₦airaland Forum

Jonraid:
But then again you once said 70b. Even 70b would not cater for that huge Nigeria population! Egypt are 97m and have a 40 billion budget! Kenya are 50m and have a 30b budget and Nigeria are 197m and have a ...

Nigeria practices mixed economy. That is all I have to say.

rvp20183:
FACTS ARE STUBBORN.
Kenya current national budget 31B dollars - 3.1 trillion shs - which translate via google today - 30B dollars.
Nigeria federal as approved by parlaiment & signed by lifeless Buhari is 9 trillion Naira - which translate via google map today to 25B dollars.

You are right! Facts are stubborn. This is your Kenya's 2018 official slashed budget.

Not up to $30b.

Now show me your Kenya's 2018 counties budget.

rvp20183:
Kenya current budget 2018/2019 national budget is 3.1 trillion Kshs which roughly translate to 31B - Counties budget is my estimate (but I can find you data if you insist).
Kenya 2017/2018(last year) - 26B dollars.
Kenya 2016/2017 was 23B dollars.

Nigeria meager yet historic federal budget this yr (2018/2019) is 23B dollars!!!!.

The 36 states have a largely kamikaze budget of 17-18B dollars this year - total Nigeria state+federal budget is therefore around 40B dollars.

Kenya's 2018 budget was never Sh3t Ksh. It was slashed big time to Sh2.5t Ksh. Ok show me Kenya's 2018 budget signed by your law makers.

Now, show me the 2018 budgets of your counties. That's if they have one. Bhuhahahaha!

Lagos, Akwa Ibom, Cross Rivers, Rivers state, Ogun state and Delta state budget alone is $12.7b. How much more other remaining 30 states and FCT
Bhuhahahaha!

Jonraid:
There exist articles pointing out their budget to be only 25 billion USD.

9.1 trillion Naira gives you 25b

https://www.ecofinagency.com/public-management/1605-38489-nigeria-parliament-increases-2018-budget-to-25-billion

http://www.africanews.com/2018/06/21/nigeria-s-president-muhammadu-buhari-signs-2018-budget-into-law//

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-15/nigerian-lawmakers-increase-2018-spending-plans-to-25-billion

I can't really trust them! Even a 50 billion USD budget for Nigeria is still low considering how many they are!

Our national budget was $29.8b dollars. State is around $40 - $45b dollars.

This is ya Kenya's budget.

Jonraid:
Devolution didn't get 2b! Do your math again!

Still chin chin money. . $3.6b dollars out of $30b.

All the whole Kenya shared $30b dollars.

Kenyanstar:
We have been arguing for over 2,500 pages and seems there is no end. I want to show the main reason why Kenyans have been fiercely defending the integrity of its development record. The past 2 decades has been euphoric to Kenyans in matters development and its fruits has been a joy to behold. Kenya rivaled only by Ethiopia in infrastructure development in Africa are the key architects of a booming craze in expanding its infrastructure in a scale only witnessed in the 90's by Asian tigers. In less than 2 decades they have built massive life changing developments to its own citizens in the shortest period leaving analysts wondering what another 2 decades or less is in store for their citizens.
Before and after pictures of massive road project in Kenya done...

How many kilometres of roads did Kenya do in a year?

How many kilometres of railway, monorail, light rail etc did Kenya government complete or has almost completed in the last 5 years?

How many international airport terminals has Kenya built in the last 5 -8 years?

My guy, we are not talking about chin chin projects here.

rvp20183:
Total state+federal budget of 2017 was 41B ( I am adding 1B for 3 missing states). Get us Local Authorities Budget so we can conclude this debate. Kenya total budget for Counties & National - was around 35B (National had 31B). As you can see with all the OIL and with all 200M people you budget is really TINY - you are 5B better than Kenya - and yet most of the budget making is unrealistic - unrealistic estimate of oil production & internal revenues.

Can you show me the source you got $35b dollars for 2017 budget for both Kenya's National and counties?

Was Kenya's 2017 budget up to $31b dollars?

Show me now before I begin to disgrace you like I use to.

rvp20183:
https://allafrica.com/stories/201712180016.html
1) N12.2 trillion combined budgets of the two tiers of governments in 2016 - around 34B dollars.
2) In 2017, the federal and 33 state governments budgeted N13.5 trillion - around 38B dollars
3) 2018 you can estimate about 40B (there is data for federal + 33 states - 3 missing) - around 41B - we shall ignore some states presented very unreleastic budges - Anambra or Cross river is really hiarously Nigerian.

Now Kenya in 2018 had 31B dollars budget (3.07Kshs trillion).
All the 47 combined counties - maybe had 4-5B budget.

Total Kenya national & state budget is around 35B compared to Nigerias 40B combined state+federal budget in rough estimate.

The way Kenya budget is growing the next budget I suspect Kenya budget will overtake Nigeria oil dependent budget.

See what Kenya's 47 counties get from the$30b dollars.

$2b dollars Crumbs!

Jonraid:
Our budget wasn't 24 billion US dollars.Get your facts right!!

It was 30 billion US dollars! https://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2018/06/14/inside-the-sh3-trillion-201819-budget_c1772862

This was your budget! There's nothing like 70 b!

https://af.reuters.com/article/investingNews/idAFKBN1JG1IR-OZABS

Kenya's counties collect their own revenues for their own budgetary commitments and also receive a 15 % of share of the total government's budget!

How you come up with numbers to get 70b is still vague.Provide irrefutable proof of each state budget and it's own revenues.Come up with clear computations to make up that combined 70b. Otherwise,you'll be talking to a wall!

https://www.premiumtimesng.com/news/top-news/249059-2018-nigerias-biggest-budget-yet-meagre-compared-angola-south-africas.html

Analyst from the above link talked of Nigeria's 2018-2019 budget.It is sad that they didn't mention the 'other budgets' and no one sees it because it's simply not there or it's insignificant or maybe it only exists to you!

Nigeria practice three tiers of governors. That is the reason there is nothing like devolution budget allocated to states on our budget. Unlike Kenya's counties that receive devolution budget from the central government of Kenya due to Kenya's unitary system of government. You can lie forever to yourself but I know the truth.

This is just Lagos state and Cross Rivers state 2018 budgets passed into law by their own state House of assembly. That is approximately $6.6b dollars for just two states.

Do you mean the opposition analysts?


https://www.google.com.ng/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.channelstv.com/2018/02/15/cross-river-state-house-assembly-passes-n1-3tn-2018-budget/&ved=2ahUKEwiTjNj1sPHeAhUdgM4BHTH9B3YQFjAAegQIBRAB&usg=AOvVaw3P_CbNquRtMgJjfLJHdWX3&cshid=1543212717945


https://www.google.com.ng/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.channelstv.com/2018/02/15/cross-river-state-house-assembly-passes-n1-3tn-2018-budget/&ved=2ahUKEwiTjNj1sPHeAhUdgM4BHTH9B3YQFjAAegQIBRAB&usg=AOvVaw3P_CbNquRtMgJjfLJHdWX3&cshid=1543212717945

Kur17:
Because of pride and fear of being ridiculed, they could not tell them Kenya had a bigger budget than them...

“Nigeria economy is supposed to be the biggest in Africa. But, we are the lowest, both in per capita budget figures and in absolute terms. Nigeria is in the middle among South Africa, Algeria, Egypt and Angola.
“This year, South Africa is budgeting about $116 billion, against Nigeria’s $23 billion, despite being the highest appropriation ever. Angola is doing $124 billion; Algeria $53 billion and Egypt $40 billion.

Nigeria's 2018 budget was approximately $30b dollars.

Jonraid:
''Nigeria economy is supposed to be the biggest in Africa. But, we are the lowest, both in per capita budget figures and in absolute terms. Nigeria is in the middle among South Africa, Algeria, Egypt and Angola.''

This was quoted from https://www.premiumtimesng.com/news/top-news/249059-2018-nigerias-biggest-budget-yet-meagre-compared-angola-south-africas.html

With 197 million people ,you shouldn't be having a budget lesser than Kenya's. If all those sectors contribute bigger amount of revenues to the Govt, where is the bigger budget that Nigeria should expect to have?

It is very disappointing that Kenya's here can't understand the basics core of system of government..

Under Kenya's unitary system of government, budget is allocated to the 47 counties in Kenya.

Kenya's total budget for 2018/2019 was just $24b dollars. From this, $2.7b is allocated to the 47 counties due to Kenya's system of government. This is called devolution budget in Kenya.

That is not the case with Nigeria. There's nothing like devolution budget allocated to the states rather all states generates revenue to make their own budgets.

For example, Lagos state 2018 budget was $3.9b dollars. River State was $1.4b dollars. Akwa Ibom $1.8b dollars. Cross River State was $3.6b dollars. Delta state was $1b dollars. Ogun state was $1b dollars etc This 6 states total budget for 2018 was approximately $12.7b dollars. if I add the remaining 30 states and FCT, we are talking about $45b - $50b dollars. Now, add that to our national budget, we can't get nothing less than $70b dollars.


https://www.google.com.ng/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://kenyayote.com/kenya-budget-2018-2019-summary-and-full-pdf-statement-henry-rotich-speech/amp/&ved=2ahUKEwiatez_zvDeAhVqyoUKHRMIB2IQFjACegQICRAB&usg=AOvVaw2mXsMSTvQ1bR2KG14By4ju&ampcf=1&cshid=1543186301427

Icon4s:
Oga, we have not started naming players. We have only listed selection criteria.

Are u ok with the criteria? Let's settle that first.

No wahala. I accept.

Kazikazi:
Someone posted this two towers as Kenya's! Mind you,these are over 50 floors each,while the AVIC tower in Kenya is under construction with 44 floors.
A Kenyan lie again!!

Bhuhahahaha! chaiiiiiii!

rvp20183:
Dangote the richest man in Africa I really doubt it. Manu Chandaria's COMCRAFT GROUP OF COMPANIES that started in Nairobi is MASSIVE it unfathomable. It has operations and office all over the world. Some people estimate his wealth from anything 3.5B - to - 6.5B dollars - and he is yet to list any of his companies -- Dangote cement & sugar have got nothing on this.

https://i2.wp.com/www.magazinereel.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Manu-Chandaria.jpg

This Kenya Indian entrepreneur & philanthropist has managed to hide massive wealth spread all over the world.

Some of companies that COMCRAFT owns globally include

1) SAFAL group - Africa leading roofing material group with operation all over - with more than 4,000 workers in Nigeria alone - with revenues over 2.5B dollars. It operates in more than 22 countries in Africa.
2) UST Global - This California based software company valued at 1B dollars and has service delivery points in India, Mexico, Portugal, Philiphines, Chile, Costa Rice, Spain etc.
3) Comcraft industrial companies across Asia - for example Steelco Gujarat Limited in India,idzania
4) Toonz - a major provider of animation to the top US and European producers, is South Asia's most admired animation studio and part of the international business conglomerate, Comcraft Group

Do you think Dangote became rich by having just two companies? Guy! You don't know anything.

Icon4s:
Ok, now we move forward with the list below:
1. Nigerian Player of the Year
2. Nigerian Home based player of the year
3. Most impactful New Inclusion (2018)
4. Best Goalkeeper (Best Ogedengbe Award)
5. Best Defender (Stephen Keshi Award)
6. Best Midfielder (Oliha/Okwaraji Award)
7. Best Attacker (Rashidi Yekini Award)
8. Most improved player (2018)
9. Young Player of the Year
10. Super Falcons player of the year
11. Super Eagles Goal of the Year.

My Nigerian players of the year is Victor Moses or Ahmed Musa.

My nominee for Home base player is Lokosa

Best defender is Omeruo or Balogun

Best midfielder is Ndidi

rvp20183:
Those are high school Economics. Law of supply & demand. High supply. Low demand.Low Prices. Low Supply High demand High Prices.

Now the question we are grappling with here is different. Nigeria has an OVERSUPPLY AND YIELDS (Price) are very high - and yet we know the aggregate supply is way lower than Kenya.

That is counter-argument against the law of supply and demand.Now to understand this you need college level economics.

You need to learn effective demand & effective supply in contrast to the notional demand.

For example. If you build one grade A office in poor slum city - you'll have caused an oversupply - of that category of offices - for many years- and you cannot lower the prices because the cost of building that slum scrapper Grade A office is high.

You have very small commercial & mall space compared to Kenya - Lagos mall supply is even lower than Kampala - and yet there is an oversupply already. Your economy is just not sophisticated enough for modern real estate. You can see the 30 new VW cars you bought in a year

Now why are the yields high in 2 tower per decade Eko City - because of market asymmetry - that is characteristics of such undeveloped markets.

Now I know your education is very poor.

The bolded is a bricklayer analyses of law of oversupply.

The purpose of supply is profit. If there is oversupply due to low demand, price will fall automatical and there will be no yield. But this not the case in Lagos and Abuja because prices and yield still remain high. Meaning, there's is high demand. Dude! You don't seems to be clever at all. See the snapshot that gives example.

Your Nairobi city real estate is less than that of Abuja and Lagos hence the low price and low yield. Poor Nairobi.

If you like cry till tomorrow, the stats are up to see and it can't be manipulated by one inconsequential lying Kenyan.

We manufacture cars here. We support our economy by buying made in Nigeria. Sorry.

Joebie:
We can always vote and move to the next item

Can you move the motion to vote?

Joebie:
Either way it doesn’t take anything away from what we are doing. Let’s discuss the more pertinent issues.

I think we should agree on this before proceeding.

Icon4s:
For the Best Midfielder's award we are toren between two Fallen heroes: Samuel Okwaraji and Thompson Oliha.

Tbaba1234, ChrisKels, Joebie, TheSuperNerd, Forgiveness, Komekn, let's chose one.

I go for Samuel Okwaraji especially as he died during service.

Is there any need tagging the awards with the names of fallen heroes?

Is it not better to just list the awards without fallen heroes attached?

rvp20183:
Ohoo boy - where is the famed Nollywood - producing cheap skits out of last generation cameras.

I thought they were really big media & entertainment wise - it appear outside Yemi Kale overcooked fufu stew - they have very puny economy - their economy at best is the twice our size - oil factored. This is what we concluded with Kikuyu after critically looking at our numbers.

You are not smart enough to notice filmed entertainment was not included in the chart I posted. Now let me cure your ignorance.

Filmed entertainment is worth $7b dollars alone. Coming from the same PWC. Bhuhahahaha!

I knew as much that one of you will question our nollywood hence saved it to use it as checkmate.

chrisooblog:
I dey laugh o
Cc forgiveness nowenuse

Hahahaha! Na to Siddon dey observe be dat.

Jonraid:
The Entertainment and media Industry report by Pricewaterhouse Coopers

For Nigeria's 2016-2021

“Of the $2.8 billion that the Nigerian market will add between 2016 and 2021, all but $452 million will come from Internet access revenue. The combined elements of TV and video will add nearly $200 million in revenue growth to 2021,” PwC said.

For Kenya's

The report says Kenyans E&M industry was worth $2.1 billion in 2016, up 13.6 percent on 2015. Revenue is forecast to grow at an 8.5 percent compound annual growth rate (CAGR) over the next five years, hitting the $3 billion mark in 2020, and totaling $3.2 billion in 2021. “Internet access is the most established industry within the Kenyan market, boasting the largest revenues and one of the highest growth rates to 2021,” PwC added.

Links

https://www.nation.co.ke/business/Entertainment--media-revenue-to-hit-Sh329bn-in-next-5-years/996-4119976-kjkyjj/index.html

http://investadvocate.com.ng/2017/09/21/nigerias-entertainment-media-industry-revenue-hit-2-8-billion-2021/


I'm waiting for Yemi Kale to say that Nigeria's media industry is worth 10 billion US dollars!

They say if you want to hide anything from an African, put it on black and white.

'Of the' doesn't mean Nigeria's total revenue from Entertainment and media, it points to the sum that will be added to the revenue. That will make it $6.8 billion dollars in 2021 from the $4.5b dollars generated in 2018. . See the snapshot 1 below.


Kenya's revenue from Entertainment and media this year 2018 is just $2.5b dollars.(See snapshot 2)

Nigeria's E&M is the fastest in Africa.

(See snapshot 3)


Get your facts from the PWC.

https://www.google.com.ng/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.pwc.co.za/en/assets/pdf/enm/entertainment-and-media-outlook-2016-2020.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj6t4_o-uzeAhVMCxoKHRghBt0QFjACegQICRAB&usg=AOvVaw3shxCyczp5jlbUeU2HcSfw

rvp20183:
Two things.Effective demand & oversupply. Nigeria effective demand for modern offices/residential estate/warehousing is so small there is 1) already an over Over supply and 2) the price is so high. That is what you find in countries like South Sudan or Niger or Chad..or NIGERIA.

Rather than spending acres of Nairaland realestate why not learn basic economics - like Effective Demand of Modern Housing in A TYPICAL NIGERIAN SLUM CITY.

Just find out how many years it will take one Eko City tower to be filled up - those two towers may already have caused a 10yr oversupply in Lagos real estate - because face it - outside Oil companies,your banks, MTN & Southern multinationals, who in Nigeria can afford to rent such space?. I am told Dar's tower have occupancy of 10-20% years on.

Nairobi is very hot market because you've got all these multinationals moving in droves - looking for modern housing/offices/malls.

If the demand for retail, office and residential space is so small why is the price high?

No wonder you have only one or two universities in the top 50 Africa best universities. Smh

The law of demand and supply says the higher the price the higher the quantity. Bhuhahahaha! Lying olodo rabata Kenyan knows nothing yet he wanna teach me. Teacher don't teach me nonsense.

You cheaper retail, office and residential office space is as a result of low demand due to the exodus of expatriate from Kenya. Poor country.

Let me teach you basic law of demand and supply. See the snapshot definitions and examples.

Since Abuja and Lagos beat your one and only best city called Nairobi in all the categories of Real Estate sector, Nigeria's real estate is far better than that of Kenya times 5.

gallivant:
You are only disgracing yourself. Notice how you are arguing with your shadow? Go back to sitting on the fence.

This is what I call disgrace.

4. Industrial market (Real Estate)

Your old outdated industries are overpriced but unprofitable. Let me not disgrace you further because Kenya's industrial estate market is in shambles. Can't be compared with Nigeria.

Icon4s:
Joebie is looking at we naming the awards after our late players. And I think I also buy the idea. However, it will be a decision for the entire house.

Meanwhile, Chief Forgiveness, we are still awaiting your response on list of awards.

Tomorrow we roll out the final list of awards and then spell out criteria for selection of nominees.

Ok. I will respond today. Thanks

rvp2018:
Kenya real estate sector - for 2016 - lot of activity - Nigeria - only the single tower of Eko City & World trade center of Abuja completed
Kenya
Retail - 100,000 sq m of retail added in 2016 - up from 50,000 in 2015
Office - 300,000 sq m of commercial space - up from the average of 150,000 in previous years

Nigera - absolutely nothing going on except in one tower Eko City -

Ahuuuuuu! You must have deceived your fellow Kenya's with this one but not me.

3. Residential market (Real Estate)

What happened to your empty residential estates in Nairobi due to exodus of expatriate from Kenya? (See snapshot 1). It seems poor Kenya's can't afford to live in estates hence 75% ended up living in slums not befitting for pigs. . Your government will rather upgrade the slums because they don't think the people can earn a living to live in estates.


Meanwhile, despite the surplus high end residential space in Lagos and Abuja, all have been occupied. (See snapshot 2)

This is a true reflection of a booming economy.

Despite the high rate of rent nobody has money to pay for an estate in Kenya save expatriates. Smh (See snapshot 3)

Abuja and Lagos is still more affordable and profitable than Nairobi in this aspect too. What are we talking about again? EOD
(See snapshot 2)

rvp2018:
Kenya real estate sector - for 2016 - lot of activity - Nigeria - only the single tower of Eko City & World trade center of Abuja completed
Kenya
Retail - 100,000 sq m of retail added in 2016 - up from 50,000 in 2015
Office - 300,000 sq m of commercial space - up from the average of 150,000 in previous years

Nigera - absolutely nothing going on except in one tower Eko City -

Not so fast.


We have just done the retail sector and I have shown you many activities occurred in many cities.

Now, let us move to commercial space.

2. Commercial/office space market (Real Estate sector).

How can you conspicuously overlook the word 'recently over supply' term used to defined the activities previously done in the commercial space real estate both Lagos and Abuja, huh? So, you didn't see the over suplurs too? (Read snapshot 1).

Let us exam the market value of Nigeria's cities and Nairobi.

Lagos and Abuja is more expensive and profitable than Nairobi in the office/commercial aspect of the real estate. Bhuhahahaha! (see snapshot 2) you can also see the post above.

rvp2018:
Real estate - Sub Sahara Retail sector outside South Africa - Lagos is below even Kampala .

Nairobi is obviously on another level outside RSA.

Lying Kenyan. This doesn't tell the whole story about the real estate in Africa. It's only about the numbers of retail space constructed and available as at 2017.

What about the office, industrial, residential, and the most important aspects of the Real Estate sector which is capital market review?

Let us start with the Retail sector.

1. Retail market (Real Estate)

As you can see, all retail development in the whole of Kenya is concentrated in one city called Nairobi according to your chart but you can see on the same chart, retail development was not restricted to one city in Nigeria in 2016, it spreads across many cities in Nigeria. And it was emphasized that developers are targeting others cities.

In short, apart from Delta mall Warri, Onitsha mall, Novare Lekki mall Lagos and Jabi lake mall listed (See snapshot 1) many malls were built btw 2015 - 2017 in different cities. This is the list of some of them.

Maryland mall Lagos (2016), Lennox mall, Lagos (2017), Circle mall, Lagos (2015), Festive mall Lagos (2015). Novera gateway mall Abuja (2017) Asaba mall (2016), Akure mall (2015), Owerri mall (2016), Sango ota mall (2017), Calabar mall (2016), Abia mall, Umuahia (2016), Funderland mall, Lagos (2016) etcetera.

Deceitful lying Kenyan like you only showed one part of the story and hid the rest.

To cut the story short. Let us compare the market value of Nairobi's retail sector with Abuja and Lagos retail sector by looking at the prime rent per square meter and prime yield.

From the stats below Lagos and Abuja retail sector is more expensive and profitable than Nairobi's retail sector. Bhuhahahaha! (see snapshot 2 and 3)

Mombasa is inconsequential in this discussion. Bhuhahahaha!


1 : 0 Nigeria leads.

Utonwanne:
Peace of mind to fans. At least Oga komekn and forgiveness go gree us rest

Hahahaha!

kikuyu1:
Hundreds of pages ago I showed your own Indians outnumber ours and are also non citizens!
You have one mn we have max 100 k,ALL CITIZENS!! Also the locals struggling in your shipping sector have repeatedly stressed its in Lebanese, Chinese and Indian hands!
There's a Dubai based Indian running your largest industrial concern, second to Dangote to the exchequer.
I had a pic of a Lebanese village of mansions built by those owning your economy, but tbh that was before you came.
I'll dig it out?

Dig it out and let me see. I don't trust the lying Kenyans here.

tlann:
Nakuru is better than that Ibadan of yours

In what way?