₦airaland Forum

Katsumoto

It is all too well being forthright when it doesn't interfere with your earnings/contracts/egunje.

@^^ . That's the tragedy of our so called intelligentsia/"elites". Poverty of spirit and material poverty is a bad mix indeed.

My humble list in alphabetical order: (1)= first preference for task. (2) Second preference for task. Oya let's go ! feel free to tinker with it . It is inexhaustible.

Judges 1------ [b] Debaters[/b]2

1:Ajanlekoko(1) ----- Ajanlekoko(2)
2:AribisalaO(1) ----- AribisalaO(1)
3:Beaf(2) ----- Beaf(1)
4:Cap28(2) ----- Cap28(1)
5:Ekt_Bear(1) ----- Ekt_Bear(2)
6:Gbawe(1) ----- Gbawe(1)
7:Katsumoto(2) ----- Katsumoto(1)
8:Kilode?(1) ----- Kilode?(1)
9:Kobojunkie(1) ----- Kobojunkie(2)
10:Ndu_Chucks(2)----- Ndu_chucks(1)
11:Ogugua88(1) ----- Ogugua88(1)
12:Onlytruth(!) ------ Onlytruth(1)
13:PhysicsQED(1)----- PhysicsQED(1)
14:Sagamite(1) ----- Sagamite(1)
15:SapeleGuy(1) ----- SapeleGuy(2)
16:Shymexx(2) ----- Shymexx(1)

Katsumoto

I am sorry Cheikh but I am missing your point.

@^ Sorry, a times I do go off track . I was trying to agree with your point before I began making a general comment about the state of our so called intelligentsia/"elites". It is a general Nigerian thing that if you agree with my inherent "prejudices"/view points you are seen as ok/respected . I do not think it is peculiar to the Igbo.
Perhaps it appears so because they are more vocal/assertive of their rights of "free speech". Obviously, it will offend people who do not understand the motivation/cultural worldview of such people. I hope you get my drift .

joeyfire

We never took it as or made noise of it as an attack on igbos, yet achebe's is seen as an assault on the entire yoruba race. Hero worship is a problem. Nuff said

@^^ The highlighted is the problem in Nigeria and indeed Africa. We find it absolutely difficult to criticise(constructively) our elders/politicians. It is like a cultural thing. We seem incapable and a times very intolerant of others who cross the "line" to make such criticisms/comments especially of those we instinctively revere unquestionably. It is a terrible state of being if we cannot question or raise doubts about our so called "elites" or "leaders" as Followers. It makes communication and dialogue with the "other" almost impossible. It has badly infected our general politics hence it is assumed that Ondo state politics must conform/follow the rest ACN states uncritically just because it is perceived as a "progressive"/Yoruba party which officially it should not be allowed to be seen as such if we had smart intellectually savvy politicians. Diversity is good and diverse ideas/politics is even better .

Katsumoto

I suppose Yoruba folks are only 'respected' when they have views favourable to ndigbo.

I also suppose all Yoruba folks are also supposed to have the same view on every topic/subject.

SMDH

@^^ Your observation maybe ok but you'll agree with me that "elites" everywhere can be good and terrible but unfortunately the Nigerian variant are devoid of any positive intellectual output let alone any iota of moral rectitude whatsoever hence people like Fani Kayode could intermittently surface to make outlandish statements against the person of Awo etc. It is a great tragedy that a country of Nigeria size/population cannot produce serious "elites"(intellectual) class not infected with the moral disease of sectionalism/tribalism in its narrow/small sense. SMH

aribisalaO

It is funny how we refuse to look in the mirror. Mob lynching of "thieves",gbomo gbomo, joystick thieves etc is an established part of our culture

Driving a six inch nail into the head
being forced to drink a cement mixture
"necklacing"
being dragged along at slow speed by a moving vehicle

these are a few menu items of our preferred methods and our outrage now seems so contrived and unconvincing.
What is new that they killed 4 instead of one?
That they were University students and not the usual Kerosene using demographic?
Or that it was filmed so we have to view in technicolor the replays of our cruelty.
We are a mean callous people and have been for the last several decades. Have we not seen executions by our own police on YouTube or other Nigerians feasting on roast human flesh with relish.
Yes those images may be shocking to those with weak stomachs but many Nigerians are inured to such carnage. Did the President say anything? How long before the senate reacted? Were not our soldiers on rampage in "revenge" killings for their fallen colleagues did we not cheer? Is there some hidden moral code by which we classify the good execution from the bad one.
Mob action appears to be a natural human instinct which is barely suppressed when you have very strong deterrents and a near certainty of punishment when crimes are committed. When those two ingredients are missing in a nation as corrupt as Nigeria mob action is GUARANTEED

@^^ Gbam+1000. You just made my day by your posts on this topic. It is clear that Nigerians generally have no memory or sense of history hence we find it pretty difficult to get a grip on our infantile/misplaced/reactionary emotions. We also delude ourselves that we are a caring society as Nigerians/Africans yet our cruelty towards our fellow human beings knows no bounds. I've always been afraid of Nigerians since I witnessed some of the things/actions you described above by the so called fellow human beings(Nigerians). Presently, the JTF is extra judicially killing civilians in Damaturu and Bornu state. It is so natural and common that our soldiers are not exactly seen as liberators anywhere they go but as liabilities/agents of death to local communities. It is a shame that many Nigerians suffer from selective amnesia hence our unconvincing outpourings of misplaced outrage. We are inherently a wicked people but most will take exception to such statement since most persons in the south of the country see themselves as "Christians and Muslims"/ believers of some spurious faith. The "nation" is sick . Thanks for your post and reminding us of who we are

Ricky Ross

Its between Gambia, Botswana, Tunisia and Tanzania. But I will say Gambians, except some of the Senegalese taxi drivers working in Banjul.

I have traveled all over Africa, I have not seen any other African country that fear their president and obey laws like Gambians, they fear their president like a God. As a result, Gambians are not ready to commit any serious crime like armed robbery, scamming etc like other West Africans. Rather, most Gambian boys and girls do charms which they wear in their arms in the hope of marrying a rich white tourist. I am saying what I know, I am a frequent visitor to Gambia. They are not shy about their charms, they are bold to tell you that they do it to get rich European tourists. In Gambia, its easy to see a 14 years old boy getting married to a 70 years old white woman. Many old white men and women purposely go to Gambia for sex or marriage.

In West Africa is is CERTAINLY Gambians. In East Africa it is Tanzanians, in Southern Africa it is Botswana, in North Africa it should be Tunisians.

@^^ The so called Gambian "honesty" as depicted by you is obviously a "forced" compliance based on fear of the president and believe me it is only recent since the reign of Yahya. I know Gambia and Senegal pretty well too. Many Gambians are actually semi illiterate and believe a lot in mumbo jombo/fetish/ Marabout. Tourism in Gambia has become a new found route to eldorado/heaven(Europe). It has messed up their cultural values. There is general poverty in the land besides the fact that they are generally lazy. As for the other countries you mentioned, you are very correct.

CHIEF AGBE

Do u understand yourself? If malians and Mossi were as hardworking as you say, they should have stayed in their savana and plant trees in order to stop the desert from eating their two countries. Burkina Faso has six borders: Mali, Niger, Togo, benin, Ghana, and Cote d'Ivoire. Why is that it is always in Cote d'ivoire they go? because Ivorians are more welcoming people than any other africans.
The issue today is foreigners such as malians and Burkinabe have abused ivorian hospitality to destroy this country once one of the best if not the best in Africa. How can you be a hardworking person and not able to build your own home? something must be wrong with you then.

@ When did "trustworthiness" of persons become a judgement on "hardwork" of the various people you mentioned above from the "sahel" region? Please revisit the topic again . For your information most of the farmers/workers of cocoa and banana plantations in Ivory Coast are citizens of those countries you mentioned above. Please do not be dazzled by false propaganda about the hospitality and peacefulness of Cote d'Ivoire. It is not and the country besides Abidjan was nothing to write home about just like most West African countries except Nigeria with numerous cities/towns. Most Ivoriens are inter-married with those people you glibly classify as "foreigners". Much of the northern/sahel regions are arid and semi desert. No African country including Nigeria has managed to tame or plant sufficient trees to contain the advance of the sahara. My friend I guess you are a little prejudiced/biased against the northerners across the border. The issue is about personal propriety/honesty and I can testify that on the whole those people are generally honest than their southern/tropical/coastal counterparts. By the way I am not from the north but I have lived in these ounntries/know the people fairly well. I still have some family living in Abidjan. In any case it's a free world. People emigrate anywhere they feel they can earn a good living just like Nigerians and numerous other Africans dying to cross the sahara/oceans. . Why should it be any different for the people of the north across the borders? People of the sub-tropical regions of Africa are generally less trust worthy and too "clever by half". You can even see the same traits in Naija if we are honest. It is sad and ugly indeed.

stagger

I find it distasteful that this CEO of an airline in which 153 people died and no compensation has been paid, is allowed to keep living life as if nothing dey happen. WTF!

@^^ Blame the so called government regulators and society for being generally insensitive to life and death of citizens. The Indian is only reflecting what is "normal" in the society .

CHIEF AGBE

Burkina and malians? Goodluck with snakes !
2 million malians in Cote d'Ivoire, more than 3 million Burkinabe in Cote d'Ivoire . The results ? they destroyed this Country supporting war criminal Allassane Ouattara.

@ ^^ What does personal/general honesty of the people have to do with politics/war? Ivoriens are generally lazy and much of the work in Cote d'Ivoire are performed by the people from across the border anyway. That there are many "foreigners" in the country is an indication that the Ivoriens are lazy . it is not unusual. Travel around Africa, you'll soon discover who are the laziest and perhaps the most dishonest/untrustworthy too .

Ezecanada

FYI Nairalanders, 43% of NASA scientists are Iranians.

http://www.iranian.com/main/news/2011/02/13/43-nasa-scientists-are-iranians

@ Bro, don't weep for Naija. Education in Naija for youths/everybody really has failed longtime ago.We can't tell the difference between a Kanuri and fulani let alone a faraway land like Iran(farsi speaking Persians) and Arabs. The fact that you have just thrown up above obviously will mystify/shock most of us but it is very true indeed. Nigerians are noted for denigrating everything not Western in origin including education too yet even amongst us Africans we are not exactly anything to write home about relative to our advantages over other African countries.We celebrate mediocrity, impunity, and ignorance as if it is an honour.

malele

Iran was able to capture that drone, with the device they bought from russia.
And pls don't compare iran to USA in anyway
US has active military that has fought[b] several wars within 15years.[/b]
(Q

@^^ Yes they fought many wars/invaded other countries but have they won any of the so called wars? You may win battles but loose the war. Nobody is comparing Iran/America. Stop being dazzled by everything "americana". It's no longer in "vogue" even for small minds.

@OP -- From my contacts with numerous Africans, I'll probably say Burkinabes, Ethiopians and Malians.

SmoothCrim

I have never seen a Nigerian Fulani or Howsad(Hausa) speak up on behalf of their direct Haratin brothers!!

@^^ Your indignation is quite in order. Unfortunately, most Nigerians including those you mischievously mentioned above do not know much about the internal social conditions of other Africans let alone such high minded topic about slavery/Haratin of Mauritania and the rest sahel region(Niger).

ekt_bear

Anyway, this is why follow-follow religion like Islam is useless. How can your religion require to visit Saudi Arabia where some dude can turn you away anyhow or treat you like dirt.

@^^ +100 . Christian pilgrims also suffer such contemptuous and ignominious treatments in Jerusalem too. Some of our women folks have been sexually molested and groped by their hosts- Arabs and Jews. Our social standing in the eyes of the rest of the world as a race, is tragic and disheartening indeed.

talkmarkay

Our goverment have been guilty [/b]of this issue for long time and not ready to correct it.

I just hope that [b]this will serve as a lesson for our goverment and put the right pen in the right hole also stop beating about the bush.

I am highly supprised seen our leaders running arround to persude the Saudi goverment to pertake on the wrong programme.

I pray to God to help our Leader turn a new leaf.

Those nairaland Insulting the Saudi Goverment should have a rethink; Why this problem only affect Nigerian pilgrims?

@^^ Do you actually think and believe what you wrote above? Is Nigeria not a secular state? Why must a "religious" arrangement by so called pilgrims be the primary responsibility of a secular state? Yes they are Nigerian citizens and that's the interest/responsibility of any serious government/country/nation. Visa delinquency or impropriety by citizens travelling to foreign lands is not the responsibility of any government. The conditions/information was/has been out there for so called pilgrims and the organisations organising such charade. Truthfully nobody takes Nigeria(ns) seriously let alone respect her. The laxity and sloppy behaviour of our so called leadership/representatives abroad, have not gone unnoticed by other nations hence Nigerians anywhere will continue to be treated with ignominy whatever we may think of ourselves as "giant of ..... " . Senegal and Mali are predominantly/majority muslim societies yet they do not suffer such contemptuous/ignominious treatments from so called Islamic "brothers". Besides, an Islamic scholar/leader from Senegal challenged the perceived primacy of Mecca/Saudi Arabia as the sole "holy land" hence they also have a Holy place in Senegal(Touba) which is equally held in high reverence like the Saudi sites. Nigerian, Pakistani, Afghan and Indonesian muslims must be the most confused and gullible of those who acquired an alien faith(Islam) unquestionably. None of these places speak arabic let alone understand the subtle beauty/nuances of the faith(Islam) they are ever ready to die for or deplete national wealth sponsoring spurious annual pilgrimages. Is it not national folly?

Siraleeyu because either way your country is mentioned. NIGERIA!, nd dat enough shud giv u a feeling of concern. Lets show some patriotism [/b]for diz our ailing [b]nation.

@^^ Your sense of "patriotism" knows no bounds . Does patriotism happen in a vacuum? Is "NIGERIA" a "Nation" or Country? Already?

nagoma

So they are liberated? You are entitled to your own opinion but the US knows fully well the possible repercussions.

@^^ You are correct. "He who rides on the back of the tiger must be ready to be eaten " The chicken has come home to roust". The four killed/dead Americans are nothing special in the eyes of a "cynical" government ever ready to expend the lives of some of her citizens for a so called "quasi-national interest" at times very grotesque and blatantly devious indeed. The problem is not Islam per se but people who somehow have steadfastly refused to be sensitive and appreciate that the world is not "monochrome" and do not wish/desire to be like the rest of the world especially the so called "West" or the chief promoter(USA) of such spurious/fancy ideology- "democracy" or so called religious tolerance of course (Western perspective/version). Majority of the world do not exactly subscribe to such fancy ideas either including Nigeria despite our pretences. Presently, they are sabre rattling in cahoot with "reckless" Israel(Netanyahu) over Iran. War and loss of life do not mean much to cynical power mongers/addicts. I cannot wait to see how the "Iran" event will pan out. The beauty of it all is that the Iranians(Persians) are not gullible nor weak/helpless let alone without knowhow/heart to fight back. It is definitely going to be war without borders just like al Quaeda without borders plus franchises too. Iranians are far more diffused and embedded everywhere than the war mongers care to acknowledge and highly skilled too.

@tomakint/Op
If Zik was a woman within the Naija context, he'll be described as extremely promiscuous and not capable of any iota of self/political discipline/reliability. I do not make such statement lightly. It is about time Africans(Nigerians) begin to[b] question, demystify and [b]deconstruct [/b]our so called leaders from Awo, Shaka,-Mandela et al. No sacred cows! I believe it'll help us move forward and stop being foolishly reverential and deferential of so called "leaders" in our midst.

andrewza

In that case you should return all the western technology, medicine, infrastructure and luxury goods

@ ^^ You obviously do not have a good sense of history . Nevertheless, sincerely, if we can turn the "clock" back I'll rather have Africa without "foreign" incursion/intervention. As it is now, we have been so affected/infected with "foreignness" that we cannot even begin to contemplate our recent past let alone the future. If it means wars so be it. We have wars today anyway just like in "peaceful"Europe too .

SAGirl

I can't believe this is still going on and has turned so ugly.

I would just like to make a plea to my fellow South Africans on this forum: we are just guests in here and I feel we should really refrain from offending people in THEIR forum. I find all these posts very distasteful, if you want to educate people about how beautiful and grand South Africa is then let us create our own forum for that.

I don't understand why you would stoop to such low levels to argue on such a pointless topic. People believe what they will and relentless hitting your head against the wall is not going to change that.

I'm here to have constructive conversations about Africa, and I'm sure that is why we are all here. So please let us refrain from allowing ourselves to be dragged into ugly country fights, that is not what we are about as South Africans. If someone wants to bash your country, let them... That will not take away from what you have.

@^^ Gosh! You are absolutely correct and I think, you are the most beautiful and constructive person I've the privilege to read their post here on NL today.. Sincerely, I have always worried about us Africans and what [b]we do to each other [/b]than what "others"(foreigners) do to us. After all that's what "enemies" do or is expected of them. It is as if we are incapable of thinking creatively but reacting foolishly to every childish talk on a chat forum. I only hope that your fellow countrymen/women will read and appreciate your viewpoint instead of the usual xenophobic tendencies they are exhibiting here. Nobody has the monopoly of knowledge/ignorance . Thank you for your wise contribution.

@Op
Seriously, African women cannot complain anymore. They are intelligent and aware of contemporary issues around Africa/world yet they continue to subvert the good struggle many good African women have fought for the emancipation of women from tyranny etc. Many a times it is not poverty per se but simply GREED/lust for power for the Ghanaian lady of 22years. She knows very well that she's not the first nor second wife so what is it that's so attractive about him? Na wa for the female psyche . Women are truly confusing and difficult to understand .

Kandiikane

I'm sorry but whether he did good for the country or not, it's no excuse killing off people and putting fear in innocent people's everyday life.

Speak bad about him in that country and off with your head.

A big fat shame!

He can't hide his atrocious behind the roads he built.

@^^ Well, I thought it's "democracy" nowadays? Obviously, Gambians are accepting and tolerating it hence he's carrying on like a dictator or military ruler. Is he still in the military?
I guess the people are not tired of him yet. Never mind he's on his last leg with the current spate of killings/executions. Those the gods want to destroy first go mad/never listen to reason/words of good advice. Trust me that's how it starts-just like "small" madness and an exaggerated sense of self importance/omnipotence. It is very sad that Gambians are living in fear. They don't deserve such "terror" in such a laid back easy going place/people. I hope the Senegalese, Saro and perhaps Naija have not turned the place into something else? .

Onlytruth

This thread was opened to bring out that fallacy and show that merit based achievements were twisted and presented as something bad in order to justify mass murder; was used to entrench a retrogressive culture, and even institutionalizing it through constitutional instrumentation by the name of "quota system" and "federal character".

Ogoni need federal character protection (some form of affirmative action), Hausa, Igbo and Yoruba DO NOT!

@Op^^ I sincerely assumed that the topic genuinely was about "Merit" and "Nepotism" as troubling issues for us as Africans not about narrow "ethnic" jingoism(Nigeria). I am out! I don't have the strength for such "fights". I thought we were going to engage in perhaps serious "intellectual"/actual issues as it affects our collective well being as Africans.

@Op

I think it is the fear of the "unknown" and also "culture". We cannot deny the fact that some African cultures are inherently "Merit" conscious/predisposed than some. To talk/discus such an "emotive" subject will open one to all manner of accusations from ethnocentric/uninformed warriors to genuinely fearful persons borne out of concern for their "tiny" group/domination. "Merit" does not happen or cannot be expected in an environment where there are a multiplicity of definitions of "right" and "wrong" derived from different worldviews/standards/perceptions. "Feudalists" see things differently from "Republicans" or "Independents". None is perfect nor the correct route to nirvana either hence dialogue is almost mandatorynecessary for us all to clear the "warts" in our eyes.

@Op
What do you expect from a so called "AIDS" "physician"/magician. I don't really blame him but his believers/supporters in a land or place "Marabouts" wield so much power/influence.
The people are gullible and believe in rubbish like their counterparts in Senegal too .