₦airaland Forum

Workch:
I don't care if a blind man thinks the moon those not exist, I care to see the evidence for your God. Don't distract me with the blind man strawman.

Just give us evidence for your God else hes a figment of your imagination

If you don't care if the blind man believes the moon exists or not, why should I care whether you believe God exists or not. That's your own cup of tea.

Buddha3:


I sincerely don't understand what you mean by lies. I gave my take on the issue from the observations I made, and you're already branding me a liar and threatening me with the Heavenly seat of judgement.

Do you now see the religious intolerance I was referring to?

No, you're trying to defend your practices with cooked up stories.

If your father is truly an MFM pastor, you wouldn't even near C&S! Your father would cast out devils from people without burning coloured candles, carrying people to the riverside to wash, saying incantations or making sacrifices beside rivers at night.

Please, people are intelligent, they can actually see through your hypocrisy!

The guy you're siding with was using unfounded scriptural references to justify demonic practices contrary to what those scriptures are saying, and I explained those scriptures to him in all simplicity and honesty. He himself didn't object. You're coming to spew lies because you don't want to lose your means of livelihood?

Judgement will certainly come. Just wait for it.

Workch:
These are your claims.
The fact that billions of People are Christians does not mean that Christianity is right, It's called fallacy of appealing to population (ad populum). If I say most Christians are not intelligent now, you will become triggered.
You still need evidence even if everyone on earth is a Christian


There's no evidence for spiritual realm, not a single one since 4 billion years, please show me one evidence for it
it's simple, just heal and amputee in a hospital. Even a blind man will be convinced that your God exist if you do that.
This is the usual excuse Christians give when they don't have evidence. We are not talking about blind man and moon here, we are talking about your God and his existence.

That's the same defective logic you atheists have that makes you walk in error. Each time you respond to my post, why must I always have to correct you regarding what I said?

Did I ever say billions of people following the Christian faith makes it right? I said you cannot call them unintelligent!

Go where the miracles are happening. If there's no evidence for spiritual realm, there'll be no such words as 'Spirirual' not 'Spirit' in the first place. Keep deceiving yourself.

I'm ready to show you evidences. Just tell me how you'll prove to a blind man that a moon exists. I don't want any distractive rants. Just tell me how you'll prove the moon to a blind man. Period.

Buddha3:
CC:

FxMasterz.
Otipoju.
Didijiji.

I have followed your exchange on this issue from the very first page to the last, with keen interest.

I am particularly thrilled and impressed with the meticulous rendition of respective views, mostly by Otipoju and FxMasterz. You both obviously committed the entire Sunday morning defending your faiths, without realising that you were educating members of the audience, like me.

Like Otipoju, I spent the first two decades of my life touring churches. Whether Orthodox, pentecostal, Anglican or what have you. I have equally had stints with the Celestial Church of Christ and the Cherubim & Seraphim sect. I have garnered religious knowledge beyond my needs. As a matter of speaking, my father is a Regional Pastor with Mountain of Fire and Miracles Ministries. He's spent over 15years behind the pulpit.

Your understanding and subsequent interpretations of the word of God cannot be invalidated. You're building your faiths around the tenets of the foundations you were propped with, while growing. But in the course of your argument, any discerning reader will notice that FxMasterz is closed-minded and stubbornly averse to swallowing other opinions, as has always been the case with modern day Pentecostal christians. While Otipoju is mostly concerned about defending his faith, trying to correct historical stereotypes, while attempting to clearly back up the doctrines of his denomination with the bible.

Truth of the matter is, modern day christianity is intolerant of other opinions or criticisms. Muslims prefer to use physical violence to press home their religious demands. Christians just put a moral burden on the world and demonise other religions. It's an easier path to conquests...and less bloody. But ultimately, it does more harm than what Islamism encourages.

If all religions purportedly serve the same purpose of leading souls to heaven, why is there always the discrimination and mud-slinging? I was a part of Eckankar for over 2years and I can proudly pronounce that religion as one of the most peaceful, tolerant and harmonious, as compared to the rest. I don't have an in-depth knowledge of the workings of the CCC, but I can confidently tell you that if all white garment churches and even Christian churches live like them, we'll have more relative peace than we have now. Christianity today is becoming toxic and I find it saddening that their adherents never bother to recognise that.

All of this bickering is the major reason I no longer go to church or any other worship centers. You religious extremists have decidedly made life quite uncomfortable for the rest of the world. Before all these foreign religions, our ancestors worshipped their gods in their huts, married many wives, reaped the bountiful proceeds from their farms and handworks, and they lived long enough to tell tales to their great-grand-children. Today, even with all your promises of el-dorado from pulpits and worship centers, the world is sad, there is hunger, people die early, then we have to tolerate the in-fighting between adherents of different fates.

It's very sad!

If these your lies make you feel good. Cheers! We shall meet at the judgement seat of Christ some day.

WhisperedNoise:
Yes sir.
Prophet Abraham Adebayo is someone I've known through the years. He's a C/S prophet who rightly divides the word of truth. A wonderful teacher too. You can check him out.

At a point in time, in the campus fellowship I spoke off, some members broke away because they wanted to continue fetishism. They started their own parish of C/S, but they were rebels, and were not led by God.

Any church or gathering that adds anything extra biblical is fetish. Those guys arguing know the truth. They are probably charlatans, so they're defending their fetish practices.

I love your submission on tongues. You rightly divided the word of truth. It's funny that posts even brought tongues up because MANY white garment churches speak in tongues. Some of these tongues are inspired of demons. The fact that the poster was trying to attack tongues shows he's fake cos quite a number of white garment churches speak in tongues - both fake and real.

Thanks brother. I'll surely check out Prophet Abraham Adebayo.

You're right, those guys know what they're doing. They were trying frantically to cover up because they felt threatened. It's their means of livelihood. They don't want to be disenfranchised.

I know they speak in demonic tongues and even have weird names for God such as Afurafujah , etc and those weird incantations but I didn't want to derail the thread on the principle of one truth at a time.

Thanks again brother. It's refreshing to find someone who loves the truth.

Gajagojo:
There is plenty weird stuff going on in Pentecostal churches. They are cults

The simple truth is that Christians and Muslims have been scammed by foreign religions

They are all now in the position of trying to justify which scam is better.


I can say it proudly God did not send Christianity. Or Islam to black People.

They are tools used to enslave us

Every human being or most anyway know what is right and wrong without a God from.The middle EAST

The Indians,Chines,Japanese,Koreans are fine without any foreign God

Ignorance is not bliss bro.

For many years, African gods were dreaded. They deceived people claiming to be powerful. When the missionaries wanted to build churches, African leaders collected money from them and gave them evil forests to build churches in, in hope that they would be stricken dead and never build any church. The missionaries cleared the evil forests, built churches and developed those dreaded places in the name of Jesus. That's when Africans began to realise that power pass power. Bowing down to stones and woods instead of worshipping the Almighty Creator of all things is absolutely illogical.

11doubledee:
That snake and Monkey story is not true.
I'll suggest you find out the truth before taking a position.
But cele too dey collect tithe,use oil and whole lot he accused the pentecostal churches of doing.

At least we use oil because Jesus used it too. Even the Apostle James wrote that we should use anointing oil in healing the sick. Tithe is commanded by Christ. We're talking about things that are taken from juju and occult practices which the white garment mix with truth.

olaboy001:
Most ex white garment members left because of their closing time not because the church is not of God..

Hahaha, who wants to leave where God is, merely because of closing time? Lol.

If God is truly there, they'll never leave.

Those people who left have spoken up. Even on this forum, there are various threads detailing the demonic practices going on in that church created by ex members.

Workch:
Then you should act like intelligent Christians in science.
But majority of Christians are not intelligent enough, an intelligent person does not believe without evidence

So how's this evidence for your God?

if I were you, I will just bring a real evidence for your God.

I have personal evidence, that's why I'm telling you that I cannot deny my personal experiences in preference for defective logic. Who follows anything blindly without evidence? The fact that atheists believe we serve God without evidence is enough a reason to dismiss them as unintelligent people. How can anyone think so coindescendingly of billions of people who practice a faith? Among them are scientists and well accomplished individuals. Such a reasoning is absurd.

The physical realm and spiritual realm are worlds apart. You can use the physical to prove the spiritual but you can see the influence of the spiritual in the physical. Such influences as Providence, nemesis, conscience and intuition, including universally accepted unwritten moral laws.

Now, if you want me to give you evidence for God, first explain to me how you'll prove to a blind man that a moon exists.

43Ronin:
the issue is that adeboye & ibiyomie were initially strong members of white garnent church. It's like after perfecting their craft, they run to cash out through pentecostal churches.

Wrong!!

The know what they saw there that made them pull out. They know the truth now and are no longer ignorant, so they're warning others. Every Ex-white garment worshipper has something weird to say about the church.

Iseoluwani:
Did you see the response FxMasterz

M sure u did not

Amen Thanks bro. I've seen it now. God bless you in Jesus name. May you continue to see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living.

gotnel:
All of them, I don't want to start mentioning names of churches.
Mostly the bigger ones are just business empire, under the control of the G O.. The President,as some of the churches refer to their founders,, .

When the missionaries came to Nigeria in the beginning, they established schools, hospitals and welfare centres. All are free for their members and the community they operate in.
Tell me any pentecostal church in Nigeria today that have any school or hospital that is not extra expensive for the common members of their congregation.

I do not disagree with you that there are business minded pastors and GOs. If they're telling you the truth of the word of God, listen to them and do things differently whenever you have the opportunity. God shall judge everyone including the GOs.

Workch:
you don't have to be extremely intelligent to know that narratives like tesimtonies are not evidence. It's not how evidence works.
You don't need to be a guru doubt me if I say that I am Zeus and I am telling you that all you are saying is incorrect, a sane person who as for evidence before believing else every dick and Harry will have something to say.

are you ready to show me anything invented by a Christian via revelation, testimonies and prayers. Show me a single in science invented by a Christian without a practicable evidence.

your encounter are your personal stories, whether or not is true I don't know but no sane person will take you seriously because you said it.

Are Revelation, visions, trances, etc the basis for intelligence? Did I ever say that? All I said is that Christians are behind most scientific discoveries and inventions, and yet you claim they're not intelligent!

Testimonies and encounters are not evidence, but overwhelming incidences from.numerius individuals should prompt a true seeker into deeper research.

You don't know everything that is there to know. The little knowledge you have is not enough to prove or disprove anything.

Glowqueen3:
You are really versed and learned in the word of God hence your honest and truthful response,May your knowledge never run dry.The Lord is your strength.

Amen bro. Thanks very much for the prayers. May the Lord continue to enrich your life with all blessings and fulfil all your desires in Jesus name.

Originalsly:
Hmmm .... interesting. Pretty good response to the points raised but why avoid the one on speaking in tongues? That I was looking forward to ... especially to see if it will be keeping the same line of reasoning as response #1.

Yes, I later responded to the issue of speaking in tongue bro. Please keep following the discourse. God bless you.

gotnel:
We are really in end time.
Pentecostal Churches in Nigeria are merely business empires.
I can proof this with much evidence .
Looking around with all sense, you will know that Pentecostal Churches are more of business than worship.
They are just trading on the name of Jesus Christ and gospel.

You've been attending the wrong Pentecostal churches bro. Many charlatans are in the church today. The moment you understand that there are more false prophets than true prophets, you'll start separating the sheep from the goats.

WhisperedNoise:
My oga,
I read all your submissions. You're very sound.
The other two guys have a bias against the Pentecostal church and it's quite ignorantl.
I am a Pentecostal, however, I have worship several times with a C/S student fellowship. They are biblical and the Spirit of God is enthroned I their parish. They have sound Bible study and they pray in tongues.

These guys don't know the deliverance sessions that many pastors do on folks who have been touched by Satan. That's why they're beating their chests. I respect Pastor Ibiyeomie and i love him. While I may not agree wkth his choice of words, I agree with his assertions. Many white garment churches have questionable practices. But a revival has come there, and God is separating the chaff from the wheat.

The fellow who is defending use of menstrual blood...his pride and ignorance is disgusting. Claiming her menstruation drained Jesus of power is a very debasing statement. So, that means people who don't menstrurate won't get some answers to prayers bah? Trash.

As for using candles, fronds and brooms to pray...totally unscriptural. Totally.

Some people have been brainwashed, and I admire your commitment at pointing out the truth to him. You did very well. We can only pray that God will bring down every knowledge that exalts itself against the knowledge of Christ in their lives and minds.

Cheers, bro.

Amen bro. Thanks so much for the prayers.

I'm so excited that you found a biblical white garment student church. I'm overjoyed by your assertion that a revival is already flaming among them and God is separating the shaft from the wheats. That's good news.

The Almighty God who has started the work would finish it in righteousness in Jesus name.

Dan18:
But the catholics also burn candles too, right??
By my own understanding, majority of the white garment churches do more of the old testament doctrine that new testament.

Was it not the Catholics that bastardized Christianity? Thank God for the reformers. Catholics worship the pagan Queen of Heaven whom the falsely cal Mary. Queen of Heaven is a fallen angel called Ashera.

LeyeWrites:
your post reeks of ignorance


But if I lay hands on you...you that still takes Paracetamol for your headaches and fever coming here to rant as usual.


You know nothing about candles nor the deep things of life.

It's not worth it arguing with folks like you.

Lol. You're just being emotional. There are so many weird things you guys do that you cannot even explain biblically, not just candies. You're deceiving yourselves.

Ade1177:
As for the Candles I don't know about Coloured candles

But Candles have been used from Time before electricity

The white candles are just a symbol for Light


Bath in rivers unscripture?

You mean the one Jesus went to John the baptist inside the water for?

Or where the man laying beside the water waiting for angel to come down inside for him to be healed

But couldn't because he had no helper to carry him there

And was there for many many years till Jesus came and healed him so he doesn't have to wait for any Angel again


Do you people read the bible atall or just listen to your pastors scam you for money while you press phone during church

If you read your Bible, you wouldn't even mention the issue of water baptism where Jesus got baptised by John.

The man Jesus healed by the pool of Bethesda, was Jesus the one who put Him there? Jesus met him there for crying out loud. And he was there only because angels stirred the water occasionally. Do you mean angels stir the waters you guys bath in? Or perhaps the soap you use in washing your heads also fell from heaven?

Ynix:
One day I woke up very early to pray, I decided to have a prayer walk. What I saw was shocking to me, I saw this priest of a Celestial Church and his assistant spraying grains and sugar on the road from the starting on and on. From what I learned it's called diversion as many as step on it with having their fortunes for the month diverted to them. Such a demonic practice

You can just imagine! Many of those guys are cultists.

Truuth:
so we are Jesus that God has to anoint him above us.

The fellows there were gods too born of other Gods.

I know why it's so difficult for you to accept and reason things through.

There are many Gods - not all were good but our God Yahweh is the only true God.

The Bible does not recognize any other God except the only true God! You're an heretic and probably an agent.

We are Christ's brethren. His fellow heirs.

Hebrew 2:11 says:

"For both He who sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren"

Galatians 3:29

"And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Romans 8:17 says, “Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory."

Jesus in His human form was anointed with the oil of gladness above His fellows, His brethren. We get anointed too but Christ has the anointing above us. John said His anointing is without measure;

John 3:34
"For He whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God, for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto Him."

Only humans can be anointed just like the Lord Jesus was in His human form. No one anoints angels. God cannot be anointed.

Scripture interprets scripture. Any individual revelation that goes against scripture is demonic.

excel222:
What spiritual practice are u talking about? Do you know that God is a spirit? The prayer you prayed to God each day is a spiritual practice, the Bible you study u need spiritual understanding of it..
The way some of these white garment churches uses spiritual items same way other churches use spiritual items also.. Like bottle of water, sweets, anointing oil, handkerchief, neck chain wit their pastor picture etc..

Let's be truthful to ourselves..

I'm talking about weird spiritual practices that are practically unscriptural. I'm sure you understand.

Workch:
So you expect us to take this stories as an evidence for your God?
Christian don't understand that personal revelations and testimonies don't count as evidence as this can be bias and be doctored to fit one's confirmations.

The issue I have with Christians is that they are not intelligent enough to know what is and is not evidence.

But if you're inteilligent as you want us to believe, you'll see that I didn't make a case for any existence of God. Rather I used those experiences of mine as possible evidences of the supernatural.

Christians aren't intelligent, yet all the inventions of this world including the great scientists who made impact are majorly Christians. Keep deceiving yourself.

The matter isn't a matter of intelligence but encounters. You cannot ask me to deny my encounters because of your defective logic.

preciousee17:
Wow! Indeed the eyes of Children see many things, though they may not understand.
This is lovely to hear, but sad that those people actually had the authority to take the younger brother's life...

Yeah, they see a lot but they don't understand.

There was an incident that happened in Warri in 2011. A man went on a visit to his boss's house. When he was about to leave, the boss's twins who were about 3yrs old at the time started crying and holding him that he should not go, he should stay with them for the night. The guy visits often but It was unusual of the twins to do that. Nobody actually made anything of it. They thought they were just being fond of him.

The guy went home promising the twins he'll visit again the following day. They were still crying as he left.

That midnight, the guy was visited by dare devil armed robbers. One thing led to another, and they hacked the guy to death. Clubbing him on his head. His wife had just put to bed. The baby was just a few weeks old. The robbers left him in a pool of his blood and dissapeared.

It was after the incident that the drama played by the twins in his boss's house now started making sense. If only they could talk, the guyis life would have been spared.

Who says the spirit realm is not real?

HellVictorinho6:
there are things i dont know or that i am yet understand,however those things arent of god. Just anoda thing,they are not worthy of worship.

Please try and research. Get informed about those things you do not understand. Do not draw hasty conclusions. It would be costly.

preciousee17:
Tomorrow is Sunday!

Tell us a reason you don't/no longer believe in Jehovah God, and we'll try to debunk your reason (if need be)

This thread is for:
• Christians who Just want to ask any
questions (those passing through hard
times)
• Christians who are planning to give up
• Christians who no longer believe in God
• Muslims who think their Allah and our
Jehovah are the same God
• Atheists who want to voice their thoughts on
Christianity

This thread is not for:
• Immature minds who just want to make
jokes and insults
• People who cannot make a valid argument
• People who will not follow the rules of
argument

How our argument works:
• When you are asked a question, you must
answer in a normal statement, not with
insults, not answering questions with a
question
• When talking about a religion, don't assume
facts based on what you see their religious
leaders do or said. Only say what is
contained in their [Official] religious book(s).
• [Suggestions Accepted Here]

This reminds me of an incident.

In 2017, we were praying for a family of 3. The wife had a little mental challenge though she was normal to a high degree. The husband was a Muslim. Their only son was just 6 yrs old.

We never knew they had a younger boy who died as a baby.

We prayed for them, laying hands on them one by one. The boy was the last to be prayed for. After we were done, the boy started narrating the visions he saw as the prayers were going on. His vision was a narration of how his younger brother died. He was actually about 2yrs old when the incident happened. Yet, he began to tell how his mother was sitting down on a bench in their veranda in the village, holding the baby on her laps. He narrated how some people appeared from nowhere and were flogging the baby seriously with cane. How the mother became really confused and dejected seeing her healthy baby crying intermittently for no reason (the people flogging the baby were invisible). He narrated how the flogging continued until the baby died. Up till this time, his parents have never told him that he had a younger brother who died as a baby. The mother corroborated his words by saying truly, that the events that led to the death of the baby started from the time the baby began crying aloud while she was sitting with the baby on her laps at the veranda, one evening in the village. The boy went further to describe events happening within his immediate and extended family. He described people he had never heard of or met before. The father was stunned. He even understood the people the boy was describing within the family.

If you're an atheist, believe me sincerely you're gone. There are overwhelming evidences and experiences around the world contrary to your views. The spirit realm is real.

Truuth:
okay I agree

Hebrews 1:8-9
[8]But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
[9]Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

Note that that scripture is talking about Jesus with regards to His Davidic throne.

Who are His fellows? See the answer below:

Romans 8:29
"For those God foreknew He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the Firstborn among many brothers and sisters."

Truuth:
John 17:3 says the ''only true God''
I said there are other God's but only ''one true God''

I wasn't lying.

If there's an only true God, then all other gods are false gods.

You lied.

Truuth:
Heresy LOL

The physical account of man's creation was in Genesis 2:7

I Know it is surprising.

Byt there were other Gods and Jesus is the son of Yahweh.

There's nothing surprising but rather nauseating.

You can only deceive gullible Christians who do not know the Bible.

1Cor. 8:6

"We have only one God, and he is the Father. He created everything, and we live for him. Jesus Christ is our only Lord. Everything was made by him, and by him life was given to us."

Ephesians 4:4-6 says:

"There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.'

1Corinthians 18:26

"For all the gods of the nations are idols, but the LORD made the heavens."

John 17:3 says:

"And this is eternal life, that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent."

Truuth:
No sire, I disagree.

The first creation Genesis 1:27 was a spiritual creation. God was creating their spirits and already made the woman spiritually. So they were created spiritually to be like God.

The woman was not created from Adam.

God taking Adam's rib to create the woman was to establish ''submission, love and harmony among them''

Hence they are called ''one flesh''

But the first creation was a spiritual one.

Another being like God existed female, of course you cannot say the females are not created in God's image. Haba.

This is heresy.

Truuth:
Genesis gave us a clue.

You believe that God created man in his own image, to look like God in every possible way.

You also agree that God is male. Ain't it.

If man was created in God image, how come there is a female. That means the females were not in God's image is that not it.

''Let us'' was referring to another being like himself - A female Goddess.

And that was why he created them male and female to look like themselves.

Please reason and leave sentiment aside.

Genesis 1:27 - Genesis 1:27
[27]So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Please stop the lies. God is a Trinity and referring to Himself as Let Us is not a reference to any external personality.

Genesis 1:27: “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.”

The Him and the He in the above verse is the same Trinity in the 'Let us' otherwise going by your narrative, the claim of creation would never have been a 'he' or 'him'.

God created man (singular) in His image. That's exactly what He said He would do. Later on, He took a rib out of the man to create the woman. However, when He said "Let us create MAN" He meant man and not men, neither did He He mean men and women. He created the man and therefore achieved His aim.

The Man is in the image of God. The woman is in the image of the man because she was taken out of man.

Therefore,

Woman = image of man = image of God