₦airaland Forum

BRIGHTRIVERS:
Yu jst gave me hope brother! Thnx for your contribution!

You're welcome, brother. To God be the glory. Never be moved from the Faith. We know and we know that Jesus lives forever.

Atheists may argue, that's fine. But when death approaches, when they die in their unbelief, I hope they argue their way out of hell.

onetrack:
All of these are just very clever fakers. They have been exposed as frauds many times.

Clearly, you've not met someone with the gift of prophecy neither have you met a prophet.

BRIGHTRIVERS and Youngpol,
have you read the stories of the following former atheists who died and why they gave their lives to Christ?


Thomas Welch. He fell from a great height and died instantly.

Howard Storm. Had a fatal disease and died after a nurse told him that a surgeon could not be found that day to treat him even though she expressed hope that one would be found the next day.

Ian McCormack. He went swimming with some friends in Mauritius, was stung by a box-jellyfish and died later.

Dr Eben Alexander. A neurosurgeon and atheist. Went into three weeks of coma when he succumbed to meningitis. All that time in coma, his brain was dead, yet he had consciousness.

These are just a few but are eye openers to let you know that atheists bask in ignorance, that is, until they come face to face with reality, especially through death, and all their argument against God's existence crumble into pieces.

Of course, there are former atheists who didn't need death to convince them of the truth in the Bible, but who can win an argument against death?

Jeromejnr:
Common sense gotten from scriptures.

No one could enter heaven until Jesus had paid the price.

So all that died went to Sheol. Sheol is divided into two:

The place of comfort and the place of Torment. The place of comfort was later called Abraham's Bosom.

So everyone that died went to Sheol. Wether the person went to the place of torment or comfort, only God knows.

I liked your post. You are very knowledgeable, my friend. My aim of visiting this thread was to feed my eyes and keep my comment to myself until I saw your comment. Very nice.

There is more to say about this subject but I'm in no mood for argument. Besides, Op has already made up his mind about the possible place Adam is spending his eternity. Seeing that, why waste my comment?

Anyway, it's nice to know you know what many don't know, and don't want to know.

Man's inhumanity to man

wellsaid:
I need Foxe's Book of Martyrs. I live around sango otta.

I have it in pdf format. If interested I can upload it.

My favourite Christian books:

The Final Quest by Rick Joyner

Revealing Heaven l and ll by Kat Kerr

The Fourth Dimension by Pastor David Yonggi Cho

The Heavens Opened and The Priestly Bride by Anna Rountree

The Final Frontier by Dr Richard Kent

The Left Behind series by Tim Lahaye and Jerry B Jenkins

Good Morning Holy Spirit by Benny Hinn

The 6th Sense Faith by John Osteen

Intra Muros by Rebecca Springer

GooseBaba:
"death which is permanent is not able to hold him "..Bros you read wetin you write so.?

If death is impossible to hold him, then that makes his sacrifice null and void. If you know before hand that your love one would die in front of you and ressurect in 3 days would you cry? If yes? Cry for what? the guy just make him mama cry anyhow for nothing..

In other words, the act of selfless sacrifice is null and void if the object of sacrifice is replaced in the future. Please read my post above.

musKeeto:
In what context for does Death mean temporary sacrifice? Jeez...

In what context does sacrifice mean permanence? That is what I'm after. Show me the definition of sacrifice as being permanent in nature, then I'll know you have a point.

Jesus already knew He would be raised from the dead. That did not stop Him from 'giving' His life. Last time I checked, giving something you would ordinarily keep to others for their good and satisfaction is sacrifice. If I gave you my plate of food so that you will find satisfaction in eating, does my act of giving become lending just because I have more food in the pot?

Just listen to yourself. I give my life for a brother. I died. It is a sacrifice. I give my life for a brother. I died. Some days later, by some inexplicable means, I came back to life. My action of giving up my life is not a sacrifice because I came back to life. By your argument, you atheists define sacrifice as the loss of something that can never be regained or the act of giving up something that can never be returned, isn't it?

I have told you guys, and I say it again, whether you define sacrifice as permanent loss where temporary loss is lending or you define it as the loss of something that can never be regained or the act of giving up something that can never be returned, since your definition of sacrifice and your argument of the same are in stark contrast with each other, and judging from your inability to tell the difference between what constitutes an act of sacrifice and what constitutes an act of lending, I hereby rest my case.

GooseBaba:
Captain unnecessary rationality.....

Last I checked death is permanent... He "died"=permanent. He resurrected =WTF..!!

Like the examples given... If I donate my kidney.it's gone permanently, if i get it back in 3 days. That's makes it a mirage because it never happened. Does the recipient still have a new kidney..?

The late jesus christ (pbuh) is probably pissed off right at people Using his name to tell european lies...

Death is permanent but since it is impossible for death to hold Him, and He rose on the third day, does that nullify the act of giving up His life for the good of mankind? Does the past act become null and void according to the meaning of sacrifice?

musKeeto:
What was he to lose? His life.
What did he gain? His life.
Was he aware death wasn't final? Yes, he was.
What was he? A substitue for the livestock sacrificed under the Old covenant.
Did livestock resurrect, like zombie chickens and cows and pigs? No, they stayed dead.
Jesus didn't stay dead. So what was lost?

This is the focus of sacrifice is the present act in connection with the object lost or given up, not the events that transpired after the act. I give up the use of my chair I'm sitting on so that another can find comfort in sitting on it, according to Kevoh's definition of what constitutes sacrifice, I'm lending the chair if I will still use the chair for my satisfaction, so then my action does not constitute sacrifice if my chair is not permanently lost or given up.

You are also trailing along that line of thought. If that is the case, I have no argument with you guys concerning the meaning of sacrifice. You have already defined it to suit yourselves. By all means, carry on.

kevoh:
1. That is not a sacrifice. Where is the good cause here? compare your younger one sleeping in your bed and sacrifice of your kidney to save a life? Which is heavier? You lent your brother your sleeping space in your bed and went to sleep on the armchair and you call that sacrifice! It's like lending him the bed for three days AND YOU KNOW YOU WILL NOT LOSE THE BED because he will be gone by then. Emphasis on the loss.

In other words, my 'giving up' the use of my bed for three days does not count as sacrifice because it does not entail permanent loss? Therefore, any act of giving up something which does not constitute permanent loss is lending, not sacrifice. Interesting.

2.Same as Number 1. You have lent something you know you will not lose and get back after some days. That's not a sacrifice. Refer to the definition again.

Lol. Going by your 'definition' of sacrifice as an act that is "heavy" and constitutes permanent loss, I'll say my act of giving up the use of my laptop for the day so that another may use it for his benefit is not a sacrifice.

3. Same as Number 1. Refer to the definition again.

There is no need for much argument here!

I get you. A temporary loss of something is lending while a permanent loss of something is sacrifice. Lolz. May I remind you that you defined sacrifice as:

A sacrifice is a loss or something you give up, usually for the sake of a better cause.

On that note, I rest my case.

This is basic English Language. The meaning of the word is so plain that any dispute concerning it unnecessary.

kevoh:
Answer lies in my modified post, let's no go into unnecessary dabbling about semantics. It's quite obvious and straightforward what '' Sacrifice'' means!

What is obvious and straightforward is how you want to perceive the term 'sacrifice'.

The word has no suggestion of the action being permanent or temporary. The keywords of that definition are 'loss' and 'give up', right? Does it say that the loss resulting from the act of sacrifice is permanent?

kevoh:
A sacrifice is a loss or something you give up, usually for the sake of a better cause.

Source : http://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/sacrifice

Examples:
1. You (sacrifice) give up one of your two healthy kidneys to save your ailing aunty or friend who needs a kidney transplant. The sacrificed kidney never comes back to you in 3 days, it's gone forever.

2. You sacrifice your time saving/helping accident victims on a Monday morning making you miss an 8a.m presentation to a billionaire client and got sacked by your no nonsense boss for coming late due to that. Time sacrificed will not come back to you in 3 days time! You have lost it forever and your job too!

Lol. True. Other examples you fail to consider:

1. I sacrifice (give up) my bed so that my younger one may sleep in it for three nights. Have I lost my bed forever?

2. I sacrifice (give up) the use of my laptop for the day so that a friend may use it to complete an assignment. Have I lost my laptop forever?

3. I sacrifice (give up) my car so that my brother may use it to go for a job interview in time since his is still under repair. Have I lost my car forever?

What in the definition of sacrifice implies that the use of the word must be associated with permanent loss?

kevoh:
A sacrifice is a loss or something you give up, usually for the sake of a better cause.

Source : http://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/sacrifice

Thank you. So, according to that definition, if I lose my sleep in order to burn the midnight oil, does it mean what I did is not a sacrifice even if I get to sleep, say, 15 hours later?

twosquare:
I'll only advise you: pray to God, believe in Jesus and carry your cross. What you are experiencing now are two things:
A) You are about to be trapped in the spirit of Apostasy that is sweeping over the earth as prophecied by the holy ones
B) You are giving heed to seducing spirits...

Wake up Lanre! We are in the perilous times and it is going to get more intense than this. If a guy or group of guys can sway you away with seducing tongues...ask yourself, how much more the Anti-Christ or the Dragon? Wake up bro..

Well said.

pbs4real:
i dnt mean to sound flippant,but am really trying my best to fathom wat u wrote. . .wat do u mean by the whole bible is a lie?

Are you shocked? Don't be. There are folks with much worse disposition towards the Bible. Judging from your reaction, I pray you never meet them. You may pass out from extreme shock.

Before anything, what is the meaning of sacrifice?

Lanre747:
Sir, you mentioned Isaiah 11, I was just pointing out that it does not point to Christ, or at least the first coming.
As i mentioned before, I am sceptical of the NT, how can I therefore use new testament writings to test the validity of new testament writings.
My logic is, if it doesn't match the writings of the prophets, or goes against the teachings of the Most High as prescribed in the torah, then it cannot be legitimate.

You're saying Isaiah 11 does not point to Christ without any valid reason behind your opinion. If it does not point to Christ, then who does it talk about? Do you have any idea?

I don't see why you should doubt the New Testament writings. Remember, Jesus Christ came to fulfill the Law. He did not come to abolish it. He became that sacrifice of sin as required by the Law. He was the only Person who could atone for the sins of the Jews and the world and permanently wipe away our sins with His spotless blood. The Prophets spoke of His coming.

The life and death and of Jesus Christ fulfilled the prophecies of the prophets in the Old Testament concerning Him. You need to study the Bible carefully to see that Jesus fulfilled the prophecies of the expected Messiah.

Lanre747:
Colossians 1:23 says "If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;"

According to Paul, that was done in his day.

I understand 70AD. But the fact remains that generation did not see all that was mentioned in that passage.

There's no one who can tell for a fact when the Gospel has been preached to every soul on earth because when Apostle Paul wrote this, the majority of the regions in Africa and Asia and other parts of the world had not heard the Gospel of the good news of Christ.

A veritable sign that will follow the preaching of the Gospel to every soul under heaven, that is, in the whole world is the rapture of the Church. This has not happened yet even after many centuries since the Apostle made that statement.

It then means that Paul was not talking about "every creature in the world" per se. What he meant by that statement, as in verse 6 of the same chapter as well, is the fact that the Gospel has been preached to a great number of Jews and Gentiles of his time, not even necessarily all the Jews and Gentiles. The Gospel had traveled to many parts of the world at the time but not to every part of the world as the statement seems to imply. If truly the Gospel had been preached to everyone in the world, then Christ would have returned a very long time ago. His statement is characteristic of a hyperbolic expression. It isn't meant to be taken literally, obviously.

About the other part of your statement, Jesus died in AD 33. The Siege of Jerusalem took place in AD 70, thirty-seven (37) years later after the death of Jesus. Without doubt, so many in that generation, not even few, witnessed the Siege.

blessedfavoured:
This is my first time in the religious section, and my first post. I just wanted to share something that struck me while reading my joyce meyer devotional today;

Change does not come through struggle, human effort without God, frustration, self-hatred, self-rejection, guilt, or works of the flesh. Change in our lives comes as a result of having our minds renewed by the Word of God and by trusting God to work in us according to His will. God, Who began a good work in you, will complete it (see Philippians 1:6).

This is the first time I will see this. Welcome to the Religion section.

Her message about change is spot-on. Truly, change has its source in trust in God and the renewing of our minds. This is how we are transformed into the image of Christ.

vooks:
Romans 15:26 (KJV)
For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem

These poor saints missed the memo and your eloquent dividing of the word

Vooks, this is unthinkable. The sentence you highlighted is plain as day. There is nothing about it that supports your argument. It mentioned the poor saints in Jerusalem. What about them? How does that verse lead you to the conclusion of poverty in Christ?

Compare it with this verse - For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich - 2 Corinthians 8:9

Now do you see how your quoted verse pales in comparison with this in both expression, character, intention, and comprehension?

Another verse is 3 John 1:2 - Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in all things and be in health, just as your soul prospers.

In the light of the verses I quoted, you will agree with me that the verse you quoted is utterly baseless and does more injury to your argument rather than support it.

Lanre747:
Thanks sincerely for all your responses.

See here is the thing. I am a firm believer in the God of Abraham, and I believe He shall not share His glory with anyone else and he is the ancient of days. And having done my own research, I believe those that say many black africans are in fact the true descendants of Jacob.

I am trying to ascertain whether the books and letters we call the New Testament is truth. So you will imagine I would be nervous to accept explanations using the same new testament. For anyone in those days to be considered a man of truth, he would have had to speak from the old testament. This is something I learned from NL admittedly, but I embrace that logic because it makes absolute sense.

So I must put to test those writings and writers spoken of.

So today's troubling passage for me is this (I have not overlooked your previous responses, I want to ask further questions based on what you guys have shared with me to make sure I have understood you):

Jesus spoke of His second coming in Matthew 24 among other places. He said in verse 34:

"Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."

Now I have read some commentaries that suggest "generation" is an unknown number of years. I read it as it is written, and as the word is used in most other parts of the bible, i.e. 'the people living at the time'. This has not come to pass yet. Therefore, I am concerned. Any thoughts?

Let me briefly explain something about this verse. If you read verses 15 to 28, you will see that Jesus prophesied the siege of Jerusalem which happened AD 70. Verses 29 to 31 talk about the rapture of the saints towards the end of this age. Now, before you understand verses 32 to 34, you must know that if Jesus was talking about verses 29 to 31 in verse 34, then what He said about the Gospel being preached to the whole world before His coming is false.

Why would Christ say something in verse 14 and make contradictory statements in verses 29 to 24?

Jesus Christ never made any single wrong prophecy. Verses 32 to 34 talk about the siege of Jerusalem, not about His return because many things will precede His return, the most important being that the Gospel will be preached to the whole world, something which has not been entirely accomplished even today. There is more to say concerning this explanation should suffice for now.

If you have any questions, let me know and I shall answer to the best of the ability God gives me.

Lanre747:
Sir, as with the other gentleman, I must say also, Isaiah 11:10, in my humble opinion, does not point to Christ.

Okay. Tell me why you think so. Are you implying Paul was wrong in Romans 15? Maybe you should read it. Still, I'd like to know why you think the Scriptures do not point to Christ. Then I shall give you many other Scriptures that prophesy of His birth, life and death.

Isaiah 11 also says:

Verse 4: But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

Did Christ do this?

This is a futuristic verse prophesying the return of Christ with His saints to war against the beast and the false prophet and the people gathered against Christ. This battle will usher in the Millennial Reign of Christ. Read Revelations 19:17-21 and Revelations 20:4-6.

Verse 6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

Verse 9:They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

I believe these are yet to take place. I am studying Isaiah at the moment and trying to find solid evidence connecting Jesus to the one the prophets spoke of. I am struggling at present.

These verses are still talking about the Millennial reign of Christ on earth. His reign will usher in a time of peace and harmony such that the effects of sin will no longer operate even on animals. As Christ rules from Jerusalem, the earth will enjoy very great peace and prosperity. Like you said, it is yet to happen.

The Scriptures foretell the revelation of the Messiah. If you want evidence connecting Jesus Christ to the prophecies in the Old Testament of His coming, read the Gospels. Study the Gospels, the life of Jesus Christ. They will shed some light. Besides, if the Old Testament prophets were not referring to Jesus Christ, then who do you think they were talking about?

SUGARBEE:
Blah blah blah

SSBN, you can see why listening to her piece of advice is disastrous. She doesn't even care to make sense as long as she is typing.

SUGARBEE:
I didn't mean scores so to speak but I mean being at peace with each other

Yes. We're called to be at peace with everyone. Being at peace with everyone does not mean trying to appease the anger of those who seek your life, or seeking reconciliation with those who want to destroy you. It means loving and praying for your enemies, avoiding any form of confrontation with people, minding your own business, never repaying evil with evil.

It's different from when you're not in good terms with a brother, or a friend. They're not seeking to kill you. Just plain misunderstanding. In that case, you seek to repair the relationship with them. If they refuse after three attempts to make peace, you are then free to leave them. However, this is not the case here.

SUGARBEE:
He needs to settle what ever score he had with them before thinking of moving on else his future might be rocky

He has no scores to settle with those who hate him or seek his life. The only thing he owes them is forgiveness. Besides that, nothing else should tie him with them.

SSBN, for the sake of your peace and long life, cut off every association with those people. They hate you. They are not friends but enemies. Have nothing to do with them. Don't go to them if they call you for any meeting of reconciliation because doing that may mean your last day on earth. Forgive them and move on. Forgiveness is very, very important, even mandatory.

About those objects placed in your house, they might be meant to place a spell or curse on you, or meant to scare you but this doesn't make sense as who would go through all that trouble to scare you, especially considering the fact that, coincidentally, you're no longer in good terms with them?

This is what you have to do. Give your life to Jesus Christ. Abandon your sinful habits with the help of God. Once you've given your life to Christ, every curse or spell against you is rendered useless through the shed blood of Jesus Christ. Pray from your heart and ask God to destroy the powers behind those objects. If you can, call your pastor or Spirit-filled brothers and sisters in Christ to anoint your house and pray against those objects. That is, if you are scared to do it on your own.
Above all, begin to live a prayerful life. Only God can save.

vooks:
Those were not preachers. The first two were kings. Please compare them with Queen Elizabeth for your rant to make sense. The other one was a shrewd business man.

In other words, the promises of God concerning material abundance to His people do not apply to preachers.

Christ was made poor that we may be rich does not apply to preachers. Preachers are the only exception in the blessings and promises of financial abundance.

David was highly anointed by God. He was a king and prophet of God. Solomon was called the Preacher.

@ topic, the best we can do is pray that God uses His servants to spread the message of the cross to the world, to use them to wake people from spiritual slumber, to use them to break the chains of bondage in the lives of people. Prayer is the key

Like a respected preacher once said, "Pray, pray, and pray."

@ Starlingslimnet, I disagree with your comment. If you have anything to contribute to help the Op understand the Word better, it is highly welcome.

@ Sability, thanks for your contribution

@ Appleyard, and MrPresident1, it's nice reading your contributions or, say, analysis.

My prayer is that God keeps Lanre747 from being a victim of false doctrines by the enemies of Christ.

MrPresident1:
A very clean and refreshing post from you CaptainJune, you have put things very well.

Greetings!

Thank you, MrPresident1. It is nothing, really. Just helping a brother in need.