₦airaland Forum

ValerianSteel:
I don't see how this exonerates Russia.From the looks of things,the investigations are still inconclusive.In the light of more evidence,acquisition of more debris and further test would determine if Russia is truly guilty or not.Till then Russia appears to be favoured currently by lack of evidence and a dwindling opinion of it being guilty due to lack of substantial evidence.

ValerianSteel:
Saw this on RT earlier on and the case is a rather dicey one.

Erdem claims that materials for manufacturing Sarin gas were brought to Turkey and transported to IS and developed in IS camps when then the Islamic group was still known as Iraqi-Alqaeda.

This is a period before ISIS gained prominence as a global terror network.Much of what ISIS is today was not yet known to world governments.

Erdem's claims comes at a time when Turkey needs to exonerates itself of Russia's claims of its involvement with ISIS.Here we have a MP giving such details to RT,the chief propaganda arm of Russia's attacks on Turkish integrity and the claims do not accuse the Turkish government knew of the movement of chemical weapons but somehow it suggests the Turkish government allowed it or inaction to knowing about it aided ISIS,hence the treason charges.

MH17: Australia Say Russia Not To Blame, Evidence Tampered With
Submitted by IWB, on December 16th, 2015

by Sean Adl-Tabataba i


The official Australian investigation into the cause of the crash of Malaysian Airlines MH17 have accused the Dutch Safety Board (DSB) of failing to provide “conclusive evidence” of what exactly destroyed the aircraft, and say that Russia did not shoot down the plane despite accusations to the contrary from DSB.
The senior Australian policeman investigating the MH17 crash, Detective Superintendent Andrew Donoghue, testified in an international court recently saying that a “tougher standard than the DSB report” is required before the criminal investigation can identify the weapon that caused the crash.
Donoghue also testified that ten months after the crash, only half of the planes fuselage fragments were handed over for inspection and that “some fragments were not consistent with debris of the aircraft”.
www.Johnhelmer.net reports:
Their criminal investigation will continue into 2016, Donoghue told the Victorian Coroners Court (lead image) on Tuesday morning. He and other international investigators are unconvinced by reports from the US and Ukrainian governments, and by the DSB, of a Buk missile firing. “Dutch prosecutors require conclusive evidence on other types of missile,” Donoghue said, intimating that “initial information that the aircraft was shot down by a [Buk] surface to air missile” did not meet the Australian or international standard of evidence.

The Coroners Court in Melbourne is the first in the world to hold an inquest into the MH17 crash on July 17, 2014, and the cause of death of those on board. Iain West , the deputy state coroner presided, after the state coroner, Judge Ian Gray, withdrew at the last minute. The inquest opened for a single hour of hearing on Tuesday. A second hearing is scheduled for Wednesday, when West will announce his findings. In the UK, where an investigation into the death of 10 British nationals, is being supervised by Leicestershire coroner, Catherine Mason, all court proceedings have been suspended without a date being set for inquest. It was reported in the Melbourne court that British post-mortem experts participated in the Dutch investigations, alongside Australian, Dutch, and German teams, plus a joint Indonesian-Malaysian group.

In the Melbourne courtroom, press reporters outnumbered representatives of the families of several of the victims. Of the 28 Australian citizens killed, 11 were from Victoria state; 10 were permanent residents of Australia; and 3 had close ties to Australia. A local newspaper owned by Rupert Murdoch reported from the courtroom “the Kuala Lumpur-bound Malaysia Airlines flight… was hit by a Russian-made surface-to-air missile over eastern Ukraine”. In fact, Donoghue of the AFP said this was an unverified claim by the DSB for “a missile of a type previously provided to Ukraine.”
In court, in addition to members of the Coroner’s staff, there was one government intelligence agent who kept his official identification tag inside his coat, and refused to say whether he was an Australian or American national.
Donoghue was the lead witness. He continues to direct a team of 22 Australian police, forensic specialists and intelligent agents stationed in The Netherlands and Ukraine. He was followed by Dr David Ranson (right), a Victorian pathologist who led a team of 4; they worked at the Dutch military base at Hilversum in July and August of 2014, after the bodies of the MH17 victims were taken there for identification and forensic analysis. Donoghue said a full report by the AFP had been included in the coroner’s evidence. Ranson has filed two reports with the coroner – one of August 25, 2014, and one on December 16, 2014. So far the Coroner has classified these documents as secret.

Testifying on oath, Donoghue revealed for the first time that the Australian government had quietly negotiated two agreements to investigate the crash site in eastern Ukraine. The first, he said, was with the Ukrainian government in Kiev for security around the crash site. The second was with Novorussian leaders in order for the Australians to carry out their searches for victims’ bodies, personal property and other evidence, as well as to run a command post in Donetsk city. Political recognition by the Australians of the separatists has never been acknowledged before. Donoghue refused to say who signed the agreement for the Novorussians.

Turkish MP Faces Treason Charges after Telling RT ISIL Used Turkey for Transiting Sarin


TEHRAN (FNA)- An investigation on treason charges has been opened against a Turkish MP who alleged in an exclusive interview to RT that ISIL terrorists used Turkish territory as a transit route to deliver deadly sarin gas to Syria.
Ankara’s Chief Prosecutor's Office opened the case against Istanbul MP Eren Erdem of Republican People's Party (CHP) after his interview about sarin was aired on RT on Monday, RT reported.
"Chemical weapons materials are being brought to Turkey and are being put together in Syria in ISIS camps, which was known as Iraqi Al-Qaeda at that time."
Erdem noted that the chemicals used for the production of weapons did not originate from Turkey. “All basic materials are purchased from Europe. Western institutions should question themselves about these relations. Western sources know very well who carried out the sarin gas attack in Syria,” Erdem told RT.
As Turkish media reported Wednesday, the prosecutor’s office is planning to send a summary of proceedings to the Ministry of Justice on Thursday. Following that, the summary could be forwarded to the Turkish parliament, which could vote to strip Erdem of his parliamentary immunity.

Once Turkish mass-media reported the criminal investigation had been opened against Erdem, the hashtags #ErenErdemYalnızDeğildir - #ErenErdemYouAreNotAlone began to circulate in Turkish social networks.
On Tuesday, MP Erdem issued a written statement in his defense, saying he had become the target of a smear campaign because of his statements made in parliament.
As for his accusations about Turkish businessmen being involved in supplying Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL/ISIS) with the poisonous gas sarin and other reactants needed for chemical warfare, Erdem maintained this statement was made based on the results of a Turkish court investigation in 2013.
Erdem revealed that five Turkish citizens had been arrested by the Adana Chief Prosecutor's Office as a result of an investigation coded 2013/139. A Syrian national was prosecuted in Turkey for procuring chemical agents for Islamist groups in Syria. At the same time, Erdem noted all the persons arrested within the framework of the 2013/139 investigation were released a week later.
In his statement Eren Erdem claimed he had received death threats over social media following the publication of his interview to RT.
Eren Erdem said that the Turkish paramilitary organization Ottoman Hearths has published his home address on Twitter in an effort to enable at an attack on his house.
“I am being targeted with death threats because I am patriotically opposed to something that tramples on my country's prestige,” MP Erdem said.
In an interview to Turkey’s Kanal 24 on Tuesday, Cem Küçük, a columnist at the pro-government Star daily, said that Erdem's claims about sarin gas should be regarded as treason. Erdem should be stripped of his parliamentary immunity to “pay for his deeds,” Today’s Zaman cited Küçük as saying.

http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13940925001074

fineguy11:
u this tarfiki,i can see the wahabbi virus is doing quite a number on u..,,they were informed as part of the agreements reached between the US and RUSSIA,as regarding military operations in syria and also as a mark of respect and not a request for permission..just like the russians informed the US abt its plans to start airstrikes in syria.www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/11902275/Russian-general-tells-US-diplomats-We-launch-Syria-air-strikes-in-one-hour.-Stay-out-of-the-way.html. I find your
your mediterranean assertion quite funny.Russian subs have been sailing the mediterranean waters from its base in TARTUS(syria)since during the time of the USSR.are u also saying FRANCE wld seek isreal approval before sailing on the mediterranean?more than 20 countries have access to the mediterranean.saying isreal will fire on russian sub is degrading isreal to the level of Turkey in diplomatic relations...

ValerianSteel:
My point here is Russia wouldn't dear enter the Mediterranean on a high horse as RT would make us believe Russia has an invisible navy that can make mockery of any other Navy as they've been postulating when Russia sent it's naval fleet into the Caspian,nowhere in the news was it captured Russia informed or announced its intentions to other parties within the Caspian,hence the theory RT wants the world to believe,Almighty Russian navy is invisible.

You do Know Israel operates an underwater nuclear arsenal in the Mediterranean and would not risk a Russian sub going anywhere near it,Russia has to inform Israel else should the sub cruise anywhere near the silo,it would have been sunk by Israeli sub.Russia having knowledge of Israel's Mediterranean control won't risk loosing its sub to unprecedented aggression from Israel.

Clearly Russia wouldn't want a dispute in a territory far from its homeland hence the important announcement to Israel primarily and US,Israel's action is to allow the Russian sub's presence in the Med avoiding any anti-vessel confrontation with Israeli subs as well.

It is not necessarily seeking permission but making intentions known and avoiding confrontations in territorial waters Russia isn't party to.

Am sure my point is duely noted

ValerianSteel:
I've addressed and redressed a large part of your post recently,I wouldn't stress,my reply wouldn't do justice to an already conceived notion by you though I concur to some parts of this post,just not all.

We'll keep observing Turkey and I await Russia to present the world with a very viable evidence of the IS oil deals naming every single party involved and putting a stop to the incessant attacks on Turkey through the media,if Turkey is not the only one involved,name all the demons involved and stop making Turkey look like the devil,if clearly it is not the only party involved.

ValerianSteel:
I've never supported the US led invasion of Iraq.It was one of humanities gross misstep against a country and it's people.

The situation here is a different one.The Syrian Civil war arose out of canpaigns and protests in line with the Arab Spring that arose in the Middle-East.The Syrian crisis is an internal conflict between the citizens of Syria and the ruling power-The Govt-Bashir Al-Assad.

No Western power initiated Syrians against the govt..

ValerianSteel:
The funny and interesting aspect of these claims by both Russia and the Iraqi PM is that they only felt the urge to speak up until they were agitated by actions from Turkey.

Russia knowing about the oil smuggling kept quiet until her jets were shot down by Turkey.Iraq on the other hand kept mute all these while until it could no longer entertain Turkish incursions in Iraq.

It all boils down to,it's either there's a bigger truth that both parties(Russia and Iraq) were scared of hence their failure in admitting the illegal oil deals earlier.
OR
Their claims are just attempts at bad mouthing their new found foe-Turkey.

seagulsntrawler:
well done for lecturing those western apologists. No objective and rational mind would fall for the lies and misinformation of the main stream media controlled by the US and her allies.
One even believed that Assad created ISIS.
Keep up the good work bro. More grease to your elbow.

NairaMinted:
I can't help but think that perhaps if Uncle Sam wasn't on Turkey's side and protecting her, Uncle Sam would have used its formidable international clout and surveillance network to release the accounts through which these sales are laundered.

Unfortunately this won't happen.


I'm back guys! And back in full force cos Oga Putin was worried I wasn't meeting my propaganda quota.

ValerianSteel:
The internet always making a buzz whenever Russia presses a button Anyways as long as they take out ISIS,all good.

Oh,let's not forget,Almighty Russia took Permission from Israel and informed US before entering the Mediterranean.



www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-35041656

fineguy11:
That's a warning to NATO,.Russia will see this war to the finish..300 air sorties between saturday and today, hiting over 600 targets..currently,the ASSAD govt has taken over the the de-facto capital of the rebels(HOMS)after reaching a cease fire with them..meanwhile,Turkey is seriously crying,their investment(The Turkmen) are being bathed left,right and centre with balistic missiles.http://www.ibtimes.com.au/russia-goes-ballistic-syria-turkey-issues-warning-1490498
Of all the external parties involved in the syrian war,only one happens to be achieving its Objectives,he's the leader of the country below,,.

scully95:
Daesh says that the Russian Kalibr cruise missiles were not that effective because only 32 of the 33 terrorists hit were evaporated on impact. The last one only lost his left arm and righ leg. That is all. Other than that, they thank Allah for his protection.

ValerianSteel:
Oh God,just stop it.

Assad turned his country into rubles,cause the Syrian civil war started in 2011,while ISIL became fully operational in 2014,though they emerged in 2013.

ISIS is just an excuse to keep Assad in power,cause his country was already torn apart prior to ISIS activities.

You keep accusing Turkey of this and that,yet there's no substantial evidence to point accusing fingers.Mind you I've never called Turkey a saint in the war against ISIS,I wouldn't call Russia a savior either,am just saying let there be evidence that clearly shows that Turkey is in bed with ISIS and other terrorist element.

As you said yourself :It has more to do with a whole lot of concentrated governmental administrative machinery.

And I add- not limited to Turkey alone,but cut across those claiming to be fighting ISIS as well.

Missy89:
Lol is this the best you can do? Ehen Appleyard?

Missy89:
Appleyard : Which of the Russian bank and businessmen? Roll them out.

mazeltov:
what evidence do we need again? There are so many proofs which have been publicised as regards to this isis and their funder. I have never for once argue about the romantic relationship between Turkey/west and IsIs. My posts are there for confirmation. Even America has divided over this same issue of the Islamist - but in all fairness of truth and modesty, these people won't stop using Isis as their remoted military puppet to pave ways for their interest in the gulf states and middle east until they strike back. Sometime, a dog could bite its owner - and that's why I hardly engage myself in that section of conversation ; and the way I am seeing it, it seems Turkey's interest in this isis is wider than that of America, Turkey have gone a long way in flaunting that interest to world. I am waiting for the day Isis will attack America and that's when you will see that the war is nearer than before.

Iraqi Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi says Daesh Takfiri terrorist group carries out the majority of its oil smuggling through Turkey.

Abadi made the remarks in a meeting with German Foreign Minister Frank Walter Steinmeier in Baghdad on Monday, during which he highlighted the “importance of stopping oil smuggling by [Daesh] terrorist gangs, the majority of which is smuggled via Turkey,” his office said in a statement.
The remarks came as tensions have been on the rise in Baghdad-Ankara relations over Turkey’s deployment of troops to northern Iraq and Daesh oil smuggling via Turkish territory.

On Saturday, Abadi urged Turkey to withdraw its several hundred forces immediately from Iraq’s northern Nineveh Province and called Ankara’s move “an incursion”.
Turkey, accused of supporting Daesh terror group, claims the deployment is a routine rotation to train Iraqis to retake Mosul from Daesh, which captured Iraq’s second-largest city in 2014.

Accusations over Turkey’s role in Daesh oil smuggling were also raised by Russia. On November 30, Russian President Vladimir Putin said he received additional information confirming that Daesh had been conducting its oil sales via Turkey.
A screen grab from a video released by the Russian Defense Ministry shows Russian jets targeting a convoy of Daesh tankers transporting oil.
Russia has on several occasions accused Turkey of buying illegal oil from Daesh. The terrorist group is smuggling oil from the areas which it has overrun in Iraq and Syria, selling it to middlemen in the region. Russian military planes, which are used for an aerial campaign against Daesh and other militant groups, have repeatedly targeted trucks used by Daesh to smuggle oil.

On November 29, Iraqi MP Mowaffak al-Rubaie said Daesh had made more than USD 800 million in black market oil sales in Turkey over the last eight months.
“This is Iraqi oil and Syrian oil, carried by trucks from Iraq, from Syria through the borders to Turkey and sold … [at] less than 50 percent of the international oil price,” Rubaie added.
He further noted that the oil is either refined and used in Turkey or sold on the international market.
Turkey has rejected oil trade with Daesh with Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan saying that he will step down if the accusation is proven to be true

NairaMinted2:
I don't know whats up with the spambot and this thread!

OutThere:
This woman had better watch her back. Thats all I can say. JFK also sang a similar tune. See what happened to him and his family - many generations down...

NairaMinted2:
Turkish planes violate Greek and Syrian airspace with abandon.

Turkish troops are presently in Iraqi territory uninvited.

Not a word from the pro-Turkish bandwagon!


Fact is, Russia has provided satellite imagery of the massive oil smuggling exercise from stolen Syrian and Iraqi crude oil overseen and enabled by member of the Turkish government, yet these images have been waved aside as "fabrications"


Members of the Turkish press, parliament and military are being jailed or silenced for outing the complicity of the Turkish government and/or refusing to follow orders and yet these are waved aside also as irrelevant events. These arrested individuals we must accept are paid Russian trolls or bots just like the rest of the hope.less bots we find aplenty here on Nairaland. They are just "making mouth" with no shred of evidence that Turkish goverment is complict in this conspiracy.

Several Western (British, American, German, etc) news media have carried these reports of the massive oil trade being carried out across the Turkish border and how the Turkish border guards look away or allow their posts to be thinly manned but these are disregard as unfounded rumours and Russian propaganda. As a matter of fact, Turkish soldiers have been videod at the border fratenizing with ISIS foot soldiers but we gotta assume that these must be some sorta Russian voodoo trick.

A reporter, Serena Shim has mysteriously died while reporting on the illict trade between ISIS and the Turkish government. What's more, the investigation (or lack thereof) of her death has been beset by secrecy and intimidation but hey, who gives a hoot! This is the Turkish government we are talking about here; vetted and protected by NATO enagaged in a noble war against the "Russian aggressor"

The US VIce president himself has accused the Turkish government has far back as 2014 of aiding and abetting Islamic fundamentalists but hey, we should pay
no attention to that raging lun.a.tic who undoubtedly suffers bouts of dementia.

At the end of the day:

TURKEY = GOOD

RUSSIA = BAD

No matter what!

Ok na!

Missy89:
What is your take on the Russian bank and business men helping Syria to trade IS oil?