₦airaland Forum

You know there is a gang up but only denying.Its visible to the blind and audible to the deaf!

raumdeuter:
Before 1999, Yoruba did not get as much as VP, So was there a gangup against Yoruba pre 1999? A gangup of Hausas and Ibos?

The Serbians had this megalomaniac feeling and taking everybody for granted in Yugoslavia until enough was enough. Continue your gang up against Igbos, it's just a matter of time.

oyatz:
So if an Igboman is defeated in a Nigerian presidential election, it means the Igbos arey wanted in Nigieria and they will prefer to go to war again?

Is the desire to build a nation not enough reason? You are in a country of hatred and you call it politics? The only tribe that can build houses anywhere in Nigeria is the Igbos, others are afraid yet they pretend all is well. A yoruba man cannot build his house in the north even with the so called alliances because there is potential of conflicts. Is this how a nation should be?

oyatz:
You are right bro, 1999 can be repeated for the Igbos but that will depend greatly on the politics played by the Igbos.

This your posture would have been believable if yoruba elders did not go to meet Bubu to warn key Northerners from contesting. No one is fooled here

oyatz:
El-Rufai and Kwankwanso are free to contest but that doesn't mean they must win or Tinubu, Amaechi, Fashola, Umahi or Osinbajo should not contest.

Even I myself will contest soon.

There is already a gang up but if this gang up persist then the Igbos will have no choice than to opt out. You can never win if the majority gang up against you in a democracy.

oyatz:
So if an Igboman is defeated in a Nigerian presidential election, it means the Igbos arey wanted in Nigieria and they will prefer to go to war again?

They deceived him that they will give him so he was hopeful. Remember Obj was in prison,
he had no money to prosecute a primary, he wasnt even eligible until a pardon was 'arranged'

Johans1991:
if they gave to OBJ free of charge then why did Ekwueme contested against him.

Our engagement has been civil and that's why I continued to engage. I will have to go now since its becoming uncivil. It has been a good engagement all the same.

0monnak0da:
How is that your problem?
If that happened what is wrong with that?
That is politics.
Yoruba are negotiating and scheming .
You are talking about war
You play your game and let others play theirs

Have your elders been silent? Has Ohanaeze been silent ?

Honestly you talk very childishly

It is their decision yet Yoruba elders went to meet Bubu to warn his people not to contest. Why cant you see the deceit and double standard here?

0monnak0da:
They will make their own decision

Who are you to strike deals on their behalf?

Did they consult you in 1999?

Why then are you threatening war

Fair enough for the Yorubas to contest against Igbos afterall, that's what the constitution says. But it's also fair game for the Hausa-Fulani to contest, again that's what the constitution says. Deal?

0monnak0da:
Targeted That makes plenty of sense. In your mind

So you can expect that the Yoruba will contest against Eboes whenever the opportunity arises simples

Now that I have convinced you that the PDP primary of 1999 was targeted at the Yorubas,then I can go further. The Igbos did not contest against GEJ an Ijaw man because they understood the Ijaws, just like the Igbos have been excluded so now that they have opportunity, let them maximize their turn. If it was an Edo man, the Igbos will do the same thing. Igbos will do the same for the Ighalas or Tiv or even Kanuri. That's why you hear Igbos always preach equity.

0monnak0da:
I am taking it that you have admitted that the presidency was zoned to the entire south in 1999.
My question was a follow through on 1999

I did not ask why Jonathan contested.

I asked why the Eboes did not contest against him but chose to contest against Obasanjo in 1999 and 2003

Clearly the Eboes believe that it was open to the entire South

You said we should focus on 1999 and now you're going to 2011 and 2015! Ekwueme contested because they deceived him but in the inner caucus meeting especially by the generals,
they already picked Obj. Obj had no money, they sponsored it. Obj was convicted, they got a pardon with the speed of light. Nobody is fooled here. Its was calculated for a Yoruba to emerge.
Obj had no personal contribution to his victory!

0monnak0da:
So The PDP zoned it to Yoruba but it was not open??

Why did Ekwueme contest?

Why did no Eboe contest against GEJ in 2011 and 2015

The PDP zoned it to Yorubas. They did not come out openly to do it but everybody knows it was an unspoken truth to compensate the June 12 saga.As a new party then, they cannot officially zone it to SW but they did it via understanding. You cannot change this fact. Obj was convicted of planning a coup by Abacha. To make Obj selection possible, they hurriedly gazzetted a pardon because they knew where they were going. That primaries was to fulfill all righteousness

0monnak0da:
That is derailing the thread

This thread is not to discuss fairness .


If you want to do that create a thread for that unless of course you admit the premise that in 1999 the PDP did not zone presidency to Yoruba but to the entire south
If you are admitting that then our work is done

I promise you if you create a thread to discuss the fairness of rotation etc I will join you but we cannot widen the discussion here ad infinitum

Let us focus on the key issue.

Many many people have repeated the falsehood that in 1999 the PDP zoned presidency to the Yoruba

Do you agree that this is not true??

If you feel you have real advantage, then scrap zoning in its entirety and let it become obvious that you have advantage when the whole Nigeria is in the fray

0monnak0da:
Let me quote you on this one

I raised several points but you dodge one. Why did Yoruba elders ask Bubu to tell his people not to contest knowing if the North contest, the seeming advantage the Yorubas have in the South is no match? Its deceitful to propose a system that unfairly swings power to you. If you feel you have advantage against others in the South then scrap the zoning and use your advantage. You and I know if they scrap zoning, Yorubas will find it extremely difficult to smell the presidency

0monnak0da:
You cannot get away with lies or half truths
BE SPECIFIC

What is this gentleman's agreement and where was it made

Who were the parties to it

The problem you folk have is dishonesty. Brazen bold faced dishonesty#

Please tell what would have happened if Goodluck Jonathan had won in 2015??

Did you not support him in 2011?

Was that part of the "agreement"?

If you want to beg or negotiate do so but do not test people's intelligence with bizarre lies

If there was an agreement in 1999 why did Ekwueme contest?

Why did he contest against the incumbent in 2003?
Do you think everyone else is an idiott?

The only agreement I know of in PDP is North South rotation and that is why Ekwueme contested

Now in 2019 The NC, NE and NW all contested.

Why was the NW not asked to abstain?

The gentleman agreement is rotation of presidency. If presidency swings btw NW and SW to the detriment of others, what's the point of zoning? You said the advantage Yorubas have is also concomitant to the Igbos advantage. But your logic is assuming trading or market ownership is zoned, where is the logic here. Yoruba elders went to meet Bubu that the North should not contest but it should be zoned to the South cos they know if North contest, the advantage they have in the South is no match.So you can see the deceit here. You want it to be zoned to where you have advantage and exclude people who have bigger advantage. Its either its zoned to the regions in turn or discarded, any other form of zoning is a fraud!

0monnak0da:
Eboes have "advantage" in trading
No one accuses them of "cheating" anyone.

Of course when Eboes talk about their trading prowess the stories are "beautiful" that is life.

No one has everything
Has anyone threatened war if Eboes do not allow them to come and takeover 50% of Honitcha market
Has anyone threatened war unless they are allowed to take over Ariaria market. ?
But Eboes control Alaba market . I am sure you have a "beautiful story" to explain why that is so. It is beautiful to you but might not be to others

Now you are threatening war if people do not vote for you.
We shall see

Your logic and thinking makes plenty of sense.........

TO YOU!!




Which gentleman's agreement exists between SW and SE??

You are looking for unnecessary argument

LegendHero:
Why not NC first before SE?

The SW have advantage and it's this advantage they are trying to use to cheat Igbos but what you are doing here is looking for a way to explain this potential cheating. That's the whole essence of the thread. To betray rotational gentleman agreement then justify it. Just like some Northerners are currently justifying ruling after Bubu by saying the entire South has ruled for 15yrs while the North has ruled for 9yrs
When people want to cheat, there are always beautiful reasons

0monnak0da:
You need to make up your mind

You mention Islam

Is Obasanjo a Muslim
Righteous indignation is not a strategy
Ranting is not a strategy

Fact is you have no strategy

Anyway you are derailing the thread

This thread is to examine the claim which you use as your underpinning argument as the case for an Igbo president

Is that claim true?

Is it true that PDP zoned the presidency to the Yorubas

Going by your bizarre logic so we can also say that PDP zoned it to the NW in 2019?

Your problem is that your argument is based on lies and half truths and cannot withstand any scrutiny.
When Obasanjo won was this done with any aggression or polemic directed at the Eboes.
Why can you not approach this in the spirit of democracy go and negotiate with the rest of Nigeria and see if that can help you defeat the Yoruba this time

We are operating the EKWUEME MODEL

which means we will contest . We the Yoruba will not step down. It is up to you to find a way to use your legendary smartness to achieve your objectives.
It is the same in business which you boast to be masters in . There is no affirmative action in trading.
Abokis are good at moving cattle of foot for hundreds of kilometres no rival
ditto for suya making ,selling dollars etc.
You are famous for many things from Mumbai to Johannesburg
no rival
So put your brains to work and develop a strategy because the Yoruba politicians are not joking about 2023

All I know is that there is no equity in swinging power btw NW and SW under any guise. After SE, it should go to NC or NE!

LegendHero:
Then you have to bring yourself down and stop demanding. You have to beg, strip yourself of any ego, and negotiate with the rest of the country.

You don’t have a bargaining power in this so stop doing like you have a choice. The Igbo presidency will be on the terms of other tribe and they will choose for you just like you guys chose OBJ against SW interest in 1999.

Obj did not negotiate, they just gave him due to the fallout from June 12. If Nigerians want integration as a nation, they have to accept that it's the turn of Igbos. You cant be swinging power btw hausas and Yorubas and expect national unity

raumdeuter:
Then Yorubas and Ibos will contest for the party ticket, Now go and use your negotiation to make Hausas vote for you like Obasanjo

The hausas voted for Yorubas at the primary because the intent was to make Yorubas emerge. They should do same for the Igbos or else!

raumdeuter:
That was because Yoruba candidates defeated other Southern candidates at the primaries.

Let Ibo candidates do the same

The current alignment btw SW and North is enabled largely by religion and I'm not being emotional here. It will take a lot to break this recent alignment because of the religious connotations. From 1960-1999, it was largely the North. Came 1999, a new order of zoning came and the other major players enjoyed their turn. When it got to the Igbos turn, beautiful reasons came how the Igbos are this and that! You don't trust them bla bla bla but insist on one Nigeria

0monnak0da:
I agree that there should be balance but all that talk of scheming people out is the case in life not just politics. In some sectors of trade the Eboes scheme other Nigerians out and that is playing to their "advantages" again the reasons are as you say "beautiful" Hausas are illiterate Ikwerres are lazy and so on
such is life.
Psychologist call this the fundamental attribution error.
When you win you are good when you lose it is because of a fundamental unfairness

In 1960 Zik was president and Balewa was Prime Minister while Awolowo and the AG were in opposition
Exactly the same scenario in 1965

In 1979 Shagari was President Ekwueme Vice President
Ezeoke Speaker HOR and again Awo and his UPN were in opposition
The same scenario in 1983

Let us not talk about your behaviour under GEJ

No one talked of being schemed out or sending the rain back to heaven and not letting it land on the ground in those times

I do not know how old you are but clearly you lack knowledge of our political history.
These things go around and you should learn patience and strategy not threats and tantrums
If anyone should have threatened war and all manner of catastrophe it should have been SW.
Now you are about to lose out on 2023 and it is as if the world will end.

If people want to scheme you out, there will always be beautiful reasons. But if you look at the wisdom behind zoning, you will know that it's not to swing power between SW and NW because of their undue advantage but to carry the major tribes along. When we do things, let's look at the intent and not excuses or reasons to make it unjustly favour us

0monnak0da:
They fielded the candidates that won
There was a competition
just like the World Cup final last year was two European Nations

Should we ask FIFA to do for Africa what it did for Europe in 2018?

The two major parties fielded only Yoruba presidential candidates! So this time the two major parties should field Igbo candidate! It's called equity

raumdeuter:
What was done for Yorubas? They allowed Yorubas and other Southern people to contest the tickets and Yoruba with their political smartness won

Same reason you did it for Yorubas. You said Igbos did not vote Northerners, I pointed it out and now you said they did not vote Bubu. So no Igbo person voted Bubu? Is it all Northerners that voted Bubu? Is it a must to vote Bubu? Now you see you're shifting the goal post when it got to Igbos turn!

QuotaSystem:
You voted Atiku (who certainly wasn't the northern favorite) out of hatred for Buhari and love for Obi. Nobody is fooled. Whatever northern goodwill you had before then was eroded with your post Jonathan anti-Buhari/anti-north antics.

Your last statement brings us back to square one. Why should we?

Digest it and Good night.

OK, so if you say the Igbos must contest then why zoning to South? Let every body contest according to the Constitution and whoever wins, win.

0monnak0da:
How were Yoruba "handed" the presidency

Please explain this to me slowly did we all fall asleep,get handed the presidency/pregnancy and not notice

Sorry bro that NEVER happened .
The Yoruba DEFEATED them .
If it were handed over then Ekwueme would not have contested.
Ekwueme then went down in history to contest against the inccumbent in 2003.
But the Eboes never contested against Jonathan.
So the question of TURN has to be put to vote just like with Ekwueme.
Let us call it the Ekwueme protocol or model
What about Kanuri don't they have a turn?

Did Igbos not vote Yaradua? Did Igbos not vote Tofa? Did Igbos not vote Atiku? Did Igbos not vote Shagari? Or are these not Northerners? You can see when people want to scheme you out, they will fabricate excuses. What Igbos are saying is that what was done for yorubas in 1999 should be done for igbos

QuotaSystem:
I also don't want to be ruled by who I don't want to be ruled by. If you want to rule, you will learn to stoop to conquer.

You cannot refuse to support the North and its candidate, insult the North, grandstand and refuse to make amends, yet expect support of the majority North with their votes

You will beg. You're already swallowing your vomit and stylishly begging APC for inclusion. Wake up and smell the coffee.

How did they defeat Ekwueme who was a founding member? Through Northern votes! The Northerners have used their population to ensure Igbos are defeated politically esp because Islam is not welcome in SE. It's all about religion. Same Northerners with ensure SW wins if they are in the ticket in 2023! So what's the point?

raumdeuter:
Yorubas were not handed the presidency, they won it by defeating Ekwueme at the primaries

You are talking of hypothetical situation that doesn't exist. Hausa has ruled! Yorubas were handed the presidency due to how Abiola was cheated in 1993. Everybody agrees it's the turn of Igbos but they insist Igbos must be punished forf 2015 and 2019 choices and if they are sober they will be considered afterwards. What clearer message to tell Igbos they are not wanted in this Nigerian project? If over 60% of the people say we know it's your turn but you must atone for your iniquities, why not move on? You are seeing presidential position while we are seeing common dislike. Our nature does not allow us to beg, so what next?
You are a reasonable person, put yourself in the Igbo man's shoe

0monnak0da:
What has that got to do with presidency?

I am sorry but the dialog is almost childish.
No one will give you the presidency.
All this talk of pass to me or I will take my ball home is pointless.

What if Alex Ekwueme had won the presidency what were Yoruba supposed to do burn the country?

You don't want the Igbos to participate unless they beg and at the same time you want them with you? I really don't understand! I don't like to be with who I don't like to be with! If Nigeria is a cohesive nation, how come everybody is certain that if Igbo leaves, everybody leaves?

QuotaSystem:
There are only two ways to leave Nigeria.

Diplomacy (which you clearly hate) or War (which you've already threatened but are incapable of).

Don't kid yourself. Its your call.

P. S - Nobody "subtly designed" Igbos out of the political process. You simply played yourselves out of relevance.

The Igbos will soon get an honourable peace! You cannot take a determined people for granted for too long!

0monnak0da:
You started the talk of war not me.
Balkanization would happen if ANYONE leaves whether Ibo, Ijaw , Ibibio,Itsekiri, Urhobo or Chibok. You are always unnecessarily emotional.
Leaving has nothing to do with presidency. No one will give you the presidency. If you work hard you will get it and to my mind you are looking at 16 years minimum.(with good behaviour)

All these threats to leave will count as bad behaviour adding to your tariff

What was done for Yorubas in 1999 must be repeated for Igbos in 2023! No excuse or scheming is acceptable! Period!

ProWalker:
How old were you in 1999 before we start about how 2 Yorubas ended up on the tickets.

Also tell me the names of those parties that fielded yorubas