspect we will have more of them at the top than the other cohort.

In reality, parental wealth and education is more predictive of
children's future success than the absence of a father.

It turns out that a two-parent household is richer on average than the single-parent one.