₦airaland Forum

Bossdave:
Are you the one to help your friend cornelboy or you're the same person?

Jesus never debunked Thomas. You're even contradicting yourself. If Thomas was only exclaiming like someone saying 'Oh, my God!' then, what's there for Jesus to debunk? The fact that you said Jesus debunked Thomas indicates that you truly know that Thomas was actually calling Jesus God. Stop lying. Your first lie is laid to rest.

Let's bury your second lie. Did Jesus debunk Thomas?


"Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God."

Jesus was not referring to Thomas but was giving instruction to a woman to deliver a message to His disciples who were not at that place present.

Second lie laid to rest. Would you respond to the other scriptures I posted to your friend?

Lol you seem not grasp what janosky is saying.

At John 20:17, who was Jesus saying he is ascending to? His Father and God right?

Definitely Thomas at verse 28 wasn't referring to Jesus as the God Jesus said he was going to at verse 17.

Calm down and learn.

HellVictorinho6:
Both u and cornelboy are perplexed on this case

No I'm not confused.

I'm only asking him to explain how a balanced and perfect universe and also life could just appear by chance or accident?
Even the complexity of a cell is enough to reason that there must be a mastermind behind everything.

Janosky:
The BossD & his fellow Trinitarians are not interested in the truth espoused in their Bibles.


One of them said Jesus Christ sits next to God but Jesus is his God.

Lol leave them.
They don't understand that it was even after Jesus accomplished his mission on earth that he got promoted in heaven. He was exalted to the right hand of God.

Revelation 3:21
[21]Those who are victorious will sit with me on my throne, just as I was victorious and sat with my Father on his throne.

John 20:17
[17]“Don’t cling to me,” Jesus said, “for I haven’t yet ascended to the Father. But go find my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

Here are few verses where Jesus clearly show that the Father is superior to him. Jesus has a Father and a God just like we do.
How was meeting today brother?

Bossdave:
Please talk about the verses I posted to you. I'm not here for fruitless arguments. I can give you a run for your money taking you from scripture to scripture and even burying you alive with the same scriptures you're quoting but that would not be an orderly discourse. I've posted you just 2 verses of scripture, answer the questions related to them. Infact, I want you to also tell me why Thomas referred to Jesus as 'My Lord and my God' after His resurrection without Jesus rebuking Him.

Okay. I don't do fruitless argument too.
Let's start from 1 Timothy 3:16

Tell me why did KJV and NKJV used "God manifested.." whereas the rest of the translations used "Christ manifested.." or "he manifested.."??

God didn't manifest in the flesh. God sent his son and the son who was named Jesus when he came in the flesh through Mary and he became the Christ.

The verses obviously talked about Jesus Christ manifesting in the flesh not God himself.

Maynman:
And "eternal" is a french word 😂

Your god is not in Existence.

Eternal is also a word to describe the state of something in regards to time.

You were trying to term "existence" to another thing and I won't buy it.

You haven't still answered the question?
How come a complex and beautifully designed life came by chance, doesn't that defy logic and science?

Maynman:
Existence is being. Didn't you say your god was eternal, was he not in Existence, or he first created existence?

You're not even making any sense.
There's nothing like existence. Existence is just an English word lol

Bossdave:
There's the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. The three are the one and self same Person.

Can you tell me why Isaiah 9:6 described the Messaiah as the Everlasting Father, the Almighty God?

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7 Of the greatness of his government and peace there will be no end."

Or tell me why 1Timothy 2:16 refers to the same Son spoken of by Isaiah as God manifest in the flesh?

"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory."

O boy go and do your research and then answer this questions:

Did Jesus, the apostle and the early church believed or taught the trinity doctrine?
No!
Why they didn't why should we believe it today?
We shouldn't because Jesus and the apostles who were evidently baptized with the holy spirit didn't say anything about any trinity.
What is their understanding about the person of God?

Jesus and the apostles taught that the one true God is the Father.
John 17:3, 1 Cor 8:5,6, John 20:17, Acts 2:36.

Jesus never said he's the same person with the Father rather he's working with the Father in perfect unity.
The Bible clearly show distinctions between Jesus and his Father.
You can read 1 Corinthians 15:24-28

Jesus came to do the Father's will. Go and compare that verse with other other translations. God who's the Father didn't come in the flesh. Rather he sent Jesus who's God's unique (begotten) son and Jesus left his glory and miraculously because human.

After Jesus finished his mission on earth, he was exalted to the right hand of God. He was promoted.

How could Jesus be coequal or co powerful with God?
Jesus got everything from his Father and he will never claim equality with God.
1 Corinthians 11:3

Aemmyjah:
How can [b]tri[/b]nity be singular?
Na wa o
Chelsea football team is also He na? Are they not driven to serve 1 purpose?

Ọmọ I can only thank Jehovah God for making things clear to me through his people

Maynman:
Existence is by itself.
Which "established facts" have you provided?
Have I quoted big bang here? You are the one doing the comparison to make you feel better about your beliefs.

You are contradicting yourself, is your god lifeless?

There is nothing like existence is by itself. Is existence an intelligent being?

Lol just stick to your "chance" assumption theory lol.

Bossdave:
No wonder!!

In 2001, I was in a gathering where I was supposed to minister. A woman who was a convert from JW mounted the podium before me to address
the congregation. The first words that came out of her mouth was 'You know we worship three Gods...' After she dropped the mic, it was my turn to minister, and the first thing I did was to correct that errorneous declaration. I now understand why she spoke that way. That was the lie they told them when they were in those kingdom halls.

The Trinity is a 'He' and not a 'They'. To this, all Christians worldwide agree. There's no disputation about that. We serve only one God. Not 3. Please stop the blasphemy and the falsehood.

I understand that when a man leaves his parents and join to his wife, they become one. But does that mean that they've turned to the same person?

There's nothing like Trinity in the Bible. Jesus, his apostles and early church never believed nor taught the dogma.
They believed that the Father (Yahweh) is the one true God and Jesus is his son whom he sent.
John 17:3, 1 Cor 8:5,6, John 20:17. Acts 2:36.

Jesus and Father are one just like the way an husband and wife are one. They are in perfect unity. John 10:30, 17:21,22

Maynman:
Universe means everything that exist, and lik you said it is eternal.

I got it from established fact, where are you getting where donkey and snakes are talking? Jewish books abi, jewish slave , sounds right

So what caused the universe to exist?

Kindly present the "established fact" here let everyone see it.

Have I quoted any book here? I'm only showing you logically that the universe could never have started by chance. Life couldn't have started by chance lol.

Present your proof here. I'm waiting.

Maynman:
You are just using human imaginations for your god, I am sure if you had tails, this your God will have a "higher tail".

Did he create his own intelligence, or it was here all along too?

What you mean "here all along"
Who created the "here"

What I meant is that he's eternal. And he is the beginning and source of the universe and life on earth.

Where did you get everything you have been saying from? Animal imagination abi lol
That's even correct self fish imagination

My argument still remain that the wonderful universe and the beautifully designed and complex life could never have happened by chance but were logically the product of an higher being's intelligence and craftsmanship.

Chance doesn't work in reality and even in science. Everything has to be planned carefully according to the procedures or else the results would be failure.

Maynman:
But a being that's higher, that's concious, that's intelligent just appeared lol

He didn't appear. He's here all along. Rather he made the universe to appear. He's the mastermind behind the universe itself.
Everything you see is his creation.

Maynman:
Is your israelite god not part of everything?
Did he create his own intelligence?

See this is not about some Israelite god.
We are doing some logical reasoning here.

How come the universe happened by chance or by accident? Boom 💥 it appeared and started working, there's balance, stability and perfection as if it was programmed lol...the earth found itself in it axis by chance lol and another explosion occured boom 💥 then life emerged from the explosion lol.
My brain, DNA, neurons, hands, heart, liver, kidney, gen.italia, skin and everything I'm composed of appeared by chance lol...it wasn't designed by any person.

Oya make ona mention anything wey don evolve or appear since the emergence of science. Just one thing o

I'll never be gullible in this life and the next

Maynman:
You said nothing, don't be a dummy.
Did your god create you from nothing?

But your creator intelligence came by chance?
An intelligence that created the world just appeared but your dull tiny brain that requires less can't come by chance

The creator didn't just appear, rather he started everything
Do you understand now?

Maynman:
He just appeared by chance with reason and a mind, he didn't create reasoning and intelligence then right 😂

There was never a "time universe didn't exist.

Those are your words not mine.

The creator of the universe can never be part of his creation. Use your head.
He's intelligent and conscious, that's why he was able to create a balanced universe and complex life.

My intelligence and life didn't come by chance. It has to come from a conscious and an intelligent entity.

There's no way a balanced universe and complex life could have come by chance from a bigbang explosion or whatever assumptions you guys believe without verifiable evidence.
If any bigbang happened, the results would have been chaos and instability and imbalance.

Maynman:
Where is he coming from, remember you said nothing comes by chance.

For something to be called "higher" that
Means you are comparing him with others, who created the other high beings?

He didn't come from anywhere. He's timeless. He reasoned, planned and started the universe. He started life on earth.
The comparison was between the higher being and humans.
There are definitely other higher beings but the supreme creator is the source of them all.

Maynman:
But a higher being with intelligence came by chance?

Nah. The higher being started the universe. Nothing came by chance and he didn't come by chance.

Maynman:
Not even the maker of artworks too.

The artist and his artworks is just an illustration.
The universe is the product of the intelligence of an higher being. It's not logical to say it came by chance.

Maynman:
The artist just happened by chance?

Nope nothing came by chance not even his the artworks.

.

.

PoliteActivist:
Well, the military industrial complex is a VERY powerful lobby group, but they are neither the US people nor the US government. They are defense contractors who supply military weaponry and equipment - businesses whose sole motive is profit.
That profit is maximized when there are wars. It is they and only they who'd do anything to have the war continue!

Whether they were influenced by the military industrial complex or not, the US government intentionally fuelled the war. That's what I'm saying.
Zelensky could even have agreed to a peace treaty but he wanted to cut relation completely from Russia and depend on the US.

Maynman:
Universe means Existence, what caused Existence?

The artist just happened by chance?

Baba go sleep.

PoliteActivist:
You have gone off on a tangent again. You ought be asking yourself what you'er driving at.
We're discussing applicability of your statement, "US doesn't want the war to end", and you're all over the place.
One way the statement would apply is if you modify it to: "US military industrial complex doesn't want the war to end" - for obvious reasons: they're making a killing from it!

Lol so the defence industries and US military can decide to involve in the war without the consent of the Congress and Biden? So how would they make a killing from it if the government didn't fund it?

So I wasn't wrong when I said the US government doesn't (didn't) want the war to end. I'm not really sure if they want it to stop now.

I think they have spent to much with little or no result lol

Maynman:
Universe means Existence, everything that exists.
That means there was a time your god was not existing, and he came by chance?

How do you know non Existence without Existence?
They imply each other.

The universe is the sum of everything existing. So what caused the universe to exist?

How you asked if my God wasn't existing at a time and came by chance is so dumb.

If the supposed creator of the universe wasn't existing at some point and then boom he appeared by chance, that wouldn't answer any questions or prove that he created the universe. If he came by chance, the universe and everything might have come by chance too.

But we are talking about an intelligent being that wonderfully held everything together in perfection and balance. The creator of the universe obviously can never be part of his creation. He was outside it just like an artist is outside his artworks.

For example, an artist can never be part of his arts. His artworks are products of his talent and intelligence and reasoning. When you look at the beautiful arts, you can only think about the talented person that made them.

PoliteActivist:
Whether you care or not, the statement "US doesn't want the war to end" is untrue.
Even if you modify your statement to: "US GOVT doesn't want the war to end", it'd still not apply/ be untrue!

Yeah you're right, they are probably regretting their actions now or not but I think they have failed the Ukrainians. Did they even care for Ukraine in the first place lol? All they wanted was to bleed Russia with whatever means they have. How on earth would they think Ukraine could defeat Russia

You think funding Ukraine and supplying them with weapons is what it means to stop the war?
This is like a war for dominance and world superpower.

Like I asked you earlier what are you driving at?

Maynman:
Existence and Non Existence go together, define "create", then tell us what your isrealite god created 😉

Whether the universe came by chance or was created by God, there was time it was absolutely non existent.
"Non existence" is not an entity itself but describes the time when an entity was not existing.

So to create means to bring into existence.

"Did non existence come by chance"? Is that a reasonable question to ask?

The fact is that, the universe was not existing, then at some point something caused it to be brought into existence.

Maynman:
Define "create".

Bye

Maynman:
Philosophy means love of wisdom.
Did non Existence came by chance?
What exactly did your call god "create"?

Define non existence

Maynman:
What's a person?
Person means mask, the mask you wear outside to portray a particular personality.
Alan watts once said, "how to be genuine person means how to be a genuine fake".
You have a personality, you are not it.

Did all these your philosophies come by chance?
Or else show me evidence that everything you're saying is the truth.

Maynman:
How will you know Existence without non Existence?
Please look up definition of "create", what does it say?

You are just regurgitating "by chance" since.
You said it yourself that your god has no beginning, was your god not existing?
That means Existence does not have a beginning. Educate your mind.

Oh you mean existence is a person or an entity. Hope I got that by chance?