₦airaland Forum

Yooguyz:

Allow me to answer, I'll be back.


Am back.Jesus was crucified with two nails, one in each hand, not a single nail through the wrist. That separate nails were in each hand is made clear by the use of the word 'nails' not 'nail'. This suggests that Jesus had his arms separated on a cross, not together on a stake as represented in Watchtower publications.

Matthew 27:37 also supports the idea of a cross rather than a stake when it says;

"Above his head they had put the charge against him in writing: 'THIS IS JESUS, KING OF THE JEWS' ". How can something be put above his head, if his hands were nailed vertically as depicted by the watchtower.

"unless I see in his hands the print of the nails and stick my finger into the print of the nails and stick my hand into his side, I will certainly not believe".
John 20:25

Compare this two pix below, which one accurately fits into bible description?

yooguys, what is the essence of quoting bible verses when you dont even believe in those verses as you wrote below

;Re: Implication Of Tithing by Yooguyz(m): 10:47pm On Apr 11, 2013
good evening op,
i have never paid tithe in my life and i don't intend on paying tithe but let those who do keep doing it, *in my mind* #deluded bunch of tithe paying folks# I am a Caktholic christian but i dont believe in God, in fact religion is the opium of the masses.
YOU can ATTACK me cos am used to attacks infact i'll welcome one so far it's sincere #but if i troll you with multiple id's eh?#
funny thing about me i don't even believe in the bible am quoting it's for gullible people
you know yourself

https://www.nairaland.com/1253965/implication-tithing#15197331

now, one prophetUdeme has fallen to your gimic praising you for quoting bible verses that you said is for 'gullible' and you dont believe, what hypocryte you are

Yooguyz: I don't have anything against witness, I have a problem with the hypocrisy of watchtower leaders as much as you have problem with pentecostal pastors.

its a lie! your aim is to persuade all christians to become like you, that is alienated from God and practice anything their mind tells them even if bible condemn it or not

and greatest weapon is to build on sentiments or add unverifiable lies and attach them to sentiments so as to please 'a party' only to turn around to build on other sentiments to attack even those 'party' whom you seem to once support

I open my threads out of pity for the average gullible witness, to expose some watchtower theology for what it truelly is.

You should be grateful to me for my eye-opening exposes.

even the apostles are prone to mistakes, but when you constitute yourself a tool 'to tactfully distort' and add your own insinuations to issues with jehovahs witnesses to gain popularity what is your own stand with the lord?

2 peter 3:

3 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in both of which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder), 2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us,[a] the apostles of the Lord and Savior, 3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.

14 .....Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; 15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.


so are you doing your best to live a good moral live? no is the answer, when christians criticize other christian it is acceptalble according in the bible which says 'that you should reprimand so as to be sound in faith' but in your own case you dont believe in God and bible,https://www.nairaland.com/1253965/implication-tithing#15197331

so what you are trying to do is just to make people 'be like you' that is stop believing in God!

Yooguyz, you think you are wise in your own mind using christian sentiments of parties in arguments to prove a point to yourself and in your mind you call those who hail you 'fools' why dont you just declare yourself as either Agnostic or Atheist i think it will be honest to do that!

Yooguyz: Long time! What happened to you bro?

I missed your insults, lies against me and bullying

kidly identify a single lie here, i have provided a link which you have not denied where in your own volition wrote that;

1, you are a Caktholic christian but dont believe in God, and religion is the opium of the masses.

2, you don't even believe in the bible,that it's for gullible people
https://www.nairaland.com/1253965/implication-tithing#15197331

tell me which was a lie! now

Yooguyz: Oh I see! I very clever excuse to avoid answering my questions. I saw it coming am not suprised.

I guess you've researched the OP and found out that some of your " facts" were misleading and some slightly exaggerated.

And that the 1919 doctrine still being upheld by Jehovah's witnesses is not based on the bible.

If you knew about my popularity in this forum, why did you even bother to respond to my posts?

wow, its been long that i visited the NL, but im only passing by and reading your post and i wonder the kind of hypocrite you are, and what you are doing on the religion section when you are an atheist and every christian is gullible in your own convinction as you confirm it by your own post in the next link (bolded) https://www.nairaland.com/1253965/implication-tithing#15197331

Re: Implication Of Tithing by Yooguyz(m): 10:47pm On Apr 11, 2013
good evening op,
i have never paid tithe in my life and i don't intend on paying tithe but let those who do keep doing it, *in my mind* #deluded bunch of tithe paying folks# I am a Caktholic christian but i dont believe in God, in fact religion is the opium of the masses.
YOU can ATTACK me cos am used to attacks infact i'll welcome one so far it's sincere #but if i troll you with multiple id's eh?#
funny thing about me i don't even believe in the bible am quoting it's for gullible people
you know yourself

if you like tell mods to help you remove the post but i hav a screenshot

funny enough your father is a priest, and if i am correct you are an ORDAINED priest, and you have travelled with missionaries on evangelism


i am posting this so that everybody will see the true picture of who they are dealing with, i m not a jehovahs witness but i have them as friends and before delving into the topic here, what do you gain in trying to distort christianity, today you support penticostals tommorrow you support so called gay christians, you incite others against jehovahs witnesses but in your mind you are calling those who think you champion their course 'mumu',

if i lied pls tell the whole forum now so that i provide further proof!

How are you frosbel! its been long that i visit NL, but when i was reading your opening post i just felt bad to the fact that most people affected by this greedy pastors having always justify the pastors/G.O ealier and when it is dawn on them that yes 'this is not what christ represent' they will just silently turn atheist, a close friend of mine who was very rich but without a child for 7rs was regularly milked by a redeem church pastor to d extent that all his business informations were monitored by the pastor, yet no solution to his child issue and appointments to see baba GO is always not posible as another pastor will be reffered, now my friend is now accomodating thought that seem like atheist! its sad though but i will copy your post and send to his mail, good write-up!

@Reiyvinn

This is a conjecture, of course, that has its strength and pillars in the word "logical". It's like sitting on the fence. The scripture doesn't teach it but you believe it, thus, it either has to be "logical to conclude" or "dogmatic to accept" that it is or it is not. If the Scripture did teach such a thing, it wouldn't just be "logical" to "conclude" but bound to the fact that it is or is not. But of course it's not!

im not a jehovahs witness but i have some question for you, so go straight to the point please make your answer short and straight to the question

bolded above in your argument lets apply your analogy to the other party of the book of revelation, that is 'the dragon called the devil and satan'

1, is he an angel ? please quote where the bible says that satan is an angel without sitting on the fence, im waiting
'

JMAN05: This is what I mean by saying evidence says differently from the claim, 'we dont worship her'. Well, it is their life. Just that I pity billions of souls that are there.

you dont blame some of them too, because right from infancy some have been worshiping idols unknown, and again, catholics were directed to "deny outrightly" their deeds

when lawyers use the title; "your worship" a title in a particular field, and not applicable outside the field, they are not under compulsion to pay obeysance-alongside

but that cannot be said of these so called catholic priests below who knelt down "in worship of mary" [size=14pt]mumu kneeling down for a man-made painted and polished wood sculpture chai[/size]

# Time to expose these catholics

Bernimoore will be remembered as the man that finally nailed the catholics

And you quickly made bold and size 100 text of a word you never really understood

SHAME!!!

Be a good xtian and admit your error now..I beg you

let me show you what berny regarded as disgusting

below:

[size=14pt]“Queen thou art, whom all things worship,
Earth and hell, and heaven above;
”[/size]

this picture below is from the shrine of a fellow catholic idol worshipper st jude's shrine

mary's portrait, whom all things worship(see saints below mary's feet) as was made to "sit upon the earth" in "the heaven" yet, they say that you dont understand, does picture not speak louder below;[/quote]

[quote author=try69]

When catholics tell you, "we don't worship mary", it is because they know what the modern ascribe for worship is

no, its because they were told to deny outrightly! thereby they put opponents on the burden of proof! but the irony is that must everyone be learned to attain the knowledge of truth? peter and john jesus disciples were unlearned and they were zealous!

..

Olodo

when italo said Olodo, i thought you would see that as a foul language but you followed suit repeating the same thing to divert the discussion to insults, and it will be noted that you and italo started this insult of a thing, guess what? im not a gentle man! olodo is beter, but if i say that you are Dindinrin=im.becile, or oponu-alainironu=Directionless or agbaya-jatijati=good-for-nothing, what is my gain?

I guess when you saw "worship", you felt like

# I just discovered what no man has known before now

i think that you should have said that when i saw "to whom all things worship" and not only "worship" as you want to divert our attention, i pictured the disgusting idolatory practices of the the catholics below yet they denied, see it boldly below

it seems some people had ran out of gas! simple question, they cant answer, yet they call others gullible, Hisbluuuuuuud, arsenalwengerrrrr and yooguuuyz, im expecting this thread to hit page 50 with meaninful contribution, are you guys tired?

help yourself with these assignment, to prove true and false prophet, (im not saying jesus is false, but i want a better explanations than the jw and assemblies of God)

here we go;

mathew 16:28
28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom

lets break the verse

"some of those who are standing"
"will not taste death until they see the Son of Man"
"coming in His kingdom"

that some will not taste death at all "until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom"

[quote author=Yooguyz]

Jesus was seing them in their true reality as spirits and not bodies. Bodies die but spirit doesn't.
Remember apostle Paul compares sleep to death...

do you understand what the verse was saying at all? you see what im talking about, most of you dont even read to understand, you have just made a mistake now,

lets read it again

mathew 16:28
28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom

lets break the verse

"some of those who are standing"
"will not taste death until they see the Son of Man"
"coming in His kingdom"

can you see what the verse was actually saying now, that some will not taste death at all "until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom"

now you, are making a case for Bodies die but spirit doesn't

youguys; Bodies die but spirit doesn't

lets assume that their bodies are dead and their spirits are waiting for the coming of the son of man, remember the verse says "will not taste death at all until they see the Son of Man" which means they are not seeing the son of man right now in whatever form, until he comes in his glory

which according to your analogy, it is when the son of man arrived then their spirit will taste death, which means spirit dies you failed badly!

if jesus was talking about spirit he does not need you to tell him, all those listening to him are all dead now!

@BERNIMORE, as an active JW are you saying Jesus is a liar just like the watchtower society?

im not saying that jesus is a liar, but i need some true explanations on the issue

im not a jehovahs witnesses, i have said it severally neither assemblies of God, i have them as friends and we discuss very deep in scriptures, so i dont know what you are saying when you said they are liars

you have failed to prove them wrong if you have been reading the thread 4,5 lately, the evidences that hisblud brought was a fake, because the 1908 issue of "thy kingdom come" has a page (pg 228) where quotes were lifted, but the 1915 issue was falsified and presented without a particular page, i thought that you will come up with the actual page of "1915 thy kingdom come" where they actually change what they said in 1908 issue

i need evidence not just verbal talk, ok?

back to the topic,if jesus was talking about spirit he does not need you to tell him, all those listening to him are all dead now! is he a liar? or false prophet?

[quote author=italo]

God also told men to worship men

did God command us to worship mary, or sing heresies about her that. that everything on earth worship her?

Are we like Farouk Lawan, olodo

your case is worst than farouk, because you denied any form of worship to mary before but now, you finally admit part, when i show you the song in the hymn where you people sang ..worship to queen mary...... what God did not command

The prophecy of Jonah was for the pple of Nineveh, they got the message, repented and God didnt bring his wrath to pass

Asking you severally you fail to answer, did God ask jonah to include repentance in his prophecy "as a condition" that can make him change his mind? if yes show me the verse!

Jw predicted that the generation that saw 1914 will not die off till armagedon. The JW message was for this contemporary generation and most JW was expecting it fulfilment (they wish it had happened) and it turns out false

it wasnt false, it was delayed

an assignment for you to test your own knowledge, since you say the jw followers are gullible, as a smarter person, what will be your answer to what jesus said below…

Mathew 16:27-28

27"For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and WILL THEN REPAY EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS. 28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

unfortunately, all those people jesus was talking to are ALL dead! was jesus a liar? i need your own answer, pls dont jump or evade this very important question, im waiting

Any organization that predicted 1914 and still hold unto it till today, be it assemblies of God, JW, seventh-day adventist is a false organization, because it has been proven over and over that 1914 is false. Seventhday adventsit, whom JW copied most of their escathololical teachings, has discarded those predictions and moved on. Why did JW hold unto 1914 after it has been proven false?

i have not see any proof! and the one Hisblud brought the 1915 edition was falsified, and you have not come up with the "page" of "thy kingdom come" you relied on that the jw changed their earlier stand, isnt that funny?

I dont think it is ok to defend falshood at all cost, it is not injurios to admit mistakes and move on

you are yet to prove falsehood with "sound evidence" cant you get that? your claims are not tenable, but best regarded as "frivolous".

As a matter of fact, watchtower believes that they are still doing research on the bible teachings, which means that some of their truth today might be false tomorrow. Watchtower history will proove me right here

right from the onset they had always said it that they are not inspired! or directly informed! they tied this to paul predictions in 1 cor 8 that "if there are prophecies, they will cease"

so what we have now is "fufilment of prophecies already prophecied in the bible" can you see why your own story is always not in tune to the subject matter?

again your assignment; is jesus a liar? when he said this below;

mattew 16:27-28

27" For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and WILL THEN REPAY EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS. 28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

rabzy: Dont even talk about the trinity doctrine....that is a doctrine that is as false as any doctrine can be...That doctrine has been debated and in dispute and disrepute as soon as it came up up after the death of the faithful apostles...it only became widely accepted because of political pressure.
If you stubbornly refuse to accept the fact that JW never predicted but only expected, then what is the purpose of having any further discussion on this.

i took time to study their claims, and it was zero, but your people too are too easy to wind down, dont expect addicted jesters or scoffers to reason with facts, as you can see

see 3 strong evidences

your pope "prostrate to a shrine built for mary's image"

your pope acknowledge that in his apostolic writings,.....yet you say its not worship that it was honor

then

you sang the hymn "all things worship mary" and try69 said "nobody is worshiping Mary"

tell me can your own children trust your own word? kai

italo: @ Bernimoore, olodo.

I thought you'd know.

Maybe you should start by examining these verses where the Greek and hebrew words for worship are used and tell me if it was talking about worship meant for God.

Matt 18:16, Rev 3:9, Gen 18:2, Gen 23:7, 12.

The problem with you folks is you have no sense of history.

"Worship" does not mean the honour due God alone...only. In the old days, it was used widely for the honour due other beings.

Read and cure your ignorance!

your case is similar to that of farouk lawan who denied taking any form of money "as a bribe" but after otedola released some videos through sss, he farouk changed just few hours later and sayid that "yes i received and accept some money, but it was not "Not a bribe"

what stops him from telling us that he took money in the first place, and why cant he allow us to decide what it means maybe it is bribe, or not dont decide for us,....that was my comment on the thread then.


why do you people wait to explain "worship", an afterthoght, until i expose your hymn where you sing worship worship to queen mary

[quote author=arsenalwenger]

You are cunny and not sincere. Ok JW is now putting her shoe in the place of Jonah for their failed prediction.

im not a jw, im only giving you valid evidences that parrallel their case, as well as the assemblies of God on 1914 issue

Jonah warned the people of Ninehveh of God's coming judgement

you have just LIED no statement from jonah himself to ninevites shows warning, if you have jonahs own personal message he delivered to the ninevites "that contain warning, show me pls" im NOT reffering to what others might say, but his own direct message that he personally declared

Now my question is this, did JW pray that their predictions should not come to pass as the peaple on nineveh did?

did jonah himself pray that ...40 days should not come to pass?.......no he did nt, but eagerly waited until it passed and his prophecy Did not happen! can you show evidence of his recorded statements where he prayed that God should hold on? bring them on, but i doubt

Will the coming of christ be negotiable, through prayer, as the peaple of Nineveh did concerning the warning and prediction of Jonah? Will God change his mind postponed the date of armagedon after a prediction had been made by JW?

you question above shows that you dont read to understand opponents view, but all you are interested in is "scoffing" back to your question;

the coming of christ "can be delayed" and "negotiable" on condition of which is "the new converts who changed their bad ways" (i have treated this on page 3 and 4 of this thread.
read 2peter3


Habakkuk 2:2-3
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)

2 Then the Lord answered me,
“Write the vision.
Make it clear on tablets
so that anyone can read it quickly.
3 The vision [b]will still happen at the appointed time[/b].
It hurries toward its goal.
It won’t be a lie.
If it’s delayed, wait for it.
It will certainly happen.
It won’t be late.

note the clause, prophecy of God can be delayed,or seem to slack......but true servant of God should wait for it.

[color=#000099]2 Peter 3:8-9

8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, [b]as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us[/b], not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

So if you try compare prophet Jonah with failed watchtower prophets you are wrong

im may be wrong with your own MYOPIC VIEW, but with the evidenced that i have shown which you and hisblud had failed totally to adress, jonah's issue is same with russel 1914

. You will agree with me that 1914, 1925, 1935, 1975 and 1914 where all prophesied as the time for the end of gentile and when God will take over the rulership of the earth from satan. Did that happen? You and i knw that it is false dates.

i have not seen evidences to that respect, and the only evidence brought forward by hisblud in pg 4 was false! because the 1908 issue he quoted the screenshut had a "page" pg 228 but the changes alledged in 1915 on same issus of "thy kingdom come" was falsified and had NO PAGE!

You pretend not to see that fault in the page, and also pretend not to see that the jw added from the onset in 1908 evidence that hisblud provided they earlier say in line 10 of 1908 edition ...we are not Directly informed.....yet you falsely accuse then of later adding that as a latter cover up or feghning ignorance or using a latter excuse,

as you can see, all what you all base your talks are false and with no basis!

So if all the dates prophesied are all false, what makes you think 1914 is not also false

who is admitting false dates here? what we have is "delayed" and not "false" ok

the same thing with jonah, nineveh's destruction was delayed, nahum prophecied again on the same city, but both nahum and jonah never witnessed the destruction until some several decades later when God finally decides and did destroyed nineveh.

Are you taking the advantage of Gods delay to better your own personal relationship with God? you better thing well and take the advantage instead of occupying yourself with jesting and scoffing

i just seem to imagine why even animals listened to noah and escape the deluge, but addictive scoffers did not

and even jesus words that ..it will be easier for a camel to pass through the hole of a needle than rich man to enter into the kingdom of God

i cant imagine you and others spending whole lifetime on internet Not to know God, but to scoff

even at that your evidence was exposing you as not reading through and discover the flaws, just like someone who submit cv but ignorant of his own details in the cv

try69: I guess when the old english say "your worship" to magistrates, it means they have put the person in place of God.. Or when chinese people bow to the other, they have put them in God's place

GO AND LEARN!

You clearly don't know history.. See, history is even more important as you try to decipher bible truths..

The word worship comes from the Old English weorthscipe, which means the condition of being worthy of honor, respect, or dignity. To worship in the older, larger sense is to ascribe honor, worth, or excellence to someone, whether a sage, a magistrate, or God.

But there are different kinds of worship, just as there are different kinds of honor. The highest honor, and thus the highest worship, is given to God alone, while the honor or worship given to living men or to saints in heaven is of a different sort. Idolatry thus does not simply mean giving worship (in the old sense) to living men or to saints; it means giving them the kind reserved for God.


Nowadays, there is a problem using the word "worship" because in the popular mind it refers to the worship of God alone. For practical purposes it has come to mean nothing else than adoration. Although it was commonly used in the wider sense as recently as the nineteenth century (when, for instance, Orestes Brownson, an American Catholic writer, produced a book called The Worship of Mary), it is usually too confusing to use it that way now, as the example of the priest shows. It is wise to restrict its use to God and to use for saints and others terms like honor and veneration.

Is this distinction without a difference? It would be if the worship given to God were the same as the honor given to a saint. But it isn't.

The term "worship" was used in the same way in the Bible that it used to be used in English. It could cover both the adoration given to God alone and the honor that is to be shown to certain human beings. In Hebrew, the term for worship is shakah. Its appropriately used for humans in a large number of passages.

For example, in Genesis 37:7-9 Joseph relates two dreams which God gave him concerning how his family would honor him in coming years. Translated literally the passage states: "'[B]ehold, we were binding sheaves in the field, and lo, my sheaf arose and stood upright; and behold, your sheaves gathered round it, and worshipped [shakah] my sheaf.' . . . Then he dreamed another dream, and told it to his brothers, and said, 'Behold, I have dreamed another dream; and behold, the sun, the moon, and eleven stars were worshipping [shakah] me.'"

In Genesis 49:8, Jacob pronounced a prophetic blessing on his sons, and concerning Judah he stated: "Judah, your brothers shall praise you; your hand shall be on the neck of your enemies; your father's sons shall worship [shakah] you." And in Exodus 18:7, Moses honored his father-in-law, Jethro: "Moses went out to meet his father-in-law, and worshipped [shakah] him and kissed him; and they asked each other of their welfare, and went into the tent."

Yet none of these passages were discussing the worship of adoration--the kind of worship given to God.


http://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/maryc5.htm

hypocrisy at the highest level! try69 where are all these explanations above until i threw what your hymn says which you people sang?

bolded below was what you said that you dont worship mary;

try69:

Oga, nobody worships mary haba!!! Una no dey hear word?? grin


Did any apostle celebrate xmas?

Did any apostle wed people in church?

Did any apostle wore suits?

Did any apostle say "bible alone"?

Did any apostle celebrate easter?

Did any apostle receive tithe?

The obvious answers are NO! But

Can you wed without a pastor/priest?

You see why your question hold no water?

you should have admited to worship first, then take the pain to explain the meanings but you denied any form of worship before you admit some form of worship when you are embarrased with the hymn

when you people are caught red handed you shift your goal-post where are all these worship explanations before i posted the song catholics sang in their hymn

[quote author=italo]

First question: how do you know all that Peter did?

simple, through the current or latest sacred scripture, and NOT the unholy pagan scripture Apocrypha

The Catholic Church told you the man wrote 2 small letters we included in the Bible. Do you suppose those letters make up 0.1% of St. Peter's teachings during his lifetime?

small letters indeed! im satisfied with that small, the 2 small letters are the authenthic since its completion more than 2000 yrs ago, and moreso since it wasnt part of the apocripha unconfirmed and unholy scripture added by the catholic

even revelation 22:18 warns about the sacred scrolls, revelation is said to be the last book is the sacred scripture, it added a curse on those who added the unholy and unpopular apocripha not recognised outside the catholic that;

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

be warned

[quote author=POPE II]^ trash

What I'm saying is the behaviors of a pope is not conditioned by his predecessor. period

stop this lie pleease: it was more than condition, directives of former papal were adhered to in this evidence;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariology_of_the_saints

Louis de Montfort who was a priest for only 16 years and had but a handful of followers upon his death at the beginning of the 18th century, yet influenced four popes, namely Leo XIII, Pius X, Pius XII and John Paul II who chose his personal motto Totus Tuus(Mary im all yours) based on Montfort's influence.

Beyond the teachings of the early Church Fathers, the growth of Mariology over the centuries has been shaped by the interplay not only of theologians but also of three other forces:

1, Papal directives and teachings of the Holy See, based largely on the work of theologians.
2, Popular Catholic sentiments, devotions.
3, Views, writings and religious experiences of saints, theologians and non-theologians.

[quote author=try69]

Oga, nobody worships mary haba!!! Una no dey hear word??

let me pick your questions one after another,

(1) you said nobody worships mary

,

you dont even know how to lie, let me show you 2 evidences of catholic admitting 'worship of mary" i know that catholic faithfuls are told to deny that they worship mary, but their own recorded


The Glories of Mary by Alphonsus de Liguori explicitly mentions Marian worship in the fifth stanza of the hymn, “Mary, Virgin of Virgins” (page 589).

“Queen thou art, whom all things worship,
Earth and hell, and heaven above;
But thy heart o'erflows with goodness,
Just and sinners feel thy love.”
http://willingshepherds.org/Aspirations%20to%20Mary.htm

Try 69 this is one of the songs catholic faithfull sang "queen whom all things worship" in the above page 589 of the "track" Mary, Virgin of Virgins

or the pope who prostrate to her shrine, ......Pope John Paul made more than 40 pilgrimages to her shrines at Lourdes and Fatima.

He wrote in his Apostolic Letter of Oct. 16, 2002, the following words:

“I entrust this Apostolic Letter to the loving hands of the Virgin Mary, prostrating myself in spirit before her image in the splendid Shrine built for her by Blessed Bartolo Longo, the apostle of the Rosary.”

POPE II: your analogy doesn't make sense so because Peter and john Paul were not wearing the same things/clothes it means John Paul is illegitimate? Ah ah don't kill me with laughter. Every pope are free to put their papacy
under a specific saint .

Peter is the first pope and therefore linked to catholic church stop throwing punches in the air, you can't fight the obvious

who is talking about wearing the same cloth, or thing? are you around? this is how you are diverting to saying "computer" and "NL"

What im saying is that no bible character,peter for example ever prostrated before any shrine of mary, nor mention "virgin mary" but rather it was an act in imitation of the pagans

there is no evidence that link peter with the catholic, but evidence links catholics with paganism

figure of Mary has been erroneously elevated to a goddess status by Roman Catholic theologians. She is known as the Queen of Heaven, Mother of God, Eternal Virgin, Queen of Peace, Our Mother, Lady of the Good Death, Co-mediatrix, and Blessed Mother. Thousands of shrines around the world commemorate her. Visions, apparitions, visitations, and channeled messages accompany the mystical experiences of her followers.

Cesar Vidal elaborates,

“The idea of the universal motherhood of Mary, which does not appear historically until the 11th century, has a much greater connection with paganism than with Scripture. The same can be said of the representation of Mary with the divine child. This concept was also unknown…in the first centuries of Christianity.
…it is especially significant that Mary worship, which we find in Catholicism and in the Eastern churches, does not stem at any point from biblical concepts, but from theabsorption of pagan theologies like those present in the myths of Isis, Demeter and Cybele.” ( The Myth of Mary, p. 86, 89)

you admit that jonah made a false prophecy, and such felt bad that he wanted to die, unlike Hisblud that that was still battling with explicit evidence when it was clear that his case lack all the elements to even suggest warning, because it was very clear in a short quote "40 days nineveh will be overthown" jonah 3:4

what you termed as "two different cases here" is that jonah felt bad, when his prophecy failed, but the jw latter came out with excuses that they never aknowledged before

below is your comment;



quote author=arsenalwenger

As hisblud said earlier, was Jonah grieve that his predictions failed, hence wish he shuold die? Did watchtower accept their failed predictions as their mistake? The latter rather choose to feign ignorance that they never made predictions, that they are not inspired prophets, that their members are over-zealous, thats Jonah also made failed predictions.

The above is a classic case of superios intelligence against the gullible followers who cant question what a more intelligent master (watchtower) tell him.

im picking you-up here (at the bolded above) brother

from hisblud's own evidence far above(screenshut), there was a disclaimer contained from the onset, see the 1908 thing above, and read line 10, it states clearly that ...."we are not directly informed".... so it was not a latter excuse! as you want to pose it!

im i right?

POPE II: Did he ever mention nairaland or computer? Nonsense

computer or nairaland is not the issue here, but clearly catholic traditions and practices are Allien to what the alledged pope "apostle peter" practice and belief, and this further shows that there was no iota of truth that peter was linked to the catholic!

because you cant show any evidence!

@italo

The catholics alledged that apostle Peter, is the first pope(no biblical basis for that except catholics own tradition), but Peter never mention the “Virgin Mary”? in all his letters. Not only did he not mention her, but zero nothing is said by peter apostle about the need to venerate or worship her. This fact speaks volumes against the Catholic’s view of Mary because;

All popes worshipped Mary and leaned on her for salvation, and they have, and if Peter was the first pope, why does he not praise and adore Mary in the same vein as other popes?

peter did not prostrate to mary's idol in any shrine! like Pope John Paul did to her graven (forbidden) image shrines at [b]Lourdes and Fatima no record of that[/b]!

[quote author=arsenalwenger]

I have nothing to disprove again cos there is no any biblical basis for 1914, it was only conjured up by WTS to deceive the gullible.

keeping to the topic

if you say that there is no biblical basis for 1914, a year that the 1st world war started, of which one third of people living on earth died and peace was taken out of the earth according to report, its not the normal war but a unique type

then

is there anywhere you can point to where God directly told jonah to mention a figure pointing to a day of doom, ....in forty days...nineveh shallbe overthrown in Gods message to jonah? if you cant point to any then does it mean that there is no basis for mentioning a figure in the first place,.....and does that stir up the minds of the people of nineveh to repentance?

I like you loyalty, but there is danger in blind loyalty

you dont know what loyalty means

1, in case of jonah he lost out, and looks to be ashamed that he told God that he wants to die because what he said did not come to pass in 40days

2, in case of Noah's children shem Ham and japhet who were married,their obedience streched to not even giving birth at all for decades because of the seeming deluge, and had it been that the people then repented, do you still see the case of loyalty of Noahs children as dangerous as you put it? because it will be twisted as if they were been deprived by blind loyalty to their father, and NOT tp God

you can see now that projecting ones personal benefit ahead of Gods can distort your sense of reasoning!

religion itself can be faulted in all ramification, but those living by a devoted doctrine to please God do not deserve jest from those doing Nothing to please God!

@Hisblud

[size=15pt]The alleged 1915 edition of "studies in the scriptures" that you posted above of "thy kingdom come" was a fake![/size] unlike the first one in 1908 by the left which has a particular page(pg 228) the alleged 1915 edition where the quote[i] "deliverance of saints must take place very soon after 1914"[/i] was lifted has no page ! and suspicious! can you provide the particular page that it says "must take place very soon after 1914"

im waiting for that!

meanwhile the 1908 issue that has a date, there was a disclaimer regarding the "direct imformation" and there was no mention of day and hour! then it could be regarded as "stiring up minds by way of reminder! like peter did below


2 Peter 3,15-17

3 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in both of which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder), 2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us,[a] the apostles of the Lord and Savior, 3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”

and instead of getting the message, some untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures

15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

17 You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked;

like i said, no matter how you try to mix them up, it will be laid bare where people distorts what was not said, which page do you lift your 1915 quote above, so that we can start from there!

lets keep to the topic .......JMAN05, BERNIMOORE ON JONAH'S WARNING VS JW RUSSELL 1914 PREDICTION.)

bolded above reads jonah vs jw russel, russel was marked out as an entity,

russel was said to have predicted about 1914! Im not admitting the screenshut below as a true copy of the jw about the claim b/f by hisblud

but can still be used to verify some details

now

Russel who is an entity, and a "singular" person here cannot be reffered to as "we" neither does the statements below refer to russel as receiving information from a source to arrive as such conclusion, because on line 10 below, there was a disclaimer, like this

.........we are not directly informed!......

see it again; quotes from Hisblud below

Yooguyz: the source is from an insider in watchtower head quaters. Lemme keep that a secret.

Buh am surely coming with more..

why keeping it a secret as you sound? expose them if you are very sure! and you youguys as an ordained pastor, in your fathers church, are you justifying your role in the church? honest answer!

[quote author=hisblud]

WHO decides that it MUST be russel vs jonah… why not russel vs Yahshua or even russel vs any of the major/minor prophet? Am still asking you this and you seem to ignore or divert from it. So if you feel that it must be russel vs jonah that’s your opinion…what of russel vs Ezekiel… moreover

you decide! from the very day you put up this thread, see the bolded .....Re: JMAN05, BERNIMOORE ON JONAH'S WARNING VS JW RUSSELL 1914 PREDICTION

you have limited the thread to jonah and russel! with the heading of the thread! it would have been another case if you if you had put jonah vs jehovahs witnesses

i was reacting to what you said below

Hisblud. Hi berny, jonah did not change his words when the destruction of ninevah never occured. But can it be said of jw on 1914, read this

i only try to also remind you that since jonah did not change his words when the destruction of ninevah never occured before he died, russel too never change anything he said about 1914 before he died, maybe you have dig and search for any changes russel might have made but you cant lay your hand on any, you seem to be hard pressed, hence you decide to put russel vs yahshua ...or major/minor prophets,

and it would be unfair if after failing to show if russel had changed what he said about 1914 to another date to now force what he did not say or changes he did not make on him, you easily try to separate jonah and nahum prediction of doom on nineveh which both never witnessed. but tried to force what russel did not change before he died on him...are you fair? brother, i want fairness to these jehovahs witnesses, no matter how you tried to mix these facts up, it would be separated!