₦airaland Forum

Boomark: Teach me as you would to someone who want be a Christian after reading somethings in the bible.

Are Christians supposed to show love and appreciation to God just like Abraham did by tithing from spoils of war, eg tribal war etc?

You did not answer the question. You just told me what Abraham did in the bolded. Christians are Christ followers. Abrahamians could be Abraham followers.

2nd kwenshon.

Did any Christian tithe in the bible and are Christians bound to tithe considering malachi? Bible proof.

If you claim not to be a christian then you have no part in such doctrinal discussion. .

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:for they are foolishness unto him:neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

So what you need is about the salvation of your soul ,not doctrinal debate

Enigma: ^^^ Add the below to the 'mix'.

Romans 8:2 --- "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."

Well, the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus does not require anyone to "tithe"' it only requires them to give cheerfully as they purpose in their hearts.

This has to do with justification. The works of the law are not wrong in themselves . But it's wrong to seek justification by them . No

Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law:for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Goshen360: Abraham was not obeying Any Law during his time.....
What is the 'my voice' that Abraham obeyed?
What is the 'my charge' that he kept?
What are the commandments\my statutes and my laws that he kept?

When you don't have answers to these questions.....you will only end up guessing and\or adding INTO God's word using educated guess. Again, can you tell us EXACTLY what the LAWS he kept was? Since you're quoting that to support tithing...if you're saying the law was to tithe, then show us where it was told to him.

These laws are spiritual laws or principles . The kingdom of God runs on principles . Just like we have natural laws like motion and gravity. Spiritual laws are not written laws . They are revelations .for example faith is aspiritual principle . Faith is a law

Romans 3:27
Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay:but by the law of faith.


God reveals his secret to his servant the prophets . They are laws or principles

Job 29:4
As I was in the days of my youth,when the secret of God was upon my tabernacle;

Psalms 25:14
The secret of The Lord is with them that fear him;and he will shew them his covenant.

frosbel: Brother, it's not about Criticism, trust me I am harder on myself by way of self-examination and anything that does not line up with the Word has to go.

Really and you don't know yet at all these evil report of the church to the world is doing more damage to the gospel . Instead of using Internet and resources to bring men to christ you labour to shame him. Giving evil reports of his work and his kingdom.

John 16:2
. . . .There will even come a time when anyone who kills you will think he's doing God a favor.

The spies who gave evil report of the promise land meant well too but died for it. Criticism of the body before umbelievers is a sin.

Image123: snooze jare, even if they were all taught by Jesus, your kind will still say He was living old testament or some similar sick excuse.

Youre right .Na church critic. Criticism is sweet it makes you feel better than others.

Jesus didnt give manual for the church. Ministry is of the holy ghost. He is the one guiding the church and its structure.
Jn 16:12-13
12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak:and he will shew you things to come.
(KJV)

Even if jesus didnt mention some of the things the principles are in the bible. But the problem with critics is that they can pick holes in anything. Afterall jesus taught on tithing yet cricts still condemned it

Six days(sunday to monday) you shall labor, and do all your work, but the seventh day(Saturday, which is the last day of the week) is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work .... For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy. —Ex. 20:8-11⁠

Jesus dealth with that already. We are not enslaved to it. He worked on the sabbath day . Resting the body is good . It's a matter of choice.

Mark 2:27-28
And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Early xtains, even during the time of Jesus, only go for God's worship in the Temple on Sabbath day. Why did we change it, and why don't we keep it holy anymore?

The early church met on Sundays

@OP

Christianity is not divided. Multiple church is only for registration . I'd doesn't necessarily mean different doctrines.

Ephesians 4:4-5
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.,

@OP Christianity is not divided. Multiple church is only for structures . I'd doesn't necessarily mean different doctrines.

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frosbel: Do you have a real life Job, you keep dodging this question ?

stop these mockery and stop getting personal with me. and but if you're really interested. im into several businesses. primarily an artist (painter) I shocased some newspaper publications of some of my exhibition shows in a particular thread 2yrs ago im into electronic gadgets as well to mention few .

Zikkyy: . . .. Hunger no dey let una see road, when it involves cash

No need for insult in bible discussion. Let truth speak for itself .

2 Timothy 2:24
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

Zikkyy: Good. so keep your convictions to yourself. It is not for preaching/teaching otherwise you do more damage than good.

I think you should take the advise also.

Zikkyy: on what ground? your post above shows the idea of tithing is your personal belief. You Joagbaje are not the one to decide for Christians you cannot force your personal belief on others (as doctrine)

I don't force any idea on anyone. We live by our convictions. I've often said every man should live by his own conviction. That's what the bible teaches


Romans 14:5-6
One man esteemeth one day above another:another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

My stand is the bolder part. There will always be doctrinal differences until the unity of the faith.its been on from the early church.its only the antitithers that turns discussions into tights and force. We should accept one another by christ blood and salvation . No one should be judge or condemned for the truth he believes.its God who judge hearts

debosky: So in the same vein, we should also undergo circumcision so we can be blessed, after all circumcision of males is in God's word too?

The bible was clear on that . Circumcision is still required but this time ,it's a circumcision of the heart. But the principle is still on.

Colossians 2:11
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

Abraham tithed once - is tithing once sufficient to say I have done what Abraham did to get blessed or do I have to do it monthly/weekly/quarterly/annually?

Abraham didnt tithe once . We only have one recorded account. Just as Isaac didn't meditate only once but we have only one account of his meditation.

Genesis 24:63
And Isaac went out to meditate in the field at the eventide:.

These men knew spiritual principles and they lived by them

Boomark: Christians were not asked to pay tithe and are not are not bound to malachi 3:8. Do you disagree with the bolded?

Every worshiper of God ought to pay tithe . It's an everlasting principle . It transcends dispensations. Nobody is coercing any person. Pastors themselves tithe because they are worshiper s of God .

You can't worship God without giving

Uncanny Genius: I don't want Bible written in archaic English like the King James Version. Please which one?

King James to me is still the best direct translation. But you can't really have a. Best modern version. I font even advise you stick to one. you need more.
The best bible I will recommend for you is the parallel bible. It has four translations in one book. Some have more.

Boomark: The bolded is the right word to use.

And who will coerce the pastor ? The word of God.? That' means coerce is not really bad

We get into error when we look at things from only one perspective . We should look at scriptures from the contex of the writer. If not we will make God contradict himself

Jesus was called father, paul addressed himself as father and called parents fathers too.

1 Corinthians 4:15
After all, though you should have ten thousand teachers (guides to direct you) in Christ, yet you do not have many fathers. For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the glad tidings (the Gospel).

If the church is not following old testament structure like you said above,then it should stop alluding to old testament laws to bind members to cough out money,(malachi). If Tithes have to be taken then it should be given to the rightful owners: the LEVITES NOT PASTORS

Tithing started before the emergence of the levite. You give to God through his ministers on the earth . Such as prophets, priests ,pastor etc. that's the principle . The Levites were the ministers of God in isreal at a time.

Same principle applies in the church today

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

That doesn't mean the offerings and tithes belong to the pastor. He is only an administrator or steward over it. Money and things given in church belong to the church. 90 percent of pastors have jobs and businesses they do. Bankers ,oil workers .etc. Such may not require church support . In most denominational churches one of the criterial of being a pastor is having a good job. Or business. A pastor is a number one tither and giver. A pastor does not buy car with church money. A pastor can only buy personal things with his own money. A Pastir who practice giving will receive . A pastor who is not a giver will not receive . If you see a pastor driving big car . It's mostly a gift . And for a man to receive such gift ,check his giving . The secret is in the giving .

Bidam: Apology noted..i pay my tithes without any burden..Infact i give sweatlessly with more than enof to give to the poor and needy cos God has blessed me. Tithing is NOT a doctrine of satan but a scriptural principles i have APPLIED OVER THE YEARS JUST LIKE PRAYERS,WORSHIP ETC. and I WORK, WORK AND WORK COS MY GOD IS A WORKER.

Tithing is one of the smallest of our givings .as children of God. We give more than the tithe . We give God lands house and cars , how much is the tithe? just 10% . Yet it's attacked so viciously . This only proves there's somethng special about the tithe .

debosky: In case you've forgotten, this is 2 Corinthians 9:7 Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.

That's a church project .

What are you exposing? Want the church have a place to worship God. Should they be under the sun? As much as God doesn't dwell in buildings . He is impressed by the honor.

Jesus went to a roman to heal his servant just because he built a place to worship God

Luke 7:4-6
And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die. And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant. And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this: For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue. Then Jesus went with them. . . .


There will always be building of worship. Even in the world to come .

Free will giving is an offering. Not tithe. But they both have one thing in common ,they were both under the law. So free will offering doesn't supplant the tithe . They both have been there in the law ,before the law and after the law.

God2man: Brethren, let's sing some Chrisian warfare hymns as a reminder:

Few years ago, when i was living in a "face me" and "face you" rented apartment, i was a tenant then, i prayed with my wife before going to sleep that particular night. Then we went to sleep.
Then something happened, i saw a demonic power with a weapon like a spear, coming to attack me with the spear, my spirit withstood him in the spiritual realm and by God's grace, not by my power, i broke the spear in his hand and the Lord gave me victory over the demonic power. why did demonic power come to my room? Of course, to kill, steal and to destroy, According to John 10:10" The thief(the devil) cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy"

A couple came for counselling to see a man of God to settle a dispute, God opened the eye of the man of God to see this couple in a high level giving money to people and they were thanking them, the man of God also saw in that revelation, evil powers firing arrows against this family. The man of God told them to do what God has appointed them to do, and not to be fighting each other.".

There is a deadly, dangerous and terrible spiritual war going on against the christians everyday. It is a wrestling match. Yes! That's how Paul described it, in Ephesian 6:12 " For we wresle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places"

Wrestling match has no respect for any part of your body, it is aggressive, tactical, and fatal.

Christians are not expected to fight human beings, that is flesh and blood, infact, anywhere you see flesh and blood in the Bible, it means human beings, the natural man. The devil understand this principle, so he introduced, the devil incarnate, devil in human form to confuse the saint and accuse them before the Lord.
If a christian is not careful, he may sin against the Lord by fighting human being. This type of warfare can only be won by the leading of the Holyspirit.

The war against spirit rebels is worst. This is the reason behind the backwardness of so many devout christians and this nation, Nigeria. The battle the enemy is waging against christian is so intense that it will take serious continuos bombardment of long fasting and violent prayers to overcome.

Fiery darts or any spiritual arrow, spear, javelin or satanic missile, aim at any careless christians, they mean various temptations, lust or evil passions that can lead to the desruction of a christian.

Victory cannot be achieved alone with prayer, you need to obey certain spiritual principles that will make your prayer effective.

Invest your money, effort, and time into God's kingdom..

Yes brother . Spiritual warfare is not igniting each other. THats satanic assignment . Satan is the adversary

When you received Christ into your life, you ceased to be ordinary. You became a new creation—a new species of being

2 Corinthians 5:1
Therefore, if any man be in Christ, he is a new creation: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new

You are born of God into His class of being:

John 1:12-13
"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God"

. The life in you is supernatural, being the very life of God. The Lord Jesus, in the course of His earthly ministry, demonstrated the supernatural quality of this life and its extraordinary ability to dominate the natural elements and course of nature.

On one occasion, He defied the law of nature and walked on the sea (Matthew 14:25). On another occasion, He was on a journey with His disciples in a boat, but fell asleep. The waves of the sea got so high and turbulent that water began to get into the boat. His disciples, in fright, cried out

, "Master, carest thou not that we perish?" (Mark 4:38).

The Master simply arose, rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, "Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm" (Mark 4:39). On both instances, Jesus refused to submit to, or be a victim of, the elements.

When He needed to be with His disciples after His resurrection, He didn’t need to go through the doors. He simply appeared in their midst, not as a ghost, but as one with flesh and bones (Luke 24:37-43). Through the Spirit, you have this same supernatural life and ability in you to rise and live above the dictates and vagaries of nature. You’re called to live the transcendent life, which isn’t subject to natural elements or laws. Therefore, don’t accept or submit to sickness, disease, failure and defeat

Joel.:
Television church program and bank account numbers.

Most every pastor be popular, fame and successful?

Christ never said anything about the TV screen.
I am getting scared.
Is this a money venture company or what?

Is tv programme about popularity or preaching the gospel?

Candour: I NEVER disputed the priethood of Melchizedek.I NEVER disputed that Abraham was a prophet.mine position is based on the historical fact that tithes was a royal tax to which Abraham was LIABLE being a citizen of that region..

Did they fight the war in Salem? . The relationship and encounter between Abraham and Melchizedek was spiritual . So lets drop this umbilical history .sbrahsm gave tithes and recieved blessing from the priest . The bible is clear on that.

Of course God had to appear to the man to save Sarah and the guy knew it was God because the man had an idea of God.I'm sure you're not trying to say the king of Gerar was a worshiper of the same God you worship?

My point is that a king would rather be blessed by a prophet. Just as Abraham blessed the king of Gerrar . Not the other way round. Melchizedek as a king has no blessing to give to Abraham. The bible says he that is blessed is lesser than the blesser ..

my brother, Jethro was NEVER a priest of Jehovah Elyon.He was the priest of midian,

Why do you think he wasnt. What do you say about this scripture ?

Exodus 18:12-13
And Jethro, Moses 'father in law, took a burnt offering and sacrifices for God:and Aaron came, and all the elders of Israel, to eat bread with Moses' father in law before God.

We know God called Abraham alone out of idolatory so which priest of the most high was involved?Does it mean God had called somebody earlier that the bible forgot to mention? we shouldn't make the bible say what it doesn't say

God had several people who worshipped him yet they were not Jews. Job was not a Jew. He and his friends worshiped Jehovah. God never leaves the world without a witness .

my brother you go against what the bible tells you and i.If you want to follow the old testatment structure of tithes,then it must be followed to the letter Deut 27:26 says ''cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them.and all the people shall say amen'' this was echoed by james in james 2:10.

Paying tithes is not based on the law .praying is not based on the law, the law was only a reference .

If the church is not following old testament structure like you said above,then it should stop alluding to old testament laws to bind members to cough out money.If Tithes have to be taken then it should be given to the rightful owners:the LEVITES NOT PASTORS

Tithing is a spiritual principle in the kingdom of God as well as other principles such as offering, alms giving ,prayer etc.

Principles in Gods kingdom transcend dispensations

Goshen360: Even for the New Testament church? Yes?

Gods principles don't change. In the New Testament yes. I know your point is eldership in church. Having elders is not democratic leadership. There's leadership structure among the elders. All can't be the head. The apostles had hierarchy .

One man leadership has always been Gods way of leadership. He chooses a leader and gives him subordinates . Gods leadership is trianglelar

Bidam: If God's blessings are unconditional...then sinners who professed themselves CHRISTIANS WILL HAVE AN INHERITANCE IN GOD'S KINGDOM.For of this you can be sure: "No immoral, impure or greedy person--such a man is an idolater--has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God."Eph 5:5.

God blessed us already unconditionally . But the receiving of the blessing in manifestation conditioned on principles . Thats why we pray, we meditate ,we give.Etc as demonstration of our faith. So if a man does not operate these principles ,he will not enjoy the blessing ,even though he has his name written on them

Seun: This video made me feel so sad. It was heartbreaking to see people in great pain, who should be in good hospitals, forcing themselves to attend the show. It's disheartening to see them that way knowing that they will inevitably be disappointed in the end.

It's an insult to God for you to call a crusade a "SHOW". I'm disappointed at your lack of reverence.

Candour: This answer still begs the question which is who owns the tithes of the people? the Levite or the priest?

Either way. It's for the ministry work . Where ever the need is.

My statement on this was not a disputation of the priesthood of Melchizedek.It was about the fact that kings in the middle east around 2000BC that Abraham lived regularly collected a royalty tax also called tithes from agric produce,clothing materials,spoils of war etc but i guess i should drop this point as it has little bearing on the trajectory of our discussion

It's not biblical. Besides ,they didnt fight the war in Salem. Abraham owes Melchizedek no obligation as a king. And if anyone should pray for the other it should have been Abraham praying or blessing king of Salem .

Remember how God instructed king of Gerar o go o Abraham for prayer.

Genesis 20:7
Now therefore restore the man his wife; for he is a prophet , and he shall pray for thee, and thou shalt live:and if thou restore her not, know thou that thou shalt surely die, thou, and all that are thine.


A king has no divine power to bless a PROPHET of God.

however my 2nd question which you didn't touch was ''Then who was receiving the tithes of Abraham's regular farm and livestock business.was it Melchizedek too? if not which priest''?

God always have ministers in every generation. Remember Moses father Inlaw was a priest of God . He never leave the world without a witness or a prophet or priest.

Also my brother,you agree there was structure and distribution of the tithes among the levites.The structure you said is in the church today,does it distribute the tithes solely among the levites bearing in mind that the levites are represented by the choir,ushers,cleaners,sunday school teachers etc if we assume that the church today mirrors the temple in jerusalem.

Not exactly but similar . The bible commands those who function in ministry to be taken care of.

1 Timothy 5:17
Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.

The "honor" here is honorarium. Which has to

The church is not following Old Testament structure . But the Old Testament structure reveals certain spiritual principles . Anyone who function in ministry such as staff or officials a kinds of levite in the church today and they deserve to be paid .

Also my brother,you agree there was structure and distribution of the tithes among the levites.The structure you said is in the church today,does it distribute the tithes solely among the levites bearing in mind that the levites are represented by the choir,ushers,cleaners,sunday school teachers etc if we assume that the church today mirrors the temple in jerusalem.

[quote author=Candour]If choir members or instrumentalists are full time workers in the church ,they should be paid.

Candour: my brother,they shouldn't be on payroll according to the bible Deut 14:28-29,Numbers 18:21,THEY OWN THE TITHES and they pay a tithe of the tithes they receive to the priests whom you refer to as pastors today.

There was structure of distribution and welfare among them. There's structure in the church today.

[Deut 14:22
''Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed,that the field bringeth forth year by year.''

Deut 14:23
''and thou shalt eat before the lord thy God,in the place which he shall choose to place his name there......''

it was a yearly feast.

The levite tithe was strictly for the levite. The feast was a different tithe

my brother don't for once assume tithes is peculiar to isreal or the Jew.It was in existence before Abraham was born and it has always been 10%.It was a mark of honour to the sovereign.I do not for one moment deny that melchisedek was a priest of the most high.however Abraham was still subject to the laws and customs of the middle east as isreal was not in existence then.If he didn't meet melchisedek,he was bound to pay that tithe to the sovereign in charge of that region.

Can an earthly king be greater in the spirit than a prophet. Who should bless who. King or prophet? Kings bow down to prophets.

Hebrews 7:7
Without a doubt, the inferior is blessed by the superior.


Is it not absurd to thunk that Abraham our father of faith was inferior spiritualy to the office of a king? What gave maelchizedek edge over Abraham was his priestly office not the earthly kingly office.

Psalms 110:4
The Lord hath sworn, and will not repent,Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.

that means we should also give away the remaining 90% if we are to follow his example as he didn't take them.Then who was receiving the tithes of his regular farm livestock increases.was it Melchizedek too? if not which priest?

Its personal choice what we do with the rest. I have done that couple of times as God leads .