₦airaland Forum

Even if Nigeria ends up splitting, the same old cargoes will end up ruling each region, it is a curse immune to tribalism!

The only reason for speeding is because you live in a lawless country! Go abroad and try this rubbish and you'll find yourself with more fines with the possibility of jail time because you'll definitely end up killing someone one day or running over a mailbox. Na 9ja you dey so nothing do you, lawlessness is hereditary

Even if it ends up costing twice as much, any husband or boyfriend should be impressed with her management skills, nowadays wey women go collect 5k for soup and end up preparing colored water with eba....

Ispiksdatroof20:
Under normal Circumstances, I shouldn't indulge you because you are obviously trolling, but since Im bored I will.

You truly think State Circuit Courts are higher than Federal District Courts? You also really think Federal District Courts handle "every trashy case thrown at it"?

Believe it or not the U.S District Court is probably the MOST POWERFUL ENTITY IN ALL OF THE UNITED STATES; EVEN MORE POWERFUL THAN THE PRESIDENT. Except the Judges don't have the Nuke codes. If your case is not heard by the U.S District Court, it is not going to be heard by higher Courts like the Court of Appeals or Supreme Court. Do you get it now? So, don't think of "Low" in terms of "Worthless". It is low in terms of "hierarchy" and whatever has been decided in District Court is held in high regards by the higher courts.

I believe your country has a similar Judicial system if I'm not mistaken.

Please stop this! When did I ever mention state circuit courts? When did I ever compare state circuit courts to federal district courts? I think you need a chill pill otherwise you run the risk of making even more mockery of yourself. I have never for once mentioned state courts as I believe we are dealing at the federal level and yes when it comes to the federal system all cases pass through the district courts hence why I called them trashy but take a look at cases making it all the way to the Supreme court, you would realize that they are cases of important magnitude and they all passed through circuit courts otherwise known as court of appeals. I never called the federal district courts worthless, that is you putting words in my mouth and you know it! We are talking of international crimes and punishments, this is why I called them unfit to handle such cases when you compare them to ICC, if you take a look at this forum; you yourself mentioned something similar about them dismissing the case. I hate rambling, I'm not into long pointless dialogues rather if you calmed down and analyzed my point without any malicious intent, you would understand that I'm more right than wrong and that our points our differ slightly....shalom!

And they said Hausa should leave Nigeria, thanks to the Northerners we can still curb many of the homosexuals out there but once they are gone, it's open season on anu.ss. motel . This one is not about tribalism it's about reality, Western exposure don scatter some of our Yoruba and Igbo brains, but mallam no go gree, they prefer underage girls than to do man to man.....Come to think of it, we are all f*cked

Ispiksdatroof20:
Have you ever heard that saying that "Its better to keep quiet and be thought of a f00l, than open your mouth and erase all doubts?". It is very apt in this case.

The U.S District Court is THE LOWEST COURT IN THE FEDERAL JUDICIAL SYSTEM.

You are a lawyer or at least a law school graduate, it's pointless to argue that one of the lowest equals the lowest. What you wrote drastically differs from what I wrote, you might want to do yourself a favor and retrace my posts in this forum, nowhere did I call district courts the lowest, just one of the lower courts. No need to drag things of zero value to intelligence!

jumobi1:
The man is right. District Courts are the lowest federal courts. It is in no way one of the lowest courts in the USA. Unless you're mixing it up with State District courts. If you say it's one of the lowest then what would you call a town court?

My friend when you qualify something has one of the lowest, it does not automatically mean the lowest. E.g. We have 5 floors in a building, I could choose to say floor 3 or 2 represents one of the lowest floors. Now since we are talking about district courts and in this case federal district courts, I'm correct to call it one of the lowest because compared to circuit courts and Supreme court, it handles every trashy case thrown at it. Now being one of the lowest does not mean inefficient, it only means that cases of highly important magnitudes rarely ever gets settled in district courts. I hope I've been able to enlighten you a little bit....No need to thank me

Ispiksdatroof20:
A U.S District Court is not "one of the lowest in the U.S.A", thats very condescending. Its the Lowest court in the Federal System,yes, but without stepping foot in it you can't seek redress in higher Federal Courts. Its a system.

It's one of the lowest courts, not the lowest. I think English is a simple language but we make it complicated at times!

jumobi1:
Enlighten me. Because as a lawyer, I know not all US lawyers are familiar or well versed with the Alien Tort Claims Act. If truly only one of them has ever been applied, why hasn't the other been applied as a precursor.

Btw are you a lawyer?

I work in the insurance industry and my mentor is a Judge, we also recently had 2 cases involving our international business partners and these acts. It's not that both can't be applied but they have different conditions which makes one easily applicable than the other. I keep telling them on this forum that it is even harder to apply them to a democratic government

Are you bloggers retarded or just slow? 50- 0 knockout? Really?....SHAME!

jumobi1:
You're wrong bro. Both are for civil actions not criminal. You think they brought civil and criminal charges in one case? Lol
I studied these acts in law school. Yes in the US.

We are saying the same thing, both acts are civil suits but only one of them have ever been applied as a precursor to a criminal case brought before ICC. As a lawyer you should be quite aware of how the ATS is perceived in the international community. This is why I mentioned in my initial post that the district court won't get Biafrans what they really want and that is criminal prosecution.

Kudos but the battle just begun! Stay focus, graduate, get a good job and invest back home. Can't trust the Americans forever and Nigeria/Biafra needs more intelligent people to run its affairs

jumobi1:
Fantastic job but it applies only to the ATC Acts...

"The Supreme Court's 2013 decision in Kiobel v. Royal Dutch Petroleum Company,22 which applied the presumption against extraterritoriality to bar the application of the Alien Tort Claims Act to acts in the territory of a foreign sovereign raises the question whether the same construction will be given to the Torture Victim Protection Act. Arguably, the most appropriate answer seems to be no. The text of the TVPA, particularly its exhaustion of remedies provision, Section 2(b), seems to rebut the presumption by suggesting that actions may arise from conduct outside the United States. Moreover, although the majority opinion in Kiobel did not refer to the TVPA, the two concurring opinions, expressing the opinions of five Justices, reflected the view that the Act applied to human rights abuses committed abroad. 23However, the political question doctrine may bar the claim in cases of drone strikes and alleged extra-judicial killings"

That is the only act that matters in terms of criminal charges but in terms of civil lawsuits then the tort act applies but will be dismissed because the plaintiffs did not meet the prerequisites!

poseidon12:
And you call the present administration a democratic government?

You still fail to understand the premise here, was the government voted in by the people? YES! Hence, it is democratic! You might say that Nigeria is not a perfect democracy but the same can be said of the USA with the election of Trump. Now to your other statement regarding the ATCA and Tort, you might want to go back and read my posts in this forum, I hate repeating myself over and over especially to a primitive specie!

Kiobel v. Royal Dutch Petroleum[edit]
Main article: Kiobel v. Royal Dutch Petroleum
The plaintiffs in Kiobel were citizens of Nigeria who claimed that Dutch, British, and Nigerian oil-exploration corporations aided and abetted the Nigerian government during the 1990s in committing violations of customary international law.[30] The plaintiffs claimed that Royal Dutch Shell compelled its Nigerian subsidiary, in cooperation with the Nigerian government, to brutally crush peaceful resistance to aggressive oil development in the Ogoni Niger River Delta.[31] Plaintiffs sought damages under the ATS. The defendants moved to dismiss based on a two-pronged argument. First, they argued that customary international law itself provides the rules by which to decide whether conduct violates the law of nations where non-state actors are alleged to have committed the wrong in question. Second, they contended that no norm has ever existed between nations that imposes liability upon corporate actors. On September 29, 2006, the district court dismissed the plaintiffs' claims for aiding and abetting property destruction; forced exile; extrajudicial killing; and violation of the rights to life, liberty, security, and association. It reasoned that customary international law did not define those violations with sufficient particularity. The court denied the defendants' motion to dismiss with respect to the remaining claims of aiding and abetting arbitrary arrest and detention; crimes against humanity; and torture or cruel, inhuman, and degrading treatment. The district court then certified its entire order for interlocutory appeal to the Second Circuit based on the serious nature of the questions at issue.

In a 2–1 decision issued on September 17, 2010, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit held that corporations cannot be held liable for violations of customary international law, finding that: (1) under both U.S. Supreme Court and Second Circuit precedents over the previous 30 years that address ATS suits alleging violations of customary international law, the scope of liability is determined by customary international law itself; (2) under Supreme Court precedent, the ATS requires courts to apply norms of international law—and not domestic law—to the scope of defendants' liabilities. Such norms must be "specific, universal and obligatory"; and (3) under international law, "corporate liability is not a discernible—much less a universally recognized—norm of customary international law",[30][32] that the court could apply to the ATS, and that the plaintiffs' ATS claims should indeed be dismissed for lack of subject matter jurisdiction.

Kiobel petitioned the Supreme Court for review of the Second Circuit's decision, and this was granted on October 17, 2011. Oral arguments were held on February 28, 2012,[33][34] The arguments received considerable attention in the legal community.[35][36] Unexpectedly, the Supreme Court announced on March 5, 2012, that it would hold additional argument on the case during the October 2012 term, and directed the parties to file new briefs on the question "Whether and under what circumstances the Alien Tort Statute, 28 U.S.C. § 1350, allows courts to recognize a cause of action for violations of the law of nations occurring within the territory of a sovereign other than the United States."[37] Reargument of the case occurred on October 1, 2012.

On April 17, 2013 the U.S. Supreme Court held that the ATS does not apply outside the United States.[38]


For those looking for precedence, in summary even the Supreme Court has a hard time indicting a democratic government official!

12Monkeys:
Maga, the terminologies apply only when a federal court is reviewing a case from another district court. Appeals as you know are automatic for capital punishments. The federal district court takes up the names depending on the judiciary process

You need proper education, Google will only help you out a lil bit but it is not a substitution for real knowledge!

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Circuit_Court_vs_District_Court

12Monkeys:
Do you know what a federal district court is?

This is not the judge Judy you are familiar with.

Ask Bola and Remi Tinubu to tell you how they faced serious felony and ricco charges in the same Federal district court

To educate your ignorant taju afonja ass, there are only 11 Federal district courts for all 50 states in the US.

Olodo

Guy you don dey craze, we have over 90 federal district courts!

Stkilda:
I see what you mean, but it would appear that the plaintiffs are also the actual victims in the current case. I assume that what you mean by the plaintiff being inside is that she was still in captivity when her case was presented, but that may not be completely true. She sued in 1992 for an injury suffered in 1989.

What I meant was that she was the direct victim and when she presented her case she was in the USA. These 10 plaintiffs were not direct victims, unless they can prove otherwise.

12Monkeys:
There are only the federal district courts and the supreme court. Meaning that any contrary ruling can either be granted by another Federal district judge or it goes to the supreme Court

Stop fooling yourself more than you have already.

Will you be QUIET! If you don't know squats ask and be enlightened instead of displaying madness! District court to Supreme, 4 where? What happened to Circuit courts or court of appeals? MUMU!

excanny:
This isn't against Nigeria, its against individuals.

And a defence minister in Guatamala had once been found guilty.

Why the defence? Are you a Nigerian soldier?

Our military isn't that OK now, they beat up civilians at will and are very unruly.

This kind of case will make them more professional, so I wish a prominent soldier like Burantai gets indicted, it will teach the military how to handle civilians.

You are going about this wrong, a defense minister was found guilty of what exactly? Criminal or Civil? The defense minister was part of which democratic government? No, military regime! You might want to read more about that particular case and discover that the USA's CIA were the main supporters of that military regime, this is why the case was easy to judge. I'm going to repeat myself again, no U.S court can convict a democratic government or a democratic government official, the worse that can happen is to ban them from coming to the USA!

12Monkeys:
Do you know what a federal district court is?

This is not the judge Judy you are familiar with.

Ask Bola and Remi Tinubu to tell you how they faced serious felony and ricco charges in the same Federal district court

Stop it already, in the Federal system, the district court represent the lowest of the totem pole.

comrChris:
its obvious your brain has failed you and its still failing you, if not you should have known i was not interested in what you know about U S law but your choice of words.
Any body can easily get information about any thing, if not so what is google for?so stop coming here to rant about what you know..beside no body asked for your opinion, sholve it into that your empty skull and stop disceiving yourself

Temper temper, this is very typical of internet warriors...cheap talk, you smile when people agree with you ut when you are criticized you turn into a monster. I'll keep educating your likes whether you accept or not, no need to thank me

12Monkeys:
I have since told you to approach the nearest sharia court in Kano to declare a half in proceedings at the US Federal court.

A US Federal judge has agreed that the case is credible and must go on and you with your stolen phone plus stolen data posting from your stool infested neighbourhood in osogbo dey here dey rant over wetin no concern you. Abi you be falana?

You must have a serious problem with Osogbo people cos I've never been there The court will hear any case brought before it, it is a freaking district court, one of the lowest in the USA. Call me when they have Burutai in chains....ODE!

excanny:
If its proven that Burantai and any of the other 13 conspirators ordered or aided the torture and killings of the victims, and they have properties in the US, they are done for.

US no be Nigeria o. Already the Nigeria military has a bad record of human rights abuses with the US. It will be seen as opportunity to punish the NA.

You've said it yourself "prove". I'll let you in on a little secret, the law has never been applied to a democratic government and it never will!

Stkilda:
Bro, but according to the precedence, it is unlikely that the defendant was in the United States. It is also possible that the Biafrans may have exhausted all local efforts for compensation, although I suspect that it might not have been possible for a local court to accept such a case. Besides, the Biafrans would be too scared to sue someone like Burutai in Nigeria.

You might want to take a look at the precedent again, she was the actual victim and she was inside when she presented her case. This is what I meant by direct victims, the precedent's claims also happened during a military regime, it is easy for court to associate hate crimes with a dictatorship but it has never been applied to a democratic dispensation otherwise the USA would be the number 1 offender.

excanny:
I think they want money.

If it's money they want then the court might actually hear their case but it will be hard for them because the 10 defendants were not directly harmed by Burutai or his men.

12Monkeys:
See this osogbo reared taju claiming social media lawyer

The Torture Victim Protection Act of 1991 (TVPA; Pub.L. 102–256 , H.R. 2092 , 106 Stat. 73 , enacted March 12, 1992) is a statute that allows for the filing of civil suits in the United States against individuals who, acting in an official capacity for any foreign nation, committed torture and/or extrajudicial killing . The statute requires a plaintiff to show exhaustion of local remedies in the location of the crime, to the extent that such remedies are "adequate and available." Plaintiffs may be U.S. citizens or non-U.S. citizens.


Although the Act was not passed until early 1992, it was introduced the previous year, and the official name of the Act is the "Torture Victim Protection Act of 1991."


Legal issues
In 1992, Sister Dianna Ortiz was the first to file a case under the act, in a civil action against former general and Defense Minister Héctor Gramajo of
Guatemala , contending that, by his command authority, he was responsible for her abduction, rape, and torture by military forces in Guatemala in November 1989. A federal court in Massachusetts ruled in her favor, awarding her $5 million in damages in 1995.


Afonja can't you hide your foolishness for once?

Are you retarded or did your mother drop you while you were a baby? Read what you posted, does it mention criminal prosecution? NO! Where the defendants diresctly harmed by Burutai or his men? NO! The ATCA "allows Americans and foreigners to file suit for violations of international law while the defendant is in the United States.Why not stop relying on wikipedia and do some research yourself, you are obviously not strong in the intelligence spectrum so I'll repeat myself, U.S district courts have no jurisdiction in this matter, the case is beyond their authority and the act that you claim does not hold water in a democratic government. I could understand if the 10 Biafrans were direct victims and have exhausted all local efforts for compensation but to go direct to a U.S district court is foolish especially when we have international bodies capable of much harsher judgments...Stop your foolishness and educate yourself!

12Monkeys:
Stop disgracing yourself afonja southhaters and read the opening paragraph again



Now go and approach your nearest sharia court in Kano to effect an overuling on the US Federal court's decision to allow for Buruntai to be rightly sued for war crimes

You're the one embarrassing your kin folks. You haven't stepped in the U.S, not to talk of understanding their laws so your username fits you properly!

excanny:
The Torture Victim Protection Act of 1991 (TVPA; Pub.L. 102–256 , H.R. 2092 , 106 Stat. 73 , enacted March 12, 1992) is a statute that allows for the filing of civil suits in the United States against individuals who, acting in an official capacity for any foreign nation, committed torture and/or extrajudicial killing . The statute requires a plaintiff to show exhaustion of local remedies in the location of the crime, to the extent that such remedies are "adequate and available." Plaintiffs may be U.S. citizens or non-U.S. citizens.


Although the Act was not passed until early 1992, it was introduced the previous year, and the official name of the Act is the "Torture Victim Protection Act of 1991."


Legal issues
In 1992, Sister Dianna Ortiz was the first to file a case under the act, in a civil action against former general and Defense Minister Héctor Gramajo of
Guatemala , contending that, by his command authority, he was responsible for her abduction, rape, and torture by military forces in Guatemala in November 1989. A federal court in Massachusetts ruled in her favor, awarding her $5 million in damages in 1995.

I'll just show you 3 things wrong here:

1. Civil Case: What Biafrans want is not monetary compensation but criminal prosecution.

2. Extrajudicial killing - Biafrans would have to argue that the protesters were not armed and the use of force was not sanctioned by the present rule of law in Nigeria.

3. They now have to show that they have exhausted all local remedies which means they have tried the judicial system in Nigeria, there are written documentation of nonchalant response from the justice system and so on.

There's a reason why this particular act has never been applied to a democratic government, the burden of proof is exhausting!

comrChris:
Must you call them names before passing your unneeded message across?

Its obvious you and your likes are the biggest monkey here, you said they are embarrassing themselves,then why not leave them alone, i know in real life you worth nothing, you are such a hopeless and a miserable being..

Indeed nairaland is filled with the most foolish persons on earth and you are undoubtly one..

I know you are going to come back to brag about what you may not even achieve in your entire life..

Seriously i hate people like you, always claim they know it all, even if you know little about this issue cant you pass your message in a polite way without abuse..

You would have made sense if we were discussing your family matters but since this issue concerns Nigeria and Nigerians(Those that like or hate Nigeria) then you have no right to stop people from commenting on issues of national disgrace! You don't know me and I don't know you, so there's no need for a statement of accomplishment but when it comes to U.S law, I don't expect simpletons like you to understand. Let me state equivocally that I do not hate any Biafrans all I'm saying here is for them to behave with some intelligence. What they want is not monetary compensation but criminal charges, a U.S district court can't do that for them, even monetary compensation won't happen, ICC would have been a better option but stubborn goats hardly use their brains but would rather crack their skull. Educate yourself man and stop your pathetic rambling!

12Monkeys:
Then why has the federal judge not thrown the case out?

Think afonja

Go back and read!

FiguratvelySpkn:
Not entirely true. The Alien Tort claim act offers some sort of relief to individuals in incidents that happened outside U.S soil; think the case of Ken-Saro Wiwa's descendants v Shell. However, the circumstances have to be "exceptional". Besides, the requirements to be met before relief can be granted are exceptionally high.

On the face of it, this seems to me like a waste of the court's time.

The case you mentioned happened because Shell is a multinational company with huge stakes in the U.S, it is completely different from a case against the Federal government of another country, the U.S district court does not deal with such and the sovereign country is under no obligation to answer to it! In addition tort refers to civil cases not criminal.