₦airaland Forum

ifeness:
God is nothing but a title given to individuals by low self esteemed individuals. When you are good at a craft in which no one could beat you,perhaps the word "God" could be used. You do hear "Messi,God of football" Shango was labeled a God because he exhibited mind blowing skills/attributes.

We are victims of ancient cave men who passed the ideology of God to their offspring and here we are today still believing in God when it is absolutely clear there is non.

Ain't we all Gods? Yes we are! Most of us are Gods with low esteems who see an Arab dude as a God rather than ourselves.

Low self esteem.

That is a point but how does low self esteem makes a river God? Can you pls explain this?

hapheeyxz:
unthinkable

You need to think about this pls.

Ask yourself why people are not worshipping you just like Guru Maharaji Ji as the God-man? What makes you different from him? What qualities does he possess that you dont have?

You need to think

PastorAIO:
My own take on it though is that God is an Authority. So we have all sorts of Gods and levels of Gods. So a judge that can send you to prison just be commanding it is a God in the legal sphere. Me, I'm a god in the sphere of my work and my expertise.

With authority comes the ability to create. To make a situation so just be willing it. and to destroy.

I agree to some extent that God is authority. We can also assume power and dominion is also features of God.

But what authority does a Tree (Iroko) have over Man when we can simplyy pull it down but still people troop to offer prayers and sacrifice to it? What authority does a river have over men? Why this same authority is not awarded to well water?

charlesikhalea:
I have told u to get a life, if u didn't type rubbish after mentioning me i wouldn't be showing up in ur mention, ur God cannot n has never been seen by anyone, u have no proof, so even if u re a little boy, this is Nairaland almost everyone is intelligent here, try not to act stupid n do something with ur life today. I made my point with my first response to the Op n all those concerned.

thanks

God is a broad word that mean different thing to different people. It comes with different forms, attributes and concepts. In all these dimensions, God is seen as a divine entity which is worthy of worship either by proxy or directly. But when we look closely, those things that are been called God exist independently either as an idea (Law and Justice) or Natural entities (River, Sun and animals) or both. We found out that much reverence is given to these entities in the part of the world where they are seen as God while on the other end, these entities attracts little or no value.

I grew up just like every other people to know that there is a dedicated shrine for a river. A tiny stream in my street is revered by devotees as a deity with the name Omisebo. A shrine is built very close to a big tree which serve as the source of the stream water. Another river in Igbekebo Ese Odo becomes a deity called Oborowe. There is a designated shrine where a lot of devotees worship, lot of people troop there for divination and spiritual consultation. Rituals and sacrifice can be found in front of the altar and at the bank of the river. While these rivers are believed to be powerful deity worthy of worship by it adherents, to me and non adherents it is just a body of water. I remember the only purpose it serves me is that it provides me food, water and place to defecate in. What I seem not to understand is why some people make it a god. The reasons it changed from H20 to supernatural deity. What makes it any different from the water that run in the tap. What are the qualities that make those rivers God? This deification does not applies to rivers only. In many cultures, tress, animals, celestial bodies and lot of many natural entities are worship as God. What make these objects God?

Humans are also subjected to this form of worship. Alot of cultures have Men and Women who at a point attained a divinity status and became a God. Jesus for example is a God for Thomas and Trinitarians while the Jew recognise him to ordinary son of Joseph. Agemo of the Ijebus were originally humans according to history but becomes Gods with annual festival dedicated for them in Ijebus. Obatala, Sango and Ibeji are historical figures but are served Gods (Orisha). Guru Maraji insist that he is God. Yet the question of what makes them a god persist.

Law, Justice (Sango and Iustice) became God. Disease (Saponna) became God. Money or wealth (Orisha Aje) became God. Earth is worshiped as God. Death became a God. Almost everything (Idea or object) is a particular God to some particualr people.

So at what point does a mere River, Stars, human or just any natural objects become God?

How does Obatala or Jesus go from powerful person to supernatural creator of earth?

What qualities must a person or entity have before he/it becomes a god/gods?

At what point do they receive or who decides to give them these qualities?

Can these qualities be lost or removed? Will they loss been God?

Apart from worshipping, is there any difference between these Gods and what they represent?

Weah96:
Are you mad? Did you not read my reply to the OP? I forgot. You don't read. You only wait to see the words atheist and God together before you begin to pleasure yourself.

A vegetarian tells you that meat is bad for the body. You disagree claiming that he too eats meat. Are you not looking to start a fistfight?

I thought you are an adult and expected you to be more civil.

If a vegetarian tells you meat is not good for his body, can you then tell us why you think god does not exist?

basille:
You're not an atheist.

He will not admit that

charlesikhalea:
U should check the meaning of the word, it relates alot to ur present condition

Oga what does this have to do with the OP? If you have no point, kindly pls bounce off my mention.

You have aaked for the evidence of my God and I have shown you one. Even your colleague in atheism approves that Lord Ra is god and should be revered. So what other point is it you want to make again?

My God can be seen out there in the night. There is picture of it out there. She is bright and beautiful. If you dont like it, you can jump into the lagoon

charlesikhalea:
Eh!! Little child, careful with ur words.....like I said only for fun will a person argue with the likes of u...whoever attested to ....... Is not me, so if u have nothing better to do, try getting a life

another tantrum

charlesikhalea:
Have u ever seen God? U re questioning people about what u don't even understand..... If u want people to believe in ur God or Gods or whatever u talking about, show some proof.... U re unequipped for what u re about to go into, anybody that argues with u is doing so out of fun, almost everything that happens in this works can be explained by science, the remaining few will only take time....u keep talking about vegetarians, at least we can see vegetables, ur God can't be seen or felt, bring prove then u n the Op can have a case

Another trash. I have seen the Gods. I can see them clearly at night. I am astrolatrist.


An atheist attests that Ra, an egyptian god exist even on this thread.

So run along
So what evidence are you looking for?

frank317:
Wow!!! U just described how I feel when I listen to him. And the fact he us so persistent... Gosh.

@Folykaze.
I believe my dogs head is the flying spaghetti monster. So now do you believe flying spaghetti monster exist?

You must believeoooo because saying it doesn't means my dogs head doesn't esist.

That is your problem.

This does not stop animist from revering the divine dog

Is there any conception that states that dog head is FGM?

What does FGM has to do with dog head?

Weah96:
Folykaze, answer me this. A man walks up to you and says that he is a truck driver. Would you ask him if he is a golf club or how a golf club can drive trucks?

This has nothing to do with the OP.

The OP aked you why you think God does not exist. Provide answer here or further ask him what he mean by God. Answering him thereafter without clarity mean you understand what god is. So I dont understand why you hold unto Jehovah as if it is the only thing thay is god

johnydon22:
Aaaaw still clutching unto the desperate need to assert Deva in Buddhism means God..lol..

I think i have made it clear enough that "Deva" in BUDDHISM is a non-human entity... And aslo the word Deva can still used as god... Your confusion stems from your sterotype of Buddhist Deva and the Sanskrit word Deva....

And you actually thought you brought up a point..

You forgot to mention that Yama is a Hindu concept from the Hindu canonical text Rigveda. . . It was a wild spread ancient asian belief and in no way a Buddhist concept..


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yama people should read and see for themselves..

And you are too blind to see that Yama is one of the wrathful deities in buddhism?

I dont have time for this kind of dumbness.

krayzieklay:
Your arguments most times can be so annoying. It's like as if I'm hearing a child scratching a metal on a tarred road. Damn!

ad homien

johnydon22:
The day you will learn to stop unfounded sterotypes your arguments will become sound and straight..

Buddha is not worshipped as a God just like Catholic revere Mary but not as a God..

Catholics pray to saints and even other christian denominations invoke angels in their prayers. . .Reverance (worship) of a thing does not connote Theism..

I worship my mum, this doesn't make me theisitic or make my mother a deity, it is basically reverance...

Buddhist practises are within the dimension of "Organized Religion" Not Theistic... You still have to go grab what "Theism" really is like i adviced ealier..

Again stop sterotypes, you always murder your argument with it

Oh my goodness?

Who is Yama?

In Buddhism, Yama ( Sanskrit: ) is a dharmapala (wrathful god) said to judge the dead and preside over the Narakas ("Hells" or "Purgatories" and the cycle of rebirth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yama
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrathful_deities
http://www.abuddhistlibrary.com/Buddhism/A%20-%20Tibetan%20Buddhism/Subjects/Tantra/Introductory%20essays/Deities/Deities.htm

I dont have time for this your dumbness.

If you cant see wrathful god there, then become blind and foolish forever.

johnydon22:
Stop clutching on an already failed argument...

The link is very explicit when it showed Deva means supernatural entities and can also mean a god..

its very clear for all to see...

We are dealing with the BUDDHIST concept of "deva" which is basically they refer to as a non-human entity like wikipedia showed us...

Stop sterotyping... Deva in buddishm doesn't mean God..let me post the definition of Buddhist DEVA again for all..

A deva (देव Sanskrit and Pāli) in Buddhism is one of many different types of non-human beings who share the characteristics of being more powerful, longer-lived, and, in general, much happier than humans, although none of them are worthy of worship
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva_(Buddhism)

Oga stop been foolish. Deva is a God but not in the sense of monotheistic God. This mean it is not a creator being or supreme being as God is depicted in western world.

Deva in Sanskrit is देव and in english mean God. https://translate.google.com/m?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&ie=UTF-8&prev=_m&q=%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%B5

The difference here lies in concept and not word. As the concept remains, it is different only to supreme being or the personified creator in the sense of monotheism.

Let me school you now. I hope you will pay for my service.

This is the gods in buddhism.

1 Yama https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yama

In Buddhism, Yama ( Sanskrit: ) is a dharmapala (wrathful god) said to judge the dead and preside over the Narakas ("Hells" or "Purgatories" and the cycle of rebirth.

research for the others pls.

Yama the God of Death, Mara the tempter deity....Deva in sanskrit means a god/demigod (Like an angel or something). Brahmā, Asura, Śakra, Yaksha, Sariputta, Tara, Kwan Yin and many other Gods are found in Buddhism. Asura means Demons, naraka (hell) and nirvana (heaven).

johnydon22:
And you did not even read the article because if you did, you wouldn't have pasted it here...this is what it says.[size=16]The claim of Non-theism is true in the sense that there is no God in Buddhism who is a Creator, Judge, or Deity-in-Charge.[/size]

The claim of Non-theism is not completely true because the Buddhist suttas and sutras make reference to all sorts of supernatural beings who inhabit the universe, from ghosts, demi-gods, devas, and brahmās to celestial buddhas and bodhisattvas. it is very clear for all to see now... Even the website you provided agreed Buddhism is non theistic but only argued that the concepts of supernatural entities like we see in buddhism means theism....lmao, this is like saying because someone believes the existence of Witches, means that person is theistic...

And your second link finished the job..here.

"Some definitions required a religion to include belief in the existence of one or more deities; this would classify most expressions of Buddhism as a non-religious since [size=16]it is essentially a non-theistic religion. [/size]………

Now go and wrap your head around the concept of theism, belief in non-human entities is not same as theism..

I dont have interest in this game of copy and paste with color paintings.

Note the word "in the sense". This in the sense postulate that:

Western Buddhist communities, on the other hand, are often made up of converts who have left a prior theistic belief in an Abrahamic Sky God behind. They often view celestial beings as outdated cultural vestiges which can be safely jettisoned without changing the essential meaning of the Dharma. Western Buddhists are the foremost promulgators of the idea that Buddhism is non-theistic.

This is the reason why asked you to speculate if you mean buddhism as viewed by the west or practised in Asia.

In pure land buddhism, buddha is worshipped and it pratises is theistic

Weah96:
I don't understand what you stand to gain from your incessant pedantry. A reasonable person asks for clarification once, receives it, and moves you. You now know what I mean, why are you obsessed with the old semantics business? This is turning out to be your signature mating ritual of yours or something, and even though it is entertaining, it sometimes can also be downright annoying.

You have just checkmated yourself, and I hope that you will present another contribution to the arena. Here's your rebuttal:





There is no such thing as a vegetarian because everyone eats meat. Just as there is no such thing as an atheist... because we all believe in God.

Do you disbelieve in the meat of a pawpaw?

Excellent shot there.

I respect this response. Take my five guy.

Jehovah and Allah is a subset of God. The OP asked why you think God does not exist. This implies that you presume that God does not exist. I dont care if it is Jehovah or Allah. Just give us your reason why you think God does not exist.

Asking a celestial Buddha for assistance is a practice within Pure Land Buddhism. Pure Land Buddhism teaches that one cannot reach enlightenment through one’s own efforts, but if one recites the mantra ofAmitābhaBuddha one will be reborn into his Pure Land after death and will achieve enlightenment from there. Having faith in a Buddha’s divine intervention seems similar in some ways to theistic beliefs and practices in the West. Keep in mind, however, that AmitābhaBuddha is neither a creator nor a judge. He offers assistance to all who recite his mantra.

Weah96:
Atheism is the dismissal of all forms of conventional theism. Unconventional Gods like Cristiano Ronaldo, Lebron James, and myself are not included.

If you feel like calling the Aso Rock building by the moniker God, then after you clarify the attributes and the benefits you get from the building, I might join your cult group.

Another nonsense.

What constitute and made up what you call conventional?

Millions of people are hindi are worship snake and cows as deity.

Millions of people in greek worship the stars as deity.

Millions in Africa worship the nature. . .animism.

Are these convetional?

Do atheists disbelieve in these gods?

Does your definition applies to these gods?

johnydon22:
Hahahaha as usual..

Sanskrit remember is a Hindu liturgical language and Hinduism is a theistic religion..

We are discussing the BUDDHIST concept of Deva which they regard as merely non-humans that are not worthy of worship.

In your usual hasty sterotypes you didn't bother to Check the etymology of the word...
"Deva is a Sanskrit word found in Vedic literature of 2nd millennium BCE. Monier Williams translates it as "heavenly, divine, terrestial things of high excellence, exalted, shining ones".[1][9] The concept [size=20]also [/size] is used to refer to deity, god."https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva_(Hinduism)#Etymology

Now we can see that the word "Deva" is used both to refer to heavenly, exalted etc things and Also used differently to refer to a deity..

Can you now calm down and agree Deva in Buddhism is not GOD but simply a non-human entity ...

Even from the link, Deva-buddhism is a word from Sanskrit. This is what is there "A deva (देव Sanskrit and Pāli)".

So maybe you need to put your thinking cap on when arguing.

A simple translation of देव to english will give you God.

Next

johnydon22:
No pantheism is not an extension of theism...Pantheism a distinct and drastically different concept in entirety. . this is where your confusion stems.

If you had asserted deism is an extension of theism, nobody would have disputed that...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theism
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantheism

like i told you before, you have to first go wrap your head around what both actually means before rushing in to discuss them.
Buddhism /ˈbudɪzəm/ [1][2] is a[size=20] nontheisitc religion[/size] [note 1][3] or philosophy
( Sanskrit : dharma; Pali : dhamma) that encompasses a variety of traditions ,
beliefs and spiritual practices largely based on teachings attributed to
Gautama Buddha, commonly known as the Buddha ("the awakened one".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism

Like i told you earlier, you don't even know what theism means...Until you get to know you will never fully grasp that which you wish to argue about.....

let me hear you say that Buddhism is theistic again!

Oga Ade stop relying on Western fallacy.

Read and read Mr http://www.existentialbuddhist.com/2011/05/is-buddhism-non-theistic/

another is here

http://www.religioustolerance.org/buddhism8.htm

I dont have the time so I cant copy and paste here.

Buddhism is theistic religion as practised by those in Asia

dalaman:
I am not a Buddhist so I wont dwell on what I don't know. The Wikipedia entry says Devas are not Gods.

Wikipedia is not wrong here. It said on another search that Deva is not God in monotheistic sense but it is a divine entity/being. The word in Sanskrit mean God.

dalaman:
As for the second question you still haven't answered anything. You just played with words. Why are you an atheist since you insist that atheist disbelieve in all Gods?

I have given you link where I answered this question above. Refer to it for answers

thanks

Weah96:
We've been here before. You know EXACTLY what my beliefs are, as far as Gods are concerned.

Pantheistic atheist you are. Not just atheist. That is what you do not want to accept.

I believe somedays, atheism will be synonymous to insanity and psalm 14:1 will be affirmed. It is not an insult but just saying the fact. Because atheism is disbelieve in God existence but God ever exist either as an entity, idea or concept.

Weah96:
I believe in certain Gods, and have serious reservations about the rest.

Example, I've been to an Outkast concert, I've had my hair cut in barbershop with Big Boi seated in the next chair, I have watched their videos.

When I say that I don't believe in God, I am under the impression that the OP if referring to the Abrahamic ones.

But you believe in Asian, African and greek God?

Thanks ahead.

johnydon22:
Always at the fore front of laying baseless claims, Buddhists do not worship or term Devas Gods

A deva (देव Sanskrit and Pāli) in Buddhism is one of many different types of non-human beings who share the characteristics of being more powerful, longer-lived, and, in general, much happier than humans, [size=16]]although none of them are worthy of worship.[/size]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva_(Buddhism)

Stop confusing yourself by changing words to mean what you want

Dont be foolish Mr.

Do some research far beyond wikipedia.

Devas in Sanskrit is देव which mean God https://translate.google.com/m?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&ie=UTF-8&prev=_m&q=%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%B5

johnydon22:
I think you are practically the confused one here, swimming in your own self induced confusion.

First you mistake Buddhist spiritualism to mean theism, then again mistake pantheism to mean theism also, how will you even know what atheism is since you do not even grasp the concept of theism.

Refering the Sun as a God is not pantheism but rather theism and this belief that the sun is divine has to do with BELIEF. i that lack BELIEF that the divinity you claim on that particular thing simply will refer to it as the sun and nothing more.

Pantheism simply is recognizing the whole universe in one entirety as God, I simply choose to refer to it as the universe and not a deity.

theism deals with belief in both assumed personal and deified objects (which in the real sense represents the actual imaginative concept)

You need to wrap your head around these before you can hope to even understand what you hastily rush in to discuss

Where did I say Ra is a pantheistic God?

Theism is a broad term which extention pantheism is part of. I dont know where I confused this together.

Buddhism spritualism is not theism? Do you mean the western buddhism or the one practise by those in Asia?

Some guys mehn

dalaman:
Deva in Buddhism is not a God. From wikipedia.

A deva (देव Sanskrit and Pāli) in Buddhism is one of many different types of non-human beings who share the characteristics of being more powerful, longer-lived, and, in general, much happier than humans, although none of them are worthy of worship.

If you read further you will see where they clearly say that Devas are not gods. It is clearly written there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva_(Buddhism)

As for the second question, you have not answered me anywhere. Why are you an atheist since you insist that atheist must disbelieve in all Gods. Why are you then an atheist?

Devas is not God? Are you serious at all?

Oga because an deity is not a god in the monotheitic concept or sense does not mean it is not God/deity.

Devas is a Sanskrit term meaning god, deity, divinity or celestial being. In Buddhism, devas are gods who live in the various realms of heaven as rewards for their previous good deeds, but they are still subject to rebirth. http://www.themystica.com/mystica/articles/d/devas.html

And you have the got to say they are not worshipping? What then is the essense of home shrine and temple? http://www.english.fgs2.ca/?q=why-buddhists-bow-pray-or-worship-buddha-statue-if-buddhism-does-not-believe-creationism

What is the dude in this picture below doing?

https://media.hamptonroads.com/cache/files/images/272991.jpg

Is he eating or praying/worshipping?

And to the other question, I have answered you here https://www.nairaland.com/2486202/let-atheist-answer/3#36505086 and here https://www.nairaland.com/2486202/let-atheist-answer/3#36507691

Niggga I dont have your time

dalaman:
Jehovah still remains God. So the OP is not wrong in any way. Jehovah is God. Op is talking about God which Jehovah is.

It is wrong to say politicians are corrupt when you mean to say Nigerian politicians are corrupt.

The OP analysis is definitive but directed to general entity

plaetton:
Again, that would depend on what is or what was assumed to be god.

If for example, giants were worshipped as gods, then surely, gods existed.

If volcanoes were worshipped as gods, then surely, gods existed.

Dont make yourself a joke. Atheist will not believe those god exist

johnydon22:
Atheism is the disbelief in the THEISTIC deity concept... Its time we now adopt the real words since you always like confusing the usage of the word God.

so lets break it down simply...

THEISM means: The belief in a personal creator deity who interacts and dabbles into human affairs, governance and relationship.

aTHEISM: I don't believe that crap above

Do I need to list out the type of theism?

And how is pantheist God not a personal one?

dalaman:
Jehovah still is God. Unless you can show that Jehovah isn't God.

God is a very complex word in which Jehovah fits in.

The depiction of the OP has nothing to do with shiva or Orangun who are God too.

So I had to nail what he refers to and tame him to his boumdary

dalaman:
Buddhism is an spirituality that lacks a God figure. You do not need to believe in God to be spiritual. Many people do not believe in any God idea but are spiritual. You calling your self an atheist is ridiculous. Why are you an atheist ? Remember according to you an atheist must disbelieve in all Gods.

Buddhism has not God?

Who do they pray to?

Who are the devas?

Why is there temple made for them?

Why do they go on pilgrimage?

Abeg pack well. You can check the lists of buddhist devas on the internet. I cant waste time trashing you on this.

And for your othr question, I have answered you on other thred. No waste my time abeg