₦airaland Forum

raumdeuter:
Before Mata met Mourinho in Chelsea he was a world class midfielder and on the level of Silva

Mata has never reached the level of Silva. Silva - Fabregas - Carzola were all ahead of Mata in the national team

eph12:
Did you also consider the players that those guys you listed played with? Evra played with Ronaldo and Giggs ahead of him. Who is manning that wing with Val? Is Walker playing that full wing all by himself?

Valencia is trying. What have we done on the right side without him?

patrickmuf:
Mentioning Kompany is akin to someone saying Dortmund's attack is world class because of Aubameyang and a certain Marco Reus who is always injured.
Sterling isn't a world class player, you're only listing him cos of his form this season.
On the other hand, Mata over 38 games in a season might not outplay Silva but he'll definitely contribute more to goals and assist. Our style of play is stifling our players. Mata and Martial and a host of others in our team will look top class playing in that City team.

Mata of 2012 or Mata of 2017?

Mata has never been a world class player. You keep saying Sterling is not world class. Sterling has been better than Mata since 2013/2014

patrickmuf:
Kompany? I'd take Smalling/Jones over him for that fact Smalling is guaranteed to play more.
Valencia for all his shortcomings is as good as any RB in the league especially as it has to do with defending, I'm sure if he played under Pep his attacking contribution will double.
De Gea is world class just as De Bruyne.
Mata though not as good as Silva isn't a slush on his own, he can do just as well in the right system.

Sterling isn't world class no matter how you look at it, he is not better than Martial.
Stones is a Pep signing so it doesn't really matter.

Aguero is very good but from Pep's body language he doesn't fancy him...

So if we want to talk genuine quality and experience, you'd be listing;
Aguero
KDB
Silva
Fernandinho

And for us, you have:
De Gea
Valencia
Mata

Kompany, Jones, Martial, Sterling etc are all good but are hampered in one way or another, injuries, in experience,

Abeg remove Mata. Mata that can't get past a (wo)man. You also underrate the influence and experience of Kompany on the new defenders. Of only we had Vidic of his last years in EPL still guiding our defenders.

Stop belittling Sterling, none of our attacking players has reached his level he was at Liverpool. City was a Champions League semi final team with such players as Sterling, Aguero, Silva, De Bruyne, Kompany, Fernandinho as the core.

No matter how you look at it, only DDG and Valencia that can be used to compare. So two against six.

It is not by chance that Silva, Fabregas have been picked ahead of Mata in the Spanish team.

If I remember well, even Carzola was ahead of Mata in selection. Herrera is even below Mata in the perking order.

And someone would come to tell me that Mata and Silva see in same category. They have never been.

patrickmuf:
We have De Gea, Valencia, Smalling, Jones, Young that's our back 5...There's Martial and Rashford who was just about the most highly rated youngster in the league. Mata, Fellaini, Shaw and Herrera on the bench

You could only mention defenders. While Jone Stone had been gathering experience in the past few years, Jones, Young and Smalling have been going to sick bed. Valencia is the only stable guy. Jones is having his first season as a real centre back defender. Stop adding Shaw abeg. Someone who has been out for two years.

Mata, Herrera and Fellaini are average players. None is up to Silva. Another quality player Pep inherited.

It means Pep inherited :

Silva
Aguero
De Bruyne
Sterling
Fernadinho
Kompany

They are still the bedrock of the team. Today we talk about Pogba as the bedrock of our team. A player brought in by Mourinho. Only two players I can say have quality+experience as the six City players above, DDG and Valencia.

IFearGod:
Alright, that's fine. Let's just hope it happens. I think we are still in a good shape. Meanwhile, we should be more concerned about not dropping more points for others to overtake us. Hoping to overtake City now has become a tall order.

We cannot over take City. If we finish 8-12 points behind them at the end, it would be respectful.

codedguy1:
Seems you did not understand what I wrote.

you gave implied or excuses of some of our players not being available and that was why we are where we are now and my reply was a question ( sorry I did not put a question mark after that sentence) do you think we would be toe to toe with city if all our players were fit?

The brand we play is annoying and Mourinho is the cause simple.

we are not saying Mourinho must win every season as a man u coach, even Fergie didn't do that but if the brand we play is not changed to one that emphasises on attack even if there is a defensive masterclass to it we would not win the league in nearest future.

And again no matter how improved we get if another team is better, any team for that matter, then we will always play 2nd fiddle.

If not for the injuries and suspension, we would be 5-7 points behind only.

patrickmuf:
This whole talk of City investing in their team for a long time doesn't cut it, it really has no correlation with where they are now or the quality of football they're playing...
If you like, compare between City and United who have payers in the team that have been there over the past 6-7 years and you'll see it's almost same number or we have more...A host of the present City team was bought by Pep, he knows the brand of football he wants to play and recruits players who can implement his ideas.

Players inherited by Pep: Aguero, De Bruyne, Sterling, Kompany, Fernandinho helped their team to finish in Champions League semi final.

You talk about Martial who went on goal drought and was pushed to the wing by Gaal. We were talking about how much his game dropped while Gaal was here. That Martial was very predictable. We talk about the teenage Rashford. At some point Carrick was our best player.

Help me to understand which players we had that were of same quality and experience with Aguero, Fernadinho, Sterling, De Bruyne, Kompany

Adisaowalla:
Those players they spent money on - how many of them are still at the club, let alone contributing to their currrent success as we speak?

There was a gradual upgrading of players over the years such that their best of the best were available to serve as a bedrock to the current team. Aguero, Kompany, Sterling, Fernadinho, De Bruyne are enough to build a new world beating team. Their best survived to the new era.

People always say Sterling was not very good. No United attacking player ( Martial, Lingard, Rashford, Mkhitaryan) has yet reached the level of Sterling at Liverpool. Sterling at Liverpool would beat his marker over 80% of the time with ease, unlike Martial and Rashford who appear sometimes to be doing try your luck. It is hard to predict which direction Sterling would go and he is dangerous going both ways. If Martial is not going behind the defence line, he is not dangerous.

IFearGod:
That's true but he doesn't need to complain all the time. He's professional enough to know that it wouldn't be possibbe to have his best 11 available throughout the season. It's practically not possible. What I'm emphasizing is that his tactics did more damage than good for the team but he wouldn't want to accept that fact and that's really bad. C'est fini!

Nobody thought City would win almost all matches. Remember just before the transfer window ended, having seen United were winning 4-0, Guardiola rushed to buy more players to strengthen his team. He is mostly lucky the players perfectly fit in.

On our side, we didn't envisage situations where Herrera would not be able to play the kind of football he played last season in case of injury. We felt Rojo and Ibrahimovic would add to the dept of the team. We were wrong, Rojo comes slowly from injury while Ibrahimovic is finished. We thought Lindelof was another Bunocci, but he was a liability in his first few matches.

Things will be fine. We are going to close the gap between our game and City's, and then think of how to overtake them.

codedguy1:
you keep looking for excuses for Mourinho. what is all this nonsense about him missing players that's why he lost games he was supposed to win.

so you are yelling me that if all our players were fit we would be toe to toe with city even with Mourinho s brand of football.

Yes losing players can affect the team but the truth is mourinhos brand of football where he places so much emphasis on defending is what has affected the psychology of the the players coupled with playing players out of position.

And Mourinho should stop talking nonsense. what does he mean by replacing carrick with one player and improving the team with a second signing. so does he mean that the carrick replacement cannot also improve the team?

Am just asking?

You cannot be at same level with a team that has won 19, drew 1 and lost nil.

Manchester City are playing the football of their life. Admit they are better and get over it. Even if you bring Zidane or another Guardiola to manage United, we wont be at City's level. Their success has been coming, now it has arrived. But they can't remain at the level for too long.

The truth be told, there was a time Ferguson failed to invest in this team. Scholes, Giggs, Carrick, Ferdinand, Vidic were calling for replacement, but nothing happened. Ronaldo and Tevez left, who did we bring? Valencia. Then Berbatov lost form two seasons after.

Many will point to our success of 2012/2013. But that season Bilbao made us look ordinary, and we were inferior on the field of play to Chelsea as many times we played them. Even in the match they played nine men against us. City, Tottenham and Everton were better than us. We won most matches by single goal, mostly late winners. During same period, City kept spending and you think those money spent wouldn't have a future impact?

IFearGod:
That's one of the annoying part of Mourinho; he talks too much ending up saying BS. What concerned him with others? why giving so much attention to their model thereby losing focus to pilot his own? Why bringing up all these BSs when you are 15points behind and not at the beginning of the season?

Did our loss at Huddersfield and draws with Burnley, Leicester, and Stoke come only as a result of lackadaisical attitude of players? Chai! He hasn't still figured out his problem or just being stubborn to accept the fact that 'attack is the best form of defense'.

This guy is just freaking not competent enough. He has lost his confidence. This is just the highest form cowardice! Giving flimsy excuses when he should have accepted the fact that he has failed the club. All these BSs would generate tension between him and the club thereby creating more enemies for himself.

When you lose two players like Bailly and Pogba at same time, it can affect your team. Fellaini is another Mourinho's game changer, he got injured when he was playing his best football in the red colour.

PietroRico:
Elampiro I feel you and all. but you are making unusually high amounts of errors today, are you high af too?

Lol, no mind me. I am not too bothered about accuracy, but the message I want to pass across.

raumdeuter:
What is this Mourinho plan other than to spend more money?

You are now sounding like a hater. How will people take your analysis serious again? You see everything as Guardiola vs Mourinho

Mourinho has his brand of football, he can buy players to fit in. Bailly, Valencia are typical Mourinho type of players. We might add Jones and Matic. We have to observe Luke Shaw too.

CapitalCee:
Even the much fabled fergie team where very good. The backline of Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra and G.Neville is far far better any one in the league today. Then there is a midfield of Carrick, J.S Park ,Giggs and Scholes with Ronaldo, Rooney and Tevez in Attack. If fergie had average players he will still struggle as he did sometimes that fans where even calling for his sack.

I think there is this panic right now about the great success of the City team. I actually think everything has its time and season. We should not out of panic go to buy players £150m that fans will start insulting if they enter ghost mood in matches. Mourinho should stick to his plans and buy players that can play his football. But the right wing should be given priority.

Strong players are still good if they can be found, look at Bailly. If he were around, I am sure we would be more stable playing from the back. Would Bailly fall like the way Rojo fell against Burnley?

Another thing is United has a separate transfer window. Which makes it hard for Woodward to buy players identified by the manager. If Mourinho had said, get me "Gabriel Jesus", the transfer price of Gabriel Jesus automatically becomes £100m

Nihilist:
I personally believe that Mourinho might have lost his touch. I suspect that this job might be his penultimate big job in club football.

I used to disagree a lot with nateevs when he used to disparage the man, because when you look at his history, you will find record breaking attacking football in his catalogue.

Jose wouls usually play expansive football up to a point, bookended by games of mors pragmatic football.

Today as i was driving, i heard on radio that mourinho was worried that Lukaku has been working out too much in the gym and has put on a fair bit of muscle...which may have led to him losing some pace.

Sometime during the last decade, the pace of the game has changed a lot. The big bruisers of the yesteryear are gone. You cant see anybody with roberto carlos type of thighs anymore. You cant see defenders that look like micah richards or oguchi onyewu anymore.

The players have shed that muscle and become lighter, faster...even shorter.

.The physique has changed greatly and many of these footballers could very easily be long distance runners. Kante and Firmino easily come to mind. If you look at Leroy sane's body shape too, the guy literally moves like a ballet dancer. I remember watching him doing his stretches and warm up at Wembley last season ahead of the FA cup semifinal and the guy literally moved like a cat.

Mourinho traditionally has always trusted in big strong burly lads. From Drogba to Essien to Matic and Lukaku, powerful men have always been central to his game plan.

This season alone, i read somewhere that Jose already has the tallest squad in the league.

Well what if, a game plan that is so dependent on height, mass and power cannot compete with opponents who are smaller, faster, more agile and boast more stamina?

What if the same bus tactics that used to work so well is failing because top level opponebts can simply run rings around Mourinhos giants?

What if the likes of Lukaku are really piling on the muscle and now struggling to cover distance quickly?

I dont know the answers to these questions...plus im high as fück!

Good article here.

But football change. There are a times a team with small players dominate, some other time it just shift. If it were possible to bring back Mourinho's Chelsea team of 2005/2006, they would still dominate today and give no single room for opposition to threaten. There are big players with quality. Lukaku doesn’t have Drogba's match winning quality. Lukaku is not even as strong and balance as Drogba.

Michael Essien at his peak would qualify for an Olympic sprinter, unlike Matic who plays in the speed of a snail. Essien was very agile too and could go into a quick sliding tackle. He could also play a center defence like it was its natural position. Remember when Ghana beat Nigeria with their centre defender sent off, and Essien had to fill in and became MOTM. Lampard had goal scoring sense from outside the box,unlike Mata, Lingard and Mkhitaryan. He won some matches with late goals from long range shots. Ballack was a tough guy. Terry was one of the best the world. Same with Cole.

The weakly in the that team were Joe Cole who if around today may be like Lingard.

I think sometimes, a coach just assembles a winning team able to play his style. That was what happened when Senegal were solid in 2002, very tall, strong and quick players. In 1992-1993, Ivory Coast had these small players with quick movement, but our Super Eagles with giant players find a way to dominate them by surrendering the midfield to the Ivorians while using speed, long passes to finish them.

hardeycute:
Sterling is benefitting from a good team set up like the one he enjoyed with Suarez,Sturridge and Coutinho under Brendan Rodgers before his transfer to City.
Player tendency to improve is related to Coach's tactics and the player desire to justify his selection in the team.Increase in his numbers is due to a system that has favoured him.

Wow!

I didn't know you already responded with same answer.

raumdeuter:
The Sterling after he met Pep or the one before Pep?

Apart from goals, Sterling was this good while at Liverpool. When he played with Suarez and Sturridge.

joeace2020:
Is it not funny how supposed fans lap up what United haters say about Mourinho. All of a sudden Mourinho turns everybody to defenders but people have easily forgotten his Madrid and Chelsea First stint team. SMH!

No mind them. I don't have their time. They want to turn Manchester United to Liverpool where coaches are changed every two years and they keep starting from scratch.

I am done with them.

odizeey:
just d way everyone knew walcot, ihenacho,. The difference between martial and mbappe at their discovery is good publicity.

I saw Mbappe destroying fullbacks in Champions League matches. Who knew Iheanacho, Walcot and Martial? Martial only played in UCL play off (I think).

CapitalCee:
All these to justify the mourinho out crusade, Abeg make dem sack mourinho jare make we hear word

They wont even sack him. Waste of time.

LoRdCaT:
So you are saying the players we have are not good enough?

What have they achieved since SAF left? Struggling to finish 5th under three managers. Is that good enough?

LoRdCaT:
Which team in this world has a complete 11 of world class players?

Were in that article did I say a club has to have eleven world class players?

odizeey:
mbappe mbappe mbappe, wetyn sef, martial no reach, no be una dey useless am. Abeg lets move on.

Who was Martial before we bought him? He was an unknown kid. When we bought him, we had to look for youtube video of him to even know how he plays. Even Rooney asked Schneiderlin "who is Anthony Martial?" He scored a few beautiful goals in two months and regressed badly under Gaal.

Mbappe on the other hand was well known before PSG bought him

Leyqute:
See story.

So Mourinho should buy Neymar and turn him into a left back abi?

Let us buy him first.

Why did Mourinho not turn Ronaldo, Di Maria, Ozil and Benzema to left back?

The players you have sometimes determine the style you play.

raumdeuter:
How many players in the EPL have been bought for 150M? Do you know that the 2 most expensive players in the EPL play for Mourinho and were bought by him?

Despite this, he has been outspent by Guardiola.

SIRcumalot:
Those two guys suppose be Micki and pogba.

Mkhitaryan is not exactly that dribbler, or may be he is still adjusting to the new challenge. Mkhitaryan and Mata should fight for one position.

We need a dribbler who can cut in behind the defence line or tear it apart like Salah. Salah is still not a world class player, so someone even better.

Pogba cannot burst with top speed. We need one. We can play three in the middle against big teams. Matic, Pogba and another top midfielder. Someone who can do week in week out what Sissoko did in Euro 2016 final.

The third position we can work on, is playing a good ball control striker like Martial in some matches. It is not every time Lukaku plays 90 minutes and just wait there for perfect cross. Manchester City, Tottenham do not play the big striker, but the ones who can involve in build up.

PDPGuy:
This must be a big joke. If you can’t be in a title race despite spending £300 million, then you don’t deserve to coach one of the biggest teams in club football.

Not in today’s market where one player cost £150m. When last did Manchester United compete for the title?

I still believe Rojo is a good defender. He is one who takes time to hit form.

What we need is one very intelligent dribbler with close control and agility to join the attack. Someone who can play from the right and middle.

Then we need more midfielder. A very fast midfielder who can burst burst some yards with the ball. He also has to be clever in build up play.

Matic and Pogba will not be able to dominate a midfield with fast players, like Chelsea. Kante, Bakayoko would be deployed in a way they can use speed as a a weapon. Matic is strong on the ball but slow to release it in a quick decisive attacking move. We need a third person who can help play a 4-3-3. Or serve as an option in selection and tactics.

We may have to sometimes play without a point man. Sometimes, fluidity is needed instead of a point man whose lack of build up technique stifles attack and his positioning just invite crosses into the box. May be this was why Mourinho wanted Griezmann.