₦airaland Forum

Stupid is a man who doesn't read; more stupid is a man who believes everything he reads...or sees.

afam4eva: I think what the bolded means is that we should confess our sins specifically to those we have wronged. For instance, if i steal from someone, i have to seek the person's forgiveness by confessing my deeds to the person.

What is the essence of confessing to the person you wronged if he has no power to forgive your sins?

Who do you then confess a sin like masturbation to?

Jesus told the apostles that whichever sins they forgave would be forgiven and whichever retained would be retained. How would they forgive my sins if I didn't tell them the sins?

advocate666: Science doesn't need to tell you things before you can use your common sense. It is simple logic: If you rise from dead, then you were never dead. Scientifically or otherwise. But let's look at what death really means.
Here is the scientific definition of death: the permanent cessation of all biological functions that sustain a living organism.
I hope this sinks in; or do you want me to describe "permanent" for you? [from this definition, science thus says that rising from the dead is false]

From that definition of death, we can not know for sure if anybody is dead or not. Since we have to be present at the end of time before we can ascertain whether the "cessation of biological functions" was actually 'permanent' or not. If you declare someone dead today, how are you to know that he cannot be revived after a year using whatever means. E.g I'm sure you'd say the mummies of Egypt are dead, or are they not? What happens if somehow, by scientific or spiritual means, they are revived tomorrow, you will then tell me that they weren't dead in the first place.

That brings me to this: hardly anything is ever certain in science, it is always seeking to understand. Even that definition of death can change tomorrow. Faith know that God has power over life and death. Science will only continue to try to understand. Faith is beyond the scope of science. Science doesn't even have the tools to test faith.

advocate666: To answer your second question,
NO! Doctors did not say that Fabrice Muamba was dead.

There was this single Boltom team doctor, Dr Tobin, that got carried away and made sensational declaration to journalist who by profession would amplify anything. But this time around, even the sensationalist journalists took such declaration with a pinch of salt because all of them put the statement in quotation marks in order to deny that any such nonsense emanated from them.
Fabrice Muamba suffered a cardiac arrest which is one of the signs of death but is not death. Please do not confuse both. Cardiac arrest is treatable. Death is not.

Doctor Tobin said Fabrice died. The other doctors didn't refute that claim. You are the only one in the whole world that I've heard that said Dr Tobin was carried away.

Anyway, I'll take the doctor's word over yours.

Boomark: Error? There is no error in exposing idol worshipers.

I have given you answers.

Yes. The error is in worshipping idols or parents or anthing that is not God.

Boomark: This how i have power over the catholics. You can't prove me wrong both ways for yes or no. Because it was not written if they are exact or not. God know his Cherubs and under His inspiration they made it. That is why you can't make a the image of Cherub with you human thinking and bow to it. It might turn out to be the image of the Indian president.

Under whose guidance was those different different images on the cross made. Do not add or remove from the word of God. What is written is enough for you. Stop idol worship.

Catholics are not tussling for power with you. So you are saying if something is not written in the Bible, you cannot be sure if its true or not, right. So how do you know if the Apostles made images of Jesus or not? Since it was not written?

Boomark: Error? There is no error in exposing idol worshipers.

I have given you answers.

Yes. The error is in worshipping idols or parents or anthing that is not God.

Boomark: This how i have power over the catholics. You can't prove me wrong both ways for yes or no. Because it was not written if they are exact or not. God know his Cherubs and under His inspiration they made it. That is why you can't make a the image of Cherub with you human thinking and bow to it. It might turn out to be the image of the Indian president.

Under whose guidance was those different different images on the cross made. Do not add or remove from the word of God. What is written is enough for you. Stop idol worship.

Coming from a self confessed parent worshipper...strange.

seriallink: And who gave you guys the ones that were not recorded? Your Pope, I guess! All important things were written in the bible.... You don't have to follow some pagan tradition because John said some events were not recorded!

I just asked you if you knew the things that were not recorded or not. So if I want to leave Catholicism, this is how you will make me leave, by dodging questions?

ijawkid: Your statement shows that the scriptures isn't enough for you and your colleagues.....

Traditions of men and pagan practices is what has eaten you up.....

It is not my statement alone that says scripture is not enough.

St. Paul told me in 2Thess 15: So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.

So if traditions of men and pagan practices has eaten up St. Paul, let it eat us up too.

seriallink: Only Enoch & Elijah were taken into heaven! Mary died, period...

So Jesus wasn't taken up to heaven?

Show me where the Bible says ONLY Enoch and Elijah were taken up to heaven... And Mary died, period.

Stop bowing down to the image of a dead woman![/quote]We don't do that. Save your breath.

Exodus 20:4-5 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness [of any thing] that [is] in heaven above, or that [is] in the earth beneath, or that [is] in the water under the earth:

v5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them that hate me;[/quote]We don't bow to any image or serve them. Use your energy for something else

seriallink: King Hezekiah destroyed the brasen serpent because some people were worshipping, burning incense & bowing to it

2Kings 18:4-5 He removed the high places, and brake the images, and cut down the groves, and brake in pieces the brasen serpent that Moses had made: for unto those days the children of Israel did burn incense to it: and he called it Nehushtan.

v5 He trusted in the LORD God of Israel; so that after him was none like him among all the kings of Judah, nor [any] that were before him.

I don't see anything like "bowing" in those verses. Could it be that you are adding to the word of God?

To summarize: The Catholic Church teaches that we are saved by the grace of God but faith and works, which are the human response to God's grace are necessary for salvation.

You might want to download an audio on faith and works and listen here:

http://www.biblechristiansociety.com/account/download?return=%2Fdownload%2Fmp3%2Fsola_fide.mp3

When we leave out 'grace' its not because we don't know or think that it is by grace that we are saved but because the protestants also agree that we are saved by grace, only, they think the human response to this grace is faith ALONE.

That's why we tend to concentrate on faith and works.

One question you skipped:

" And even John said not everything that happened was recorded. This means there are things that were said and done that are not in the Bible. Do you know these things? Please tell me if you know these things."

Are the images the exact images of the Cherubs, Yes or No?

advocate666: Some things are facts that cannot change no matter what. None of those is "beyond the scope of science". Science has already declared them wrong, unless you want us all to bow down and start worshipping Fabrice Muamba. Do you?

*perplexed* What has worshipping Muamba got to to with anything?

Okay let's handle your specifics one by one.

When did Science say "rising from the dead" is false?

And did doctors (scientists) say Fabrice Muamba was "dead" or not?

Shouting a LIE a million times will not make it true.

Sorry dear.

@ Boomark,

You haven't answered the questions I asked you and begged you to answer o.

Do you think they will expose your error?

ijawkid: This is what shows you are dodger and a pagan worshipper...

For you to make statements like this shows you have no regards for the scriptures and you aint contented with Gods word,rather you choose to adopt anything and everything that is pagan...

You forget that the holy spirit has done its work already...that is why we have the scriptures....

Just because you want to incessantly bow down to images and carvings and the use of amulets you resort to saying that rubbish you put up there...

So I guess it was the holy spirit that told you and your pagan god fathers to adopt the use of prayer beads in worship(something that never came to the minds of the early christians) and also to construct a white womans image and pray through it...right??

You might be blaspheming against the holy spirit you know.....


Holy spirit don suffer for ona hand..

Small time the holy spirit go tell ona to worship satan...

Why don't you just point out how I went wrong with that statement?

No amount of words you use will make a LIE TRUE...or vice versa.

Boomark: My dear tell us what will make idol worship true and legal according to Christianity.

You should tell me. Isn't it you that confessed to worshipping your parents?

Boomark: Wait o! Whose image is on the cross Catholics carry about since it is not the image of Christ?

As a picture of me is not me or a sculpture of me is not me, so an image of Jesus is not him.

My picture may really resemble me or it may not really resemble me. But it is not me. A sculpture made of me may or may not resemble me, but it is not me, it is only meant to depict me. So with an image of Jesus.

I'm sure you still don't understand though.

Boomark: My dear tell us what will make idol worship true and legal according to Christianity.

You should tell me. Isn't it you that confessed to worshipping your parents?

seriallink: There are so many people that the bible didn't say how they died, that doesn't make them immortal, no? We are all bound to live and die which was why the bible explained why God took Elijah & Enoch because their cases were different. If Mary didn't die and was taken into heaven, it would have been boldly written in the scripture!

Jesus was raised from the death, the bible equally explained everything! Lazarus was raised too, but lived & died! So, I can't just figure out why you think Mary's case was different! She's dead & resting in the dust, waiting for ressurection when Christ returns...Shikena!

To summarize: the Bible doesn't say it but you believe it, even though NOT everyone in history died.

Symbolic of what?

And you and the others are not biased?

Anybody who believes as you believe is open-minded...

But anyone who differs with you is biased.

This is hypocrisy.

Awaiting your ANSWERS.

advocate666: Yes there are. Science says the following assertions in your book are false:
-The world was created in 6 days.
-The moon is a light.
-The sun rises and falls and can be ordered to stand still.
-All species of animals in one boat for 40 days
-A talking donkey
-Staying alive inside a fish
-Walking on water
-Getting pregnant without sex
-Rising from the dead
-etc.

Science can never say categorically that certains things are true or false. Scientists keep learning and understanding new things everyday. So what was "false" yesterday can be "true" tomorrow and vice-versa.

And most of these instances are well beyond the scope of science so they cannot be declared wrong, only unfathomable.

I thought Fabrice Muamba rose from the dead. It was doctors that said, not me.

seriallink: ^^^ And was she referred to as the 'Queen of Heaven'?

Who are you asking about?

Is it the WOMAN that appeared in HEAVEN with a CROWN of twelve stars on her head?

Boomark: Go ahead, make the image of Joshua and bow to it.

Perhaps there are images of Joshua somewhere and people bow before them.

Boomark: At least Christ never commanded catholics to make the image of criminals, sinners and bow to it.

If He wants you to bow to His image, He will do that with a command and with His exact image not the one of thieves. Don't you think so?

I don't think Christ told the Apostles - the Church - everything that was allowed for them to do. Afterall he said he would send the Holy Spirit to teach them ALL things. That means he hadn't taught them ALL things. And even John said not everything that happened was recorded. This means there are things that were said and done that are not in the Bible. Do you know these things? Please tell me if you know these things. You see how I've answered your questions, pls answer mine.
The images on the Ark of the covenant, were they EXACT images of the Cherubs? If not, whose images were they?

Boomark: Yes He did.

To whose image did you liken Him? Whose image did you bow down to saying this is our lord Jesus Christ?

We never say an image is Jesus Christ. It is you who says so.

seriallink: Oh okay, was Mary immortal? Or are you saying she was taken into Heaven like Enoch & Elijah? Because it's not written anywhere in the Bible & since we are all mortal beings, she died like every other human, no? Unless ofcourse you are suggesting that God raised her from the death too!

For the fact that the bible wrote a little about Mary shows how unimportant she was! She was only a vessel the LORD used, nothing more....no special treatment attached to it, understand? She was just like any other righteous person in the bible! So, just leave that pagan doctrine alone & stop bowing down to her statue, simple!

Mary died over 2000 yrs ago & she is sleeping in the dust now; she can't hear you, unless ofcourse you are praying to that pagan goddess (queen of heaven) that the LORD detested & condemned in Jeremiah 7:18 & 44:15-18

The question is: how did you know Mary died over 2000 years ago. Show me where the Bible says that...

ijawkid: Lol......

I'm talking about Jesus The son and servant of Yahweh....

You assasinate Yahweh,you worship Jesus,you pray through mary,you use beads in worship like buddhist...

E remain to worship satan.....

Idol worshipper.......

Obstinate idolaters.....

Shouting a lie a million times will not make it true.

Sorry dear.

seriallink: The woman in Revelation is a coded prophecy! I wonder how Italo arrived @ a conclusion that it's Mary 'Queen of Heaven'! All I know is that anything linked to the queen of heaven was copied from the pagan worship that the LORD detested~!

Nothing wey person no dey hear oh *SMH*

Oya decode the prophecy for us nau... Teach me, let me learn.

Who is the woman that gave birth to Jesus?

And why does she have a CROWN on her head?

pastormustwac: I knew your intentions from the start was to stir up trouble because of the spirit that controls you.

You are lying. You didn't know that because that wasn't even my intention. I wanted to know your views on those issues and by so doing, exchange knowledge. You are only saying these to deflect attention from your lies and inadequate theology. You are not alone in this; many so-called pastors do the same. Anybody that challenges them is evil.

pastormustwac: You are completely powerless against me, believe me. You have tried to use fear, even sheer will-power to stop me from talking about certain things you dont like. And you are already judgemental.

I don't want to be powerful against you. How can I use fear, what can I possibly do to you, lmao, is that how low you can go to demonize me? I keep asking you questions about the things you say and begging you to answer and you LIE that I don't want you to talk about them. You accuse me of being judgemental, for you to say I am judgemental means you are being judgemental against me.

pastormustwac: Repent, go back to God on your knees, accept Jesus into your life, receive baptism of the holy spirit (water baptism is not enough). Walk on the path dictated by Jesus and the holy spirit (if you really believe in them). Then you should be fine. This is the summary of all that i preach.

I try to do these everyday and invite you to do same, not just say it.

pastormustwac: Remember, whatever your church is, or doctrines you follow, if you dont obey what Jesus taught us and have his spirit, you do not belong to him. No matter what you do or think.

I belong to the ONE Church that Jesus built and gave the Holy Spirit to teach men his doctrine and nourish them in his sacraments. As long as I live according to these, I believe I am covered...as Jesus promised. I don't know of any other shop or obey any human doctrine, not even pastormustwacc's doctrine which changes from day to day.

pastormustwac: Think twice about challenging me to a fight you dont know anything about.

You seem to be obsessed with "fight,". But I'm not interested in it. I have stated my intentions above... And what is it I know nothing about?

*oops! Another question. I hope you don't see it as "fight"*

Ninapha: Its only anglicans dat can stand and say what is amess. Sodom is happeneing in catholic but who born them to voice out when pope is God.

Please don't blaspheme only because you want to get at Catholics. The Pope is not God.

Go and read the history of the Anglican Church.

It originated from not being able to stand and say what is amiss.

You can't start now to stand for truth when your foundation is false.

That house is built on sand.

uboma: u have failed to reason along frm the scriptures. Hence i will not engage in a blind argument with u. research on the scriptures deligently with an unbiased mind for there are so many bible truths u do not know...

I wasn't arguing. I was only asking a question.

italo: @ Uboma, do you fully agree with this statement too?

Jesus never commanded that the Bible should be written or compiled. Even the word "Bible" is not in the Bible.

Where in the Bible did non-Catholics find that anything not found in the Bible must not be done? This way of worship is not in the Bible.

Do you agree with the statement? Simple.

uboma: u have failed to reason along frm the scriptures. Hence i will not engage in a blind argument with u. research on the scriptures deligently with an unbiased mind for there are so many bible truths u do not know...

I wasn't arguing. I was only asking a question.

italo: @ Uboma, do you fully agree with this statement too?

Jesus never commanded that the Bible should be written or compiled. Even the word "Bible" is not in the Bible.

Where in the Bible did non-Catholics find that anything not found in the Bible must not be done? This way of worship is not in the Bible.

mollie12: Guy, the woman being referred to in Revelations is the church. You know the church is referred to with female gender. If you read the rest of the scripture you'll see it fits in with that profile and not that of Mary's.

Okay, let me obey you and read "the rest" of the Scripture.

Rev 12: 5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.”[a] And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.

So is it the Church that gave birth to Jesus Christ?

mollie12: There is no real justification for the Roman catholic doctrines in scripture, that is, if you read the bible the right side up.

I will believe this only if you can prove it to me. Can you read Rev 12:5 "right side up" and tell me if the woman that gave birth to the male child - JESUS - is the Church?

funkietunm: . So?I presume u r a catholic

I don't want to say at this point because it is irrelevant to the topic being discussed.

The Anglican Church was founded just to allow King Henry VIII get away with adultery... Whether I'm Catholic or not.

Or do you have any other version of its origin?