₦airaland Forum

Mustiboy:
So, if I understand very well, pastors are tasked with bringing people to the church by all means, even if it means invading their privacy and compelling them to come to your church?

Is this not the idea of more members, more revenue?

It's now glaring that today's churches are business enterprises; churches, since time immemorial, have always been so.

Nothing dey shock me again.

Today's churches? No! The churches of men have from their very inception back over about 1700 years ago, have always been businesses and operated as such. And this is not limited to Christianity. Religious establishments have been owned and operated as businesses from their very beginnings... Avenues through which so called Religious leaders/authorities have been able to control access to God and the things of God , and the narrative.

malcom1X:
What does bearing of fruits mean?

Is it winning souls for Christ or getting converts for your church?

Jesus Christ never asked anyone to win souls nor did He even hint at it being possible for anyone to "win" souls. The command was that you go out and preach the Gospel of the Kingdom of God to the world.

As for bearing fruits... be sure to visit the context to comprehend the message that Jesus Christ has given to you.

hobyner:
many are called but few are chosen.

Jesus Christ does not call people to go work for companies, even church companies, for perishable food .

Instead, He calls them away from such to working instead for food that endures to Eternity which only He, Jesus Christ can give them - John 6 vs 25 - 33

TiglathPILESER:
You have lost it. From henceforth I cease to caution you about any topical issue on Christianity. Ofcourse nothing bothers you about morals. Do you know the man called Aleister Crowley....look him up...his motto was 'do as thou wilt' - in other words ' morals can go to hell'. I knew I would come to know what you truly stand for. Christianity is fatherhood and nuturer of morals...everything morals stand for except self-righteousness.

If everything about our present day doctrine of Christianty is wrong as you wildly claim on many occasions, how about evangelism - The great commission what stops you from engaging in it. Again, what on Earth stops you from leading your pack of believers and let's see how God will back you with his power?

Ofcourse you won't, or if you were, nairaland would know. Instead you leave the few lovers of the gospel in disarray....contempt and uneasyness with your deep rooted abraviseness! Blocking others from joining the flocks!

You keep using the name Jesus but have never for once applied the doctrine of the great commission to your portfolio of arm chair criticism against the kingdom work of others.

Jesus Christ never preached morals to you so you insistence that Christianity has to do with morals is baseless.

Jesus Christ gave you a law to live by, God's own standard of righteousness, not to be confused with Man's idea of morals which like everything else is ever changing. God's Law is eternal, unchanging, so I am not sure what you are trying to argue but it fails right at the door.

billyG:
If pastors are called by Jesus...why should a mortal sack or demote them?are they his employee?

These pastors are just employees of the church companies where they work for their perishable food, like the rest of the world.

Jesus Christ came to call us away from working for perishable food aka food that spoils , commanding instead that we work for food that endures to eternity which only He can give us.

So what those Mogs need is Jesus Christ and not another church company Job.

kwasoly:
Already your ideology is biased, sorry I can't help me.

Biased in what sense?

bidierichie:
Well, you have a point but I have other view about this based on the word of Jesus you highlighted above that Jesus said He will build His church. I'm curious, Jesus is no more here, is he going to come back and build the church or he committed it to peoples hand. The last time I checked, he manifested Himself to Paul the Apostle Himself on his way to Damascus and Paul established many churches, is that not Jesus building churches through men? What about Peter and the rest.
Just trying to draw from the little I know though

Jesus Christ's Church is built by Jesus Christ , is operated and administered by Jesus Christ and is managed still by Him and Him alone.

You may not have heard of Him since the time of Paul, but He is still alive and well, living inside of those who belong to Him, and to God - Sons of God - John 14 vs 20 -25 .

Jesus Christ is not building anything through men .. He never asked anyone to build anything in His name, let alone these churches that are instead world businesses glorified by men who run them.

What Peter and the rest of them did was simple...go out and preach the Gospel of the Kingdom of God, just as Jesus Christ commanded. They never built a single monument, let alone a church in God's name.

kwasoly:
Your argument is wrong, he was sacked from the ministry but his calling is still there. All he need to do is go back to the one that called him.

So what you are saying is that God "called" this man to be a pastor, got him a job in this church company, and even though the man was fired as a pastor from the company, God's "call" on this man remains as is?

Workch:
But the Bible also said Cain to the land it Nod to meet his wife. Who created the people in Nod?

Instead, it says that Cain went off and lived in the land of Nod. Nothing there about him meeting his wife in the land of Nod.

And the people of Nod? Not sure where you got that from that one verse.

Ogamysamo:
it's because the question is not mainly from the bible. i answered it because am not busy answering any biblical ones i wouldn't have answered the question if there are biblical ones

Your topic says you are open to answering Bible questions, did you mean you were here to offer up your opinions as answer?

Gemid94:
But Vanguard investigation revealed that the pastors sacked were pastoring rural churches which depend so much on the headquarters for funding rather than bringing in money into the church’s purse.

A senior pastor close to the helm of affairs in the church who does not want his name mentioned in press because he has not been authorised to speak, said: "The Living Faith Church had the vision in the year 2019 to open 10,000 rural churches nationwide.

"By the close of the year 2020, over 80 per cent of these cottage churches had been built following a prototype designed and constructed by the church professionals. Then came the human factor.

"Ordinarily, pastoring in Winners Chapel had followed a pattern of training and discipleship since its foundation 40 years ago. However, in view of the massive recruitment to take charge of the new 10,000 churches, many who were neither spiritually nor morally prepared found their way into positions of authority as Pastors-in-charge," our close source said.

See church business ooo! Even McDonald's no fit compete at this scale!.

How many other nonprofits fit compete with this..almost 10,000 new business locations in just about 2 years.

kkins25:
Sin: The First Lie of God
Sin, many have been taught is the defiance of the laws of a so-called God but is it?
_**taught** is a word i chose because we ignorantly go around criticizing sinners even though we do not understand the technicalities of 'SIN'. Sin is what our pastors says it is- based on the books he too had read without commentary from the original author.

Sin can be considered to be the defiance of the law of God, whether deliberately or involuntarily- a sin is a sin, so the religious folks want us to believe. what if i told you, that God- from the onset has laid a beautiful foundation for the existence of sin. if there is anyone to blame for the sin of men, it is none other than God himself. Allow me to elaborate:

What exactly is this first lie of God?

Why is God to blame for man's choice to disobey rather than obey God's law?

FatherCHRISTMAS:
you are intelligent.
The above prayer is from the song by Kendrick Lamar... You know billions of f people have listened to it except you...

Just because billions have listened to you does not mean those billion people are right though - Matthew 6 vs 6-9

patani:
God never gave law for such?

Are you a Muslim or you just don't read bible?

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. 2 Timothy 3:16-17

We are all here condeming the act of church as a business enterprises and you seems not to even understand my post of even desern the context of my point...

Oga abeg leave me....to everyone his belive...

Stop with the emotional rambling! Get straight to providing an answer. If you claim God did in fact command your churches, then show us where He did that.

Calling your churches business enterprises is simply stating an over 1700 years old fact. If you are able to show it is not, go ahead but stop wasting my time and yours with the drawn out ridiculousness.

madegreatbygrace:
The Truth is in me
The Truth is a person
The Truth abides in me forever
Have you not read?
“because of the truth which abides in us and will be with us forever:”
‭‭II John‬ ‭1:2‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
What part of forever do you not understand?
He that has been set free the Son of God is free indeed!

The Truth, Jesus Christ, only abides in those who abide in Him ... John 15 vs 7 - 11.

Those who are Friends of the Truth(Jesus Christ) are those who do as He commands them to do - John 15 vs 14.

Those who Know(submit to and obey) the Truth, are set free from slavery to sin by the Truth(the teachings and commandments of Jesus Christ) - John 8 vs 31 -44

madegreatbygrace:
I ask you, what is the will of the Father in this context?

Duh, to obey the Father's commandment?

TruthHurts1:
His family is now fully supportive of him and his marriage.

“After a few years my mother told me they understood and that my sexuality was normal and a part of nature. They just wanted me to be happy and to meet someone.”

Zahed plans to continue his struggle to convince others that homosexuality and Islam are compatible.

He thinks that the prophet Muhammad, if he were alive today, would support same sex marriage.

“He defended men who were effeminate and who were not attracted to women. He banned any violence against them,” said Zahed.

“He was a believer in social justice and a revolutionary, like all prophets. Giving the same rights to homosexuals and opening marriage to everyone is a part of social justice.”

I hope they remain safe and away from the hate mongers out there.

patani:
Na you sabi...its baseless arguing with you...since i see you don't reason matter...Keep using emotions na u know

I am not the emotional one here

Jesus Christ said His Church is built by Him. So, that means your churches which are built and managed by your Pastors and their Mogs are not Jesus Christ's Church.

Your churches are registered and managed as business according to the world and not God's Laws since God never gave laws for such to begin with.

SatannB0SS:
He will pray with this moniker in order to appear nice in the face of nairalanders he plan to beg

Then use tons of other alternates to destroy threads and tarnish peoples image...

4mat don cast fatherkrimishi

characters plenty for this nairaland

Babinski:
Please check the definitions of business below for better understanding. A charity is not a business!

A business is defined as an organization or enterprising entity engaged in commercial, industrial, or professional activities. ... The term "business" also refers to the organized efforts and activities of individuals to produce and sell goods and services for profit.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/b/business.asp

business. n. any activity or enterprise entered into for profit. It does not mean it is a company, a corporation, partnership, or has any such formal organization, but it can range from a street peddler to General Motors.

https://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=111

Make Google your friend abeg!

A nonprofit charity is a business entity

madegreatbygrace:
“Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said to Him, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Assuredly, I say to you that tax collectors and harlots enter the kingdom of God before you.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭21:31‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

This is an embarrassment to all the self- righteous folks out there who believe that God’s righteousness is earned by works. Jesus is telling you that even harlots will enter into His kingdom before you.
Ooh!
Ooh!!
Ooh!!!
Butterflies in my belly
This is too good to be true
This is the good news

Like so many, you misconstrue the meaning in what Jesus Christ said to the Pharisees, a class He already knows were themselves sinners, among those He was sent to save - the Lost sheep of Israel, even if they lived mostly in denial of this fact.

The Kingdom of God is meant only for sinners and not for the already righteous. So the audience of that verse were themselves all sinners in need of saving much like the harlots and tax collectors. From what Jesus Christ said in that passage, we can understand that because of their, the Pharisees, denial, they, continued in their rejection of Jesus Christ while the taxpayers and harlots continued to go ahead of them in to the Kingdom of God. .....

Entry into the Kingdom of God is not automatically granted. One had to accept and obey the call in order for that door to open.

22jumpstreet:
Not at all. I have been on the road as I just lost my dad. So as customs demands I had to travel to tell my relations in the village...
I will be available during the Salah holiday..

Ok

pafra:
You are missing it.

The primary reason for church exist is to win souls then equipped the soul won to win souls. Jesus said church growth is important. "Any branch that does not bear fruit is cut away"

You lack understanding of the bible.

What is" God assignment" his assignment is soul winning.

God never asked anyone to "win souls". Read and understand that book using the understanding that God has given you so you can receive more from Him as a result- Matthew 25 vs 14 - 30

Adamgeneral12:
Chain! This one go just give kobojunkiee chance to call them mog

Mog == men of gods

omonighoblessing:
receive sence and brain in Jesus name.

Nah! Jesus Christ already told you even easier way to that via the parable of the 10 talents. He said if you use even the little sense you have right now in understanding Him, more understanding will be given you. But if you refuse, even the little understanding you previously had will be taken away from you.

That is probably why many of you are blind now to the truth that has been before the world for 2000 years now.

Chibuking1402:
Read your Bible in book of Matthew where Jesus use the parable of a Master that gave his 3 servant talents. Read the account of what happened to the one that refused to grow and nuture his own rather he hid it and when the master returned, he was stripped of the talent and cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and suffering..
Yes....the church is right...Growth is Paramount, if a pastor fail to increase his talent he should be sacked...it's biblical

The parable of the 10 talents has absolutely nothing to do with what you describe. Jesus Christ even explained how that parable applies 2when He insisted that those who use the understanding they have been given will recieve more understanding but those who do not use the understanding they have will have even that which they have taken from them by God.

Twisting scriptural texts in order to justify worldly dealings is unbecoming for one who believes himself to be of God, don't you think?

If you do not understand church growth, I suggest you make Google your friend..it is an aspect of running of even a church business in this world https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Growth

coputa:
Church growth and winning of souls are the same,the church is the people,christains serving God,so if the church Is dying it therefore means that the people are no longer worshipping God,so therefore, the head of that ministry need an overhaul.thats what Bishop oyedepo did as a general overseer.

Jesus Christ said He will build His own Church, your churches are instead built by the hands of your pastors and their Mogs. So do not confuse two different things here.

The mission Jesus Christ gave to those who belong in His Church is that they go out and preach His Gospel to all. "Soul winning" is instead the mission your pastors gives you in their churches..it has nothing to do with what God called us to do since we have no power given to us to win souls let alone save anyone.

This case with this church and its former Pastors is simply about world business and nothing else.

capnies:
I SAID BELIEVING ALONE CANNOT GUARANTEE ETERNAL LIFE. YOU MUST WORK OUT YOUR SALVATION TO MERIT ETERNAL LIFE

According to Jesus Christ, believing is what you need to have eternal life. You already merit eternal life by believing in Jesus Christ - that is what that command demands you do.

So again, you don't believe what Jesus Christ said then in John 3 vs 16 -21 & John 3 vs 36 & john 6 vs 43 - 47 and also john 10?

It's either you believe Him, or you don't. Which one is it?

GboyegaD:
You don't need to reason it, he just needs to follow his heart.

For me, as of today, I will pay. I stopped for some years and no one needed to convince me to start paying again. The very reason I said he should decide.

Follow his heart or follow God's command?

luvmijeje:
There is no fake Pastor. There is only a 'wrong or right pastor'. In order for you to know whether a Pastor is right or wrong, you must first of all understand yourself. The 'right Pastor' aligns with your values and most importantly the 'right Pastor' have the ability to inspire you.

They are all false teachers and false prophets, wolves in sheep's clothing, seeking to prey on God's sheep.

22jumpstreet, you don abandon this one?