European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:55pm On Dec 16, 2017 |
Smellymouth: Now you know why Jose parked the bus. Open up like Spurs and you're dead..  No be e I dey tell them since last week? E don reach for this thread wey people go just dey say "sir" "sir" "sir", when I dey analyse ball because I know ball. I know ball well, well. Our tactics was very okay, we didn’t just sit back, we still went forward. A far better approach than the Liverpool and Arsenal games. But two self inflicted errors turned the match upside down. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:45pm On Dec 16, 2017 |
[quote author=chrisley024 post=63344047][/quote]I don't know why you quoted those stuff which I think is irrelevant to the recent debates. However, it might interest you to know that Hazard has more pass accuracy than De Bruyne. Which support my argument that pass accuracy doesn't necessary mean more Assists or goals. Ronaldo, Neymar, etc don't count pass accuracy. Same should be for Rashford, Martial.
Ronaldo can have 60% pass accuracy and win MOTM. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 9:37pm On Dec 16, 2017*. Modified: 11:04pm On Dec 16, 2017 |
CapitalCee: People should watch the much heralded city and see how Aguero, Jesus, Silva , Sterling and KDB track back to help Mark and defend, as well as help in attack. But in my team, what we have are just lazy players who just want to be fed then, they will score or assist and take the glory. Check how many assists and chances created pogba has, still he tracks back to help in defending, how about Valencia and Young that will defend, mark ball and still run at the other end of the pitch to deliver crosses and assist. But no the lazy man wants to just daily in midfield while other will go and get the ball for him and put it on the plate for him to score/assist. Any body supporting mikhi in this case is just being unfair to the manager. Let's ask ourselves, why is Pogba creating more chances and assisting and even scoring, with more defensive responsibilities, how many goals/assist did Felliani have in how many minutes compare it with that of miki, even with his defensive responsibilities. That's why i suggested earlier that we need to cut down on our losses and get rid of all these indomie players without bottle and buy only super quality players like Pogba, Martial and Ibrahimovic, and some few very no nonsense and serious players like young and Valencia. You can't be lazy during Fergie, Ronaldo, Rooney, Scholes, Giggs, Rooney, js park all attacking players have defensive responsibilities but still deliver up front. When I was checking the defensive contribution of attacking players of top six teams in comparison to ours, my eyes were opened. Our guys don't press for ball. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 9:34pm On Dec 16, 2017 |
dubylhover: God bless you abeg..what's all this talk about micki being dropped for defensive lapses when he has actually been terrible in thr offensive third of the pitch Once there is a general held opinion here, it is hard to convince people otherwise. I mean people just follow. Now it is everyone, everything against Mourinho. Now people who have been shouting Mkhitaryan should be dropped want to accuse Mourinho of dropping him for defensive reasons. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 9:25pm On Dec 16, 2017 |
raumdeuter: elampiro how many dribble did you see from KDB to dominate games This question doesn't have any bearing to any of our arguments we have had recently, because I never said only dribblers dominate games. But the best footballers in history are dribblers. Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo, Messi |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:47pm On Dec 15, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Looks like many people have forgotten the man Ronaldinhp
Let me remind you of what he did in the big games
Ronaldinho dribble vs Ashley Cole led to assist https://j.gifs.com/kZom8N.gif
Ronaldinho dribble vs Nesta led to goal https://j.gifs.com/2v9581.gif
Ronaldinho dribble vs Gattuso led to assist https://j.gifs.com/wmkB01.gif
Ronaldinho dribble led to assist https://j.gifs.com/2v957N.gif
I wont even bother with the ones vs Ramos in ElClassico and many more
Remove these goals and assists after those dribbles from Rnaldinho and we have another Okocha I decided to leave you and not respond again. But let me point out to you that the quality of strikers and forward players you have determine how many Assists you can have. If you play with Di Lima or Messi or Ronaldo or Raul or Inzaghi or Henry or Shearer, you would have many Assists. For instance, someone who had De Lima and Rivaldo as team mates would Assists more than one who has Lukaku and a forward like Mkhitaryan. Nevertheless, as I said before, Ronaldinho didn’t have high games/assits ratio compared to many WF, FW, LF, RF, etc. He didn’t top Assists chart (among 5 European league) in any season when you add league+UCL Assists together. Ashley Young who didn't play UCL and with average team mates was able to top the chart once, and came second another season. Ronaldinho was known for his dribbling not Assists. You are becoming a 'sinner' on top of this Hazard matter. I will be glad to have Hazard in my team. He has effective forward dribbling and has bailed Chelsea out many times with his consistent way of mounting pressure on oppositions. Repent o. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:31pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
pamcode: Hazard was Joint top assister with Ramsey in Euros 2016 with 4 assists. Euro 2016 Assists chart  Raumdeuter will commit suicide.
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:21pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Separate the 9 from the AM and also tell how many seasons of CL each of them played
ROnaldinho played 6 May be you want to tell me Ashley Young is a striker or AM. Guy, all kind of attackers are there. They beat Ronaldinho hands down. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:18pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: The difference was Maradona Messi ROnaldo Ronaldinhos dribbles led to goals
That is why they are productive dribbles, any dribble that doesnt contribute to a goal is not productive.
So you are now saying Ronaldinhos dribbles were productive because it led to goals and assists.
Think of Ronaldinhos best dribbles, You yourself mentioned the one vs Ashley Cole in 2002 that he assisted Rivaldo the 2 at El classico vs Madrid that led to goals
Yet you are telling us Ronaldinhos goals was not to score or assist
blueangel444 you see how elampiro has come around to admit that Ronaldinhos goals were purposeful because it led to productive output Hazard dribbles also led to goals. Hazard has forward dribbles which help the overall team. That is what I want you to know. Ashley Young, Fabregas, Giggs were more productive than Ronaldinho, but were valued less. Ronaldinho is known for his dribbles and skills, not goals and assists. He was poor in those aspects. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 5:53pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
Champions League all time lead scorers
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 5:51pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Elampiro you said Okocha was not known for productive dribble, while Ronaldinho was known for productive dribbles
Please can you tell us what productive dribble means Don't you know what purposeful football is? Maradona for instance was always dribbling towards the goal. You see Messi, you see Ronaldo. Same with Ronaldinho, but not as purposeful as Maradona. You saw what he did to Ashley Cole to set up Brazil's goal at the world cup. But Okocha would go forward one time, the next times he would turn a return... I know you would go get youtube where Ronaldinho also turned and turned beating someone. Even Maradona or Messi did same, but there is a difference. What killed Okocha, Nani, Mephis Depay is that they mostly isolated themselves while trying out their skills. Their team mates would be waiting for them in the box area while they would still be trying to get past one or two men. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 5:29pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: He topped the assist charts in 1 season plus 18 goals
How many goals and asisst does Hazard have in the same 6 seasons that ROnaldinho played
ROnaldinho played 6 seasons of CL and had 13 assists, How many in those your list only played 6 seasons The chart shows Ronaldinho was not known for Assists. Anyone can top UCL Assists in a particular season. For instance, Rooney topped in 2013/2014. Ronaldinho is known for dribbling, skills and forward play. Ronaldinho is ahead of Hazard in football. But Hazard is ahead of many many footballers who score week in week out. Okocha you mentioned earlier is not known for forward play and productive dribblings. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 5:21pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
Ronaldinho has 9 Assists in Champions League history. These players have more than he had.
Now, someone said he was known for Assists?
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 4:38pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
I just discovered Lampard beat Ronaldinho in Assists in 2005, I thought they levelled. Using league and UCL.
I am yet to see any Calendar year Ronaldinho top Assists among the top 5 leagues. He was no where in 2004. Lampard beat him in 2005. Klose beat him in 2006. No where to be find in 2007. Ronaldo won the highest Assist in 2007, Klose, Fabregas, Arteta, Ibra, Deco, Young, Rooney and dozens followed before Ronaldinho
2008, De Piero, Kaka, Young, Xavi, Schweinsteiger, Fabregas, Dani Alves were join highest with 14 Assists
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 4:12pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
In 2004 Ronaldinho played 3381minutes, scored 15 goals, 0.38 goal per game.
Adriano for instance played 2983 minutes, scored 28, 0.76 goal per game.
Henry had 0.82 goal per game. ......................
Ronaldinho is not even to be seen in top Assists that year. I checked over 70 players, whoosa. I no see am. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 4:00pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Before some of you started following European football closely outside of your favorite clubs I have been following it and I followed Barcelona closely because of my hatred for Madrid
For those that didnt know, Ronaldinho was a wing forward in a 4-3-3 similar to what Robben Martial and co. Most of those you listed up there are strikers, Makaay, Henry, Berbatov Shevchenko etc were all top strikers Ronaldinho was never a top striker
In 2003/04 season Ronaldinho was injured and Barcelona sunk to around 11. Ronaldinho came back from injury mid december and scored 11 goals till season ended to push Barcelona from 11th to 2nd
In 2005 Ronaldinho was top scorer at the confederations cup the only FIFA tournament and won the FIFA awards
Now lets look for ROnaldinhos stats to see if he was dribbling for nothing
In 2005/06 Ronaldinho was top assist provider bth in La Liga and in the CL. He was 3rd highest goal scorer in the La Liga 2006 and 2007. At the twilight of his career Ronaldinho was top assist provider in the Serie A. Please which year has Hidden hazard ever been top assist provider either in the league or in the CL
So its a blatant lie to say Ronaldinho was not noted for his goals and assists when multiple times he either topped the chart or was close to the top of the scorers chart despite not being a 9
Hazard has been playing the CL for 6 seasons now he has 8 goals, ROnaldinho played the CL for 6 seasons won it and scored 18 goals total Bros, na lie you dey talk here. Ronaldinho was not injured in the years I mentioned. He played far more minutes than players who scored or Assisted far higher than him in 2004.
He was also not injured in 2005.
If I have time, I will give you details
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 3:50pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: No. What I asked you was a top attacker who wasnt noted for his assist or goals
Ronaldinho without his output will be another Okocha. What you asked me doesn't matter if it didn't address the genesis of our discussion. My breakdown shows Ronaldinho won FIFA player of the year without having good figures in goals or Assists. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 3:40pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
I don't even know Ronaldinho for Assists. I know him for his dribbling and great skills.
Na Fabregas, Lampard, Silva, Ozil, Di Maria, I know for Assists. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 3:38pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: You are missing where I asked you a top attacking player who isnt known for his goals and assists
Then you mentioned Ronaldinho who topped CL La Liga Serie A assist charts was top scorer at Confed cup, 3rd top scorer in La Liga Mr man, this was not the basis of our argument. Do attackers who didn't win Assists or Goals chart win best player or not? |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 3:02pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Rather tell us how a player who was top assist giver in the CL La Liga and Serie A was not known for his goal and assist 1. The argument was that whether Hazard deserved his MOTM award. You said no, because he didn't give Assists or score. I countered you by telling you that you don't have to be topping/giving Assists or scoring to be the best in a match or the best player. So I showed you where Ronaldinho won FIFA best player after coming far behind in goals and Assists. 2. So now, you tell me how a player who was poor in goals and assists in a particular period won FIFA player of the year in that period? |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 2:44pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: I read everything you posted
Your response to my question Tomorrow show me any highly rated attacker who isnt known for his number of goals nor assist rather for running around creating space
Is Ronaldinho. The same ROnaldinho who topped assist charts in CL, La Liga and Serie A, is your attacker who isnt known for goals or assists? He won FIFA best player in 2004. Tell me his number of goals. His number of Assists also vs other players. He won FIFA player of the year and Ballon'dor in 2005, tell me his goals+Assists vs other players. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 2:42pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
BlueAngel444: This has just murdered EVERYTHING Dayo NOISES about.
 He has now met someone who will discuss those his noise in details, and bring him to quietness. Look at the way he hurried to reply me without reading my response. Ronaldinho won those awards in 2004 and 2005. But Raumdeuter is bringing some other years he didn't win the awards. Again, Ronaldinho was never a great goal scorer. In 2004, he was poor in goals and assists. In 2005 he was poor in goals, but tried in Assist, even though he was joint second with Lampard among players of top ten leagues. But Lampard beat him in goals. Dayo is bringing 2006, 2007, 2008 when Ronaldinho did not win those awards. I have already succeeded in stating that highest goals and Assist are not the criteria for determining world best footballers. Who sabi play sabi play. Hazard sabi play ball. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 2:31pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: This is a very big lie
In 2005/06 Ronaldinho was top assist provider bth in La Liga and in the CL. He was 3rd highest goal scorer in the La Liga 2006 and 2007. At the twilight of his career Ronaldinho was top assist provider in the Serie A. Please which year has Hidden hazard ever been top assist provider either in the league or in the CL
So its a blatant lie to say Ronaldinho was not noted for his goals and assists when multiple times he either topped the chart or was close to the top of the scorers chart despite not being a 9 Do you pay attention to details at all? Please go back and read what I wrote. This time do it patiently. After you have observed your mistakes, we can talk. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 10:04am On Dec 14, 2017*. Modified: 4:41pm On Dec 14, 2017 |
15 goals 4 Assists in all competition of 2004 is what Ronaldinho used to win FIFA player of the year 2004.
In same period Henry had 40 goals, 14 Assists. Henry came second in FIFA award.
Makaay 28 goals, 9 Assists Berbatov 22 goals, 11 Assists Marcelinho 17 goals, 15 Assists Adriano 28 goals, 3 Assists Schevchenco 29 goals, 1 Assist Pires 20-9 Mcarthy 26-2 Ivan 26-12 Etoo 25-2 Ronaldo 19-8 Lampard 12-15
Going down down on the list, you would see Aiyehbeni with 20 goals 1 Assist.
Going by Raumdeuter's analysis, Ronaldinho was just busy creating space and dribbling for nothing, so he didn't deserve the FIFA player of the year 2004 awarded to him. The above players and even others not listed deserved it more.
Thank God say no be people like Dayo dey govern soccer. He for frustrate the real footballers and give awards to anyone who can score many goals.
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 9:30am On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Tomorrow show me any highly rated attacker who isnt known for his number of goals nor assist rather for running around creating space Ronaldinho When he won the FIFA player of the year award in 2004, how many goals and assists did he give in that calendar year. I can count dozen players who scored more than him. Same with Assists. In 2005 he won both FIFA player of the year and Ballon'dor. How many goals did he score. He was joint top Assists with Lampard in the Calendar year, and Lampard scored more goals. If we left awards in your hands, Ronaldinho would not have been termed great because during his time, we had Henry, Eto, Toni, Trezequet, Makaay, Lampard, Klose, Drogba, Defoe, Anelka, Berbatov, Owen, Torres, Raul, etc, who were scoring more. In Assists, we had Lampard, Loscov , Henry , Dennis Bergkamp , Ljugberg, Giggs , Xavi , Zidane , Figo, Ballack , De Lima , Deco Schweinsteiger, Bercham CR7, etc who beat in Assists in 2004 for us instance, and some other seasons. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 12:05am On Dec 14, 2017 |
raumdeuter: That is not the job of an attacker, that is simply forming activity. 3goals no goal no assist yet he is voted MOTM from ballot box It is also part of the job of an attacker, particularly, a false 9. An attacker can score or help to create spaces for scoring chances to emerge. False 9, specifically, is to bring others into attacking play. Anyway good night. Sleepy |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:53pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
raumdeuter: For an attacking player, output is something that can be seen. Not running around and forming activity.
That is why Hazard was ashamed to accept the award, he knew he did not deserve it In football, some people do dirty work before the Assists and the goal. That was what I saw Hazard do throughout the match, except in the opening minutes when he struggled with the false 9 role. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:47pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Which moves? I watched it all first goal Pedro presed the keeper who kicked the ball to Hazard who gave to Willian and to Bakayoko for the first goal
2nd goal Alonso crosses for Willian who nods in
3rd goal Willian to Pedro Best player of a match is not about who scored or Assisted a goal. I never for once rated best player that way. That's why I always joined Chelsea fans to rate Hazard high. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:44pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
3 points is very important.
We missed chances.
Good for Lukaku he scored.
My MOTM is certainly Phil Jones. Defended brilliantly and solidly. Strong in the air and in tackles. Fast and distributed balls swiftly, even had to give excellent long through ball to Shaw.
We expect Bailly, Pogba and Fellaini to be back soon to come complement these other guys.
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European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:39pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
raumdeuter: Even Hazard himself knew if was fraudulent to give him that award, he was so ashamed that he handed it back to Willian May be you didn't watch the match. Hazard orchestrated the best moves of the match. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:35pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
patrickmuf: Lukaku, please stay in the box, he is always drifting to the wings like Costa... See him looking at Mata from an offside position instead of running onside. Martial on the other hand should've buried that chance. He actually left his centre forward position unnecessarily. Good he scored today, and it was the only goal of the match. So I expect his confidence to build from here. But in two months time, Raumdeuter would show us heat map how Lukaku didn't play in the box, whereas it was his choice not to stay there. |
European Football (EPL, UEFA, La Liga) › Re: Official Manchester United Fan Thread:''20 Times EPL Champion by elampiro(m): 11:30pm On Dec 13, 2017 |
codedguy1: You are being very unfair and unrealistic in your criticisms of Lukaku.
As a professional amateur footballer in Benin, you never made any mistakes abi?
Imagine suggesting that Lukaku should have used his head. SMH or done a shuffle to select the leg he would use to clear ball. Time will stand still for him to do that and while at it take a piss behind the goal post before coming back to clear the ball with his ass. The truth is head would have been better. How did Vidic used to count steps? That ball traveled and was easily readable. |