₦airaland Forum

feedthenation:

---Putin just wants to invade Ukraine for his own political ideology---nothing to do with NATO---

https://www.foxnews.com/world/putin-ukraine-invasion-rationale-july-2021

I don't believe Putin is more ideology driven than money driven. Ukraine must have something everyone else wants, for all this interest.

sanpipita:
Global community will always give their opinions and solidarity to issues around the world, still had end sars resulted to overthrow of government will it still be meddling because they talked about? reducing 2014 Ukrainian revolution to meddling is an insult to people of Ukraine

I do agree with you. Just that other views exist and form the basis of the actions of some.

sanpipita:
There wasn't even any meddling, a people's revolution is what these guys are calling western manipulation, if Obama was meddling in Ukraine he would have moved in once Putin seized Crimea

America does not need to move in to meddle. We already know Biden's involvement in Ukraine through his son. That is very high level access to influence if not meddling and manipulating to your advantage as opposed to that of another.

sanpipita:
A removal by people who elected him? if end sars lead to removal of buhari, will you say its meddling?

Not if there were no external meddlers I wouldn't. And if only because end sars was a stupid ignorant typical disorganised Nigerian aluta uprising, I doubt there was external meddling.

Damn! Do they teach this stupid ideology in our universities or something, that might is right?

Fact is, external meddling goes on in Ukraine, by Russia and by Europe and by USA, as we all can see. And we are a democracy! We should not remove our president by storming the capital like some ignorant Americans tried to!

AmazonTopaz:
And you think what Russia is doing right now is not enough reason to justify Ukraine's membership of NATO?

I think it does justify Ukraine seeking membership of NATO, though not "reason", since
Ukraine's membership of NATO is justification for what Russia is doing, according to them.

It's chicken or egg, to me, Amazon.

Pre-Socratic philosophers were mostly interested in cosmology, the beginning and the substance of the universe, but the inquiries of these early philosophers spanned the workings of the natural world as well as human society, ethics, and religion. They sought explanations based on natural law rather than the actions of gods. Their work and writing has been almost entirely lost. Knowledge of their views comes from testimonia, i.e. later authors' discussions of the work of pre-Socratics. Philosophy found fertile ground in the ancient Greek world because of the close ties with neighboring civilizations and the rise of autonomous civil entities, poleis.

Pre-Socratic philosophy began in the 6th century BCE with the three Milesians: Thales, Anaximander, and Anaximenes. They all attributed the arche (a word that could take the meaning of "origin," "substance" or "principle" ) of the world to, respectively, water, apeiron (the unlimited), and air governed by nous (mind or intelligence). Another three pre-Socratic philosophers came from nearby Ionian towns: Xenophanes, Heraclitus, and Pythagoras. Xenophanes is known for his critique of the anthropomorphism of gods. Heraclitus, who was notoriously difficult to understand, is known for his maxim on impermanence, ta panta rhei, and for attributing fire to be the arche of the world. Pythagoras created a cult-like following that advocated that the universe was made up of numbers. The Eleatic school (Parmenides, Zeno of Elea, and Melissus) followed in the 5th century BCE. Parmenides claimed that only one thing exists and nothing can change. Zeno and Melissus mainly defended Parmenides' opinion. Anaxagoras and Empedocles offered a pluralistic account of how the universe was created. Leucippus and Democritus are known for their atomism, and their views that only void and matter exist. The Sophists advanced critical thinking and philosophical relativism.

The impact of the pre-Socratics has been enormous. The pre-Socratics invented some of the central concepts of Western civilization, such as naturalism and rationalism, and paved the way for scientific methodology.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-Socratic_philosophy

Those who find their mind and learn how to use it will have started In the Beginning and gone on asking and knocking and seeking for wealth moths can not consume instead of merely believing and trembling.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pDO2hLLWLw

sanpipita:
There wasn't even any meddling, a people's revolution is what these guys are calling western manipulation, if Obama was meddling in Ukraine he would have moved in once Putin seized Crimea

The removal of the elected president seemed like meddling. I'm not blaming Obama though.

raumdeuter:
Personally, I want America to ignore and focus on itself. For example Ukraine, let EU take care of themselves. All these NATO members when they ask them to contribute 2% of their GDP they will refuse but anytime Putin shakara them they will be asking America to come to their aid

Anyone that cannot contribute their 2% should defend itself

That's precisely what drumpthfp said, so I find it amusing some think he would have shipped forces to Ukraine.

feedthenation:
---Why is NATO as an organization to be blamed for what is happening--- they can't stop any democratic, sovereign nation from joining its membership---

---Ukraine like other Baltic nations who have joined NATO have every right---

---92% of Ukrainians voted from independence from USSR in 1992---

---Putin who is a totalitarian despot doesn't appreciate the democracy of free and fair election in Ukraine---He wants to control Ukraine---by his proxies---

They can't stop, but in this case they are actually encouraging, which is equally not wrong unless you are Russia.

Just flip it round. Think Russia base in Hawai.

benalvino3:
Are you going to deny reality? This conflict started 2014 what dont you understand? That was as a result of Obama and his admin meddling in the country neighboring russia.

Its not what they said, its what they did.

The whole mess is there for you to see. They can play with other nations as they like but russia will not allow them play at their backyard

It actually was Europe that was meddling long before Obama and in response to splits in Ukraine.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine%E2%80%93European_Union_relations

LordReed:
Forced Russia? You are kidding right? What military moves did the West make in Ukraine that required a military response from Russia? Putin's stated goal of demilitarising Ukraine was brought about by which of the West's actions?

Not sanctions, my Lord. Europe first tried some alignment with Crimea, which was why Putin annexed it, then they tried letting Ukraine into NATO and here we are now.

Anyone who thinks Russia will sit back and allow itself to be surrounded by what seems like US proxies, is in lalaland or thinks Russia can have a military base in Cuba, or better still, Hawai.

BasedUsername:
I generally just match the energy of the person I'm debating. I usually start off respectful but if the person acts an idiot, then it's chimpanzee time! I don't take myself too seriously and I'm not above doing a little trolling. However, I'm never the one to start beef.

So, you allow yourself to be swayed to immitate idiots by becoming a chimpanzee?

Sorry, I'm not doing history and benefits of religion with you here. There's lots of threads for it already. One benefit however is the language you are writing here with in words that likely don't all exist in your native language, which probably differs to mine, meaning communication would be much harder and misunderstanding more prevalent, providing more opportunities to lead you to donkiefy and chimpanzee.

See here so you have an idea where I'm not coming from.

BasedUsername:
No offence but this is very one-track thinking. I'm not talking about blowing up all your opponents and my example never insinuated anything like that. Power and might may come in the form physical strength, military, intelligence, money, social dexterity, beauty, etc. However it still holds true that at the root of most of this lies the implicit threat of violence.

But the end result of 'might is right' is always "about blowing up all your opponents". I mean, see us here. Immediately we identify an opponent we disengage brain and donkiefy and violently attack.

War is after all just the same violence on a larger scale, no?

BasedUsername:
The LGBT community will gain power by influencing how people think through different media and winning more people over to their side. That's how it has always worked. One caveat though, that is also how immoral ideas spread. How did Christianity and Islam spread so far and wide? I don't know if you're familiar with the meme, but the answer is: "through Jihad".

Perhaps stop learning from memes and study some history. You might find parents paying for their children to be taught in Islam and Christian schools too, which were superior to what preceded them.

BasedUsername:
Now back to my original point. In countries where LGBT rights are recognized do you know what happens when you beat someone up for being gay? Well, they send a bunch of armed men to deny you of some of your rights. Are those countries bullying homophobia? No, but they need to employ the power of the police to protect these people

Another thing you learned from a meme, based?

In UK where LGBT rights are recognised, unarmed police will investigate and arrest you and if a case can be made against you will be brought before a judge and jury who will determine if you are guilty and must be fined or jailed or not guilty and set free, and if you got that wrong, well.....

Ibime:
What know-how does Taiwan have that China doesn't?

I know o. Was responding to his "pretty much screwed", as if China hadn't screwed him already.

olushowunm:
Its not possible to pay for 365 days a year in the real calculation...

So, you tell them you will pay in advance every Monday and request a discount paying 5 in 7.

Let us know how much you save.

tonididdy:
Absolutely!
The West had plans for Ukraine, a Nato deal is as simple as putting pen to paper.
Why the delay?
Definitely there was a change of plans, Putin is wild.
Honestly know one know the capabilities of the Russian military.

Question is : who wants to find out?

This is not in the proper order nor is it all there is. If you help with either I'd appreciate.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_on_Priority_Measures_for_European_Integration_of_Ukraine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromaidan

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russian_Federation

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Yanukovych

gambojimeta:
Russia Isa have base in Cuba.

Where, please?

Livelystone01:
Don't you think Putin and Xi's latest bromance is because of something like this?

How will the US come into the battle between China and Taiwan when it happens? Like, what would be their reason to defend Taiwan or attack Chinese troops?

This is a chess game, everyone is tired and poised for war.

This is something like a bone stuck stuck in our throats. No one is safe from what warmongers are planning, not even those of us who are faraway in Africa.

The funny thing is that it is inevitable. It's not a matter of if but when.

God help us all.

I'm expecting to hear, China invades Taiwan, anytime soon.

BasedUsername:
If China takes Taiwan, we're pretty much screwed. China would corner the semiconductor market, making them the manufacturers of most of our electronics. With the growing prevalence and reliance on smart devices, IoT, and cloud services, digital security would be a nightmare. Even moreso than now.

For that reason, I don't believe America will let Taiwan fall. Strategically speaking, they can afford to lose Ukraine but not Taiwan.

If China invades Taiwan they'd take all the technology they want before Biden wakes up in America.

They don't need the infrastructure. They just need the knowhow.

BasedUsername:
It goes even further than that. Most power is upheld by the implicit threat of physical violence.

Murder is bad, stealing is bad. What do we do to offenders? We send armed men to deny them some of their rights.

Look at it this way. For example the LGBT community is persecuted in Nigeria. I believe it is moral for them to have equal rights in this country but my belief isn't enough to change anything. Why? Because I, and the people who think like me don't have the numbers orthe power to effect that change. Until a critical mass of people support them, nothing will happen.

And that is why LGBTs has used brains instead of brawn to achieve equality wherever it has achieved it, unless you want to show me LGBT doing aluta.

I've always said the Biafra proclaimers will fail until they use their brains. Mere making the Biafra area the best and most secure and law abiding will invite investment but they unfortunately reason like you do and wouldn't surprise me if the resort to the might of bombings someday, unless things change of course.

BasedUsername:
It's neither moral nor fair, it's just true.

True for you, based, not for buda.

It's called, might is right, the ideology of the bully, for a reason.

This book is a reasoned negation of the Ten Commandments–the Golden Rule–the Sermon on the Mount–Republican Principles–Christian Principles–and "Principles" in general. It proclaims upon scientific evolutionary grounds, the unlimited absolutism of Might, and asserts that cut-and-dried moral codes are crude and immoral inventions, promotive of vice and vassalage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Might_Is_Right

stanech:
He should have stayed out of it... Now his country is getting destroyed while the west looks on.

He was doing what he was voted in to do.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromaidan

stanech:
This is bad but it's all Ukrainian president's fault for letting his country to be involved in whatever is going on between Russia and US. His brain could have saved Ukrainians from this war than the weapons that the instigators are giving him.

I'm impressed!

Can someone please tell these people no God made any world except biblically because the ignorance is becoming very painful!

pocohantas:
That is fine dear. I didn’t cook it for you.

You think well too.

zendi:
The day I did the above post, or earlier, was the day Ukraine should have renounced loudly her Nato accession bid, and Vlad would have pulled back his siege, and the ongoing invasion would have been averted.

Sovereignty is important, but world peace is th,e most important.
Nato should not thrust itself into Russia's bedroom just because Soviet Union was defeated.
Russia still deserves some respect at least in its own neighborhood.

All these sanctions will be painful to Russia. But having Nato in Ukraine breathing down Russia's neck is an existential and extinction threat and feeling far more painful than any sanctions.

The sanctions are useless in these circumstances.
Vlad is doing what he has to do, [s]unlike in the woke west where the word patriotism has come to mean racism.[/s]

I do love the brain use.

"These sanctions will have a heavy impact,” she said. “These sanctions will suppress Russia’s economic growth; increase the borrowing costs; raise inflation; intensify capital outflows; and gradually erode its industrial base.”
https://www.ft.com/content/6a1e12c6-d1d0-4ecb-ac02-65f4284b2140

You'd think they were sanctioning USA with the way things are there already, depending on your news source of course.

BasedUsername:
Not hypocrisy but power. You get to make the rules when you're strong.

In your world perhaps. In the real world opposition will rise up against your so called strength and pull you down.

DissTroy:
When is the U.S. going to get sanctioned like Russia is being sanctioned? What is good for the goose...

It is hypocrisy, Diss. USA would never allow itself to be surrounded like they've surrounded Russia.

[quote author=sanpipita post=110495720]Conservatives are clearly on Putin's side and speak for him.

Why do Democrats want you to hate Putin? Has Putin shipped every middle class job in your town to Russia? Did he manufacture a worldwide pandemic that wrecked your business? Is he teaching your kids to embrace racial discrimination? Is he making fentanyl? Does he eat dogs? pic.twitter.com/xYEvapjbNT

— Tucker Carlson (@TuckerCarlson) February 23, 2022

are not. Their enemy's enemy is just now there friend. If drumpthfp were there the same people will be baying for blood already.

zendi:
So what, if so?

Has Russia attacked America?
Or any of America's neighbors, or something?

But I think that Trump Derangement Syndrome
has made you forget that Russia and America remain in Diplomatic Relation.

I'm watching Final Account.

I don't expect you to get it.