₦airaland Forum

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I don't really know how to respond. I guess we differ a lot in how we view things. Btw, I have no problem with you worshiping Awo if you do so in the religious sense. It is your right. Just not something I'm into (and I mean this with no sarcasm or disrespect intended.)

Ystranger, I'm starting to think that I am misunderstanding your analogy. Surely you cannot mean "worship" in anything close to a religious sense. Because I've not ever met any of these sort of Yoruba in my life.

Great respect and admiration for, yes. But worship? There is a huge distance between the two, yes?

Ystranger:
Yes. The cat hasnt changed. There are very few FUNDAMENTAL ways to skin the cat. You can compromise on everything else, but you cannot compromise on  basic fundamental principles.

One needs to then ask if Tinubu has violated these basic principles. If you are alleging that he has, then point out how he has screwed up specifically so we can deal with it.

Maybe you should ask Tinubu that. The dressing, the glasses, the ACN logo, the many billboards with Tinubu's image juxtaposed with Awo's and Jawaharlal Nehru, amongst others. Did that remind you of anything? And, BTW, Awolowo admired and met with Jawaharlal Nehru so many times. But never in his lifetime became obsessed with him to the point of erecting billboards in strategic places, in the SW, of his image juxtaposed with Jawaharlal Nehru's.

And, yes, we dont care, and no one cares really. But trust me, TINUBU cares. But you may not know, and I will not take offence with such blatant ignorance. After all, we are all ignorant of one thing or the other.

Alright, Tinubu might care, but I don't.

Living in the past? In what sense? We spend too much time learning about our history? You think learning about our history is TIME NOT WELL SPENT? You do know that every university in your beloved country, USA, has a History department? Are you suggesting that the time spent on reading, researching and analyzing the past could be better spent doing something else? Sarah Palin and Paul Revere hoopla isnt romanticism to you?But we talking about Awolowo is "Living in the past and engaging in romanticism."  You do know that learning by itself, irrespective of discipline, is to some extent "LIVING IN THE PAST."

Right. But at some point it becomes a disease, when one expects that the solutions for the next problem will come from the past. History is a nice thing to learn, but to use it as the rubric to judge decisions by subsequent leaders doesn't necessarily make sense. Which to me seems to be what we are doing.

Or what is the point of judging politician X on whether he is an "Awoist" or not? I've never even been a fan of such blanket terminology. . . of what use is "Awoist" or not if we have to analyze policy decision Y? It make have turned out that Awo would have said "yes" in the 50s through 70s on Decision Y, but now the correct answer is "no."

What goals are we talking about here? This where I think you are confusing things. I am not sure what goals you are referring to here?

I think building a strong national party that leaves us less susceptible to power plays made by other groups is a good short-term (and long-term) political objective. I view it as a political goal to make strong alliances in other parts of the country with those we can work with. Especially in places like the MB and SS. I think it a worthy goal to greatly weaken the PDP. These to me seem to be very worthy tasks.

I view it as very important to grow the economy of the SW and increase the fraction of money generated through IGR in each of the states. I'm tired of being dependent on oil money from the SS. This seems to be a goal that the ACN shares, to some extent.

There are other matters, but these are just a few off the top of my head.

Who is talking about replacing Tinubu? I think you have things mixed up.

So what exactly is the point of this? It is meant as constructive criticism, or destructive one? My impression is that your goal is the latter rather than the former.

Why would anyone want to destroy Tinubu? What do you mean by we? Are you a card carrying member of ACN? And why do you think everyone here supports ACN? This has nothing to do with ACN? If Tinubu is an effective leader for ACN, well congrats to him. No one is out to bring him down. As a matter of fact, we wish him luck with his ambitions. And I am sure HID Awolowo, the[b] Yeye Oodua of Yorubaland[/b],and the rest of the Awo family, and real Awoists, want the best for him.

I'm not an ACN member, I just think that their interests and that of the SW largely overlap at this point in time.

Okay. You are mixing so many things together. I dont know how you manage to bring ACN into all of this? Quite impressive of you though. Tinubu and his lap dog, Omatseye, insulted HID Awolowo, and I think thats what this is all about, No? Is there something else here that I am oblivious to?

Alright, maybe I misunderstood. I thought this was about something more than just this spat between newspapers.

Heh, you and I are no sort of brothers, relations or relatives. Not even metaphorically.

Looks like there are strict regulations before one can say "made in America":

http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus03-complying-made-usa-standard

In any case, "assembled in Nigeria" is not a bad first step. Maybe one day we'll get to "manufactured in Nigeria."

manny4life:
Lol, I'm not saying what you're saying, I'm saying it's not 100% of the total parts of the cars manufactured by the BIG 3 is locally manufactured.

I think the lion's share is manufactured locally though. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Besides, why does everything has to be imported from China?

I don't think things have to be. Ideally nothing would be imported from China, and everything would be locally made. But practical considerations (mainly price) make this not that realistic for all items.

Eko Ile:
Obviously, all these silly attacks and spites against Tinubu serves only one purpose which is to take him down and drag us back, I think Yoruba people need to rally around Tinubu and not leave him exposed to outside forces trying to reverse our gains and advancement. We've sacrificed too many Yoruba leaders because of silly and petty rivalries and shortsightedness jealousy. 

It's really disgusting

+1

If you don't like Tinubu, hold him accountable and be a watchdog. Help to improve him, don't destroy him. Now if he later down the line goes power mad or uncontrollable, sure, then take him down. But I don't think he is at that point.

manny4life:
What does it matter? Thought there are difference between assembly and core manufacturer, success has a starting point. After all, the big three in Detroit, Michigan don't have 100% of their parts manufactured in he U.S., does that mean we should now say they assemble rather than manufacture?

I don't think it matters that much. Like I said, it is a good thing any way you look at it.

Regarding the US, I was under the impression that we still manufacture most of the value of a car here locally? Engines and such manufactured here? Or do we import from China and assemble too?

Of what relevance is whether Awo would be buddy buddy with Tinubu or not today?  Is Awo Jesus Christ?

Do you all worship the man, or something? So there is no one who will ever be effective in Yorubaland now or for the next 1000 years, unless they align exactly with what Awo said or believed in? There is only one way to skin the Nigerian cat, and this is copying Awolowo blindly?  

Are the challenges of the 50s and 60s EXACTLY what we face today?

Who cares whether the Awoists are close to Tinubu or not?

We spend too much time living in the past and engaging in romanticism.

Are Tinubu and the ACN an effective way to achieve certain goals, yes or no? If no, what would you like to replace them with? If you want to destroy a very effective tool that we have, then kindly suggest something better to replace it with.

Otoh, if you like me think that the current tool has value, should be kept and improved rather then discarded, then suggest concrete ways to do this.

Hehe. It is just marketing. . . sounds better to say "Car Manufacturer" rather than "Car Assembler."

But yeah, looks like they are an assembler of Chinese vehicles made by this Wuling Auto rather than a manufacturer. In any case, still a good thing.

Skimming through this woman's book, Nnewi sounds like a very interesting place.

Heh, I'm actually going to buy this book by this woman. Looks like it'll be a good read.

^-- It looks like they try to make the plastics inside the car locally. But core pieces like engines? I doubt that is possible in Nigeria at this point, without a viable steel industry and no electricity.

They are to be commended though. Even if only 10% of the car is produced from local materials, this is better than nothing.

@Tineemeka: Really?   What exactly is manufactured by Innoson?

I looked into the matter some months ago and it looked like local assembly of knock down kits from China, not actual manufacturing.

See this for example:

The new factory will assemble up to 100 vehicles a day, using about 30% local content at start of operations, which will be scaled up to the world average of 60% local content as the operation builds. The remainder content will be sourced as CKD (completely knocked down) parts imported from China's Wuling Auto.

http://www.star1960.com/business-professionals/automaker-innoson-to-boost-local-economy-with-nigerian-car-factory/

Or page 208 of this book on google docs:
https://i52.tinypic.com/14e71ur.png
http://books.google.com/books?id=2rl5QF39S6cC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false

To be clear, there is nothing wrong with local assembly. But it isn't local manufacturing.

It is what it is. Maybe for some of you you are looking for your next Awolowo or whatever.

Me, I am not looking for any new "god". . . just a guy who can accomplish certain political goals. Nothing more, nothing less.

I think we romanticize stuff too much in the SW. . . "Asiwaju of Yorubaland", all that stuff.

We need to accomplish tasks X, Y and Z over the next 4-8 years. Tinubu and the ACN look like the best means for achieving those goals over that time frame. All this other romantic stuff, I could care less about.

If anyone has a better alternative to Tinubu, I'm all ears. But so far I've not heard anyone offer anything useful.

Anyway, even if he did drugs in Chicago, who gives a damn?

Or is everyone here claiming they have never in their lives done anything illegal before? Never smoked marijuana? Never consumed alcohol while underage?

Let he who is without sin be the first to cast the stone.

For all we know, Tinubu was an armed robber and a r.apist while in Chicago. But given that he was never CONVICTED of any of these crimes, no man can say he is guilty of these crimes.

jerseyboy:
Question: Is Tinubu a fellon?

Nothing there says he was convicted of a felony. On what date was he convicted of a felony, if Tinubu is in fact a felon?

Ystranger:
Malighn ke? To say unpleasant things about someone or something, usually unfairly

Point to one thing that the Tribune has said that is untrue? TInubu lied about his background, No? Tinubu claimed to have gone to GCI, No? Tinubu did drugs in Chicago, No? Tinubu uses Area Boys to harass his opponents, No? Tinubu sent his thugs to beat Gani Fawehinmi, No? What has Tribune said about Tinubu that is not public knowledge? He has two Date of Births, How come?

How on earth do you know he "did drugs in Chicago?" What evidence is there of this? He may have laundered drug money. . . this is what he was accused of, which was never definitively proven. But to even go from there to saying that he sold drugs personally is a big thing. And to go from selling to consuming is also another big step.

Or did anyone here on Nairaland do drugs with Tinubu in Chicago? If so, make yourself known.

My own hope is that GEJ shrinks the power of the FG massively over the next few years. This new revenue formula is a good start towards that goal.

That way when power reverts to the north in 2015, there is less room for them to screw things up

I don't understand this habit of falsely calling people felons. If that happened here, you could get sued for libel/slander/defamation or something.

Tinubu probably is not a "b@stard" either.

In general, Nigerian media is pretty uncouth, I must say.