₦airaland Forum

nobilis:
I'm sorry to say but most of your facts aren't in line with reality.

Jehovah is the name of the Christian God.
Yahweh (YHWH) is the name of the Jewish God.
Allah is the name of the Muslim God.

You cannot say Jehovah and Yahweh is the same God because their characteristics are very very different. Study the Jewish Talmud and Torah and then study the bible. U will notice these glaring differences.
Moreover, the Jewish God has more in common with the Muslim God than with the Christian God.

I believe your knowledge of God is purely hearsay, not gotten by study. Even a blind man can tell the difference between the Christian God and Allah.

Secondly, you're talking about revelation. God revealed himself to this person and to that other person. Most of these revelations are not verifiable. We just have to take the words of those who claim they experienced God.

Even what is supposed to be the ultimate revelation of the christian God is still in doubt: the existence of Jesus hasn't been proven beyond reasonable doubt.

So don't bring that logic here.

In a court of law, in the absence of material or physical evidence, the testimony of an eye witness to an event is admissible as evidence. You do not tell the witness to provide physical evidence to verify their testimony. It's simply unheard of. The testimony of their experience is a key factor in deciding a case. Of course, they have to be examined and cross-examined so as to be certain their witness is true and not fabricated. Nonetheless, their testimony becomes as important as physical evidence.

Again, when conducting an investigation into a matter, for example, to determine the whereabouts of a missing person, you question people who you think may have an idea where he may be, or who were the last persons he spent time with before he went missing, or who he last called and so forth. Here, the answers given, true or false, are based on experience, not physical evidence. However, in order to solve the case, the investigator acts on some of the answers gathered, those he deems helpful, while also looking for physical evidence to support his theories of the case of the missing person. He does not discard the testimonial evidence he has gathered because he knows they are of prime importance as physical evidence.

If testimonial evidence of something is as important in weight as physical evidence of the same thing, why do you discard it? Much knowledge we have gathered today in this world have their root in the testimony of others. Why discard testimony when it is naturally meant to replace physical evidence?

About the historical existence of Jesus Christ, how do you prove the existence of Alexander the Great and Socrates beyond reasonable doubt?

Very inspiring read! Has double 'very' in excellence. This is the topic that is of the greatest interest to me next to the Bible.

I never knew there's a believer in nairaland who thinks the same way I do, who practices love daily like I do, who sees the tremendous benefits in putting the needs of others first before self.

Please permit me to add my experience of learning to love and what I've learnt to this top class article.

A long time ago, through a book, God planted in me the seed of love. I learnt the meaning of the God-kind of love. I learned that love is rooted in our action, not feelings. Feelings or emotions are not necessarily involved in exercising this kind of love. It begins with a decision and is expressed through actions. The absence of feelings or emotions doesn't mean one should be a robot or zombie mindlessly practicing love. It only means you do not need to have any special kind of feeling of love for the object of love like the romantic love; all that's required is your action demonstrating love for others.

Though it looked noble in writing, however, it was very difficult to put into practice, understandably. My flesh always wanted to have its way. I tried and tried to practice love, to be selfless, to make the wants, desires, happiness and satisfaction of others take first place before mine but kept failing, I kept going in the opposite direction of that which I intended to do.

Still practicing love as my flesh permitted, I cried to God to give me love, to give me love to love others selflessly, that I cannot of myself love as I wanted.

That was the beginning of my journey of love. I cannot say the result was instantaneous, but I grew in love.

Though I grew in the grace and ability to love, I still had problem choosing to act in love in certain situations. This kept me looking for a condensed or simplified explanation of love to encompass every situation, or simply put, that can be easily applied in every situation without appearing ambiguous or unsuitable in application.

Then, one day, a thought hit me that changed my life forever. The thought that I should do everything because of love suddenly struck me. I was amazed. I had never thought about loving others this way. While I pondered this, I understood that all God has always done for us is because of love, Jesus chose to die for our sins because of love, one can choose not to be angry because of love, we overlook a multitude of wrongs because of love, we obey the commandments of God because of love. In fact doing anything or everything because of love is the very core of walking in love, doing everything because of love is love itself.

Thus, I learned two important principles of love through this experience:

1. It is the Holy Spirit who gives us the ability to love. We can never fully love unconditionally as we ought without God's help.

2. To walk in love, do everything because of love. That way, your actions will be an expression of love as well as having the pure motive of love behind them.

Now, though I love others better than when I began (not bragging or anything), I'm still very much imperfect. I still fall sometimes, but walking in this knowledge of love has made my Christian walk progressed in leaps and bounds. And I'm still learning, and will continue learning to love till I leave this earthly tent. Love is an endless journey.

Long post. I know. However, I wrote this to help others who God may lead to this thread, those who God may have planted the seed of love in them but who may face similar difficulties I faced when I first set out to practice love. In all, glory be to God. He is the author of my walk in love. All the credits for where I am today belongs to him and not a penny of the credits belongs to me.

Is she a kid? Didn't she know Islam has severe restrictions on the female folks before she converted? May God help her.

menesheh:
Very easy to copy and paste the particular English meaning of faith from your previous posts since you claimed to have answered it.

All my posts have already defined what I mean by faith in the existence of God as opposed to blind faith or ignorant belief and trust which are factors responsible for making religious fanatics or extremists of various religions of the world.

Faith in God should not be blind or stupid. God Himself is more than willing to lead anyone who lets Him to the level of total and complete trust in Him. In the Bible, you'll discover that Moses' faith in God was as a result of God proving Himself to the Egyptians, Enoch had faith in God because he walked with God three hundred years before God took him, Abraham believed that God was able to perform whatever He said because he knew God, Joshua, Caleb, Samuel, Noah, David, Elijah, Elisha, Isaiah, Jeremiah, John the Baptist, Peter, John, Paul, etc etc all had faith based on their personal and historical experiences of the ability and power of God. It was not blind. They all had very great and tangible reason(s) to put their complete trust in God who is unseen but whose acts are always seen.

If a Christian, believing to be full of Biblical faith, decided to walk on water because he read that Jesus Christ and Peter did, and as such he would be able to perform the same feat, then such Christian would be a personification of stupidity because he would not be operating in faith in that case; he would be operating in fatal presumption and ignorance.

Yet, the faith the Christian thought himself to possess and the faith the prophets and apostles of the Old and New Testament operated on have the same English definition - complete trust in someone or someone; belief in a religious doctrine or a deity based on spiritual conviction rather than proof. So what was the problem with the presumptuous Christian's faith? Simple, his faith was not based on reason.

How? How was Peter's faith different from the faith of this Christian if both exercised the same measure of faith, and especially when this Christian's faith even seemed to surpass Peter's? This is why people should learn to read the Bible to understand it and not just read it as if it were a novel. When Peter walked on water, he didn't just take the decision to walk on water. He asked Christ to tell him to come to Him if really He was the one approaching them on water. Then Christ gave Peter a reason to walk on water, Christ told him to come to Him. That was why Peter walked on water towards Jesus, otherwise he wouldn't have attempted it even though he had previously cast out demons through the same faith.

Now, do you see why the dictionary definition of faith does not cut it in explaining faith in God?

menesheh:
Everybody will like to win noble price and be popular. Miracle can't withstand scientific test of which many have been carried out. If what you termed miracle do happened, don't just say "it is a miracle" because you don't understand how it happened, it is laziness. Get to work, ask questions, collect data and evaluate it, i bet my shoe, at the end, you will know the processes that leads to such phenomenon.

In all honesty, this is a really naïve statement as regards spiritual matters manifesting in the physical. Can you evaluate and give a scientific explanation to the 'psychic' phenomenon? How about you dissect the human anatomy to study the mechanism of the gift of prophecy among others? All I'm trying to tell you is that spiritual matters cannot be verified the same way physical matters are done.

Man for the greater part of the past millenia has engaged in such unsubstantiated labouring of whatever that looks confusing and strange to them as miracle or even god, to the extent of worshipping those things. With science, we now know those things and have stopped labouring anything we don't uet understand as miracle from the unknown.

You said it. Faith in God, as well as the products of such faith, is not confusing, and is not strange.
When will you understand that science is grossly incapable of providing logical explanation for every phenomenon or event in this world or universe?

hahn:
I am only responsible for what I write. You are responsible for what you understand

So much for intelligent folks. Not at all disappointed. It was expected as typical of atheists.

menesheh:
I didn't see any English definition of faith in your previous comment. I noticed that you are intentionally dodging my question.



cheer

May have been overlooked or answered previously. Either way, do point out the question "in question".

hahn:
What can I say?

I guess you can never really take away the human need to believe in something. Nigerians have found solace in religion because it, amongst other things, encourages us to shun our responsiblity. When something good happens, it must be god, and when something happens, it just has to be the devil. Nigerians have to be number one in the ranking of people who refuse to accept responsibility for their actions. If it is not the government it is god and if it isn't god then it is the devil.

This same god has failed to reveal itself or repeat all it's "miracles", at least the ones in the bible and other religious story books, in over 2000years. When malaria was a major epidemic, and it still is, killing thousands of people, "it" never performed any miracle nor healed anyone. In its love, as its followers will like us to believe, it let millions of kids and people die. Then a set of humans decided to look into this problem "themselves" until they were able to come up with a cure and thus saved millions of lives. Needless to mention that countries that don't expect god to solve their problems have progressed and broken greater barriers than Africans, who god seems to be only concerned with either sending them to hell or preparing "paradise" with lots of singing jobs, and who still live in abject poverty.

Until the average Nigerian understands that he is solely responsible for whatever goes on in his life, we will continue to be faced with people who consider "believing" in something as evidence that that "something" exists.

Of course, there's no amount of miraculous evidence or proof of the supernatural that will separate the natural man from his ignorance.

He never looks for it neither does he investigate the claims but he is quick to condemn the testimonies of millions all over the world all saying the same thing.

Moreover, it's absurd to assume that responsibility is tied to spiritual matters. That people peg every event on either God or the devil or the government is the most careless statement I ever read showing a great absence of effort in thinking this through. And I thought I've heard it all.

menesheh:
The bolded part of your post caught my attention immensely, faith is the evidence of the unseen . Waw. . Are you misunderstanding faith to predictions based on evidence and data collected.

Here we are, stocked in a vast deep universe, with Phenomena we as human couldn't phantom out the causes of those things. Human with its cognitive reasoning prowess has created too many fantasies through the observable and non-observable phenomenal happenings before them and outside their reach. The question that arises is "how can we, the greater primate distinguish between facts of a phenomenon to fantasy of the same phenomenon. Are we to apply faith, or use observable evidence to evaluate those things. Applying faith implys accepting anything atall posited by human mind without censor.

Faith as you said being the evidence of the unseen, is not a pathway to finding the fact of something. Lets say there is a murder in a house, can u apply faith by either saying that it is not murder, or start looking for clues to finding what actually happened.

Using faith as the evidence for the unseen maybe illusional. A magician performing in a stage may use tricks, accepting his tricks as true with the application of faith may be illusional. We can start believing anything with faith since faith is the evidence of those unseen fantasies.

Read my posts to understand the meaning of faith (in God) as opposed to gullibility and fantasy and illusion. They're all quite different terms and are not related to the faith I'm talking about.

johnydon22:
As always you don't still check what you post.

Faith is not an evidence of anything.. FAITH: A feeling or conviction that something is true without empirical evidence.

A muslim has faith in Allah, this is not an evidence of Allah but simply a conviction.
A christian has Faith is Yahweh, this is not evidence of Yahweh but simply a conviction.
I may have FAITH that a flying diamond pig exists, this is not evidence of the pig but simply my delusional CONVICTION.

Your faith in anything doesn't make it true, doesn't even make it probably true... Your faith only means you believe it whether it is true or not. So please don't pull this stupendous comparison between Empirical evidence (that science deals with) and Faith (conviction).

If you read the Bible, you'd see that the Israelites worshiped different gods, they had 'faith' in those gods of woods and stone they carved and served otherwise they wouldn't have bothered serving those gods. However, their faith was blind. There was no reason to put their faith in the existence of the things that did not supernaturally deliver them from trouble, gods that could not provide water for them in the wilderness, gods that were incapable of healing them from their diseases, gods that could not supernaturally feed them when they were hungry and had run out of food in the wilderness when they left Egypt. Their faith in those gods was, in essence, blind. This is not the faith the Bible teaches. God asks His people to believe in Him with childlike faith. Faith which is convinced of the ability of God. This conviction comes from knowing or experience of the power and ability of God so that one's confidence rests completely in God. This is not the blind faith that believes in a deity in the absence of the physical manifestations of the deity's powers or ability, as you erroneously assume I described.

With FAITH you only able to be convicted in your own delusion that there is such a thing as the spiritual world when you are in a material world. Again study of nature (science) tenders postulations and gives the methods used to arrive to such conclusions.

But in your conviction of something as delusional as claim a spirit world, no compelling evidence to suggest so, yet you are fully convinced of it and call your conviction evidence? is that not a total show of ludicrous gullibility

I have FAITH that i am Zeddicus Zul Zorranda... Bingo, there is my evidence..

If you read my post, you'll find this comment very laughable because there's no semblance of faith in this declaration. It is pure delusion and fantasy, not faith. It is possible schizophrenia in the making. You talk about science arriving at a conclusion
through observation and deduction, are you aware of many events that science has no explanation to offer using the same methods to arrive at a conclusion, occurrences about which it has kept mom? If science is the sole process by which reality is proven, why has it failed to come up with clear conclusions as regards these supernatural phenomena? Why is it still difficult to explain why a patient was able to accurately describe to doctors what they said and what transpired in the operating room at the same time she was being operated on even though all the instruments showed her brain was dead, or say clinically dead, without life or pulse, but eventually resurrected to the great surprise of the doctors and nurses who had eventually declared her time of death?

One can only imagine how such gullibility stems. . Personal Experience, so people should swallow YOUR PERSONAL conviction as a UNIVERSAL TRUTH?

since your personal experience cannot be demonstrated for substantiation, it sorely rests that you are only postulating your own assumptions.

You postulate that something IS, yet you can not tender how you arrived at such conclusion... How then did you know because for the fact that you got to know show that it is perceivable.

But NO, you don't know, you are only convicted that it is true thereby shutting out reason in entirety, subjecting yourself to a gullible state of nonsensical conviction.

Makes us wonder who "the blind fools or fool" is in this case..

Lol. Did I hear you say faith should be based on my personal experience? This here is really funny submission. Whether you admit it or deny it, there are so many things in this world that defy logical or scientific explanation. The fact that they cannot be explained using scientific methods of deduction, should they be discounted as false? Should they be ignored because they fail to appear under the microscopic lens of science?

You'll never get a compelling scientific evidence of faith in God. Even science is incapable of providing such even if it does not deny the existence of consciousness after death.

Where you lack knowledge is a call for more study and not some stupendous superstition. . .

Study has come up with [size=16]Chemotherapy, Radiation therapy and many other ways cancer can be battled[/size] which in the near future will be drastically improved with more study, leaving to people like you who employ superstition where they lack knowledge, man would still be riding horses now.
Malaria once had no cure now is as common as common cold.
where you lack knowledge should incite more study not superstition...

On the contrary, your blind insistence on the impossibility of the spiritual world is superstitious. Medical experts and some scientists, not attached to any religion of the world, have proved to the world that the spiritual world is a reality. For want of space, I shall not publish their findings now. If scientists and people who have had similar experiences, Christians or non-Christians, testify to the reality of the existence of the soul, then it is worse than blindness and ignorance to state otherwise.

Out of body experiences, Illusionary projections. And somehow someone cannot fathom that the BRAIN is the center of consciousness and perception in man. . Every illusionary projection by man is as a result of the brain which in turn is one of the last ORGANS to die in the body..

Very unintelligent comment. You're still backward in terms of scientific discoveries that state the possibility of consciousness even after the brain is dead, even after oxygen has left it for about four to six minutes tops and the person is declared dead.

Faith in a thing doesn't make it true, it only means you believe it whether is true or not

True. It doesn't matter if you have faith in God or not. It doesn't make Him any less real. However, faith in God is the conviction of His existence. It is a conviction not based on the principles of science or logic, a conviction that is aware of His reality, His presence, His power, His love - this awareness is the basis of faith, it is the evidence of the unseen, it is true faith in God.

Another test is the test of the afterlife. Does the afterlife exist? How do we determine its existence? If it exists, which deity do we have to give account of our existence on earth? Is it Allah, or the Egyptian sun god, or Annubis, or Chemosh, or Diana? The question of the afterlife is no longer a subject restricted to religion or spiritual beliefs. It is a subject of scientific interest and the results of these experiments are quite interesting. Many subjects describe seeing a deity whose descriptions correspond to Jesus Christ or the Father. Some describe seeing peaceful light and a being in the center of that light, some experiences are so vivid and detail that they describe the nail marks on his hands while some describe seeing the peaceful abode of the saints in paradise. A set of others had a different story of being dragged to a region of flames of fire, seeing hell, hearing tormenting wails and screamings. All these experiences point to the fact that the Bible is no fiction. It is real as real can be.


There are many other tests but this three should suffice to answer your questions concerning the determination of the true God.

2. Let us zero in on Christianity and its bible.

Now the bible protrays God as all-loving, slow to anger, righteous, protecting the helpless and so on.

The same bible also portrays God as a fickle being who is a slave to his passions. He sanctions slavery, manslaughter, polygamy, genocide (Egypt, Amalek, Assyria), favouritism and so on. In most cases, like in the case of Uzzah, he kills by himself. This same God who is portrayed as peace-loving is also portrayed as a specialist in pitting one group of his creatures against the others.

This has no bearing with the topic of discussion. Let's stick to the topic. Focusing on this may lead us to deviate from the original topic.

Even though faith doesn't need to have evidence but it shouldn't be blind. Faith should not be divorced from reason.

I quite agree with you on this. Ironically, this is also my argument for the belief in the existence of God.

For example, more than half of the people who profess Christianity today are not really doing so because they love God. No. They do so because they are afraid of hell fire. Because they know that even though he is portrayed as merciful, they see him as one who can be wicked in punishing someone; they see him as one who, even though he is portrayed as merciful, has a limit to the level of his mercy.

You should speak for yourself here. Do you think everyone loves sin the way you do? Why do you ignorantly assume that serving God is based on fear of punishment when literally thousands are much more fulfilled and happier serving God than serving the devil as you do? You can't just judge everyone with your narrow lens of perception. Even if there were no hell or heaven, many will still gladly serve God for the rest of their lives while many will still refuse to serve Him. It is just like the relationship between a father and his children. They know their father is ready to punish them when they go wrong but they never doubt for a second their father's love for them. The father's love is reciprocated despite the certainty of punishment because the love the father has for them is far far greater than the desire to punish them. They do not rebel against their father simply on the thought of possible suffering of punishment should they go wrong.

Besides, you conveniently excluded the part where belief in God is based on love for what God has done and is doing for His people. His goodness, His mercies, His answers to prayers, His deliverance of His people from chains of darkness, His miracles, His salvation given freely to all mankind, His unconditional love for us despite our wickedness. These are just a few among many reasons for loving and serving God and they're more than enough for anyone to serve Him without fear of punishment because there's no fear in love. You're very free to ignore His love but that is ultimately your choice, not ours, the children of God.

3. The God of the christians is portrayed as loving unconditionally. Yet he gives out laws and tells those who do not obey him that they will be punished for not obeying.

I continue to say this, you're deluded if you think God is only a God of love. He is, of course. However, He is also a God of wrath. He is a God of mercy as well as a God of judgment. He has made this fact well known in His Word and through the ages. It will be best you always keep that in mind.

So I will ask you: what exactly is the basis of your "faith"?

I want to ask, what is the basis of your doubt despite all the physical evidence of an unseen Creator?

nobilis:
LOL.



I have some few questions.

1. When you talk about Faith an belief in God, which God are you talking about?

Are you talking about the God(s) of the Abrahamic religions or are you talking about all other Gods out there whose followers also have holy books claimed to have been inspired by their deity?

The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Yes, the God of Elijah, of Moses, of king David, of Jeremiah, of Joshua, of John the baptist, of Peter, of John, of Matthew, of Paul. The one and same God.

Even among the Abrahamic religions, are you talking about Jehovah, Yahweh or Allah? Or do you erroneously think they are the same God?

Go through the old testament, the new testament and the koran, you will see that they are not the same God. They are very different in character, attitude, actions and dispositions.

Jehovah and Yahweh are two among the appellations of the I AM, the Elohim, the God of Abraham. Allah is a deity extremely different in disposition, expectation, character and ways from the God of Abraham. Jehovah and Allah are as different as day is different from night, as mountain is different from valley. Yahweh sent His Son to die for the sins of mankind, but Allah denies the death of Jesus Christ, says it is a figment of imagination, in other words.

So which God is the real God and how will u arrive at that conclusion?

The God who is greater than all other gods is the true God. The logical question should be how can we determine the God that is greater than others?



One of the tests to determine the answer to such question and probably the most important test of the sovereign nature of the true God is the test of universality. How known or experienced are the different gods to people all over the world? Has Buddah been seen by thousands of Africans or Europeans or Canadians or the Greeks past and present? Krishna? Allah? Zeus, Baal? Molech? Odin? Has Sango or Amadioha revealed themselves to people across tribes, nations or the world in order to erase doubts of their existence and to establish their supremacy over other gods? Which god passes this test of universality? I'd like to know. They cannot. You know why? They're not gods but demons parading as gods. They're hindered by time and space so that they cannot be everywhere at the same time. This is why this so-called religious gods can never stretch their activities beyond a region. The only Being that passes this test and even goes beyond that since He is the Creator of time and space is the God of Abraham.



Another test is the test of universal revelation. This is similar to the test of universality but the difference here lies in reaching out to people of contrary beliefs by the true deity. How often have you heard that thousands, I mean thousands - okay, for the sake of modesty let's say hundreds of practicing buddhists, or Muslims seen and accurately described Krishna or Zeus or Dagon or Ra? What about atheists? Have they had any experience with these gods in order to impact their beliefs or lack of it in their existence? Have Muslims seen or heard any Indian god or goddess? Where? Give me links, books, audio or video evidence of this phenomenon. The one true God accepts everyone irrespective of belief and loves them the same. The one true God not only reveals Himself to His followers but also to those following other deities. It is easy to doubt Christians when they say they saw or heard Jesus Christ. However, a number of pagans, atheists, Muslims, buddhists, traditionalists, or egyptians, people of various religious beliefs have reported seeing Jesus Christ or angels, an encounter which changed their lives forever.

Sweetmarriage:
I've come to discover that the things being said about God is too divine to be a mere 'fiction' See, GOD IS REAL!!! When we die, we will go and meet our Creator (GOD) in Heaven where we will be rewarded according to the way we live here on earth.

Accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior today. If you are a thief, stop stealing. If you are a fornicator, stop fornicating. If you are a drunkard, stop it. Let Jesus our Good Lord cleanse you from your sins with His Precious Blood that He shed on the Cross Of Calvary for you and me.

Today is the day of salvation, kiss the Son lest He be angry with you.

Live your life for God, so when you leave this bitter world, you will reign with Christ in His Kingdom Heaven (where there is no pain but Joy everlasting)

#No real enjoyment here on earth
#Real enjoyment waits for us in Heaven.

Will you be there?

God bless you

lalasticlala, ishilove

I love everything about this comment, everything, especially the bolded.

I always wonder what joy folks derive from fornication, adultery, stealing, intimidation, sinful pleasures of life. It is probably the fact that since being delivered from darkness, I've seen what sin really looks like from this angle of light - it's hideous, disgusting, temporal, worthless, empty, shallow, a source of internal dissatisfaction, unreliable, perishable, all are vanity of vanities.

First off, thanks for the mention.

There's something we have to understand about the relationship between faith and evidence - they are the same thing. They're both evidence of something. Faith is evidence of the unseen; science is evidence of what is seen. Whichever is used one thing is certain - Faith is older than science.

With science we're able to interact with and understand the physical world, its mysteries, its laws, man, animal, plants, land, air, etc. However, with faith we're able to interact with and understand the spiritual world, its mysteries, its laws, the forces that inhabit this world, the beings, etc.

Atheists and unbelievers perceive faith in God as some kind of belief without evidence. This is why it is said that they are blind fools. While you can never manufacture a 'physical' evidence for something of spiritual nature, you can never deny the reality of the supernatural, or the existence of the spiritual realm whose evidence lie personal experience, people's experience, history of people having the same experience, physical manifestations confirming the Word of God such as unexplainable cure of cancer, HIV/AIDS, resurrection from clinical death, the manifestations of the gifts of prophecy (that accurately describes the details of life of strangers), tongues and interpretation, word of knowledge, discerning of spirits etc etc, or physical manifestations of spiritual phenomena such as poltergeist activities, ouija board, the activities of rain makers, physically undetectable cause(s) of an illness bearing the same symptom with common illness, womb overdue for delivery but remains in that stage probably for years (rare and usual at the same time), unexplainable manifestations defying explanation which the medical and scientific world recognise as real but fail to explain using scientific knowledge gained from reading textbooks, but which others also call the paranormal, there're also out of body experiences, near-death experiences, too numerous to mention.

The bottom line is faith in God is not blind neither is is it the exercise people resort to to feel good about themselves and their situation. Faith in God is no longer a question of religion because the evidence of the existence of God is overwhelming in our daily lives so that whoever does not believe despite this pieces of evidence scattered all over the universe has no one but himself to blame in judgment neither will he have any excuse to offer for doubting the evidence of the existence of God - faith and science.

menesheh:
Why not shot-up and read between the line or read other chats between us.

Lead by example.

menesheh:
And your problem is that you fail to look at a url i posted there, am not a blogger and am not the writer, that i posted a write-up i agreed with its points doesn't make the writer.
Reason with your brain broo. That's why you quoted me and wrote same point about being a kid of which i don't give a damn. I don't do age. I never know, i make not be your age grade or even suppose to be discoursing some issues with you.

It is so pitiful you had to resort to pointing the accusing finger at a link after publishing and clearly defending its topic in order to save your neck.

When you defend a topic, it doesn't matter if you brought it up or not, you're clearly inviting criticism and opposing thoughts that naturally come along. If you can't handle that, you've no business defending it in the first place.

Obviously, the op did not think this through before pointing the accusing finger at Christians.

Should I school him and tell him the difference between prayer and faith declaration which stands on the promises of God.

Where to begin? Judging from his prejudice of christianity, I believe it is futile to attempt.

winner01:
You have a point though, cos i wonder why one will even list sex as a benefit.

Lolz. If sex is an exclusive benefit of atheists, then I'm Brad Smith.

johnydon22:
When you explicitly agreed that your after life postulations cannot be proven with any physical, testable, tangible, perceivable evidence.

You still expect any rational person to take you serious? . . . Or you expect me to now take you on based on your personal beliefs in after life that you will sorely just rest on FAITH (conviction that your assumptions are true)

Seriously am not cut out for such ludicrous insanity

Spoken like a true atheist who ascribes the word 'irrational' to be the exclusive property of the known unknown. When the thought of dividing the atom was first conceived, was it rational? When the giant-winged bird was first conceived, was it rational at the time? When doctors and nurses witnessed the resurrection of some patients who died clinically, was it rational?

While you sit here arguing against the possibility of the afterlife where thousands: christians, pagans, doctors, former atheists, scientists have all testified of its existence, many experentially, and your only argument to the contrary is that 'it is irrational' then you have no claim to intelligence to which you pride yourself of possession by ignoring the huge body of evidence, religious or scientific, in the form of testimonies by these technical and qualified experts and common people, past and present.

When you're told by the media that a strange, undetected phenomenon is responsible for multiple deaths in an area warning people to stay away so as not to risk infection, would it be irrational to heed the warning even if the phenomenon in question is undetected or air-borne or unseen?

winner01:
He isnt an atheist, real atheists dont care about religion......he is either a God-hater or anti-theist.

He has no idea. On the contrary, I doubt he is a God-hater. I think he feels being an atheist is fashionable. This, I believe, explains his naive tone of excitement at listing the worldly pleasures which are the 'exclusive benefits of atheists'.

johnydon22:
Good this settles it in Toto

I thought it is the habit of intelligence to verify a fact, to attempt an investigation into a matter in order to ascertain the possibility, or not, of the unknown. Obviously, your replies have been anything but intelligent.

menesheh:
Yea, point one among those earthly things atheists enjoy that you've never enjoyed or will never still enjoy.
Car
Sex
Holiday travel
Yacht
Drinks
Partying
Love
Etc

The issue here is trying to control how i do those things. Christian will come up theirs, same with muslim, and Judaism. How do we Choose the factual one from god?


Whether they are mundane or not, as far as you are living in this our physical world, brother you need those things. What you are doing is pretence and faking.

Excuse me, are you implying that only atheists have the exclusive access to worldly pleasures?

So Christians don't enjoy drinks, cars, travels for pleasure, yachts, sports, sex (as married couples), parties, etc, etc?

My, you're really a kid who thinks atheism is all about enjoyment of worldly pleasures.

Google...please, do yourself a favour and google the meaning of atheism.

johnydon22:
Hahahahaha bro why getting emotional over a simple discourse? Please it's not a fight or enmity, we are only discussing... I never claimed to be an authority here; i stated my reasons.. "Prove to us, so we can learn and KNOW" that shouldn't be hard for you i presume..
You really don't know how to argue do you?
I have never asserted to agree with the big bang theory (By the way hope you know was postulated by a theist,catholic priest for that matter) so in case as usual you are thinking it's an atheistic theory, you are sadly mistaken.. Big bang is a scientific theory and has nothing to do with atheism or theism.

I have never asserted to agree with big bang theory so why did you ASSUME i did? Thats Straw man you know..

About Atoms, am not sure i even need to talk on that unless your theistic beliefs impairs your scientific cognition.

There's nothing to prove to you by way of physical, testable, tangible, perceivable evidence of the reality of the afterlife. Even the scientists, after who you model your intelligence, and who are not attached to any so-called religion are of the opinion of the great possibility of the afterlife after conducting researches on the subject. Needless to say, none has ever never come up with a physical evidence of their belief in the afterlife except, of course, the conclusive results of their many experiments in that regard.

johnydon22:
Your cognitive ability is way too low. . . So in all honesty you cannot discern that this is not a bible quote... This leaves us wondering who the reasonable and unreasonable one is

Besides the fact that his poor use of ellipses made it appear as if he omitted some words in his quotation so that all the words are read together, in your opinion, it is reasonable that he proposes death by stoning of couples who remarry as a result of divorce. This is why you jump to his defense, right?

Can you tell the difference between these sentences in response to the question:

"Should we engage the enemy or retreat?"

No, war is bad

No war is bad

plaetton:
This is the inherent contradiction of religions, especially the pentecostal christianity of the modern era.

This is one reason why Christianity is different from religion.

Go and verify the source of your Bible quote. At least to appear reasonable.

BoTNaija:
The concept of an afterlife is at best, illusory and at worst, a criminal attempt to limit the human mind from attaining to its best capacity. God is real and every living creation of His has a terminal period of existence - humans, monkeys, lizards, vultures! The Bible or Quran are as good as a bottle of whiskey (opium), meant to lure you to sleep, while your mental captors exploit you perpetually!

There's no afterlife? You're more misguided than a drunk who thinks a major busy road is his magnificent stretch of palatial, king-size bed. When your error of thought vaporizes - may God have mercy on you that it is not too late.

johnydon22:

Oh yes how can someone disprove what is not proven, it's tantamount to asking someone to disprove nothing. . .

So am sure you know quite well thats why you made the absolute statement that there is an afterlife, so please regale us the thrilling tale by postulating your methods of observations of this simple fact, we so much want to KNOW.

Tell us how you got to know, prove to us there is

Question. Science can explain every phenomenon in the universe. T or F?

paxonel:
ok, what is the difference between revelation and prophecy?

Jesus Christ fulfilled the prophecies concerning Him as foretold by the prophets in the Old Testament.

Paul, on his way to Damascus, had a revelation of Jesus Christ that changed his life forever.

flexybobo:
nobody is like Jesus
we all commit sin
what we do is to pray that we will not commit sin on rapture day, because many people who think they are righteous will be caught on aware on that day

I agree with everything you've said. I hope my post did not give you the impression that walking in love makes you perfect. No one can be sinless on earth in this temporary tent (flesh). However, with love you strive for perfection everyday. That's all what God requires of us. Love is God's nature. If you love, you're living and expressing the nature of God.

denisbid:
heavenly creatures?
so eagles and lions are heavenly creatures?
do eagles and lions talk? how then do they praise?

Read the book of Revelation 4:6-9

Weah96:
You should try to get murdered as soon as possible, just to make heaven. Try Sambisa forest.

Make sure to remind your murderer that you love him.

How about you re-read my post? Who said anything about seeking death?