₦airaland Forum

tbaba1234: Not intended, I apologize.

accepted

[quote author=tpia@]My other post still applies, imo.

A man who sees nothing wrong in beating up his wife, will do so whenever he feels like it, it doesnt matter what excuse he gives.

So, even if the wife had washed his mother's clothes, he might have found another reason to still beat her up regardless.[/quote]But the only reason he did what he did is the thought that he is the alpha who can ask her to do anything. Not doing it means she should be punished. That is my point.

In whatever case that this is being applied, it is simply wrong and not only peculiar to the scenario I spoke about.

[quote author=tpia@]What if he didnt change at all but simply agreed to what you were saying because he was bent on marrying you?


Secondly, if you have a contract stating clear rules on what you'the wife'will not do, and thrn later, you change your mind and decide you will, in fact, do those things, can he refuse those things at that point?

Say he has gotten used to the things in question being done by others, or the servants in the home.[/quote]well, like I said earlier, the situation of things dictate what happens. no one can tell, yet.

Two people can agree to go against their words to each other.

tbaba1234:

The best men are those who are best to their wives. It is not supposed to be a dictatorship. The Quran also describes married couples as garments for each other.

If it is within her ability and it is not haram, then she should do it. She is not a robot and would certainly raise objections to things. The mothers of the believers (RA) were quite vocal at times. You still have to recognise that the man has some authority. If he is being oppressive then you can seek redress or a divorce.

ok..of course.

But sorry I have to say this. When you use the word you, it seems like it is directed at me.

I dont wish to have such a redress. So You can use words like, the person involved can seek redress.

[quote author=tpia@]Well, imo, if something works for a particular culture or religion, it doesnt really make sense to impose another way of doing things just because its different.

As long as its not harmful or illegal, then i guess its not really good to criticize.

For example, a young man who grew up never seeing his mother in the kitchen or doing household chores, would probably consider it strange if his wife insisted on cooking and cleaning.

Its all about perspective.[/quote]This is really it. That is why no one way is the right way.

kayword: Having gone through all These posts, what I av surmised is that it goes either way, part religion part culture (wit d culture part determined by our perceptions of how a home should be run).

Religion:- It is not compulsory for a woman except d husband insists

Culture:- The woman is supposed to take care of all those things. Inability to do this is seen as a kind of negligence of her primary duties.

Thus it really is going to be a back n forth thing since it is a reflection of our differing postures on this issue.

But all the same it has been as funful (dont knw if dat is correct tho) and illuminating as it could be.

My problem with people is when they take religion only when it suits them.

People can decide it is a cultural marriage or an Islamic one. It means the values they base their lives on and want to impart in their children would never have to clash.

The part of your previous question that I ddint answer is what happens when he chanfes.


well, I dont believe pple just change. I would have been changing as he changes too. or probably he changed cos I did or vice versa.

The situation of things would determine the reaction. Options are there in a Muslim marriage It is not a for better for worse. I dont believe in that.

tbaba1234: A woman has to obey her husband as long as he has not asked her to do haram.

and if he asks her to do things she is not capable of?

can she even challenge him or give reasons why she may not be able to do certain things he asks of?

[quote author=tpia@]another worst case scenario.

in this instance, the woman is already in the marriage, and moreso, seems she's not the only wife.

generally speaking, "opa tan fi na iyale", applies here.

if the man had been beating his other wives and considers it normal to do so, she cant expect to be treated differently.

besides, if his wives were expected to wash his mother's clothes, or do whatever other odd duties done in that household, could she have exempted herself, and on what grounds?

as per beating, someone who sees nothing wrong with it, will beat the wife for whatever reason, it doesnt really matter what excuse he gives and neither does it depend on religion.




i guess you are equating housework to slavery, like maybe a man considers the wife a slave, that should not be an automatic assumption because it depends on the individual.[/quote]In the case mentioned, She is the FIRSt wife and they have been married for many years. In fact she wasnt involved in the washing because younger wives(one is her husband's and the other another wife in the family) excused her.

My point was not about slavery at all. It just does not make sense that something that should not have to be her duty was a reason to get her beat up.

Even if she was not the first wife, that other wives were doing it doesnt mean she would have to. They would have met the husband under different circumstances and drawn up different contracts, if they were educated enough to draw one.

[quote author=tpia@]ok, you have to help me out here, i want to understand what you, as a muslim woman, consider ways of showing love in Islam.

first of all, i assume you're planning to get married to someone you love, or is love not a factor you will consider when you decide on a partner? Meaning i assume this context i'm referring to, is not an arranged marriage. etc.

for arranged marriages, are you expected to love your husband or simply obey him?

for marriages where you had a say in who you're going to marry, is love involved? If no, then what is? ie what are your duties as a wife? I googled some sites and found mention of the wife waking up her husband to pray and things like that.

If love is involved in your marriage, what ways do you show your husband this love?


Another scenario: let's say you found the perfect guy, he meets all your requirements and you his, and best of all, he nods like an agama lizard (pardon my language) at everything you say.

you: honey, i'm not into house chores and the like, i'm just here to help you be a better muslim.

him (nodding): ok sweetheart, You are my ideal woman, so fine and godly.

you: so, we have a deal?

him (nodding): of course! I love you nah.



So, you go ahead and get married, then later, one day, he wakes up and suddenly says "darling, you have to start cooking and cleaning, and yes, i know we have a maid. What say you?"

what happens next? [/quote]My reply isn't late, I guess


I believe Love is an important pre requisite for marriage. Without falling, no marriage. And this is my thought.

To some others, an arranged marriage is ok. and I have heard this from a very pretty girl, that I was surprised.

Whatever the case maybe, everyone is hopeful that there is love in the marriage.

In Islam, I have not heard of any ruling about how to love your husband or wife. What is usually stressed are the requirements for the wedding and the duties in the marriage.

The duties are mentioned. Husband provides and protects. Wife guards her chastity and guards his property. Every other thing apart from these are secondary.

Oops! I am not divulging my potential romanticity on here!!!. I can show love in a million of ways. The people I love already, I know I do everything it takes to make sure they are fine and happy. Guess that's how its gonna be for someone I love enough to marry.

Nods at everything I say? Well if everything I say is tested and trusted. A reasonable.person would have to agree with them. Once we agree on the things that we want and want to do, Fine. we have a deal. we are cool. there is no question to it.

@Op
Dont you think it is wrong to spread info based on something you can not provide proof for?

How far could the reference be?

I was once interested in knowing this.

But not just to know how many of them exist but to ask of what they eat.

okpara ugo: Sista, notin dey happen.

Cake nah N50, that type wey dem wrap for white polythene... Mr biggs dey too far...

that is still something jare

[quote author=United_abby]Ehn!!na wetin una sabi be dat na...chopin n chopin alone!is dat all dat concerns you?[/quote]wetin I talk wetin u reply?

I dont see the need for a celebration but if anyone brings independence cake to me, I will eat.


so, you all, how is it going at your end.

ShehuAba: Alhamdulillah 'ala Ni'matil Islam.
We muslims really have to be grateful to Allah for been one, because it's Islam that actually touched all aspects of human life which made it possible for us to discuss all we could thus far.
My prayer for us all is to be among those that will listen to words of Allah and be able to follow it.

OH ALLAH MAKE IT EASY FOR US TO SEE THE TRUTH(GOOD) AND FOLLOW IT. AND MAKE IT EASY FOR US TO IDENTIFY FALSEHOOD(BAD) AND MOVE FAR AWAY FROM IT.
Ameen

amin


tpia, make I answer u tomorrow..e don pass my bedtime..

onegig: You can do it.. Its easy. Just the determination is what you need. Programming is basically about instructing computers on a specific task and the main thing here is learning the symantics and syntax of this language. There are various languages for talking to a computer e.g java, c++ and a host of others.. How proficient you are is determined by how good you can combine the various words and keywords to form things that have meaning to a computer. ..which in essence is like learning a new language from scratch and making use of that language to communicate.

sounds simple

some people use Islam when it suits them and bring in culture when that is what suits them.

God help everybody.

onegig: programming? Interesting and very simple if you got the flair for arithmetic and problem solving. Used to be a small fan but now am more inclined to other aspects of computing. Are you interested in learning?

If I have time after my degree, that is what I'll spend it on i. sha Allah. I dislike the idea of not knowing what it entails. I have to fight the ignorance.

Sissie: This is exhausting. If you want your wife to do 100% chores, clean every hour and cook 5 course meal 3 times a day, fine, hand wash your cloth (even when you can afford to buy a washing machine), FINE, PERFECT, GOOD, FOR YOU. The thing is you can't convince someone like me it's compulsory, or their aren't other option SIMPLE.


We will keep going back and forth.

People who can't wash their clothes, talk more of a man's cloth should marry their type too.

That is the simple way out.

In my case sha o, a man I am marrying will have to understand my capability b4 hand and not assume he will ask me to do whatever he feels like.

A woman came to my mother and narrated the things her husband do. I couldn't close my mouth. He beat her because she did not join the other wives in washing his mother's clothes. You can imagine.

well, she was not there to gossip. she was hoping my mum would call the man and speak with him about 'forgiving her' or something like that.

some women don suffer

You did not answer any of my questions golpen.

But it looks like it does not matter since it has been said that the husband can command her to do whatever..she will have to do them, according to Islam.

Your personal opinion or mine don't matter.

tbaba1234: A woman has to obey her husband as long as he has not asked her to do haram.

Of course, this is not the first time I am hearing this.

He can ask her to do anything.. That sounds like she has no right whatsoever.

Sissie said something about marrying the one you can trust and submit to..sounds like a good thing. But if he changes or starts to act somehow, she'd either deal with it or find her way out.

[quote author=tpia@]Anyway, moving on.

Deols and sissie, what is your definition of love in these contexts:

1. Islamic

2. African

3. Western

4. Personally, if slightly different from any of the above.[/quote]I don't think what love connotes differ. it is a feeling that is not culturally determined. I believe you choose whom you love. But certain things about them are the catalyst. It could be their religion(Islam) or their dark skin (African/not) or their personality, intelligence...

tbaba to the rescue


but then you said she will have to do it if her husband asks her to. What is the proof for that.

I ask because it sounds like she gets to be at his beck and call. How much can he ask of her. what if he starts to ask for too much. can she decline?

Lilimax: Bismillahir Rahmanir Raheem.
I greet you all

salam alaykum.

You are welcome

Sissie: It's important to note that cooking, cleaning and doing chores are acts that would fetch a woman reward, highly recommended and has lots of positive effect but does that make it COMPULSORY for a woman? NO. Is that her primary duties? Her duties is for her to guide her chastity, satisfy her husband sexual needs, protect his property and submit to him.

How do we judge her primary duties islamically?
Her duties are what is compulsory on her, if she doesn't do them it's a sin. If a woman do the whole house chores and deny you your urges, does not respect you, or protect your property, she has neglected her primary duties. If a woman employ a maid, nanny, cook is she commiting sin? No.

This maid thing is oveeflogged jare, maid for some people is a very good idea, it's a neccesity. In the north I know lots of women who don't cook for their husbands, I have friends who have never seen their mother in the kitchen cooking, who can't even imagine their mothers doing chores. Did those women commit sin for not cooking? Did their husbands marry their cooks? No.

Please I need someone to bring an hadith saying doing chores is compulsory or a woman's primary duty.

I know many northerners and having maids has not affected their marriages.

[quote author=tpia@]could still be done though. And cooking involves much more than tasting alone (although taste is important). Presentation, ease in the kitchen, style, etc can be evaluated.

for example, boiling an egg or making a salad isnt specific to one culture per se. Those are eaten anywhere. Grilling chicken, fish, etc also isnt specific to one culture or country.






no, the competition wasnt about women emancipation.



i doubt that was the intention, you might be reading them wrong and besides, werent you against the competition before?




the competition was mainly to address perceptions about women's head covering and also to encourage females muslims in their deen.






i was paraphrasing a quote from a christian source, it was referring to people being too caught up in what they consider spiritual things, and ignoring the basic stuff that still need to be done.

"don’t be so heavenly minded that you’re no earthly good" is the exact phrase.




i find onegig's question embarrassing, i'm too old to be asked that type of stuff. Lounloun.[/quote]loun loun!! I was thinking you would entertain us.

Okay..my idea of the competition may have been wrong and I don't support it, still.

[quote author=tpia@]not sure what your definition of "rave" is.

is he your hero because he obstinately refuses to listen to reason?[/quote]I thought rave of the moment is used to mean the happening thing.

He is a nairalander..dazall.

and on NL, there is always a rave of the moment. could even be a popular phrase like oga at the top or a new troll one like, end time things.

[quote author=tpia@]seriously, i didnt mention it before, but i did feel at the time, when i heard about that muslimah competition (even though most found it offensive and unIslamic), why things like cooking, homecare, etc, werent part of the skills being evaluated.

one can be heavenly minded but at the same time, you still have a physical presence, and i dont know if Islam encourages women to remain single? if not, then you cant just feel as long as you are facing spiritual stuff, other things dont matter.


just thinking out loud,[/quote]Judging their cookery would not have been easy since they are not from the same part of the world. It would also be against what they hope to achieve. They wanted to show woman emancipation. They wanted to show that women can be much more than domesticated beings. Asking about homecare would not go in line with their job of presenting Muslim women as beautiful and able to also have a pageant based on that.

I dont understand the reason for the second paragraph. I mean, in what context are you mentioning that. Marriage is half of religion. Many know that if not everyone sef.


and you have not answered the questions by onegig.