₦airaland Forum

Eastbay:
it's getting ridiculous.You're contradicting yourself at the speed of light with each post.
Which international individual honour did Maldini win to be termed a world-class player?If Zizou backs Scholes as world-class,then justSTFU.
now you're referencing groomed players again.
When Zidane was at Bodeaux,could anyone say he was world-class?I ask same as Ronaldinho at PSG.The list is endless.

This is what happens when you jump in the mdiddle of a discussion like a trailer with no brakes.
The discussion is about SAF grooming world class players, and you are yet to point to any other players he has produced.
When you have consensus evidence, and not some quotes cut out of context, that scholes was world class in his position, then come and post, but till then I advised you refrain from posting nonsense and just read.

Maldini not winning the WPOY is primarily due to the position he played, yet he has still won more individual honors than scholes. Even an unborn child knows of the greatness of maldinin.
Maldini and scholes no be mates.

And bsides,talent without titles make you a loser.and losers don't make world-class players.
And who has AW spotted that has become a world-class player,apart from Henry?

George weah?

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4159606#msg4159606 date=1247149773]Read Henry's quote. . . . .
For someone prattling about English comprehension, you have let me down.[/quote]still on quotes eh?

You are a retard. . . . .
When Ferguson bought Roy Keane, there was no guarantee he would be in the first team.
He had the potential and nothing else. . . . . . .Go and read his book.
Fergie turned Roy Keane to a world beater. . . . .What makes me antsy is DSTV fans like you pretending to be knowledgeable.
The fact that Roy joined Man Utd at 22 does not mean he wasn't groomed by Ferguson: Read a book!!!

so a player bought at 22 was groomed?
what next, a player bought at 35 becomes a recent discovery?
[quotes]I have provided you more than enough.
Knowing your memory fails you instantaneously, scroll up and read my input on SAF's world class players.
[/quotes] yep, I remember, quotes eh

Tell us the world class players Wenger has spotted.

did I say wenger groomed world class players? but you can point to talented signings like weah, viera, Anelka, cesc . . . . . . who were less popular before be signed.

Eastbay:
biina,
thierry Henry,Glenn hoddle,Sam allardyce,Zidane,Shearer,Venables,Edgar Davids,Cesc Fabregas,Tony Adams,eidur gudjohnnsen,Patrick vieira cannot be United admirers by any stretch of the imagination.
That list is as wide in range as it possibly can be.and while you're at it,let's add Stam,Schmeichel and Cantona to the list,so we don't say it's only the English guys.

yes and they all voted scholes the WPOY for 5 consecutive years

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4159466#msg4159466 date=1247148551]Some players don't like the lime-light. . . . . .How many times have you seen Scholesy name in the media apart from footballing issues?
He is so shy he rarely grants interviews so his skills were slept on.
I have provided quotes from Zidane, Lippi and many great players. If you can read well, you would admit i have made u look like a fool(again)!!![/quote]Quotes that never got him a globally recognized individual honor?
You must be high on something free.

What about Roy Keane? Mr English.
I have to assume there's a splinter in your sphincter. . . . . .
How many dynasties has SAF built at Man Utd? Considering the fact that many of his players in 92/93 are still playing for the club today.
It's as if you failed qualitative analysis as a child. . . . .It shows through the balderdash you spew week in week out.

what about Roy keane? was he on your list? or at the age of 22 and playing for 2 clubs over 4 yrs he is still being groomed? Keane  was developed before he joined ManU or where was SAF when Keane was joining Nottingham.
Dynasty? we are not talking about the premiership my friend nor are we even talking about the manU as a team. Simply provide examples that SAF grooms world class players, shikena!

What has AW won with his budding talents?
SAF won the league with kids in 95/96. . . . . .Tell us what AW has won with his KIDS.
U are a soccer-illiterate.

Again missing the point. English is not as hard as you make it seem. Wenger is better at spotting talent. Shikena.
Never said anything about winning titles.

@Sauron
ROTFLMAO
That list is simply hilarious.
A bunch of culled statement out of context from predominantly manU folks is what you have to show that he is a great player
What next, letters from his school teacher?

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4159279#msg4159279 date=1247147053]At this juncture, it will be fair to say you don't know what you are talking about.
So Ryan Giggs and Paul Scholes are not world class players. . . . .If i dig out quotes, you will be forced to swallow your vomitus here.[/quote]No they are not. When was either of the two the eminent player for his position in the world?
Giggs was so exceptional that they had to give him the PFA player award as a retirement gift, while Scholes can only boast of a PFA player of the month
You need to get out of the mediocrity of your club.

By your blurry estimation, Ronaldo and Giggs are from the same generation?

Is it that you cant comprehend English language, or you simply cant count up to three.
I said CR was the exception, and thus he cannot be counted twice. I simply ignored him on your list. There were only 3 players relevant to your argument on the list.

Name one manager in the world who has not copped failed projects.

Not all of them are being touted as world class talent groomers by a fan. The real question is what is the success rate?
For example AW has had failed projects, yet he is far better than Ferguson at spotting budding talent.

Eastbay:
Barring Maldini,how many of the above listed players became world-class players in places where they were groomed?
If your argument is to be deemed consistent,you'd know that these players were raw and unpolished when they first started out.Of course,I don't expect you to accept since you're determined to say anything disparaging about United.

I didn't say those became world class at the club they were groomed, but if you want examples of such: maldini, Raul, baresi, totti, messi, xavi, casillas. . . . . . .

HNIC:
@ Sauron
Whoever wrote that article is an idiot and
whoever believes the 100% drivel in it(where the hell is the idiot geting all those figures from, like he's Arsene Wenger's personal assistant) is a bigger idiot!
Why can't all these nitwit bloggers leave Arsenal alone
Arsenal will finish below Spurs, will finish below Man city, Everton etc
They will never win any trophy anymore
In fact at this rate, they will be relegated in three years time
They are useless,hopeless and senseless, bla, bla, bla
Arsenal issues look even bigger than the Global Economic Meltdown
Rubbish

living in denial eh?

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4159012#msg4159012 date=1247144597]Where is your retentive memory?

David Beckham
Paul Scholes
Ryan Giggs
Cristiano Ronaldo

What are those? Village-class level?[/quote]Dont you have any idea of what a world class player is? Some examples might help: figo, zidane, Ronaldo de lima, Ronaldinho, kaka, Van basten, Cryuff, Maradona, Henry, Ruud, Maldini, etc
The likes of Beckham, Scholes and Giggs were very good players (just like Rooney still is) but were never at a world class level.
The fact that 3 players from the same generation of youth products were all you could come with proves my point.
What SAF has always been good at is building a coherent team that plays like a single unit. Under ferguson, ManU play like if they share a common presence of mind.
His numerous failed youth purchases like Bellion, Anderson, Nani and co, are evidence he is not the talent groomer.

ogazi007:
Abidal has never delivered a useful pass since he joined barca and yet we have been winning most of our matches,our LB must not necesserily do the crossing,he only need to sails the ball to henry/inesta and the ball will be bouncing in the oponent 18 yrads box.

Abidal did get an assist against Villarreal 

its a mere rumore,the guy is styaing for good.he will do better than abidal if given enough play time this season.

We will wait and see.

yes!Brazillian Andre santos,we have all seen what he can do in the just concluded confederation cup.Roma bidded for  6m if we add 2m the boy would have multiple orgasm for being wanted by the best football club on planet earth.

An untested player from the brasileros is your solution? or did you miss the match against the US that he was taken to the cleaners, time and time again? All I have read are words from his agent claiming interests. The desired amount for Corinthians was said to be 6M, so I believe the deal would have been done if Roma had shown serious intent.
Until the guy proves himself in europe, he is not up for consideration.

Madrid had given up on villa since u opted for Benzema, really is he better than Higuain?inasmuch as i want to agree with u that samuel eto has been ill treated by barca,i think Eto can humbly leave for mancity,its obvious laporta and pep are not ready to better his existing incentives.he is my black brother,he deserves more respect from barca, how i wish thay can resolve this amicably, i like Eto alot

Madrid were not trying to sell higuain cos we bought Benzema, while Barca are trying to sell eto so that they can buy villa. Villa is a great addition to any team, but should you sell eto just to buy Villa?

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4158896#msg4158896 date=1247143177]Why not?
It could be Obertan, Valencia or even Nani.[/quote]I beg, there is no evidence that SAF is good at either spotting talent, or nurturing it to world class level.
The only success story is Ronaldo, while there is a long list of 'still waiting to happen' and failed projects.
One can clearly see that CR is the exception and not the norm.

and now SAF attempts to repeat same with Obertan?

Laporta confirms Barca's bumper bid for Villa (with comments on Ribery, Eto and Pep's contract)
https://soccernet-assets.espn.go.com/design05/images/JonMC/April2009/villa-275.jpg
Barcelona president Joan Laporta has confirmed the club have lodged a bid of over €40million with Valencia for striker David Villa. A host of top clubs have been chasing Villa this summer, with Barca understood to have been locked in talks with Los Che for the past few weeks. Real Madrid have already pulled out of the race to sign the 27-year-old forward, saying the price was too high. Chelsea and Manchester United are both still interested, but Villa's preference is a move to either Real or Barca. He recently called for a resolution to the situation, with the La Liga season fast approaching. Now Laporta has confirmed Barcelona want to take him to the Camp Nou. He said: "He's (Villa) a player we're interested in, and we made a good bid for him, closer to €40 million than €50million."

Laporta also confirmed Barca would attempt to sign Franck Ribery, should Bayern Munich decide to sell: "He's (Ribery) a player we are interested in at a logical price. But Bayern don't want to sell. Although if they are interested in selling, we are interested (in buying). We need small adjustments; a left back, a central defender, a midfielder and a forward."

The Samuel Eto'o situation is no closer to being resolved, Laporta said. The Cameroon striker has been offered a two-year contract extension but has yet to respond, while Manchester City have put in an offer for him. "I have called him a couple of times but he hasn't answered his mobile," Laporta said. "I don't know if he has changed the number or whether he's lost it, but I would like to speak to him."

The Barca president also said there is no way Lionel Messi will be leaving the club: "I love him a lot! He wouldn't leave Barcelona for any price. We are not selling, he has a clause of €150million, but more than that there his commitment to the club."

Laporta confirmed manager Pep Guardiola only has one-year left on his contract, but insisted both parties were content: "He's got a contract until the end of the season and he likes this situation."
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=659873&sec=transfers&cc=5901

Nice article. AW needs to close his eyes and spend some money, but a debt that exceeds the value of the club    is not helping.
They need to sell some key players to raise funds.

Its a shame that AW didnt join Madrid under perez, as he would have had the opportunity to cement his legacy as the best talent manager in modern football.

@ogazi007
Puyol as your primary left back for the season is simply asking for drubbings in la liga. Offensively, he would have to  make 180 degrees arse turns to deliver crosses as he is right footed.
I havent seen Caceres at LB so cant comment on him, but I doubt he is better than abidal, and anyways he is rumored to  be going on loan to zaragoza.
Of all your current options. abidal is still the best at LB, and moreso you need puyol for depth at CB.
You are not ready to pay €11m for filipe, but think you can outbid chelsea for the €20m rated Bruno Alves
You talk of an affordable rate, but can you think of one alternative of comparable quality that would come cheaper?

I am starting to suspect that Barca are hinging all their other transfers on the eto-villa deal, a deal I still dont get what they intend to achieve by it.
Its one thing to show interest in Villa simply to drive the price up for madrid, it something else to buy him at that inflated price.
Selling Eto for less than €30m, and buying Villa for €40m+, just seems like a bad deal. I dont see Villa as being €15m better than eto (if at all)
Now Laporta is playing innocent saying eto is not picking his calls. What was he expecting, given the way he and pep have treated samuel?
I hope eto simply sees out his contract and moves on for free

ahonohai:
I remember  a certain beast called Julio Baptista. He turned down the chance to move to Arsenal in the year before the World Cup. . .he didn't make the squad and by the time we got him on loan, he was so inconsistent he couldn't secure a permanent move despite his best efforts

From what Gazidis is saying in his latest interview, we may be done with our activity in the transfer market. Wenger only admitted interest in a striker in the event of a departure (preferrably before the end of July) and the CEO emphasised on securing the long term futures of our young talent rather than buying the finished product unless they would improve the team - a team they consider competent enough to challenge for honours

Baptista is the best example of a 'dream' player. He dreams about what he is not.
The guy is a born striker, who sees himself as a midfielder. Every time he has tried to play  as a midfielder, his performances are mediocre at best, and outright disgraceful on some days.
On the other hand, watch him in the box and see him netting goals like if they were going out of fashion.
For example, how many strikers can do this
[flash=480,385]http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/rRnc1b8Div0[/flash]
Baptista scored 50 goals in 81 appearance for sevilla. A 62% goal rate which is right up their with any of the top strikers.
The idiot is wasting his time trying to be a midfielder, essentially throwing away an opportunity to be one of the best strikers of his generation.
The gods truly must be crazy.

bgees:
buy whatever and whoever, we are still gonna burn ur galactico asses when we meet again!

who you be? who be you? abeg clear road for jagajaga, we no get break

@muki
I dey give una better advice, u no wan listen

Am surprised at the kind of support some arsenal players are getting.

AW needs to sell some players to raise funds for buying needed players.
My choices would be
1. Van Persie: An injury prone finesse player. The guy is no bergkamp.
2. Cesc: Another guti in the making, who has failed to round his game with either defensive abilities or good dribbling skills. He is a liability that would always necessitate the play 3 around the circle to have a balanced midfield.
3. Adebayor: His on field performance is not worth the attitude problems. The guys seems to think he is kanu or henry

All three are overrated and AW should sell them while he can still get good money for them.

Play Nasri behind Arshavin and Bedtner/Eduardo, acquire quality DM, LM and (possibly CB), and, Arsenal; will be in good position for a title run.

If you dont need a LB. why are you after the kid? and neither Puyol nor Alves would solve your LB problems.
Add that Alves is being evaluated at €20m, and Chelsea are also rumored to be interested, I doubt Barca could land the portugese.
It is not about being father christmas but that if you are willing to pay €9m, why not just add €2m more and close the deal, instead of dragging things out.The boy wants to play for Barca, and depors evaluation are reasonable given the inflated market.
Even Cissokho is valued at €15m.

tayoccu:
i hope you know that until a player puts his signature on paper,and is officially unveiled, his transfer can still fall through?

do you really think em match fixers are bigger than the red and white army?

Nobody said it was official. In fact he can still fail the medical and have problems with his teeth, but those are exceptions not the norm.

Simply put, Juventus is a bigger club than arsenal!! It is incomparable.

You guys need to stop being so tight fisted and make a more reasonable bid. Something above €10m will get you your guy.
LBs are scarce in the market, with Milan and Madrid also looking for one. The price will go back up if those other teams show interest.

debosky:
So what? Is he the only quality CM/DM out there?

Let the Melo deal be confirmed before y'all go all gaga.

why are you getting defensive (or your team not getting 'defensive' )
Arsenal wanted Melo, but he is on his way to juventus. Arsenal lost out.
There is no going gaga about it. The guy picked the bigger club

@tayoccu
Goal.com did not originate the melo story, but were only quoting Sky sport Italia.
Fiorentina already admitted to Juve reaching an accord with the player.

For you information

Juventus president Giovanni Cobolli Gigli insists the signing of Arsenal target Felipe Melo is not yet a done deal.
The Turin giants are on the verge of acquiring the 25-year-old Brazilian star in a £21million transfer from Fiorentina.
"Melo is not yet a Juve player," said Cobolli Gigli to Gazzetta dello Sport. "The negotiations are still ongoing.
"We still need to define certain terms to officially confirm his signing."
Melo arrived in Florence from Spanish side Almeria last summer in a £7million transfer.
He is contracted to Fiorentina until 2013 and is expected to pen a five-year deal with the Turin side.

http://www.sportinglife.com/football/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=soccer/09/07/08/SOCCER_Arsenal_Melo.html

The guy is going to Juventus, it is just not yet official. Even the CR to madrid took some weeks to iron out the details.

Ibime:
hehehehe. . . . .are you blind?. . . . abi you no know say language na relative expression. . . .check the statement again. . . .  

"Laurent Blanc has managed to challenge and even beat Lyon for two seasons without spending a dime. . . . even the £4.5m he spent on Yoaan Gouffran was extravagant by his standards"

and Alou Diarra that he bought for  £5.2million nko? I beg stop wriggling my friend

Ibime:
(1.) Perhaps you are referring to Debosky here. . . . I made no assertion that Blanc didnt spend a penny. . . .

Ibime:
Jose Mourinho is a spendthrift and money waster . . . . Laurent Blanc has managed to challenge and even beat Lyon for two seasons without spending a dime. . . . even the £4.5m he spent on Yoaan Gouffran was extravagant by his standards. . . . so far at Lyon, he actually has a net surplus on transfers. . . . thats what you expect from a man with a degree in Business Management. . . . perhaps Ivan Gazidis would recommend him to Gaynners since he doesn't like spending cash.  

yes it must have been debosky

(2.) This is complete and utter misinformation. . . . . if Gomez is the tactical genius, where is he now? The same Gomez who completely messed up Monaco?
When Laurent Blanc took over, Bordeaux were 6th.
2nd was the season before. . . . in 2005/2006 when they finished 2nd, they were still a good 15 points behind Lyon. When Blanc took over in 2007, they had just finished 24 points behind Lyon. . . . yeah I see. . . . GOMEZ IS A TACTICAL GENIUS! 
You would soon be telling me that Ranieri set the table for Mourinho since he finished 2nd the season before JM took over. 
For the first time in 7 years, Laurent Blanc took the title race to the last day of the season in his debut season, finishing only 4 points behind the Lyon behemoth. . . . in his 2nd season, he eclipsed Lyon, finishing 9 points ahead. . . . and you are here yarning that Blanc had the table set for him by Gomez. . . . ol' boy, tell that one to the blind man, if you are feeling one-eyed. 

The problem at Monaco was not the fault of Gomez nor his predecessors, but of Pastor, who ruined all the hard work of Svara, and was more interested in 'has been' players. I didnt say Gomez was a tactical genius, but rather given time he would have likely achieved the same result as Blanc. The pieces for Blanc success were provided by Gomez.

Mourinho inherited a very good squad from Ranieri, with players like Makelele, Terry, Lampard and Joe Cole. Ranieri did lay the foundation for Mourinho's success, but his reputation as a tinkerer has always hindered his ability to win trophies (also evident at Juventus). His 2004 second place finish was the highest for the club up till then.

Bordeaux winning the league had as much to do with them doing well, as with a Lyon era coming to an end (they finished 3rd after 7 titles). The handwriting had been on the wall for lyon since 2007/08 when the new coach, perrin decided to overhaul things. Blanc has done nothing to earn him the star status you seem deluded about, or was he not the coach when they were being hammered in the champions league?

The brilliant coaches in ligue 1 of recent were the likes of Deschamps, Eric Gerets and Le Guen. Blanc is just an up and coming coach, and only time would tell if he would be great one.

Agreed that Marseille is a bigger club than Bordeaux (actually the biggest club in France), but that has more to do with finance and popularity, than actual success on the pitch.

Contrary to your earlier assertion that Blanc didn't spend a dime in winning the league, 5 of the starting eleven were acquired by Blanc.

In the two seasons under Ricardo Gomez, prior to the appointment of Blanc. Bordeaux finished 2nd and 6th with the best defensive record in 2005/06 (conceded only 25 goals). The primary reason for them not getting over the hump was their low scoring attack, which averaged 41 goals in the two seasons. This problem was obvious and Gomez was already making moves to solve it with the purchase of Cavenaghi, and wendel. and taking Jussie on loan. Unfortunately he was sacked before the additions could take effect.

Enter Blanc who added Gouffran and Bellion, and the attack became sharper. Add gourcuff a season later, and Bordeaux had the class they needed to win the title.

Blanc is no tactical genius, he simply had a meal on a table set by another.

The old lady of Turin seems to be doing quite well in the transfer market. They are assembling a quality squad without the high expenses of Real Madrid. Recent additions include Diego, the playmaker from Bremen, and Cannavaro from Madrid. With existing players like chielini, Amauri, the evergreen del piero, and upcoming giovinco, things arent looking too shabby for a title run. The only question mark would likely be over the coach Ferrara who has never been a coach, but was assistant to Lippi for the national team.

Poor arsenal, as they seem to have lost out on the signing of a quality CM/DM.

Juventus Sign Felipe Melo
Juventus have signed Felipe Melo from Fiorentina for €20 million plus the full ownership of Marco Marchionni, according to Sky Sport Italia.
The deal has been done and official confirmation will arrive tomorrow. The total value of the deal equals the €25m release clause in the new Fiorentina contract that Felipe Melo only signed last week. The ex-Almeria man has signed a five-year contract in Turin worth €2.6m a year.
Juventus have been in the market for a top-class centre midfielder, and their primary target had been Udinese’s Gaetano D’Agostino. However, the failure to agree on a transfer fee had seen Juve look elsewhere for possible alternatives.
Over the last few days there had been widespread speculation over a move for Felipe Melo, who has also been tracked by Premier League side Arsenal.
On Saturday, Sky Sport Italia claimed that Felipe Melo’s agents had reached an accord with Juventus, and that Bianconeri officials were to meet their Fiorentina counterparts on Tuesday in order to arrange a transfer fee and close the deal.
This was followed by an official announcement on the Fiorentina website, which stated that the Viola had only received one firm offer from Arsenal, and that they were negotiating a cash-plus-player exchange with The Gunners, that player being Emmanuel Eboue.
The saga continued to play out, and only today Fiorentina transfer chief Pantaleo Corvino insisted that Juventus had still not made an offer, and that Arsenal were in pole position.
However, Sky Sport Italia, an extremely reliable source, claim that Felipe Melo is now a Juventus player.
The 25-year-old will become the third Brazilian member of the Juventus line-up, along with Diego and Amauri.
https://i.media.goal.com/g/46994_news.jpg
http://www.goal.com/en/news/10/italy/2009/07/08/1369874/juventus-sign-felipe-melo-report

Cristalz:
Good idea there. I'll do that. Thanks.

Nice job with the directory. Adding a mod feedback/complaints thread would help with the communication.
BTW I had a good idea why my post weren't showing, just thought they were being deleted by the bot and not just hidden. I knew it wasn't a mod action (response time was too fast )

As per sorting the directory, instead of alphabetical sorting, you could try subgrouping with bold headers e.g

1. Club Fan Threads
Manchester United
Liverpool
Barcelona

2. Player Debate
Berbatov vs Ibrahimovic
Cristiano Ronaldo vs Lionel Messi
I Think Messi Is Overrated

3. Other sports
NBA Season 08/09
Formula 1 Grand Prix 2009
NFL 08/09 Season
Tennis Fans
Martial Arts

Cristalz:
lol.  .  .your posts aren't disappearing. The anti-spam bot is not sure if you posted spam or not, so it's made your post invisible to all users but moderators and admin.
I'll tell Seun to rectify it when he comes online,k? I'm reading what you posted now, don't worry.

I feel exploited