Albertone:
I agree with only a few of your points.
You need not use God to prove your point because you're twisting things and getting them wrong.

My submission:
People in relationships quit easily and anytime they are not feeling themselves anymore.
In marriage, if you want to quit, your religious leaders, in-laws, families, friends, elders etc will all appeal to you. Even the judge might not grant you the divorce.
This will force you to put up with emotional, psychological, mental, verbal, and sometimes physical abuse.

Lack of freedom of choice to quit is a major reason I don't like marriage.
Everyone will want to salvage the marriage you're not interested in any longer.

xavuv:


Don't mind the gentle man up there. He should have gone soft on you. But try and remveyou fiancee from Nigeria to your place in uk asap.

phorget:



Wehdone the historian of our time, but is Tilumbu a Lagosian? Is Ambode a Lagosian? And also so many power brokers in Lagos ain't even Lagosians.

OurTruth24:
Sexual energy is the most powerful form of energy on earth.

There are two most potent forms of energy in the universe. The energy of creation and the energy of destruction. The clearest manifestations of both forms of energy in our world today are in the form of sex and death.

When a person is murdered, a lot of energy is released. That energy can be used to alter reality when a powerful and aware consciousness is focused on it. The person has to be murdered by another human, and not killed accidently or from some illness..

If you want to get a car for instance and you have a clear picture of the car you want; the type, the color and the amount of money you need to purchase that car, take a knife and murder someone and as they die, focus all your consciousness on the car you want. Within a few days you will get that car. What I just shared is a spiritual principle that is universal. It is well known in dark occultic circles. But I'm against it. It is wrong to take the life of another human.

But there is a more potent form of energy. This is the creation energy. It is the energy released at the point of sexual orgasm. But certain parameters need to be met. There has to be a sexual intercourse between two people who love each other truly and are sharing the moment. When these parameters are met, the energy released during orgasm is so pure and powerful, that if either of the people experiencing orgasm can focus on anything and be precise, that thing will become a reality. This practice is more potent than fasting and prayer or even the dark occultic murder ritual I talked about earlier.

rbass144:


They were informed about the location of the gen and the possibility of noise, they still went ahead to secure property. Fine you want tenants to work things out, but you ended up issuing executive orders instead of subtly reaching out and have a man to man talk which can lead to a mutual resolution. Is that you are daft or you lack comprehension to understand my write up, abi na naira wey nor dey ur hand dey frustate you?

Naira20:
I don't expect you to ask that question. I expected you to know the reason for the surge in population in Lagos.
There are other SW cities yorubas can easily settle in more than ibos.

For example, it's easier for an ikorodu person to relocate to Ogun state to buy acres of land than someone from the SE.
An Ondo boy can easily relocate to Akure etc

Lagos, not even Ibadan, attracts many IBOs.They have lived long enough and established businesses for decades to leave Lagos.

Naira20:
Are you sure you know the ibos in Lagos well?

Ibos are very many in Lagos... As in very many.
Those areas you mentioned are where they dominate.
Go to Ikorodu, ketu, Ojota, Ikeja, Yaba, Palm groove etc

Unlike in the past when it's very easy to identify Ibos, it's very difficult.
Imagine an IBO trader who was born in Ekiti and relocated to Isale eko?

Or an IBO boy whose mother is urhobo,you think he'd come across as the average IBO?

TheSourcerer:
Good Morning and I like the way you type
How about you try this know in your mind that a woman's strong suit is not her brains or her ability to reason 'logically'( but their bodies , sexiness, cuteness, her feminity) lol Logic now that's the Man's deal , so lets cut them some slack if you don't expect much from them you won't be disappointed and maybe even enjoy a long term relationship with them

mu2sa2:
Ignorance is a disease. She should have opened a separate bank account for her savings and sent upkeep allowance to the wayward daughter.

onumadu:


@First bolded: The practice clearly protects men and foists the punishment on women and their children.
Proof?
The woman is saddled with the child and the child faces all kinds of abuse from his mother's future husband and get called "Omo ale".
Whether given the child or not, the men who impregnate women lose nothing. Their future wives simply abuse the child if dumped on them by such mothers. The child suffers in BOTH instances.

Did you say "a way to discipline?" Has such pregnancies ended in the hundreds (or thousands) of years of Yorubaland? Isn't the problem of such pregnancies getting even worse today? So, what is the point then, except to abuse people. Even a family where a known thief was caught never gets called "Thief family". It would be sweeping and irrational. How can a dog eat a bone, and a sheep get punished?
The child is the sheep in this instance.

Also did you say "you can't liberalize sex"? Who told you that the reason Igbo chose to not punish innocent children is to liberalize sex?
Igbo are realistic about sex (created realistic institutions around it) and its associated outcomes. Nothing more. No pretenses about it.
I told you that the Igbo value children more than sex.
In any case, Igbo society is traditionally generally more conservative sef than Yoruba society, but I don't want to debate it here because it will derail the thread. Igbo conservatism overall is known worldwide. The only thing is that Igbo hate hypocrisy. The Igbo culture punishes a man who impregnates a woman by denying him access to the child.
If he wants the child, he MUST do the marriage rites before claiming it.
BTW, in Igboland we believe that a man who impregnates a woman without claiming his child is the biggest fool in the world.
He cannot brag with it. We call such men "mkpi na agbalu oha ewu" (the billy goat that impregnates all female goats free of charge).
No sensible Igbo man wants to bear such tag.
So, children (no matter how born) get protection.

@Second bolded: Has teenage pregnancy ended in Yoruba land, or is there even any hint that it is ending any time soon?

@Third bolded: If it is not a punishment, why then call a person "Omo ale"?
It is a deeply offensive abuse of an innocent person.
Have you ever seen any person who contributed to his or her own birth?
If you see please tell me.
A lot of us non-Yoruba even see "Omo ale" in the same way we see "Omo ole". We don't know the difference.
In fact some of us Igbo see "Omo ale" the same way you Yoruba see "Osu". lol

onumadu:


Obviously you would prefer Yoruba approach "to many issues". But I suspect it is not because of the soundness of the soundness of the logic behind the practices.
Being able to separate primordial sentiments from issues like this is what makes one an intellectual (or an intelligent person).
For example, I don't support the Igbo "first son inherits everything" practice. There is no sound logic behind it.
Same applies to the Osu issue.
But the one around children is a different kettle of fish: The Igbo got that one PERFECT. In fact I'm so proud of it that I would keep advocating it for the rest of the world.
Pretending is not an Igbo thing. We deal with problems by accepting that they exist, and create institutions for them in our culture.
It is an unbelievable flexibility and resilience rarely found in African cultures. Sophisticated. Period.
The "Omo ale thing" is an exercise in pretense and denial. lol
it is a feel good measure created by men to punish women and their children because of men's hurt sexual egos. Doesn't solve the problem. Only kicks it down the road, creating future problems.

onumadu:


Well, it is what it is because ethnic groups decide what is best for them.
Methinks that unmarried women with fatherless children will continue to happen in Yorubaland till the end of time, regardless of the tags.
Which means that there will always be Omo ales there regardless.
It is really a matter of how groups value things; i.e VALUES.
The Igbo VALUE children more than sexual discretion.
The Igbo give these names to children: "nwadiuto" (child is sweet); "Obiajunwa" (the heart will never reject a child), "Nwakaego" (the child is worth more than money), and many many similar names...
Once a child is born, everything is really forgiven. Which is why a child will always have a legitimate claim to a family in Igboland no matter what his or her mother does. Similar child in Yoruba land faces dicey future because of the Omo ale tag.
His or her survival and future rights to familial acceptance, hence happiness depends on the mercy of other people.
Very very very FEW men married to women with such children would treat the children the same way they would their own biological children by the same woman.
Interesting differences.

onumadu:


So, if a boy impregnates a GIRL, it is not Omo ale? But if the same boy impregnates a single working class WOMAN (you do know that teenage boys can impregnate women in their forties, do you?), then that child becomes Omo ale?
It is duplicitous.
The Igbo have a consistent yardstick for every woman's child born that way. The Igbo never pretend that such things never happen. Or that such occurrence is a freak of nature. People will continue having sex whether married or not till the end of time. It is not society's place to punish an innocent child.
I can understand situation whereby a woman doesn't know the father of her child, but how is it the child's fault, such that he or she gets tagged derogatorily? The woman can be tagged but not the child, IMHO.
In Igboland, a child is NEVER wrong due to the circumstance of birth, and can never be punished for the sexual behaviors of his or her parents.

onumadu:


@First bolded
So, if one is entitled to everything from one's biological father's family line, why then does such a person get labelled "Omo ale"?
Since I'm not Yoruba, could you please explain this "Omo ale" tag better?
All I know is that it is a very bad tag.
The one Yoruba proverb I learned from here in Nairaland is that "if a family is at peace, it means that the bastard child in that family has not grown up"
Now, tell me how such a family can ever have peace with people bearing such tag.
In fact, how can an "Omo ale" inherit the throne if his father was a king?
You see why the Igbo avoided such tags?

As for the second bolded...
promiscuity was also frowned upon in ancient Igboland, but they organized society in such a way that only a very very bad and deviant person would go afoul of the traditional law. Hence rape was very rare, and strongly dealt with. You had absolutely no reason to rape a woman in that tradition.
Sex was made available (through various institutionalization) that one has to be very bad to go outside of those established institutions of sex and marriage.
No adult was starving of sex; hence any "unlawful sex" was STRONGLY condemned and called "Alu" or "Aru" which means an ABOMINATION.

onumadu:


@First bolded words: I never said that Igbo culture represents ALL Nigerian culture. Igbo culture and its associates in the East however represent about 30 -40 % of Nigeria's culture. A HEFTY percentage by any standards.
But that is not why I often cite Igbo culture in marriage and sex matters. I'll get to that in a minute...

@Second bolded words: I cite Igbo culture because it is a very RICH and STABLE culture in its original form: i.e before it was "modified" (i'd say adulterated) by other cultures that are clearly not as well grounded as Igbo culture.

Not wanting this to turn into tribalism, but I would argue that the fact that your culture labeled a child born out of marriage "Omo ale", doesn't really solve the "problem". It only tags (and hence vilifies by appellation), children that will continue to be born that way in your land till the end of time. Did naming such children derogatorily stop unmarried women from having sex and having children without marriage?
I guess NOPE.

The Igbo had no such word because the Igbo ancestors were more honest about the "problem", and found a way to institutionalize it for societal cohesion and peace. In Igboland today among the ignorant(due to that adulteration), you hear the word "bastard" sometimes used against someone behind his back. Is "bastard" an Igbo word? Nope.
Like I said in the OP, in a certain family in my village, the only surviving MALE child in that family is a man that would be called "Omo ale" in your land. If not for him, that family's name would have been lost forever because all the "legitimate" male children died.
He is now married with 4 children: two males and two females. Family name survives.
Would you now call his family "Omo ale" family?
The ancient Igbo were more realistic.
Some of us still believe that the current Igbo society is inferior to the ancestral one, because it has been adulterated because of Nigeria.
To each his own, I guess.

Mindlog:


His phone number, please

Mindlog:



So how does what you narrated relate to this thread?