₦airaland Forum

bolaino:
Lol. FOLYKAZE. The Part Man, Part Orisha.

abeg free me

plaetton:
In fact, marketers and advertisers rely on the analysis of your inner self, your psyche, to determine what brand of toilet paper to market to you and how to successfully market it to you.

If you have ever thought or bought one brand of toilet paper as being better than another brand to wipe your bum bum, then your inner self, your psyche , has been successfully hacked using well known and time tested scientific methods.

what is this nitori Olorun?

I cant find anything analysing consciousness or inner self here.

You are only coating psychology and not providing any analytical depiction of consciousness

plaetton:
Obviously humans have been trying to understand nature from the beginning. This is the reason for the early birth of religion and of gods.

I concede that some ancients, even African shamans, were dealing with aspects of quantum phenomena or scalar physics , but without the pre-requisite knowledge of its underlying nature and characteristics.
It was like trying to harness lightning without the knowledge of basic electricity.
Therefore, their practices yielded no practical enduring results.

impressive.

I know of a guy who practise shamam and claimed he can control flame to flow at any direction, stop and disappear at his will. Though I havent verified his claim but I am doubting possibility of his claim.

African shamamism is spirituality. But what I am drawing your attention to the fact that spirituality entails spiritualism and practical science. Note that science there is not modern one

plaetton:
@ FOLYKAZE.

Oh,
I forgot to mention that your so-called inner self Can indeed be scientifically analyzed.

pls let me have it

McSterling:
Haba! My "choice" of god? What exactly is your problem? My said disbelief in the supernatural? What do you think the op refers to as god? Yemoja? Man? Gaia? Ra? Was I supposed to address your esoteric definition of god or the op's and most people's? If you choose to think a body of water or other natural entities can be defined as gods, then good. I believe they exist too though I don't term them god. There is no question of evidence for such, since they are essentially evidential in themselves. But that's obviously not what the op meant by god. So, I don't understand your contention. You seem to just be caviling at my comments.

Brace peace man. I am not the OP and I we have different view of what God is. The OP could be christian but does that mean he has the priviledge only to us the terrm God?

Lets leave that aside. There are some particualr concept of God you believe becuse they exist. Does this stances still make you an atheist? Or does you atheism is to a particular god while you are theist to other ones?

McSterling:
So anything we can't explain just yet is supernatural?

Anything that cannot be explained scientifically is supernatural

McSterling:
Does this mean you believe consciousness is transcendental or supernatural?

I dont seem to find a scientific explanation for it. That is while it is God in panpsychism.

plaetton:
When then, I too don't see why you can't see that we are saying almost the same thing,.. or does it sound better when you say I ?

I think you are speaking of general science while I refer to modern science which is trying to dislodge pre-science inquisition

plaetton:
I think you off tangent here.

Yes, every question is a scientific enquiry, but you must admit, that in remote past, one was very limited in the nature of questions asked.
In all remote cultures, people were hardly permitted to ask questions or seek enquiry that may tend to diminish the supremacy of a local deity.
Priests were the pre-eminent , unquestionable and final definers and arbiters of all natural phenomena.

The last 300-400 yrs has seen the gradual and then accelerated reversal of this arrangement, where , now, proof has triumphed over revelation.You are wrong on your submission there. And maybe you are not getting me right.

The scientifical explanations as a body is made up of observation, experiment and practicalisation of ancient knowledge. My point exactly is that we today remodel, rebrand and restructure this knowledge from the prehistory, premordial ages.

Botany, zoology, medicine, mathematics, mineralogy, geography and astrology have their developmental history in ancient civilization taking like 5000 yrs ago.

I disagree also that very few things can be explained 200yrs ago compare to this age. How do you arrive at this? To the best I can understand, there is nothing new that is invented or theorized. We have remodelling of old methods. Shikena!


[quote author=plaetton post=36403162]In everything in life , your daily life, there must always be an auditing mechanism through which we must sift all the information that come our way. This is especially important and relevant to Nigeria and the religious market marketplace it has turned into. Here, in Nigeria, like a typical marketplace, everyone is trying desperately to sell you their religious wares as being made of the finest and most durable material. like any buyer or consumer, you must examine the fabric, the cut, the dye to see it meets any established and accepted STANDARDS.

The key word here being STANDARD.
The scientific system is such a STANDARD. A Standard through which we sift, measure and audit the plethora of constant competing claims of knowledge.
And you know what ?
It has been working wonderfully for the past 300 yrs or more.

And for your last statement that science cannot explain everything, let me give you a helpful hint.

The correct statement ,that no one will dispute, should read " Science has YET to explain everything "

Abeg stop dribbling me into religion bigotry. We are talking about universal civilization, science and the medieval aspect of it that couples with spirituality. I mean something like alchemy and chemistry.

I am not wrong in science not explaining some event. I think we got ourselves wrong because modern science has successfully. The genesis of modern science is traced to early modern period and in particular to scientific revolution of 16 to 18 century. The only unique thing is the methodology which is principle of modern science unlike the pre-science age when scientific inquiry and observation to the nature is been consider as pseudo-science.

If you observe closely, you will understand that the term prescience age has put a boundary between modern science and the practise of the folk in 1000yrs ago which wrap their science to spirituality.

Traditionally, all form of inquiry is science so I will have to put a fence around my statement. Those things modern science has not known yet is supernatural. This does not mean that other scientifical methodology in the prescience age does not knw this either. Maybe when we learn to bring the two to same field, our world would be abetter place

K9blunt:
Honestly I did not go to school of atheism, neither am I bortherd about it. What you're talking about are for those who took their time to study about religions, god concept and humanity. I have more important things that's on my plate.

So good day.

Shoki Ha!!!!

Na me you dey yansh like this?


Well tell me, how did you become an atheist without prior knowledge of religion and concept of god? What is the reason for your stance? I know there should be one.

plaetton:
No sir.

What do you mean by the phrase " cannot be explained by natural laws " ?

Don't you first have to know the entire sum of all natural laws, before you can boldly CLAIM that something CANNOT be explained by any natural laws ?

The truth is that we are still trying to understand the natural laws and how they operate at the macro, micro and subatomic levels.

I remind you , once again, like I did the op, that over the past 2000 yrs, newly understood natural laws have explained away tens of thousands of ersthwhile mysteries or spiritual things.

So with this in mind, a supernatural phenomenon is one whose underlying physics has yet to be fully understood or even scientifically studied.

If we plug in Quantum entanglement, Relativity, Gravity and Time dilation, Torsion Fields, etc into our everyday experiences, we would see that all phenomena may be or can be fully measured and explained.

A mystery is just something waiting to be discovered.

And, we have to stop using mysteries to explain mysteries.

Where did i say things cannot be explained? I said and repeat cannot be explain by natural law. I baffle how this is hard for you to differentiate.

Maybe when this knowledge is attained in the scientific society, we will know how to bend space and time. We know how to disappear and teleport. But if this events hapoen now, it remain as supernatural until after there is a natural explanation.

Right now that there is no natural explanation for an event, it is supernatural until after there is an explanation when it will change course to natural occurrence.


I dont know why this is hard for you to grab

Zedric:
No he wasn't. He married Mary Magdalene and fathered a daughter named Sophia

The unnamed disciple in the book of John was his gay wife

CR77:
Who cares

Then jump into the lagoon

K9blunt:
If I'm getting you right, you've actually explained God in another aspect different from what the op probably intended.
The op is trying to understand God in a humanic view like, indeed God is a spirit in human form, he's trying to understand God as a being. Not in the idea of love for money, or nature.

I guess you are new to atheism.

Do you know what Anthropomorphism is?

Descibing an entity as human or person is very common in every society. It is nothing new and not wrong

I am proud to have Buhari as my president

Esdb3:
Bleep your shii bruh! Wtf! Britain's educational system is on fleek yet they have a lot of youth mason members! These things were invented to change your view of the world!

I'm not occultic I woulda asked you to give me the name of your mother and yours so we'll see how spiri spiri is due to educational hogwash you just spat!



Bleep! There are engineer pastors that schooled abroad what is ur reply to their case.

Pastor E.A Adeboye had Ph.d in maths when he was called for mission work!

Among all inventors(greatest of them) list those that were atheists and pagans.

Oga abeg shut the hell up

McSterling:
It isn't really my duty to define god since I have no belief in the concept in whatever form. But I mostly use the word god in the sense that most theists mean. A divine, benevolent, extraterrestrial personage with omni-abilities who made the universe and transcends it. Supernatural would mean transcending the observable natural world. God transcends the natural world. God is supernatural. I do not believe in god and disbelief in the supernatural follows as a corollary.

Abeg stop kidding yourself.

How can you tell me there is no pen on a table when you cant tell me what a pen is?

Let me take it on with you on your most theist statement. In the bible, men and judges were called God. Even a paper money is explained to be worship as God. Can you pls explain how a Man or Judge or Money is an extraterrestial personage with an omni-ability who made the universe and transend it.

And again, why is your choice of God application applies to most theist? Are other Gods in the category of not most and have no or any attribution you have up there not befitting to be called God? The Goddess of law and justice - lady justice is not having omnis attribute or is any claim of creating the universe attributed to her. Natural entities in pagan religion are called God. So why is your definition not covering all these? Yemoja is a body of water and also a deity. Gaia is earth and a greek goddess. The sun is Ra, an egyptian God. Mars is the god of Iron. The moon is a god in ancient cultures. Yet they do not have omni-abilities, non did they create the universe. Does these non attribute stop them from been God?

Supernatural is nothing but an event or phenomenon that can not be explained by natural laws. I think that is simple enough.

The Inner I/self/me cannot be known or explain scientifically. This implies that it transend observabke natural world. Does this mean I dont have inner self? Does this mean you dont believe in an entity that live inside you, your reak self?

plaetton:
Even that statement is lame.

200yrs ago, how many things could be explained scientifically?
Very very few.

2000 yrs ago, how many things could be explained scientifically?
Virtually none.

Today, how many things could be explained scientifically?
A lot.
A lot much more than the op knows.
I wonder the last time, if ever at all, He read a scientific journal.

2000 yrs from today, how many more things would be explained scientifically?
A lot lot more than we could ever imagine.

This does not explain anything. And pls stop descibing science is something that starts yesterday. How can you tell us that those that live 200yrs ago does not have scientific knowledge?

Science starts from the day the first man asked the first question about what to eat and not to eat. Science start from when the first man starts experimenting the taste of a leaf, fruit and root. How can you think modern methodology of scientifical experimentation is the real science?

Isnt it all about knowledge? Does it needs to be in a particular method? Mr, there is nothing unknown today that it idea cant be trace to 2000yrs ago. Should we start from health, to inventions and cosmos?which among this is unknown in the past? I wonder why you think science start in this age.

Anyway the point remain that science cannot explain everything

menesheh:
God is an imagery mythical medium, invented by our medieval ancestors (a specie of primate called human) in their search to unravel the puzzle of the universe and the reason why there varieties of animals and plant on the earth.

Just wow

K9blunt:
That's what I mean read about other religious definition of who god is and then come up with your definition. But if you want my definition of who God is, then here it is,

God is an imaginary being composed by some confused humans to control, insatiable need to understand any reason for their existence, and just want to be governed by the idea of a god.

Wrong Ms.

The value of a money is in it wealth which is Imaginary. But can you deny wealth is non-existing?

That is if you know that money is a God and very sacred entity

onetrack:
And in addition, the idea of god has allowed ambitious people a way of controlling others through the fear of this imaginary god and his imaginary anger at imaginary sins. This resulted in organized religions that we see today (Christianity, Islam, Judaism).

The God you refer to here are Allah, Jehovah and Yahweh.

The point is what you descibed there has to do with a particular concept of God while the other ones are not touched.

Does the God of a religion that preach against or have no doctrine of sin not relevant or stop been God because it has no sin in it tenet?

bolaino:
Please Tell us More about The Irunmole... Don't mind these church people.

go and meet the babalawo in your hood

plaetton:
Pls answer this simple question.
If, as you say, something cannot be explained logically, then how else is it explained?

Is tagging something as spiritual an alternative explanation, or a cowardly copout?

the guy was wrong. I have to admit this.

What he mean to say is that not everything can be explain scientifically

K9blunt:
Hmn,
In the apotheosis concept of God, if am to go by that concept/definition of what a GOD is then ofcourse I will believe the person is a God (based on that concept), meaning the so-called person has done something that is provable, av seen him/her doing the admirable whatever, and or experienced it. Like for instance Prof. Soyinka, who's the 1st african (hope am correct) to get a nobel price for literature to me is known as a God of literature. I wasn't there but I have evidence to prove it.

For the natural pantheist , well I could say I understand what they mean in the sence that gaea is the earth we walk on, nature that governs the other of existence. According to that ideology, its more about entities that we living beings, feel and see with our eyes that are bigger than our control that governs us. You can't kill death cause its bigger than you, that's the natural order of existence. If that is a definition of what a GOD is then I believe it.

Spinozoa, huh!
Lady justtice is just part of a natural order of karma, you and I both know that there is always a concequence for what ever we do, either. Wrong or right. I don't need to call her a god and pray and worship the so-called lady justice. You can become justice by getting even with your offender or sorts.

Venus and Mars are simply planets that exist and the studies on them are if there are living things in/on them like on earth, so if they are considered as GODs, like calling venus instead of Venus planet, God planet , ok I believe.

Finally my thoughts are there is no "GOD" like a supreme being,incapale of faults, who's right when he says so,wrong when he wishes and calls it right, jealous, and what have you. I don't believe in all that, I don't believe in the greek gods/goddeses, egyptian gods, omadioha in the way they have been presented by their worshipers.
But if explained logically like saying nature is god because I can see it,feel it,touch it, but can't control it because its bigger than me. Then I believe.

I hope av answered something.

Lol Sis.

You have answered me perfectly.

But permit me to ask further, you believe in a particular God and disbelieve in another; do you still think with this you are and remain an atheist?

Believe in apotheosis concept of God is samething as believing in Egypitian sacred kings/ Roman emperors. So I wondered why you denounce an open fact with the statement that you dont believe in egypitian deities. Imperial cult are across the world. In this society, personalities are been worshipped as God which Egypt is not excluded. So how do you mean by you cant worship egyptian gods when you already believe in Apotheosis concept of God?

Karma is a supernatural/ natural force. For there to be cause, there must be an effect. That aside, Lady Justice is an ancient greek God of Justice. It today symbolize Law and Justice in our Court. It is represented as a woman holding a scale on one hand and a sword on the other hand. That you claim you aint worshipping and praying to Lady justice is hillarious. Praying is petitioning while Worshipping is acknowledgement of someone or something. So tell me Ma, hw you refuse to pray and worship lady justice? Dont you petition can call for justice when you see irregularity? Dont you acknowledge the worth of Justice and the power the deity carries?

Venus and Mars are the name of Roman God dear. The planetary bodies were named after these Gods because they share the same trait. Mars is the God of metals became the name of the twin earth because it has lot of metalic elements. This implies that those planets are real and evidence that particular astrolatry deities exist.

Sam Harris once said something, take buddhism away from buddhist. I think you have an open mind when you said you dont believe in God as presented by worshippers. We know that lot of distortions, misconceptions and wrong attirbution either through exagerration or effort to appear logical but this does not mean God should be thrown in the bin like other atheists do here. I mean read the bible, quran or gita for values and not contradition. Look for the philosophy, moral teaching and not faults. Learn how to separate myth, fiction and superstition from reality. Do you as an atheist do this?

onetrack:
Like I said, atheism is only a lack of belief in any god. Beyond that atheists do not need to have anything in common. So there may be superstitious atheists, though I think they would be rare, and would almost certainly be questioned by other atheists.

I dont think any atheist deserve the question coming from since the believe system is outside atheism and existence of god.

Atheism is disbelieve in god existence. If a particular atheist like I have shown you and still lot others believe in ghost, ETT and supernatural beings, it would be agree that their stance is outside atheism and not called for questioning by atheist because it has nothing to do with god.

onetrack:
As far as so-called supernatural events, I'd say that most atheists would simply say that a natural, rational explanation exists but may not have been found at this point, as has been the case so many times in the past, where events formerly believed to be supernatural come to be explained by science as perfectly natural.

Supernaturals mean the nature is super. Everything in the nature is super.

And I dont need those long story when you can simply use the word superrnatural to express yourself?

onetrack:
But atheists don't agree on many things, so you will find a diversity of opinions about subjects other than the existence of any gods.

The remaining diversing opinions has nothing to do with atheism and should not be related to atheism. This buttress my point that atheists should not ask for evidence of supernatural claims an any other thing other than existence of God.

McSterling:
There is no evidence for god and the supernatural.

Lol.

Before I take you on this, can you explain what you mean by God and supernatural?

Because to me and others, the sun is god. Does this mean there is no evidence for the sun?


Kindly define God as per the sun pls

onetrack:
I don't know any atheist who believes in the supernatural, but there may be some that do. Atheists lack belief in any god, that is the only criterion. Atheists generally want real proof of supernatural claims. I have never seen any; and superstitions of the past have easily been disproven by experimentation and science.

I think there is an atheist who believe in the supernatural. He commented on this thread https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100922033708AAeqSKW pls stroll to read his words.

There is another atheists who believe in supernaturals http://www.atheistrepublic.com/forums/atheist-hub/atheists-who-believe-some-supernatural-concepts-help-me-out-here

Supernatural is an unexplained occurrence. Or let me say an event that cannot be explained by natural law.

Atheist ask questions about God existence and not evidence of supernatural claims. I might be wrong maybe if you tell me atheism is not about god but supernaturals.

The namr is an appelation for the members of PDP which explain how bitter and painful they are since their President Jonathan was sent to the darkesk side in Nigeria.

Yoruba people call them Gboromideleru

McSterling:
I don't believe in the existence of god(s) and the supernatural.

As I can remembered, atheism is disbelieve in God and not disbelieve in supernaturals.

K9blunt:
Am just a plain atheist, all through atheist of any god/gods concept.
Not spiritual yet, just a free thinker.

Can i pls engage you?

In the apotheosis concept of God, an influencial, admired and adored person is a God. Do you as an atheist disbelieve in the existence of influencial person because they are been called god?

The naturalistic panthiests, every natural entities are Gods. Do you disbelieve in the existence of natutal enities because they are called god? Do you disbelieve in Gaia (a goddess who represent earth) and Mother Nature because they are been worship as God?

To spinoza, the god concept in spinozism states that natural substance is God. Do you disbelieve God (substance) not existing? Justice and law is substance that exist as a god/deity in ancient and modern culture as Lady justice. Do you disbelieve in the existence of lady justice because she is greek deity?

Astrolatry concept express the stars as one with God. Is Venus and Mars not existing? Remember they are gods too.

I want each of this questions answered pls

Obadiah77:
wats this nonsense all anout

He is exposing the cowardice of trinitarian

OP.. But do you know that Jesus was a gay?

In the Yoruba royak family, the Kings dont die

I love the part of a dying tiger that makes the loudest noise before it die. This is very true and realistic. When we measure it to insurgece menace, we observe that these beast are been given tough fight and are doing everything at their disposer to remain relevant.

The fight against corruption and terrorism is not for Buhari alone or the agencies. I think it is collective fight that need to involve every hand om desk. The media has a lot of task just like the army. Religion societies need to preach against insurgency. We need to start educating our people and children on the effect of corruption on humanity. I once remembered my Dad joking with his friends sometimes ago. He said he will guide me through my education so thay I can find my way into Government office and have the oppportunity to steal from the treasury. I had to shake my head in non-acceptance. This is the norm in our society. People see government office as money acquistion oppportunity. This is the mentality in our society. We praise those that steal and speak i of those that decide not to steal from government pulse. We need a media campaign against this immorality.

This change start from me and you