₦airaland Forum

TenQ:
In summary, the more ENLIGHTENED (Educated), STRONG and TRAINED our mind/soul is, the more Cultured our Bodies appear in the Society.

We do not educate your soul, TenQ, we educate your mind.

And I do not appreciate the dishonesty that makes you attempt to make the two one without first establishing "mind/soul".

TenQ:
Why dont you look at it this way sir.
1. The Body is a Slave to the Mind.

I have looked at it in many ways, and I think you ignored how I see it and are trying to tell me to see it your way, which is like telling me to ignore what I see with my own eyes and mind and just believe what you say, which will make me a slave to you.

Sorry sir, but buda does not believe because buda can ask and knock and seek and does not read only one book so as not to become malnourished. But I'll do some just so you understand how buda sees it.

TenQ:
1. Why do you think Jesus distinguishes your mind from the "needless soul"?

Because the soul was a requirement in his day. Something needed to go to hell and we all know it wasn't the body, which ended up 6 feet deep as worm food.

TenQ:
2. If the heart is sometimes used synonymously with the mind, what then is the soul as referred to in these scriptures above if it is needless?

It is a requirement for those who need to believe. Only ignorant people will sometimes use heart synonymously with mind, and even then, they will not claim their heart is being attacked when they mind is attacked, and if they do they'd mean something different.

Your soul is irrelevant to me TenQ, because it would be wrong of me to focus on your soul and not on TenQ who is before me.

TenQ:
You see no evidence that the mind exist?!! Don't be an escapist!
I didn't ask you questions relating to the soul

Oh! My bad. I did not note you'd dropped the needless soul. I do apologise. But I never said the mind does not exist, TenQ! The mind of buda is what buda is communicating with you with and not buda's physical body nor soul!

TenQ:
I asked you about the mind-body interaction...break it down in a relatable way. QED!

My own body used to be a slave to my mind, doing its bidding obeying its instructions until a particular illness affected me and now my body often tells my mind to go to hell.

When my mind was like God to my body, mind would imagine it and body will fulfil it as best it could, joyfully too, but not so much anymore. Now my mind must carry its own burden, which is turning out rather good for my mind, since the added burden makes it stronger and more effective in its doing.

Of course, they both work for budaatum their Lord and Master, who will take them both down to the bottom of a river and bash their heads against rocks if they do not do my will. Thankfully, I trained them well to serve me. And I have compassion for my body since it was the mind with budaatum's insufficiently informed oversight that led the body to pick up the illness.

Think, Trinity. It might help you relate.

TenQ:
If your knowledge ends with disputing what others think, you have achieved NOTHING (zero knowledge) except you can show how your position brings better understanding of its workings.

I don't see why I should do any more than dispute what you think about a thing I see no evidence for its existence. And if you really do intend to learn you'd see I've not only disputed it but given you something to think about.

BasedUsername:
You're probably envisioning people who say racist and fascist things (read: anyone to the right of -∞) being held accountable (read: losing their careers and livelihoods) when in actuality stuff like this can and will be used against religious skeptics, the LGBT community, and political dissenters.

It does depend on those "using against". Besides, religious skeptics and LGBT and dissenters have experience of resisting "racist and fascist things" without reading to the left nor right.

BasedUsername:
Your authoritarianism is showing

Damn! And there was me promoting my entrepreneurism.

DissTroy:
This is based on the erroneous assumption that Nairaland offers full anonymity.

With that info, anyone with good knowledge of cybersecurity can unmask you.

The lack of anonymity is what's glorious about here. You show what you are with the words you have typed and we can match them to you somehow and unmask you.

That's why some are not donkeys, diss. And some are, even in their real world.

BasedUsername:
Hey, if there's a subscription fee and they don't sell your info to ad agencies then it's an ok deal for people willing to pay.

To post any racist bigot untrue alternative facts?

Now that's a business idea worth pursuing.

Military0001:
Make I laugh sha!! 2023 on the beat… make all man with him team strategize but I hope the youths are also strategizing towards electing a credible and visionary leader come 2023? If not na pro max inflation and suffer go be the outcome.

Youths think and leave religion, ethnicity and cash bribe to avoid further hardship… make NIGERIA great again with your votes towards a better NIGERIA & don’t vote towards regional line but competence…Thanks

I borrowed the above. Hope the author does not mind.

Strategize, he says. As in, "think of a detailed plan for achieving success in situations such as war, politics, business, industry, or sport".

The post is from a thread where transporters are organising themselves to strategise, which is our next and probably most daunting step considering we are all "youths".

We will grow.

DeepsightX:
We are all invisible.

DeepSight, just by posting on here one makes some of oneself visible to those looking and to oneself, if one is looking at oneself.

Great opportunity to reflect on oneself and learn and evolve, is what God Seun has provided for us here.

TenQ:
I wish you concentrated on the mind/soul/body relationship. What have you learnt?

I've learnt some want to split themselves and others into separate components instead of seeing the whole person, and that I should focus on the persons I see before me instead of their souls that I most definitely see not.

TenQ:
Hmn!
I think you speak so much of Asking, Seeking and Knocking without actually knowing
1. Where to Ask
2. Who to Ask
3. Where to Seek
4. Where to Knock
5. What to Knock

You presume, TenQ.

In the school of ask, seek, knock, lesson one is the learning of the tools called what, why, when how, where and who, and their uses. Another word for it is Science, or how to use the senses.

‘I keep six honest serving men
They taught me all I know
Their names are WHAT and WHY and WHEN and HOW and WHERE and WHO’
From ‘Just So Stories’ by Rudyard Kipling

It is for this reason we do not live by bread alone least we become malnourished. A fruit forbidden stands no chance wherever it might be hidden.

TenQ:
To know much about TenQ, the best person to ask is TenQ. To ask TenQ anything, you must know where to find TenQ. How you ask TenQ the question may open or lock the door of this knowledge to you. Even when TenQ locks this door of required information from you, how you knock may get you the information.

That depends all on what I want to know about TenQ, and what concerns me now is only how TenQ reasons, which I can learn by reading TenQ's words, for they are the fruits TenQ lays before me.

TenQ:
To Ask, Seek or Knock is not difficult. The question is do you know the where, what, how, when and who Asking, Seeking and Knocking should be directed at?

Actually, to ask and seek and knock, is the most impossible thing for some to do especially for those who have been taught to believe they have already found.

As for where, In the beginning was the Word, so we start with reading, or rather, learning to read, and to understand what we read.

TenQ:
For specifically on the question of the Mind/Soul/Body relationship, where, what, when, who are you to Ask, Seek and Knock?

You start by reading up on what has been written on the topic from before Plato up until today. Then you read up on contemporary thought on the subject and in other fields where it comes up, like in psychology, mythology, philosophy, history, archeology, creative writing, science, etc., and then you apply your own mind to all you've learnt so you understand it, after which you may come to a determination or not.

TenQ:
For me, I always start from the known to glean knowledge required for the unknown.

I often start from the unknown. When I pick up a book to read, it's content is unknown to me, and to know is why I read it. That way, I don't just end up only reading what confirms what I might have already known, and I learn things I did not know.

I'm currently reading Dirty Old London by Lee Jackson to learn how the Victorians won the battle against filth so I might learn how the same tools might be used to fight filth in Nigeria because I don't already know.

TenQ:
I know quite a few about the computer, it explains so much of the observations I see with the soul and body of man.

To those who's only tool is a hammer, everything seems like a nail.

Deepthoughts:
I think the only way to really fight it,is to challenge it legality in the court that's all.

Not only courts. We must first fight it in the minds of Nigerians who think it benefits them. Once that battle is won and the majority understand, the subsidies will disappear.

Frigga13:
To see igbos complain is something Yoruba people derives joy in.. they hate it when igbos live good .

Not all Yorubas are this ignorant. Some of us actually love our neighbours, even if only for selfish reasons.

Hizzy:
You get time to write, it doesn't stop us from wearing it many schools will start wearing it as school uniforms

To be honest, this is an appropriate response.
Let them come arrest us all!

TenQ:
It was an objective question with four options


If Buda's two hands were surgically removed, will Buda still be Buda?

What if in addition, Buda's two legs were surgically removed, will Buda still be Buda?

What if after this Buda's kidney and spleen and lungs were replaced with machines (God forbid), will Buda still be Buda?


What then is the totality of Buda?

The totality of Buda is whatever buda has become at the exact moment that you enquire, and your own ability to see totalities instead of perhaps just the physical body or the soul.

At the moment, buda consists of arms and legs and kidney and spleen and lungs, and mind too, and so far as you are concerned, the words of buda that you read, and removing or replacing any one of them in particular will still be buda even if buda looses buda's mind or is rotting six feet deep, you will point to buda and say that is this particular totality of buda. At least depending on how narrow the focus is, of course.

We have a thread on here about replacing the parts of a ship, my Lord might remember.

TenQ:
Even without you seeing TenQ, you can work from what you absolutely know to postulate about the TenQ you haven't seen

Like how much of Buda do I know? Not too much but I still know a little of him even though I've never seen him

1. Buda is a grown man
2. Buda is a Nigerian
3. All Nigerians are negroes, therefore Buda is Negro
4. Buda reads a lot (or used to)
5. He is on Nairaland

No one has a machine to measure the mind or soul, therefore it falls in a realm where we ALL have insufficient information.

If buda generalises from my postulates of TenQ based on so little then I buda must love being ignorant because it is far too insufficient knowledge for me to claim to know you, TenQ. I mean. Our discussion so far is an introduction to so many conversations we might have over so many years during which I know I'll learn so much more about TenQ, so perhaps my consciousness of my current ignorance about TenQ gets in the way of the hubris of delving into TenQ's soul.

Please know that if buda adopts the above attitude to knowing [about] TenQ to that used to knowing about souls or anything at all, then buda is a lazy ignorant fuq who has not bothered to ask and knock and seek with all her heart and soul and mind and being and entire existence.

TenQ:
I honestly wish you presented a better theory!

Theories are not laws, they are subject to modifications or replacement!

A theory even if NOT perfect is never discarded UNTIL a better theory comes to light.

I don't particularly have theories of my own regarding things like souls, to be honest, though I have, for sake of knowing, studied some literature on the subject, but I take it like I do "inasmuch as I have considered things I see before me instead of the crap I choose to believe inside my own head".

Take physical you, TenQ, as in, the TenQ who has presented to my awareness. Are you not sufficiently mysterious enough for me to be insufficiently informed about you so as to delve deeper so I know you more? Now imagine I ignore physical TenQ and start looking for TenQ's soul and you might see how insufficiently informed generalisations might make one seem.

That said, I'm sure its because I do not have a soul detecting analyser or whatever it might be called. My bad. Though, ignoring physical TenQ for TenQ's soul seems very rude and disrespectful to TenQ, to me, because it would mean I have insufficiently considered the physical TenQ you've presented.

TenQ:
If it doesn't make sense to you, it could mean that
1. You are obstinate about your position
2. You refuse to negate the other person's view with valid arguments rather than repeating your assertions that such views are not correct
3. You have not presented an alternative reasonings that answer questions the other views cannot
I've been clear in my presentations, can you present your own?

Might all these not be a description of your
very self, is precisely my point TenQ, which is why I am doing "Philosophical methods include questioning, critical discussion, rational argument, and systematic" of your point in contrast to mine which I am presenting but which you seem to not see not to talk of consider.

TenQ:
1. Sufficient information is relative my dear Buda!

Is it? Say, I have knowledge of say, numbers up to a relative 100, is that sufficient information about numbers? And what would you think a person with relative knowledge of a thousand or ten thousand or fractions or decimals say of me when I claim my relative knowledge of 100 is sufficient?

TenQ:
2. You were the one who brought up the issue of insufficient information not me.

I believe this your statement is be based on insufficient information/knowledge.

TenQ:
In summary: We do not have sufficient information similar to that which we have with softwares acting on a computer: thus, we can only generalise.

TenQ:
You did not answer any of the questions.

I repeat:
Is this "You" you call (I, ME, MYSELF)
A. Your Brain?
B. Your Mind?
C. Your Soul?
D. Your Body?

Who experiences an emotion out of these four options?
If you are completely dismembered and surgically replaced, would you still remain you?

I believe I did answer your question and you are refusing to accept it is what I think.

budaatum:
Just as any one bit of an elephant is not the elephant so is buda the totality of a physical being and my entire time accumulating knowledge and experiences etc, and it is that totality that feels, as opposed to any one aspect feeling for me.

That totality of buda is what is being presented to you while it seems you are trying to split buda into aspects of a Brain, Your Mind, Your Soul and Your Body.

TenQ:
Philosophical methods include questioning, critical discussion, rational argument, and systematic presentation.

Note that nowhere does it say philosophers "generalise from insufficient information", but that they do the opposite and go questioning.

TenQ:
It makes perfect sense to me

Like beauty, right? In the eyes of you the beholder?

Those seeking knowledge don't normally work that way, and are more willing to consider what makes perfect sense to others, and why.

Deepthoughts:
Ok you made a nice point,but if I may ask,is this constituency projects legal?,is it back by law or the Constitution?, I'm not sure but there are claims that it was introduced by obasanjo as a way winning over the NASS,if that is true then why can't the president if truly he is desirous of ending budget padding approach the supreme Court to declare it unconstitutional n end it permanently?.

No it isn't, which is why Jonathan and bubu have fought the cabal that benefits from it at the expense of all Nigerians, and instead of supporting those who try to fight it we all condemn the fighters as if they are the thieves.

HenryDion:
It's always mutually beneficial. When it's not, it becomes parasitic. Anything that brings no value is immediately cut off. Better to be with none, than with liabilities.

This is capitalist speak, Dion. Shows you are not as anticapitalist as you initially made out you were.

HenryDion:
I'm always open to making friends with people of value.

And with people you bring value to through your philanthropy, obviously.

Its your employees that concern me, and their inability to grow your capital for you and themselves.

Please invite me to valentine with you next year so we can at least say you have one friend.

I will pay for myself so you don't have to but if perchance you invest your capital (money, machinery, land, brains, brawn, etc etc) and make suitable returns, I just might let you pay.

TenQ:
For Christians then, all animals have their souls and when they die, they cease to exist. Humans on the other hand have in addition their spirit body: such that when they die, their soul even though disconnected from their body is not disconnected from their spirit body. I am not saying this that you might agree with it: I am just stating how Christians relate to the concept of body, soul and spirit. God Himself is a Spirit! Angels, Demons too are spirits who all have their unique souls/personalities.

Are you stating what you have chosen to believe is the truth, TenQ?

DeepsightX:
Maybe "soul" is another word for "you."
Or "I" . . . or "me."

As TenQ has been suggesting.

Like a proxy?

Imagine I could possibly be looking at the soul of DeepSight when I am obviously completely blind to seeing the physical DeepSight that you present before me.

Now imagine me telling you to believe what I saw about the soul of the deepsight that is the proxy I see instead of you.

TenQ:
Can you look at it this way:
If we agree that the person you call "I", "ME", "MYSELF" is truly you howbeit not the physical you.

Is this "You" you call (I, ME, MYSELF)
A. Your Brain?
B. Your Mind?
C. Your Soul?
D. Your Body?

Who experiences an emotion out of these four options?
If you are completely dismembered and surgically replaced, would you still remain you?

Just as any one bit of an elephant is not the elephant so is buda the totality of a physical being and my entire time accumulating knowledge and experiences etc, and it is that totality that feels, as opposed to any one aspect feeling for me.

Deepsight. You might note why my "love for" might differ to that of someone else.

LordReed:
Might wanna read this: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/naturalism/#MetNat

It's belief that's the problem.

One can't be a use the senses to ask and knock and seek, and at the same time hold on to beliefs. Because, once one believes, one stops asking and knocking and seeking, and after so long even the abilities to ask and knock and seek are lost.

HenryDion:
I don't have friends now doesn't mean I've never had friends. I'm a born philanthropist; and giving is part of my nature.

And those you give to abandon you when you suffer? You sure you philanthrophising right?

HenryDion:
My friends can work for me, earn wages, and still remain poor and unable to feed, living from hand to mouth.

Why, Dion the philanthropist, would your friends work for you and "still remain poor and unable to feed, living from hand to mouth" when you'd be paying them a fair wage plus philanthropy?

Are you not earning a profit from paying your frienes perhaps, being you are anticapitalist and all, as in, reluctant to profit from your investments?

HenryDion:
Feeding should be a fundamental human right that should be available for all, free, under government supervision.

A fundamental human right as as in manna from heaven dropping freely into people's mouths so no farming no transporting no processing of food, and government must supervise it?

Seriously? Nigerian government, Don?

In the "should world" that you would like to live in perhaps. Me I'd rather be freed use her senses Eve than ignorant enslaved Adam even in a Garden of Eden not to talk of the hell that a government is most likely to "supervise".

HenryDion:
Criticisms of capitalism suggest how it not only promote hunger but poverty when there's an abundance of food to feed the entire human population.

Other people's "Criticisms of capitalism" has suggested to you that "it not only promote hunger but poverty when there's an abundance of food to feed the entire human population", and I would expect you to have looked at capitalism and formed your own opinion Dion, instead of allowing yourself to be suggested to.

Do tell. Where is this supposed "abundance of food to feed the entire human population", and why are some not eating it such that they are hungry?