₦airaland Forum

cornelboy:
Lol firstborn as used in that psalm is very different from the firstborn Paul used at Colossians 1:15,18.

That's why I do say you people are evil

Now, the firstborn is different in Psalm.

I never said firstborn means first created.

But that's your conclusion.

As you can see the whole phrase "firstborn of all creation".
This shows the status of Jesus among every other creation.

And He was never created.

Jesus was first to be created and first in preeminence

First in PREEMINENCE again

When the mouth is full of much lies.

My interpretation for firstborn is; first regarding the order of time and first in preeminence or superiority.

Which is different from Paul interpretation.

because Paul explained what he MEANT BY that phrase in the very passage.

cornelboy:
If it's just about superiority, what does firstborn among the dead [/b]mean?

Colossians 1:15 KJV
[15]Who is the image of the invisible God, [b]the firstborn of every creature:

Even if it's about superiority alone, the verse still shows that Jesus is part of creation.

I've already explained this also.

Stop blocking your brain when you're reading people post.

Aemmyjah:
Who did John wrote that describe himself as the beginning of the creation of God?

The @color is your own misunderstanding.

The word translated as THE BEGINNING means SOURCE.

I showed you how another translation put it, didn't I?

I asked you, why did you abandoned your Prov 8?

You must see something bigger than you there

Aemmyjah:
The highlighted is your own addition to contradict John

No! It's Watchtower who added "OTHER" to their own translation in Col 1:16-17

No where John ever said the Word had a beginning.

In fact, scripture called Him THE BEGINNING just as the FATHER was also called THE BEGINNING.

cornelboy:
Lol you don't think before you type lol.
I was proving a point that real Christians can't marry people outside their faith.

And you don't even have brain to read and understand before you reply.

Which is the reason I said that means what you read from the story isn't new in Christianity and even went further to ask you who is A BELIEVER AND WHO ARE NOT A BELIEVER according to the scripture?

What did you do?

You only gaslight it and now come back of what you already ignored

Can you allow your daughter to marry someone from Jehovah witnesses?

When you already says JWs aren't to marry outside.

So, redirect your question, can you allow your daughter to marry my son?

Then I will take you serious

cornelboy:
Being the first to be created is just one of the instances where Jesus is the first just like he's first among those that will be raised to spirit being.

You didn't get it or you did but still living in your delusion.

The text says "He MIGHT BE THE ONE WHO BECOME FIRST IN ALL THINGS"

All things already included creation.

And even the first is about SUPERIORITY Paul made it clear in his own writing

cornelboy:
He was not created but he's the firstborn of all creatures lol

I've told you what that means.

“I also shall make him My firstborn,
The highest of the kings of the earth." I quoted this before.

So FIRSTBORN isn't about FIRST CREATED

cornelboy:
What's your business with knowing my business about the story I posted there
Are you a JW?

Was the story you posted about JWs?

Can you see your life outside?

Aemmyjah:
Tag those 'many' na
😂😂😂
It's like I see your motive on the marriage issue. 🤔

You don't need to go far.

Use that as your stepping stone to get others

Even your deluded brother claimed the person isn't a JWs

Aemmyjah:
For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,”

 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

Jesus Created Himself? 😂😂😂

Oya quote John 1:3 from any translations

Let's see what it says, your claim of God created Jesus first won't turn out to be that Jesus created Himself

Aemmyjah:
John who wrote John 1:1 also wrote the Revelation
In the beginning was the Word... the same was with God... The WORD was in the beginning with God

Micah 5:2

Study Bible
Micah 5:2
And you, O Bethʹle·hem Ephʹra·thah, The one too little to be among the thousands of Judah, From you will come out for me the one to be ruler in Israel, Whose origin is from ancient times, from the days of long ago.

Who is that person from Bethlehem to become ruler whose origin was from ancient times?

Funny how you keep jumping around.

Why did you run away from Prov 8?

John 1:1 never said the WORD WAS CREATED in the BEGINNING, is English your problem?

Why did you run away from KJV?

This is the reason I told your brother to stick to one translation.

KJV John 1:1 says the WORD WAS GOD. God can't be created.

Micah 5:2 “But thou, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall come forth unto Me He that is to be ruler in Israel, whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.”

Micah 5:2 I'd about the operation of the eternal Word of God.

cornelboy:
Did Jesus create himself?

He was never created in the first place.

But if you agree that Jesus was created, then based on John 1:3 it means Jesus created Himself.

because Bible is so straight that "WITHOUT HIM, NOTHING was created"

cornelboy:
Only if you know that you didn't say anything worthwhile

After all, I'm not like you.

Jesus was never called the creator.

Who created ALL THINGS?

And of course Jesus is first in all things and being first among creatures and first to be raised into a spirit being are part of his first

Then if he is the first,

Why must HE still need to "BE THE ONE WHO might BECOME FIRST in ALL THINGS(which included creation?"

I know you lack simple comprehension, the key phrase her is "Might BECOME FIRST"

Aemmyjah:
Don't be like an illiterate
One is talking about the physical creation- heaven and earth

Waoooo very deceptive of you.

Even John 1:1 never talk about Jesus being created IN THE BEGINNING.

One is talking about the Word and the word existed long before the heaven and earth were made?

So where is the WORD RESIDE because every CREATURE NEEDS A SPACE TO OCCUPY?

According to the Revelation
Who is the beginning of the creation of GOD

I've given you another version so that you will know what that verse is saying.

Aemmyjah:
Na wa o
Jesus no get father again?

"All things came into existence through him,+ and apart from him NOT EVEN ONE THING came into existence." - NWT

Even the fact is,

The ONLY THINGS CREATED in the beginning is HEAVENS AND EARTH.

Where did you read it that Jesus was CREATED in THE BEGINNING?

You have ran away from your Prov 8

Why nah?

Aemmyjah:
It's not completely different

Waooooo

Why you people are so evil and full of lies?

One was talking about the beginning of creation

So is Jesus not THE BEGINNING OF CREATION according to you?

Another about the Word

So the word is the beginning of what?

King James Version
Revelation 3:14
And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

Read it from another version.

CEV: This is what you must write to the angel of the church in Laodicea: I am the one called Amen! I am the faithful and true witness and the source of God's creation. Listen to what I say.

The Father is THE BEGINNING.
Jesus is THE BEGINNING.

Who is that beginning? Who caused his beginning? What title did he use to address the one who caused his beginning?

The Father is THE BEGINNING, are you saying the Father has beginning?

Also, you didn't address your point again in Prov 8, why?

Na wa oooo

cornelboy:
Jesus is first in all your things of course. He's first to be created and first to be raised into a spirit being

You can see how you shot yourself in the legs

Then the next verse says so that "He might be the one WHO IS FIRST IN ALL THINGS"

"First created" comes from "firstborn of all creation/creatures.".
It means out of all creation, Jesus was the first and most preeminent

JESUS is the Creator.

NOTHING WAS CREATED without Jesus.

So if Jesus is the first created, then it means Jesus Created Himself

The Jehovah's witnesses are not your mates when it comes to bible matter

That's why they usually collect Bible study every day

cornelboy:
Lol
You have failed woefully

Colossians 1:15,18
[15]Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
[18]And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

The word firstborn as used by Paul in both verses doesn't only signify superiority or preeminence, it also signifies the "first in the order of time".

Like I said, if Jesus was first created, then no need for Paul to say "So that He MIGHT BE THE ONE WHO IS FIRST IN ALL THINGS"

For example, let say I'm the firstborn son of my parents, it'd mean that I'm the first (regarding time) male child they gave birth to in our family.

I even gave you a passage in Psalm where it was stated that Jesus was MADE FIRSTBORN.

So what Paul was addressing there is the superiority of Jesus over creation because Paul already stated that Jesus CREATED EVERYTHING.

So why did Paul use the word "firstborn"?

Reading the content you will understand why.

Don't forget that firstborn means first regarding to time and also regarding preeminence or superiority.

So what Paul meant is the superiority.

He even used PREEMINENCE so that people like you won't be deceived.

So according to verse 15, "firstborn of all creation/creatures" means first to be created and most preeminent (or first in preeminence) among things that were created.

No!

In verse 18, "firstborn from the dead" means that among those that will be raised from the dead to a spirit being, Jesus is the first and most preeminent.

No! The first to experience the actual RESURRECTION believers in Christ will experience.

I won't collect offering for this Bible study

I just need you time for Bible study.

Aemmyjah:
Read Proverbs again

I've read it many times.

Personified wisdom is talking

Who is the person personified?

Who did Jehovah produce as the earliest of his achievements?

It's the infinite Wisdom of Yahweh

Was it another angel talking?
You don't even know English

It's the Infinite Wisdom of Yahweh speaking.

The 'HE' you mentioned was identified in that first verse

Who is HE?

Bible says that the Word has a beginning, 'in the beginning was the word'
Emusan says na lie

"In the Beginning WAS..." which means the Word already exists before that time.

The only things that came to creation "In the beginning" is Heavens and Earth

Genesis 1:1 "IN THE BEGINNING GOD created the Heavens and the Earth"

To say another being was created IN THE BEGINNING again negate that verse in Gen 1:1.

Aemmyjah:
Lol
Someone telling a story is contradicting things

HOW IS MY STORY contradicting?

Even a non witness or an atheists can share thoughts but when it comes to marriage, it's a no.

But many JWs confess here that they married non JWs, so you mean they just jam themselves and boom then marriage

It's best to meet the parents if it can't be resolved...

Are you responding to my post or another one?

But she's telling you her husband womanise, about her aunt, what her mum and dad feel about marrying you, her uncle, how the organization as a whole treats her cos she's sharing feelings to a greedy man to stir desires, fooling himself here that he's happily married (lemme say this but this is not to insult women, when a woman acts this way, trying to draw emotions from you, i flee, cos you too will out of pity get so vulnerable, it could lead to holding hands, rubbing hands, looking at each other eyes, speaking soft words to each other, forming an improper longing, touching and kissing. I just direct them immediately to another woman they can talk to, they say I'm gay or I won't be romantic to my wife's feelings, I don't owe anyone that attention for now)... You'd better leave someone wife alone and drink from your own well, greedy fellow.

But I do advise you people to always pick your brain before leaving your Hall.

because it's evident that you're spewing rubbish and not replying my post.

Aemmyjah:
All things came into existence through the Word. God created him and used him in creating all things.

ALL THINGS came INTO EXISTENCE yet the deluded still went further to say God CREATED HIM.

Is Just not part of ALL THINGS THAT CAME INTO EXISTENCE?

Jesus work in creation is just like that of an architect and the contractor.

I've trashed this for a very long time here.

Show me where Jesus worked in creation.

Jehovah God is the architect, Jesus was used to bring about all other things...

Architect only DESIGN
So you means Jehovah ONLY DESIGN CREATION?

Now he has to smuggle the word "OTHER" in between

Thats why I quoted the Bible that the WORD had a BEGINNING. Go argue with Bible na.

NO WHERE THE BIBLE SAYS the word had a beginning.

One never had a beginning, he's the eternal One, the Ancient of Days. Who is that one? Jehovah God and that is why Jesus addressed him as Father at all times.

THE Word never Had a beginning.

Proverbs 8:22

Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way, The earliest of his achievements of long ago.
23 From ancient times I was installed, From the start, from times earlier than the earth.
24 When there were no deep waters, I was brought forth, When there were no springs overflowing with water. 25 Before the mountains were set in place, Before the hills, I was brought forth,
26 When he had not yet made the earth and its fields Or the first clods of earth’s soil.
27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there; When he marked out the horizon on the surface of the waters
28 When he established the clouds above, When he founded the fountains of the deep
29 When he set a decree for the sea That its waters should not pass beyond his order, When he established the foundations of the earth
30 Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day; I rejoiced before him all the time
31 I rejoiced over his habitable earth, And I was especially fond of the sons of men.

I always say never use this when it comes to Creation account to proof Jesus was created because you will be exposed for your lack of scriptural understanding.

Now, I color over 5 pronouns HE

Who is the speaker?

And who is the speaker referring to as HE which is actually carrying out the Creation activities?

Note: the speaker never involved in the creation activities DIRECTLY as stated in those verses.

In Max Voice, may you have peace

I already have the peace Jesus peace promised all His followers, do you have it?

cornelboy:
Lol it's seems your brain and eye stop functioning whenever reading my posts.

Check your brain first

I didn't interpret "firstborn" to "first created". I interpreted the whole phrase, "firstborn of all creation/creature".

Then where did the phrase FIRST CREATED is in the scripture?

That means Jesus was part of God's creation and he's even the first and most preeminent of all creation.

And I've showed you that, that is a wrong interpretation of that verse since ALL THINGS came into being THROUGH Jesus.

If he's first in all things, he's definitely the first to be created

That's not what the verse says, stop twisting the scripture.

So that He might BECOME THE ONE WHO IS FIRST in ALL THINGS.

If Jesus was first created then there's no need to still BE THE ONE WHO MIGHT BE FIRST again.

English language is not that hard, just open your brain for easy understanding.

cornelboy:
You can marry whoever you want to marry. That's your business not mine

I'm married already Mr

So what is your business with the story you pasted here?

Aemmyjah:
Ask it here

Check the one he replied to.

Aemmyjah:
Someone is deceiving you and herself

Waooo so quick you can deny your sister you praised few minutes ago

Moreover, things from your mouth should be taken with a great pinch of salt...

But you praised the same pinch of salt coming from my mouth not quite long

Are you her sibling or her father that she's telling you about her marriage?

I said we are friends.

Are you not a friend of Jehovah's?

Is there anything Jehovah will hide from his friend?

Either your story is not true or both of you are just lustfully attracted to each other.

Well, if we're attracted to each other lustfully, she's still your sister you just praised for avoiding me

Ken4Christ:
Why. You don't believe that there are structures that aid church growth which most ministry lack?

The only structure that aids church growth is God's Word.

Or you are an anti Christ?

No! I'm a follower of Christ.

Did Christ send you about structuring church growth?

Aemmyjah:
What a deep relief I feel for that sister

The sister who is already out of your demonic organisation

Well these are remarkable statements from your sister:

1. My Aunty died unhappy

2. My mum refused to support my marriage with a JWs brother without giving me any reason. (Her dad never against them)

3. The said brother is a womaniser (though my friend still loves him).

4. The way the organisation treated my aunty makes me loose interest in the organization. (I'm even the one who used to encourage her to go to meeting sometimes)

Let me stop there....

So your organisation deceptions and self acclaimed righteousness isn't strange to most of us here.

Aemmyjah:
What is your post?

The one your brother replied to.

Or you think he's just replying his own post

Aemmyjah:
Is he hungry to marry one of us?
😂

No I'm not because I'm happily married but I have a JWs friend whom we could have married each other back then.

Now, can you reply my post?

cornelboy:
If God created nothing then how did Jesus exist?

Without Jesus, NOTHING came into being.

The facts is that God created everything else through Jesus Christ.

Yes! because The Word who became Christ is God's Word.

Reason why scripture says God created everything ALL BY HIMSELF.

God didn't use anybody outside His being in creation.

He of course created Jesus.

Provide the verse.

That's why Jesus is the firstborn of all creation/creature.

Now, you're back to your initial denial.

Firstborn now means first created

He's the first to be created and most preeminent of God's creation.

That means God is lying in John 1:3 "All things came into existence through him,+ and apart from him not even one thing came into existence." - NWT

cornelboy:
It's not about doing new things lol
It's about following every Bible principles and commandments.

So the example you cited, are they following Bible principles and commandments or Satan principles and commandments?

A believer clearly can't marry an unbelieving spouse.

So who is a believer and who is not a believer?

So people dragging the JW father's for not supporting their their children marrying from another religion are ignorant or don't take the Bible serious.

Read the thread for understanding.

Even some JWs testified here that they actually married outside JWs and their family sees nothing wrong with it.

Don't change gear yet

cornelboy:
Lol what does firstborn mean?
Gimme another word or phrase for firstborn

I've said this above meaning you don't pay attention but just burying your head in what has been fused into it.

Firstborn means "superior in"

As you can see from Psalm 89:27 “I also shall make him My firstborn, The highest of the kings of the earth."

This doesn't mean the FIRST ENTHRONED KING on earth.

Also, this verse says CHRIST will be MADE FIRSTBORN.

Reason why Apostle Paul says "He must be the ONE WHO COME FIRST IN ALL THINGS"

Summary, Jesus was not part of creation but when he became part of Creation He must still take first Position in everything.

BIBLE STUDY 101